The Bobby Bones Show - BOBBYCAST: Dan Wilson of Semisonic on The Real Story of "Closing Time" + Writing with Adele + Splitting the Money Evenly in the Band + Bobby and Mike D Talk Famous Artists Who Wrote Songs for Other Artists

Episode Date: May 3, 2025

On this episode of the BobbyCast, Bobby sits down to talk with the lead singer from Semisonic and one of the best songwriters of this generation, Dan Wilson. Dan tells Bobby the real story behind "Closing Time", what it is like to write with Adele and splitting money evenly with his bandmates. Plus, Bobby and Mike D dive into famous artists who wrote songs for other artists that you may not know about!  Follow on Instagram: @TheBobbyCast Follow on TikTok: @TheBobbyCast Watch this Episode on YoutubeSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok podcast network on TikTok. In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins. But the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice in so-ins, correct? I doctored the test ones. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern.

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When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands. I vowed. I will be his last. target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And then I got one email from a 16-year-old girl after the song became really big. And she said, I have a theory about your song closing time. And I know it's pretty crazy. And if I'm wrong,

just forgive me. But no way. Yeah. Welcome to episode 509, Dan Wilson of Semisonic. Closing time, time to close the tours and time to close the stores. It's kind of it, huh? Almost. Yeah. We've tried to get Dan. I've tried to get Dan for a long time.

The problem is Dan doesn't live in Nashville, and I kind of didn't want to do it over Zoom. Because Dan is not only closing time, he's also a massive songwriter, and has written so many songs and I guess I'll set it up with that. First, Simasonic has a tour. It's Toad the Wet Sprocket, Simasonic, Six Pinson on the Richer. That's pretty legit though, because Six Pinson on the Richer has Closing Time. No, they have, there she goes. Do you know how it's a cover by the way? There she goes again. It's about the laws. Yeah, L-A-S. I've never heard that. Don't let the accent confuse you, not the laws like the L-A-S. But the L-A-S. But their biggest, but their biggest song is the one where

Kiss me Yeah, she walks down the Right, is that that one? She's all that, yeah Yeah Underneath the bar beautiful barley Yeah, you know the words better than I do Yeah, that'd be a really fun show to go

I would go to that show It sounds like you Yeah, that whole show sounds like me Like that's like right in my wheelhouse Dan also has a new instrumental album called Goodnight Los Angeles Comes out May 9th But again, Simiconic for sure

But he's a seven-time Grammy nominee, a four-time Grammy winner. And then it's like a second life. It's like he was reincarnated into something else amazing, except it was the same person. And I didn't know why Simasonic stopped. I knew they were what some people would consider a one-hit wonder because one song was massive. They had other songs that did pretty well, but if one song is massive, and you really don't meet that with another massive song, you get labeled that. Even if he had other hits that did pretty well. But Simiconic does their thing and they quit. Not because they weren't having hits anymore, but he'll tell that story. I did not know that.

And it kind of sucks. It really sucked them, but it kind of sucks. But then it put him on this whole music thing where he's just writing songs. He wrote, For the Chicks, Not Ready to Make Nice. Was that Song of the Year? It was at least nominated. Nominated at least, yeah. Album of the year as a producer on Adele, or 21. Do you know why all Adel's records are numbered? Her age? Yep. So you did know that, or did you guess? No, I knew that. Yeah. That's kind of cool. one for writing best country song for Chris Stapleton's White Horse Best song written for visual media

for it never went away for John Batiste I could keep going and I'll go quickly James Bay these people he wrote with or wrote for Celine Dionne Megan Trainor Noah Cyrus Christina Perry Vance Joy, Tenil Towns

Leon Bridges Teddy Geiger Joe Joe The Chicks Then it goes back to Leon Bridge of Sling Dion. It's just, it's two pages. It's of not Noah, Noah Con, James Bay, Mike Posner, John Legend, Josh Grobe, and Steve Perry, Jason Maraz, Leon Rhymes and Stevie Nix, Nile Horan, Dirk's Bentley, Wieser. The dude writes like, oh, there's a third page. Oh my God. And even that is like half of his. Panic at the disco, Harry Connick Jr., Chris Stapleton again, Taylor Swift,

Pink Adele I mean Adele He wrote Never mind I do someone like you You can't closing time Every song comes into that Back to that

Yeah Anyway he's awesome And I was super pumped To be able to sit down with him This is one we waited for We were super happy He came to the studio And you can follow him

At Dan Wilson music And now Here he is Dan Wilson of Semasonic Slash One of the great writers of our day Dan, first, you've been a bit of a white will for me. I've been trying to track you down for a long time.

Because your story to me is two different versions of what we do here is we talk to a lot of songwriters and producers and creators at times that people don't know unless somebody highlights them. Yep. And then also, you're the guy from Semi-Sonic, which is a whole different story. Does it feel like two musical lives, like separated? In time, really, most of Semi-Sonic happened before I started earnestly writing songs for other people with other people.

Even though the band is still together and we do things as much as we can, most of that happened before 2002. And then the co-writing and producing phase began around then until now. So, yes, it does feel like two different lives. I have a significant amount of friends. and I'm not sure who you write with when you're in town, because you're rioting in town, right? Yeah. That their careers had a similar art.

They didn't have the success that you had in the artist side, but they came to be an artist, a frontman, and in one way or another, they either realize they don't want to travel. Right. That the touring part is such a grind. Right. Or they got dropped,

and they were like, you know what, I don't have the tenacity to do what some of the artists do and go get a third and fourth record deal. Yeah. Or they're just like, you know, I don't think I'm going to cut it as an artist, so I'm now going to focus on what I started doing first, which was songwriting. What version of that did your life play?

Well, it's sort of an almost like backwards or upside down way. When I first came up, I played bass in jazz bands, and I played classical piano, and I played guitar and thought about Carol King. But I really just wanted to be in bands, and once I had a band that was really good, I realized that it needed songs, and so I would need to really learn how to be a good songwriter.

