the bossbabe podcast - 128. I Built + Sold Two Billion-Dollar Companies. Here's What I Learned with Cindy Eckert

Episode Date: October 26, 2020

We’re joined by Cindy Eckert, Founder and CEO of The Pink Ceiling, a business incubator and VC firm that invests in women-led and female-focused companies. A self-made serial entrepreneur, Cindy is one of the few women to have ever sold a company for a billion dollars, let alone two pharmaceutical companies. In fact, it was Cindy’s second venture, Sprout Pharmaceuticals, that brought Addyi aka “the female Viagra” to market. Having successfully built two billion-dollar companies, Cindy has such a wealth of knowledge and experience that we had to invite her back for part two which will air on Wednesday, 10/28. So tune in to part one as Cindy reveals the true story of how she built her own startup and sold it for over a billion dollars, only to buy it back and rebuild the company when she learned that her life-changing product for women was not going to market. We’re also diving deep into the narrative surrounding female sexuality and the challenges with research for female products, as well as, funding for companies founded or led by women. If you have a mission and are in need of motivation, this episode will inspire you to keep going even when the odds are stacked against you! Links: Sign up for our free training: How to Plan & Execute Profitable Repeatable Launches with Our 4-Step Formula. https://bossbabe.com/launchformula Join Online Launch School, our 12-week program designed to take the guesswork out of sold-out launches. https://bossbabe.com/ols Organifi’s mission is to empower you to live a happier, healthier life with organic superfood blends. Use code BOSSBABE for 15% off your purchase at https://bossbabe.online/organifi Follow: @bossbabe.inc Danielle Canty, @daniellecanty Cindy Eckert, @cindypinkceo

It's wonderful that we all see this opportunity to pave our own path, that you can decide your own destiny by starting your own thing from scratch. But I think we undersell the idea, go learn from someone else for a minute, go get into that environment, because it's actually going to shore up your success on the other end so much. Welcome to the Boss Babe podcast, a place where we share with you the real behind the scenes of building successful businesses, achieving peak performance, and learning how to balance it all. I'm Danielle Canty, president and co-founder of Boss Babe and your host for this episode. Okay, so I am really, really excited about this episode because it was phenomenal. It was so epic, in fact, that we had to do not one,

but two episodes with this amazing female entrepreneur. So part one, you're listening to it right now, and part two is actually going to be airing on Wednesday. So two days time. The guest was that fire. We literally for the first time ever broke the mold and invited her back on for a secondary follow-up. And that magical guest is Cindy Etka. She is a self-made serial entrepreneur and a vocal advocate for women. She has built and sold not one but two pharmaceutical companies totaling 1.5 billion dollars and one of those companies created the female Viagra. She is the ultimate boss babe and like I said we got so deep into conversation that there was so much to cover. We had to spread this across to you episodes and I am really, really excited for you to hear all about Cindy's journey from how she

first got sold it to her first job to decide that she wanted to be an entrepreneur and set up her first company. She sold that first company for half a billion and then built her second one up to sell it for over a billion. But wait, the story continues. She later bought back that company that she sold for over a billion for a nominal fee. I want to say a dollar, but I'm not 100%, but very, very little. So imagine selling a business for that amount and then buying it back. This woman is absolutely amazing. And you are going to hear the passion come through when she talks not only about female leadership but about entrepreneurship and about supporting women she is absolutely incredible and

it was such an honor not only to have her on the Bossway podcast but to actually really really get to know her so in this episode we spoke about all things business including funding for female companies and their challenges that they also have. We spoke about workplace culture surrounding this and Cindy shared some of her visions. We also spoke about the narrative surrounding female sexuality and challenges in research for female products. So I know that you're going to absolutely love this episode. It is entertaining. It is full of information. So you are going to, as I always say, want to grab your notepad and pens and make some notes. And I would absolutely love for you to tag me at Danielle Canty and at bossbabe.inc with some of your favorite takeaways. So without further ado, we're going to dive into this episode and don't forget to come back and listen to the second one,

because I'm telling you now, it is just as jam-packed with amazing content as this one. Okay. I want wanna quickly interrupt this episode because I've got some really exciting news that I wanna share. So if you haven't yet heard, Online Launch School is now open for enrollment. This is one of the most exciting courses we've ever created and it's been in the works since November, 2019.

Let me tell you, this course has the ability to significantly impact and supercharge your business and your life. Here at Boss Babe, we know a thing or two about launches and let me give you some insider info. So our last launch was actually our biggest launch yet and it was actually the least stressful time for me and the entire team. This is such a big reason we decided to create Online Launch School. We know that we've unlocked such an amazing formula to make our launches really profitable without the stress without the overwhelm and without endless amounts of caffeine because trust

me danielle and i have been there so ols is a 12-week program designed to walk you step by step through a successful launch of your online product or service we want to help you take the guesswork out of sold-out launches so that you can spend more time moving the needle in your business and doing the things that you love so if you're ready to have the biggest cash injection your business has ever had, head to bosswave.com forward slash OLS and let's dive in. A boss babe is unapologetically ambitious and paves the way for herself and other women to rise, keep going and fighting on. She is on a mission to be her best self in all areas. It's just believing in yourself. Confidently stepping outside her comfort zone to create her own vision of success.

