the bossbabe podcast - 89. How I Went From Working In My Living Room To Selling My Business For $1.2 Billion with Jamie Kern Lima

Episode Date: April 13, 2020

We’re joined by Jamie Kern Lima, American entrepreneur, philanthropist, co-founder and CEO of IT Cosmetics. Jamie has been named as one of the 2019 Forbes’ Richest Self-Made Women, 100 Most Intriguing Entrepreneurs and WWD’s 50 Most Powerful Women in Beauty. Get lost in inspiration as Jamie shares her incredible story of how she grew IT Cosmetics into a top-selling makeup and skincare brand, which she later sold to L’Oréal for $1.2 billion (in cash) making it their largest US acquisition to date and cementing Jamie’s legacy as the first female CEO in L’Oréal’s 100+ year history.  We’re giving you the real behind-the-scenes of what it looks like to go all-in on your dreams and having faith in your vision, even when the world keeps telling you no. Tune in as Jamie lifts the lid on how you can start your product-based business, including actionable tips for finding the right manufacturers and business partners that will save you money and years in developing your business. Follow Jamie Kern Lima on Instagram: @jamiekernlima Get two free months of Skillshare premium membership and receive access to unlimited to over 1000+ classes: www.skillshare.com/bossbabe

For me, the biggest thing was that your gut is better than anyone else's advice. If you allow yourself to get distracted by what your competition's doing or anyone else, and you risk diluting your own secret sauce, your own why, your own authenticity, you're done. Welcome to the Boss Babe podcast, a place where we share with you the real behind the scenes of building successful businesses, achieving peak performance, and learning how to balance it all. I'm Natalie Ellis, CEO of Boss Babe, and your host for this week's episode. And today, I'm also joined by Danielle Canty, my business partner and co-founder of Boss Babe. This week, we're interviewing our dear friend, Jamie Kern-Lima. Danielle and I got to know Jamie during a trip to Puerto Rico earlier this year,

and the three of us immediately clicked. Jamie is the co-founder of It Cosmetics, a brand that I am completely obsessed with and I've been using for years. And she has such an incredibly inspiring story so prepare to get lost in inspiration. In 2016 Jamie sold to L'Oreal for 1.2 billion in cash and we're going to dive into the full story behind the scenes of how she really made that happen. What we love most about Jamie's story is how she was able to take one of her own biggest pain points and that of millions of women around the world and use it to create multi-million dollar beauty brand that actually empowered women. Jamie's path though wasn't always smooth and she definitely hit some obstacles along the way. After having numerous

doors closed on her from people that really didn't believe in what she was doing, persistence finally paid off when she struck the deal of a lifetime. Believing in her why and working hard led her to become the first female CEO in L'Oreal's history. Now I don't want to give too much away but I just know you're going to love Jamie's story and you'll definitely have some amazing takeaways after listening to this episode. So as always take a screenshot and share your biggest takeaways and learnings on Insta stories tagging me at IamNatalie, tag at Danielle Canty and then also you can tag Jamie at at Jamie Kern Lima so with that let's just get started a boss babe is unapologetically ambitious and paves the way for herself and other women to rise keep going and fighting on she is on a

mission to be her best self in all areas it's just believing in yourself confidently stepping outside her comfort zone to create her own vision of success. So there are only five women who have taken a business out of their living room and created a billion dollar company and you are one of them. So I am so, so excited to dive into that whole journey. Jamie, welcome to the podcast. I am so excited to be here. I love both of you. And yeah, thank you for having me. It's going to be amazing. So what's really interesting is, so I had a face peel two days ago. And when I have a face peel, my face just goes crazy red blotches, everything. And you can barely even tell because I'm wearing the CC cream and then the concealer, which is a game changer. It's pink on the bottom and you put it

on. It covers everything. I would not be able to be doing this today had I not be using that. So thank you. Same. I'm also kicked in it cosmetics right now. That's where it's at. How did you come up with this idea or where did your journey begin with this? Well, it's so funny because I never thought in a million years I would create a makeup company or a beauty company. I love other people's stories and I fell in love with like writing in the school paper and that kind of thing. And so I was a journalist and I was anchoring the news, anchoring the morning news. And I thought I was going to do that my whole career. And I started getting these bright red patches on my cheeks, which I learned through the dermatologist as hereditary rosacea,

