the bossbabe podcast - 334. The Operating System of a Product Based Business, Balancing Life with Business Growth + How to Get Those Early Customers with Danielle + Kayleigh from Clearstem Skincare

Episode Date: November 7, 2023

If you have a growing product- based business, or are wanting to know how to start an online product store, tune in to hear BTS of the skincare brand that’s going viral. We’re getting an in-depth look at the strategies it takes to build a successful business AND what it actually looks like to run a fast growing company as you scale. In this episode, Danielle + Kayleigh, co-founders of CLEARSTEM Skincare share everything with me from the operating systems they use to run their product- based business to the best marketing advice they received in the beginning of their business. Something CLEARSTEM Skincare embraced early on was connecting with their customers and they’re sharing how they took their company from selling their flagship serum in one clinic, to building a full product line and selling internationally. HIGHLIGHTS What to consider when starting and creating a product-based brand How CLEARSTEM went from their flagship serum being sold in the clinic to building a full product suite, selling online and creating an educational platform on their Shopify site The best marketing advice they received at the beginning of their business that they still use today The platforms, tools & structure CLEARSTEM uses as a virtual team Why Kayleigh and Danielle invest in a co-founder Executive Coach LINKS Use the code BOSSBABE for 15% OFF at clearstemskincare.com FOLLOW bossbabe: @bossbabe.inc Natalie Ellis: @iamnatalie CLEARSTEM: @clearstemskincare

Some of the best advice that we still reference to this day, if you do all the things to make it rain, like you're paying for some huge influencer to post you, you're going on some huge podcast, like you're doing the really big, like top of funnel awareness things. And you're, she called that making it rain. Cause like, it's all coming down.

Ready? If you don't have the buckets to capture it in, it's just going to go down the drain. A boss babe is unapologetically ambitious and paves the way for herself and other women to rise, keep going and fighting on. She is on a mission to be her best self in all areas. It's just believing in yourself. Confidently stepping outside her comfort zone to create her own vision of success. Welcome back to the Boss Babe Podcast. Okay, i have got a good one up my sleeve for you right now i got the chance to sit down with the founders of clear stem skincare danielle and kaylee

they are phenomenal business women and what they don't know about skincare is not worth knowing what i really wanted to do in this interview was go more behind the scenes of their business because I know they've done a lot of interviews where they share their story, how they got into skincare, what their business does, what their products do,

and a lot of advice on hormonal acne, all of that kind of thing. And you can find those interviews. I really wanted to take this interview in a different direction because this is the Boss Babe podcast. You're all here for business and wanting to know the nitty gritty behind the scenes. So I was saying to them just after the interview, I was like, I hope I didn't go too in detail and ask too many prying questions. And they were like, no, it's okay. Because I

really do want to know the details. I want to know what your meeting structure looks like. I want to know the operating system of your business. I want to know what's challenging about your co-founder relationship. I want to know what brings in sales for you month after month, because that's the kind of knowledge that we can all take and implement in our businesses to really see results. So we really dig in, in this episode, we jump headfirst into what their business operates like, where they started, how they were getting their first clients, and now how they have grown into a multi-million dollar business. They are everywhere. You'll see them in stores. You see so many influencers posting about their brand. They are collaborating with so many people, so many brands. What they have built

is phenomenal. And they get really honest about what that takes and what it looks like behind the scenes and how they aren't in a season of having harmony across their lives right now. A product-based business is a whole different ballgame. And it's something that I am not doing myself and I can't really speak to. So to get them on and to get a chance to really dive into the operating system of a product-based business was really, really inspiring. And I hope you enjoy this angle of the business. You can obviously check out any of their other interviews if you want to find out what their skin stories was and their tips for acne prone skin. They also mentioned at the end of the episode, if any of you want a discount on their products, you can use the code BOSSBABE and you'll get 15% off. They're amazing. I really, really love this conversation and I would love to

hear your feedback on it. As always, if you feel called, I would love it if you could leave a review because it really helps get our show out there and attract even more amazing guests to to join us. So with that, let's dive into the episode. Danielle, Kayleigh, welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for having us here. This is like one of the best, like most famous podcasts, like everyone knows it. We've been looking forward to being on here with you for a really long time. Thank you. I have to say, so I had a chance to try some of your products before I went away for the summer. I have to say, so I had a chance to try some of your products before I went away for the summer. I actually took some with me to Europe. So I have tried, I think almost everything. My absolute favorite hands down is the exfoliating cleanser. Oh my goodness. You guys, the one with the green label, I keep it in the shower and I use it every single

night. And I think it has changed my skin. Thank you. What's so funny about that one is it's a simple scrub, right? But I think we're so used to scrubs just ripping apart our face and causing more damage. One of the best, best things you can do for your skin is healthy exfoliation and that's exactly what it does. It's formulated so well, thanks to Danielle. It's perfection. It is. I formulated that scrub. It's simple and straightforward-ish, but there's the key things that it does not have that make it so special. It's literally the sweet spot. It's the Goldilocks of scrubs because sometimes it's just like rice powder and it doesn't really do anything or it's too harsh and it's abrasive and it scrapes your skin

and you can only do it once a week and that that's not the right amount so we designed this specifically to be used potentially nightly not a lot but like you know like five to ten seconds a night and for it to transform your skin so you're a perfect example of who we made it for perfect well it works it really works i have such sensitive skin and when i'd seen exfoliating i was like oh i don, I don't know, but I'm listening. I'm going to try it. I trust these women. And I have to say, I mean, I love all your products with that one in particular, you know, when you find a holy grill that you're like, if this goes empty, I'm screwed. So I just wanted to share that with you. I am such a big fan of your brand. How long have you guys been in business for? When did you found this company? We kind of have two start dates. Danielle and I originally came together without ClearSem, but we originally met in 2015. And then ClearSem started the ideas of it more in 2017.

But I would say where we really started to hone in on the brand, like I left my full-time job. Danielle pulled back in her clinic because in the beginning days, I was working a full-time job and Danielle was literally in her clinic seven days a week. That was about 2019. And then when 2020 hit, Danielle's clinic had to close down. And for the very first time in all of ClearSims' existence, we had every single day together. And that's where we just went so hard into the business. But the concept of ClearStem was around 2017. I love it. And I've watched the brand evolve too. And it's been, I mean, I was just saying before this started, Kaylee, you guys are everywhere right now when you're so busy and it's amazing seeing your success.

