The Bobby Bones Show - Nicolle Galyon On Having 10 No.1 Songs + Her New EP 'Second Wife' + The Story Behind Writing Miranda Lambert's "Automatic"

Episode Date: October 30, 2023

Amy Brown sits down with songwriter Nicolle Galyon to discuss her impressive career, new album and more! Nicolle's songs have become a mainstay on the country charts with hits like Kelsea Ballerini and Kenny Chesney's "Half Of My Hometown," Morgan Wallen's "Thought You Should Know," and so many more. She shares how she got her start in songwriting and how it took years to breakthrough. She also recalls the first time she heard a song she wrote on the radio and how she reacted and reveals the story of how the first time she wrote with Miranda Lambert she had to breast pump and they created the song "Automatic" from the experience. Nicolle will also give an inside look to her new album, Second Wife, what inspired the songs on it and share advice to aspiring songwriters!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Women of IHeart Country. Sitting here with Nicole Agallion, and before we sat down, Nicole's like, okay, I have an event tonight. I guess a record label is throwing a party, a toga party?

Yeah, I don't know how to goga. Yeah, and so, Yeah, being in a white sheet or Toga situation, I could see how you'd maybe want to spray tan for that. And you just got it. I'm like dripping wet in spray tan formula right now. So she said that by the time the interview's done, it may have advanced to the darker level. Yeah, you know when they shoot movies and they need like continuity, you have to, if you show any of this out of order, I'm going to look different shades. Yeah.

As it. Well, I mean, I think any woman listening to this right now can appreciate that because we all have the struggle of the spray tan. whether it's the rapid one that's just going really quick or maybe the one you sleep in and you wake up and your sheets, your white sheets look tan. It's awful. It's awful. But Nicole is here to talk about way more than spray tans that just came up. Your EP second wife came out on October 13th, and it was your 16th wedding anniversary to your husband. And so I think it speaks for itself that you're his second wife.

But why make that the title of the EP? Now, I was a huge fan of Firstborn, huge fan. Such a beautiful project that I encourage everybody to go check out if you haven't yet or revisit it. There's such good stuff on there. But let's talk about Second Wife. Well, Second Life actually started when we wrote the last song for Firstborn, which was five-year plan. And that record was all about the arc of my.

my story as an individual, and I said that one was the one for me. But I couldn't tell my whole story without our story, kind of wrapping it up. And so we wrote five-year plan. It was like the first song we had ever really written the two of us about us. And it was so special, the experience that I just said, I want to do more of that. Like, even if no one even hears these songs or they don't make sense for anyone else, let's do more of that. Like, I just want us to spend more time together writing. We are, that's like the one part of each other's lives we've never shared is what it's like to be in a writing room together. And so it was that paired with, well, what comes after first, second, oh wait, I'm a second wife. It just kind of all came together

in one moment. And I didn't even know like what the arc of the second wife story would be until we started writing. And so just to clarify for people that don't know your husband's a songwriter. Yeah, I'm married to Rodney Claussen. He's kind of a big deal if you are interested. to who writes the songs that are on the radio. He's written a lot of, he's written like 25 number ones. 25 number ones. Yeah. Yeah, that's amazing. How many number ones do you have? Do you know? I now have 10. 10. I made it to double digits, which feels somehow really significant. Which, some that y'all would most definitely know, automatic Miranda Lambert, thought you should know, Morgan Wallen, which I got to say that song, it came out a couple years ago, but something about it this year,

I'm not quite sure, but I have been listening to it on repeat the last few months. I just love it. I don't know why it's hitting me different. I loved it then. So many other hits have come out, even from Morgan since then. But it's like I'm revisiting it like it's new. Do you, when you listen to it, are you more of the one making the phone call or the one getting the phone call? I'm the one making the phone call.