no cure for it. And my cheeks started getting like bright red and like sandpaper like texture. So I was fine with it, except I would be anchoring the news and under the hot lights. And I would hear in my earpiece from the producer, there's something on your face. There's something on your face, like live in the newscast. And I knew there wasn't anything on my face. I knew that it was the makeup breaking up and then the rosacea coming through. And so it was kind of like this, I guess, story of so many entrepreneurs. It's like they create something because it's sort of like a pain point for them or a problem they can't solve. And they have this kind of like aha moment. Oh, I bet other people out there have the same problem.

And for me, it was I started just spending my whole paycheck on makeup. So I would try like the most expensive department store stuff. And then the most inexpensive that I could find, I would try everything and none of it would cover or it would be like the super thick mask. And at the time, all you saw out there was these sort of like airbrush Photoshop models. So you never even knew by even looking at what's out there, A, if they're even wearing the product and B, if it even works. And I just tried everything, nothing worked. And I thought, okay, there's so many people out there that have different challenges with their skin. They must be frustrated with makeup because they, you know, want to look like themselves, not like they're wearing a mask, but nothing works.

So I just kind of became obsessed with figuring it out. And it was a crazy journey. I thought I've worked hard my whole life. Like I've bagged groceries. I was a Denny's waitress. Like I've worked really hard. But as you two know, I had no idea how hard it would be to be an entrepreneur and to start a business from scratch like in my

living room. It was a really tough start and a tough first three years. So what did that look like to have the idea to then start in your living room? Did you just decide, okay, I'm going to start making these products? What was that? Yeah. So I didn't know anything about the beauty industry and I don't come from it and I didn't know it. And so the first thing I started doing was meeting with different dermatologists and plastic surgeons and trying to figure out, okay, how is it formulated? I started going to trade shows where all the formulators are there or the chemists and like the not fun part of beauty is like the clinical testing and the, you know, just kind of familiarizing myself with how does this all work and how does the third party manufacturing work, that kind of stuff. And then on my honeymoon flight to South Africa, wrote the business plan with my husband,

Paulo, and so not romantic. You guys will so relate to this, right? When you're like all in, all of a sudden on a business idea and you're there with your partner. So got back from the honeymoon, quit our jobs. And I just thought like, okay, I'm going to use like every penny of my savings and our savings, and we're going to make the best product we can possibly make. And it's just going to sell. Like I just thought, oh, there's such a need for it. It's just going to sell. And so from the moment I quit my job and poured all my money into the product, into the R&D and all that, I had no idea it would be at least over, over three years before I'd be able to pay myself.

And it was so hard because we created this great product. And I mean, the packaging wasn't so great. I hired, you know, when you're starting out, you just got to figure it out, right? And then you're like, oh, wait, I can't afford to hire anybody. And so everything you have to learn, you have to figure out. And so thank God for Google, of course. But like, even with Google, it's hard sometimes. So I hired the guy that does like the crime scene maps on the TV news from my news station. You know, where it's like, the murder happened here. Like that was that was the only person I knew who worked in graphic design at the time.

So he would bring his computer to my living room every morning at, like, 4 a.m. before he went to his full-time real job. And we designed packaging. We just sat there. And I would, like, Google, like, regulatory compliance, FDA labeling laws, like, stuff like that, and just pray and, like, freaking write and create the packaging. And my middle name is Marie. As we grew and grew and I realized, oh, this is going to be a while before I can afford to hire someone, we created an email address for Marie, my middle name.

