The Bobby Bones Show - FEELING THINGS - How to Get People to Like You More + Why Glen Powell Couldn't Eat Ketchup for Years

Episode Date: August 29, 2026

Amy bought Glen Powell's ketchup on a whim at the store and there’s so much more to this then we realized. We get into his wild journey from a childhood ketchup trauma to co-founding his own organic condiment brand, Smash Kitchen. Kat unpacks family systems for us and the different roles people tend to fall into growing up, the Hero, the Mascot, the Lost Child, the Placater, and the Scapegoat, and talk through why the "truth teller" of the family so often ends up labeled as the problem. We also talk about a psychological trick called the Benjamin Franklin Effect, the surprising reason people actually like you more when you ask them for a small favor, not the other way around. Plus, we share an incredibly touching story from a Hasbro Moment listener whose autistic son found connection and confidence through simple board games like Hi Ho! Cherry-O and Hungry Hungry Hippos, thanks to a teacher who knew exactly what he needed. Hasbro is sponsoring Feeling Things for 8 weeks, celebrating back to school by getting families around the table with games again. Even better: they're helping us honor amazing teachers! Know one? Email [e-mail] or call 877-207-2077, they could get featured on the show, plus a $500 Walmart gift card from Hasbro for classroom supplies. Grab your favorite Hasbro games like Guess Who?, Monopoly, Clue & more at Walmart.com!   Get some Feeling Things merch by clicking HERE! (FeelingThingsPodcast.com) Sign up for the Feeling Things newsletter HERE! Watch us on Youtube HERE! Find us on TikTok: @radioamy Call and leave a voicemail: 877-207-2077 Email: [e-mail] HOSTS: Amy Brown // RadioAmy.com // @RadioAmy Kat Van Buren // threecordstherapy.com // @KatVanburenSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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and the in between sometimes the best thing you can do it just out this is feeling things with amy and cat happy tuesday welcome to feeling things i'm amy and i'm cat and my feeling of the day is i don't know why naughty keeps coming to mind because it's not it but it feels naughty i am a hinds ketchup girl through and through like i love me some hines oh do you Even the organic one throws me off a little bit, but I'll still be able to identify it. I mean, I've done a full-blown taste test, and I can always pick out my Heinz. I bought a different kind of ketchup. So I've cheated on Heinz, and I bought this stuff that I guess Glenn Powell is a part of.

You know who he is? He's an actor. He was a top gun. Never seen it. The second one. That Netflix movie with Sidney Sweeney. He's a cutie. Yeah. Yes. And he was on the marketing for this ketchup as either one of the investors or he's a creator. I don't know his role. It really doesn't matter. He was just on the little, what's that called? Where there's like campaign? Yeah, but at the end of an aisle where they have the bump out and they've got all this stuff, it's called something specific. A sign? Yeah. But the sign, not like a marquee, but we're going to get there. Let's figure this out together. The special product at the end of the

No, it's a setup. It's like you want display. That's it. They're getting closer. But there's a specific word for it. People that work in shelving and distribution probably know exactly what we're talking about. And it's not display? It's not display.

It would be like the special promo. Yes. It is, that is the definition of the word I'm trying to think of. It's a special promotional display called something. that's on an aisle at the grocery store. Either way, they had this special thing that we can't think of. Was it him, like a cutout of him? He's on, yeah, he's part of the whole thing.

And then there's all these ketchupes. And it says, smash kitchen, I think is the name of it. And I thought, I'm going to buy one, which felt a little naughty because I'm, I'm buying it because of some hot guy. Yeah. And I'm, you know, messing around on high. And I got to say it's good. As good? I am not like disgusted by it.

Would you buy it again, though? I might. It depends if I'm walking by and they have it on the aisle and a little promotional bump out display thingy. Well, look at that has worked like using like a, I mean, duh, we know this, but using an attractive male figure to sell things works. And the fact that he made it in his kitchen and now I'm eating it. I'm just kidding.

Okay. I was like, what? Yeah. Okay, so you're feeling naughty. Is that the word? What's the word? I'm feeling risky. I took a risk.

Are you feeling naughty because, like, it's bad. I did a bad thing because Heinz is going to find out. We're naughty because I'm eating Glenn Pau's ketchup. I think it's that I bought a ketchup because a good looking guy was on the, while you sure you're feeling of a day. I feel like a bad girl. So it feels, and it would have been a waste of, I don't know how. much as ketchup was, is it four bucks? Okay. Yeah. I'm so particular about ketchup that the likelihood of

me enjoying this ketchup was low. How about you're feeling risque? Like, you're feeling a little risky and also you're like, ooh, there you go. I bought this hot guys ketchup. Yeah. So I'm just letting you know, if you see the display, it's, I mean, if you know what the word that we're talking about, please let us know. Well, while you're sharing your feeling of the day, I am looking up what the word is. Well, you're going to like my feeling. If you're feeling naughty, you're going to like my feeling. What is it? Because it's an alliteration.

I'm feeling nostalgic. Ooh. Okay. But I don't know. I actually don't know if that fits either. I don't know if it's nostalgic or like a little sad. This is my last week ever, ever in my current office that I've been at since the beginning of 2020. So I think that's over six years.

And that's a big thing. Moving out. And I don't know where I'll be when I come back from maternity leave, which I'm not even going on maternity leave yet, but I am stopping in person right now. And you are getting there, just some behind the scene stuff. Lavering as a breathing. Cat can barely breathe. And every time she sits down, she's like, I am so uncomfortable. These chairs are not meant for pregnant me.

and we try to put together lengthy episodes, but I feel like leading up to your pregnancy, the episodes might get a little shorter. Get a little shorter and shorter. Because Kat's like, I can't sit here for much longer. And I get hot. Like, I'm just hotter. I know.