And my mom passed away, well, nine years ago this month. And so I think that I, you know, honestly, I probably, I picture Morgan on the phone to his mom, but I am him. Like, I'm the one making the phone call to the mom. I'm not on the receiving in from my kids. I don't know that they're to that point where they would call me yet to tell me, thought you should know. Hopefully someday. 16 year old, so 13, so different ages. But that's such a beautiful song. What was the writing process for that song like? Honestly, I give all the credit to Morgan on that. It was a really crazy day because it was me, Miranda Lambert and Morgan Wallen on my porch swings. And I think it was

the end of 2020. And there was really no agenda that day. He had just finished the dangerous record. So we weren't even really trying to write for anyone in the room. But he came in and he said, hey, I've always wanted to write something for my mom and I'd started this. And he had so much of the song sussed out. And I'm not trying to just like gas him up. I mean, truly like that song was his and he brought us in on that. But he has since told me, I think he said in another interview, like, I don't know that I would have written that song if I wasn't in the room with females, maybe bringing out some of his vulnerable softer side. I don't know. I'm just speculating, but that's my favorite thing about, you know, first time co-writes is you don't even know,

like, what people are going to bring out in each other. And that song was the outcome of that day. So that was the very first time that you had written with Morgan, not Miranda, but Morgan and Miranda together. Yeah. That and you all came up with that. That's, I mean, it's gold. You as the writer, were you like picturing your kids calling you or are you calling your mom? I just remembered when we were, when we came up with the line of, you know, been losing sleep since 93. I just immediately thought been losing sleep since 2015.

when I had my son and I was like, man, I just hope and pray that I get one phone call like this someday. I hope that we have the relationship that, you know, they're like boomerings, like these kids, you like send them out in the world and you just pray that they go as far and as fast as they can toward whatever they're going toward, but that ultimately they will come back to you and have touch points with you. And that's where my head was at. I was just like, God, I hope my son cares enough to write a song about me someday. Yeah, I love that. Other songs that people definitely know for you half of my hometown with Kelsey and Kenny, Homecoming Queen, another good one with Kelsey, boy Lee Bryce, Consequences, Camila Cabo, which when you cross over, like you're in the

country space and you went to Belmont. Let's talk about that before we get into more songs and then and more of second wife. But were you setting out to be more of a songwriter or an artist when you were at Belmont? And then how did you get from country into even some of these pop spaces? Well, I actually never came here to be an artist or a songwriter. I came here wanting to be a manager or an agent or record. In the music business. I just wanted to be one degree away from the center of my biggest passion, which was country music. And I got here and then met songwriting and met songwriters and learned that that was a job I could have.

And then I just must have been, had enough of an ego or I was just delusional and thought I could do it. And so I started writing by myself. You know, I always wanted to be a songwriter. I'm more of a creative. I don't love to perform. So I didn't ever really want to be an artist because the performance and going on tour is such a big piece of it. And I have crazy nerves around performing.

It like takes the life out of me, honestly. It like fills true artists up that were meant to be on stage. They go on stage and they come off stage and their cup is full because they did that. It depletes me. So I just wanted to be a creative and create and write songs. And, you know, at a certain point when no one was recording my songs, I just thought, well, maybe I should be the artist if that's going to be how I get my songs out in the world. So there was like a brief stint in there where I went on the voice and I was playing some showcases around town and was trying to make inroads with labels and stuff. And luckily, it didn't work out for me because I am so glad that I have like the perfectly curated life for myself now that I have where I get to be home.

I don't have to be on the road. I just get to create wherever I can. And so being married to a songwriter, or do you all ever just, you're sitting around the table, does something organically come up and you're like, we should go get a guitar and get a pen and paper and you just start it, even though you had no intention of doing that in the moment?

