the bossbabe podcast - 187. Level Up Your Life, Your Worth + Your Bank Balance with Mel Robbins

Episode Date: October 7, 2021

$100k in one hour. That’s how much Mel Robbins makes to stand on stage and share her message with a room of thousands..  But this hasn’t always been Mel’s reality. From the financial crisis to being fired from her dream job at the onset of the pandemic – Mel is sharing her simple secrets that paved the way for her success, even in the most unlikely circumstances.  Tune in for a candid conversation around money, female entrepreneurship and how to connect the dots between a simple high-five and high self-worth. Plus, Mel reveals how she showed imposter syndrome the door and the one thing you can do right now to negotiate a higher pay packet.  Links: BossBabe’s FREE 6-Figure Business Live Training  Soul CBD  Use code “BOSSBABE15” at checkout for 15% off Influencer School Our 12-week, guided coaching and certification program designed to help you gain full clarity on your personal brand, learn how to create easy, consistent content, build an audience of engaged followers and create a full-time income from social media. Influencer School Reviews Follow: BossBabe: @bossbabe.inc Natalie Ellis: @iamnatalie Danielle Canty: @daniellecanty Mel Robbins: melrobbins.com +  @melrobbins The High 5 Habit The High 5 Challenge

It's important that you not underprice yourself because of your insecurity, because people won't believe you're actually good. Welcome you guys to another episode of the Boss Babe Podcast, the place where we share with you the real behind the scenes of building successful businesses, achieving performance and learning how to balance it all. Today we're interviewing Mel Robbins. And I have to say, I think this is one of our most powerful episodes yet. Mel Robbins is a best selling author, the highest paid female motivational speaker in the world, and one of the nicest human

beings we've ever met. You're going to see that throughout this episode, there were so many goosebumps and powerful moments, weren't there, Natalie? Yeah, Mel was so vulnerable, sharing stories she's never talked about ever before, and really bringing us behind the scenes of what her journey has looked like. Yeah, totally. And we don't want to give too much away. But what I know for sure is that you're going to want to mark this episode as one of your favorites to re-listen to. It's also on YouTube to watch as well. So if you want to check it out there, just head to thebossbabepodcast.com. Yeah. And lastly, before we dive in, I also want to make sure you have got your front row ticket to our brand new masterclass.

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roadmap to success on social and start making it happen then i want to invite you to the influencer masterclass you are going to learn the exact steps to grow and monetize on social media and we're social and start making it happen, then I want to invite you to the Influencer Masterclass. You are going to learn the exact steps to grow and monetize on social media, and we're going to do it live. The best part is that it's free. So you can register for one of three live spots at bosswave.com forward slash masterclass. That's bosswave.com forward slash masterclass. We're doing it over Thursday, Friday, and Saturday with three different time zone options. So I know there's going to be space for you to join. And with that, let's dive in. So this is not the direction that we were going to actually kick the podcast off on,

but we got talking like the second you walked in the door and you said something really interesting, which our eyes were like, let's sit down and talk about this. You talked about business being a lineup of failures for you. And we're really open about that. Can we start there and talk about what kind of failures you've experienced in business and how that's led you to do what you do now? Oh, of course. First of all, the biggest failure of my life is what led me to discovering the five second rule, which is the basis of my entire media business. It was the first book I put out. I hit rock bottom in 2008. I'm a lot older than you two. I'm like your older, saucier sister. You probably think that I, yes, you better have your seatbelts on.

I'm ready. Here we go. No, I hit rock bottom. My husband's restaurant business was failing and I had been laid off. The recession hit the United States and I found myself at the age of 41 with three kids under the age of 10, unemployed and nearly a million dollars in debt. Wow. We had secured the restaurant business by cashing out our life savings, the kids' college plans. We had taken out a home equity line because hell, that's free money. We had cashed out our credit cards. We had shoved it all in. And the first location had done dynamite and the next two were complete dogs. And when failure hit, because I never dreamt that at 41, I would be facing bankruptcy,

divorce, and a drinking problem. So when failure hit, I faced my issues like a lot of high functioning people do. And that is by screaming at my husband and blaming everything on him and drinking myself into the ground, avoiding my problems and hiding from my friends. That's basically what I did. That does not sound like the Mel Robbins you know. And I knew what to do. And this is the kind of central thesis of the work that I'm putting out into the world and the things that I'm sharing. We all know what we need to do. We don't have a fucking clue how to make ourselves do it. When you're afraid, when you're anxious, when you're beaten down, when you're doubting yourself, when you're jealous, when you're

insecure, those states, whether they're emotional or mental, they drag you down. And so at the age of 41, I would wake up every morning, you two, and I would be pinned to my bed by anxiety. It was like a gravity blanket that was just pinning me down. And I would stare at the ceiling and I would think about my problems and I would think about what a failure I was. And I felt like the world's worst mom. And we lived in this really nice suburb outside of Boston. And so everywhere I looked, I saw people who were successful and people who had nice cars. And I could not pay for groceries. I had to ask my father to pay for our mortgage while we were literally trying to figure out what to do. And that was the moment

that I discovered the five-second rule by mistake, by mistake, you two. So I was a lawyer. I then got into kind of the first dot-com wave. I never intended to become a a lawyer. I then got into kind of the first dot com wave. I never intended to become a motivational speaker. I never thought about writing a book. I had to save my own ass because I realized nobody was going to come and do this for me. And every night I would sit there and I would give myself a pep talk. I don't know if you've ever been in a situation like this in your life where you're like, all right, that's it. Tomorrow morning, I am changing. Tomorrow morning, I'm getting out of bed. Tomorrow morning, I'm going to stop drinking.