And that took a long time for me to do. But it was almost like got a band, loved to perform, I'm going to need to learn how to write. It just seemed like the only way to go. And where did you live? Because a lot of people come here and they go, oh, I've not co-written before. Because in Nashville, you're in room with another person, sometimes two other people. Where did you learn to write? Or did you just start writing by yourself and just it got better or worse?

Well, I was really lucky because my brother Matt was super into music and we're only two years apart. And he and I, my parents gave us an acoustic guitar as a joint present. So we shared this guitar and we both learned all the chords together slowly. And we both started writing songs together when I was like 14 and he was 12 or something. So we were co-writing from the beginning. Was that in Minnesota? In Minnesota. Yeah, I grew up in Minnesota.

And if your parents gave you a guitar, so music in the house, because if you're classically trained, did they have an influence on you learning to the next? Because I can play a guitar, but I'm not that. You know, my parents were loved music, but were not musicians. My dad had been in like a duop quartet in high school. And they sounded okay. There was a record that they made. But it wasn't an aspiration.

And I don't think they thought we would become. professional musicians or anything like that. At what stage of your life was it your thing? And you knew it was going to be your thing forever? Like when I was like 12. Were you that kid in, I guess that would be junior high? Were you the music kid? Yeah, probably.

Although I always made a lot of, I drew a lot of pictures. I got in a bunch of trouble for the pictures and never for the music because I could make a really killer satirical cartoon of a teacher. Of that, of your teacher? My teachers, yeah. So I was sitting in the back and draw.

pictures and they eventually got wise to me and they would like stroll back and see what I was drawing and pick it up and take it away. Then I found out later they kept them. Am I crazy? I think I've seen some of your lyric sketches where you do lyrics and drawings in the lyric. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So that was I was either going to be somebody asked me once at a party, if this music thing doesn't work, what are you going to do with your life? And I said, well, you know, I'll probably be a painter. And they said, do you mean like paint houses? What do you mean? I said, no, like a fine art painter. and they laugh because that as a fallback career that was a pretty dumb idea too.

Yeah, the fallback is almost like as outrageous as the first career. Exactly. So when you are finished in high school, did you, again, if you're that trained, I'm assuming you went to college to do music? Yeah. Well, no, not to do music.

My parents got me into the piano lessons because they thought my dad said, and this is kind of funny, my dad said to me, you know, if you take piano lessons and you get good, you'll be at a party in high school and you'll be able to play songs on the piano and everyone will sing along. That was my dad's era. That was, nobody did that when I was growing up. It still does feel like that though. Like I took piano lessons as an adult and that was much harder. Yeah. And I was

like, man, I'm going to just be somewhere and just going to be piano. I had the same thought that your dad told you and everybody's going to be so impressed. Yeah. And I never got to that stage. But I don't think that theory actually has died yet. Does it happen? Almost. almost never unless it's like Paul McCartney was playing at a party and we hear how Paul and Taylor are singing. Right. Charlie Booth led us in a sing-along. I've actually never seen it now that I think about it where just someone dominates a party by getting on the piano and surprising everyone. I know. I think there's a scene in rear window where one of the neighbors is a Broadway songwriter and he always has parties where he's playing the piano and everyone in the party is singing along, but that's a movie

obviously. Yeah, that's much more of an even two and a half men thing where Charlie Sheens playing the piano. Yeah. And you're like, wow, look at that. Yeah. So you go to Harvard. Yeah. That's pretty cool. Yeah. But yeah, because I'm assuming you were just extremely studious by even your actions, the drawing and the music. I assume that effort went into learning as well. Yeah, I just, you know, I was a dutiful first son, but also I was super enthused about things. So I had a, I had a job or kind of a freelance life in high school, making cartoons for magazines around Minneapolis in St. Paul. That's pretty crazy.

And some of them are pretty good, the illustrations. And my parents, when I applied to colleges, they advised me to make a portfolio of the cartoons that I made, send it along with the applications. And so I think that's probably why I got into Harvard, because I had straight A's and high test scores and also was a crazy cartoonist. And like found a way to stick out is what it sounds like, because they're going to see 10,000 versions of the perfect student, whatever those finger quotes are. Right.

But it was a way to stand out. So you drew this stuff in the packet or on the applicant. Where did you do the drawings? Sent a little manila envelope full of Xerox copies of the pictures that I'd published. You know, like 20 of them or something like that. Yeah, I'd have let you in, even with midgrates. If they were to come and been that good. That's super cool.

Had anyone in your family been to Harvard? My dad had gone to Dartmouth And he went to Harvard medical school So I guess I was a legacy to some degree So to you your dad showed you it could be done Yeah of course, yes, yes That's cool Yeah, it was a possibility that was real

And you get to Harvard and are you When you're, I've spent a lot of time Not actually at Harvard But in that area of the country And you're up in Boston Are you learning to play up there? Are you playing shows? When do you start actually play?

When do you decide? you're going to go out and do clubs and stuff? Well, when I was a freshman in college, I met some guys not from Harvard who had a band that I thought was really cool, and they asked me to play bass. So I was doing gigs already one or two weekend nights if we could do it in Boston.

Were you like a kid looking to play bass somewhere? Did you have like a poster, like peel off and call me? I would have if I hadn't met those guys. I would have. How did you even get in the same, situation as these other musicians you weren't in school with. Well, I saw an ad that they put up. It was two guys who went to Berkeley and two other guys who were just musicians.

I can't remember what their setup was. My assumption is if they went to Berkeley, they were high-level musicians. Yeah, these guys were really good. And so for you to jump into that, you had to also be pretty good. I was pretty good on the base, and I showed up to rehearsal on time. and, you know, the basics. But we were gigging right away freshman year, and then I just really never stopped.

And I remember, it was funny, I went to a 10-year college reunion. And maybe this point, yeah, maybe a 15-year. I can't remember what it was, but I already had a couple of medium hits with Semi-Sonic. And all these people at my reunion said, So how come we never saw you? Like, why did we never meet?

Like, this happened over and over and over again. And I realized that I was just never on the scene socially. I didn't go to any parties. I was always out doing gigs. Were you gigging, you have to drive a few hours gigging? Or was it all since there were so many places near Boston? Like, were you actually traveling a bit? We would get in a van and, you know, a cargo van and six of us drive up to, you know,

on the coast. It was usually on the coast of Massachusetts. But we'd go, you know, an hour or two hours away. And what was this band? This band was called Animal Dance. Did any of those folks in Animal Dance turn in any of the people in Simasonic? My brother Matt was in that band. And Matt and I started a band after that called Trip Shakespeare.

