the bossbabe podcast - 6. Turning Pain into Profit and Building a Multi Million Dollar Empire With Deliciously Ella

Episode Date: March 27, 2019

In this week’s episode, Danielle interviews blogger turned multi million dollar business owner, Deliciously Ella!  Ella explains how she grew a simple blog to 130 million hits by overcoming her own health journey to now pitching her business to Whole Foods and Starbucks. She shares how she turned adversity into opportunity, a negative into a positive, and the 3 key things you need to do in order to build a business.  Ella chats openly about finding your why, failing forward and how she switched from a victim mindset to a growth mindset. She also shares her morning routine, and how she still deals with imposter syndrome and criticism. 

Music Opportunities don't just come to you, they don't grow on trees. Opportunities will present themselves to you and the answer is whether or not you jump in and you take them and you're prepared to take that risk. If you don't have that strong sense of why, when things do feel too much, when you do feel emotionally burdened, stressed, whatever it is, it's so easy to give up. You've got to fundamentally think that what you're doing is incredibly valuable and important. Hey, and welcome to this episode of the Boss Paid Podcast with myself, Dania. A couple of months ago, I had the honor of sitting down with the extremely talented and successful Ella Mills, founder of Deliciously Ella. Now, if you're based in the UK, there is no way you won't know who this woman is. And her brand has

grown so much in the last four years that even if you aren't UK based, if you are foodie, you'll know who she is. Because Ella is an award winning New York Times cookery author and entrepreneur. She is a champion of plant-based living. And all started with the blog DeliciouslyElla.com, which has in the last four years had over 130 million hits. Ella has built an empire around her brand. Her food product lines are stocked in thousands of stores across the UK. She has not only created a huge social media following, but has created a number one app, a podcast, and a deli. So the boss babe quote that I want to share to reflect this episode today is, I am not what happened to me. I am what I choose to become. Because whilst Ella is hugely successful now, you will hear in her story that Deliciously Ella was actually born

out of less than desirable circumstances. But Ella chose to switch her mindset and Deliciously Ella was actually born out of less than desirable circumstances. But Ella chose to switch her mindset and see why this was happening for her rather than to her. So this episode is for anyone out there who is looking to make a change in their life, big or small, but is ultimately ready to take on a growth mindset. I hope you enjoy it. A boss babe is unapologetically ambitious and paves the way for herself and other women to rise, keep going and fighting on. She is on a mission to be her best self in all areas. It's just believing in yourself. Confidently stepping outside her comfort zone to create her own vision of success. Thank you so much for joining me Ella. I am so excited to hear where did it all begin?

It's such an accident and I have this terrible habit of when someone asks me that question answering it in like 30 minutes so I will try not to do that interrupt me at any moment but basically it was all super unintentional. I was not ambitious in any shape or form like I never ever ever had big hopes myself or thought I would be particularly successful in my career and as a result I never really pushed myself didn't have a kind of huge amount of confidence and all these things and then at the end of my second year at uni out of nowhere I got really sick and I spent about four months in NARF hospital and I was then diagnosed with something called postural tachycardia syndrome and it affected the workings of my autonomic nervous system so I couldn't regulate my heart rate properly my blood pressure I had

lots of digestive issues I had chronic fatigue I had secondary infections and I literally couldn't get out of bed a lot of days I could barely walk down the street and the issue is characterized by when you sit down your heart rate is normal when you stand up it's 180 190 beats per minute so that happens within seconds and you can imagine that obviously you've got the risk of blacking out but then also you're like so dizzy you feel like your head's not connected to your body so yeah and then things like brain fog and all kinds of sort of secondary issues so after about four months I was put on all these medications I was 21 and I was already on all these steroids, I was 21. And I was already on all these steroids. And my doctors saying, oh, you need beta blockers. And, you know, I'm

literally having to make like an Excel spreadsheet for something. And only time I have ever done that for all the meds that I'm taking. And I got really depressed. And I really struggled to kind of reconcile what was happening. And instead of kind of, I guess, facing up to it in any shape or form, I just really hid away from it for the first year. And I just watched the Kardashians, to be honest about it. And all the Grey's Anatomy and like all kinds of shows. And I sat in bed and I ate a lot of pick and mix. And I honestly, I felt quite sorry for myself and I felt really alienated. And, you know, I would every now and again try and kind of bring myself back in with my friends. But I couldn't do anything that they were doing.

I physically wasn't able to. And then I'd like sit and have a tea with them and they'd be all talking about what they did last night and how funny that this person did this with this person. And I was like, well, I can't leave the house. So like that makes me feel really crap, basically. I just really made myself quite a victim in it to be honest and then after about a year I hit a real rock bottom and I just I guess it was the first time I'd had an honest conversation with myself and you know I do think for any change to happen you have to be honest with yourself and I was honestly like look I'm not really trying like yes I'm doing

everything that my doctor told me but no am I doing anything extra to help no have I even looked into it no like do I have a positive mindset for this no and so I was like okay look there must be other things I can do on top of what I'm already doing so I started researching and I started coming across all these people who had helped all kinds of different issues through diet and lifestyle nutrition nutrition. And I thought, well, to be honest, what have I got to lose in trying? I had loads of digestive issues from this. And I was like, well, maybe I will even help those and that would be nice. I couldn't cook.