I'm not going to be a bitch to my husband. I'm going to look for a job. I'm going to tell my friends the truth about what's going on. I am the new Mel. And then the next morning, I'd wake up and the old, shitty, drunk, angry, bitchy Mel would still be there. And I would continue to feel stuck. And then one night as I

was sitting there giving myself this talk that I got to change, I saw this rocket launch at the end of a commercial. And I thought, that's it. That's the secret. Tomorrow morning when the alarm goes off, instead of lying there and letting that anxiety and fear consume me, I'm going to launch myself out of bed like a rocket. I'm going to move so fast that I'm not going to be in that bed when that anxiety hits. Now, look, I'd had four Bermuda Manhattans that night. So it was probably the alcohol that gave me that idea, because that is the dumbest thing that anybody has ever said in their entire life, right? Well, the next morning, for whatever reason, the alarm goes off. And I remembered the rocket launch and I started counting backwards, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. And I stood up and that was the beginning.

And I used it in secret for three years to 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, push myself to take action, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, put myself in pause and not scream at Chris. And slowly but surely, one decision at a time, my whole life changed. I picked up the phone and networked until I got a job. I not stopped drinking entirely, but could stop after a glass of wine or a Manhattan instead of like drowning myself in it. 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, I was pushing myself forward and exercising and telling the truth and working on my marriage. And then in 2011, somebody asked me if I would be willing to give a talk about career change because I had changed my career so many different times. And it was at a thing I had never heard of called TEDx. And it was one of the first TEDx conferences ever.

So there was no real formal vetting process. And it was the first time I had ever stepped on a stage. Yes, I had been a criminal defense attorney, but it's very different to talk to a jury and a judge than to stand on a stage and stare out into an auditorium with a bunch of people with their arms crossed looking at you. I get out there. The speech is about changing your career, right?

Getting out of your own way. It was not about the five-second rule. In fact, I was not gonna talk about it because telling people you can change your life by counting backwards from five sounds like the stupidest thing you've ever heard in your entire life. I had no idea why it worked. I was just using it in secret. So I start that speech. I basically have a 21 minute long panic attack on stage. If you look closely, you will see the neck rash that grows through the entire TED Talk. And at the very end, I forget how to end it. And I pause and I say, oh, there's this thing I do. I call it the five-second rule. The moment you have an instinct to move,

you got to move within five seconds before your brain kills it. I was so disassociated. You too. I gave out my email address on stage and then left the stage. A year passes. I go on with my life. I say, I'm never giving a speech again. That was the worst thing that ever happened to me. TEDx uploads it. I don't even know it's online. Another year goes by. So now it's 2013. And I'm starting to get messages on Facebook about some speech I gave in San Francisco. And I'm replying like, oh, were you there? That's how this all began. And then I gave speeches in 2013 for free at women's conferences. And then somebody came up to me at the end of the Pennsylvania women's conference and said, Hey, I spoke in the morning and I loved your session.

Can I ask you a question speaker to speaker? And I said, sure. And they said, did you get your check yet? And I said, check, you got paid for that. And she looked at me in horror and said, you didn't? And I was like, no, I didn't even know that normal people got paid to stand. I thought you had to be a celebrity or a bestselling author. I did not know that this was a thing that you could do. And so I made myself a promise and I want you to steal this. This is the first, you got the five second rule already. Here's advice number two. If you don't know how to price yourself, steal this idea. Because I had no idea how to actually charge. And plus, keep in mind, in 2013, we still have liens on our house. We are still in severe debt. We are still barely making the ends meet.

And so I also have major imposter syndrome about what my value would be. And so I promised myself this. The next time somebody calls me and asks me if I will speak, I will count backwards, five, four, three, two, one, and put myself in pause. And then I'm going to say, what's your budget? And then I'm going to like back away from the phone. So I don't say anything. And then when they say it, I'm going to put myself in pause again and go, normally I'm double. Wow. I like that. Can I just say this has to be one of my favorite openings to a podcast we have ever freaking done. Why? Just because like, I have been following you Mel for absolutely years and I just love your authenticity and your willingness to be vulnerable and just put yourself out there

and just say how it is and be like do you know what my business started out of failure I was here I was drinking and there's something powerful that happens when not only you own that but people around you see you owning that because then I think it empowers everybody to feel like oh my god you know what I'm gonna own my shit a little bit more because it elevates you and I just think like just opening straight out the gate it It's being like, you know, there is this perception that people who are successful were very, very intentional about it. And yes, don't get me wrong. I do think some people are very, very intentional about where they got to.

But then there are others that like you're describing, they kind of have just kind of stumbled into it away. Not without talent, not without showing up, not without putting in the work, but it wasn't necessarily, okay, I'm here and I'm aiming for A and I'm aiming for C and I'm going to get there via B. Yours has gone via all these different routes. And I think that's really refreshing to hear because lots of people see this highlight reel, this overnight success, this story of like, I'm just going to put this out there and make it happen. Whereas yours isn't like that. And I just love

your honesty. I don't think anyone's is like that, honestly. I think here's the irony. I constantly am complimented for being authentic and vulnerable. And the fact is, it is so much fucking easier to just be honest like the pretending that we all go through i think that's what creates anxiety is feeling like you got to be somebody that you're not in order to fit in and be accepted and the truth is if you simply are who you are you tell the truth about what you're experiencing first of of all, you're accepting yourself. And secondly, you're creating room for connection at a totally different level because you're not trying to prove anything. You're just being who you are. And so I thank you for that. I feel like I, in the early days, succeeded in spite of myself. I didn't know what I was doing. But the one thing that I have that I have to credit my mom and dad for,

I come from a very long line of farmers and blue collar workers, and I have one hell of a work ethic. I may not be the smartest. I'm definitely not the best looking. I'm not the most talented. I'm not the youngest. I'm not the tech savviest,

but I will fucking outwork anybody if I want it. And that has been the thing that has literally built the foundation. And when you outwork everybody, I mean, hard work definitely beats talent when talent don't work hard, but you're going to make a lot of mistakes. But see, that's where the wisdom is. You don't learn shit when you're winning. You learn the wisdom that you need when you're losing. And I have lost a lot. And so like, there's so many lessons from the business that I built because what ended up happening is the first person that called me is the man who now manages my speaking business and has managed my speaking business since 2013, Darren Powell of Powell Speakers. And he called because his wife, Lori, had seen my thing on