I think I'm going to have to go turn the air down. Yeah. Because, and I'm having sympathy. So you're getting. Because I'm suddenly uncomfortable in the chair. And like, now I'm hot. And I want to put my hand. on my belly.

It's like we're synced up. I have the name. Okay. I have the name. And it's called an end cap. I would have never gotten there. Oh, I've never heard of that. I have and I'm mad at myself because I know this word.

I don't know if I took this in Marketing 101. Oh. Back in college, but a in retail marketing and end cap is a freestanding display unit or to or genendend. Jenind. Why can't? I'm like, my eyes. G-E-N-D-E-N-D.

Jennd? Jennd. Jennd. Is a display for a product place at the end of an aisle. I guess some people call it in-cap and some people call it Jen-end. But I don't know. Jen-N-N-N-N-W-E-N-W-E-N-We would have still been talking about this if you were waiting for me to guess that. I think eventually it would have come to me because that is the exact word I was looking for.

Okay, well, now we know. Um, here's, in Wikipedia, this is the in caps at a Walmart store in retail marketing or any other store is a freestanding display unit or Jen End. Now I know what Jenin stands for. General End shelving is a display for a product place at the end of an aisle. And that's what this was. Glenn Powell was at the end of the aisle in a display with his ketchup. And I bought it. It worked. Was it on sale? No. No. No. I just they were it got it got the gen end for that week or think um because you know how like celebrities like you know they always go into another business venture so a lot of people make you see a lot of people doing skincare or drinks like alcohols or whatever what makes you think I'm going to get into ketchup oh I think he likes ketchup I think I I wouldn't get into ketchup well To me, I think maybe he was passionate about making, maybe they make mustard too. I don't know.

But maybe he loves condiments. Maybe he wanted to make it healthy. I have no idea what the ingredients are. I don't know. You have nothing about this ketchup. He seems like a very fit, health conscious person. So maybe he wanted to make his special way. Is this an organic ketchup?

I have no idea. Listen. I saw, I grabbed, I bought, I tried. And it was good. So if you were going to be a celebrity brand guy, woman, what do you think you, what product line would you go into? I mean, ketchup? I could make ketchup. I would maybe want to do a skincare or some sort of protein.

Oh, yeah. I would do a protein bar because let me tell you. Another feeling of the day is disappointed. And you know this because I was driving home from the studio and we were on our way to meet at my house to do this. And I was starving and all I had in my bag was this protein bar that I bought randomly. I'm not going to throw any names under the bus, but it was so disappointing. I was like, I told you, I was like, this protein bar is horrible, but I'm going to eat it because I'm so hungry. So that's what you would do.

I don't know any celebrity facing protein bars, do you? Or, I mean, I'm just not thinking. No? Because you can't, this is my thought. You can't do skincare. Everybody has skin care. Yeah, but they make a lot of money on that. Yeah, but think about how much competition.

you have. I don't know. I can't think of one famous person's protein bar, but I can think of a lot of famous people's skincare or makeup lines. Well, back up. I'm not like famous. If you are, if you were. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. Protein bar, I feel like it's safer. Okay. I have Glenn Powell's journey with ketchup. I googled it. He is now making ketchup as part of his new condiment line, Smash Kitchen, which he co-founded after a childhood experience left him traumatized by ketchup. Who knew this is going to lead to like actual mental health-minded or related content? He has since rediscovered his love for the condiment and aims to offer organic options for consumers. So I guess it's organic to answer your question.

I'm getting there. Glenn Powell's relationship with ketchup changed dramatically due to a childhood prank. As a kid, he loved ketchup and used it on everything. So did I. What's everything? Everything. Macaroni and cheese, eggs. My dad used to tell me food was just a carrier for ketchup.

Like, I wanted to eat ketchup and I had to use food to get it done. Like, that's how much I loved ketchup. Okay. However, during a sleepover, his friend's sister poured ketchup on him while he was sleeping. The Texas son baked. the ketchup creating a terrible smell that traumatized him and made him unable to eat ketchup for years. After years of avoiding ketchup, Glenn has rediscovered his love for the condiment through his new venture smash kitchen. He co-founded this organic condiment line to offer healthier options to

consumers. The brand includes various flavors such as ketchup. They have classic or hot honey ketchup. Oh, I want to try that. I'm intrigued. Classic mustard, two mayonnaise options, classic spicy mayo, and then barbecue. They have classic or honey barbecue. His mission is to transform the condiment market by providing organic options that are free from artificial additives. His goal is to make delicious healthy condiments accessible to families, making a full-circle moment from his childhood experience to now creating his own ketchup. Okay. So was he sleeping outside at this sleepover, it sounds like?

I guess so. Also, that's a crazy prank. I mean, I've frozen my friend's underwear at like a sleepover. Or, you know, the trick where you put their hand in the water while they're sleeping. But I've never thought to pour ketchup on somebody. That's mean. Do you think as a co-founder, he's like, hey, I think put me on the end cap and we'll sell some ketchup. Yeah.

Or the marketing team is like, Glenn, we really need to put you. I mean, because they didn't put them on the bottle, but I'm... I definitely think everybody in the room is probably like, yes, we need you. You would never have bought that if it would just... No. I mean, the packaging is cute. But for me to step out on Heinz, it's got to be something which... All the things were right that day to where I bought it.

