the bossbabe podcast - 235. How To Avoid Burnout

Episode Date: July 26, 2022

We know the feeling. Sometimes there’s just so much work to do, you feel like you have to go, go, go until it’s all finished – only then, can you feel better about yourself or your progress. The trouble is, there is no end. It’s a dangerous cycle that’s easy to fall into for any entrepreneur. In today’s episode, Danielle is joined by accomplished businesswoman and podcaster, Lori Harder, to talk about what burnout is, how you can avoid it + the simple things you can do (starting now!) to take better care of yourself. Listen now! Highlights: Ask yourself these questions if you think you might be approaching burnout. The key difference between resting + recharging. Why saying NO to some things means saying YES to others. Links: Subscribe to Lori’s podcast — Earn Your Happy Follow: bossbabe: @bossbabe.inc Danielle Canty: @daniellecanty Natalie Ellis: @iamnatalie

the definition of insanity is to keep doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result so if you are listening to this finding yourself in a situation that you're like oh my goodness i can't see the end of this this just keeps going on and on and nothing's changing or you're like well hang on a minute i've been close to burnout i've burned out several several times and this really is that invitation to be like, right, what do I need to do myself? The tendency is to look around you and maybe blame other people and become frustrated with other people. Whereas the actual accountability can stop with you. It's how are you letting people treat you? How are you taking responsibility for what you're doing and what you're saying yes to

and what you're saying no to? And how are you really making choices that are working with the way that your brain works and working with the things that you are good at versus doing the same old thing and complaining about it? A boss babe is unapologetically ambitious and paves the way for herself and other women to rise, keep going and fighting on. She is on a mission to be her best self in all areas. It's just believing in yourself. Confidently stepping outside her comfort zone to create her own version of success. Welcome to the Boss Babe podcast, the place where we share with you the real behind the scenes of building successful businesses, achieving peak performance and learning how to balance it all. I'm Danielle Canty, president and co-founder of Boss Babe

and your host. Well, actually one of your co-hosts for today's episode because I'm joined by Laurie Harder, who's also the founder and host of Earn Your Happy podcast. So we did a joint one today, which I know you guys are going to absolutely love. And we're talking all about burnout. We're sharing our personal journeys, what we feel like is the definition of burnout and how we've overcome it. You're going to hear some real and raw thoughts on all things burnout. And we really hope you will share with us how you relate into them. So share them with myself at Danielle Canty and also share them

with at Lori Harder, which is L-O-R-I-H-A-R-D-E-R. We hope you enjoy this episode. Okay, so this is a very special podcast because you're either listening at Boss Babe or you're listening to Earn Your Happy because Lori and I are recording this together at her house in Wisconsin. Did I say that right? Wisconsin. Give it a try. Wisconsin. Wisconsin.

Okay, I'm going to use the American accent to get it right. She had her first cheese curds. I had my first cheese curds. I didn't learn to wakeboard in the end because I hurt my knee, but I had a great time on the lake. She was on the boat. It was good fun. So we're here today and we wanted to record this podcast because both of us came together for like a very special mastermind weekend. And truth be

told, I literally rang Lori two days before she was coming. I was like, I can't come. I'm too busy. I have too much on. I'm overwhelmed. I'm just feeling really exhausted. I think I need to stay at home. And she very kindly and politely persuaded me that it was not going to be beneficial for me to stay at home on my own. And I should come to recharge and rest because I was sounding like I was burning out. And so we went into this podcast today and have a really real conversation about what is burnout and what does that actually look like? So Lori, I'd love to hear your description of burnout because I know that you've been kind of feeling similar to me too.

Well, first I wanted to say just when you had called or when you were like, can you get on the phone? And I was like, okay, this is real. What are we talking about? So we get on the phone and she was explaining to me all of the reasons why she can't come. And everything that she was saying, I was like, oh my God, this is exactly how I sabotage myself when I'm starting to burnout. Because burnout can feel like you are uninspired. You're not feeling productive. You're feeling really overwhelmed. You're feeling like you need to just dive in

even deeper into your work. You must have something that you could do more of in order to feel better. I just feel like I totally observed myself in those moments where I think that if I do more, then I'm going to feel better. Except if you're doing a ton of work, which I knew that you are literally doing a ton of work right now, you're thinking that more work is going to be the answer. It typically isn't. So that's when I was like, oh my God, I do this to myself all the time. You have to come and actually do something different and recharge so that maybe you can see things more clearly. When you're feeling burnt out, when you're feeling exhausted, when you're feeling uninspired, when you're feeling exhausted, when you're feeling uninspired,

when you're feeling overwhelmed, you're not coming from a place where you're going to get the answers that are going to push you through that, that are going to make your life easier. So for me, when I feel burnt out, it really does come in the form of feeling uninspired, not productive.

