the bossbabe podcast - 167. How Teen Pregnancy Became A Turning Point & Allowed Sarah Jakes Roberts To Impact Thousands

Episode Date: May 27, 2021

After a teen pregnancy, struggles with self worth and a marriage that ended in divorce, Sarah Jakes Roberts had one resounding thought that echoed in her mind... “I can do better than this.”  It was this turning point that transformed her story of struggle into one of resilience, empowerment and ultimately gave her the courage to share her experiences and impact thousands.  In this vulnerable and heartfelt interview, Natalie, Danielle and Sarah have a very honest conversation about what it looks like for anyone to hit a turning point in their life – big or small. Plus - they’re sharing how you can navigate your own “turning point” experience so you can move forward with hope, healing and confidence.  Links: Organifi Pure: https://www.organifishop.com/pages/bossbabe/  "Woman Evolve" by Sarah Jakes Roberts: http://womanevolvebook.com/    Follow:  BossBabe: @bossbabe.inc Natalie: @iamnatalie Danielle: @daniellecanty Sarah Jakes Roberts: @sarahjakesroberts

By the time it comes out of our mouths or by the time it comes up in our head, it's already gone through this like funnel, right? And the thing for me in changing it was determined like where did this come from? And when I started realizing that a lot of the thoughts that I were having were really rooted in fear and not love, it's not that the thoughts stopped coming. It's just that when they came, I realized that that is my fear. That is my insecurity. What would love say instead? Welcome to the Boss Babe Podcast, the place where we share with you the real behind the scenes of building successful businesses, achieving peak performance and learning how to balance it all.

I'm Danielle Canty, the co-founder of Boss Babe and today I am joined by Natalie Ellis. Today we have a phenomenal guest on the podcast. She is called Sarah Jakes Roberts. So to give you a little background on her, at 23 she was almost, you know, tempted to allow her journey as a woman battling insecurities, team pregnancy stigma, low self-esteem, toxic relationships and depression to define the rest of her life. It wasn't until she was in her darkest moment that she realized she had two options settle or evolve she dared to harness the wisdom of her past wounds and apply them to the hope for her future and it's been incredible to dive into her journey in 2017 she launched woman evolve which is a ministry that focuses on incubating every woman to her fullness since its conception it has been really successful reaching and guiding thousands of women to waking healing wholeness and love for themselves and

others sarah has amassed a huge audience on social media as well for spreading the message that she does and being really honest and vulnerable about her story which i think for me was probably the biggest takeaway of this episode was just how vulnerable and honest she was. Yeah, this was a real talk episode. And that's what I loved about it. You know, we spoke about, you know, she shared just then, Natalie, about the stigma around teenage pregnancy. We spoke about the battles of mom guilt, which I know you and I don't fully understand yet as we're not moms, but it was really what I liked about Sarah. She was just really honest about that and just sharing the trials and tribulations

she had building her business alongside being a mother. Some of those challenges and insecurities that she had along the way. And for me, this is what the Boss Be podcast is about, having real conversations that affect real people on the daily, things that are not always comfortable to talk about, but actually things that we all battle with behind the scenes yeah and speaking of realness you guys it took us

like six attempts to be able to say the intro welcome to the boss big podcast because we were just like tripping all over our words we have had the most crazy few weeks you've obviously been following along on social you saw us speak to an audience of over 900 000 people which was epic traveling launching like you name it we've been doing it and i think we're hitting a wall i think it might be time to take a week off yeah literally i think sometimes you just you push push push and then you're like actually do you know what i need to put my boundaries back in i know that i mean you and I just had a conversation on the phone last night. I was like, Natalie, I can't do to be accountable for that as well you know hold each other grounded and be like no just invest in yourself right now because you can only show up as you know healthy as you are you know if you're

not if you're not in a good mental headspace if you're suffering with any of your like body ailments like you're not going to be able to be your best self so I think it's a way of reflection something to recognize yeah 100% I am fully going into prioritizing me and making sure I take care of me first and foremost because like you said that really determines how you show up and neither of us live to work which is really nice that we both feel the exact same way so just sharing you know that took a lot of a lot of times getting into this episode, but we did it. You said it, you rolled off the tongue. So with that, let's dive into the interview. A boss babe is unapologetically ambitious and paves the way for herself and other women to rise, keep going and fighting on. She is on a mission to be her best self in all areas.