But I'm sure in the beginning, it wasn't so easy. What was it like getting this kind of business off the ground? Oh, it was very intense, very demanding of growth. I want to say like unforgiving, but then also forgiving at the same time. Like you have to learn stuff. You have to figure it out. If you're, you know, trying to figure out your new website and your developer isn't there,

you're up till 3am trying to like, you're Googling like how to adjust the code. Like you're literally there like fucking figuring it out because you don't have a choice. But then also we've had a lot of angels guiding us this whole time because we've had a lot of things happen that could have, you know, ruined another company, but they, they turned into something cool for us. Like one time our labels came and they were bright pink and we were about to sell out and they're normally blue and white, just to put it in perspective, but they came metallic pink, but we were about to sell out. We had to fill them. We had to roll with it. What if those labels had come and they weren't just bright pink, but the letters were smeared

all over it. We couldn't have sold that. We would have been out of stock for like four months and that could have killed the company. So we've had a lot of luck and we've had a lot of learning and just everyday demands growth. I love those early stage stories, especially in product-based businesses. A lot of my friends that have product-based businesses, that's the kind of stuff that I love them to tell me. I'm like, okay, tell me what was actually like when maybe you were shipping out of your apartment or you were starting. So do you have any of those core memories of like, oh my goodness, I can't believe that we had to go through that labels being one of them? Well, we literally had to use to fill all of our product

by hand and self-label everything. So our very first serum was our Selver New Serum. It's the one with the blue label now, but that was our only serum at the time. So we had a makeshift Shopify store. I had my label maker plugged into my computer and we had to ship the bottles to my apartment, the labels to my apartment, self-apply all the labels, get our chemist to ship us gallons and gallons of the Selvernu serum. We had to sanitize, do the whole thing, fill all the bottles, seal them, and then individually mail every single one of them out. And it's so crazy. We did that for two and a half years. We didn't get a warehouse until

two and a half years into the company. So it was two and a half years of mailing out every single order. And then we also started carrying to fill the gaps with a few things. We were carrying products from another line to be able to offer face washes and different things. So we were mailing all of that out. So literally under my bed, stuffed in closet spaces behind boxes and boxes behind my couch that were hidden of just so many materials. And that was the first two and a half years. And what was it like in the beginning with cash flow? Because I imagine this kind of business, you've got to put a lot of money up front to even be able to sell something. Generally, yeah, that is the case. That went well for us too, actually. So my first business is San

Diego Acne Clinic. And I was seeing like 12 patients a day, like I could not even get a break. My schedule was just so packed. And I had a lot of darker skinned in every ethnicity you can think of. So darker skinned patients actually scar much easier. They scar from acne. They scar from a flea bite. They scar from if you go too strong on a chemical peel or a laser, they can scar. So I knew I had to help heal the scarring for my darker skinned patients a different way. So I had this recipe in my head. I knew what it needed to be. And it was like a stem cell based scar revision serum. And I found a lab that would take me on, even though I don't think I could find someone to do it today for the setup that I had.

But basically, this chemist, her son had acne, and she loved the concept. So she's like, all right, I'll take you on. She charged me, I think, $1,500 for an R&D fee. We made the iterations. And then it was just a one-ounce serum. And I was able to sell it for 60. And you know, the benchmark was like $150 serum, right? So 60 was a fair price for this, but our margins were like 90%. So there was a lot of profit and I, we already had customers proving that concept and funding what would be the growth of it because I was able to sell it

to my clinic patients. So took all that money, bought more product, got more packaging, and then another patient of mine put it on Amazon. It blew up there. So we just reinvested all of our profits for a couple years. And to that point, knowing your margin and your cost of selling is everything. Everyone has a good idea for a product, but if it's an $8 item, sorry, you got to be manufacturing it for 50 cents. And it has to be like, you know, it's, there's some things where it's like, you need to have enough margin or the idea can be great, but it will not survive. Yeah, totally. I would love to, to second to what Danielle said, because I know your audience that that's listening to either have companies, they want to start one, they're really ambitious humans. So I just want to drill this home a little bit

more for everyone that's listening. You can be so tricked by looking at all the brands and companies that are out there. For instance, there's a skin, I'm just not going to name names, there's a skincare brand out there that has really unique serums that sell them for like $8 to $12. Well, what people don't understand and don't know is the behind the scenes of that. This specific company, they own the manufacturing. They own a lot of the suppliers. They own so much of the supply chain that they are getting these ingredients at barely, barely, barely any cost. And that's why they're able to manufacture them and sell them at such a low price. But if you're just someone that's going out there and wants to

create it, you don't own all this manufacturing. You don't own the suppliers. Some of these people, they're like 40 years deep in relationships with suppliers where they're working with 100 different brands. They can negotiate different pricing. So that's what's going on in the back end of a lot of these products. So that's why pricing something is so important. And you first have to figure out how much you can make it for to then build in your own margin, to build in your pricing. So you can actually grow your business or you're just going to keep going downhill and you're never going to have enough money to actually reinvest, market your product, build a good website, hire a team. Yeah. And product market fit is huge, huge, huge. Cause you can have a great product, but

if it's not being marketed correctly to the people that need it in an efficient way, I mean, this is what keeps me up at night. Like the ads people could press the wrong button on our ad limit and I could wake up to an $800,000 charge. Like, like something could happen in your marketing where it's like, it could like change on a dime where you're all of your ad spend is gone and it wasn't aimed in the right way or it wasn't on the right ad sets or something like that. Right. So like, yeah, knowing what's the fundamentals of the business behind it, having that really, really squared away is like step one. I love that you're going into that. Let's go deeper on that because I know there's a lot of women listening that do have ideas for product-based businesses and they are terrified

thinking, well, you know, the only people that are going to buy it is like my mom and my grandma. And I can't even imagine getting an order online from a stranger. So can you walk us through the progression of your brand from starting it, selling it in your clinic to then how you got online and what it was like starting to actually get orders from people that didn't even know you? Yeah. Well, I mean, the proof of concept, I think is what you're kind of talking about, right? Like someone has a great idea, like give it to everyone, see who comes back and ask for it more, get that feedback, right? That's how you kind of know you're onto something. Yeah. So because I had the clinic business and was treating hundreds of people, you know, every month and everyone wanted

it, people were buying two at a time. We knew it worked, right? I could, the proof was there, like in the before and afters. I mean, if you look at Kaylee's skin, it's flawless now, pretty much because of the serum, it's our cell renew serum. So we luckily had the proof of concept there. And then Amazon at the time was another like proof of concept. That's how it worked for us. But for people that have a product idea or a product, just like give it to everyone, you know, I'll say, is very problem solution oriented products. For example, I think we're so saturated now, not just in the skincare industry, like every industry, the food industry, beverage, tech, I mean, all the AI things that are coming out.