I could make pasta. You know, I could pour pasta into a pan, put water in and stir in sauce. And that was about as good as I got. And I also was like a full Ben and Jerry's like Harry Bow pick a mix kind of girl I did not like fruits and vegetables I just assumed it was all rabbit food I was just not really interested so those were two kind of fundamental obstacles to wanting to change the way I was eating and the way I was living and a girlfriend of mine said well why don't you do it as a blog and this was 2012 I didn't honestly really know what a blog

was it was still which is crazy to think now you know really not that far on but and now it's so commonplace it's like an official job title to be a blogger but at that point it was still pretty unknown anyways I was like okay cool so she sent me up on wordpress and I've since got married and so I've changed my name to Mills but my maiden name was Woodward and ellawoodWoodward.com didn't exactly have like, oh, you know, let's be honest, it doesn't have a whole load of magic to it. It doesn't have the ring. No, it doesn't really have the ring. So the aim is to make broccoli delicious.

So let's just call it Deliciously Ella. And so literally overnight, the blog was born and I never intended it's become a brand or a company. Like we've got over 40 people that work for us. I could never in a million years would have imagined that but I just started it with like yeah personal goal and I started sharing it and then I shared it with friends and family and they shared it with friends and family and it grew really slowly you know the first six months it had 100,000 hits but then in the second six months I had 900, 000 so you know really started to grow

and the same girlfriend said oh this really cool thing called instagram you should get on that which is again so funny and like retrospect that it wasn't a thing so I was like okay cool so I started on instagram and that really propelled it and then yeah then somehow we got up to 130 million about four years later so it then went on pretty intense trajectory growing but you know honestly it's a right time right place kind of situation so I'm really interested to know I think it's fair to say when you started this journey you probably had a little bit of a fixed mindset so like that whole victim mode like the what is happening to me how did you switch that to have a growth mindset where you're actually like do you know what I'm gonna look into

this I'm gonna to look into this. I'm going to take control of this. I'm not settling for it. What was the final trigger? It's a really, really good question. And the honest answer is I'm not 100% sure. I think what it was for me was just for a long time I just lived in denial with it. And I was kind of like, wouldn't own up to the reality of what the situation was. And I would always look for someone else for the answer I was like well my doctor's got to solve it

and just kind of I guess just would not internalize the solution in any shape or form it was always up to someone else as you said it's quite victim mode you know why is it happening to me poor me this is so unfair and I guess it was just a realization at a certain point I think it was like my boyfriend at the time was amazing and I really was in love with him and I remember looking at him and just being like what are you doing you know in the nicest possible way this is not fun for you I am not fun right now I can't do anything anything. You know, and he was amazing. But I think it was almost looking at him and looking at my mum, who were the two people I kind of really let in on this journey,

and realising that this was not fair on them. And these are the two people at the time that I cared about most in the world. And I just sort of thought, you know, this is not making them happy. And my mum has always said, you're only as happy as your least happy child yeah I also heard that on the Kardashians the other week

I think it's a well-known expression but she certainly lives by it you know she's a really kind of dedicated mother and I I think I just started to understand that whilst my mental health had got to a point that I didn't really care at all about myself anymore you do realize you're having an impact on other people I think that's really powerful when you are deciding to do anything that's challenging sometimes it's easier to let go of your dreams when they're just your dreams but if you understand how they affect the people that you love it's almost like a bigger push to 100% get stuff done because we're much better at caring about other people than we are

about ourselves and then I started doing this research and I started becoming interested and then so I started buying every book watching every documentary and the more I started to understand the more I wanted to do it because then I started to read all about like how my body works isn't like how the human body works. And it was like, right, okay, well, you know, these are how all these amazing systems that are so amazing in our bodies work, but they need X vitamin, X mineral, you know, to make these processes happen. Okay, right, well, the vast majority of these are coming from plants.

Like I'm probably eating like my five portions of fruit and veg a week, a month rather than a day. Like I am not filling my body with all the things that it needs to make these things happen so again I think for me then what was in terms of step two to make the change what was helpful was to understand the why and I really am a massive believer in that in like personal professional goals like just generally in life you know we were talking when I came in just now and I was like I'm so stressed and you come back to why am I doing it well I'm I'm doing it because like, I really started to

understand why eating well matters. And I started to really care that I did it for that reason. And I really care about giving that as a resource to other people because I think it matters. If you don't have that strong sense of why, when things do feel too much, when you do feel emotionally burdened, stressed, whatever it is, it's so easy to give up. You've got to have a really deep why and biggest believer in it. Totally, totally get that. I completely agree because I think that why is a real driver. Like that sits behind everything when you're up late at night or you're not settling well because you're stressed. And when you have a strong why and a strong pull it just gives you that extra energy to really dig deep when you need to so hello I want to just take you back a little bit to

first starting your blog so you were feeling really unwell you were starting looking into how you could be proactive and make yourself better you started your blog and what did you start putting on there was it just recipes or did you start talking about yourself how did it just begin it was just recipes I did an about section which I was really hesitant to do actually but the friend of mine who introduced me to WordPress was like honestly you need to put it because you need to explain why you're doing this because as well like it was all plant-based food you know it's all about you know celebrating the broccoli and you know back in 2012 again like plant-based, vegan, et cetera. It wasn't cool. It wasn't mainstream. It wasn't trendy, was it?