Yeah, that happens a lot, but usually because historically we haven't written together a lot, so when we're like at a dinner and someone says something in a conversation, and it's like, we both look at each other and we're like, oh, that's a song title. He always says, first to write it wins. And so then we like, look at our calendars and like, you just never know who's going to get in the room next and write it. But we've always written it with other people. And now that we've, you know, written this EP and now we're writing together, it's like this new era for us. I think when

those moments happen and we have a song idea that comes up, we're going to just write them together. Now, y'all wrote it out at your farm? Yes. Which is near Nashville. writing with a spouse is it different than like if you're writing with Miranda or any of the other laundry list of people that you have written with um do you have to like take breaks or yeah i think um i think the reason that we didn't write together for so long was because we wanted to have boundaries um and we're both wildly independent but something has shifted in our relationship where even with boundaries like we it's because when you write you write you really can't have a lot of boundaries. You need to be able to be open and for us to be in a room,

we're so close. It would stress anyone out to be around us trying to go right with us because we would say anything about anything to each other. Everything's on the table. And when you're right in the room with a third or a fourth writer, you're kind of like, well, you got to keep some things like professional, you know? I don't know that we could have been professional. And so now I think the secret is writing just the two of us because we can, you know, stop in the middle and go do whatever we want to do or say, I hate that, or I don't. And writing Second Life specifically was so cool because I don't even remember songs starting and ending. We would just start conversations. And then like the next thing you know, we're writing a song or we would pour all this wine. He was

drinking tequila, I think, a lot. And we would just like sit on the couch and I'm drinking wine, he's drinking tequila, and we'd play We're Not Really Strangers, the card game, and that would turn into a conversation about us. And then I'm like, wait, that's a song. And that's really how we wrote it. We gave ourselves two weekends, and we said, what we write in these two weekends is the project. And it was this really fun challenge to just be as present as possible and shut out everything else in the world because we had one task, which was just to spend time together and create. I love these projects for everybody because we all get to enjoy it, but especially your kids. Oh, yeah.

Like how cool for firstborn they have that. And then now they have their parents with second wife. When they're older, it's such a gift. Yeah, I think that's... Or even now, they don't even have to be older. Yeah, it is kind of fun even like, you know, we've had even in our family, there's a lot of things that you need to explain to your kids as they get older. And it's kind of, I think there's a connection between what I'm running. writing and trying to get out on firstborn and second life that felt somewhat age appropriate for me to start telling my kids about those things from my life that it's that in turn is going to

give them a better understanding of theirs and where they come from and who they come from. Yeah, because the title of one of the songs is pre-nup and it's y'all poking fun at their, your lack of a need for a pre-up upon marriage. Oh, we were both a financial liability to each other at that point. I came in with a lot of private school, like college loans. Rodney had back taxes. We were like, why would we ever need a pre-up? And now it's kind of like it's balanced itself out because I think we've both paved our own way. If we split it in half or it kind of's all the same now. Yeah. Other songs, The Grain, which is about how different love stories can look, rooms about multiple life experiences and how walking through

rooms has evolved throughout their relationship. Tell me about that. Rooms was a song that came from us having too much to drink and playing, we're not really strangers. And I forget what the card prompted us to talk about, but I started reminiscing about how differently it has felt over the years walking into the BMI Awards with him. It's an event we have here in Nashville that's exclusive for songwriting and publishing and it's kind of like the Super Bowl of songwriting every year it's like everyone gets dressed up and and i remember i've gone now i guess like 17 or 18 years now with him and i was just like it's just wild when you watch how differently every night of the bMI awards has felt from me walking in and him winning writer to then me winning writer and then last year i went by myself and

had a really great night but he was off hunting and and we were talking through all that and then i was like And then if you go back to the very first year, this is how it felt to me to walk into that room with you. And I told him all this and he said, I had no idea that that's what you were experiencing. I just thought you were excited to get dressed up and go to the party. I was like, no, there was so much more wrapped into it for me. And so we just, on the spot, I just started like, you know, there's our title rooms. And, you know, what will I wear? I remember just like what person no matter what your life story is.