It's just believing in yourself, confidently stepping outside her comfort zone to create her own vision of success. Sarah, welcome to the podcast. We're so excited to be chatting with you. Thank you. I'm excited to speak with you guys too. Now, I just selfishly want to hear your story because I've been reading so much about you and you are incredibly inspirational. So I would love to start in your teen years. I would love to find out what you were like as a teenager. As a teenager, I was probably just a little, a lone wolf compared to the world that I was living in. My family is a family that is well known in faith. And yet I felt very much so connected to just like the culture of the era that I was raised. I'm a 90s baby. So you couldn't tell me that I wasn't like a hip hop star down on the inside.

I loved all of the things that just felt so anti-faith at that time. But I like to think that I was kind of charting my own course. I felt so disconnected from my family and this faith that they represented. And I think because of that, I just found myself in a circle of people who kind of felt the same way that I did. And, you know, I was trying to fit in with them.

And I don't know how far in my story you want me to go. I can tell the whole thing, but I think in the process of trying to find community that I encountered a few wounds that, you know, have now turned into wisdom. I would love to find community that I encountered a few wounds that, you know, have now turned into wisdom. I would love to dig into that and find out what you mean by that and what happened for you.

Sure. So I'm in this community of people. A lot of times when people tell their story, they're like, I got into the bad crowd. I don't like to think of it as getting into the bad crowd because I think that I ended up in a crowd full of people who were just as broken, insecure, lost, and confused as I was. But in that context of friendship and community, I was seeking validation, seeking to be understood, seeking to fit in. Because of that, I ended up getting pregnant. I had sex at an early age. I was 13 years old when I got pregnant, 14 years old when I had my son.

And now the person who felt like they weren't connected with their family and church and faith is even more disconnected than I was then. And I spent 10 years really of just having questionable self-worth, not sure if I had any purpose, definitely not feeling like I fit in. I would say 10 years really of just a toxic relationship with self, with others, with faith, anything that could be toxic was toxic. And I just hit this rock bottom. I was leaving a CPS office. I had this altercation and I just thought to myself, there's got to be more than this. I'm still young. I'm like 23, 24.

And I don't want to spend the rest of my life like this. I'm still young. I'm like 23, 24. And I don't want to spend the rest of my life like this. And the process of me kind of doing the work kind of changed and became this transformational experience, not just for myself, but for others. I think having a child at any age, whether you're in your 30s or your 20s is, you know, I don't have children, but I hear it's a transformational process and challenging and really hard. So like, you know, you't have children but I hear it's a transformational process and challenging and really hard so like you know you just talked around then like feeling quite lost etc for those first 10 years but what were some of the things that really got you through that to actually you know start on this change or like what were things that you were doing at that time you know I feel like to your point motherhood is transformational and traumatizing.

You are no longer who you used to be and you're not really sure that you can be good at what is ahead of you. I will say that having the responsibility of having a son really allowed me to kind of sober up in my thoughts. Even though I still had some shame and some guilt that I was working through because I got pregnant at an early age, I also had this intense desire to provide a life for him, this intense focus to make sure that I was ambitious and had a work ethic so and started working on myself instead of trying to build a life. And that's what I think so many of us lose in the hustle of things. We're so busy trying to build a life for the outside to look in on. But our true growth comes when we start building ourselves. And then what happens outside of that is just extra credit. We don't need it. It doesn't define us. We get to have fun and be

creative in the process of producing because our identity and worth isn't connected to what we do. I love that so much. And I'm really curious at that age, did you have support of many people around you? Because I just, you're such a child yourself. It must have been, you know, something you would never have been able to prepare for. And I feel like even with all the support in the world, it would have been difficult. But like you said, you already had that disconnection. I did. I had the disconnection, but my family, you know, in times of crisis, my family was like,

we got to stick together and figure out what we do. So I had my parents, I had my siblings. We kind of grew up in what would be like a fishbowl because there were us, there were like a family of seven, my home family, like a family of seven. But then my father was the pastor of a church that literally had 30,000 members. And so though I had support from my family and friends, there were also 30,000 people watching how we navigated a 13-year-old being pregnant. Some people, you know, sent us well wishes and had hope and faith that we

would be okay. Others were so upset that it had happened that they wanted me to get up and apologize in front of everyone. And so I think the pressure of the fishbowl, my own shame, my own brokenness and disappointment within myself really is what allowed that toxic relationship to continue for almost 10 years. And I mean, the relationship I had with myself, because it was the only thing I saw and the only thing I thought other people would see when they looked at me. And you spoke about suffering from that for like 10 years. So the age that you're up to about 23, and you shared with us previously that you know you had like two choices at that point and you talk about either settling or evolving