I feel like I can't have the same conversation again. I get really frustrated with people in my life. I start to place blame when maybe it's not them at all. It's me allowing certain things or me being not clear with certain expectations or me showing up and taking things on that I don't want to do, but I'm not really sharing how I feel. Burnout can come in all of these forms, but for me, it's mostly exhaustion, overwhelm, and frustration. I think that's so key just to recognize, like you said, it comes in so many forms. And just listening to that list, I also know so many people listening to us like, yep, yep, either ticking that box right now, or they've been there and done that at a certain point. The way I also have

realized what happens during burnout is I'm like on the ground and I'm so on the ground. I can't see what trees I'm cutting through. Does that make sense? So let's say if you had like a, you were in a forest, like the best way to make sure that you cut the correct path is to kind of climb a tree, look above the canopy, see where you need to go and then come back down and actually take that action. And I feel like sometimes with burnout, you get so used to being on the ground. You're just like cutting for cutting sake, like must keep going, must keep going, where actually there's so much power in that pause that actually allows you to be like,

okay, right, let me climb to the top of the tree. Before we really start digesting the things that you and I, Laurie, are doing around burnout, let's also talk about the two reasons why you get some of the symptoms of burnout. Because I really feel like I get burned out when I'm either not resting at all. And like you say, I'm too busy. I've got too much work to do. I can't possibly get away. I can't possibly do anything else. And so I'm not sleeping as well. I'm not really resting at all. I'm just going from task to task to task and just executing so, so much. And the other reason I think that a lot of people can near burnout or eventually get burnout is when they're doing things that don't actually suit their brains you know we all have left and right side of the brains and some of us are more creative and artsy

than we are mathematical or analytical and I think sometimes if you end up in a space where you are consistently trying to do a thing that you are not actually that good at and doesn't actually work with your brain that can be so much more exhausting than actually staying in your, not zone of genius, because I think it's really great to have like an array of things that you learn to be good at. But if you are literally climbing uphill to try and be good at something you are not actually naturally good at and your brain doesn't work in that place, I think that's also a shortcut to burn out too. I so just like resonate with that because right now in that place, I think that's also a shortcut to burn out too. I so just resonate with that because right now in my business, I have to be a little bit in the tactical. There are some times in your business where you don't have the option

necessarily to hire someone. Or maybe it's a brief period in your business where you really do have to deal with these things that you do not want to be doing that are not in your zone of genius. So I'm observing that when I'm in those because I'm in a bit of the tactical right now that is just a momentary thing. And with that, I know that it's going to challenge me. I know that I'm going to feel like my attention span is super limited. I know I'm going to feel annoyed and frustrated.

So during these times, I'm trying to integrate more actual recharging. And I know we're going to get into that in order to allow myself the space to be like, okay, this is temporary. I think that's important too, to really know when there are certain times in your business when you do have to be in things that you don't love, but also how quick can you get out of them? And how can you take care of yourself during those times? Yeah, I think that's really powerful, actually, that responsibility of taking care of yourself, because I think that's what my realization was in actually making the decision to come here and take, I mean, essentially six days. Yes, we're still talking

about business, but there's travel time, all these pieces, but it was actually like an act of taking care of myself because it was changing the rhythm of, I was in a rhythm of something that didn't actually suit and support me and I needed to change that rhythm. That's like so much self-care. Like that's my choice to go. That's a very selfish decision to go and there's so many things to do. But actually in that act of self-care, I actually propelled more things forward than I even anticipated, which I think is really, really powerful. And I love that because you got out of your situation so that you could look in on what was actually happening. And I feel like whenever I'm inside of something and I'm just like, no, I'm not getting the answer, but I must need to do more of what I'm doing. And whenever I start hearing myself say things like that, I'm like,