has what girl hasn't like overthought you know everything that every move she made when she walked in a room um it's it's just part of i think being a young woman texas holdham is another song which is lighthearted cheeky romantic song under the rainbow now this one is this written by others are you all involved in this at all yeah we we took a song that is um you know already like a huge classic song and kind of did our own little spin on if we could if we could rewrite that what would it sound like our version of the fairy tale yeah i love putting a spin on things which speaking of thought you should know back to that with morgan wall and there's a dj that put a spin on that with um and merged it with tupac dear mama have you heard it no because you know if you think about it twopac singing to

his mom oh yeah dear mama um when i was young me and my mama had beef 17 years old you know he's like lady, don't you know I love you sweet lady. And then Morgan's singing to his mom, but he kind of merges and the beats kind of go together. It's so good. I'm going to text it to you. Please do. I have to go see this. Because it's just a snippet. I wanted to DM the DJ and be like, can you send me the full, can you do a full version so I can listen to this over and over. So instead, I just listen to the Instagram reel over and over. Okay, well, that is a task for some young DJ out there to go put it on TikTok so we can all use it. Well, this one, he's, He does. He's on TikTok. Yeah, he has like a million followers on TikTok. Eric, well, I'm going to find it now and then I'll play it for you. But it is so good and I'll send it to you. But I want to go to the first song on the track. Save this one for last. Because I thought it was really special that there's a song expressing gratitude to your mother-in-law and how she shaped Rodney, your husband, her son. So talk us through Joe, which is the title. Joe is Rodney's mom, but Joe is a name that is a common thread through Rodney's life.

beyond his mom. His sister that passed when he was younger, her middle name was Joe. Our daughter's middle name is Joe. My aunt Joanne, who's like the sister that he never had. I mean, Joe keeps throwing up in his life. And I just, I just was like, okay, I have to write a song called Joe. And as I was stewing on that, I realized what a trailblazer his mom was for me in his life. she you know she's that like take 12 diet coax out in a cooler and dry the tractor and she'll she'll cut all the she's like she's very much an i can do it myself mentality and we're so different she and i but i just wanted to give her i wanted to give credit where credit is due for maybe why he was even attracted to me in the first place and i can as i as i now have kids

i start to imagine like what's it going to be like when my kids bring people home and i can see oh you like this one maybe because your dad's this way or I'm this way or and I really leaned into the idea that of just gratitude for her in all of her quirky and beautiful ways and it was so fun to write with him because I don't know that he would have ever on his own written a song about his mom but it kind of forced him I mean all those details in there really came from him you know green roof on a gravel road I'm like I didn't remember that the house you grew up in had a green roof. But yeah, she's, she's an okay cook and I'm an okay cook. And I think he doesn't care if he's married to a great cook because of her. And I'm so grateful for that. Nicole, I know just seeing you

bake and cook on Instagram. I'm impressed. I like to bake. Kansas, Kansas has brought out my Martha Stewart side, but he always says, like, if I go like three days in a row without making dinner, he's like, I didn't marry you for that. And then I always think about his mom. I'm like, oh yeah, she'd throw anything in a microwave. You know what I mean? She'll freeze Pizza Hut Pizza for six months and then pull it out. I mean, I'm like that, thank you. Thank God that she was that way. Yeah, there's this mom. Have you seen her? She's gone viral. I can't think of the handle, but she's, you know, she'll be in the kitchen like with her son and they're doing dishes together. Like, this is a normal thing. And the caption will be like, and she's kind of glaring into the camera.

and she'll be like, me doing dishes with my son like it's normal so that when he's married, it's not like this big deal for him to have to do dishes. Yes. Yeah. Rodney prides himself on the fact that he can make a really mean mashed potato. And I think it's because his mom, I really hope Joe Alice is not listening to this right now, but would not make a lot of mashed potatoes like on Thanksgiving. And he's got some deep trauma about the lack of mashed potatoes because he'll make 25 pounds of mashed potatoes.

Every Thanksgiving. And I'm like, okay. I mean, so yeah, I think we all, you know, are living out the things that maybe we didn't have. Well, you mentioned earlier that, you know, once you realize, okay, I'm going to be a songwriter, and you do have your own albums, your own music that you perform, but performing is not necessarily something that fills your cup up. It depletes you. So what are the things that you do besides songwriting that fill your cup up? Oh, well, I love playing volleyball. Like sand or court? I'll play sand, but I prefer court. I actually,

am on a rec league volleyball team back in my hometown right now with a bunch of girls that I grew up with. And it is literally the most joy that I've ever had in my adult life. And I love taking photos. I'm forever a yearbook editor. I've been carrying a camera over my shoulder long before there was an Instagram or a Facebook. I just love the storytelling and the creativity of photos. And it's like a part of my life that hasn't become a business. And so it's just so pure. I just love, you know, I love taking photos and I do love baking cakes now. This is a new thing for me. When I go back to my hometown, I have quiet and I have space.