Welcome to the Boss Babe podcast, Cindy. I am so honored and excited to have you on here because your story is just absolutely incredible. I love everything you stand for, and I'm really, really excited to be introducing you to the Boss Babe audience. I'm so excited. I love this community. Thank you so much for having me today. Now, listen, you are a super successful serial entrepreneur. You've sold two businesses totaling 1.5 billion. But I know you kind of like, it's not been a straight road. It's not been all given on a plate. It's not all happy endings. So I just really want to take a minute to take you back to the beginning of your story,

take you back to the childhood, and then really just learn what the road has looked like to where you are now. Yeah. Okay. Well, buckle up, everybody. So for my childhood, I am a average girl from upstate New York, Rochester, New York, specifically blue collar town. I'm nine years old.

My dad comes home one day and he says, how would you like to go to the Fiji Islands? I'd never even heard of the Fiji Islands. I want you to know. So I ran to our living room. We had a globe in there. I spun the globe. I realized it was the other side of the world. And the little adventurer in me said, yeah, I want to go.

And my dad said, great, because we're moving there. And so as you naturally do from upstate New York to the Fiji Island, so goes my childhood. I would move perpetually from that point, the fourth grade through my senior year of high school, changing schools every single year. And you might imagine like new kid syndrome, kicking and screaming every time. But when I look back on it, it really was great preparation for entrepreneurship. And you might imagine like new kid syndrome, kicking and screaming every time. But when I look back on it, it really was great preparation for entrepreneurship because of two things, really. I got quite comfortable being uncomfortable.

And I had the opportunity to always stand at the outside of the room, if you will, and listen. I wasn't forced into a way I had to be, right? I wasn't in the jock group, the popular group, the geek group, whatever that was. I could be any of those things. And so I think even for folks who didn't have such a weird childhood, maybe you lived in the same place your whole life. The joy is always being able to sit at the side of the room, listen, and pick whatever point of view you want to bring into it. I love that. And I just think it's so important to recognize the power and the strengths that we gain from our childhood. It's something that I'm a real believer in, whether you've had a really challenging childhood, an easy childhood, whatever that looks like,

there were always so, so many lessons in it. And I think when you're able to reflect back as an adult and go, oh, okay, I can take from that. I can learn from that. And I've applied that in the way my life is now. It's really, really powerful. So like you said, you traveled around with your family, et cetera, went from school to school. Now I personally remember on my career days when I was like, okay, what do you want to be when you grow up? And it was like, oh, a fireman, policewoman, a teacher, an accountant. Were you like, oh yes, I want to be an entrepreneur? Or like, what was your, like, how did you kind of like navigate into this world? I didn't even know what the word entrepreneur meant at that time. So I am dating myself by saying I actually became an entrepreneur even before that was sexy,

before a shark tank era, I'll call it. But at the time, I have two big brothers. They're big influences in my life. And what they would say to you is, no matter what imaginary game I was making up when I was a little girl, there was always one common thread. And that was, I was the CEO of that. So I think that from a very young age, I wanted to be heard. I wanted to create my own vision. And that was good for entrepreneurship, but no clue what that meant. You always had that instinct to leave though, hey? Yeah, that's right. Or desire, right? And so how did you decide on like, what was the path after school for you? Similarly, Danielle, I think these are the things you look back on and you recognize I was very fortunate. And there are moments of luck for all of us as we look back. And my moment

of luck is I had a great professor in college who recognized my love of business. I was always very curious. Why does this business get to be on the cover of the magazine, but this business isn't? What makes this one great? And even as a little kid going into stores, what makes this store the one I'm so loyal to? She recognized that and she would make me do all of these special assignments, which at the time I think I just needed extra homework. I was burdened by all of this, but she was making me have this curiosity and read all of these business magazines, which set me on a path to being very singular in terms of what I was going to do. And it was this, I'm going to go learn from the best.

I picked at the time, Fortune's most admired company. That's who I was going to go work for. And I can remember she teased me. She's like, okay, well, maybe you need to be a little bit more broad than that. You got to have a backup plan. Nope. I'm getting the job of fortunes best at Meijer because I thought if I went and learned from the best, I could take it anywhere. I will say this philosophy is true. Even as I get the chance to talk to students today who are wondering like, what am I doing next? But I would reframe it. I thought I'm going to go learn from the best company. And what I know now is'm going to go learn from the best company. And what I know now is you should always go learn from the best people. It's really who you work for that makes all the difference in terms of your career trajectory. So, so true. And so what were

your findings? You decided, like you say, to go work at Merck and what role was that in? Yeah, sales. So started in field sales. I had a territory in Washington, DC. I love it. Okay. So you're working at Merck, you're doing sales. And at this point, I'm guessing you're not loving it as much as you thought you would be. I sort of gave that away, right? In terms of my, I mean, I don't necessarily go work, work for the best, work for the person who will give you the most opportunity, if you will, to try new things. For me, what became so clear, and I'm so grateful really for having had this opportunity because even when we're in circumstances that don't work out, they're teaching us what we want.

And for me, it was very clear. I'm not going to fit in a big environment in which I can't make a mark. I'm not going to be heard. I am employee 1,564, whatever it is, that wasn't going to work. And so what I knew is I wanted to go to a place where I really could be heard. And so what did that look like? Yeah. So I'll tell you, there were two things happening at the same time. One, I was, I think I was figuring that out. I was figuring out that I didn't want to stay and have this predictable career ladder where I would spend four years in this role and then I would move up to this role for two years and then I would do this for 18. No. So at that same time, my brother, I told you my brothers are big influences. He'd

gone to this thing called a startup, which I'd never heard of. What is this? A startup in the dot-com space. And I'm watching him from afar in there. He's like changing what he's doing every few months. He is at the table contributing these ideas. He's invigorated by it. And by the way, he has skin in the game. So we had equity. And at that time, so I'm watching this environment, which looks starkly different than the environment that I'm in, and they were going to go public. So they had a friends and family round. I had no money. I'm in my first job.