And then I started Semisonic with the bassist of Trip Shakespeare and me and a drummer friend. What about Simasonic was different? than Tripp Shakespeare or the band before that? Or was it people just attrition, like life, attrition of life and people were changing? Not really. Well, my brother was the, Matt, was the leader of Trip Shakespeare and we had traveled, we had toured for eight years or something like that,

and everybody was medium burned out on it, I think. And he wanted to take a break from the band, so we just stopped playing. And we had been extremely like, I don't know, But we were like essentially a jam band, not a jazz band, a jam band. And we would practice every day. But you'd think it was aimless because we would just jam all day long like five days a week. And so then at our shows, we'd learn our songs and then we'd just turn them into crazy, lengthy, druggie freakouts.

Would some of those songs be writing sessions, though? Like some of the jamming, would that be writing sessions then? They would lead to songs, yeah. Yeah, especially if something really, really special happened and it felt like we all. all could remember it, then that that would turn into a song, you know. And with Simisonic and you're the singer, was just the first time that you said, hey, I'm going to be the guy? Was that a desire of yours to now move up front? Yeah. It was never my dream to be a celebrity or anything like that, but I did want to sing for people.

And I, I, trip Shakespeare was like one way. Like we were extremely dedicated and we worked really, really hard. And also, the music we made was kind of wild and especially live. And I had always wanted to do things that were more like aligned with the charts that were, because that's what I always listened to was like pop music. So when we started Semi-Sonic, I told the guys, John and Jacob, that I had some principles I'd like to use and, you know, what do you guys think? the principles were life is more important than music. You know, if we're having like a quarrel or if we're, if someone's just really bummed out and can't play their instrument and wants to go to the bar, we're not going to rehearse.

We're not going to apply ourselves. We're just going to go hang out. That was one thing. Second thing was if it's not good within an hour or so, a song, if it doesn't sound great within an hour or so of us trying it, I'll go back and write another song. We're not going to torture ourselves to get something to sound good, because usually it's the song's fault. That's my opinion.

And then the third thing was, if I can be the last word on all things, I'll be collaborative, but we'll have a guiding principle, and I'll be a deciding vote. And we're going to split everything we earn from the band equally three ways. Was that even in the publishing, the writing part? Because you guys wrote everything together. Or even if you didn't, even if you didn't, it was still going to be split. Their names were on it. Nope.

So. I would just pay. Wow, honor code, big time. Yeah, we didn't really write it down. But, I mean, it did seem like I had agreed to it. And also, I don't know. Once you start earning good money for music, you can say, yeah, I'm going to need three times as much as this. But I don't know.

Do you really? Like, I'd rather not burn two of the most important friendships in my life to have a little more money. And also a trio probably makes it a bit easier too. Yeah. Well, if it was a seven piece. More so than a five or six people, person band. And if you're doing all the work, I would imagine that. Oh, you're revealing me to have a line.

I would draw a line at. I was watching a story on something corporate, the band, and they're touring now, and they were talking about ticket prices. And the guy had, he blacked out the show, but the lead singer something corporate was like, look at this. This is where all the money goes. And he's like, okay, so our guarantee is this. And when it was all boiled down with all the added fees and venue and traveling, he's like, we're each making about $7,000 a night on a $100,000 guarantee fully sold out show. Because, and they still, they split the money evenly still, which I, which that just reminded me of that because I still, I liked that. That the band still, after their success, and they're still touring really well. Right. The bass player and the singer are making the same amount of money. Yeah. And I think that's probably an agreement they had way early that they're still holding on to today, which I think makes the band fundamentally better too, right? I think everything is based. So they agreed fundamentally that you are the guy. And that's the reason. that you guys are doing. So how was the band different than musically? Like, then what happens?

Well, it's a trio, and it's me playing guitar, and it's, uh, and the things I liked at the time were kind of loud riff rock. And so we were much more focused on just sort of powerful, loud rock all the time. Were you focused on like bigger hooks, like hookier songs? Yeah, well I naturally would gravitate towards that anyway. But yeah, we definitely, I mean,

every band has a sort of range of, you know, positions that people take. Like, like I was always willing to do the hookiest kind of possibly corneest thing, you know, musically and try it out. And then Jacob, the drummer, usually was a pretty good barometer of taste. and then John, our bass player,

has always been like the coolest guy in the room and is very, has a real, his cheese meter is very sensitive. So if it's cheesy, he's like, no, I refuse, we can't do that, or I hate this or whatever. So between us, I would probably be the one trying to write something that everybody could sing along to. And sometimes when you swing like that, you end up with something pretty hokey, you know,

so they would be there to kind of say, not cool. Did you guys move to Los Angeles or like form-ish in Los Angeles? No, we, we, uh, we, John grew up in St. Paul. I grew up in Minneapolis.

Jacob moved to Minneapolis several years before we started the band. And we stayed in Minneapolis. And the reason we stayed in Minneapolis, I'm pretty sure, is because Prince was there, the same time and his whole empire was out in the suburbs in Minnetonka. He didn't move to L.A. until, I don't know, it was the 2000s maybe. You know, he was in Minneapolis bringing all the

business to him, bringing the producers to him, bringing all the talent to him, and sending music out to L.A. from Minneapolis. And we just, like you said about my dad at Harvard, prince made it seem possible for us to stay at home and be part of a scene there and be with the people we loved and also have a chance at reaching a broad audience. When did you guys decide you wanted to pursue a record deal or did they come after you because you were getting some traction? Trip Shakespeare, the band before Semi-Sonic had been on A&M Records. So we were a known.

And we probably, that, that, Trip Shakespeare was a band where like if I, even now I run into musicians in L.A. who were at our shows at the time, even now, which is crazy to me. but I never run into a member of the general public who was at a trip Shakespeare show, you know, it was all musicians. But that, so the industry is the same way. Like, the people in the music industry go to shows. They like, they love the stuff.