So it was like Marie at itcosmetics.com. And then she headed customer service, headed PR. So Marie would like – We did that. Oh yeah. I love this. I've never met anyone else that admits this. I had a fake assistant. Shall I ask Natalie and get back to you? I was Natalie. You have to. I fell in love with you to the moment I met you. I have never met anyone who's admitted this before. You had a fake assistant. It's a hack. You have to like think

outside the box. Didn't we have a fake community manager at one point too? Renee. Oh my God, Renee. Renee was never real. Sorry, Boss Babes. She was never real. Yeah, but we needed somebody so we could like remove ourselves from it. And actually like, you know, because when you're first starting out,

and this is the realness behind it. Like when you're starting out, you can't hire everybody. And you cannot have like the luxury. Like, you know, we were in our bedrooms like creating this. It was just like, you know, I'm on one side of the world. Natalie's on another. We're not quite, you know, there's, okay, different continents. But, you know, like that's what was happening.

And we had to create different. And then we were even stressing about the Google domains because you had to pay for them. And we were like, is it worth the $5 a month? Do we have to pay $5 for Renee? Right? I think we're going to have to. Yeah. Okay.

I'm just having a moment because I am realizing like you guys have millions of women in your community. Like I created a billion dollar company and we both are like sharing with everyone the real, I've never had this moment before. And I've done like thousands of press interviews at this point. Like we both did this. I love this because anyone out there who's like, you know, hustling going like, how am I going to do this? And everything looks so – when other people do it, they don't share this real stuff.

It looks like, oh, maybe it's different for them. But like, oh, no. If you rewinded like eight years ago, Marie would be emailing you two going, our founder is available for an interview. Like you'd be like, who is that? Like, right. You hustle to make it happen. 100%. This is exactly what this podcast is about. It's about the behind the scenes. When we started, we really wanted to be about the real behind the scenes, not just like what you see on the front. This is like the behind, like the backstage, like this is what we love sharing. And I want to just pull you back. Like, I love hearing about your story, but I want to understand your mindset at these points because

you've kind of just gone oh yeah like I decided I could see this gap in the market and I knew that this product was going to exist and next minute you're pouring in all your savings and you're leaving your job I would love to know like what was going through your mind at that point were you excited were you happy were you fearful like how did that conversation with your husband go was he supportive you're now going on your honeymoon like that point? Were you excited? Were you happy? Were you fearful? Like, how did that conversation with your husband go? Was he supportive? You're now going on your honeymoon? Like, give us all the things. Like, how was that? So we both went all in. He quit his job as well. And we were just all in. And he really, like, he knows nothing about beauty, but he really believed in me. And I really believed in this idea. And for me, it was like, you know, there's

a lot of talk about your why and like why you do stuff. And for me, that was everything at the beginning, especially, but really through the whole journey. But I, two things. One, I knew there was a need for this product. I knew it would make my life better. So it must be huge for so many other women and men who can't find anything that works for them. But secondly, I wanted to shift my bigger why, and it's always been this way since day one, was to try and shift culture and beauty to be one where it's more inclusive, one where you see images of women who look like you and me and all of us, which is like, okay, every skin tone, every skin challenge, every size, every age. And at the time, you never saw that. You just saw this airbrush Photoshop version of what was called an aspirational model. And so I had this whole vision from the beginning of, oh, you know what? What if I show my bright red rosacea and show how it actually works? And what if I use all different real women? And so I was fired up about that. And I thought at the time

I had the best idea in the world. The problem was no one else thought that for a long time. And that's when it got really hard. So in the beginning, my mindset was like, oh, this idea is huge. And I would imagine it on Sephora store shelves and Ulta beauty store shelves and on QVC. And I'd walk into department stores and I'd be like, we're going to have a counter here. And I would just like envision it. Then when I finally started getting product samples, I sent them to everyone, Sephora, everybody. And it was always a no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I would email, I would get on phone calls. It was like literally a million no's. And that was really hard because the hard thing is when experts that should know, like you trust them to know what's going to work in an industry,

when all the experts are telling you they don't believe in your idea, that's when it got really real and really hard for me because it was like, okay, to not let that, all those no's sort of like translate into self-doubt was really hard. And I mean, it was a lot of no's. And I hustled. Just like you two hustle. I hustled. And we hustled.

You hustled. Yes. And I mean, by the way, we were staying alive like one to three orders a day on our website. That was it, right? And it was like, okay, our office was our living room and we were barely, at one point we got down to under a thousand dollars in our bank account, which was personal and company. And it was hard. And I didn't know what we were going to do. And I remember the first big meeting at Sephora and I'm like, women are spreading the word because they were. Women were starting to post their own before and afters online. And I'm like, your customers are going to love this.