I'm right out of school. I have no money. And I ate rice every day for a year. So it was a dollar. And I would get sort of got a cup of steamed rice and save all this money. It was like squirreling away as much as I could to put it into this friends and family round for when they went public. They went public. I made money. And I thought, that's what I'm doing. That's it. I'm moving. So at this point, you were still at Merck, but you were starting to say, oh, hang on a minute, I can do this.

And then, so you kind of got like a little bit of a taste of the startup world, I guess, both from the experience of your brother, seeing him change roles, which I kind of guess going back to your childhood, what you were very much used to and probably felt more familiar than staying in a business for long periods. And also you're seeing that monetary reward going, actually, I can put this in and get this out the other side. So was it very clear at that point? You're like, right, I'm moving from Merck. I'm starting my own business. Like that's exactly what I'm going to do. Or were there a few steps in between? So I will tell you, I wanted to go to a startup because that leap was going to be pretty hugely different from the environment I was in. And I wanted to go learn what those

looked like from the inside. I'm a big believer of go learn it from the inside before you roll the dice and do it yourself. So the reality is I wanted better. And my better came in three ways. I wanted a better culture, a workplace environment that I was in. I wanted better for my pocketbook. I loved the skin in the game and being able to make money on the value you were contributing. And frankly, I wanted a better world. And it mattered to me that who I went to did something that directly impacted people's lives. That's why I love this industry that I'm in, the difference it can make in people's lives. So I looked at companies that were startups in my world, in the science world and innovation world, and I targeted those to go interview with.

Let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite all-in-one platform, Kajabi. You know I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity, which I love. Not to mention our team couldn't be happier because now everything is in one place, so it makes collecting data, creating pages, collecting payment, all the things so much simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and Kajabi has really helped us do that this year. So of course I needed to share it here with you. It's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business, you know, get rid of the complexity and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible. I definitely recommend Kajabi to all of my clients

and students. So if you're listening and haven't checked out Kajabi yet, now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial. Go to kajabi.com slash Boss Babe to claim your 30-day free trial. That's kajabi.com slash Boss Babe. And how did that go? Who did you end up working with? I worked for a company called Dura and it's so funny. I laugh that I think they were a startup because there were so many people there compared to when I actually started my first and there were three people. And we had three really lonely desks sitting in this big room. First they were my garage and then the cheapest rental space we

could get. But it was so wonderful to get to be part of that. And I think right now in particular, it's wonderful that we all see this opportunity to pave our own path, that you can really decide your own destiny by starting your own thing from scratch. But I think we undersell the idea, go learn from someone else for a minute, like go get into that environment because it's actually going to shore up your success on the other end so much. I feel like as I talk to a lot of folks that are coming fresh out of school and they're like, I am an entrepreneur. I know this is what I want to do. They've studied it even in school. I'm starting it from scratch. I really think going and spending a year or two in working

in a startup is going to help you immensely. 100%. It comes down to shortening that learning curve as well, again, isn't it? Like actually experiencing it, learning it on the job. It's just really, really powerful. So I just want to make sure I got my time right straight. So you did four years at Merck. Then you went to Dura. I did. For how long? I was at Dura for probably another four. I went from Jura into, I decided I needed to sit at the other side of the table. I went into an agency for a period of time

and then I started startups. So I wanted to sit on every side of the table, understanding so that when I went to construct mine from scratch, I really felt I had all the points of view. And so you started your first company, which is Slate Pharmaceuticals. Just tell us a little bit about what you did there. Yeah. So here's what I did when I started it. I thought, okay, I had this opportunity when I worked for my last startup, it was acquired. And so bigger company had bought it and they'd actually been buying up a couple of some other little businesses. They were going to put them all together. Well, here was my career defining moment. I got to be on that committee to decide like, which products are we keeping? Which products are we divesting? What are the

teams going to look like? And once I did that, I'm like, okay, like I've done, I can do this for myself. And what's interesting is I think I didn't sweat that I wouldn't be able to find product or an idea that I could get. That actually wasn't my worry at all. I think what I really wanted to focus on is could I find the right people? And I viewed myself as somebody who was growing, achieving, very personally competitive. I always showed up with a certain drive, but I was pretty uninspired. And so could I find people like that, put them all together against a task and what would we achieve? And what was so great is that's why I called it Slate, right? Truly, clean slate, going to do it on my own terms, going to create this culture. And when I built this company, we had a product that was the only long-acting testosterone product for men. The

science was already there, but nobody had commercialized it. And within four years, we became the second most prescribed product among urologists in this space. And that was just a rocket ship. Now, it didn't come like in the first, I want to be clear, like the first four months, six months. Maybe we hit our stride in that last year. It's incredible to me, but what a ride it was.

But the satisfaction of that was really about cultures that you create that matter more than anything. 100%. I couldn't agree more. Our culture at Boss Bay was so important to us. It's something that we really cherish and we really nurture and look after. And I think it's one of those things that you have to be very intentional about. And I know that we kind of asked our audiences what questions that they wanted to know. One of the pieces was like, how do you assemble and hire good teams? So I would love for you also on this part, just really share about, you know, that was a big worry for you. Like, okay, I know I can get the product, but what about the team?

So how did you go and find those right people? What did that look like? You know what? I wrote down exactly who we were going to be on a paper towel. Right. Don't all founders should have a napkin or a paper towel somewhere. And I still have a photograph of it to this day. And I was very clear about who I wanted us to be, how I wanted us to show up in this world. And then it's this simple to find people.