Facebook. And she said, get this woman. And he had been in the speaking business for two decades. And he called me and I used my trick for the first time. This was the first call. And when I said, what's your budget? He said, $10,000. I nearly fell out of my chair. And you're like, double it? Oh, I forgot that one. Are you kidding me? I literally had a heart attack. That was like four months of our mortgage. Holy shit. Like who pays? This is what they pay? And so then I made the next really important decision by dumb luck. If you're worried about imposter syndrome, take all the money that you have and invest it in preparation. So I literally took $7,500 and I worked with a graphic designer to help me put

up a pretty presentation. But in order to create the presentation, it forced me to think through, how am I going to explain this five second thing to people in a way that makes sense? And so that one speech is what skyrocketed me because I got on that stage. And there are moments in your life where you are up to bat. And if you are ready to take the swing in that moment, the trajectory of your life changes. And because of the preparation that I put in, ironically, because I felt so unworthy of $10,000, which now I'm sitting here is a joke because I make a hundred grand to stand on a stage and talk for an hour. And that is in seven years flat. And I say that and own it. And I think it's important for your female listenership to hear that because we have not been taught as women to be proud of the

fucking money we make. And we have been taught that ambition means you're a bitch or ambition means that somehow you're not a nice person or you aren't going to be a great partner or you're not going to be an incredible mom. No, absolutely not. You have value, you have worth, and you should get paid for that shit. I cannot agree more. And there's been so many times in my life where I've dealt with people saying I'm greedy or I'm this I'm that because I've been forthcoming about wanting to earn money and wanting to get paid and speak up for myself I just want to go back to a couple of things that you'd said the work ethic thing I think we relate to so hard we've been in some shitty situations

and the two of us have looked at each other and said you know what we can work our way out of this because we're willing to put in the hours where most people want to go home. We're willing to do that. I think as well, just leaning onto that, it's like the work is a numbers game. How many times can you get back up after failing is what will lead you to success. Well, let me tell you something. You want to know something? So here's the thing. Getting up after you fail, it's in your DNA. Resilience is in your DNA. When you were learning to walk,

you fell an average of 17 times an hour. You didn't lay on the floor in your diapers and look at the ceiling and go, well, that's it, I quit. They said no. You got up over and over and over and over again. So life may tell you no, but if you give up, you're ultimately the one who said no. It's within you to keep going.

And that's the secret. Yeah, I completely agree. And so I want to touch on, you talked about, was it 2013 or 2014 you gave that talk? 2014 I gave that talk. 2014. It's 2021 now. And you are arguably one of the most well-known motivational speakers in the world. You are incredible at what you do and you're really leading the industry

against a lot of people that have been in this industry for decades and decades and decades. What is it about you that has helped you get there in that timeframe? Number one, I focused on the thing that most people don't focus on. And actually two things that most people don't focus on. And actually two things that most speakers don't focus on. I think the vast majority of people that get into the speaking business are in it for the rush and the ego drive of being on stage. That's not why I'm in the business. In fact, that's the part of it that I hate. I mean, I enjoy it, but in terms of the scale of things, that is my least favorite part of it other than being away from my family. If you want to be good at this, you have

to do all the stuff that nobody wants to do. You have to understand deal flow. So the audience doesn't book the speaker. It doesn't matter whether or not you get a standing ovation. You should get a standing ovation. You should get a standing ovation every time if you're good. That's the price of entry in my mind. If you're excellent, you take amazing care of the people behind the scenes that put the event on. You make those people feel like a million dollars. So I just naturally started doing things that, you know, I did because I had hardworking parents. When I landed at 11 o'clock at night, I texted the event planner and the person that booked me to let them know I had gotten there. I was at the hotel. Things

were great. In the morning, I text the event planner and the head person saying, hey, I'm grabbing coffee. I'll be there in 15 minutes. What can I get you? When I come in, I greet all of the tech people who normally the speakers walk by and ignore because I'm the main attraction. My job is to make sure I kill it on that stage and that their experience and putting on this event is stress-free and I am the most delightful aspect of it. Then the other thing that I focused on, so that's it, like all the little stuff that makes the people that who feel invisible want to work with you all the time. Because if they want to work with you, your name is going to spread through the entire place. And every other speaker out there tends to focus on,

is the speech really good? Well, it should be. You're getting paid. That's not what you focus on. And the second thing that I focus on is I have this, you know, I'm in this because I am so driven to make an impact. I have fucked up so much of my life for so long. And I have so many mistakes that I have made, whether it was in dealing with my own anxiety or my kids' anxiety or shit that I did early in my marriage that I regret or who I was during college or law school that I wish I had done differently, that I've done so much work to try to become a better person, to try to become kinder to myself, that if I can save anybody, the heartache and the headache that I put myself through, that's the mission that I'm on, to make an impact in a real person's life. And so when I'm backstage,

I center myself by saying, there is one person in that audience who will either not commit suicide or who will take this tool and help their child who's struggling with anxiety or will take the five-second rule and go to their brother who's got PTSD after doing a tour of duty and they will be able to make a meaningful difference in their life.