And it was good. And now we know. Now we know. A childhood. So the weirdest thing you put ketchup on as a kid is macaroni and cheese. Well, I don't know if that's weird. it on most everything. I would dip sandwiches in it. I would eat it with steak, which some people would be mortified by. I think that's a thing a lot of kids do. Well, kids, but I'll

do that as an adult. Like, if I were to go to a steak house and you want me to eat a steak, I would like some ketchup, please. And that is not compliments to the chef, right? And I'll be like, it's not you, it's me. People are so hoity-to-to-y about their steak, though. So my mom used to make me bologna and ketchup sandwiches and pack them in my mom. And I'm like, my lunch as a kid. Do you like them? I have a kid, yes, but now I, okay, I have to admit something. Get Bell, Pure Fiber Internet with Crave, Netflix, and Disney Plus from $94 a month.

Price guaranteed for two years on internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit. Visit bell.ca for details and to check availability. Bell, connection is everything. I have to admit something. I would never choose to eat that now. Bologna kind of like freaks me out, even though I'll eat a hot. dog sometimes baloney feels different than me to me to me I think if I took a bite of a bologna and ketchup sandwich I would like it it would be nostalgic yes sort of but I'm not ever

wanting that you know what slaps is a child when it comes to its game to sandwiches and I don't make it now but I made it all the time and you're going to hate it because it involves mayonnaise but it's white bread mayonnaise sour cream and onion chips and that's it's a potato chip sandwich so good. That's basically a mayonnaise sandwich. You can use his special mayonnaise. Maybe he'll send you a special package for cheating on Heinz. I don't think he's ever going to know.

Yeah, I doubt that. But I will say they're on to something. And I am intrigued by these other flavors, so I will check them out. And that is our ketchup moment. moment of the day speaking of moments we do have another hasborough moment coming up in the show where we'll be reading an email that we got and be doing a giveaway thanks to hasborough and walmart we've got our games here with us today this week it's guess who clue and monopoly when i had the walmart delivery sent to my house i had it dropped off and my dog immediately started eating the walmart box so

she didn't get anything inside of the game so it's still playable but inside of the game but inside the box. I do have a question that doesn't come up when it comes to games, though. Okay. So this is something, because you're a big game person. And I saw this online and I thought it was genius. If I said to you, Kat, you can still be a part of game night till the end of time, even after you die. Would you want to be? Is this like a hologram thing? Just asking, would you want to be a part of it? I mean, it's game night. Yeah. Yes.

Yeah. Okay. Not, yes. So here's what we can do. If you get cremated after you die, we can put part of your ashes into an hourglass and you still get to participate in game night because you would be the timer. That's honestly not a bad idea. I don't think so either. But are that I've never seen cremated ashes.

Is it like ash or is it like sand? Because is it going to work the same way? It's not like sand. Because an hourglass is sand. Good point. Maybe they could. mix it with sand because you're right it would have to pour the right amount of if it was a 60 second timer you're right that it would need to I don't think I would hate if you could figure that out like

honestly should we look into this like creating a multiple and then after you die you have them distributed to all your friends like hey I'm now a part of game night with you every night because there's plenty of ashes to go around especially for mixing with sand you could make multiple timers and have them delivered to people after you die. This is a great business idea. If people are making jewelry out of, you know what, then we could make, what do they call it hourglass? This is a great idea.

If somebody dies, it can be like a family package. Like we can make one for every family member. You can buy an ad on. Yeah, people could do custom. Yeah. I bought, today I bought a new phone case and I got to the checkout and it was like, do you want to buy a screen protector for $15? Do you want to buy a key ring for $20?

Do you want your initials engraved? Yes. And I said, no, no, no, no. But if it said, do you want a cremated hourglass for your game? I would say yes. Yeah. Sign me up. The problem is we need to wait until we die.

Yeah. Like, I don't have my dad's ashes anymore, but that would have been cool to take his. And then. Okay. What a cool gift if. If what? Okay. We all know we're going to die at some point.

So if I, you know, some people will plan their funerals before they die, especially if they know that's coming. That's something that you can plan. Like it can be part of, we probably need to partner with a funeral home. It can be a part of the package. Would you like to make keepsakes for all of your. Yeah. That'd be cool.

And then like, especially if somebody knows that like you love games or something or whatever. And then it's my funeral and the funeral director is like, hey, by the way, Catherine made you guys all of you. Yeah, they do upsell you there. I've had to do this for both of my parents, and there's always options of do you want their fingerprint put on a necklace? Oh, so this is already kind of like a good thing. Do you, you know, do you want their tooth as an ear? Like, they can really.

Stop it. No, they don't. There's their teeth. But they can make things out of before, like, if they are going to be cremated, they make sure to get their thumbprint or their fingerprint before they burn them. Or there's. I've told you this, I think, that my forensic. science teacher in high school, he is going to be turned into a diamond. Yes, that's an option. They can make you into jewelry. So that's kind of, I mean, kind of cool. Yeah. Who is he giving the

diamond to you? His kids probably. I think he was, he said him, this was so long ago, but I'm pretty sure he said him and his wife planned to be turned into diamonds. So I guess whoever dies first, the other spouse will get the diamond and then they'll pass it down. But like, think about this in like 200 years there's this like diamond that was your great great grandfather it's kind of cool if we're even around but is that actually a diamond in 200 years don't what do you mean by that AI it's taking over in 200 okay well that makes me a cat's gonna cry cat's gonna cry so but guess what your baby will have lived alive because 200 years your baby's not living that long either that makes me think like you're not

going to cry. Zoe's children. Yes. Like, when do we stop? You're not going to cry. You're already crying. I just, like, when do we stop having kids? If you, like, if that, because I did see something recently, and I try not to look too much into it because there's not a lot individually I can do to stop what is going to happen to the world. There are things I can do. I can recycle and, you know, not use chat GBT for everything. all of that. But I did see something that somebody was saying, like, I didn't listen to the whole thing, so I don't have a lot to report on it, but we're going down a dark path and like they're going to take over. Okay, that's if you choose to go down the dark path, though. There are optimists in that,