And somehow later in life, like at the age of like 36, I discovered that I needed to learn how to bake a good birthday cake. And it just has taken on a life of its own and I have made a gazillion cakes and it's so fun. What's your go-to birthday cake or what flavor? I personally love like an almond flavor, like a wedding cake, just basic white on white, you know, I've made a bunch of different iterations of it. But like I'm kind of a basic Kansas girl. Like I love a really good funfetti. I love a white wedding cake.

I recently nailed a red velvet cake for the first time. Thank you to my best friend's grandma. What kind of icing did you do? It was, I have the recipe card of the photo of it in my phone. And I may have even posted on Instagram because it's handwritten and it's all faded from my friend Brenna's grandma, K. because I'd made two different cakes already and failed. And I was like, I have 24 hours before my husband's birthday and I got to nail this. And it's called no fail icing.

And it's not cream cheese. Right. So I was curious if you did like a vanilla buttercream or cream cheese because red velvet, you can go either way. Oh, it's like nothing I've ever had before. And I will send you the link because, well, the link, which is a photo of a recipe card, because it's so old school. But you put milk and flour on the stove.

and you like, it's like, you put flour in it. It's so, it's so interesting. Okay. I'm definitely curious about this, which if people want to see your Instagram and all the photos and the baking and the recipes at Nick at Night Music, N-I-C at N-I-T-E music. So, Nicole, why did you go with Nick at Night music for your handle? Because it was my email address when I was in college. And as before I knew. Nick and I, Hotmail, AOL? Yeah, it was a Hotmail. Actually, my very first email address was Nash underscore 22 underscoreville at Hotmail.

Like that. It's like, hmm. But then I moved to Nick at Night. And I don't know that I would have put Nick at Night music had I understood what a big deal Instagram was going to be. But now I am Nick at Night and so I forever will be. Yeah, that's what I know you as too. But it is interesting.

Yeah, when you come up with handles at the beginning of something. thing not knowing, yeah, who knew that Instagram would even still be around or what this stuff was? Twitter, well, obviously there's Facebook, but I think Twitter was where we got handle. And it was like, I don't know. What is a handle? Right. I don't know. That's what you put alcohol in.

I didn't even understand. I thought Instagram when it first came out was just an editing tool. I didn't know that it was like a platform or like a community. So I was going on there and editing photos over and over and saving them. And I would have like 27 versions of the same photos. with different filters in a row, having no idea anyone was following me and looking at all of these awful things that I was posting. So, I mean... Well, your photographs, they're amazing. I know you say that's not a job for you yet, but I'm like,

well, this could be. Like, you just have, you have an eye and you're very creative. And besides a spray tan, since we talked about you getting one at the beginning, and you haven't really gotten much darker as we've been sitting here. But what is something that as a woman makes you feel most confident? Probably, that sounds so woo-woo. But when my nervous system is like calm, that's my favorite version of myself. And so I think, you know, that's where Kansas comes in. I think when I feel calm and centered, I'm offering other people, like the best

version of me. And so I come across more confidently. And, you know, the music business is stressful. Like, I'm not always, you know, I come across a certain way, but I'm so anxious under the surface all the time when I'm at music business events or making decisions. And but truly it's when I do the work to just get calm and centered that I feel like, oh, there I am. There's so many young artists where we're premiering their songs on women of I Heart Country. And they're listening. That's one of the fun parts is they're, they'll be in the car and they'll record it and they'll throw it on.

yeah, Instagram or TikTok, and they're hearing their song on the radio for the first time. Do you remember the first song you wrote and it was recorded and was released to radio and where you were, maybe even what car you were in? Yes. The first time that I heard, We Were Us on the radio, I was on my way back. I was driving back to my house fast and furiously because I think maybe my daughter was just a few months old at that point. I had her in May.