And that is the one person I am going out there today and doing this for. And then I have that person in mind and I speak directly to them. And that intention to move someone is what comes through in the way that I behave on a stage. You're able to speak to that person because you've been in such dark situations yourself. Yep. And because the things that I'm sharing, whether it's the five second rule and now the high five habit and all the tools in between are so sticky and easy that they spread like wildfire. And so I am also standing with the hundreds of thousands of people that have written to us. So I can stand on stages

around the world and say with every fiber of my being that counting backwards, five, four, three, two, one will change your life, can save your life. It will interrupt any pattern and believe it and know it's true because I've got 111 people that have written to me and said, I've not committed suicide because I counted backwards. I've lost 111 pounds using this thing. I had an entire wing of psychiatric care nurses show up on my daytime talk show. This was another failure, not this story, but I'll get to that failure in a minute. And say that of all the tools they give people when they are discharged from an inpatient state, the five second rule is the most powerful because everybody can remember it. And tools only work when you use them. Let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite

all-in-one platform, Kajabi. You know, I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity, which I love. Not to mention our team couldn't be happier because now everything is in one place so it makes collecting data, creating pages, collecting payment, all the things so much simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and Kajabi has really helped us do that this year. So of course I needed to share it here with you. It's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business you know. Get rid of the complexity and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible. I definitely recommend Kajabi to all of my clients and students. So if you're listening and haven't

checked out Kajabi yet, now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial. Go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim your 30-day free trial go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim your 30-day free trial that's kajabi.com slash boss babe i think that's the beauty of it it's so simple it's so effective like i literally when i was starting out my entrepreneurial career i listened to know i was a chiropractor and so coming into online space so freaking daunting for me. I literally used to do your five, four, three, two, one. My first Facebook live. Oh my God. I was so like, I was freaking shaking because I've got to do this thing. I was like, five, four, three, two, one, press it. And I just went on. I mean, I was on and off before anyone got on there, but you know, that's the size of the point. I did it. You did it. Well, the genius of it is that,

well, for, you know, is when you start counting, you've actually made, you've already made the first decision. You've moved from hesitating and fear and doubt into action. You've gone from what psychologists call a bias towards thinking

to a bias towards action. And the counting backwards requires you to focus. So instead of getting stuck in autopilot in the interior part of your brain, as soon as you start counting backwards requires you to focus. So instead of getting stuck in autopilot in the interior part of your brain, as soon as you start counting backwards, your prefrontal cortex engages and it starts focusing. So by the time you get to one, you've created this micro moment where you can take control of what you think and do next. And that's why it works. And do you feel a pressure? So you've been really honest about

your journey and your failures and what's led you to be doing what you're doing now. Do you feel a pressure for where you're at now to make it look like life's perfect because you've got these tools and you've been doing it? Oh my God, no. Or are you still able to be really transparent about that? I'm like, the only thing that I don't talk about are things that lawyers won't allow me to or personal issues related to my kids or my husband's personal life. So there is so much that I would love to be talking about related to dating and young women and confidence and this, the culture of dating at this moment and how it's impacting young women,

because I'm seeing it with my daughters, but it would infringe on their privacy. Yeah. And so I'm very conscientious about that. But, you know, in this book, The High Five Habit, I got my daughter's permission to talk about the fact that she's struggling with her weight and her health. I got my daughter's permission to talk about

her imposter syndrome in music school as she is studying to be a singer-songwriter. I got my husband's permission to talk about how failing in the restaurant business sent him down a journey of feeling like a failure as a man because he wasn't providing. And the difference between his point of view about who he was and my point of view as a story that people can relate to so I can explain how your own brain and the filter in your brain either shows you a world that reinforces something negative or shows you a world that reinforces where you want to go based on how you're training it. I sometimes think that authenticity is what's missing from the motivational world because I sometimes feel like some of the motivational speakers, because they are

teaching from where they've been, it makes it seem like everything's perfect now because they've got tools, which is just unrealistic for all of us. And so I really admire anyone that has an audience and has previous talk about stories and coming through them is still willing to say and I'm still going through it and it's something I always try and be conscious with with our business too because I know on the outside what it looks like and in reality it's so different and I always want people to know that yeah and I think that's just I think you're going to touch on it as well you know and what Natalie's point is that you say you've used these tools to get you somewhere and then oh my goodness these tools actually didn't help me through this next part or I had to shift I have to change so

let's talk about your talk show because I think that's like a good you know you know we get to certain heights and sometimes we're like oh I don't want to we expect of ourselves sometimes more than other people expect of us, but we expect everything we touch then turn to gold or to be a success. And it can be really, really hard when that doesn't happen. Oh yeah. And it didn't happen. So I get into the speaking business in 2014, as you so graciously pointed out, I became a sensation, the most book female speaker in the world. Oh, I want to tell one more story because I think it's important for your female entrepreneurial listenership. So I

had such a sense of, I don't belong and I'm not good enough that I underpriced myself and it really hurt my business. And I only found out because the chief HR officer at a publicly traded financial institution pulled me aside after an event. They had hired me for a CEO retreat and it was me and there were two other speakers at the event and they were both men, both multiple New York Times bestselling authors that I deeply admired. And I showed up early at the event that day because I wanted to geek out like a fangirl in the back, which was probably a bad idea because it just gave me more fear about how I was going to do. I mean, these were big fucking

names. Okay. And I'm like in the back year one, they're probably charging 20 grand an hour to give a speech, which at the time still for me still leans on the house. It's like, what? That's like a car. At the end of my speech, I was the closer. The head of HR pulled me aside from this publicly traded financial institution and said, I need to tell you something. We almost didn't hire you. And I said, why? And she said, you came so highly regarded that when we heard what you charged, we didn't think it was true. Wow. And then she said, and this is going to hurt, but I need to tell you, we paid the male speakers in one case three times, and then the other case four times what we paid you. And you were 10 times better. Wow. And I have to thank her because my speaking, you know, agent Darren had been saying,

you need to raise your price. And I'm like, okay, I'm not worth it. And I went back and I said, all right, like double it, at least triple it, do what you need to do because I understand now. And so it's important that you not underprice yourself because of your insecurity, because people won't believe you're actually good. Okay. So on our last episode, I shared with you about our partners, SoulCBD, and how I've been incorporating SoulCBD into my routine for the last several years and how I use it morning and in the afternoon and the evening. I had so many messages about this. And a lot of you are like me, you find it really hard to take supplements and forget them or kind of put them off. And so I thought I'd share a few more ideas about how you can actually incorporate it into your own rituals because Soul CBD has products that you can take at any point throughout the day. Now, the easiest way to take CBD for me is just to take a drop under your tongue. Now, I know that