No. And so she was like, you know, it's quite random and weird what you're doing. You know, you need to explain, like, why, like, what's the authenticity behind it. So I wrote the about page. And it was honestly the first time I'd kind of, like, written down about my illness and, you know, why I was feeling what I was feeling. And I think although that was just the about section, it wasn't, like, the crux of the blog and the content on it. And same with social media has always been kind of recipes or just like general kind of natural living, plant based living.

It was still quite powerful for me to kind of, I guess, that sense of openness and honesty. And I actually think in retrospect, it was the most unbelievable cornerstone for the brand. And I don't know if we would have grown in the same way without it because I think it gave an authenticity and a genuineness to what we were doing that you can't manufacture that and I guess at this point it wasn't a business right it was just like no you're just doing a blog and yeah you're almost therapeutic totally it's exactly what it was it was a hobby for myself and myself only that was completely the intention so how long did that go on like how long was it like a hobby for until you were like oh hang on a minute maybe this could be something yeah it was about a year and a half I'd say

so the first year when we then hit the million mark, which happened pretty much on the one year birthday, was when I was like, OK, wait a second. This isn't just me. There is something here. And I started to think, OK, I could probably have a career in this. But to what extent the career was, you know, what the career was, I wasn't sure. You know, I thought, do I want to train as a nutritionist and just work as a nutritionist one-on-one with patients and then I started my social media and it was on Instagram that people then started saying oh would you do cooking classes would you do workshops would you do supper clubs would you do brunch clubs so I then started doing those and I guess that was step two bring it to life and making a bit of a business and from that I then invested that money into an app and then the app came out

beginning 2014 and that went to number one overnight in the iTunes store, solely through our community online. No PR, no marketing, nothing. No spend behind it. And that was the moment where I was like, okay, there's really something here. Like I can really make something from this. And so what timing was the app?

So not the first year, into the second year? In second year, yeah. Incredible. And what's on the app? The original app was into the second year in second year yeah incredible and what's on the app the original app was just incredibly simple like it's very basic recipe app and then we are just in the process of building so it's launching kind of end of january beginning feb 2019 a completely new app which is going to be amazing there's some yoga moves on there is it there's some yoga moves yes honestly i think the apps like if there's one piece of our business that kind of symbolizes how much I've learned is the app you know just to give an example like as I think I said at the beginning like I didn't

have a huge amount of kind of confidence or ambition in what I was doing and so I wanted to build this app but I was embarrassed to go to people and ask for advice because I was like they're just going to dismiss me you know I was so young I was like 22 had no idea what I was doing I'd created a name for myself called delicious niella it's been embarrassing and I was you know sharing the wonders of kale and turmeric online you know it's pretty pretty niche and I was quite embarrassed to go to people and say like I've got this idea I think it could be really cool. Will you give me some advice? And there were so many people I could have asked, but I didn't ask anyone. And I found this guy and he did the app and I just trusted him.

I just never even thought because I just didn't know to ask about like a contract or something. Anyway, it turns out it wasn't until 12 months ago that we even owned our app officially because he had created no contract with me but a separate contract with a coder I thought he was coding it so the coder owned the code obviously I owned the content but he owned the code which is like a fundamental part of the app I had no idea when I needed to move away from him tried to move away and realized I couldn't take the app with me it just shows you though sometimes you don't know what you don't know no exactly but I was too embarrassed I thought people would dismiss me as not worth their time so I was embarrassed to say like what

questions should I ask is there anything I need to know do you still feel like that now because I feel like sometimes even as you grow even as you create big businesses sometimes there's always insecurities yeah I definitely definitely do still feel like that if I'm completely honest I mean much less so like not to that extent obviously but I do still 100% get nervous or embarrassed or worried about what people think and you know that they'll dismiss it and things like that and then again without you know I'm like a creative person I really don't have like a brilliantly strategic mind in the sense of like understanding cash flows and all the spreadsheets my husband's my business partner and our now CEO and like that's

his job and my job's brand and it works brilliantly and I love working that way but again I never thought about that with the app so I was like okay I literally plugged a number out of thin air and I was like we're gonna charge 2.99 it's a completely random decision and it didn't work as a model because the app's been phenomenally successful like it's been number one in the iTunes food and drink chart for most of its life which is over four and a half years now so it's pretty good that's pretty awesome but someone bought the app back now. So it's pretty good. That's pretty awesome. But someone bought the app back in 2012 and it's been updated continuously at vast expense. It's incredibly expensive to update an app throughout that whole time without ever paying a penny more.