Everything is just very, very saturated and the consumer is becoming smarter and savvy, and they're asking more questions and they want more meaning behind brands. They don't just want to fill their house with a bunch of junk. They really want to understand, okay, if I'm, especially we're in a recession right now, if I'm spending my money, what is this helping me? Is it helping me get better, feel better, look better? Am I struggling with something right now? And so really dialing in on your why, why are you making this product? If you think it's just fun to start a company, I want to be like, it's not fun. It's actually the most fun ever, but it's also the most like craziness you'll ever go through. So you don't want to start a company because you think it's just going to be fun. The fun comes from, I mean, now we're like six years later and it's, I mean, we still

have so much fun just that's because that's Danielle and I's mindset. We make everything fun. Even when it's like something goes wrong, we just make it fun. And that's us, but it is a grind and you have to love it. And you have to be solving a problem that keeps you so passionate and engaged and rooted in your why. Like, are you your why. Are you helping someone? Are you helping yourself? Why are you doing this? And that's going to be your internal driver and motivator because you need the energy. That's a big part of it. You can lose faith so many times

if you don't have the passion and energy and why. And I'm grateful that Danielle and I have always had that and we both always have it. And we have it together in our partnership, which is so beautiful because I see other companies fail because of that. And it continually makes me so grateful for the relationship we have and the problem that we're solving and the community that we've built around this. But just always keep in mind that you need to be rooted back in your why for any company you're starting. Totally. I feel that too. The resilience, the resourcefulness, like it's never going to be easy. You've got to have that willingness to keep going and pushing through.

So tell me about your journey in terms of coming online and scaling online. It sounds like you were in a clinic and then did you move on to Amazon and then you were having people come directly to your website? What did that process look like for you guys? We had a small little website, like a $6,000 one, but we didn't have any marketing towards it. We weren't running ads. We didn't have any SEO. We didn't have anything. Right. So we would get a couple of people that would find us. But yeah, Amazon was like the primary channel at first and then it got super saturated. And here's one thing we did. We hired these web developer branding people who we thought had our best interests at heart and sold us on this custom website.

You guys are doing innovative stuff. You need a custom website. Never go custom ever, ever, ever. No, especially not in your first 10 years of any business. We had to pay. No, I know companies that have gone custom and then trashed the whole thing and then they're back to Shopify. Just stick with Shopify. Yeah, I did that. I went custom.

It was the worst idea for my membership. Everyone will convince you to. They'll convince you you have to. Don't do it. They make money from you doing it. We had to pay $150 an hour to the web developer to change some font like literally like that's where all of our money went at first oh and then we finally got a shipping company and they were awful they like took us for a ride and were like charging us like like 14 to ship at

one ounce serum or something like that. They literally took like 30% of our profit and like we couldn't untangle from them. It was kind of a mess too, but like we got through those. Yeah, I've been there. The custom is a bad idea, especially in the beginning.

You don't need it. It's so expensive to maintain. There's so many bugs. I did that, big mistake. So then how were you getting people to find you then when you did eventually pour into your own website and your own brand online and how are you getting people to find you? In the beginning days, it was all free of marketing because it was just Danielle and I. And so I was running the social. I also had started a blog and

a podcast at the time. And Danielle would come on the podcast sometimes. We'd talk about acne. So we'd put it out that way. And I just went to every single event in San Diego, Orange County, and LA could possibly go to that was wellness. I remember, I don't know if you remember the Good Fest. It was like five years ago. Kate Van Horn and a few amazing women put it on. And I remember that was the first time ever we gifted.

And I think we gifted like 50 bottles, which was absurd at the time. Cause it was like 50, that was crazy. 50 at the time, like in the beginning days, which is so loud, but it was crazy. And there's still women to this day that are like, I remember you at the good fest, like six years ago. And it's just, I just met everyone I possibly could to get our mission out there. Because again, our mission has always been to help people relieve the suffering around acne, to help them actually understand the true education behind what causes acne. So any possible thing I could get booked for Danielle and I going on podcasts, meeting people, just getting the awareness out there.

That's what we did for me. It was all free, but it was just meeting people, introducing them to this new world of acne education and getting them to try the product just getting it in people's hands any way we could and what would you say now has changed the most in your marketing versus when you're in the beginning kind of throwing everything at the wall what do you focus the most on now i don't want to overwhelm people because I know it's step-by-step. So the very first thing we did, we did hire a head of social who is still with us to this day. She's been running our account since that was the first thing I wanted to pass off because I knew how important it was

and I was being so drained by it. So I was like, we need to get someone on this. So we got someone on our social and Danielle and I have been always on top of social since day one. What graphics are we posting? Is it meaningful? Making sure we're not just posting random things. Like are people being impacted in a positive way for everything we're posting? So we started with that. Then we hired someone for email.

That was next. And then we hired someone to start running Facebook ads. And that was really the beginning. Now we're pretty much on every channel. We do podcasts. We do Google ads. We do TikTok, Meta. Our email is way more complicated than it was day one.

I will tell everyone, please don't get overwhelmed by email. Get your basic flow set up and you can grow from there. It can seem so overwhelming. You can be pitched on these like crazy big packages. Just one step at a time. Just get your baseline going. There's this amazing woman, Abby, that we worked with in the beginning for some media training to help learn how to tell our story in a constructive way. Because we would like,

I remember my story starting like 15 years ago. I was like, what's important? How can we tell this in a really impactful way? So we hired her for some media training and some of the best advice that we still reference to this day. She said, if you do all the things to make it rain, like you're paying for some huge influencer to post you, you're going on some huge podcast,

like you're doing the really big, like top of funnel awareness things. She called that making it rain because like it's all coming down, ready? If you don't have the buckets to capture it in, it's just going to go down the drain. So you're literally flushing money, time, and energy down the drain. And those buckets are ad retargeting, email retargeting, SMS targeting, all the way, gaining consumer information, getting their emails, capturing all of those things from making it rain. And to this day, we still use that advice. I think that's actually

some of the best advice, especially in your product-based business, because the awareness is great. But if people land on your website and it's really messy and they don't even know where to start, or if they land on it and they forget to buy, but no one's following up. I think a lot of people forget that that's where a lot of the sales are made. So I absolutely love that you talked about that. Do you remember the point in your business where it really started to turn in a way that you were like, wait, I'm seeing consistent revenue now come in every single month. And it's less of, oh, what are we going to do this month? What are we going to throw at the wall? And actually it's predictable and it's growing. Do you remember when that happened? Oh, I'd be interested to hear Kaylee's moment. That's such a good question.