So they had, a lot of them had seen Trip Shakespeare and oh, Dan Wilson's studying a new band. You know, we're curious. So there was already, there was interest really early in us getting a record deal. and it was kind of a you could really be a band who'd only rehearsed in your garage

and toured you know for four years or whatever and get a big record deal at that time it was if the right person saw you if the right person saw you or if you just got some sort of regional radio

yeah it's different now what was like the way TikTok is now well so what was the first single that you guys did you cut a single or did you cut a bunch of songs first we did a tape of four songs

and we sold it to fans and we sent it to radio stations and a couple of radio stations played the cassette tape on the radio. Any of the songs that ended up being big for you guys? Yeah, one of them. There was a song called FNT, Fascinating New Thing. And that ended up getting played by

in its early demo form in Minneapolis and in the Midwest, you know, in different stations. And then that was, yeah, that song came out on our first album and ended up in a movie. And it did a lot. It had a long life, actually. Let's take a quick pause for a message from our sponsor.

A win is a win. win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Clivert Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about

life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast, it's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me, or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to the Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by.

Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't

seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Everyone, I'm Ego Wodom. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers, Anchorman, Saturday Night Live and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. Woo. Woo.

My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with them one day. And I was like, and Dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you. Which is really sweet. Yeah.

He goes, but there's so much luck involved. and he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be.

Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck. Listen to Thanks Dad on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And we're back on the Bobbycast. So what's the story? Because everybody, there's always, not always, most of the times, it's like, oh, it was the last song added, or we never thought it was going to be good, or it wasn't, it was misinterpreted. What's the story on closing time? Like, was it the last song?

Was it the first song? Closing time, so Semi-Sonic, we make our first album. it gets a lot of critical praise. Major label? Was the first? Yeah. Major label. It gets a lot of critical praise.

It's called Great Divide because we did half of it in Minneapolis and half of it in Los Angeles. So we would always go over the continental divide to work on the record back and forth. So we did Great Divide. It got a lot of great press. We got a lot of great reviews. All the Musos liked it once again. But I had thought it had hits on it. And it didn't.

It had some sort of songs that got on the radio, but the people, the general public didn't respond to it, really. Do you think, though, not to interrupt you, but before you move on, do you think listening back to that now, you still think it has hits on it, or do you think the version of you then thought it because you had just done it? I think it was pretty wiggly.

I think it had too much going on much of the time. because we had come out of Trip Shakespeare, which was like the ultimate band of too much going on all the time. So we were, it was, we were still kind of settling down into a kind of simplicity that I was seeking. So yeah, in retrospect,

that first semi-sonic album was not simple enough in the right way. And when you took that, what was that feedback to you? That was, no, nobody told me that.

Okay, then, why this next record was different, though? The strange part was that I had thought that Great Divide was full of hits, and then it was like a critical smash, but not a hit. And so I was kind of taken aback by that, and I decided that our next album was just going to be an art project, and I wasn't going to think about hits.

But at that point, I was like, I was on fire as a writer. So I wrote 60 songs for Feeling Strangely Fine in the next album. And a lot of them were good. And there were a couple that everybody in the band just, oh yeah, we got to do this, we got to do this. We gravitated to our favorites pretty quickly. And closing time was kind of in the middle of the batch when I had probably written 30 of the songs. And I was doing a song every day. And I would once or twice a week, I'd go over to John's house and John and Jake and I would make a really simple demo.

like what in Nashville you'd call it work tape, just acoustic guitar and singing. And in the batch of songs that we kind of weeded it down to like 15 songs that just sounded like work tapes and we didn't do demos really. And closing time was one song that people went, when they heard that demo, people would say,

whoa, whatever you're doing there, you need to make more songs like that. Did you feel like that was a simple song? Like, what was your feeling about the song in comparison to the other stuff you were writing and the last record you did? I wasn't really comparing, and I definitely didn't think that closing time

was going to be an international smash that still is played 25 years later. No. But I knew it was good and I thought it was going to be, and it was about our lives it was about bar time I had been on tour at this point for nine years or ten years

in the nightclubs of the Midwest and hopefully the coasts you know so it was it was just about our lives so I didn't really have an objectivity about it but I knew it was really really good and I knew that it fit I had this scheme

I told Jacob our drummer that what I really love is like Carol King, Paul Simon, James Taylor, like all the music that I heard when I was nine, I really still loved it. And I just wanted to write songs that could live up to that standard. And then we would play them really loud, whatever they were.

So I would try my best to write a Carol King song. And then in rehearsal, we'd just play it as loud as we could. And some of them, you know, sucked in that form. And we just would drop those songs. but some of them sounded great in that form. And closing time is a really good Busker song. You can play it on a street corner. Was it, you said Barr,

because I've heard nine different theories of what the song's actually about. I feel like the two songs that have the most theories are Ben Falls Vive brick and closing time. Because if you just go enough places, there are enough theories about the song. So what is it about? Another of my little,

I get on these kicks, where I have something that I think is the guiding principle of everything. So at the time I was writing for Feeling Strangely Fine, I had this guiding principle that all the lyrics, every line of lyrics should have two kind of plausible meanings. I didn't want any lines of the lyrics to be just one simple, straightforward meaning. So when I was writing closing time, I actually thought I was writing a straightforward song about halfway through.

I thought, well, this is literally just about who we're going to hook up with at the end of the night when they turn on the lights. And then I, at the same time, my wife and I were expecting our first child. And so I was thinking about fatherhood. I was thinking about birth. I was thinking about that a lot. And halfway through the song, I was just like, oh my gosh, this could totally be about being born. This could totally be about getting bounced from the womb, you know.