Yeah. It's not a very sustainable model. Yeah. So I guess the app's the ultimate symbol of how much I've learned and understood. So our new app, for example, is going to be 99p a month. So it's a subscription model, which is what it has to be to be able to afford to do the content updates. But for that, the amount of content you get is literally like 100 times. You know, we're going to have weekly yoga videos, weekly recipe videos. We're starting with over 400 recipes and then you'll get a new recipe every single week we've got shopping lists we've got meal planners it's literally like everything allows you to email us ask questions like it's so much more than an app and it's like a third of the price of a cup of coffee so in terms of value for money it's unbelievable but it actually again first of all

we own it brilliant um but second of all it's built on a model that's actually planned out and fleshed out and makes sense and when you start something we talked about this as well just before we started recording like you just make a lot of mistakes and you know the app it certainly wasn't a mistake it's been a really brilliant part of the business but it's not something that I at the time again because I never thought it would be a success I never looked at what like the 10-year plan could be for it let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite all-in-one platform Kajabi you know I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity which I love not to mention our team couldn't

be happier because now everything is in one place so it makes collecting data creating pages collecting payment all the things so much simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and Kajabi has really helped us do that this year. So of course I needed to share it here with you. It's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business, you know, get rid of the complexity and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible I definitely recommend Kajabi to all of my clients and students so if you're listening and haven't checked out Kajabi yet now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim

your 30-day free trial that's kajabi.com slash Boss Babe to claim your 30-day free trial. That's Kajabi.com slash Boss Babe. I think that's really interesting though when you're starting businesses and growing them is almost you have to jump feet first into things at times. And yes, you might make mistakes, but would you be in the position you are now if you hadn't have done the app? And yes, okay, maybe it wasn't the best financial model um and there were mistakes along but I question sometimes whether if you hadn't made those mistakes and this goes with all of us if you hadn't made those mistakes would you be

where you are now it's interesting isn't it about failing forwards totally and oh I think you've got to do it 100% like ultimately also it's hard to know what you don't know when you're starting because you don't really know anything I think now I know what I don't know then I guess that's what changes in my confidence like I'm very aware of what I know where my skills are what questions I can ask but I'm also very aware of let me invite this member of my team or Matt or whoever to the meeting let's all discuss this together because because this is my strong point. This is not my strong point. I'm not completely clued in on X, Y, or Z. Let's all discuss this together. And I think now I have the confidence to hold my hand up and say, this is my area.

This is not my area. And I think that's been a really, really big part of my learning. But I think it's, I mean, it depends at what point you start your business but I think especially if you start your business relatively early on I do think it's really hard to know what you don't know and actually it's counterintuitive because it's not what I did but actually anytime someone asks for advice my biggest advice would be not to some extent to jump straight in because it's incredibly risky like I look at my journey in my career and I think I've been you know touch wood unbelievably lucky that was an unbelievable money maker to start with that's what allowed us to fund the build of the first deli to start a products business

it's just five years on those customers are now not so lucrative are you lucky though or is it that you were prepared for opportunity and you went out there looking for things do you know I think it's a complete mixture of the two I completely agree with you you can't just sit at home on the sofa and expect to be lucky you can win the lottery yeah that's very lucky but otherwise no you can't sit at home or sit at a desk doing the same thing every single day and expect an opportunity to come to you opportunities don't just come to you they don't grow on trees it's just not true what opportunities will present themselves to you and the answer is whether or not you jump in and you take them and you're prepared to take that risk and like everyone would say like when you're gonna get a job when's the job coming and you know everyone was like Ella you've known your husband for

no not my not my he's my husband now but like we met we moved in together after a week we started we were engaged after three months we were working together after four months it's nuts and people were like what are you thinking you just knew and I was like look I just know I know this is the right thing but also like I want an interesting life. And like an interesting life doesn't come from just sitting. And like, you know, we were in the US last week because we're looking at maybe launching our products business over there. And it was an exhausting week, like seven flights in seven days. Like it was back to back and we were starting at like 4.30 in the morning because we were doing calls and stuff for the team over here. And when we landed and I was like, gosh, it's nice to be home.

And for a minute I was like, you know, are you sure this is an opportunity that we should explore? Is this a good idea? And again, Matt was like, well, if it was easy, everyone would do it. And I think that's true. If it was easy, we would all have multi-million pound businesses. If it was easy. It's not easy.

And I think it's super important to be honest about that. Running our business is not easy. It's incredibly interesting. I think it's super important to be honest about that running our business is not easy it's incredibly interesting I wouldn't trade it for anything I feel unbelievably grateful for the opportunity that it's given me in my life but it's really hard and you have to make choices you shouldn't see your choices as sacrifices but you do have to make choices like I do not have a social life and I don't mean to say that in this way of self-pity or self-deprecation or to make anyone feel sorry for me or like to sound like a complete loser, although I probably do.