which at your baby shower. You just said, we're only going to be around for 200 more years. Well, I felt like that was like a comment you just say in passing. Like, I thought we would move right past it. And then your eye started watering. And then you were like, oh, no. Because I did just watch this AI documentary a couple of weeks ago. Actually, it was at your baby shower. Taylor told me to watch it. Oh, gosh. And it's, it was very helpful, though. And the guy that created it decided to do the documentary because him and his wife are having a baby. And he started to get scared of like, should we be bringing a child into this? And the first part of the documentary, there's a lot of fear around it. He interviews everybody from both ends. And then the pendulum swings to where he's like,

oh, wait, there are actually people that are really dialed into this. They're like, this actually isn't the end and there's a way we can coexist and survive this and it's actually going to be pretty cool like what a time to be alive well maybe I need to watch that then because that's okay you do because you will you will he's the the creator of that he chose to still have a kid yes because that was already happening I was going to like get rid of the kid but he is choosing to be an optimist about it because living in fear like that is no way to live well and I also do think this because I'm listening to a book about, actually, I can't figure out if it's more about World War II

or more about War I because it goes back and forth in time. The Alice Network, I think I told you about it. And I was thinking about there's pregnancy involved in it. So I was just thinking like, what is it like in a time like that, like World War to think about having a kid? like there's always going to be something that's going to say like this is not the best time there's something that's going to scare you so right now i mean we have wars too but right now it's like ai's freaking me out but like i can't just yeah i have to choose to have optimism because

she's coming she's coming i don't know if you can hear it in cat's breath yeah she is coming speaking of babies and families is that where you were going to go yeah okay i was going to say I've been thinking about because now I just got some more pictures of her. And the pictures you can get now at your ultrasounds are insane. Like you really can like see what they look like. However, her face is smushed up against my placenta so I can only see half her face. However, I was thinking about after that, like she's a real, she's a baby. Like she could come out now.

She's a full grown baby, not totally grown. But you know what I mean? So, like, I wonder what kind of baby she's going to be like and, like, what kind of kid she's going to like and what kind of personality she's going to have and, like, what kind of friends is she going to have in middle school and what sports is she going to like. So I just have been thinking about what kind of kid she's going to be now that it feels very real. And I don't think we've talked about the family roles down here. I mean, it doesn't sound familiar to me. So I'm also thinking about because there's these family roles that every dysfunctional family has. and every family has some kind of dysfunction

so you can find these roles in every family. And I learned about them in college and used them in my work all the time. And I know what role I played and my siblings and all of that. And I'm like, I wonder what family role she's going to be. So I want to go through them. We're not going to be able to protect that.

But we can talk about what we relate to and how it showed up in our families. And why is it helpful to know these family roles? I think it's, well, we'll get the last one. I'll save it for the end scapegoat. That one is actually really interesting to talk about because a lot of times a scapego is somebody that is seen as like a bad kid or an outsider, but they're actually a lot of times very healthy.

It can be like a clue for the family to help the family find health and regulate. But it's also helpful to know these roles so you, one, you can feel seen in some of this stuff. But also, if I know what role I'm playing, then I know what role I can stop. playing so I can actually get my needs met and the family can find help because what these roles do is they keep the family in what we call homeostasis which in dysfunction you're that would be staying in dysfunction when we have dysfunction in a family it feels like balanced I mean I felt that in relationships even that I know this relationship is unhealthy but that's what feels normal to me

you know and so these roles help keep that together and so when when somebody is like, oh, I'm not going to play my role anymore, then the family gets all wobbly. And then people are like, oh, no, we have to get this back in order. But really, we need to feel a little wobbly so we can find some help. We do that in all. It's like we're talking about family dynamic with kids, but that could be in a friendship and a romantic relationship,

a working relationship. because it's reminding me of a saying the devil you know is better than the devil you don't. Because you want to stay. Sometimes you want to stay in that because you know how to navigate it. Even though it can be really unhealthy, it's like, well, yeah, I could maybe go out and find something better or healthier. But it's like what would happen if I did? Yeah. I know this.

I know this chaos. but I don't know what's out there. So I'd rather stay here because that feels safer, even though out there could be so much better for you. Right. So I'm going to go through the different roles. Now, not every family or system is going to have every single role. And also something to think about is you can play more than one.

I relate to more than one of these in different areas in my life, in different times in my life. So I want you to think about like what you were. And I also think maybe I won't tell you. you can tell me what you think I was, where I am. Okay, so the first one is family hero, which is kind of self-explanatory. It's like the perfect child, the child that everybody can count on, the child that, you know, is getting straight A's, or the child that's the star athlete, or the one that every parent wants to brag about. And they kind of give like a shining star for the family.

They like give a, if there is dysfunction in the family, they can help, like, how. hide it because they have this. So is that you? Like I feel like you were... That's so sweet that you think it is. I feel like you were a higher achiever and like the golden child, but I mean in the classroom, I don't know what you were like at home, but... I was not the golden child in the home.

Growing up I was not. That's also interesting. I'm glad you actually said that because you know me as an adult, but you don't, didn't know me as growing up. Growing up, I had a lot of, um, how do we say this? I don't think my parents would ever say I'm a problem child but there was a lot of defiance at times but more so like I needed more I needed more I was not I was needy ish I hate even saying that I just wasn't go with the flow okay the hero is going to be

are you go with the flow now you don't think so um the hero is the golden and child and I was not like I was never the best at anything whether that was in my family or out and I didn't yeah I was smart but I didn't like excel or okay well I definitely was not that was your sister that or do you think that was she would have fallen more or so into that category than me well in the golden the not golden child but the hero a lot of times from if you're in the family you're looking at the hero being like it must be nice to be you. Like you have all the attention, you get all the accolades, everybody thinks you're so great, must be nice to be you, but also it's a lot of pressure.