Thanks for asking it. What's coming up for me is knowing that we had enough coming in from the various sales channels like Amazon and our DTC on our website, knowing that we had enough coming in from the various sales channels like Amazon and our DTC on our website, knowing that we had enough coming in to keep doing what was to, by then we kind of knew what was working with our ads and we had someone that we trusted to run them, which is huge. So knowing, okay, we can, we have enough money coming in to keep scaling that big avenue that's already working for us. And then being able to test some other things. And we tested a lot of free stuff too. I think when we started doing the master classes during COVID and we saw like how well people responded to us and the influx of loyalty

that came from that, that's when we knew like, okay, now we have a second way of really, really driving customer loyalty and customer value. So when we started to be able to just like one by one have these different acquisition channels, that's when I felt very, very confident that we were never, ever going to fail. Never thought we were going to fail, actually. But like that's when it just that's when the feeling of sureness really soaked in. I agree. I have to second Danielle. For me, it's when people started showing up to things and engaging with us in ways beyond our product. Anyone can dump a bunch of money into ads and get people to buy a product. Are they buying again? Are they not? But if you can host a two-hour masterclass at 6pm at night and get hundreds of people to show up, you're onto something. It's crazy how long our masterclasses go because we'll educate about root causes of acne and then

we'll leave it open to Q&A. And we've been on Q&As for well over an hour and a half. And we simply have to cut it off because we're tired and we're like, need water. And we need to eat. I'm getting hangry. I'm like, text, I'm texting Danielle. I'm like, I need to eat. Can we cut this now? Because we'll be on a masterclass for like two, two and a half hours. And we love it so much. I'm joking, but it's, you know, when people show up in that way to learn and they're investing their time and money into you, that's when I really started to see it and know that I knew that we were building a community. Cause again, this was all online. So you physically can't see these people, but when we started hosting the masterclasses and seeing all these people and like the chat going

off and everyone being so engaged it was just really special moments during those times the pandemic we're just locked down danielle and i just hosting master like doing everything we could just to connect with our community and um it was a really special time. Yeah. I think that is something that you guys have done so well in your business is build a community around your product. I mean, it's not just your social following. I feel like you're saying it's going beyond that and having those kinds of loyal customers that are going to continue coming to you time and time again, but are going to tell other people about it are going to put you forward. This is how I ended up up interviewing you guys because someone that works for me was like, you need to have them on. I'm obsessed with these products. And I could tell she was such a part of your community.

And I think what a testament to a brand to be able to build that because like you said, a lot of people can throw money at ads and they'll get that first time purchase, but they are not building people that continue to come time and time again, and then buy products for friends. And I think that's really, really powerful. Okay, so switching gears a little bit, because I'm just so interested in your journey. And I know for those listening, that eating it all up, because, you know, starting a product based business, I think it can be mysticized, like, so mystical, sometimes people like I don't even know where to start. Tell me about your partnership because I'm really, really curious for obvious reasons. What first had you guys partner up and decide to

do this together versus having your own individual businesses? Well, we just realized very quickly that we were cut from the same cloth and our passion for education is very, very much the same. Kaylee knew how to educate multiple people. I didn't even have an Instagram. She was already big on Instagram and had a blog. I was educating in depth one-on-one in my clinic all day. So our journey was that we had both been gaslighted so much in our acne journey by Western medicine. We don't like to point the finger at dermatologists because they're doing the best they can in the system that we live in.

But our experience is what really bonded us too. Like we both had dealt with crazy aggressive cystic acne. I had to do Accutane three separate times and it still came right back. People were telling her to, you know, get lymph node surgery to remove her lymph nodes when really it was just eating eggs was it was aggravating her limbs, you know, so it's like she went through a crazy, you know, medical roller coaster with her skin, you know, as did I, and when none of it worked, and we found each other, and we knew what what did work, and saw a vision for how to educate people on how to get it spread to the masses. That's when we knew like we had to. And what about your roles in your partnership? Was it very clear in the beginning when you got together? Okay, I'm going to do this,

you'll do this? Or has that evolved over time? A little bit of both. We have brains that have the same goal and the same why and the same excitement around purpose, but we get to things in two different ways, which has been so incredible for our company because we'll have two different ways of describing something, which hits two different people that is so necessary. And both of our brains together create such a beautiful, I guess, ending to things or accomplishment from different things that we're working on. So we feed off each other really well. I'll say something and Danielle will notice something that I didn't notice and vice versa. So we just work so well synergistically together, but have two different operating systems as brains, which I think is so important for co-founders and people working together.

If you're thinking the exact same and you're not seeing blind spots, Danielle and I can see blind spots because we think so differently. But again, we both have the same goals. We're on the same page. We want the same things. And that's always kept us just propelling so fast in a forward motion is because of that. Yeah. And there's some things that Kaylee is just naturally a genius at because of who she is and how her mind works that is not my strong suit. Like she, she's a connector brain. Like she'll remember who everyone is like that she meets at like founder made or something, who everyone is, what they're doing, who they need to meet. She'll think of it later and be like, Oh, you need to meet this person. So-and-so like my

brain doesn't do that. I remember science stuff and like random facts from history. And that's it. I love you so much. Guys, Danielle formulates every single one of the products. Like that is her brain. Like she not only can describe things in such an eloquent way and way of deeply understanding the why behind something, but also every single one of those products in our whole fleet that perform so insane and create so much change in people's skin that's danielle's brain she formulates all of them it's amazing love formulation it's

like you should i literally want to show your audience my house but i'm embarrassed there's bottles everywhere lab samples benchmarks like oh my god like i'm literally like drowning in bottles here but i love it because i'm just like rubbing stuff on like every four minutes and it's like, it's the best. I love it. And so when you both got together, was it very clear? One of you would take CEO role. One of you would take, I think, uh, Kaylee, your chief growth officer. Is that right? It always changes. I wear a thousand hats. I'm not, yeah. I'm kind of growing more into CM. It's like, it's such a blend, right? I pretty much had up all the marketing. Got it. And was that clear from the beginning? Those were the paths that you would both take? Yeah. And talk to me about this co-founder therapist.