like what was the real turning point for you in making that decision and then what were the steps that you took when you decided no I want to evolve? You know so when I first got pregnant my biggest fear was like that I wasn't going to be a good mom. And so when I was leaving that CPS office 10 years after having that fear, I realized that my fear was going to become a reality. Someone was literally questioning me about my ability to be a good mother. And part of the reason why they were questioning that was because of the decisions I'd made in relationships. And so I thought to myself, I feel like I can do better than this. I can do better than being in this

emotional, abusive, traumatizing relationship that I could do better if I decided to be healthy for myself and for my children. And that was really my turning point in which I said, I am not going to allow my fear to be in the driver's seat of my life anymore. My insecurities can't determine my destiny anymore. I'm going to have to choose what is going to determine my destiny. And I just had this notion that I can do better. I want it better to drive my destiny. And so I started doing what a better version of me would do.

It felt foreign, felt awkward. I had to practice it, but I started leaning into that. And that's when I began to really see my life change. And what did that version of better look like for you? And what did that lead you to building from nothing? Oh, goodness. Better looked like instead of talking negatively about myself, taking those thoughts and saying like, what would better, what is a better thought to have about yourself? Instead of thinking that I could never do this, I started thinking like, what would be a better way to achieve this? What classes would I need to take? Who would I have to become in order to make it happen? I started taking care of my body,

even small decisions that seem like they aren't even connected to our ultimate purpose or vision for our lives play a role in teaching us what we can do. I'd lost like 40 pounds in over a few months time just because I started making those better choices. And as I was making those better choices, I invited other people in on the journey. I wasn't sure where we were headed. I didn't really know what I was doing. I was just sharing what I learned along the way. And then there started becoming hundreds and then thousands and now even millions of women who said like, hey, I want to figure out how to do better too. And that process allowed me to create different opportunities and communities for us to come together to determine what better would look like for us all. I think as well, you just said

something there that I think is really poignant that you didn't know, you didn't have it all figured out. You didn't know exactly where you were going, but you just started in that journey. And I see this with a lot of people that we get to know, women and men alike. And sometimes it's like, oh, I have to know exactly where I'm heading, what that North Star is. But sometimes I think it's just making the decision that you want to change, you want it to be bad hitter, or you want to strive for something different. And that first step in my mind is taking that, you know, that action or making that decision. And the next step isn't like knowing exactly where you're going, it's just, okay, I'm going to do one thing. I'm going to start getting up at the same time every day, or I'm actually

just going to start smiling more. I'm going to start this self-worth practice or this self-taught practice and I think so often we look up to people that are so many steps ahead of us versus being like actually I'm going to anchor to someone who's one step ahead or I'm just going to follow a process or a challenge or something that's one step ahead and just take that first step and then I'm going to worry about the second step and the third step and so I'm just wondering like how you know what inspired you at that point to be And so I'm just wondering like how, you know, what inspired you at that point to be like, wow, I'm going to share this journey. Was it because you were struggling to find people that you could anchor to and look to? Or were you just like, actually, I'm quite an extrovert and I wanted to share the story? Oh, girl, no, I am not an extrovert. I am not an

extrovert, which is kind of like, I think just like just this divine, something bigger than me, just kind of guiding me towards this moment. First of all, I love writing. Writing is like one of my favorite things to do. I don't even know what's in my head until I start writing. And I didn't think writing was a gift. I just wanted to jot it down somewhere. And I don't even know why I thought that a blog would be the way to do it. I'll tell you, I was married. I'm married now, but this is my second marriage and my first marriage. No one knew who my father was because of my last name. So I was really just writing under this name that I didn't think anyone would know.

And I think that there was this safety and kind of like, I'm just going to tell my story and no one has to hear it. And then people started listening. I feel like I kind of stumbled into this because I am an introvert. And so I started sharing it, not with the intent of helping other people necessarily, but just to relieve what was down on the inside of me. And then I had to make a decision to become intentional about it. I love what you said, though, very quickly about that idea of just taking small steps, because I can remember walking out of NCPS's Child Protective Services. It's how they, you know, determine whether or not parents are doing what is necessary in order to protect the child's well-being. And all I thought to myself was, I can do better than this. I can do better than this. That's all I thought is I can do better than this. And I think that when we begin to hear that, whether it's about our nutrition or our spending or our relationships or our thoughts, I can do better than this is the first step towards change. What was it that put you in the situation with protective services in the first place? Was there