So I think when you are the golden child, there's a lot of anxiety that comes with that. And maybe even anger too of like having to keep that up or because of that pressure. So I have a lot of compassion for the hero. Even though growing up, I would have looked at the hero in my family and been like, lucky. Must be nice. Yes. I would have said that. Okay.

So the next one is the mascot, which also is kind of self-explanatory in its name too. It's like the class clown of the family. So this is the kid that if there's a fight at the dinner table, and there's something going on, you're going to crack a joke to kind of ease the tension. You're the one that's trying to like break the ice or just even things out. You might even be like a class clown in your classroom. That's something that you just take on. Use a lot of humor. Could this be you? I mean, I think I wanted attention. I don't know that I was, you know, break break the tension. I wanted attention. Okay. But were you like a goofy kid? Kind of.

I mean there are parts of me that could be goofy and fun, but I wasn't, I don't know that I would put class clown. I would put, I could be disruptive. I was talking all the time. Well, this person is going to use humor or anything like that to ease any kind of tension, to soothe any kind of discomfort. They grow up a lot of times to be the kind of person who's in therapy who will say like, you know, I just got. in a car accident, ha ha, isn't that crazy? Like they'll make a joke out of everything

versus sitting there being like, I just was in a car wreck. It was traumatic and I'm so scared, straight-faced. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know yet. Well, let's go through all of them. Then you can say. But the next one is the lost child.

And this one will make me emotional because they're the kid that just gets left behind. And they're usually very well. well-behaved kids. They look like everything's okay.

They kind of don't want to add any more anything to what's going on. Sometimes they notice that they're lost. Sometimes they don't, but they just end up, they're just in the background. And the reason I think that happens a lot. Ooh, did you watch that show Cape Fear? Get Bell Pure Fiber Internet with Crave, Netflix, and Netflix. Disney Plus, from $94 a month, price guaranteed for two years on internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit. Visit bell.ca for details and to check availability. Bell, connection is everything.

I'm Munga Shatigula and I'm back with a new season of the podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I'm diving into a rabbit hole of peptides, organoids, blood boys, blue zones, and brain replacement to try to understand what this longevity obsession is all about. And what it really means to live forever for all of us. I learned about some rad science. I can make a brain for you, and then we can test what draw is the best for your brain, as opposed to his brain. Here's some hard truths.

I would expect Indians to age faster, but I did not expect it to be almost a four to five-year acceleration. And get myself into a world of trouble. I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. Make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know.

Listen to Skyline Drive How to Live Forever on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B.

I'm Julie Pinero, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people, and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here.

It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If your bookshelf and your for-you page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. This is Prose Society, the weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for thought daughters,

pop culture obsessives, and anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. I'm Eli Rallo and every week we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and the conversations everyone can't stop having. I'm going to have to look up this story. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. From bestselling authors and your favorite book talk creators to the latest pop culture moments, nothing is off the table. It's like if you can hide some real messages inside compelling characters, then that is a Trojan horse. Whether you're looking for literary deep dives, smart pop culture conversations, or a community of readers who love to think a little too much,

you're in the right place. Listen to Pro Society on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. See you between the pages. Did you watch that show Cape Fear? Yeah. Oh, it was a show? Oh, no.

Sorry. I saw the movie back in the day with Robert De Niro. Okay. They just made it into a show, and we just watched it. And if anybody listening has seen that show, So the daughter would be the lost child because the mom constantly, she kind of oscillates between like the hero and the lost child. I think she feels like the lost child, but her brother probably thinks she's the hero. Because they never have to worry about her because she's just always okay.

So she doesn't really get a lot of attention and she doesn't feel very seen. So that's what the lost child is. And what can happen is they can be the lost child. I'm going to be in the background, whatever. Eventually that might show up. They might rebel against that. Like when they finally do realize what's going on, they might start to act out. And then they can switch roles.

But I have a special place in my heart for a lost child. The easy child is what a lot of people would think they are. That wasn't me. Okay. That wasn't me either. And then the play came. So the placator is like the fixer of the family. They're like the family therapist almost.

They get triangulated in a lot of stuff. They're probably somebody, I mean later, not as a small kid, but later, they might be the person that everybody calls to talk about whatever is going on in the family. But they ease everything, not with humor like the mascot, but they will help like fix the problem. Do you think you're a placator now? I think I've always been a placator. Oh.

Yeah. I think maybe not always. I probably was a placator from like high school on. Yes. We've had listeners. They didn't use the word placator, but I'm thinking of emails that we've gotten during couch talks where people are, they're exhausted because they're the one everybody comes to.

They can end up being like the, what we would call the surrogate spouse to, a parent. So when there is a parent and a family that isn't emotionally available, they might be physically present. I mean, this can happen when there's a divorce and two and they're not physically present, but if they're even physically present, but they're not emotionally available or emotionally there, this placator can come and play surrogate spouse with that other parent to help lead the family or give emotional support to that parent. So as kids, our parents are supposed to be the ones that are caring for us emotionally. But when this dynamic happens, they're sharing that role, which can be really confusing

for a kid because that feels normal to them because it's what they know. And then they get exhausted later in life because that's the role that they always play. Placator can also, I'll say this from experience, it can feel really good. So to feel needed or to feel, they can make you feel wanted, it can make you feel important, it can make you feel smart or knowledgeable, special. So that's why a lot of times people don't rebel against those roles, because it feels really good to be the one that people go to until it doesn't. This is kind of reminding you, I'm going to veer away from this, but I saw this life hack

of if you want people to like you, ask for small favors from them. So people like you better when you ask for small favors, not the other way around. It's called the Benjamin Franklin effect. When somebody does something for you, their brains need to justify the effort. So they tell themselves, I must like this person. Otherwise, why would I do that? What does that have to do with Benjamin Franklin? Good question.