You hire against that. And I say, there's six choices you make to come work for me. We talk about them all the time. I hire against them. I fire against them. I incentivize against them. It is how you really find those people because it matters so much less as you are building your business, constructing your startup, that people have this pedigree, right? That you imagine they should have. It matters so much more that they fit the cultural

spirit that you're going to design this around. People can be taught if they've got the heart in the right place, the work ethic to go get it, you can teach them all of those skills and that's part of the fun. Yeah, I really, really agree with that. So when you talk about those six choices, are you talking about your company values at that point? It is. And it's so much more than a mission statement on the wall. I always said to our group, we'll never be a mission statement on the wall. And I used to have this picture. I shouldn't say I used to. It's front and center when you walk into my office still to this day. But I had a tiny little photograph that my dad had taken somewhere in Montana. And it was a sign. And it said, Cowboys scrape shit from your boots before entering.

And it was so funny. I was talking, we had grown a little bit and I had this bigger organization. And I said, we'll never be a company with a mission statement on the wall like ceremonially. And somebody said, but wait a minute, we do have a mission statement on the wall. And I said, what's that? And they said, cowboys scrape shit from boots. And so now it's the centerpiece of when you walk into even my pink ceiling offices today, although it says cowgirls. And that's so true that you really do have to pick kind of who you are. And for me, the choices were simple. We had to choose to be owners. For everybody who comes work for me has skin in the game.

That's an absolute because that's why I'm doing it. And when I cross the finish line, they have helped me equally get there. And I want to look to my left and my right and know that we all earned it together. So that's a piece. And ownership is more than equity. It's your attitude, right? And how you take personal accountability and everything. Boldness is a choice. Quirky is a choice, which I can talk about. Learning is a choice, family and appreciative. And really that is who we are. And if you went and we are such an eclectic group of people to this day, every walk of

life, every background. And yet if you looked at us against those six choices, you would understand the commonality. I think that's so, so powerful. And just like having those choices that everyone is aware of them too. And we do very similar when you're talking about hiring and firing those choices. It's everyone is aware of them too and we do very similar when you're talking about hiring and firing those choices it's not personal at that point is you leading in the way that's set with the values like are you living up to these values are you adhering to these values of the company if you're not you're not right for it and I think that just

makes it super clicker and easy to see when someone is so perfect and we have the most amazing team and then also those ones who actually just, they're just not quite right for the culture. And even then they might be great at what they do. If they're not right for the culture, you just have to be very, very careful that then that doesn't start tainting the water. That's what we're always really mindful of. Very true. And look, I would say you have an accountability to your folks adhere to that culture when it's been so important and you've laid it for us. So if they are cultural fit and somebody isn't, I would argue the person that isn't actually isn't

enjoying their time anyway in their environment. And when people come in to interview with me, I have a responsibility and I have a responsibility to put all the cards on the table of here's who we are. And this isn't the right environment for you i want to save you the time because we don't want to be looking at each other four months from now both unhappy yeah 100 so you started assembling your team yeah you obviously just created state pharmaceuticals and it was really really taking off and i know you ended up selling that business so i would love to hear a little bit more about what that process looked like, whether you had literally, you'd always gone in that you were going to sell in a period of time, whether that was a very organic progression.

I think you should always begin with the end in mind because it will inform all of your choices. It will make you, in my mind, think bigger from the outset, which is a valuable point of view to have. But as soon as I had that in my mindset of what the end, the destination looks like, I didn't sweat it. Any day at that point, all I cared about was execution. It wasn't my focus. I didn't believe that my constant job was to be getting to this exit. My everyday job was to be creating value that would make people come seek me out. And for Slate, I built this company. If you can imagine in the male sexual health space, there weren't many other women in hot pink leading these businesses. And I got a beat on science and women. So finally there were 26 drugs, by the way,

FDA approved for some form of male sexual dysfunction and not a single one for women. And I'm in this field, if you will, I'm watching the science emerge in terms of understanding what unlocks desire for women. And it was very clear to me that I was going to sell off my business and men and take this on. But I got to tell you, my board was, are you crazy? Because we have gotten, we've hit our stride. We're the second most prescribed. All of a sudden we're out of all of the horrible pains of early days of startup. The chart is going the right direction and I'm going, nope, we're going back to zero and we're going to take on what no one else has done. Okay. So, you know, I like the details Sunday. So tell me exactly then. So you already, you're still running the business. You're still running Slate. You're creating and selling this testosterone treatment, long acting testosterone treatment. And you're

like, right guys, we're on this trajectory, but I want to start this other company now. Or have you already got people wanting to buy it at this point? I didn't have anybody at the time. You do the things that make sure you're on people's radars, right? I'm at the same conferences as companies that would be naturally acquiring, making sure they know just how well we're doing in little conversations. So I will say I was always mindful of that, but not fixated on that. So I made sure that happened, but my fixation was, what are we selling today? How well are we doing? How are we growing the business? And so that when that moment came and I thought, you know what, I'm going to have to sell off this company in order to take this on.

I basically knew who I could go to and tap the shoulder of. And so a company that had been watching us along the way became a natural acquirer. So I literally, I found this new science for women. I had brought it into Slate. I sprouted that one asset out of... Why? My second company was called Sprout. Yeah, I'm laughing. Oh, I see. Out of Slate. And I literally sold Slate one day later. And I went back to work on the new company. And so it really was an incredible... From one day to the next, I went from my business card saying Slate to my business card saying Sprout the next day and I was back to work. No celebration, if you will, in that exit.