The song came out in August. And I had just gotten a blowout for like, a music business function. And I remember feeling so vulnerable like, man, my body's not right. I'm going, going to this event tonight. I'm not myself, you know, but I had gotten a blowout. And I was in sweats, a blowout. And I just remember going through Green Hills and this song came on. And I just cried so hard. And I just remember sensory wise, I can remember my hair sticking to my face, like the tears on my face. And me feeling like, wow, isn't this just all a metaphor? Like you're kind of, this is a mess. And, you know, you're worried about what you look like going to a music business function but look what you've done

like it was just and it's just it's just continued to be that way over and over and over for me like every time there's a high it's always balanced out by some really like humbling life experience it's happening at home that like has kind of kept me grounded through it yeah I love that I got goosebumps as you were telling the story I love when when artists truly remember the first time they ever heard it and they've got you have a story behind it even the You remember the feeling of your hair sticking to your cheeks. Yeah. I also remember, like, trying to video myself.

I'm like driving off the side of the road. I'm like, I should not. Thank God my daughter's not in here. I would not be trusted to be a driver. But it was, gosh, it was wild. It feels like a million years ago. All right, Nicole, you wrote Automatic, which Miranda Lambert sang it. Who all were the writers on the song?

What was the automatic right day like? I wrote Automatic with Natalie Hemby and Miranda Lambert. It was my first time to write with Miranda. I had been writing for years with Natalie, and she was like a sister. So there was that comfort level to balance out the nerves of getting to write with a legend, like Miranda for the first time. And to set the scene, I had never heard a song of mine played on the radio or anything at this point when I got the opportunity to write with Miranda.

I was like, oh my gosh, like nothing in my career had technically, quote, worked yet. And so I just felt a little out of my league. Like, and I was a new mom. So tired. Like, wow, the odds are really against me today is how it felt. And I walked in and, you know, this is Miranda's like superpower is just being so real. She doesn't have a fake phone in her body and just walking in. It's like you feel like you've known her for 20 years and she just started talking about her career. And we all started having girl talk and next thing you know, we had this, this idea started. And it was such a special day because I was so nervous about the fact that

I had to take like a breast pump to the to the right, you know. And I was like, well, Miranda's not a mom. So maybe she's going to be annoyed that you have to stop. And we got like a verse chorus and I ran in the other room like, I have to pump like right now. I cannot wait any longer. And she's like, okay. So I just, but we were we were on a roll. So we didn't want to stop the momentum of writing.

So I went right around the corner and just was pumping and we could hear each other. And we were screaming lines back and forth to each other. And I just remember her saying, whatever you do, don't stop pumping. It's the magic milk. And so the second half of Automatic was definitely written to that awful sound that goes, the pumping sound. The pumping sound. That was our metronome.

That was our track to ride to. That's funny. I feel like now every time people hear Automatic, they will picture Nicole pumping. We're welcome, everyone. Now, Kelsey Ballerini is someone we feature on the show often. She's got hit after hit after hit on Instagram. I see y'all writing together all the time taking writing trips. I'm like, oh, these writing trips, they look fun. And y'all are dancing and late nights and wine and hot tubs. And what's it like to write with Kelsey? Kelsey is one of the most effortless co-writers that I've ever written with. She, like, one of the hardest things about songwriting is just getting that first line and getting the first idea out. And she just has a flow to her. And maybe it's because we are drinking. a lot of Rose when we're on these trips, but she can just get a song going and get the plane

off the ground better than almost anybody I've ever written with in Nashville. And, you know, it's fun with her. I think our writing relationship feels very sisterly and very like no agenda. Like maybe we'll write something that you'll want for you. But at the end of the day, I think we just both become like equal songwriters when we're together. And we're just writing songs for the love of writing songs. And sometimes we get lucky and that turns into a song that's on the radio like half my hometown. But there's a vault of songs that we have written to get to those songs together. And those are just a special to me because we're all evolving. She's evolving. I'm evolving. And we got to write through certain things to get to other songs. And I've been really lucky that