I was pitching my heart out in this boardroom in San Francisco at Sephora's headquarters. And the head buyer at the time just said, if women were talking about this and customers wanted this, I'd be hearing about it. And I'm not. And I remember it was a no. And I remember the elevator ride from the boardroom all the way down to the lobby. And it was a packed elevator. And I just remember like, OK, these are probably all Sephora people around me.

Like, don't cry, don't cry. And I was like, you know, have you ever held back tears and you're like trying to hold it together? And I remember getting to the lobby and the doors opening and I like ran walk in my heels, like to get out and around the corner and just start sobbing because I didn't know how we were going to stay in business. I remember the first time I ever got the head of beauty on a phone call from QVC. And I just like had this vision that, oh my gosh, if all these ads are fake in magazines, I want to go on television live. And this was before Instagram and Facebook Live. Just a few years ago, QVC was really the first to be live 24-7 to 100 million homes. And

people call up and all that. And I'm like, oh my gosh, I want to prove how good this product is. So I want to go live on QVC and take my makeup off and show how it works. And no one had ever done that. And show real women. And I just had this vision. And when I finally got the head of QVC on the phone, a guy that is incredible. He's like a legend in the beauty industry. And he changed QVC from in the past, it was kind of like known as like, buy now and whatever. And he brought in all the luxury brands, all the designer brands. And he created this like multi-billion dollar, like he's a legend. And I remember I got him on the phone and he, his name's Alan. And he said, we've reviewed your products and you're not right for QVC or for our customers.

I'm like, oh, no, no, I am right. You know, and he just sort of put your heart out and he thanked me for loving QVC. But it was like that moment I remember crying myself to sleep like three days. And then, you know, you wake up and you hope it was a dream and then it's not. And it was like, anyways, we not to like give up the end of the story, but when we did get on QVC one day, and when we did create the largest beauty brand in QVC history, which it is, it Cosmetics is to this day, the largest beauty brand in QVC history, he became a great friend, a great champion.

And when he left QVC, we actually hired him on our advisory board. And he is incredible. And so it was like, for all the entrepreneurs out there, when you hear people telling you no, it's like, for me, this was this moment of, oh my gosh, this guy that is amazing, that rejected me is now working for me. It was like, when you stick with your why and you stick with your everything and your heart

and your everything's in the right place and like the right people will come into your life at the right time. Anyways, I'm jumping way ahead, but it was just kind of a cool. Yeah, we're going to rewind you. I love all this. So I think it's really amazing to just share that like vulnerability and just say, look, you know, there were days when I cried for three days straight and there were really

tough times. And I think it's really empowering for us to start like sharing that with everybody. But I want to just take you back for, I know I love to make sure, and that's the same, like we get loads of like actionable takeaways for our listeners. And so when you said you were on the plane and you were on your honeymoon, you were writing that business plan and you'd not been in the beauty industry before, your husband not been in the beauty industry before, like what were some of the first things, like how did you go about exploring that?

I know you mentioned like looking into FDA, but I know one question we get asked a lot by people looking to do product-based businesses is like, how do you even find someone to make it? Like, what does all of that process even look like? If you have that idea, what are the first things that people can start to do to really, and like, what did you do to start finding those people? Yeah. So, and to your question, when you're trying to figure out who makes a product, how can I partner with a manufacturer or any of that? Okay, if I'm going to go deep, I'll go really deep. And you can edit it out if it's too, like, boring.