an incident that happened where you had to go see them or was it because of your age? How did that occur? Okay. Okay. So I'm going to tell you. All right. So I was in my first marriage. There was a, it was toxic and not just because of infidelity on his part, though, that was there, but just because we were both young, broken, insecure, and trying to dress up a life that would look better. But there was a lot of infidelity, a lot of infidelity, infidelity, and it would just drive me crazy because I could never fully catch him. And so there was this moment where we were having dinner with our children and we're just trying to play like this white picket fence life anyway. And I looked outside and noticed that there was a car running. His car was running outside while we're having dinner. And so like he was doing something with our daughter. I kind of snuck outside. I walk up

to the car. There's a woman in the car. She's waiting on him to finish dinner because he was going to leave with her. And I lost it. And I think I lost it because she told me, but there's nothing going on between us. And I'm like, now you guys are trying to make me feel like I'm crazy because like it's right here in front of my face. And yet you're still saying that's not it. So I grabbed, I got in my car and I started ramming her side of the car over and over and over again, like forward, reverse, forward, reverse, like over and over and over again. Cause I was like, what you're not going to do is go anywhere. No one is going anywhere until we figure this out. And then the police came and they were like, you're not going to do is go anywhere. No one is going anywhere until we figure this out. And then the

police came and they were like, you're not going anywhere either. You know, it's very, it's not ideal, not ideal. But the officer didn't arrest me. He asked me what was happening. And I told him, well, my husband brought his girlfriend to our house and he was like, I won't arrest you for this. But I do want you to go see child protective services to make sure that the kids are in a safe environment. I'm betting you look back on that moment as probably a blessing, the fact that you got to then experience that and come out thinking, you know what, I deserve better than this and I get to to do something different to this. Was that the moment that you think was the biggest turning point for your life? I think so, for sure. That was the moment where I realized like you could

end up in prison. Like you think the worst thing that happened to you is that you got pregnant at 13. You still have a life to live. And if you don't get intentional about your life, you could end up in prison. You could end up in the hospital. Like things can get worse than where you have been if you don't finally take control. And so I had to take control of what I had left. Everything we're going to do that will lead us to our next victory has everything to do with what we have left. And sometimes we are so resentful that we don't have what we used to have, that we don't maximize what we have left. And so I took what I had left and I just tried to do better with what was left. Let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite all-in-one platform, Kajabi.

You know I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity, which I love. Not to mention our team couldn't be happier because now everything is in one place. So it makes collecting data, creating pages, collecting payment, all the things, so much simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and Kajabi has really helped us do that this year. So of course I needed to share it here with you. It's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business, you know, get rid of the complexity and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible I definitely recommend Kajabi to all of my clients and students so if you're listening and haven't checked out Kajabi

yet now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim your 30-day free trial that's kajabi.com slash boss babe I love that and thanks just sharing that story because I feel like these are the types of things that so many people go through but so many people don't talk openly about so first of all thanks for sharing that piece and second of all you just said something then again you know it's like people think oh no like I'm I'm this age I'm like 20 I'm 30 I'm 40'm 50 and 60, but they forget about all the years that they have to come yet. And I think that's just a really grounding realization for so many. Like it doesn't

age is just a number and you always have so much ahead of you. Like if there's something that you want to go after, if there's a change that you want to make, if there's something you want to do, I, you know, I mean, I did a huge career pivot and I think sometimes as well like loads of people like oh well I can't change now because I put so much effort into this so I can't leave that relationship because you know I've been in this relationship so long or I can't leave this because they're the father of the children or the partner but actually when you have that realization around like okay I've done this for so many years but I want to change so that my next few years are different I think that's a that my next few years are different. I think that's a really, it's about taking back control.

And I think just, I love when people listen to this, just hearing that actually they're not the only ones who are going through this. Sometimes like, yeah, we all want to take back that control or we decide where the next part of our life takes us to, you know? Oh my gosh, that's so good. And I have to tell you, so that was like I mentioned, it's probably 10 years of my life before I came to that turning point. I'm 32 now. I'll be 33 in July. But I spent, I will say when I turned 30, I'd come to a place in my life where that was just only five years from having that breaking point. And those five years of freedom were worth the 10 years of trauma that I've gone through. I was probably a year out of my marriage and rebuilding my life where I felt like where I am now is worth everything that it cost me to get here. And I say that to say, no matter how old you are or how long you've been

in something, you would be astonished at how one month of peace, one month of freedom, one month of healing is worth 10 years of trauma. Like you'll say to yourself, this one month was worth it. If I could just finally get the peace to move out of this relationship or whatever that situation is that has you feeling stuck. There's an acceleration that happens where it's almost as if you had joy for the time that you didn't, because it's all waiting for you in the moment that you step into that change. I love that so much. And just hearing your story and then looking at where you are now and the empire that you've been able to build is just phenomenal. Okay, so I want to interrupt this episode quickly to tell you about a brand that I am completely obsessed with. So if you watch my stories, you'll know that every single morning