But my shareholders were very happy. I'd made them a great return. But I will tell you, I turned around, held my hand back out and I said, I just made you money. Now I'm going to need some of it back because we're going for women. Okay. Now I want to ask, I hope this is okay to ask, what did you sell Slate for then? I can't disclose, but I bet you can do the math. Yeah. I'm thinking that. Okay. And then you were like, right guys, we've sold here, but I want some of that money to reinvest into what got dubbed as the female Viagra, right? Right. That's right. And that's what became under the umbrella of Sprout Media. So let's talk female Viagra first

of all, because I feel like, and my understanding is from the research I've been doing that at this point, there were all these, and you've already alluded to it earlier, there were all these companies really, really making sure that men got their sexual desires met. Whereas women, there weren't any, there wasn't anyone, anything out there at that point. Is that right? Zero. Can you imagine, but I'm going to say something to all the audience. So think about this for a second. For the last 20 years, you've either turned on the television, the radio, the Super Bowl, and you've been told that satisfying sex really matters if you're a man. You may not even be conscious of it, but for 20 years, we have marched through 26 different medications being approved for men,

for them to have help in this area and not a single one for women, that was like a lightning bolt to me. There is no way when we have the scientific evidence and when we know that just as many women have issues behind the closed doors of their bedroom as men do, and yet we're not giving them treatment options. That fired me up. Quite right as well. Yeah. And by the way, it's a brilliant business opportunity, right? To address an unmet need. And so it was very clear to me that this was what I was called to do, what I wanted to do. And I set off to do that, leaving this success very quickly in the dust with Slate. It's almost came and went in the cloak of night

when I took this on. Okay. So what was your first move? So you're like, I just want to ask this because I felt like this is going to be a question for a lot of people. You mentioned earlier, you were never worried about getting the product, right? Yeah. We didn't touch on it with the testosterone piece, but let's talk about that with the female Viagra side, because whether it's a pharmaceutical product or any kind of product, a home furnishings product, right? There's product research that needs to be done and investigation and sourcing. And so what did that look like for you?

How did you get your hands on this? And no one else did. Oh my gosh, this is a crazy story. So like I told you guys, I was in this space. I was watching the science emerge for women. I'm running a company on the male side. I'm at these meetings and I'm watching the science emerge. And it was out of a company in Germany. And so the German company went to the FDA, were given a roadmap of what they needed to do. And they made a decision to walk away. And they did it not because the science wasn't spectacular, but because of the societal narrative that is so difficult around female sexuality. When they came forward with it, the crazy

headlines in the media were so ridiculous. They were like, no way. And that was really them walking away was my signal to walk in. And I'll tell you what I did. I spent a year just talking to women. That's it. Just talking to women who were struggling with this condition and didn't have an option. They'd been in clinical trials, they'd seen improvements, but nothing was approved for them today. And that was it. It's ever so simple sometimes finding the idea. We have this romantic idea that lightning strikes in the shower, right? We watch people and we're like, why didn't I think of that? And we think that they were just sitting in the shower one day and all of a sudden this brilliant idea came. I doubt it. I doubt it. For me, a year inside of Slate, I was doing my

homework with these women. And that is what made me think, well, if I'm listening to them, then by God, the world is going to listen to them. What was the narrative that was coming from those women at the time? Because I want to talk about this because I also felt like this is still really not spoken enough about. So true. So this is what happened. And I think it's the portrait of a woman. A million times they'd raise their hand in the healthcare system. Hey, something's changed. I used to want it. I never think about it anymore. I'm not interested. And they would be patted on the shoulder and they'd be told to have a bubble bath or have a glass of wine. And that's what we do. It's so dismissive. And I will tell you the heart

of that, if I dissected it, is if something goes wrong for men, we go, oh, biology. If something goes wrong for women, we go, oh, psychology. So true. Okay, so I hope you enjoyed this episode so far. Please stay tuned as we share a bit of info about who sponsored this episode. Okay, so I want to interrupt this episode just quickly to let you know about a brand that I absolutely adore. So if you've been watching my stories for the past couple of years, you'll know that I've been watching my stories for the past couple of

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that aren't filled with crap and are really, really good for you. So you can use the code BOSSBABE and it's Organifi, O-R-G-A-N-I-F-I. So BOSSBABE and Organifi. And let's jump back into the episode. And we're back. Let's jump back into today's episode. And we're actually doing a disservice to both men and women in keeping that narrative right so simple. But the idea that we would never even consider the biology of sex for women was outrageous to me, especially when we had the evidence that showed I can put a woman in a MRI machine. I can expose her to some

erotic cues who has this condition. She basically once had desire for sex. It's not really there anymore. It's bothering her. It's showing her self-confidence in the relationship. Put her in an MRI, put a woman who's totally happy with the ebb and flow of desire that she has exposed into erotic cues. Their brains light up totally differently. Totally differently. And we had a solution for it, but we were going to walk away. That says a lot about why we're, why, and I'll step down from my soapbox in one second, but listen to this stat. Four, 4% of dollars go to women's health research. Wow. I had no idea it was that low. 4. 2% of dollars go to prostate cancer alone. That should really ignite everybody in terms of why you have to be such an advocate for yourself and for each other in the healthcare system.

Yeah, 100%. And I really do believe it though, as well. It's not even you're saying that statistic and I'm like, actually, am I that shocked? Not really, because I think of my own experiences, my friends' experiences, my family's experiences with female hormones or female reproductive health. You're right. It's really underserviced. And there's so many like, oh, we're not really sure. Off you go. Let's hope you don't come back because we're not really sure what to do with this. And so, yeah, I really see this. So I can really hear in your voice, this business wasn't just like you say, it's not just, oh yeah, I can see how to make money here. It's, oh, I really need to change something here.