But some big lessons I learned because companies hold so close. Like, their closest trade secret is who their manufacturer is, right? Like, you don't ever want to give that up. And I learned this lesson the hard way later. If you're doing really well and people know who has your formula, who makes your product, bigger companies will come swoop in, pay a lot more money, and get something that's really hot, even if legally they're not supposed to. And even big companies guard with everything, like who their manufacturers are. So it's really hard to figure that out in the beginning, especially if you don't know

anybody and if you don't have any money. So what I really hard to figure that out in the beginning, especially if you don't know anybody and if you don't have any money. So what I did was a couple of things. I first, by that point, I had been into Sephora a million times and Ulta Beauty a million times, and I knew just about every brand in there, at least what they were called, what brand names were of products. So I cold called every single beauty company in the entire country and asked whoever I could get on the phone, oh, who makes your formulas? No kidding. And so obviously I got hung up on a ton. I got a hold of one girl who now in hindsight, I'm like, oh, bless her heart. She should have probably been fired. And I got a hold of one girl at a very small beauty company

that was sold in Sephora, a brand that was sold there. And she told me, and she said, oh, we use this guy. He's based in New York. And I'm like, oh, thank you so much. So I call that guy based in New York, get a meeting, learn in his showroom, because people's showrooms tell you a lot. And so in his showroom was all the products he makes. So now I know, oh, he makes for this brand, that brand, that product, this product. And one inside tip, too, is whatever industry you're in, when you get a manufacturer that does manufacture for the largest brands, that's actually a really great sign because their regulatory compliance is so strict that you know you've just saved a lot of money, you've

just saved yourself a lot of years and you've jumped and fast forwarded, right? Because they have to manufacture in compliance with those crazy tough regulatory things that are hard to know about when you're small and hard to know about when you're starting out and hard to pay for also. So in his showroom, I saw everyone that he manufactured for and he made our first prototypes. And he still to this day is a partner at Cosmetics. But we have 20 plus manufacturers now in the US, Korea, Italy, everywhere. So the other thing that is like a super unsexy tip, but so helpful. Oh, we love these tips. Okay, good.

Keep them coming. This is great. So no matter what industry you're in, if it is a consumer product. So I would go to these trade shows, but obviously the formulators aren't allowed to tell you who they work with. But what happens is when you go to these trade shows, when you see packaging, you'll see, like, let's say it's a food and beverage. Well, you're going to see the aluminum can manufacturer or the bag manufacturer. They have trade shows for all of those vendors that they want you to hire them. In their booths, they put out all of their products they make. And usually vendors don't care enough to say, don't put my stuff out. It's you, brands don't. So they usually have everything. So you're able to see and ask them,

oh, did you make this? You know, you confirm with them, did you make this? And it's like, oh yeah. And so you know right then and there, okay, they're working with all of these companies. And then that's like, again, fast forward, save yourself a lot of time and a lot of years. And a lot of these trade shows, I mean, there's only a couple of them in beauty, but every industry has them. And they're like the manufacturing trade shows, right? So they're not like Instagrammable, but it's like the behind the scenes operational side of the business. And that can save you so much money and time when you're trying to figure out a space and you don't know anyone in it. So you walk into those booths and you see who they work with.

And that is huge, really in any consumer product space. But I would also imagine any service space too. Let's take a quick pause to talk about my new favorite all-in-one platform, Kajabi. You know I've been singing their praises lately because they have helped our business run so much smoother and with way less complexity, which I love. Not to mention our team couldn't be happier because now everything is in one place. So it makes collecting data, creating pages, collecting payment, all the things so much simpler. One of our mottos at Boss Babe is simplify to amplify and Kajabi has really helped us do that this year. So of course I needed

to share it here with you. It's the perfect time of year to do a bit of spring cleaning in your business, you know, get rid of the complexity and instead really focus on getting organized and making things as smooth as possible. I definitely recommend Kajabi to all of my clients and students. So if you're listening and haven't checked out Kajabi yet, now is the perfect time to do so because they are offering Boss Babe listeners a 30-day free trial. Go to kajabi.com slash boss babe to claim your 30-day free trial. That's kajabi.com slash boss babe. Love that. Yeah, I love that. That is so powerful. There's probably a lot of people listening that just needed that one. Like, that's the one thing I'm looking for. Yeah, right? Because here's what's a little scary about like, yeah, Google's free and you can find