I got to look up. Sorry, I got side. by the Benjamin Franklin part. I'll look that up while we continue talking about this because that's just something I pulled and I stuck in there and I was like, wait, this is sort of like if you want people to like you, because you were saying people like it when people come to them. But this is saying if you want people to like you, ask for small favors. In small is probably the key there where it doesn't feel overwhelming.

So it's like, yeah, I'll do that. Yeah. I mean, think about if you've ever been asked to like help with something or do something or be there for somebody. It feels like almost like you're the chosen one. Like if my friend, let's, maybe not if they get stuck on the side of the road, but like, if my friend was, I don't know, needing to bake a birthday cake for something and was called me and was like, hey, I'm really nervous about making this cake because I have a lot of pressure. Like, would you come and do it with me?

I'd be like, oh, you want me to come do it with you? Like, yeah, that feels good. So it says here, the Benjamin Franklin effect is a psychological phenomenon where people tend to to like someone more after doing them a favor, especially if the favor is small. This occurs because individuals often rationalize their helpful actions by believing they must like the person that they helped, resolving any cognitive dissonance they may feel, which is what I was saying a minute ago, but what we want to know is why is it called? The Benjamin Franklin is that?

Did he do this? Was he like the captain of small favors? Maybe they just wanted to be one one. Orgeon, got it. Okay, finally. The effect is named after Benjamin Franklin, one of the founding fathers of the United States. Franklin famously used this strategy to improve his relationship with a political rival. Oh.

He asked the rival to lend him a rare book, which flattered the rival and led to a more amicable relationship. Franklin noted that people are more likely to help those they have already assisted, illustrating the principle behind the effect. So now we know. Okay. So ask your enemy. Can I borrow that book? Yeah.

Or your rival or just someone you want them to like you. Okay. I'm going to try this out. More you know. Okay. So we got to the final role. And this is the one that I feel like I talk about the most. And it's the scapegoat.

So this is. scapegoat while the hero is the golden child the scapegoat would be the problem child what is interesting about this is in reality the scapego often is one of the most healthiest in the family they just don't appear that way you're looking at me like how is that because like the scapegoat usually is like when i think of scapegoat i think of like a kid and like a leather jacket and spiked hair and chains and like I don't know, like bad, smoke cigarettes. Yeah, you, when you were like, this is me, I'm going to smoke cigarettes now. Well, that was for six weeks, but yeah.

Yeah. So that's what, like, my brain goes to. But the scapegoat really is a kid who is no longer playing by the same dysfunctional rules that the family is playing by. So a lot of times they're the truth tellers in the family, but the family might not want the truth to be told. so they act out because they don't want to play the game that the family's playing. They don't want to just keep the status quo of the dysfunction. So they're going to go essentially tell on the family by acting out in other ways. Yeah, that makes sense.

I definitely, especially as a child, but gosh, even thinking as an adult that has had a lot of work. Yeah. I still like to keep the status quo. Oh, so this was not, you don't feel like. I don't think I'm ever someone. I mean, I could ruffle some feathers a little bit. I mean, I have other people in my family that have gone through drama on their extended sides of family. And I want to, like, step in and for justice to be served.

Like, I've ruffled some feathers in initiated conversations and probably dabbled in stuff I shouldn't have. But that wasn't my immediate family. But I wonder if I was the one directly involved. I'm just like I would just let it be because I don't want to. You don't want the conflict in the... I don't want the conflict, but at the same time, I'm thinking about how I've come in and try to help people that I love. Yeah, which might not like...

But I'm not directly in the mix. Like, I'm not in the system. I'm an outsider being like, this is not right. So I'm going to step in and try to figure it out. But I do wonder if I was directly in it, which is a lot of them were. And they were all just like acting like this wasn't a thing. And I'm like, but that's what they're doing. They're just, that's their status quo and it's a game and it's like, why, why rock the boat?

This is just, we're going to keep, keep on living. Well, and what is interesting about a scapegoat is they don't usually know that they are like the truth teller. They often just feel, they feel very different from the family. Like they feel like an outsider because they have this part of them that's like, I'm not, I don't, I don't want to go along with these rules that we've been playing by. And there are a lot of times, the one. that get identified as like the identified patient of the family. The scapegoat is often the one that ends up in treatment or therapy or whatever. And then the family is just at home waiting for them to get better.

But what happens is when the scapegoat goes and gets help, that makes it even worse for the family because they're not going to reintegrate into the, then the family doesn't have that person to blame for dysfunction. They have to look at, okay, what's actually going on. So it ends up one of the best, the best week. when I worked in treatment was family weekend because what would happen is we would have clients come in. We would get to know them and their stories and all that. They would get working on their stuff.

And then when they were ready, they would have their family weekend. Their family would come. And I think the family would come expecting to be like, okay, you fixed my kid or you fixed my spouse or you fixed my brother. You fixed the problem. Yes. Whoever that may be. And then when they get there, we start talking about systems and how systems work. And yes, this person is taking accountability for his stuff 100%.

But then these people are forced to look in a mirror at like, what's my part in this? And the amount of people that would like storm out of sessions was, I mean, not surprising, but surprising. And the amount of people that would just rebel against and then they would love us and want to talk to us about updates every week. but as soon as they come to Family Week and then they really get into that actual work, they're like, you don't know what you're doing. Because a lot of times people don't want to have a mirror put up to them. Look inward. I was seeing a therapist probably like four, it was like four years ago.