He's amazing. His name is Etienne. He's an adorable South African teddy bear. And I am a huge believer in therapy. I think everybody needs one. Everyone needs a therapist. You know, if there's something you want to get better at or that you want to understand more, get a coach, get a therapist, talk it out. You know, like people are so hesitant to do that sometimes. And it really is the difference between a happy life and a frustrating life. So I already had my therapist. And then when Kaylee was going to move to LA, I knew that like our ability to communicate

was going to drastically change. And it was right at the, cause we normally were together all day, every day, right? That's easy. But when someone moves and our company was like growing so much, we were doing things we'd never done before writing checks. We've never written before, you know, the stakes were high. So I was like, okay, we definitely need to have like an executive coach, an executive therapist for us.

And he has just helped us both as individuals and together and with our team to communicate. And he has a bit of a background scaling businesses too. So he knew kind of like what we needed in order to hire, like, okay, what are your core values? What's your vision for three years? Like we didn't have any of that before him. So he's like basically our Sherpa. Have you felt like you guys have had any challenging times in your partnership or has it been pretty much smooth sailing? I mean, any relationship, if anyone listening is in a relationship past the honeymoon phase, you've had issues. So I wouldn't even, and issues isn't the right word. It's more of communication blocks is really all it is.

And that's what Etienne, like some, it's crazy that sometimes we've been in a session with Etienne and he's like, okay, okay, pause. You guys are saying the same thing. Literally just in two completely different ways. And he was like, Danielle saying this, it's, you know, Kaylee's not, it's not landing with Kaylee around. Kaylee's saying this, it's not landing know, Kaylee's not, it's not landing with Kaylee around Kaylee saying this, it's not landing with Danielle right now, because the way we both communicate and then also need to receive information. So it's so healthy to have someone in the middle that can

kind of pick up what you're saying and give it to the other person in the way they need to receive it. Because a lot of times, if we feel like we're not being heard, defenses go up, frustration goes up, and then you're really not communicating in a healthy way. So when we get to talk through things with him, we're always on the same page. We just needed help filtering it. Let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite all-in-one platform, Kajabi. You know I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity, which I love. Not to mention our team couldn't be happier because now everything is in one place, so it makes collecting data, creating pages, collecting payment, all the things so much

simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and kajabi has really helped us do that this year so of course i needed to share it here with you it's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business you know get rid of the complexity and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible i definitely recommend kajabi to all of my clients and students so if you're listening and haven't checked out Kajabi yet now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim your 30-day free trial that's kajabi.com slash boss babe I love that and talk to me a little bit about people because you mentioned

when you were talking about your growth journey, it sounds like hiring really great people and having a good team has been such a big part of your growth journey. So when it comes to say hiring people you're mentioning for social, for email, for ads, how along your journey have you made the decision of who your next hire is going to be? And are you learning the thing yourself or are you fully delegating it out to someone that maybe has experience in it? How have you thought through this? It kind of came naturally and we knew we needed someone for customer service and social customer service should always be your first hire. So that it was necessary that it was overloaded. We couldn't do it anymore. We had to get someone for that. Same thing with social. To do it well kind of is a full-time job if you're really focused on scaling and being strategic and being cutting edge with it, right? And then it was like, OK, people want to sell our products. There's ambassadors.

Need someone to run that department too. So it just was like brick by brick. This is what the company needs. It needs a person. One thing our coach did tell us, though, is don't just put warm bodies at things. And that's what we learned. We're like, OK, we know this person. They love Clearsome.

They want to help. We need help with this. OK, do that. But it wasn't a right fit. So learning to not throw warm bodies at people is we learned that lesson kind of painfully a couple of times. Nothing too drastic, but we definitely learned it. Everyone has their zone of genius and things

that they should and shouldn't be doing for the company. And then director of supply chain was forecasting. So I did all the formulation and ran the money for a long time and did all the operations, like the insurance and all the boring shit. But supply chain management became a monster and our vendors were just like, they were so chaotic and unreliable with timing. Like POs were taking six months. You can't forecast the growth we were having when your inventory is taking six months to get there. So hiring someone to do that became absolutely necessary. And it was like the best day of my life. And then we hired a chief operating officer who has transformed our company. He has a lot of experience, comes from a tech background, you know, as part of like an incubator, like has a lot of experience

and a lot of experience hiring. And he's scary to interview with. So if he is searching for someone and you make it through an interview with him and he serves them to us, chances are they're a 99% fit. So that has been absolutely huge for us. That's how we found most of our strategic talent this last year. And how has it been bringing kind of another chief into the C-suite between your two relationships as co-founders and then bringing in a COO? How has that relationship developed? That was nerve wracking at first because we didn't have an executive. But I think what's so important to note is Danielle and I have done the work with Etienne for the last few years, our executive coach. And so

at that point, when he came on board, there was nothing we couldn't talk about, work through, be honest about, figure out. And then it was just constant reaffirmation of if he says something we don't agree with, we don't have to do it. Again, we own the company. So it was just making sure we were on the same page because what he's doing that's amazing is he's trying to free up Danielle and I to each be going so hard in our zone of genius and not be doing all these other things that pull us into the weeds and truly exhaust us. So we aren't doing the things that make us happy and grow the companies in the right way. And we all three have an amazing partnership together now rooted in just really honest communication. And we all flow together really well now, but I do believe

it's because we had done all the communication work for a few years leading up to that, that it just, it went so well for us. I absolutely love that. Yes. Okay. So then tell me a little bit about what your team is looking like now. Are you all virtual? How are you communicating? How's the actual business operating? What's your operating system? We're all remote. We always have been. We love it that way. I mean, I would love for us all to be able to work together like once a week. It's just not possible where we're all over the place, man. So talk to me a little bit about how you guys structure that. Are you having certain set meetings? Do you use any

certain tools, apps, softwares? Like tell me the details that I know everyone's so curious about. Oh, good question. Yeah, I'll take this one. There's a system called Traction, a book called Traction and Entrepreneur Operating System, EOS. Backtracking on that even, I found out about that because I joined a business group called EO, Entrepreneurs Organization. You have to have a million in revenue. And if you're at that level, get in that organization. They also have an accelerator program where you only have to have 250K in revenue. If you're there, get in that just entrepreneurs organization, the learning and the connections and the conversations are completely unreal and will unlock your entire world. Like could be like a make or break kind