oh, I need to get out of this energy so that I can get the answer or someone can give it to me. What was so cool to watch is these moments where you were having conversations with different people on this trip where you're like, oh my God, did that answer really just come while I'm sitting on the front of a boat during a conversation while I'm enjoying myself? And it's because you're open. It's because you're not looking at it the same way. You're at a totally different angle. You're seeing a completely different perspective. And I know on our walk this morning, we were saying, it's never usually a what. It's not a what should I do more of? What should I do now? It's always a who. It's like, who has my answer? Who could help me? And who has been here before who could maybe give

me some advice? If you're not surrounding yourself with people and a community that you can get you, who understand what you're going through, that you can have conversations with, whether that's a community of like-minded people or a coach or a mentor or just anyone. I just think it's really, really key to have those surroundings. And yeah, just like you were saying, like, I think that key thing was like, I was on the ground and I climbed the top of the trees, looked to the canopy and was then like, okay, what is my next decision to move forwards? And then also I just did a post on my Instagram this morning which was very much around the reflection that the definition of insanity is to keep doing the same thing over

and over again and expecting a different result. Let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite all-in-one platform Kajabi. You know I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity which I love. Not to mention our team couldn't be happier because now everything is in one place so it makes collecting data, creating pages, collecting payment, all the things so much simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and Kajabi has really helped us do that this year. So of course I needed to share it here with you. It's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business, you know, get rid of the complexity

and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible. I definitely recommend Kajabi to all of my clients and students. So if you're listening and haven't checked out Kajabi yet, now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim your 30-day free trial that's kajabi.com slash boss babe so if you are listening to this finding yourself in a situation that you're like oh my goodness I can't see the end of this this just keeps going on and on and nothing's changing or you're like well hang on a minute I've been close to burnout or I've burned out several, several times. And this really is that invitation to be like, right, what do I need to do myself? The tendency is to

look around you and maybe blame other people and become frustrated with other people. Whereas the actual accountability can stop with you. It's how are you letting people treat you? How are you taking responsibility for what you're doing and what you're saying yes to and what you're saying no to? And how are you really making choices that are working with the way that your brain works and working with the things that you are good at versus doing the same old thing and complaining about it? So we're going to talk about the differences between actual resting and recharging. Because I think that for most people, they think the solution for burnout is to take a break. I know for me that sometimes when people are like, you just need to stay home and relax,

put your feet up, take a break, watch a movie. I work from home. So the thought of actually just staying at home to rest sometimes is really nice. But other times I'm like, man, I know I'm not going to rest at home. I'm probably going to go find some projects. I'm probably going to look at my laptop. It's going to stare at me from the opposite side of the room. I'm going to be tempted to pick it up. I'm going to feel bad because I'm like, what am I actually doing here? I'm going to want to feel like I'm making progress. And for me, there's a huge differentiator between resting and recharging. Because when I'm burnt out, I can be... Danielle, I sleep like a boss. I can literally be still sleeping

eight to nine hours a night and feel burnt out. And this is where sometimes I'm like, oh God, what is wrong with me? I don't know if you've ever asked that. I'm like, is there something wrong with me? Is it something I'm eating? Is it something I'm doing that I need more rest? Do I need more sleep? And truly, that's another sign for me when I know that I am burnt out and I need to recharge. So what does recharging actually mean? Recharging for me is looking at these buckets of my life that aren't filled that actually bring the most fulfillment. So in one of my recharge buckets is really connecting with soul-filling friends. Do I

feel recharged because that connection and that encounter and that conversation really, truly filled me up and gave me life and gave me answers. Another one is play. Am I playing? Am I being active? Am I going wake surfing? Am I feeling like I'm progressing in the physical things that I love like skiing, snowboarding, surfing? Am I doing anything that's artsy? Those are all things that really, really feel my soul and make me feel less resentful about work. Because honestly, I'm also working to be able to do those things. So if I don't get to do them, it makes me feel burnt out on my work, even though my work also feels very purposeful. It's remembering that recharging is really about making sure that all of your buckets that

fill you up are getting filled. It's funny because this morning, I had a call about something that I'm doing creatively where I really had thought to myself like, wow, I should be taking time this weekend to sit for a few hours on Saturday, a few hours on Sunday to get these creative ideas together for this call that I had on Monday. And instead, I recharged with girlfriends and we had great conversations. And I was out on the lake and I wake surfed and had the best time ever so that literally on Monday, I went to go prepare for this call. I gave myself an hour, which I was like, oh my God, you're being so irresponsible. This is not enough time. I had more ideas in 30 minutes than I know I would have had all weekend long. And when I got on the call with this woman, she was like, you're on it. You're creative. You're flowing. I'm like,