There'll be many listeners feeling the same. Yeah, like if you have a responsibility, like you have a responsibility and it's the same thing. If you have an opportunity, you have an opportunity. The opportunity isn't going to come around again. So you're going to take it or you're not going to take it. What do you think it takes to have a successful business? What are like the three key things you'd say it takes I think you have to have a kind of almost blind and naive sense of optimism like I'm thinking that is that is so true really

true because it comes back to the same thing like if everyone thought it was possible to do x y or z well then it would have been done so you're no different to everyone else so you've got to believe that you can do something that no one else can do that takes blind naive optimism it does completely and particularly when i think when you voice it yeah a lot of people will just look at you and be like really you're off your trolley like that's not gonna happen how did you find the support in the early days of that? When you started seeing the vision for Deliciously Ella, when you were like, hang on a minute, I could turn this into a business. I envisage an app, envisage projects. Who was there at that point saying, don't do it? But who was there who was saying, do do it?

I think most people said, don't do it it but I think the do do it honestly so much of it for me was our readers and I guess creating a business when you already have a brand is a lot easier slightly cheating the system because you've got hundreds of thousands and now millions of people saying I want it it gives you confidence in doing it but I think it was also for me knowing I wanted to do something differently with my life I don't want to go to an office job every day and report to a boss I just don't I just don't so if I don't want to do that I've got to find something else don't I so what are the two other traits that you think other than complete naivety um so I do think that's very important I think the second

thing is to have and it's a bit cheesy but I think you have to have a really genuine sense of authenticity and vision and your why. And I know we just, we talked about why a little bit earlier, but like, I think, I don't think you can achieve anything if you don't know why you're doing it. And I think that goes across the board.

It's why things don't work, you know, and it can't just be to make money. Like that's not a why. It really isn't a why. It can be part of it, but it's not a why it really isn't a why it can be part of it but it's not a why no you've got to fundamentally think that what you're doing is incredibly valuable and important whether other people think that or not doesn't matter you have to believe so deeply so intrinsically that it is fundamental for the world that you

do what you do there was a research paper done wasn't there that is if you earn over something like seventy thousand dollars a year I mean the paper's a couple of years old now you're no more happier and it was about a sliding scale of happiness and actually when you get to a certain point wherever you are in the world when you get to a certain point financially money doesn't buy you happiness and so like you you say, it's what that purpose is. Yeah. Like really knowing in your core why you get up every day. Totally. And like, when your alarm goes off very early, and when you work very late, and when you, you know, we cancelled five holidays in the first 18 months of working together because different things came up. And like, you know, we were going to Paris for our first year wedding

anniversary, and we're literally on our way to the Eurostar. And we a call being like Tesco changed the date of launch for the cereals like we need to sign them off by Monday so we spent our anniversary weekend of our first wedding sorry our first wedding our first wedding our first anniversary of our wedding in a port cabin with you know our manufacturers just eating kilos and kilos and kilos of granola and like you have to be willing to do that and know why you're doing it because if you don't know why you're doing it you're like I'm sorry it's my first wedding anniversary it's a really special thing it's not something I get back I booked this trip I paid for this trip I am going and you have to be willing to be like no turn around like we're not going yeah and like that

for us was a split second decision and has Matthew always been really supportive that I know he came into the business yeah you hadn't did you say four months that you've been together no so yeah we we started working together three years ago when we'd been together for four months yeah and so has he always been really supportive of the business because he's been in it like how has that relationship yeah I think I'm very lucky to work with him. A, I don't know how we would personally make it work. I think it would be really challenging because we're so committed to it. And like, ultimately, it's our kind of top priority.

It's like a baby. Yeah, totally. You know, we have such understanding of the other person if they have to do X, Y, or Z and can't do something else because of the business. And that happens all the time. so I think that's really important but I think also for me and I'm the first person to say it and some people do say like so self-deprecating it's not about supporting women but like I did not have the confidence to build the size business that we have so far and

hopefully will continue to do without him I don't think there's anything wrong with saying that. I think everybody, like you touched on earlier, one of the strengths of being a entrepreneur and a successful entrepreneur is knowing what your genius zone is and admitting where your strengths aren't. Yeah. And I think that's why, you know, partnerships can work so incredibly well.

Working with Natalie is exactly the same. She has different strengths to me and likewise I have different strengths to her and think if you can find that person and if you find that in your lifelong partner as well how incredible I completely agree with you like I'm a massive believer in partnerships and like no one is good at everything no one is amazing at managing a cash flow, creating a P&L, organizing all sales, looking after marketing, creating like interesting creative strategies, content, sales, and it goes on and on and on. Like nobody is the best graphic designer and Excel modeler. Left and right brains here. Exactly. And no one has the ability, even if you naturally have the ability to be incredibly talented in all those like and no one has the ability even if you naturally have

the ability to be incredibly talented in all those areas no one has the time to hone all the skills so don't be embarrassed to say I'm not very good at that because you've spent all your time working on something else it's not embarrassing I agree and it takes a lot of confidence to own your flaws and your weaknesses but I think once you do that... It's a game changer. Completely game changer. Once you can say, actually, I don't know this, I'm going to ask for help. It just is a way to really, really lift any business.