And at that point, I didn't change any of the words. just all the words, open all the doors and let you out into the world. Turn all the lights on over every boy and every girl. Like there's certain things about it, boy and girl, like these are, this is about a bar. Why are these boys and girls, you know? But it's because it's about little baby boys and baby girls also. One last call for alcohol, finish your whiskey and beer. That seems like straightforwardly bar time related, but it's also about being cut off from the umbilical cord, you know.

you can't have this anymore, you know, and you don't have to go home, but you can't stay here. It's like, it's all about like emerging into the world. And once I realized that, I was laughing and laughing and I was like, everyone's going to laugh so hard. This is, this is going to be really funny. So I finished a song. I did throw one line in to just be straightforward, gather up your jackets, move it to the exits. That was just, that was a straightforward bar time song. but I think every other line in the song

had that to me magical double meaning and then no one got it. My band didn't get it? Which part didn't they get the double meaning or the birth or the bar? They just thought it was bar time. No one ever said it's about someone being born. Nobody.

And I just made a funny decision. I'm a big explainer, as you could probably tell, you know. I'm always like ready to tell everybody why I did something or what. But I did decide with that song not to really talk about the double meaning.

And then I got one email from a 16-year-old girl in Utah after the song became really big. And she said, Dear Dan Wilson, I have a theory about your song closing time, and I know it's pretty crazy, and if I'm wrong, just forgive me. But it sounds to me like it's about someone being born.

No way. Yeah, one person, one person. And I was kind of, I was so overjoyed. Okay, somebody got it. Then I just let it live for about 15 years, and then I just started talking about it. So after Simasonic, I don't know, do you feel confident as a songwriter? Was there confidence or was there, okay, this is a new version of all, this is 100% of me now. You're just going to write and not tour.

Did you have to rebuild the confidence? Well, one of the reasons I stopped touring was because the baby in question. and spent a year in the hospital, Coco, my daughter, and we were driving back and forth to intensive care for eight months and then to the step-down intensive care for four more months. And I just realized that when all this, and the doctors told us this is going to be a complicated life and very medicalized for a long time.

And I just realized that there was going to have to be a horizon somewhere in sight for the touring. and I managed to like tour like crazy for another four years, three years, and then it had to kind of take a step back for me being a parent. And I would say my confidence has always been very mixed. I can't say I'm always, I'm always willing to go into something and try it. Like I'm willing to go up on stage and sing a song with people that I only learned, you know, 20 minutes ago. I don't know if that's confidence or I don't know what that is. But I'm definitely ready to be worried and insecure at all times about what I have to offer. Every time I write a song

and I think, this is great. Okay, that's it. That's the last one. It's never going to happen again. It's like, and I have to tell myself, no, you think this every time. You always think it's the last one, but it's never the last one. But it's, so coming out of semi-sonic and going into trying to write songs for people was interesting because I kept asking people, do you want to write a song with me? In Minneapolis, no one wanted to do it. No one wanted to like, because everyone thought their method was really dumb and really embarrassing and they made it up themselves, which is true. They did make it up themselves. Nobody realized that they made up the same method as everybody else. Everyone is the same. Their method is hacked together over years and then slowly refined, you know?

So I kept asking people in Minneapolis, we write a song with me, and people were like, no, I've never done that, you know, no one wanted to do it. So one of the things I did in response to that is to organize some trips to Nashville. Because I had heard, and I had always listened to country records. And when we were on tour, like our drummer, Elaine, was obsessed with Alan Jackson.

So we'd always listened to the dead and Alan Jackson and Soundgarden. and Nirvana and Flaming Lips and Liz Fair and Bjork, you know. But a country was always in the mix, and I had a lot of reverence for the music that came out of Nashville. So I thought, okay, maybe I can go to Nashville and learn what it is that they do there that I admire so much. So I came here every year a couple times for like five or six years and wrote with people. one of the songs you wrote with Dirk's a good friend of mine.

Yeah. You wrote Home with Dirk's. And to me, as a songwriter, you guys were able to write a song that felt patriotic, but not cliche, not nationalist. And there's a difference, right? I felt like, I don't know if it was on purpose, but I feel like you guys walked that line. Will you purposefully walking that line? Okay, that's funny that you should ask that because it relates to something I said before,

it and it's I love that question. When we, can I tell my version of how we wrote it? It may not be Brett Sir Dirk's version exactly, but the way I remember it, we all got together, I was real excited. I had insisted that there would be a piano at the session and apparently it was kind of a pain in the butt

to organize that. I didn't realize that it, you couldn't always just say, I need a piano at the session. But there was a piano at the session and we all showed up and we sort of were shooting the breeze before we started and then Dirk's got a text or a call from his wife who was a cold morning and her Prius wouldn't start and so he hopped in his giant truck and drove away he said I'll just be 15 minutes I'm sorry

I'm sorry I got to jump start my wife's car so he disappeared and Brett and I were sitting there and we talked for a little while and I was sitting at the piano while I was talking to him and I I turned to the piano and I literally just was like, you know, what's this thing like? And I played one chord with two hands. And Brett was holding on to his guitar at the time. And he played that the guitar riff from the song, like instantly. Like I was holding the note on the piano and he just played the beginning of the song. And where did I, I said, where did that come from?

I was like, that's amazing. I love that. That's incredible. And he goes, well, I guess it came out of that piano chord and out of this. And he pointed to a cross that was on his guitar. And he pointed out, he said, it came from there. And so Brett and I kind of played around with a shape for the verse instrumentally. Dirk's come back in 15 minutes.

And he goes, okay, so let's get started. And we said, well, we do have something. And we played him what we were doing. And he was like, did you do this yesterday? When did you write this? and we said no we did this while you were off jump starting your wife's car and he said this is incredible

and I said I have some thoughts about it it reminds me of it reminds me of I don't know it's almost like it feels like it's got to be a patriotic song and maybe it even has to have the word America in it and they both went ugh no

like so so that's me going to the cheesy excess. But it is what it was about. It just didn't it didn't need to say that word. And that was their opinion and I totally agree.

I'm really glad that we didn't do that. I'm glad we kept it more metaphorical. I think it's a beaut. I love it. Yeah, I do too. You wrote someone like you with Adele. Just you two? Yeah. To write.

Did she sing the, I don't know, the demo, the work tape? Does she sing the work tape too? Yeah. Because a lot of the times here, like, my friends, if they're the artist, they won't sing the work tape. Because they don't really want the work tape of them singing that early version of it existing. So one of the writers that can also sing will sing the work tape in case it never comes. So that way it can't like accidentally be put out.