this was such a good reminder that if I would have just rested or even took all that time to really dive in and think that I'm doing all of these things that are going to really give me progress on this thing that I'm creating. It was that moment that I was like, that's right. I mean, it just keeps showing up in my life that when I go and make sure that these other buckets are not being neglected, that I move faster. I love that because I think sometimes there's two types of productivity. There's like the execution side, but actually the creative side. And sometimes you move quicker by getting creative about how you get there. Like I feel like sometimes the execution, like when you're in it, you're like, okay, I need to get from A to B by going A, B, C, D, E. And like, okay, I have to go through every step. Whereas I sometimes think when you're creative and in flow, you're like, oh, I don't need to go from A to Z this way. I can just jump

from A, then I could jump to F, then I could jump to N. There's these different ways of thinking. Whereas when you are free and when you've been playing and when you're rejuvenated, you can create and then you can connect dots that you didn't even see before. One of the things I think has really helped me avoid burnout and I think definitely came close this time and I really had to speak to myself about that reminder of when you are saying no, you're actually saying yes and when you're saying yes, you're actually saying no to something else and the yes and no's always come in pairs And I hear a lot of people who get burnout, it's because they're like, oh, I feel bad

saying no. So they say yes, yes, yes, which comes down to a feeling of often scarcity that they have to take every single opportunity out there because there's not enough opportunities. So they're saying yes, or it's because they feel bad saying no. They have a story that no is a negative word when in fact, really no is just a no. There's no polarity to it. It's just a no, I'm not going to do that. Okay, cool. But it's like, oh my God, no, I'm so sorry. I'm not going to do that. But they trick themselves because when you are saying yes to something, you're automatically saying no to something else because we don't have an infinite amount of time. We only have 24 hours a day. And so if you're saying yes over here, you're actually saying no to another opportunity coming in. You're saying no to you or your team's

attention being on something else that could actually propel that thing further forwards. And I think it's just that realization that you can't be afraid of saying no, because whether you like it a lot, you are saying no as a byproduct to when you say yes. For me, this weekend was about, okay, if I'm saying no, I'm not coming. I'm saying yes to sitting at home and trying to slog these things out versus okay if I'm saying yes to going away I'm saying no to actually being alone and slogging these things out so it's like there was always a yes and no whichever way I cut the cloth right and I think that's the realization that a lot of people get to go through is that being intentional about where they're utilizing their yeses so that they can then be intentional about where they're utilizing their

nos. I love that. And I'll just share an example of that in my life and kind of how we also questioned everything around what we were saying yes and no to. And honestly, you're in the manifestation right now of that, Danielle, of saying yes to something that we were saying yes and no to. And honestly, you're in the manifestation right now of that, Danielle, of saying yes to something that we were really nervous about saying yes to. So my husband and I have grown up in the Midwest area and we had always had this dream of being on the lake in the summer and really inviting back people who are important to us and making this a little haven for people and for us so that we can really get back to our roots and do things that recharge us, right? Not just taking breaks, but truly, truly feed our soul and that vision for our life.

Before we bought this house, we were like, okay, well, maybe we shouldn't do it. We had so many more reasons why we shouldn't because it was like, all right, well, maybe we shouldn't do it. We had so many more reasons why we shouldn't because it was like, all right, well, we're splitting time between Arizona and LA and we both have new startups and we want to make sure that we're in the energy of California and LA and around all of those people. If we go and do this lake thing, we're kind of disrupting that energy in all of these contexts that we're making in the life that we're making there. And we felt like we were taking ourselves out of the scene and building for a while. And we were like, but we know that this home is going to recharge us and bring these ideas. So we were like, what if we rethought how we're looking at it? What if we get to have these

summers in this lake house, but we invite the people to us? What if we make it exactly how we want it and we get to say yes to all of it and have people come to us and we keep those contacts up and maybe it even deepens those connections and those contacts, which is so crazy because that is exactly what has happened. We have just about every weekend filled with people who we have been wanting to connect with, most from LA area, which is so funny because we live there, but we haven't had time to connect there. So really looking at when you think that you have to say no to something, even if you want it to question the way that you are looking at what