Totally. But it also then gives you the space to grow your side of things as well. Rather than wasting your time trying to do something that you're not really excelling at. Let someone else do it, excel in it. Give them autonomy, give them space space and then you spend your time doing that in the other side of

the business and then it comes together and you can grow twice as fast yeah because I have taught some of our other clients about this because we were chatting that actually when you try and do those things that you're not good at it's actually costing your business because you're spending way longer than you should be doing it and you're probably not doing that great a job about it so if you just outsourced it and then went to the stuff that you were good at and then brought it all together totally i'm a big believer in that completely so we've touched on how the blog started the growth of the blog the app let's talk about the product side of the business when did that start and how's that grown? So that was two years old so we launched that middle of 2016.

And just tell our listeners like what products that you have? All our recipes are developed from the blog and so we started with our energy ball which was like one of the very first recipes so the whole concept. Which I love I have to say. Thank you thank you cacao one is like so good yeah that's everyone's favorite so everything we do is plant-based no additives no preservatives no flavorings nothing and so like the cacao is actually like dates almonds almond butter cacao coconut oil pinch of salt that's it so we did our energy balls we launched them into starbucks waitrose etc etc, etc. Okay, I'm going to ask, what were the pitches like for that?

How did you even get your foot in the door with some of these companies? To be honest, again, that's when I come back to working with Matt, it's a game changer for me because I was nervous to approach them. I wasn't nervous to approach Whole Foods because we'd done stuff with them with the books and they're a great fit. But approaching Starbucks, petrified. Never would have done that on my own never ever ever because i just assumed they'd laugh us out the room whereas they like we want to stock it we want to stock it tomorrow so what would you say to people who have got products and they want to get into some of these

big companies how do they even go about that is it something they put a pitch together and then start ringing around is it something they work with who has these contacts where would you even start well it depends what you're making and it depends who you're selling it to to be honest but in terms of a food product i think you've got to create something that has a usp you know it's got to have that unique selling point it's really important but most of all you've got to understand that it's got to work for the person you're selling it to supermarkets for example like they're one in, one out. For ours to go in, something else comes off the shelf. Really? Interesting.

Yeah, but same in probably anything you're doing. Because if you're selling clothes to a department store, like the department store has a limited amount of space. So it can't just keep adding and adding and adding and adding and adding. It has to subtract as it adds. And how have you found like working with the big players? Like you say, missing the first wedding anniversary. How has that been?

Because I imagine it's completely different from having your own business. You've got a blog and you've got your app and you're in very much control to then actually supplying these big, big companies. The dynamics can completely switch. It is definitely different. Like when we open our first site, you know, you're in it like it's your cafe it's your space it's your pnl you're

in charge of it if it's not displayed in the way you want it to you can just change it whereas there you've got to work in a big structure and you're not in charge of everything and that's a learning curve for sure because you know you're a tiny part of a massive massive machine you know I remember when we launched like just walking into store after store after store that just didn't have our product you know like we sold out last week so we've had no sales in a week and if you don't hit certain sales you get delisted so it's like well we're not going to hit the sales because you don't have any stock and then you stop for seven weeks and I mean you're now talking about thousands of stores that you're permanently trying to run into like we literally were just like non-stop going around

store after store like please please please I literally gave my number to like you could even know how many store managers have my number or your mobile number yeah like just call me so this is what it takes though isn't it it's the dedication like I don't think people realize this like the dedication and the sacrifices that it does it's a seven day a week 365 days a year you cannot turn it off I think that's what people don't totally appreciate about starting your own business like it's amazing but like we said it's not easy it's really hard it's incredible and for me the benefits outweigh the disadvantages to it but I think we all need to be more honest about how hard it is and what it takes because I think a lot of people go into the entrepreneurial world or business thinking oh yeah I'm just gonna launch the site it's gonna get 130 million views within like two

weeks and oh no hang on it's not I'm going to quit now and really like having the tenacity to keep going one of the ladies in our boss babe community asked me to ask you like how you deal with negative comments on social media she says I always see Ella showing up but how does she deal with it when people are negative because I feel like when you get big there are people who love you. And there's a minority who hate you. But sometimes that minority voice is so much louder than the people who love you. Like, how do you deal with that?