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and I'm really curious what the biggest turning point in your career was was it a book that you released that changed any everything was it a decision you made like when did your career trajectory just change completely okay it was definitely a decision I made so I started sharing my story about the teen pregnancy, about me coming to this place of healing and wholeness and people would invite me to come and speak. And I would share this story all of the time. And I got invited so many different places, but my social media was growing really rapidly. And I could tell that the people who were following me on social media, weren't the people I was speaking to when I was going to these events. And I realized that like, okay,

if this is what I'm going to do, I'm going to share my story. I'm going to share it with as many people as possible. Then I also need to be intentional about who I want to talk to and what it is that I want to say to them. And I felt like there were a generation of women who maybe didn't go to church, didn't have faith, were on the fence about it, or just hadn't had any type of inspiration that were drawn to me, but wouldn't come to the spaces where I was speaking. And so I decided to create atmospheres where they would feel safe enough to come and bring all of themselves into this moment. So like, I only gave you guys like a snippet of my story, but I've done so many random things. I waitress at a strip club.

I was a receptionist. Like I've got all of these different experiences that I see now helped me to understand women who've come from different walks of life. And I wanted to create a space where anyone, no matter who they were or where they were on their journey could come in and feel safe enough to say, I want to figure out what better looks like for me. I mean, I feel like I need to hear some of these stories. Is there a story in the book that stands out to you as one of your favorites? Oh goodness. There are, I will, there, there is a story. It's not as entertaining as the strip club or the ramping the cars, but there is a story that I think was like really healing for me. And I think it just speaks to the testament of even the most difficult moments can turn

around and be used to, to heal you. I'll just share it briefly. So when I first got pregnant, someone close to my family told me, I always knew to expect something like this out of you. And I think it just spoke to how much I wasn't just in the flow of what my family was doing. And that really stuck with me for a very long time because it made me feel like, what is it about me where someone could just look at me and expect for something like this to happen? And so now fast forward, and expect for something like this to happen.

And so now fast forward, and I'm about to go on tour. So I wanted to have this tour where I could create the community for women from different walks of life to come together. And this was just something that I did on a day or rented out the venues, hired the crew, didn't know if anyone was going to come. We put the tickets up for sale and it sells out like in the first week. Every single city sells out in a week. And now I'm scared because it's like, all right, it was one thing if we were doing this, but now we're like doing this. And I was feeling so scared, so nervous.

I felt like a 13-year-old girl who was pregnant again, just like, you can't do this. You're not worthy. You have nothing to say. You have nothing to say. You have nothing to offer. And I just felt like God just like invaded my thoughts, invaded my insecurities in that moment and just whispered to me, I always knew to expect something like this out of you. And I shared that in the story because those same words that really made me question myself are now the words that I use even when I'm nervous before I'm

getting ready to do something. I draw on those words because I'm not standing in something that wasn't already seen. And so that's one of my favorite stories that I cherish and still draw on in moments of insecurity. I love that. That's so powerful. And it's so like, you know, things happen for you, not to you as well, right? Like everything in your life has happened for a reason and it's led to you in this moment as well. And utilizing those words in two different contexts is one to kind of, one that caused a contraction and then one that's really actually helped you expand, I think is really, really powerful. I want to just talk a little bit more on, like Natsi said, you've built a huge empire and, you know, you're an author and a businesswoman and you've been on loads of shows and you spoke about your tour. Motherhood has been such a part of your journey, right? That's what kind of started the whole thing off. And now you've gone on to have, is it six children? Yes, we're a blended family of six children. Six children didn't live in me, but yeah, we're a blended family of six. They all live at at home with us I would really love to open up the conversation if you're