I want to have an impact at this point. So you acquired, and I don't know the right terminology, required the rights to this drug or however, what's the terminology here? I did. I acquired the, basically the global rights to it. So the patent across all of the world. And at this point it wasn't FDA approved. Is that right?

Or it was? It was not. No, it wasn't. And listen to this right? Or it was? It was not. No, it wasn't. And listen to this. This is a crazy piece of this story. I went to this German company and they gave me the rights. Not just like that? Yep.

So I paid nothing up front. They had a back end. If I won, they won. No deal ever works. It's a win-win. But I think they were so certain that we couldn't get out of our own way societally that they were like, sure, take a shot. We'll humor you. And so let's just say we're good friends today, right? Yeah, I bet. It was about ideas as everybody is listening.

When you have these ideas, the ingredient is the person, the champions of those ideas. It becomes teams of people, but it's really that it requires that. Great ideas don't execute themselves. People do. And that passion quotient in it, for me, you're so right. Spending a year talking to women, it became so much bigger than just me. I actually felt an obligation to do this. And thank goodness I had that sense of calling in this because I had a lot of really dark days and would pick me back up is I could not afford to let them down by not seeing it all the way through. I love that. So I know this took a lot with getting the FDA approval. So how did this

passion really move that forward? Listen, I sat down. So you said, what happened? I'll give the quick version. You sit down. I had a roadmap. They'd given it to the German company. I said, is this what I need to do? They said, yes. I went and did it. I met all the end points that I was required to in clinical trials and they turned me down. And I was blindsided by it. And it was the moment of truth. What was my conviction here? How much was I really going to give to see it through? Because can you imagine turning around to shareholders and saying, hey, guess what? We're turned down, but I need more money. So I made this radical decision to dispute the FDA. Is this something that happens often or not?

No, I call it the road less traveled on the government, especially for female sexual pleasure. But here's why I did it. The data was there. And we have a mandate in my mind that if we have a problem, and this isn't just in this field, but anywhere really in life, right? If there's an issue that isn't being met, who should be at the center of that conversation? The person dealing with the issue, right? And we weren't listening to women. It really was exactly what I did for a year. I spent time talking to women. Well, by God, so too were they going to talk to them. And I really, through disputing them to their credit, it forced opening their doors

and talking to women. And suddenly I think all of us getting out of our own way in terms of our opinions that we might not even be conscious of, of how much it matters if women have more satisfying sex to just making a data-driven decision. Science had given us the answer a long time ago. We just weren't listening. Wow. And I want you to share another statistic here as well, because share how long it took you to get the FDA approval versus how long it took. Was it Viagra that got through and like was fast-tracked share with us that because I think this also said a lot and then like you said we'll get off our soapbox but while we're here I'll tell everybody the

little blue pill Viagra met it was deemed to meet such an important medical need it was a national emergency that men were not having erections. And therefore, it received this very special designation of being fast-tracked for approval. What that meant is they rushed it through and it got to the market in six months. It took me six years in that. Thank you. It says a lot, doesn't it? And by the way, the prevalence of ED is identical to the prevalence of women who have this condition, frustrating low desire. The medical term for it is hypoactive sexual desire disorder or HSDD. Crazy, right? Just crazy. Quite an experience. But it was all of the things that all of you

experience as you are building a startup. The tests are just little check-ins for whether or not you're going to stay in the game. Yeah, so true. And I think that's just really, really important to see in your story. Like it was not a straight road. There was roadblocks, so many roadblocks along the way. And just bringing it back around to that business piece

and going, okay, so you got FDA approval. Yes. What happened next then, right? So this means when you get FDA approval, this means it's a drug that can be prescribed at this point, right? Right. Yes, it is. So what came next is I sold the business. I think nobody thought the girl in pink with the tiny little company that could, was going to cross this finish line and be the first ever in the world to break through with a product for women's desire. And you better believe they came calling. So I had suitors at the door almost overnight and I sold the business for a billion dollars up front.

Wow. What a happy ending. You've done all this work, Cindy. You've pushed through, you've gone against the FDA. You've got the approval. You're ready. And then you sell for a billion dollars. You must have just sat back at that point, hey? Yeah, exactly. Now tell us the real story. This thing is a billion dollar happy ending. So here's what really happened. I was bought. I was so excited. This was the dream come true. They're going to march it across the world. They're going to make it affordable in a way that I never could have as a little company.

And they buy the product. And within a couple months, they invite me to leave, is how I like to say it. And within three more months, they dismantle my entire team and they don't launch it. And it was crushing, crushing. You can hear so much of this was, again, it wasn't about building the next billion dollar drug. It was about changing this conversation for women forever. And you have crossed the finish line and then have women who deserved it, who needed it, not be able to get it. It was awful. And I think, again, these are the tests. So I was sitting, licking my wounds and crying in the corner. And then I kicked myself in the ass, picked myself up and said, not on my watch. And so I went back, I fought them. I actually sued them. And in exchange for dropping

the lawsuit, I got the drug back and my shareholders kept the billion dollars. And now we invested in other women and in the product. So I'll tell you how I did it. This is really- Let's go into the details. Okay. So when I sold Slate, first time ever selling a company. So very often, its transactions are structured, meaning I get cash up front and then I make it some consideration, royalties, milestone payments, whatever it is downstream. All right. So how do you govern those things?

Well, the typical language in a legal document is going to be called a best efforts clause. What I will tell you is best efforts can hide a multitude of sins, meaning your best efforts and my best efforts look a little different. So they can actually deprioritize and not put the focus on your product that you'd want to extract the full value on that backend. I'm not saying my slate deal wasn't wonderful, but it was governed by that clause. And so eyes wide open, right? You learn as you go along. When I sold Sprout, I wrote really specific performance obligations. They weren't crazy expectations. It was how much money are you spending on education? How many salespeople do you have calling on physicians across the country?