of thing, right? So getting into that, I learned that everyone was using the same system and everyone would talk about how it transformed their business, how it made every meeting more meaningful, got rid of meetings that weren't meaningful, how it kept everyone accountable in a really organized way. So we started implementing some of that. And with that comes a meeting called the L10, the level 10 meeting. So we have that with more of the senior people that are like running their own departments. We have a standing meeting every two weeks where we have a scorecard that we all have numbers we're responsible for, and then we put them up on the scorecard and we go through and we each mention one of our core values and how we've related to it that week. We read our core

focus, like the vision of the company. We like take turns reading that. We do our wins too. And then we have something called an IDS, idea, discussion, and solution. And then our weekly huddle where everyone's involved. And Kaylee can tell you how that one's run. We have everyone talk about their departments, what's going on for the week, what they're reporting on, but it's not as numbers-based. It's definitely more awareness-based, like the pulse of the company, what's going on this week, this month. So all the departments can talk because since we are remote, some people can go a while without talking to certain departments. So it's a great way to keep everyone on the same page.

Marketing, social, inventory. And then Natalie, you asked about apps that we use in different plugins. So we use Monday for task tracking. I know a lot of people use Notion. A lot of people use Asana. We just fell upon Monday and we really like the way that one works for our team. Love Monday. Yeah. So we use Monday. Danielle and I don't communicate as much on Slack, but our whole team does.

We're just pinged from every direction. Phone calls, texts, emails, Slack. So we're on it. We're on like two different groups on Slack. We're just need to chime in for, but it's just for us, it's a little overwhelming, but interdepartmental, our whole team loves being on it. And they, every time someone new comes out of the team or new agency partner or anything, they want it all on Slack. So they love that.

And Danielle and I are just running a million miles a minute. So usually text is the easiest for us still. I've heard great things about a lot of people moving over to Voxer. We haven't done that yet. I continually think about it. And then the stress around like shifting a whole way of communicating just doesn't happen. So yeah, that's honest. Yeah. Email, DMs, business DMs. It's out of control. Yeah. We're like, if we're not getting back to you you really need us just text us yeah I love the honesty around it you're like like we've tried it's just like it's just too much it's just too much I feel you so speaking of running a million miles an hour how do you both balance you know life and running a really fast growing company? Because the truth is fast growing companies often do require a lot of sacrifice. And there is a lot going on. How do

you feel like you're finding that? Do you have the balance? Is that not the season for you? What is that looking like? I love that you phrased it that way. It's not the season of balance for me right now. It sucks because it is kind of affecting like it affects your health. It affects your sleep. It affects your relationships. You know, like I miss my grandparents. You know, I'm like, God, I've been gone this whole month. I haven't even seen them. You know, so it's like there's always something you're feeling behind on, especially if you prioritize your relationships. That's the struggle for me right now. I'm looking forward to more balance, but I know that this is a season and there are some times where you just have to do what's required. If it was easy, everyone would do it. We do prioritize wellness. It's one of our core values. So we, you know, I think Kaylee and I both have at least two self-care appointments of some kind a week. I get a two hour massage every week. We love massages. Other ones in there too. Yeah. I literally solve business problems while I'm getting a two hour massage. It's a business necessity. So you find the balance any way you can and being aware of the fact that you're not in balance and making other decisions to try to get better. Saying no to something that you know

is going to go late that night so you can get to bed early. Saying no, be like, hey, I want to connect with this friend, but I don't want to do an early morning hike on Sunday. I want to lay in bed and do nothing. Like being able to prioritize rest is like the thing that I think everyone in our position needs to learn how to do. I second everything Danielle said. It's just it's really not the season for complete balance. Again, we do like I prioritize eating really well. I prioritize sleep every single night. That's the one thing I remember in the first few years of our business.

I would be cool with just getting like four and a half, five hours of sleep. I don't know how I did that because now it's like I have to get eight hours. So I really, really prioritize sleep. We don't start meetings until 10 o'clock. It cuts into my... What I need to get done. It'll completely chop off my train of thought or my motivation for the day if we have really early meetings. So we've structured our meeting schedule so we can prioritize rest. But I think my biggest struggle right now too is relationships. I mean, I'm very

grateful my boyfriend is also an entrepreneur at a similar stage. So we get to do so much together. And if there's work things, we usually both benefit from traveling together. So I'm really grateful for that. But I do feel a lot of guilt around friendships and family relationships about truly not having the energy to give my all. Because most weekends I joke, but I spend them hibernating. I usually don't have my phone on me a lot. I'll check it for like any really work purposes. But Danielle and I are at the point where we have such an incredible team. We don't have to be like grinding on the weekends as, as much as we used to in the earlier days. It really just

depends on the season, but I hibernate most weekends. I chill, I rest, I do things that are really low stimulation. I don't do any high stimulating things and just chill. And I really love that. And it gives me the balance I need from the really over stimulating weeks. Yeah. And it is stimulation too. Like sometimes it's, it's fun stuff. Yeah. It's all super fun, but it's still extremely taxing on the nervous system when it's out of whack with the rest. Totally. And I think there's a lot to be said for just acknowledging this isn't the season for me to have that kind of balance.

This isn't the season for me to be pouring into certain relationships because I feel like when we're trying to convince ourselves we still should be, that's where all the guilt comes in of like, oh, I should be. And sometimes it's nice to be like, you know what? I shouldn't be right now because I'm prioritizing these amount of things and that's enough. But I just love the honesty around it too. Cause I think it's really important to show that building a business requires a lot from you, especially in growth phases. There's a lot of momentum that comes and it's not always as simple as saying, I'm going to go take a couple of weeks off because you've got those commitments signed up. So I really love the honesty there. So then coming back to where we started at the beginning, I want to

talk products. I want to talk business. I want to talk ClearStem for anyone that has never heard of you. What do you do and who are you for? We are for everybody, but specifically people who are acne prone, want to age well, and want to avoid toxins. So we are literally all three categories of skincare. We're anti-acne, anti-aging, and we try to be as non-toxic as possible. You know, the definition of clean changes all the time, but we follow all of the most current rules around that too. And why that's special is because normally those three categories completely cancel each other out. Clean beauty and organic, all that stuff is loaded with pore cloggers in it. Organic skincare breaks people out all the time. Anti-aging skincare breaks people out all the time. But yet anti-acne products dry the skin out, they cause irritation,