I find it the most telltale thing about how we can see negativity and how easy it is to find negativity over positivity. Because you can have 500 comments and there can be one negative and yet you see the one negative and you don't see the 499 positive. And it's so telling. And I always try and remind myself of that. But I think what I've come to realize

and like I'm a big believer in is I try and like criticism goes in two boxes for me. You've got constructive criticism. Who likes any criticism? Like obviously sometimes you're like, oh, that's really sad. But you know, it can can be really good I got a message on this morning being like you know I've been to Deli Lo's the last few weeks and like sometimes orange juice has ice sometimes it doesn't have ice sometimes you know and I was like yeah fair enough like I know I appreciate that sometimes you want ice it's a random example but you know I'm like that's

really good criticism that's really helpful with that totally because I'm going to just check in with the managers and check that we always serve our orange juice consistently that's really important or like someone was like oh I wasn't sure you know the packet doesn't say like whether you can eat your birch and muesli hot I think you should give more information that you can cook it you know you can definitely cook it like porridge that's really helpful like yes you were disappointed that we didn't give you as much information as you wanted but I can take that away and decide to do it or not. And that's helpful. Or if someone's like,

that recipe was challenging for me or whatever it is. Helpful, really helpful. Whereas when someone's like, yeah, I think you're right, you're getting your marriage, or like, you've got fat, or you don't look good in that dress, or like, whatever, you know.

Do people say that? Sometimes, yeah. But not, I'm super lucky. Like, it's rare rare mostly because it's like a bowl of porridge how much negativity can you have but you know all this person being like I can't believe you didn't eat the bowl you photographed yeah and you're just like I used to get upset about that and I've come to a point where I'm like I just honestly I just don't care like I literally can honestly say couldn't care less because you can't care less. Like you have to put criticism

for the sake of criticism in a separate box. Tom will be like, tag their friend and be like, don't you think she has the most annoying voice ever? Apologize for anyone listening who agrees. But, you know, and you just have to be like, cool. Yeah, can't change it. You'll spite me more annoying. Or when people, you know know say this is too expensive

you know i know like when we launch our new app some people will be like i'm really unhappy about this why can't you keep updating the old app for free and that's a valid point i appreciate why that's coming but it's criticism that we can't really take on board because it's not feasible no and it's the same someone was like it really upsets me that you advertise your products and i was like well do you want free content or not because not to be too sassy about it, but I can't do my job for free. So either I'm going to build Delicious Yellow, I'm going to build a really cool company that helps people live better. And it helps the world because we all need to eat more plant based foods because we desperately need more vegetarianism in our life if we're not going to send the world into a burning inferno. But need it so I want to make plant-based food accessible and I want to build my own brand around that I'm not going to be a marketing vehicle for right I'm not going to sell you a mattress on you know through my I'm going to be an influencer and do like kind of random vehicles of advertising but I am going to build my company I'm going to

be really proud of that so I am going to tell you that I stock products yeah the only way I can continue to share free content is in building my business so if you're not happy about that that's okay I appreciate that but I'm not going to take your criticism on board because it's not possible I can't do my job for free unless I'm a charity you've got to eat right so exactly like it's not possible so either I'm going to get another job and I'm going to close Delicious Ella completely or I'm going to build a company and I'm going to share tons of free resources so like either I can give you an app that has over 400 recipes you get new recipes new videos new yoga videos everything every single week and you're going to pay for that every month less than half to a third depends where you live but you know London about a third of a price of coffee totally I think that's reasonable I feel confident

to hang my hat on that feels unbelievably good value to me. And if you want everything for free, I totally understand why we live in the age of free content, but it's not possible. So I can't get upset about that criticism because there's nowhere to go with the upset. Do you think this has been a personal journey that you've gone through?

Oh my God, I used to cry all the time. I feel like you're so sassy about it now. You're like, right, I've come to peace with this. Totally. I'm owning it. This is what's happening. If you like it, carry on. Again, it comes down to the why.

I guess every day that I've done this, my why's got stronger. And, you know, and now I'm just like, this is what we do. This is why we do what we do. This is what we do. If you love it, I love you for it. And I'm going to support you. This is why I reply to every email while I reply to every Instagram comment like I'm here I'm going to show up for you every day I'm going to answer all your criticism and it's remembering the people that you're helping like to upset those one or two people

you're helping so many more because your purpose and your why and I think just kind of coming back around to that at times and you've got to be confident in it totally you're never going to be able to please everyone exactly and i think what i realized is i'd so much rather be criticized for something for people knowing what they're criticizing rather than people just criticizing you because they don't even know really what it is and i think it's much better to have a really clear sense of why really connect to the people that matter and that care about what you do look after them really nurture them those are the most important people in your journey and if other people don't connect to it that's absolutely fine you just gotta let them go

there is no company in the world that everyone loves like not everyone even loves nike you know it's so true or apple that is so true or vogue you know take like the biggest brands in the world some people will say vogue promotes an unhealthy relationship with your body. Some people will say Nike, you know, sweatshops. You know, there's all these kind of complicated things. Other people will say Apple too expensive. Whatever it is, you're going to find criticisms of companies that are the biggest and best in the world. I think when you start creating polarity, that's when you realize that you are successful.