And when they didn't meet those, that was my opportunity. So I was able to say they were in breach of what they had agreed to do to give sufficient promotional effort and investment to this opportunity. And when they weren't doing that, that's really what the leverage was to get it back. And so I just want to ask questions that I know lots of listeners will be like, new to contract law, et cetera, and just really understanding this. Those provisions, were they on both sides? Did they have them on you as well? And you put them on them? Like, how did that conversation work? It didn't because they completely took over the brand. So it was completely in their hands. I got

to participate in the win. So they paid me some money upfront. It wasn't really the full value. So the billion dollars wasn't actually how much this would have been a much multi-billion dollar deal with all of the continued payouts. And really, again, because they were harming the potential of the shareholders to capture all of that, payouts. And really, again, because they were harming the potential of the shareholders to capture all of that, that was the leverage. And they're not, I should say this, the reason this happened is that their business had its own issue. They changed CEOs from who had acquired and really it got sort of got lost without a champion inside with all of the team gone.

Yeah. Cause I know that a lot of listeners are going to be like, hang on a minute, a company pays a billion dollars for a product and then just gives it you back or like doesn't do anything with it. Like it just doesn't make sense in normal terms. Right. So just share a little bit about that story and how it led to that and even like how you ended up leaving and then coming back and that lawsuit because I think there's so many lessons in this and I certainly have had my own mistakes in business and I'm like oh I wish I had known that and I really believe that the more we talk about mistakes that we make then there can be lessons learned for the people that actually have to go through it so just talk to me around how that evolved and unraveled.

It's so funny because I said I had a couple different suitors for the company and this is the one I chose that didn't go the way it was planned, right? Now I'll tell you why I chose them. I chose them because their intention was to keep the team. And I said it before, I'll say it again. People are what matters. That's what you bet on. And in the hands of this committed group, I have the most extraordinary team that when they changed that, so that wasn't one of my provisions, right? That they kept people. That's a little bit complicated from an HR perspective, but that's really why they emerged the winner because I knew that was really the secret sauce. And when they dismantled all the team, one thing to let me go. And when you're a founder, I'm a mama bear completely. This is my

baby. I have a vision for how this baby is going to grow up in this world. And if anybody is deviating from that vision, it's very hard to take. And you have to check yourself. They paid me a lot of money for this company. And I thought, you know what? I understand. And I need to step to the sidelines and be their biggest advocate and cheerleader. And I had this relief because, well, I know the team is there. And that's what really counts. Now, when they dismantled the whole team, that was the turning point for me. No way. No way did we fight this hard and I can't get it. I mean, I used to secret shop it. You're going to laugh. I would go to like Target and Walgreens and et cetera, and try to get the product and I couldn't get it. They didn't stop it anywhere.

And so again, it went back to, I am letting down all of those women who have so graciously shared their story with me. So what am I going to do? I'm going to find the workaround. And I sat down with their new CEO and I said, give it back. And of course, you know, the first response to that is to laugh. And he's a lovely guy. And he's like, we paid a billion dollars for it. And I said, I know, but you also agreed to do all these things to launch it. And I think his intention, he was coming into a new business would absolutely have been to do that, but he had so many different business dynamics. And really when I couldn't get their attention, I said, okay, I have to sue you for the contract. You have to do it.

It's what you agree to. And this product isn't being launched. And that's why ultimately, again, in exchange for dropping the lawsuit, they gave it back. But in that conversation with him, I said, he's like, this has a lot of value. And I said, I'm glad you know that because so too, to all my shareholders who were holding me accountable, right. For the backend of the deal. So it was really, it's been an extraordinary circumstance. And to get it back though, really feels, it was so incredible to pick up the phone. I knew people who'd been with me had moved on. They were in new jobs. This took me several years. It's not like I got it back a minute later. It was several years in the making, behind the scenes, biting of ankles,

if you will. And I picked up the phone and I called a lot of my old crew and I said, look, I got it back. We got to get this right for women. And the ultimate flattery is that they dropped what they were doing and they came back and they work on it today. And we turned it on. And literally in the first week, I can remember when we got it back and we launched it, I was doing some interviews that week in New York and a reporter said, okay, well, Cindy, when are they going to be able to get it? Because it's not so easy, right? To just all of a sudden have the supply chain working and put something

up. And I looked at her and I was beaming and I said, they can get it today. Women are literally getting this product right now. And I've been sitting waiting for this big company to do this for years and they can get it right now. And that has been, I mean, that's the coolest part of it all. I turned on radio ads earlier this year and I sat in my car, like the first one came on and I cried like a baby because by the way that was 10 years in the making to get to now that overnight success what nothing is that's right pretty much you can presume there's a decade that went into any of those stories hit the covers for sure that is so amazing and I just want to say thank you for fighting so hard because you're so right like that drug means so much more it's's so much more than a pill. It really does stand for something.

And I think just imagine if it had been left in the company's hands who you'd sold to and it just sat on that shelf, that would have just knocked. Because this is a ripple effect as well, right? You pushing forwards with this drug, you fighting to get this drug on the shelves. This is a ripple effect to say, hey, actually, because unfortunately money talks, right? You pushing forwards with this drug, you fighting to get this drug on the shelves. This is a ripple effect to say, hey, actually, because unfortunately money talks, right? Oh, there is an industry here. We should be paying more attention to female hormones and female reproduction and female sex drives. Like that is something that we should be paying attention to. So thank you so much from so many of our listeners for fighting this. That's what this is all about. In 2015, I'll share with you guys a stat.