Wow. That's what I wondered about the Adele. Like, did she sing the work tape? And was that even a thought where maybe you sing it. So if it does exist somewhere, it's not Adele singing a song that she never put out. When we wrote together, she wasn't, she, she had had some nice medium-level success in America, and she had played on SNL, and it had gone really, really well.

But she wasn't hounded by photographers and whatnot. She wasn't living that life. So that wasn't really in the equation, you know, avoiding a leakable version of the song. However, we cut it in this small studio in L.A., which had a piano in it, a really nice piano, So I often wanted to do writing sessions there because it was this beautiful Steinway there. And we wrote it there.

She sang it there. I played the piano there. On the second day we got it, we ironed out some pretty bad kinks that it had in the first day, and we'd finished the song. And there's no work tape of it. There's just that demo of us. And there's no other version. Well, they tried recutting it a couple times with a full orchestra and band, and it wasn't cool.

So they just contacted me at the last second And said, can you send the parts to the demo? Wow. We're going to mix it for the record. And that's what's the record. That's what we hear. So really, that was the first version of the song. That was the work tape

because it was literally her and me hashing it out and me just being a perfectionist about her getting a real performance. Where do you keep your Grammys? There's a bookshelf in my living room that has three out of the four and the fourth one still in the mail apparently.

No way. You never got it? I haven't gotten it yet. It's always a long delayed thing. That's funny. It always takes a long time. Then you get it. You're like, what's this big square box that just arrived?

You know, you don't, and it's often from some, like, I don't know where it's from a publicity firm or a law office or stuff. I can't remember how they do it, but it's never like from the Grammys,

you know, so you get, oh, what's in this? Maybe it's a piece of music gear that I forgot I bought. I'm always confused by that because I get a, if it's like an ACM or a CMA or whatever,

it'll be like fragile. I mean, what are the order that's fragile? Like, why is there a fragile box on my porch? The fragile thing throws me off more than anything because I don't really order fragile things. And then I'm like, because you're right, it takes like three. You don't get the award at the show.

You get it when you've forgotten entirely about it. Yeah. Yeah. Well, my CMA this year showed up in many pieces. It was... No way to get broken in the mail. It was busted. The fragile need to be bigger on that box.

It was really fragile, yeah. The new instrumental album, Good Night, Los Angeles. It comes out May 9th. You guys on tour with Toad the Wet Sprocket? Yes, this summer. That's super cool. Yeah. That's fine.

Yeah. We saw them, Eddie and I saw Toad the Wet Sprocket a few years ago. Yeah? Still got it. Oh, I love them. I love their songs. Glenn and I've been friends for a long time. And so I'm looking forward to that.

And John and Jake and I, if we can just organize some way or reason to play a bunch of shows every year, we always feel really lucky. We'll put all the tour stuff down in our notes. here on the podcast. But Dan, I'm a massive fan. It's super cool that you came by. I think I could go two hours, but I know you're riding today. You got a whole Nashville experience ahead of you. So I won't take up too much of your time. But thank you for giving me the last 40 minutes or so. Bobby, thank you. This has really been fun. That's awesome. The Bobbycast, we'll be right back.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care which I'll say it. Yep, that's me. Clipper Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits. the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football, or my career in sports media. Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment,

and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be.

Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either.

We always say that, trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands.

I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Ego Wode. My next guest, you know from Stepbrothers, Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network. It's Will Ferrell. Woo! Woo! My dad gave me the best advice ever.

I went and had lunch with him one day, and I was like, and dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through, and I know it's a place that come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet. Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot.

He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall, and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there. Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck.

Listen to Thanks Dad on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. This is the Bobbycast. All right, with Dan, it's pretty cool. As we mentioned in the intro, all the songs, he wrote for other artists. What I wanted to do was take a second and talk about artists

who wrote songs for other artists either early in their career before they blew up or they did it as they were blowing up or they did it like Dan after they already had their time as an artist.

And so I have like 10 of these. I have Sia. She wrote diamonds. Did you ever hear the Sia? Mike, give us to the podcast clips of them playing this where you hear Sia sing it. I think Benny Blanco

plays it from his computer. Oh yeah. It's really cool when Sia sings it. But so she wrote diamonds for Rihanna, titanium, which she's on, David Geta, but it wasn't supposed to have her name on it at all. And Sia is like reluctantly famous, because she hit her face for a long time. Yeah, with the wig. Yeah.

So Sia was a songwriter first. Ryan Teter, who's the lead singer of One Republic, so was already an in-demand songwriter, then has his artist vessel. They blow it. up, but songs that he wrote other than than one republic songs, he wrote

and there's a halo, the halo. Beyonce. I could see your halo. Halo, halo. Rumor has it. Adele. Yep. And how are I sing this? I'm a sucker for you. I'm a sucker for you. I'm a sucker for you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Jonas Brothers. Yeah. So he did that. Chris Stapleton, which we knew Chris a bit before he blew up as an artist. We had him on our show before he ever had a hit. He wasn't always a massive artist. Now, he was always trying to do the artist thing in different forms, but, you know, he wrote, drink beer with Luke Bryan. He wrote this song with Thomas Red that's like, oh, ah, you know that, that, yeah, I don't even know what that one was. Yeah, it kind of sounds like, that's the sound of them, the chain game song, but it was a Thomas Red song.

Yeah, I think he might have had some trouble with that. Oh, really? Yeah, I think so. Thomas Rett written a bunch of songs. And with Thomas Rett, I feel like he's always been a front-facing artist, but they write so many songs. And Thomas Rite So, He'll come in and talk about how he's written a song and he's writing it for himself, but the timing isn't right,

meaning there's no album in sight. Like, they just had made an album, put out an album, and he's like, this song is so good. so I'm just going to go ahead and give it away. I think Stars Like Confetti, right, for Dustin Lynch? Yeah, like he liked that song, but he said the timing was so wrong and that he was going to have to hold it for like a year and a half.

So Dustin Lynch got it. That's that, Stars like confetti. Yeah, yeah. What's the noise it does? Yeah, yeah. He did round here, Florida Georgia Line. 1994, Jason Aldeen. Thomas Redd has a bunch.