And I was struggling with some people in my life of just some dynamics that had changed. And I felt like I had caused a huge problem. and it came from a really good place. So I was just trying to figure out like, did I do something wrong or like, what am I missing here? Like, how did this happen after like I created this situation out of having good intentions? And the therapist was like, well, here is the problem. You're a truth teller. You have a really hard time turning a blind eye and biting your tongue.

Truth tellers hold mirrors up to people. Most people don't want to look in the mirror. So if you hold a mirror up to somebody who doesn't want to look in the mirror, they're going to find a way to flip that back on you. And so I had to learn, because like, what do you do with that? Like, okay, like, do I just not be myself? But I had to learn like, okay, if I am a truth teller, what's the truth that actually needs to be told and what's like my own discomfort? And also who do I, who are the safe people to tell the truth to? Like, not everybody wants the truth.

And that to me was hard. So I'm like, why not? Everybody knows the truth and we can fix everything. Right. So I do relate to the scapego in a lot of areas. I don't know if I relate to it growing up as much as I do later in my life. But I don't think my, I don't think my family would put me in that role. Yeah.

I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm thinking no I think I lean probably more towards the mascot okay well and it doesn't have the mascot also like I know I explained it as like the class clown but it really is it can be any kind of like how you I might tell a joke to break the ice and break the tension you might do something else to break the tension to get you might do something cute oh yeah to get attention yeah you keep saying break the tension on like when I think of me as a child I just wanted attention Yeah. So I would do obnoxious. Okay. Well, and I don't, I don't know. Okay.

Maybe. Uh, I feel like there's probably two parts of me of like when my parents were together and then when they weren't. But when my parents were together, I have very little memory of that. But I was, I was nine. So that I'd lived.

Yeah. That's a lot of my childhood. I mean, that's half my years at home. But I don't have a lot of memories of that. I do think that. after my mom went back to work when my dad left and she wasn't around as much, I don't know, I remember, I became more problematic. Get Bell Pure Fiber Internet with Crave Netflix and Disney Plus from $94 a month.

Price guaranteed for two years on internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit. Visit bell.ca for details and to check availability. Bell, connection is everything. I'm Mangas Chitigula and I'm back with a new season of the podcast, Skyline Drive. This time I'm diving into a rabbit hole of peptides, organoids, blood boys, blue zones, and brain replacement to try to understand what this longevity obsession is all about and what it really means to live forever for all of us. I learned about some rad science. I can make a brain for you and then we can test what draw is the best for your brain, as opposed to his brain. Here are some hard truths. I would expect Indians to age faster, but I did not expect it to be almost a four to five year acceleration.

And get myself into a world of trouble. I'd say probably start bone smashing. That doesn't work. To make it look more defined. They say it works. I don't know. Listen to Skyland Drive, How to Live Forever on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. On the new podcast, Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling.

alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people and they were like, you smiled at us. Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip,

I hope you listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months. I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this low, taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was something.

someone at the end of my bed and I just started screaming. They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them. There's stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to the Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I have a hypothesis. And this could be very wrong.

but I just am thinking I would need to sit on this for a while but I wonder if there is a part of you that is the scapego and I'm thinking more so like because the scapegoat is you have to remember they're not like thinking I'm doing this because of this but think about like how when we have feelings and we don't acknowledge them they come out in crazy ways right and they're come out sideways and maybe we're not expressing ourselves and what we actually want. If I'm thinking about you and your story and what you've shared growing up with your parents and all of that and then your history later with your disordered eating and all of that, you're giving me scapegoat vibes because that becomes the problem.

All of your behaviors become the problem versus you not getting what you needed in a lot of areas in your life. And so then it's like, well, we have to fix Amy's eating disorder versus where did this start and how did it come about? So then you're the identified patient of the family. But if we trace it back, there's a lot of dysfunction and all of what's going on. That's just how you were dealing with it, maybe. And that could be, you can throw that back. Yeah, I'm not sure. I would have to really think about it. I just know that created a lot of tension with my mom. I was very combative and scapegoaty. I was angry. Yeah. But looking back, like, I was angry. But like at my dad's, I was so nice. Yeah. So, I don't know.

It's interesting. I have to sit with that. And I mean, I've done some family weeks, not with my own parents, but I've... Did you walk out? Did you slam the door, the therapist's face? No. when I did a family week with my ex-husband, it's like, and we've done multiple, we have adopted kids, so we've done a lot of intensives. And yeah, you do have to realize your role. Yeah. And in codependent behavior and ways that you've been a part of the ecosystem. Like, it is functioning in a way. And you, you were absolutely part of. that and it almost has to be dismantled and everybody has to want to put it back together. Yeah.

And I think we did put ours back together, but just in a different way. Like it wasn't going to be the way. Yeah. It was. Our marriage ended up in a divorce, but we've still put ourselves back together. Yeah. It just doesn't look like what we thought, but we co-parent well. And, I mean, I think most of the time.

95% of the time. When we talk about, you've used this and I've used this like doing the dance, like people doing a dance and a lot of times people want to keep doing their dance that their family does but you have to create a new dance a healthier dance some more functional dance um after those moments and I feel like from my perspective you've done a good job of owning I mean nobody's perfect but like owning your stuff and looking at roots of things versus pointing fingers because I will say It's so easy and I want to do it a lot. I have talked to you about how I want to stop being so negative sometimes

because sometimes I feel like I point fingers because it's easier to do that than realize like what's going on with me. Just like today when I said I almost got in a car wreck and I was like, this teenager almost hit me. And if I'm honest, the light was turning yellow when I turned. So I maybe shouldn't have turned it. You know? And this is the second.

week in a row you've almost died in a car wreck yeah so I'm like it might be me but it's easier to be like this kid wasn't paying attention maybe it's both things yeah well there you go some stuff look into when it comes to your family dynamic and seeing maybe who you are as a kid who you are now how do your kids stack up yeah like what is Zoe gonna be I don't know we'll see that'll be see in 15 years yeah we'll record that episode later tune in in 2040 good math oh thanks did you just add it was 2026 yeah and I added 14 cool math is not my strength at all we do have drum roll our haz roll moment of the week now I'm going to read an email that we got and then We'll do a little sweet, fun giveaway.