In 2015, we broke through with this approval and the term Femtech was coined, which is much more expansive, right? Than just these products. It can be a lot of things, toys, tampons, et cetera, et cetera. That's going to be a $50 billion industry by 2025. Amazing. I want to ask you a few questions because you have such a wealth of experience in this sector but also with shareholders yeah and i think and raising

and i think this is a conversation now we know that like what venture capital it's like but two between two and four percent depending on which articles you read actually go to female founders which is just absolutely crazy because we know the success rate of companies with females on their boards is much higher, right? So what are some tips that you would give our listeners in first of all, raising money? Now I know there's going to be a really deep dive in this, but just some high level things. What are the things that people should really, or women really think about when it comes to raising? Okay. So first of all, and I don't know that I said this before, but I didn't have a rich uncle. So part of my dilemma when I was doing Slate was I felt

I had a track record that I could go out and really talk to people about to get their buy-in that I was the right person, but I didn't have any obvious choices to give me money. So outside of calling my big brothers who didn't have any money, but still wrote me a tiny check and now they're happy they did. You really have to be thoughtful about who is my wishlist? Who invests in these things? It's already in their wheelhouse, so to speak. And how do I get in the room with them? And I really professionally stalked, if you will. I did not know, but I knew would give me the best feedback, even if it wasn't good, or would open the doors for me to money. And so I had targeted, there was a guy who was a healthcare managing director of healthcare

banking. He had left this big firm. He was now investing his own money. I could figure all of this out online, by the way. And I figured out a way to get in the room. I made a point to be at an event that he was going to be at. And when I met him, he was interested. He liked the idea. I said, great, can you introduce me to two of your friends? And then I got to two of his friends and I said, can you introduce me each to four of your friends? I'm not kidding. I raised a hundred million dollars from high net worth individuals and family offices, never from

because when I went to the VCs, they laughed me out of the room. Now I'm not telling you all that venture money isn't accessible, even if it's, I will not, I refuse to say it's more than 3% because it's really steadily been at less than 3% for all of these years. Like you said, despite the fact that we know how well female founders perform. So if you're going to go that route, my first tip is find angel networks. They are in every one of your cities. You can look them up online, go and pitch them and start working a high net worth individual crowd because they will be

more of a double bottom line investor, meaning they will be attracted to you because of the mission you're on. That was my saving grace. When I hit these road bumps, if I had had traditional venture capital, they would have looked at the spreadsheet and kicked me to the curb. And these other folks understood what I was trying to do for women. And they hung with me through the toughest times. So one is consider that first of all, as a funding source. Again, you can find them in your city. And the second piece is if you're going the venture route and you have a product that really uniquely serves women, and therefore by the numbers, you are less likely to have folks sitting on the other side of the table that can relate in their blue and gray suits. So

you are choosing to ask them to have somebody in the room who would be a user. You get to make that ask. And I'm going to frame it. And I do say this a lot. So forgive me if you've heard it, but I'm really going to put myself on the hot seat here. So I don't golf. If somebody wrote me and said, Cindy, I have an invention that is going to change the game of golf. I would say, great. Okay.

If you wrote me and said, Cindy, I have an invention that's going to change the game of golf. Do you know anyone who golfs? Can I come pitch you with them? And we got in the room together. I was willing to do it. And they said, holy crap, I would be reaching for my wallet. This is gold. This is such good advice. You're so right. So please make the ask. My biggest mistake ever was taking money from the wrong person. And I forgot that I was choosing to, because you want the money, you need the money. I need to scale. I need this money and don't do it. So be discriminating in

who you select. And when you're in the room, don't allow the excuse of, I don't get it and the brush off. So true. And it comes back to like, right at the beginning of this interview, we spoke about those interview pieces being like, when you're hiring someone, they also need to choose you as well. And it's the same thing, isn't it? It's always a relationship. It needs both of you need to choose each other very consciously. And I think that's an amazing, amazing takeaway. Honestly, Sydney, this interview has been absolutely amazing. I have a full A4 piece of paper covered in notes. It's just amazing. And your story, I know, is going to have inspired so many and just really letting people know that the journey is not

always easy. It's not always direct, but it's worth going down that path and just really letting people know that the journey is not always easy. It's not always direct, but it's worth going down that path. And just knowing that you're having such amazing impact on so many women is just so incredible. And yeah, just thank you for being who you are, Sidney, and showing up the way you have today. It's been truly amazing. Thank you.

I want to say to all of your group, there's one thing I have learned. Success does not come from having all the answers. It comes from having the courage. Just keep showing up. It will not be the path that you expect it to be, but you can still get to the destination. I love that. I would love for you to share your handles and where people can find you because everyone always has so many takeaways and both of us want to hear them. So please tag myself at Danielle Canty, tag at bossbabe.inc. And Cindy, do you want to share yours? Yes, please. At Cindy Pink CEO. And if there's ways I can help through

DM or if you'll share it with Boss Babe, I'd love to answer more of your questions. We didn't even talk about my three Ps. Danielle, we got to do that next time. I feel like we need to do. Okay. Should we do this? Should we do a part two? Yes, absolutely. Okay. Let's do this. We've never done this before, but I think we should do a part two and then we can dive into some of those pieces as well, because that would be amazing. And I would absolutely love that. I love it. If you loved this episode, please subscribe, download a a few more and please leave us a review i really want to hear what you enjoyed what your main takeaways were and i also want to know what you want to hear us talk about next to say thanks for leaving us a review we'll send you a copy of the boss babe 25 the boss of 25 is the 25 essential resources you need for personal and professional

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