and they cause accelerated aging because they're so drying and harsh. So if you're a woman in your 20s, 30s, 40s and beyond who is breaking out, but you also want to age well, you are literally in a whiplash state where one product is helping ish and one product is making it worse and they're all garbage pretty much. And no, and it creates a lot of suffering because you're trying so hard to get control of your skin and nothing is working for you. So we are for people who can relate to that statement that I just made. Oh, it's just so smart. It's so smart because you're so right. There is no brand that I can think of that does the things that you do. The anti-aging stuff really does break you out. And anti-acne stuff, it feels like it's for like teenage skin and it's so drying so can you diagnose me and hopefully this will help people who are listening if they

want to try some of your products so I would say my skin is like combination between dry and oily I have scarring from having acne back in the day, you all know how that goes with the hormones. What would you say would be a good regimen for me to get on with clear stem products? Oh, love this question. So sensitive can mean different things to different people. So what does sensitive mean to you? Does it mean you get really red? Does it mean you get irritated? Do you get rashes? Like what does that mean for you? Yeah. So if I use anything that has harsh chemicals in my whole face just goes burning red. Got it. That's good for you to know. So it's more harsh chemical. So you would stay away from things like parabens and like the like dyes and things like

that. So that's good to know for you. But like you said earlier, you're not so sensitive that you can't exfoliate. So even if you have sensitive skin, you should still be exfoliating. It will still help. So the clear kit, the one that has that scrub that you were talking about, and then our two serums, our cell renew serum, which is that scar reversing serum that we were talking about earlier. It has that one in there. And then clarity, which is a mandelic acid blend that also has turmeric and vitamin C. So mandelic acid is the sweet spot. It's like the, I keep saying Goldilocks, but it's so relevant during this episode. It's the Goldilocks of acids, right? So alpha hydroxy acids are one of the most powerful tools that we can use for our

skin, but there's salicylic acid, which is only in a 2%. It doesn't do all that much. Or there's glycolic acid, which is just too aggressive and too stimulating and would probably make you red. Mandelic acid is the sweet spot. And it's sensitive for everyone's skin, even if they have rosacea. But what the mandelic acid does is it dissolves clogged pores. So it dissolves blackheads. That's literally its nickname is the blackhead dissolver. So what that acid does when it's on your skin is it eats away the stuff you don't want there anymore. That stuff inside your pores, it's old scar tissue. It's just debris from like makeup. So it's basically cleaning your skin and clearing out your pores so that the acne can go away, but it's also stimulating collagen at the same time. So that's like what the, the, everything

in that regimen is clearing your skin and stimulating collagen at the same time. The fourth thing in that kit is our HydroGlow moisturizer. And that's this luxurious acne safe moisturizer that you can slather on your face and it will never break you out. But it also has something called Bacuchiol in it, which is like a retinol alternative. So it stimulates collagen without causing sensitivity. So that kit has those four things. and that's where everyone should really start. Okay.

And this sounds like it's going to be a basic question, but I still need to ask it. You mentioned that kit, which I did get and I love, but there's two serums in. Do you use two serums at the same time or do you alternate? How would you recommend doing that? Great question. A serum just refers to the texture of something. It doesn't have anything to do with its function. So the blue one, you can slather it on.

That's a calming, hydrating, moisturizing serum with balancing herbs in it. You can use the whole bottle of it every day, and it would just be like the more the better. Clarity, the yellow one, if you look at the instructions, it says to only use it at night or every other night, and you put it on bare skin and you leave it alone for about 15 minutes to do its work, to unclog your pores. Then you follow with the blue serum because that's a hydrating serum. It does something totally different. So you can mix and match serums, but you really want to know what the function of them is. Our other serum, for example, Bounce Back, that's a peptide serum. It's also very hydrating. It's not an exfoliant.

So you can do Bounce Back in the morning, Cell Renew at night. You could mix those two together and cocktail them even. You wouldn't do that with Clarity, though, because it's an acid. It's its own thing. That makes sense. And then you mentioned earlier you were referencing Kaylee's skin and how perfect it is. And I agree. We randomly sat next to each other in an event

when we were doing this. I was like, oh, hi. And your skin is glowing. I mean, both of you, but I saw you in person, Kaylee, glowing. What was the serum you said that really supported you in your skin journey? It was the Selver New Serum. So if you want to know what my skin looked like before when I was struggling with bright red, inflamed, angry, angry cystic acne on both my cheeks and partially down my neck, my before and after is pinned to the top of our Instagram. So you can check it out there and see it. And when I got clear because of Danielle, because I was again, one of her clinic patients, when I got my skin clear, I still had scar damage left over because I had such aggressive cystic acne. And the reason why I have absolutely no scar damage, no redness, no blotchiness, like literally nothing is because of our Selver New Serum. That's when Danielle had

first formulated it and I was testing it at the time and she's getting like different batch numbers and different renditions of it. And I would test it. And that's truly the reason why I had such aggressive acne and not any scar damage on my skin anymore. Now I'll do microneedling stuff now, but I actually, during this whole process of clearing my skin, I didn't get microneedling done for a few years. I think maybe like two years. So my scarring was completely gone from the cell renew. And I only started exploring microneedling later. And that was more just for like the anti-aging benefits of it. But my scarring was completely gone at that time. So it was really only that one serum was the only thing I was doing for a scar damage reversal.

Yeah, removing Kaylee's acne triggers, which were some of her products and hair products had pore cloggers in them. And then changing a couple of things in her diet. Like she was overdoing it on B12 and then having eggs every day and eggs are a trigger, right? But like removing those things and then adding what is essentially our clear kit got her skin to perfect in like three and a half months. Like even Accutane couldn't do that. You'd still be in the middle of the purge if you were on Accutane at that time. So it really is transformative. And also another thing that I want to ask you about in terms of products, which I absolutely love that you guys are doing this, because I actually haven't seen another skincare brand do this. And I think it is so important

because we all know so much of this is from within. You now do lab testing, you do supplements. Can you talk a bit about that? Because I'm so glad that you do this. Yes, I'll have Danielle kick off the supplements. And then I will talk about the acne lab test because the supplement was created from Danielle sending hundreds of thousands of patients, acne patients out to get lab work done. And it's the culmination of what came back every time. Yeah. So I've been working with this really talented blood work person. She's got like 30 years of experience and she has Western medicine and Eastern medicine degrees. I'm so lucky I found her,

but she's who I would send all of my clinic patients to. And over the years, I mean, it's like hundreds or if not thousands of people at this time, and everyone would come back, including myself and Kaylee, when we did our labs with her, everyone would come back with almost some of the same stuff. Like some people would have a random parasite or something, you know, a one, like an autoimmune thing, something a little more unique to them. But over 80% of people had the same issues, not digesting proteins well enough, not digesting other macros. Like say they weren't digesting their fats or carbs very well. So they needed digestive support. And then they also needed liver support. And nearly almost everyone who has

acne is low on vitamin A. And we need that for our skin. Our skin does not shed as much as someone who doesn't break out. Like our pores get clogged more naturally. Like we have to have vitamin A for that. So everyone was coming back with the same profile. And when I made those changes for myself, it was a night and day difference. And I saw the same results, the same protocols and the same like functional nutritional supplements that she was putting people on. So we knew that we had to have this wing because I couldn't keep referring her everyone that would come to us online. She's only one person.