I was watching a whole TikTok series on Julia Michaels. I say serious. I've watched so much Benny Blanco content. And he talks about Julian Michaels because they wrote a bunch together.

And so I'll do this first. Julian Michaels before she was a singer. She did Justin Bieber sorry. I have too many songs in my head right now

at this point. Sing that one. Is it too late now to say sorry? Yeah. And good for you for Selena Gomez. But when they wrote,

I got issues. The label according to Benny Blanco wanted to get that to like a big artist and Julian Michael's according to his story calls I'm like hey I want that song for myself because I think I want to be an artist

and he was like awesome and so that's really what launched her as an artist that song was so good because I got issues Ed Shearin he this oh man

I got like three Benny Blancos in a row the story was that they were in the back of the bus and I think they were going to go through customs or something in the bus in a few hours. So it was like, we can go to sleep now and just wake up in a few hours

or we can just stay up and write a song. And so they just stayed up and wrote a song. And they wrote that Love Yourself. And Ed Shearin's got like the work tape and he's playing it on the computer. The tone of like Bieber and Shearant are similar-ish to where it doesn't sound like

Bieber did a whole other version of it. But yeah, they just kind of wrote that because they didn't want to fall asleep. Yeah, and I think he said he was going through a breakup. He's like, I don't want to write a song about a breakup. He's like, no, we should write a song about you not wanting to write a song about a breakup. You should go in love. The whole Selena Gomez relationship has really taken me to love Benny Blanco. Not even if they're dating, but it's put him more, again, him more front-facing because he's a producer.

But he's like the most likable guy. I mean, even the connection with that song, because Beaver ended up cutting it about Selena Gomez and then he ends up with Selena Gomez. Oh, I didn't think about that layer of it. Yeah. I knew that is weird. That's got to be weird for all of them. them. Because I saw where like Bieber and Slena's

unfollowed or she unfollowed Benny I guess was the big story uh

Bruno Mars before just the way you are he wrote and I you drive around town with a girl

I love and I'm like knit you for Celo which is fun Casey Musgraves she co-wrote

Mama's Broken Heart for Miranda Lambert Lizzo uh was a session artist because Lizzo plays the flute

which is very interesting because nobody plays the flute in the pop world but Lizzo worked as a songwriter and a session artist in Minneapolis before she broke through as a solo artist but she wrote for some of Prince's protégés and

doesn't have, from me looking at it up doesn't have any massive hits that she wrote but was like oddly behind the scenes very relevant because again she was a session flute player and background singer. I almost play the flute and band. What kept you from doing it? I couldn't bring myself to play the flute. I was like, I can't see myself going. What led you to want to do the flute? Because you were in a punk band. Yeah, but I wanted to audition for band in

sixth grade. So they did this thing where they brought all these teachers with all these instruments and said, pick an instrument. And I wanted to be percussion, but everybody wanted to do percussion because I wanted to be a drummer. And they're like, too many spots. Nobody's, they're all filled. So then they wanted me to play flute. And I was like, I can't do that. So I settled on clarinet. Oh, they wanted you to play flute. Yeah, they were like, it's totally open right now. We have a lot of slots over here. You should go to flute. And I was like, no, no, I'll do clarinet. I didn't know you played clarinet. Yeah, that was first chair, man. If one was putting your hands now, I think I could figure it out. I played probably two to three years of clarinet. So I think I could still

remember it. Did you enjoy playing clarinet? I loved it at the time. But then, like you said, I wanted to be in a punk band. So I was like, I got to play guitar now. Man, it would be so punk to play clarinet in a punk band because it would be so not punk that it would be so punk it would be so punk it would cut through so much in a punk song a clarinet solo how did you get a clarinet because one of the reasons i didn't do music was i couldn't afford an instrument because they were expensive yeah you could rent it is that what you guys did yeah i think we could rent it for like 20 bucks a month or something like that so yeah rented a clarinet yeah i was secretly jealous of the band kids because i really wanted to do music but i couldn't i don't i did there may have been rental options

but I couldn't afford the instrument in my mind so I never even tried. So then I was like, nah, band sucks. But really secretly, like in my heart, I was a little jealous that these kids got to play band. I think the coolest part was like learning how to read music. That's how I did it. Let's take a quick pause for a message from our sponsor.

A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me. Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, the reactions, my journey from basketball to college football or my career in sports media.

Well, somewhere along the way, this platform became bigger than I ever imagined. And now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Clifford Show. This is a place for raw, unfiltered conversations with some of your favorite athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated.

One week, I'll take you behind the scenes of the biggest moments in sports and entertainment, and the next we'll talk about life, mental health, purpose, and even music. The Clifford Show isn't just a podcast. It's a space for honest conversations, stories that don't always get told, and for people who are chasing something bigger. So, if you've ever supported me or you're just chasing down a dream, this is right where you need to be. Listen to The Clifford show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either. We always say that trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist.

I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no. I vowed I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends.

Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, everyone? I'm Ego Wode. My next guest, you know from Step Brothers Anchorman, Saturday Night Live, and the Big Money Players Network.

It's Will Farrell. Woo, woo. My dad gave me the best advice ever. I went and had lunch with him one day. And I was like, and dad, I think I want to really give this a shot. I don't know what that means, but I just know the groundlings. I'm working my way up through and I know it's a place they come look for up and coming talent. He said, if it was based solely on talent, I wouldn't worry about you, which is really sweet.

Yeah. He goes, but there's so much luck involved. And he's like, just give it a shot. He goes, but if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall, and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit. If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration. It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat. Just hang in there.

Yeah, it would not be. Right, it wouldn't be that. There's a lot of luck. Listen to Thanks, Dad, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And we're back on the Bobbycast. Neo started out behind the scenes. he wrote irreplaceable for Beyonce

and then he became a star he's from Arkansas, do you know that? I think I've looked that up before when I've got famous people from Arkansas He doesn't like rep it hard or anything That's what I was like, is this true or not? Megan Trainor and she has written even country songs.

She's written songs for Rascal Flats She's written for Sabrina Carpenter I think in her earlier days Did you see, I was watching a bunch of the Fortnite stuff with the new Sabrina Carpenter skin? Yeah. And how they'll come together and turn into a band.