Hey, Amy and Kat, I was listening to last week's episode about your back-to-school partnership with Hasbro Games, and I got so excited as this hits close to home, and I wanted to send you my story. My son, Elijah, is autistic and has struggled with severe social anxiety throughout his elementary school years. Connecting and playing with his classmates has often felt overwhelming for him. And honestly, it has been difficult for me to watch him, want those friendships, but not always know how to step into them. Last year, his teacher, Mrs. Owens, who is genuinely an angel on

earth, we wouldn't be where we are today without her. Introduce him to Hi-ho Cheerio and the Hungry Hi-Hippos Board Games. Elijah absolutely loved them and before long those games became more than just something fun to do in the classroom. They became his way of joining in, engaging with other students, and beginning to make friends. Something as simple as gathering around a game, and gave him a comfortable way to connect without the pressure he usually felt in social situations. Those games truly became a gateway to friendship and community for him, and I will always be grateful to Mrs. Owens for recognizing what he needed and helping create that opportunity. When I heard you talking about Hasbro games last week, I immediately went to Walmart and bought

some new games for his new classroom. I always try to give his teacher a simple gift at the beginning of the school year, and this felt like the perfect one, something that could help another child connect and feel included the way Elijah did. I already bought games for my son's classroom, but if you wanted to do a gift card for our school here in Wichita, I know the teachers would all benefit from having some new games to welcome students back this year. I love you both and the show. Thank you for always sharing helpful things and keeping a smile on this girl's face. Tiffany in Wichita, Kansas. which Tiffany, yes, our friends at Hasbro, they want to send your school a $1,000 Walmart gift card to get all the games for the classroom.

So exciting. Kat's going to cry again. I know. I'm like reading that. When she said she used the phrase like games became a gateway to friendship. And I'm like, yes, they are. And I don't think a lot of people realize, yes, gateway to friendship and gateway to connect. team, but also it's like a gateway to learning too.

You don't realize that you're actually, you can be learning while you're playing has a board games. Yeah. Well, I even think of playing Guess Who and having, asking questions and problem solving and working your brain in a way to prepare it to learn other things. Yeah. It's just, the games can come in handy for all kinds of things. All kinds of things.

Yeah. I think Guess Who? Monopoly and Clue would all be games that do that. Yeah. Guess Who was definitely a clutch one for me. And Clue. Oh, yeah. Oh, Clue?

I mean, Monopoly is just like a staple for sure, for sure. But when I think about what I wanted to play the most as a kid, I feel like my family, they maybe all monopolies when everybody sits down. But I was probably always the one begging, like, I want to play Clue. That's interesting to me. Colonel Mustard in the dining room with the candlestick. I feel like I wore my family out with Guess Who. And then you get to know the, like, characters and the faces and they become your friends.

Yeah. If you're looking for fun ways to build confidence and skills, all the ones we're talking about, you can find these Hasbro favorites at your local Walmart. Or you can tap the link in our show notes as a way to explore all that they have because everything we're talking about is going to be curated into that link. And you can grab games for your family or like Tiffany did and think, oh, this was helpful for my kids. So now I want to go buy games for his teachers. And as a mom, I like being reminded, too. It's good to think of teachers, giving them a little back-to-school gift. And maybe they would want a little gift card to somewhere. Now, in this case, shout out.

Hasbro and Walmart, it's going to be a $1,000 gift card. But just teachers knowing that you think of them, even if it's like for a coffee or something. But this is just a way where maybe they would enjoy the gift, but it's a gift for their whole classroom. because kids would get to play the game for years to come. So thank you so much, Hasbro. Thank you, Tiffany, for that email. And thank you, Walmart. And yay games.

Yay, game. Thank you all so much. We'd love to hear from you if you would like to submit for the Hasbro, Walmart. Give back the Hasbro moment. You can email us, hey, they're at feeling things, podcast.com. And you can also call us and leave a voicemail. 877-207-2077.

We would absolutely love to hear from you, whether it's that or you have comments about the show. You have a catch-up we need to try. Or you've got a question about your family dynamic. And Kat being an excellent therapist, we can give it our best and try to unpack it in a couch-talks episode. So we'd love to hear from you. And we hope wherever you are, you have the day. You need to have. Bye.

Bye. On the new podcast Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility. Listen to Solita on the Iheart radio app. Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

If your bookshelf and your For You page are equally important to your personality, welcome home. Pro Society is a weekly podcast that's part book club, part group chat for anyone who thinks Pride and Prejudice and Love Island deserve the same level of discourse. Each week, we're connecting the dots between books, the internet, and pop culture with your favorite writers, book talk creators, and plenty of overthought opinions. Yeah, I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed. Listen to Pro Society on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, this is Hayes Davenport.

And Sean Clements. We host the podcast, Hollywood Handbook. Each week, we talk to someone in show business and try to help them with their careers and see what they have to offer us. Everyone has a good time and no one gets mad at their publicists for letting them do our show. We've had a lot of great guests like Sarah Sherman, Adam Scott, Danny McBride, Ben Stillard, and a lot of other big shots that wouldn't be where they are without us. Listen to Hollywood Handbook on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I survived nine months in captivity, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files.

Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to the Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.