You're doing well. Yeah, you're doing well because you've got to have the lovers and you've got to have the haters yeah and people care to have the conversation about that so I want to start wrapping up our interview with a couple of final questions so I know a lot of our listeners always love to know how you start every day morning routines are a big part of boss babe like how do you start your day okay I love a routine yeah I love a routine so I'm quite an early riser like I'm definitely a morning person so I'm normally up at about six and then get up I've got this new slightly weird thing where I have celery juice first thing every morning yeah I have to admit I saw her on Instagram I'm just gonna be honest about that one as well and people are like it's been amazing for digestion

energy blah blah blah I was like you know what what have I got to lose I'm gonna try it it's really good is that yeah it doesn't taste that good it's fine it's totally drinkable so I made my celery juice and then just kind of get myself together and then I do yoga either 6 30 to 7 30 or 7 to 8 every day it's like a complete non-negotiable for me and I'm like really militant about it it's the only thing that I won't move someone be like you have a really important meeting and I'm like nope that is I've got yoga I just need it and I again like I'm the first to admit like I need some routine and some constant in my life. I need a tiny bit of moment for myself. And I try not to turn my phone on now. I charge my phone in our living room. I take my phone with me to yoga, like just in case, you know, we're all glued to our phones. But in case of emergency, in case where I get like murdered and the fire's on the walk, I don't know why I take it. But you never know. But I don't turn it on. And then I come home, take a shower, get ready to go but I don't turn it on and then I come home take a shower get ready to go to work and then turn it on and I really appreciate that like I need that bit of time and then I normally so this is now like between 8 and 8 30 depending which class I've got to

and then I try and have like a blast for an hour of to-do lists and emails where we just like whack through everything and then I can go into my day and like I'll have a day like this where it's literally being like back to back to back to back to back like I haven't had one minute since 9 30 but it means like you're ready for it because you've cleared your inbox you've got your to-do list done and then you can kind of power through so I find like an hour for myself a kind of power hour work, time to make my celery juice is important. Yeah, super good for productivity. It's like 52 minutes is like the perfect focus time.

Interesting. Yeah. I care for my time more in tomorrow. Yeah, exactly right. And so what advice would you give to yourself if you were to start this journey again? Have more confidence. Yeah, definitely.

A hundred percent. I've not had enough confidence for myself I think now it's like I think I'm coming as you said I think I'm coming to like a sassier moment now where I feel I feel comfortable in what I'm saying and I like stop really kind of minding people not liking me for me and that's really okay but I really struggled to start within like standing up for myself in saying what I believed in having confidence in my business and putting myself out there and it's taken me a long time to get there and it's a work in progress I think you've got to fake it till you make it with confidence for sure I think you're totally right there

confidence is a big game changer and actually a a game changing moment for me was I always thought I was like a bit pathetic and I was a bit hard on myself actually for being quite kind of nervous and shy about the whole thing. And then I read Lean In and, you know, I don't know if you've read it. Yeah, it's a brilliant book. I actually really, really recommend it, even if you don't read the whole thing, just to kind of get a sense of it. It's by Sheryl Sandberg, who's one of the most successful women in the world the CEO of Facebook and what she said which just massively resonated was she then talked about imposter syndrome and how terrified she was and I just remember reading it thinking okay I've got a business that employs one person it's teeny tiny you know and I'm terrified and look at this woman she's put next to Oprah on the most powerful women in the world list you know she is killing it and she's terrified and she feels nervous and she feels like an imposter

so it's normal yeah i mean believing it was normal i felt so much better about owning it you know like not feeling you're on your own and something is powerful i think and just realizing it's not an alien thought you don't need to be hard on yourself for feeling it it's very normal it's very common in women it's okay and actually like that was a really really great moment for me understanding that it was normal so then I started talking about it like online and just to friends and I don't know anyone who hasn't agreed Ella I feel like it's the perfect way to end this interview everyone needs to have more confidence and take charge of that and really own it right and just know that it's okay not to have confidence all the time and that no one that gives you confidence every time so every time you walk into a room feeling nervous probably one of the people you're meeting feels nervous too yeah like if not more than one like exactly at

least one and every successful person in the world has failed a hundred times and they've been petrified about it yeah I think that's an incredible way to end thank you so so much for coming in it's been an absolute pleasure

I feel like it's quite better so I love it I love it shared a lot it's been incredible and where can our listeners find you? everything's under

Deliciously Ella like it's you are pretty easy to find it's pretty easy to find but yes also shows Deliciously Ella our apps Deliciously Ella our books Deliciously Ella our products are Deliciously Ella. You are pretty easy to find. It's pretty easy to find. But yes, also shows Deliciously Ella, our apps, our books, Deliciously Ella, our products at Deliciously Ella, our cafes, Deliciously Ella. And in the UK, they're in all these stores. And then hopefully they're going to be in America. Yeah, that's the dream. That'll be amazing. 2019, that's the dream.

I'm sure our listeners will be waiting. Yeah. We've got a big American base. Amazing. Well, hopefully you can support us. Yeah. Thank you so much. If you enjoyed this episode, we would love it if you subscribed and left us a review. Let us know what you enjoyed, what your main takeaways were, and who you'd like to see appear on the show. As a special thanks, we'll send you a copy of our Boss Babe 25. Now, this is an awesome resource. It's the 25 essential things that you need for personal and professional growth. We've included everything from must-have products to books to rituals. This guide literally

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