willing to share a little bit about um how you balance it and mom girl and those pieces because I know for our audience that's something that is real a real struggle for so many people so how have you kind of like created that balance and how have you battled with that emotionally and physically of trying to make yourself be in two places at one time I'm sure what are some things that you've done there when I first started that's exactly what I tried to do I tried to do every single thing I tried to be the perfect mom at the school but also the you know most savvy business woman when taking meetings and I realized that me trying to do both of those things at the same time was adding a lot of pressure to me. And so I had to come to this place where I

made one decision, which was I'm going to be fully present wherever I am, instead of trying to divide myself up and be great at everything at one time. So when I'm here in this interview, like I'm here in this interview, I'm not trying to remember if I had left fruit snacks or what I'm going to cook for dinner. Like I'm here in this moment. And then when this moment is over, I bring all of myself to that moment. I think that that has a lot to do with being fully present at the end of the day. I'm old enough as a child of parents, but also young enough as a mother to realize that at the end of the day, the kids don't I'm not thinking about what my parents fed me for dinner. I'm thinking about what they taught me.

I'm thinking about the quality time that we spent together. And so being present with our children is so important. And then add boundaries. Like there are some meetings I don't take past a certain time. There are some days that I reserve exclusively for myself, exclusively for my children. But I do think you can have it all, but you just have to be willing to determine what all you want to have in any given moment. Do you know what? I think that presence thing, I love it. You said boundaries and presence. And I just want to speak to the presence bit because I think that is something that when I talk to successful entrepreneurs, that is a theme that really sings through.

Being present in the moment and being like all in and I think there's like two things that happen one it allows you to focus like you say on the actual conversation at hand or the tasks that you're doing but I actually feel like it really serves a lot of people's happiness too because they don't feel always conflicted and it gives a lot more peace I know that's something that I've really tried to battle with as well. You know, I turn off my notifications on my email, on my phone when I'm actually doing stuff so that I can be present because otherwise I feel like I'm not showing up to anything. And it's a horrible feeling of when you're feeling like, hang on a minute, I'm not really showing up to the right places at any one time. And then with boundaries, I really love

that you say that because Natalie and I talk about that all the time. For me, having boundaries was such a negative thing before. Like I felt bad saying no i felt bad turning down like late meetings i felt like i had to be on 24 7 so was that something that you learned um or something that you'd already had pretty good idea around like a strong mind around certain boundaries that you are willing to kind of go against or not? No, I didn't have a strong mind. I definitely learned that. And I think that part of the reason why I had to learn it is because I very much saw the trajectory of my career through a scarcity mindset. So I thought to myself, if I don't work hard for this, if I don't say yes to everything, then I could lose it. And so I had to come to this place where I realized that there is no it to lose.

That at the end of the day, this is about me being true and authentic to what I feel like I'm called to do, what I feel like I'm called to create. And if I don't have a vision and an agenda for my life, for my purpose, for my gifts and my talents, then I'm going to be subjected to someone else's agenda. And so boundaries came as a result of me having an agenda about what I'm supposed to do, where I'm supposed to be speaking, who I speak to. And it's from that agenda that I was able to create boundaries. And I'll say this, the boundaries that I had last year don't work for this year. As life changes, as my life grows and blossoms, then we can't be married to yesterday's boundaries because it may not work for today's circumstances. That makes so much

sense. And just on that topic of the things that you had to put in place, my guess is, and I know a lot of people can relate to this, when you started this journey of healing and stepping into like your next level, your next evolution, like you were saying, you probably had so much shame. You probably had low self-esteem. You were coming out of a toxic relationship. How were you able to really start changing the way you felt about yourself or talking to yourself and changing your mindset? Because I feel like that's really hard for so many people. You know, I had to really narrow down because speech, by the time it comes out of our mouths or by the time it comes up in our head, it's already gone through this like funnel, right?

And the thing for me in changing it was determined like, where did this come from? And when I started realizing that a lot of the thoughts that I were having were really rooted in fear and not love, it's not that the thoughts stopped coming. It's just that when they came, I realized that that is my fear. That is my insecurity. What would love say instead? And when I started thinking about what would love say instead about my body, what would love say instead about my past, what would love say instead about my potential, I was able to insert another thought. And I kept inserting those other thoughts until the love thoughts became my only thoughts. And so I think that has a lot to do with like us taking capture of those thoughts that come into our mind.

The thoughts can come, but it doesn't mean that they get to stay and control our actions and our self-esteem and confidence, but we have to be willing to kind of say, wait a minute, that's not the best version of myself speaking. That's my fear taking over. And so as it pertains to this book, especially, you've wrote so many books. What's different about this one and what's really exciting you about it? Man, this book feels like my first book because this is the first book that I have written since making those decisions about being intentional about who I'm talking to. Before, I was writing books as I was growing and changing, but I still felt very unsure and uncertain about, like, where do I put my stake in the ground? Where do I start building?