she's invited me into her process in that way to where I can be the one that helps her write to get to where she needs to go next. If there's anyone listening that they're thinking about maybe being a songwriter, they feel like they've got something in them for that. What advice would you give them if they're starting out with, you know, even just pen to paper? Maybe they've never even shared it with anybody. I would say like just be as honest as possible. And I think sometimes when you're honest and your writing, it can make you and others feel awkward. And I think that can be your superpower because in a town where people are drowning in a thousand new songs, every day, even making someone feel a little bit uncomfortable when they hear your lyrics can be

what makes you memorable. So if something feels a little bit uncomfortable for you when you're writing it, keep leaning into that because it means you're tapping into something and you're going somewhere that someone else hasn't gone. And so, you know, yeah, dare to be a little uncomfortable. Love that. Nicole's latest EP, second wife. I'm going to read here something about it. It shows the side of Nicole that is flawed, self-deprecating, understated, silly, and yet unconventionally traditional. It's a side of Nicole that fell in love at 21. Second wife. Which, yeah, okay, never mind. We don't talk about the age difference. No, we can. Rodney. Rodney's 18 years older than me. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I had a, I had a stepmom that was about 20 years different from my dad.

I feel like that's still doable. You know, Robert De Niro, was 80 and he just had a baby with like how old is she 45 a little different yeah I mean there are definitely some logistical things when you get that far apart that you're like how is this going to work um but i you know it's funny i i thought i went into marrying someone older than me eyes wide open knowing that it would come with its set of challenges at some point like maybe not when we got married but at some point and we are 16 years into being married and we still we haven't gotten there yet. So I, you know, I'm ready for when that day comes, you know, like everyone, we're going to have different seasons at different times. But I think that's kind of our, one of our strengths is that we give

each other space to be where we are at that time. And I think even if you're the same age, you need to, you need to learn how to do that. But Rodney is like Benjamin Buttoning. He's like as young and as youthful and as playful his has ever been at the age that he is now. So to each their own, but I will fly the older man flag proudly. Oh, yeah. It's working for me. Y'all did a photo shoot, probably for second wife. I'm not sure, but you put up some pictures the other day. And I was like, oh, okay, hey, cowboy. Yeah. Oh, and he's so cute. Dinnam on denim. Yeah, he's looking, y'all both looked. Well, aren't you from Texas? Are you from Texas? I'm from Texas. Well, I, you know, my first crush was at the age of seven, and it was Troy Aikman.

and I joke that like Troy Aikman like was my first attraction and then I married like someone that looks like maybe he could be like a Troy Aikman cousin. So thank you Troy, Troy, wherever you are for paving the way for Rodney. Laid that groundwork. That older man thing must have been in me. Yeah. It was a part of me at a very young age. Well, to round out what you said about second wife, this EP, it's a side of you that you don't

always show the married one. So I encourage everybody to check it out. Six tracks with videos, which is, I think, one of the coolest things about firstborn. And they're in, similar to firstborn, are they in the order? I mean, firstborn, there's specific order. It's telling this story. Same thing, I assume, with Second wife. Second wife's really different.

It's more of like scrapbook vibes. Okay. It's not as much, the words, the lyrics of the songs kind of tell the story. And the video is more of just like if we wanted to look back and remember the process later on, we videoed it kind of like a documentary like that. Oh, I love that. Okay. Of course it's creatively different. I've thought of maybe I'm the same vibe. But okay, well, Nicole, thank you so much.

Nicole Galleon. You'll follow her on Instagram and TikTok at Nick at Night. A music and check out the first EP, firstborn, but this latest EP, so good. It's called Second Wife. Bye. Bye. Thank you. Women of Iheart Country. In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins.

But the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice, Ms. Owens, correct? I doctored the test once. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern. Two more men who'd been through the same thing. Greg, a lesbian, Michael Mancini. My mind was blown. I'm Stephanie Young.

This is Love Trapped. Laura, Scottsdale Police. As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences. Listen to a love trapped podcast on the EyeHour Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.