Yeah. I just saw them doing pretty suggestive things with them too coming together. Oh, that's funny. I saw like six of them, and they're fighting other people and other skins, and they didn't know each other, but then they all just decided to team up,

and all of a sudden there's six of them fighting everybody else. And then once there was nobody else around, it allowed them to have instruments, and they start playing espresso with full instruments, drums, singer, the whole thing. That's funny You're playing Fortnite Yeah for about a year

Yeah I'm just not much of a shoot him up Like it was fun But it was so kid intensive Where I can play I have like Three friends and we play Madden I only need three friends total

And I can play a lot of that by myself With Fortnite If I'm playing by myself There are also like other kids I'm playing against It was just too much And so it also wasn't that good Because I didn't care that much about it

where I love sports, so I had, like, dialed in to make Arkansas win the championship. But yeah, I had about a year of Fortnite. Charlie Puth, and he still writes a lot, but he co-wrote slow motion, portray songs,

even back when he was doing YouTube. Charlie Puth, to me, I think of, for just having perfect pitch because he'll pitch on TikTok. Yeah. Because he can identify pitch, but he can also make pitch, which is really interesting.

I was watching the Yacht Rock documentary on Max. And what I did know about Yacht Rock, well there was a lot but I didn't know that that term didn't exist when yacht rock was actually happening yacht rock is actually a term that was made up by people on the internet way later referring to that music of like soulful mostly white people with beards that played guitars and so yacht rock was the thing they did in like the early 2000s and identified it all way later and so Kenny Loggins was like the king of yacht rock.

And Kenny Loggins is, foot loose, but he wrote what a full belief for the Doobie Brothers, a song that won Grammy for Song of the Year. And this is that song here.

Nothing says Yacht Rock like this song here. Because the Doobie Brothers has like, to me, and I wasn't alive when they were massive, but they have like two versions. They have the hippie version, which we talked about,

which is like, whoa, whoa, China Grove. Or I want to hear some funky Dixieland pretty mom going to take me by. They like that, which is, oh, black water, keep on rule. Miss April moon, won't you keep on shining on me?

And then they have this, which feels like Yacht Rock Central. The documentary is pretty good. Not my favorite. Have you watched those Bill Simmons? I think they're called Music Box. Documentaries? I think I've seen maybe, was one of the Woodstock ones part of that? Yes.

Then yes, the Woodstock. Awesome. And people would get there and look at the lineup and they look at it now, and they were like, golly, look it. testosterone filled. Yeah, and it ends up being just an S show because Limp Biscuit and Chili, everybody's like urging the crowd to go crazy. So they do and they burn everything down and but also just the full lineup like that enough of that music over that amount of time probably just gets all the testosterone. Like

Atlantis was like, what is it so weird? Like Joel I think played it. I think yeah, she had a terrible experience. And she was like, this is not for me. There's another one that I watched. Okay, this is what it was. Jewel did that but I watched the Alanis one that he made by it was awesome yeah that was really good like I forgot just how transcendent she was as an artist because she's been around for so long now but that jagged little pill album that thing had like five singles on it which was unheard of back then because it took a song forever to make it to number one on like top 40 radio but the Alanus one was really good it made me want to go see her I think she's doing a residency in Vegas and that one made me want to go see

Alanis. I think it was in that documentary where she said she didn't get recognized too much after her first music video because her hair was in her face the whole time. Oh yeah, because you ought to know. It's like, yeah, it's like from far back and her hair's in her face. That's crazy. Because I want you to know that I had. And that was an alternative song. Now it feels like that's like soft pop or like mainstream for then. But that thing I believe launched on like the alternative station in Los Angeles. I just heard that as a pop song. Yeah, it was very, very, and part of it is, is,

would she go down on you in a theater? And that was in the song until they took it out. Yeah, Atlantis was awesome. But like we're talking about with Dan, a lot of these artists, Tyler Hubbard's a guy too who wrote a bunch of songs and is a songwriter aside from doing his solo work with Florida Georgia Line

and even Tyler Hubbard now and he has a bunch of songs. But I just want to take a minute and talk about other artists who were songwriters either before, during, or after their artist careers. Which I didn't know the story that Dan told.

I didn't know that kid got sick and that's why they kind of stopped, like touring. Did you know that? I didn't know that. Yeah, I didn't either. But I thought it was awesome and thank you guys for listening

and thanks for hanging out with the Bobbycast. If you don't mind, share this with a friend. If they love music, like for the most part, this is just a music podcast. And it was super cool to have Dan on. So I feel like I'm a bigger a simasonic fan than I was. I didn't know the guy was like a Harvard, like music genius. Like,

that's pretty cool. Because I feel like they just see it different. Like, I'll never, I can, I don't think I would ever talk music and be able to understand what he's actually seeing in his head as he's talking about it, like that level. Like, if you talk with like a really good comedian or somebody in art, you just can't see what they're seeing. And I feel like I would never be able to understand what he was actually saying. On a scholar level? Yeah, like, so I appreciate him dumbing it down for us today. Yeah, thank you guys for listening. You follow the Bobbycast on social media. That would be awesome.

And we will see you guys next week. All right, bye, everybody. Thanks for listening to a Bobbycast production. A win is a win. A win is a win. I don't care what you're saying. Yep, that's me, Cliver Taylor the 4th. You might have seen the skits, my basketball and college football journey,

or my career in sports media. Well, now I'm bringing all of that excitement to my brand new podcast, The Cliver Show. This is a place for raw, unfills of conversations with athletes, creators, and voices that not only deserve to be heard, but celebrated. So let's get to it. Listen to The Clifford Show on the IHeard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. And for more behind the scenes, follow at Clifford and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins. But the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice, Ms. Owens, correct? I doctored the test ones. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern. Two more men who'd been through the same thing. Greg Gillespie and Michael Rancini. My mind was blown.

I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped. Laura, Scottsdale Police. As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences. Listen to Love Trapped podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When a group of women discover they've all day. the same prolific con artist. They take matters into their own hands.

I vowed, I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that, trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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