kind of sounds a little bit weird, but that's actually the key to making it really kick in super, super fast. And I do this, I have it in the morning, which I shared about, but you can also have it on your desk. So if you're feeling a little bit stressed, if you're feeling a little bit anxious, you can grab the salicyl-BD, put a couple of drops under your tongue and instantly start feeling back to normal. My favorite flavor of this is the watermelon and mint drops, by the way. It's also kind of really refreshing and gives you that little pick-me-up. Another way that you can take it is adding it to your morning elixir. So the easiest way to do it is to use some of the fruit-infused water and then add a few CBD drops. So whether you're putting it in your coffee, whether you're having hot water and lemon,

whether you're having a morning smoothie, whatever it is, you can just put a couple of drops in there. And then if you're kind of thinking, hang on a minute, these drops aren't really for me, I would totally recommend the gummies. These are also really good if it's the first time utilizing CBD. So CBD do the best tasting gummies that I ever had. I often, like I said, on the last podcast, I actually take them as a mid-afternoon dessert. They chill me out and they taste really good, but you can also take them at night when you're winding down and they'll also just kind of help set you and get you in the right mindset to go to sleep. So whatever you're doing, just really make sure Solve Your CBD actually create their products so that you can leave them on the

table or you can have them on the kitchen work surface or you can leave them next to your bed. That's how I do it and that's how I really incorporate them into my routine and how I recommend that you do too. So, so if you want to try it too, head to mysoulcbd.com or just use the link in the show notes and you're going to put in boss babe 15. That's going to give you 15% off your order. Now, if you've listened to this and you've already bought Soul CBD before, amazing, you're going to love it and you're going to want to reorder. And that coupon still applies. Okay. So Boss Babe 15 to get 15% off your order, whether you are new or old customer. So a little while ago, I recorded a podcast with Natalie on partnerships and she was asking me the advice that I would give to people looking to partner on social media or podcast platforms, etc. And the advice I gave was, you always have to work with brands that you love and adore. And when you find brands that you love and adore, contact them. It's exactly how, for example, our Source CBD

partnership came about. And that's exactly how our brand new partnership with Lunya came about. Because let me tell you, Lunya is mine and Natalie's favorite sleepwear company. They make the most adorable robes, matching sets, face masks, loungewear, all the things. And they have been our favorite for years. Natalie started wearing them and I fell in love because I was like, Natalie, you're wearing these kind of like jogger pants around the house all the time. And I was like, they're so soft. They're so comfortable. They feel light. They're not too thick. Where did you get them from? And lo and behold, that birthday, she bought me my very own exactly matching pair. I went on like her to purchase so many of their things. I have jump sets. I have

their new washable silkware. I have the face masks, all the things. And they are my go-to favorite product. If I'm looking for something not just comfortable to wear around the house and in bed, but cute and sexy too. That's what I think sets Lanyer really far apart from other brands. Because they have this way around making the comfiest clothes, but they'll also look super cute. And you go to bed feeling sexy as you should. So in true Boss Babe style, we contacted them and we said, we want to work with you more because we are such huge fans of your brand. And here we are today with their debut on the Boss Babe podcast. And we're giving you a special Boss Babe discount code to share the love of learn your products. And this will tell you how much i love

them i my birthday had just passed and i literally said my mom said to me what do you want and i sent her a link to buy me some lanyard clothing so i now have an extra edition of the sleep set i got another brand new jumpsuit so honestly guys you are gonna love it and you absolutely need to check this out so like i said we've got an exclusive boss babe discount for you. We've linked it in the show notes. We've also linked our site so you can have all the things that you need to not only feel comfortable in bed, but super cute too. So definitely go and click that link before this episode finishes. And with that, let's dive back into it. This has come up twice now, you know, about how we value ourselves as females and the conversation around money and i think it's like a subject worth just sitting on because it comes up a lot and you

know natalie and i are both from the uk and as we kind of started off this conversation and i believe it's the same in the u.s like women talking about money is kind of like how do you how would you describe it I mean especially where I'm from you don't do it it's it's kind of like shameful yeah it's kind of like oh that's like so distasteful of her you know and I personally I'm not a man but I don't feel like that exists for men as much I think this is a generational pattern because women traditionally didn't make the money so it wasn't theirs to talk about. Yeah, potentially. And I'm curious, like, do you think that's going to start slowly eroding?

I mean, you know, Nat and I are always on about unapologetically ambitious. And we always say like, hey, yeah, we want to earn money and we're here to earn money. And we care and we want to give back and be in service. And we want to make some dollars. So thank you. Of course. Like, I don't, I mean, this is what I'm saying to my daughters who are 23 and 20. Your life is your responsibility. Yeah. Your dreams are your responsibility. Don't you dare organize your life so that you are

needing a partner to step in and provide for you. If you want something, figure out what it is and go make it happen. And if what you want is to eventually stay home and take care of your family, fabulous, fabulous. Agreed. But also make sure you are an equal partner in everything that is happening financially, because what you're contributing at home is what is allowing your partner to go out into the world. My husband was a stay-at-home dad when the restaurant business failed. I would not be successful if it wasn't for the contribution he made, which was a financial contribution because if he wasn't the one there, I would have had to pay somebody a ton of money, not to mention how it supported me in the business. And so, I don't know, I'm so far

away from that because I so embrace my ambition at this point. And I think it's really important for women to do that because I think it puts you in a very subservient position in your relationship when somebody else is responsible for providing everything financially. What is your advice for women who struggle with that? Stop struggling with it. I like that. who struggle with that? Stop struggling with it. I like that. Count back from five. Stop struggling with it.

Let's go. Yeah, like enough. Yeah, I fully agree with you. So talk to us about the talk show. Okay. So I end up getting approached by Sony Pictures Television to do a talk show. Here's another piece of advice. Say no.