Who am I going to be in the earth long term? And so my last book before this book was called like Don't Settle for Safe, Embracing the Uncomfortable to Become Unstoppable. And I was the perfect person to write that book because I was completely uncomfortable in everything that I was doing. And now I've come to this place where I am not as uncomfortable. I still have moments where I'm stretching and growing, but I don't feel as uncertain. And because I managed to kind of navigate through the uncertainty, I feel like this is a book that allows me to help women from a place of

the promised land. Like I've kind of made it to this other side of womanhood that I feel like is available to every woman, regardless of her age or stage in life. And so this is the manual that led me here. And just digging into that a little more, because it sounds like you've just experienced so many things that, you know, probably most people only experience a handful of, which has given you so much perspective to be able to jump in. So no matter what someone's going through, you really can't offer something. And I'm curious if what kind of things you learned growing up with a dad that was really well known. That again is an experience that not many people have. And my guess is it's probably not as easy as it seems.

Oh, not at all. It's really challenging because there's so much expectation placed on you at an early age. I think one of the gifts that my father taught me, though, I mean, he was in ministry before I was even born. And I think that the greatest gift that he's taught me is that longevity is possible. Because I'm not a first generation person to experience what it's like to commit to changing people's lives and to become effective at that. I feel like I understand that I could do this for the rest of my life. When you're the first anything, I can't imagine that there's this feeling of this

could all be taken away from me or I'm the only one who's out here. I don't know if I can actually create this new normal for my family, for my business, for my community. And yet the gift of having someone go ahead of you is that you understand that you can keep going and growing it's that ability isn't it to see people who have been where you would like to go and I think that's amazing that you saw that in your father and I also think it's amazing that you know we now as women as collectively we get to make sure we have more women CEOs we get to have more women climb up the women CEOs we get to have more women climb up the career ladder we get to have more women with voices because I think that is really

important so that you know young girls as well can see like okay well I can go I can go here these people have been here all these women have been here before me and also which I'm really passionate about on our Boss Babe podcast is like sharing actually you know what it's it's not perfect either and none of these people before you get there very easily but they'll share their stories and they'll share their learnings just like you are today you know opening up about some of the struggles that you've had and just allowing more women to see it as possible for them even though they might not have deemed it possible before and it's like I don't need to have been born into it I don't need to have come from wealth or, you know, when I had children young or when I had children old, I think it's

possible for everybody. So I think there's a lot to be said for people like you sharing your story as well, Sarah. Thank you. I appreciate that. I hope that people take away from my story and what I'm continuing to learn is that easy is never the promise growth is, you know, and we get to choose whether or not we tap into growth. Even now with the things that I've been able to experience and accomplish in my life, I'm still like, okay, what do I do? Who am I? What, what does my next look like? And so I think that there is this misnomer that like, if I am able to arrive, then I never have to worry about who I am and what's next for me. And yet here I am,

the book is out. It became a New York Times bestselling book. And I'm still having to ask myself like, but what does that really mean? It doesn't really mean anything because I still have years of my life ahead of me. What do I want to do with what I've been given? What is going to make the most impact? And so I'm back to the drawing board. And I think until we become comfortable realizing there, I'm going to be back at the drawing board. I might as well get comfortable here because this is where I'm going to be setting up shop. I think we'll always be frustrated, but there's something beautiful about knowing that creation is beautiful and getting the opportunity to create again, allows us to revisit who we can become.

So true and what would your advice be for the woman listening in who is perhaps at that stage she's struggling she has so much going on she doesn't have clarity on where she's going or even what she wants out of her life she's at the drawing board just asking the question is it possible for me to have more to have have a life that I actually love? Because right now it feels like it's not possible. Yes. I love this. I would tell that woman to go inward. A lot of times when we find ourselves in those moments, we start thinking about like, well, what do I want my outside to look like? What do I want people to see when they see me? And yet I believe that the answer to what is going to happen outside of us begins with what's taking place on the inside of us. And to make it daily, sometimes we get so overwhelmed with the long-term goal and vision