So we knew we had to find another way to do that. So that's more of the lab panel stuff. But what the supplement was because when I was working with this person, I was seeing the supplements and I was like, okay, this is like six different things that people have to take. And it's too overwhelming for a lot of people. So how do we condense all of this into one supplement that's going to address like 80% of everyone's concerns?

So that's what we did. We put liver support, turmeric for inflammation, the right amount of vitamin A, DIM to help with estrogen and liver, and then vitamin B5, which is huge. It helps with oil control and also digestion again. And then we went so far as to put a stress support element, 5-HTP in it as well, because everyone's stressed. So I knew that formula was going to work. We launched it. It took off. It's like literally our bestseller. It's it changes people's skin in like five days. Okay, ordering right after this. It's been so incredible to see. So like Danielle said, the supplement gets

helps 80% of the people because all of these root causes of acne just aren't being addressed. And since we aren't getting a lot of them through our diet, or we're just deficient in these things, it really combines a lot of different areas into one to help support our whole body functioning better. Acne clears up as an outcome of everything else realigning in the body. So there is that still 20% of people, and there's still people that have been struggling with acne for decades. They've been through the gamut with so many prescriptions. The amount of women that Danielle and I have talked to, even in the last six months, it feels like all of them on spironolactone. Like every single, it's crazy. And every single woman we talk to is terrified to get off it. They're like, I have a wedding coming up, so I can't get off it. I have this coming up,

I have this coming up, but they're getting to the age too. They're like, well, I want to have kids and I can't be on it. And I'm terrified. I don't want my skin to blow up like it did when I was a teenager. And acne brings people so much PTSD of when they lost their confidence, when they didn't want to show up, when they were terrified, everyone was looking at their skin and judging them. It really hits on our mental health. So it's this PTSD from people that don't want to go off the medications because they're like, I don't want to go back to that place that I was in. And it's so sad, but we're just like, we get it. We get why women feel that way.

So we launched the acne lab test so people can order it on our website, get their blood work done. And our team of acne specialists analyzes for patterns of root causes. And so we're able to give this beautiful report of showing how we came to the conclusions of all the patterns that we're seeing. Is it stress and blood sugar related? Is it infection or bacteria? Is it hormones? Is it a drainage issue? Something not draining properly in the body? Is it dehydration? Is it a deficiency? And so you will get your root cause of acne based on the patterns in your report, plus a custom recommended protocol for each one. And then for people that want to go deeper, we do gift three free months of our membership. And within the membership is all video breakdowns of the report. So if you really want to understand it even deeper, you can chat with our acne specialist that's in there. You can join the

group calls that go on monthly. And then there's a lot of different amazing guides in there like acne safe makeup and body products. And it's also just a great way to connect with the community and share resources of other people that are working to clear their skin through these really bio-individual reasons that are going on in the body. Oh, it's so brilliant what you are both doing and also so life-changing. I mean, I bet you get emails just constantly of people whose lives you've really, really changed. It must be amazing. Yeah, I got a really nice note. I actually have it on my desk, but it's from someone who said that she finally decided to get married because she had been with her fiance for a long time, but she didn't want to plan the wedding because her skin was still

so terrible. And then we got her clear. And then that's like why she decided to finally get married. And she like sent us a picture of them. And it's just like the sweetest thing. It's just, yeah, relieving suffering is our main goal. I love that so much. And I love a picture of them. And it's just like the sweetest thing. It's just, yeah, relieving suffering is our main goal. I love that so much. And I love what you both do. And I didn't know about your membership. I think that's incredible. And I wish when I was in my early twenties,

this kind of thing existed because I feel like it was just throwing everything at the wall and hoping something worked. So I absolutely love that you're doing it. I love that you've got that resource. So for someone that is completely brand new to your brand, would you recommend if they were going to dive in the first place to start would be the supplement? Would it be the clear set that you mentioned? What's like the first point that they should hit with your brand? The first thing is to know what's causing the problem because you can change a bunch of stuff, but say it's your makeup that's actually really breaking you out or your sunscreen,

right? You need to know what's causing the problem so you know what to switch, especially if you're on a budget or you're weary to just switch everything all at once. If you take our skin quiz and you check all of your current products for pore cloggers, you literally just copy paste the ingredients into it. It could not be easier. You don't even have to learn how to pronounce any of them. Like it'll just tell you in red if there's something in that deck that's breaking

you out, right? It's been four minutes doing that and you learn like, oh my God, it's been my lotion this whole time, right? So that's step one. That and the quiz, you'll get a huge lay of the land. Like, okay, this is what's likely happening, especially if you're overdoing it on certain supplements like B12, which is just huge. Everyone's doing B12 and it breaks everyone out, especially the hormonal region. And people just think it's their hormones, right? So it goes over everything like that, guides you on how to check your products. And then from there, you have your action point. You're like, okay, I need to switch out my moisturizer and my sunscreen, or like, I'm not exfoliating enough. I do need the whole kit.

And then if you think your acne, you know, if it flares up a lot during PMS, which is extremely common, or you feel like you're too oily or that your hormones are out of whack, definitely get the supplement because then you're addressing internal and external and acne is internal and external. So yeah, I do most everyone is on the kit, our sunscreen and the supplement. I love it. Thank you both so much. This has been so fun to dive into your business. And I'm so grateful that you've been so open. Where can everyone find you both find clear stem take the quiz, you can find us across every platform clear stem skincare and clear some skincare.com right at the top, you just click take the quiz, it's free gives you all that amazing info Danielle referenced. And then Danielle's Instagram is Danielle the acne guru.

And mine is Kaylee Christina. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you.