Say no. They reached out, were interested. I said, no. They're like, excuse me? Do you know how many people come in here and beg us for a talk show? I'm like, I know. I don't have, I've always dreamt of hosting a talk show, but no. And they kept coming after me and coming after me. Why? Psychologically, when you can't have something, it becomes more attractive, particularly when you're negotiating with men. Oh yeah, I bet. The male brain is structured very differently than the female brain. And when you say no in business, in dating, in whatever, in a real estate transaction, the chase mechanism and the

testosterone kicks in. I do this with my husband all the time. Yeah. Do it in business. And so ultimately this is what happened. They kept coming back and I was really honest. I said, first of all, I'm going to make less money in the early years. Secondly, it's going to take me off the speaking circuit. Third, I'm going to lose control. And you know, I kept going on and on. They're like, you're right. You're right. You're right. I'm like, fourth, it's not my audience because the audience that's home watching daytime is not online consuming my social media or buying my books. You're right, you're right, you're right. And then somebody said this. They said, the women that are home have been left behind by daytime because daytime is all celebrity talk

or hot topics. Interesting. And there has not been a show that isn't trash conflict that is truly trying to help people with real issues for about a decade. And we think you could be that show. You could be a lifeline for people without the resources that you have. And I said, okay, I'm in because I'm all about making an impact. I mean, I started my career as a public defender at Legal Aid, representing people who could not afford a lawyer. And I have worked a domestic violence hotline as a crisis intervention counselor. Like, I just love helping people. And so it was one of the greatest experiences of my life. It taught me so much about what I was doing wrong. First of all, I'm a horrible CEO. I am horrible at managing process. I am the worst person to manage people.

And I am at my best when I am inserted into a situation where I can react to somebody, coach, I can teach. And it made me realize I need to build an organization that can actually produce me in a way that allows me to do the kind of work I want to do. And I also realized I want to get off the road. I don't want to speak. I don't want to live on airplanes. I want to see my family. And so it was a great learning experience, but we didn't make it to season two. And I got fired. I got fired from my dream job literally 18 months ago. And then the show got abruptly canceled when they found COVID at CBS Broadcast Center. And within three weeks, Houghton Mifflin canceled my book contract and wanted the advance back money that I'd already spent. Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, was this full, the high five habits? Nope. Nope. Um, and I hadn't written the book yet, which in full disclosure,

I had also failed as a writer because I was a year overdue. So they had to write to cancel the contract. Oops. So yeah, like I, and what did I learn? I learned, I didn't want to be writing a book when I said, okay, we'll take a book deal. I learned that I need to slow the fuck down. I am no longer a woman who has leans on her house. I am no longer needing to operate from a place of scarcity. I need to slow down and get very intentional about what I want to be doing. And I think for most of my life, I have had a nervous system

that's been very dysregulated. I've struggled with anxiety since my teens. I took Zoloft for two and a half decades. I had severe postpartum depression. I believe that my nervous system became dysregulated because I was the victim of an older kid molesting me. I woke up to this kid between my legs. And I don't think I've ever not been sort of like on edge or busy. And when I got fired from my dream job and my book contract canceled, and then every single speech started to cancel because it was the early days of the pandemic, I found myself literally fearing that I'd be in a financial freefall again, even though I'd put a lot of money away, even though I'd been really responsible.

But what was really triggering the anxiety was something deeper. And that's where everything that I write about in the high five habit came to the surface. What I realized when I had nowhere to go, no plane to catch, no meeting to run to, when I was waking up every day in a house with three kids in states of distress and grief and panic and upset, when everything seemed to be uncertain, I could not avoid my anxiety. I started to realize, holy shit, I run to Target or Pete's Coffee or make phone calls as a way to avoid having to sit with myself. I have been on the run since I was a little girl. I have been on edge waiting for the next shoe to drop. I have been waking up and the first thought that I have had for as long as I can remember is something's wrong or someone's mad at me. And with nowhere to go

and nothing to distract me, I came face to face with myself in the mirror. And that's where this high five habit began. I can really relate to the nervous system dysregulation. I also had that really badly and I struggled with depression and anxiety and not really understanding why I was constantly feeling this way. And luckily, I went to a process that was like a 10-day process that completely aligned my nervous system. And I remember coming out of it and calling my husband and saying, I've never experienced feeling at peace before. And thankfully, did that when I was like just a few years ago and young and got to see that was another way. Cause I didn't know that was another way at

the time. So you getting to slow down and, and hear that, what, what is the high five habit? And how did you start to bring yourself out of that? And do you feel like you've been able to bring your nervous system into a place? I'm a totally different human being. It feels good to have a chill nervous system. Yeah. It feels really good to be in your body versus seeking validation, approval, love, and self-worth outside of yourself. And likes follows acceptance from other people. And so the high five habit began, you know, one morning I walked into my bathroom. I started brushing my teeth. I'm standing there in front of the bathroom sink in my underwear. I look in the mirror and I'm like, ugh, ugh, God. I start to notice that my

jowls look like saddlebags on a horse going down the trail in a Grand Canyon. I only found out what jowls meant. Oh, they're right here. And I'm looking at my lines and the gray hair is coming in and I got the stripes on my neck and one of my boobs is hanging down lower than the other one. And as soon as I'm critiquing my appearance, then my mind drifts to, oh my God, I forgot to text that person back. And I didn't finish that report that I needed to do. And my first, oh my God, my first Zoom call is in nine minutes. And oh shit, there's the dog on the floor. I need to walk the dog. And my mind is taking me

down. And in that moment, and I know we can all relate to this, I felt overwhelmed by my life. And I don't know what came over me because this is the corniest damn thing ever. I looked in the mirror. I could not think of a single thing to say to myself. And so I just raised my hand and I high fived my reflection. And that was it. And I just felt this weight drop. I felt like, oh, okay, I can handle today. Do you know, I'm just kind of processing everything you're saying and just listening to the conversations. And for me, that high five and just hearing how you're utilizing it is like being in that present.