for our lives, but let's shrink it down to like, what do I want my life to represent today? Maybe sometimes I need a rest. I need a break. I need creativity to emerge for me from a place of rest and not just hustling, but be willing to go inward and from the place of rest, from the place of peace and confidence to then say, what would I want to do for the rest of my life that I would do for free, but could possibly monetize if the possibility came to me because we've got to find the thing in our life that makes us excited to wake up in the morning and not just because of the check that's going to be waiting for us at the end of the deal and from that place I believe that that's where all of the resource and creativity is. I could not agree more and I think sometimes it takes being in the situation where maybe you have everything externally, you're getting paid a ton of money and you have recognition or impact or whatever it is that you were chasing, but something internally isn't feeling good. It's maybe not everything you hoped it would be. It's not feeling

fulfilled. And so you trade the job you're doing now for a salary that might be half the amount for something that you love. And so I love that. I think that's so incredibly powerful. Do you have, say, like a morning routine, something, you know, something that you do daily that gets you in the right mindset, that helps you ask the questions, what do I need? What do I need to show up to as my best that keeps you consistent and in momentum? Absolutely. I take a minute, even if it's just like two, three, 10 minutes in the morning. And I like breathe intentionally, like deep breaths. Cause I find a lot of times when we wake up in the morning, we're already holding our breath. We're bracing ourselves for what the day is going to be. And so I allow my

lungs to fill to their fullest capacity. I exhale, I breathe, I acknowledge God's presence. I acknowledge the fact that I am connected to God's presence. I think about the day that is ahead of me, who I'm going to have to become in order to fulfill whatever is ahead of me and whether or not I can honestly do that without losing myself. And if I'm not able to do that, I ask for resources, help, peace, strength in order to do it. But if that's not available, then I modify my schedule because at the end of the day, I don't want to be successful on the outside, but then struggling mentally and emotionally on the inside. I try to make myself a priority at the beginning of the day. And I have found that when I establish a rhythm of peace, no matter how fast paced my day is, if my inside is peaceful, then I can handle the multitude of things I have to do throughout the day. I'm obsessed with that idea of a rhythm of peace. And so does that come from what you do in the morning, you would say? Is there anything you do throughout the day to keep that going? Let's say a bunch of stressful things come at you midday and you feel like that rhythm is thrown off. How do you bring yourself back to center?

I go back to that place of breathing. It's just like I start the day over, but start the day over with myself. And then I try to pinpoint what is it exactly that threw me off? Was it the fact that the deal didn't close? Was it something I saw on social media? There's something that shook me. Something stole my peace. What was that? And what did it communicate to me? And how am I processing that? And when I realized that maybe it just stroke of fear, maybe it just reminded me of an insecurity,

then I'm able to kind of categorize the other issues. Because you know how it is. You have one thing that goes wrong and then everything is wrong. It's like, what am I doing? I need to close the business down. None of it makes sense anymore. But when I can pinpoint it to one specific thing, it makes me feel more in control of what's truth for me in that given moment.

I love that. That's so good. And I want to say, so your book right now, Woman Evolve, it's out now, right? I love the taglines because it's like break up with your fears and revolutionize your life. So just a high level, tell us the woman that should read this book. Who is she? Oh, the woman who should read this book feels a little stuck, a little, and I say a little because a lot of times we think it's just a little, but it's actually a lot. She is in

relationship with her fears. She acknowledges perhaps that it is a toxic relationship, but she doesn't know how to break out of the cycle of being with her fears. And she knows that she needs change. She doesn't know exactly how or where, but she can sense within herself that something needs to change. Woman Evolve is about identifying how our fears have engaged our soul, our thoughts and our actions, but most importantly, how we introduce a new rhythm so that we can experience a new version of who we are. Oh my goodness. I am obsessed. I literally cannot wait to read this book. Sarah, I'd love for you to share with us like where people can

get the book because I know so many people are going to be listening to me like right I want to get my hands on this like where can we get it from okay Womany Bob is available literally wherever books are sold Amazon of course Target Barnes and Noble wherever you buy your books we've got a Womany Bob available and of course you can find me if you ever want to find me at Sarah Jakes Roberts on Instagram and Facebook. Thank you so much. And if you could leave our audience with one thing, maybe it's a quote, a message, a resource, something that if they are in the space where they're ready for change, they're going to grab your book. What would you say to them or give them to help them on their journey? I would tell that woman who's ready to start this journey that you do not need anything.

You are already equipped with everything that is required for you to revolutionize your life. Your greatest goal right now is not to see what all you can acquire, but rather what you can excavate so that the best version of you can emerge. You've got this girl. That's what I would tell her. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you. Thank you for having me. you