you have to say yes and no to just saying, is there a way to have both or truly not? What does Warren Buffett say? He says that successful people say no to almost everything. And that truly is something that Chris and I are both looking at as well. Like, what are the top five priorities in our life that we want? And what do we have to say no to in order to do that? And what's like a really funny thing about that is when you actually say no vocally more, you're up welcoming so many more opportunities that then come in because you guys were like okay we're gonna say no to working every single weekend in the summer and now it created that time for more yeses around people coming to visit and more opportunities like we've even been discussing more business opportunities being together

and how much more abundance that has been made available during that time so I know some people might be listening to this being like oh well it's all right for them or it's like okay if you if you're in a certain position but I really want you to catch yourself when that springs to mind because your thoughts and your feelings create your actions. And if you think like that, that will be a self-fulfilling prophecy. And if you can't own, like this is a little bit of tough love, but if you can't own where you can change for the better, it's going to be really, really difficult for you to change your situations. So like I've had to take a lot of responsibility over the last several weeks. Like this weekend was about me taking responsibility for why I'm close to burnout.

And in this situation, like if I'm just going to point the finger at everyone else, I actually give away the power to make that change. So just encouraging any of you who are feeling like, oh my goodness, like I can't possibly do that. You can, because if you say you can't possibly do it, you won't be able to do it. Whereas if you're like, I can do that. Now I just get to figure out how I can do that. You just give yourself so much more power and freedom to create that change. So I think that's a really important thing about burnout is that you get to invest in yourself and you get to look after yourself and you get to do the self-care, create the time, recharge, do all of these things, learn how to delegate, understand what

things maybe you do do. And in fact, in the walk, you remember you were just talking about the five things that are most important to you, but you actually made a list of 15 and crossed out 10. And so like really making sure you understand the priorities that you have in your life, what is important and be willing to cross ones that are less important out. I love this. And there's a few questions that you guys can ask yourself if you're wondering, if you're feeling burnt out. I think the top is, are you feeling irritable and impatient? Are you lacking energy? Are you lacking satisfaction from your achievements? So what normally you might get satisfaction from... I can see it a lot in even my girlfriends who are achievers. They've got a podcast, they've got a book, they're doing

all the things, but they're not getting the same satisfaction. And it might be because one of those recharging buckets is not being filled. Are your sleeping habits changed? Are you using more food or alcohol or things like that? I can definitely recognize in myself when I'm leaning a little bit more onto different crutches where I'm like, hmm, I'm eating excessive amounts of chocolate this week. Maybe I should go wakeboarding. I don't know. Maybe I should call a friend. Although excessive amounts of chocolate is not, I kind of dig it. So it's fine. I love that. It's so true. But it's just like having this self-awareness. So our hope was that doing this podcast was just like one, normalizing it and having this conversation because burnout is something that lots of people

either suffer from or become very close to, but you don't actually have to accept it. And there's so many things that you can do to support yourself. So just like Laurie was saying that recharge versus that rest and really understanding what that means for you if you're answering yes to a lot of those questions and I think the other key thing is just making sure you surround yourself with people who know how to elevate you and bring back that energy too and you get to have fun with and play with and just really explore other elements of your personality versus just being like oh must work must grind must do this thing which I think a lot of us can get really, really caught into and be open to all the opportunities that come when you actually play and have fun,

particularly in the summer. All right, you guys, Danielle, any last thoughts? No, but this is really fun. I'm glad we got to open up on the side that I feel like not many people really talk about. And that's my favorite thing about the podcast, like getting way deeper than social media. So if you're not already listening to the Boss Babe podcast or, and you're happy, you need to subscribe to both for sure. We're so grateful for you, you guys, we would love to hear what your thoughts are, what your takeaways were. So give us both a tag, let us know, because I really want to know if you are noticing the difference between resting or recharging, if there's something that you're going to do to recharge and if you notice a difference.

So we're so grateful for you. And until next time, we will see you next week. Bye, everyone. Thank you so much for listening. And if you enjoyed this episode on the Boss Babe podcast, I'd absolutely love it if you leave us a review. As a thank you, we'll send you our side hustle success kit, your simple no BS guide to keeping track of everything that you need to do to start and grow your business. To access this freebie, all you need to do is leave us a review, then share a screenshot of your review with contact at bossbabe.com and we'll send this must-have kit straight to your inbox. you