Like I'm just acknowledging myself in this present moment because I was listening to your story about scarcity of finances, which I actually really relate to. But also, do you know what my biggest scarcity around? Time. Yeah. I have such an anxiousness around the scarcity and the passing of time. I'm like freaking hell,

I'm late for life right now. I'm late for everything. You know? You mean like in an existential way, like you're going to die and not get everything done or like, holy shit, I got less than 24 hours and I'm not even where I need to be kind of thing.

Like you want everything done yesterday. Yeah. And it's really annoying. It creates a lot of anxiety. And you're doing it to yourself. Yeah, exactly. And I think I'm going to have to book in Hoffman now. Yeah, Hoffman.

Oh, the Hoffman method. That's the thing that changed my life. Well, I'll tell you what changed my nervous system is a guided MDMA therapy session. We'll do that on a whole other episode. We'll do another podcast on that. But you realized your situation with time through plant medicine. No, I did.

That's true. I did plant medicine. All it did for me was unearth shit and I had to go to Hoffman to figure it all out. But I think there's like this, for me, I'm just going to speak for myself, is that I feel like I have a real challenge in living in the moment and the present. And I keep trying to find ways to anchor myself. And I'm curious as to if that high five is like, do you know what? This is an anchor to me in this moment, who I am. I do not have to be

in my mind, giving myself a pep talk. I'm just acknowledging me and my body, me and my reflection. This is me. Let's go. Do you want me to hit you with the science? Go on, Max. Do you have like hours? It is unbelievable. So I start high-fiving myself and let's just first unpack a high-five. So when you think about when somebody else has given you a high five or you've given someone else a high five, what does that gesture communicate? We did a good job. Yeah, good job. What else? High vibration, like, yeah, let's go. Acknowledgement, openness, positivity, gratitude. Yeah. If somebody's attitude's going down or they're slowing down in a race, a high five is a transfer of energy. You got this. Yes. Yes. Yes. So first

things first, that moment. What I've realized is I've spent probably the last 40 years either criticizing the woman I see in the mirror or ignoring her. So when I started high-fiving myself and I stacked it with the habit of brushing my teeth, so when I put my toothbrush down, this is the moment that I take. Research that is recent out of Harvard has proven that one minute of intentionality in the morning where you intentionally align yourself with who you want to be and how you're going to show up today. Changes your level of productivity. It changes how you show up as a leader. It changes the level of impact that you have. So this moment is not just some cheesy ass gesture. This is a habit that is an intentional moment for you. So that's number one. Number two, this is the cool fucking

thing. You cannot raise your hand and high five yourself and think I'm an asshole. You can't do it. And I'm going to tell you the science why. You have a lifetime positive association with the gesture of high-fiving other people. All of the stuff you two just said, belief, energy, celebration, empowerment, support, you've got this, I believe in you. All of that is stored right here in your brain. The second you raise your hand to your own reflection, that part of the brain takes over. This is a field of study called neurobics. I did not make that word up. That is neuroscience plus aerobic activity. You accelerate new neural pathway development when you marry new thought patterns with unexpected physical motion.

It is proven. So when you raise your hand and highfive your own reflection, it silences decades of negative self-talk. It silences you going on autopilot and thinking about your day. And it marries and fuses all of that positive association that you have by giving everybody else high-fives and cheering everybody else with your own reflection. It's unbelievable. That's just the beginning. When you look at what the most motivational forces on the planet, so they did the study with NBA teams, right? And they looked at who was in the championships at the end of the season and who was like, just completely dogging it at the end, you know, like completely bottom of the league. You could trace back who was going to be in the championships in the NBA by the number of high five fist bumps and backpacks that teams gave each other during the preseason. Wow. Because that sort of high five fist bump is a trust builder and a partnership. And when you start doing it with yourself, instead of criticizing or ignoring yourself, you build trust and partnership with yourself. And that is so important because we talk about self-love. We talk about self-confidence. We

talk about self-worth. And the only way you're going to do that is when you build it with yourself. The relationship you have with that person that stares back at you in the mirror, it's the most important relationship you have in life. The relationship that you have with yourself is the foundation of every other relationship that you have. And so in addition to the NBA, they also studied kids. So they divided kids into three groups in this one research study. And they wanted to know if we gave kids a challenging problem, right? What is the best way to keep them motivated? The first group got praised for a fixed trait, like, you know, oh, you're really smart. You can do this. Didn't work so well. The next

group gets the growth mindset. Oh, you're working really hard. You got great perseverance. Keep going. That works a little bit better. The third group in the study, they simply got a high five, not a single word, a high five. No. Wow. The group that got a high five, not a single word, a high five. No. Wow. The group that got a high five, absolutely five, six, seven fold outperformed the other kids, kept going through greater challenges. Why? Because a high five is more than praise. A high five fulfills your deepest, most fundamental needs as a human being, to be seen,

to be heard, and to be celebrated. What's going viral right now? We're getting close to the school season starting in the U.S. All these teachers standing outside of their classrooms doing what? Giving each kid an individual handshake. Why is that going viral? Because we recognize in that, oh my God, they're celebrating each one of those kids individually. Yeah. They're all feeling seen. Yes. And I'm telling you, when you do this as a habit, you are learning how to fulfill your most fundamental need of being seen, heard, and celebrated. Now, here's the big thing. The big thing is going to come tomorrow morning when you stand in front of that mirror in your underwear and you don't want

to do it. The resistance to celebrating yourself is so fucking sad. And for a lot of women, what they've been writing to us as we've been informally, you know, kind of studying our audience is that I don't deserve to get a high five because I haven't done anything. Wow. And this is where the real transformational stuff comes to play. So if you're withholding empowerment, support, and celebration for yourself because you're not the right size or the number on the scale or the size of your pants or the bank account isn't where you think it's going to be, how is withholding support and celebration helping you? You see, most of us stand in front of that mirror and we criticize ourselves.

That's not motivating. Tough love doesn't fucking work. The research proves it. What you need in order to feel the resilience and the courage to take actions that change your life is you need to feel supported and empowered in doing it. So I'm here telling you, if you want to get healthier, if you want to start a business, if you want to break through self-doubt, you must start encouraging, empowering, and cheering yourself there as you are. Yeah,

I know you're not the weight you want to be. So fucking what? You still deserve a high five because you got your ass out of bed and you're standing in front of the mirror. And by high-fiving yourself, you're going to feel seen, heard, and empowered, and you're going to feel a little bit more motivated to do the things that you currently tell yourself you don't have the energy to do. And so when you start to cheer yourself forward, it has this little momentum effect in your life because you're not changing because you're withholding what you need right now in terms of support. You're basically saying, well, I'll celebrate myself when I lose the weight. I'll celebrate myself when I get the job. I'll celebrate myself when I fall in love. I'll celebrate myself when I find the place to live.

Bullshit. I can relate. Here's the thing about ambition that is difficult. It's really easy. And this is the other trap that I fell into. I started equating achievement with love. If I'm achieving, I'm worthy of love. And if I'm not, then I don't deserve to be loved. And that sets you up to be supremely jealous because you start to think if other people have the things that you've always wanted, it means you're never going to get it, which means you're not lovable, which makes you hate other people. And then the other thing that ends up happening is that your self-worth goes in the tank because you are constantly, this is why I'm so busy. I wasn't busy because I was ambitious. I was busy because I thought I needed to be achieving shit to be lovable. Big difference. Big difference. And what the high five habit has taught me is no,

you are worthy of love simply because you woke up and you're still breathing. End of story. And when you start giving yourself that fundamental need to be loved and empowered and to be seen and to be heard exactly where you are. It doesn't change the shit that's happened to you. Look, you know, you might be standing in front of the mirror and all you see is somebody that is damaged, that is abused, that's traumatized. Maybe like me, you have so many regrets over the things that you've done in your life. So you've got all this over the things that you've done in your life. So you've got all this evidence stacked up that you've been looking at for a long time. I am telling you, when you start empowering, celebrating, and cheering for yourself using the tools in this book, it doesn't change that shit.

It changes something more important. It changes you. And that empowers you to be able to move forward in your life in a different way, standing on the support and the empowerment and the love that you are now giving to yourself because you survived that shit. Yeah. It's so powerful. And also, when I'm listening to you, it's also like not just yourself, but then the ripple effect. And I always talk about the positive ripple effect of what we do in a business. But that's self-love and then how you're able to give it on to others.

And then that then ripples across your family, across your work colleagues, across people that you come in contact with on the daily. Yeah. And, you know, you inspire and reach so many women and so many women say, I'm last on my list. I'm so busy taking care of everybody else. I never have time for myself. And building on what you just said, these habits in this book, you know, the high five in the mirror is just the Trojan horse. I mean, there's tools about looking for hearts, which changes the live filter in your brain and teaches you that you can actually teach your brain to see the world differently. There's the hands, the high five to the heart, which is a tool you can use to tone your vagus nerve and regulate your

nervous system. Because some of the other research that I've learned talking to some of the leading neuroscientists is if your nervous system is on edge, it's nearly impossible for your prefrontal cortex to engage. It's impossible to learn something new. It's impossible to think clearly. You must first calm your nervous system and get back in your body before you can truly harness your power and make decisions that are aligned with your values and with what you want. If you don't do that, you're going to constantly be trapped in that loop that's been triggered by your past. And so one of the things that I think is super important for women in particular is that the way you learn how to put yourself first is by treating yourself the way

that you treat everybody else, because that's how they got to be first in your life in the first place. We're all amazing at cheering for our favorite sports teams and following our favorite musicians and buying everybody's stuff and planning birthday parties and taking on extra work and making sure mom and dad are okay. We have no idea how to do that for ourselves. And we end up feeling resentful because we're busy giving and then nobody's giving back. I'm here to tell you, you can create little habits that actually fulfill those needs for yourself. Not only empowers you to your point, when you leave the bathroom with the wind at your back, feeling acknowledged and something like, bring it on today. I today. I fucking got this. You know, there's a woman in this book who wrote to us who

is in a domestic violence shelter, childhood trauma, super abusive relationship, very, very violent. She's lost everything. And she said, simply high-fiving herself, doing this thing I call the high-five challenge, which is just wake up five mornings in a row, suspend your resignation, push aside the resistance, and start your day by high-fiving your reflection in the mirror and see what happens. And she said, I have nothing. But what this has taught me is that at least I still have myself. I have my own back. And that means I have the ability to face this and to build something new. Wow. I love that so much. Mel, I feel like I could keep talking to you for hours and hours. Where can everyone grab a copy of this book because they're going to need

one? It's everywhere. It's being released in 18 languages and counting. And the thing that's also super cool is I like tools that anybody can use. So you kind of got the gist of one of the tools. You can start using that for free. But just Google the High Five Habit. You can join the High Five Challenge, which I know you're going to have links to. It's free. In the show notes. Yeah. It's 5 million people waking up five days in a row with a high five in the mirror, all powered by an app called Growth Day. It's all free to do the challenge and you'll be supported and celebrated as you try this out for five days with the rest

of the world. And I just thank you. As you can tell, I'm so passionate about this because these simple tools work. Yeah. Yeah. We're so grateful that you're sharing this with us. This has been incredible. Yeah. So if you're listening, the links in the show note to join the challenge, we love growth

day. So I love that it's going to be on there and it's at Mel Robbins everywhere on social. Yep. Everywhere on social. Amazing. Thank you so much. Thank you. If you enjoyed this episode episode we would love it if you subscribed and left us a review let us know what you enjoyed what your main takeaways were and who you'd like

to see appear on the show as a special thanks we'll send you a copy of our boss babe 25 now this is an awesome resource it's the 25 essential things that you need for personal and professional growth. We've included everything from must-have products to books to rituals. This guide literally covers it all and I know you're going to love it. So if you want your copy, simply leave us a review and then send a screenshot of your review to podcast at bossbabe.com.