everything on Google, but so many things aren't vetted or fact-checked. And it's hard to know sometimes what you find online is really, you know what I mean? And it's just not so regulated. So really seeing who does it. And the trade shows are pretty cheap to get into and some of them are free. So if you're an entrepreneur hustling, I would definitely check that out. I love that. So I want to jump back into your story because I am bought in. And I want to know, when did you first get your big break or what you felt was a big break, like finally someone saying yes to you? Yeah, it was literally probably the biggest and hardest moment maybe in my life as an entrepreneur. So I had sent our stuff to everyone, but also QVC

and had been told no for years over and over and over and over and over, as I shared earlier with Alan on the phone. And we were down to literally no money. And we were at this trade show. There is a, it's called Cosmetic Executive Women. And it's this like beauty expo in New York City where there's 6,000 women and members. They walk the floor in this huge space. And every brand that's launched a new product that year gets like a three-foot

table and you demonstrate your product. And the whole point of doing it is that all of these attendees vote on your product. And if you win an award, you can sell a lot more product and get more distribution. Your other hope is, oh, there might be stores there that see you and want to carry your product. So I was there demonstrating our concealer at this three foot table and there's like thousands of women walking by. And I see QVC has this massive booth in the background. And I'm like, okay, I just knew I've got to meet someone in person, but you're not allowed to leave your booth. So if you leave your booth, I know because it's very organized. It's a huge, beautiful production. And you know, there's me. And at the time it, beautiful production. And there's me.

And at the time, it was like, oh, there's Givenchy and all the beautiful brands. And I'm like, and I'm at Cosmetics. And no one had heard of us, right? And I'm at this three-foot table. And I'm demonstrating. And I believe you should always be fully present. In this moment, I was not. I don't even know who was coming up to me.

And I was just talking kind like I always am. But all I could think about was was how am I going to get over to the QVC booth and meet somebody? And the booth was, their booth was packed. There were buyers over there and they were swarmed. And I kept like sneaking off, but they were busy. And I kept going back to my booth and sneaking off and just talking to everyone that would stop by. I finally got away, went over and introduced myself to a buyer in the QVC booth. And I'm like, hi. And I was like praying and like shaking. It was total mess. And, you know, mainly because everything was kind of like on the line. I didn't know how we were going to make it. You know what I mean? It was like, and our concealer is amazing. And, you know, and I was talking to her and she

was so kind, gave me her card, said, let's have a meeting. And then I went back to my table and I thought like, okay, like, did she really mean it? You know, some people give you their card and you're like, okay. And so, but I was just like, anyways, I'm kind of just like going back in my head, everything that I wish I would have said, which is not what you should do and whatever at that. And then all of a sudden this woman comes up to me at my three foot table and she introduces herself to me and she says, hi sugar. My name is is Miss Lisa Mason. I'm a QVC show host. And I tried your product earlier. And I was just like, did I meet her early? I think I was so not present. I don't remember talking earlier, but apparently I'd showed her the product,

all these things. I didn't even recognize her. I just must not have been in my head. And she goes, I think your product's amazing. And want you to know I just marched over to our buyer. I made her try your product and I told her our QVC gals would love this product. And I looked at her and I just started crying. And I don't even cry that often. I just start crying. And I think I scared the crap out of her because she's like, oh, honey, honey, oh, oh, oh. I don't have any power.

I don't have it. And I'm like, thank you. Thank you. And long story short, we got a meeting. I flew out to QVC, which is just outside of Philly. And we got a yes. But what came next was like literally the hardest moment as an entrepreneur, which I would never advise doing this. When people give you a purchase order and you're going to front the manufacturing costs and everything for it, there's a famous saying, you should never accept a purchase order. You can't afford to lose.

And with QVC, beauty is consignment. So we had to pay for all the inventory, ship it in, package it, pass all their third-party regulatory, everything. And then you go live on the air. And anything that doesn't sell, you have to take back. And here's the situation. We were only selling like a couple orders a day on our website and we had to manufacture 6,000 units of our concealer to sell in a 10-minute segment or not come back and to hit their sales goal.

And what's tricky about that is if you are live on air in that 10-minute window and you're not doing well in the first minute or two, your clock jumps down to two minutes, right? You're done. Oh yeah. Because every minute of airtime and you're not even just competing with beauty. It's like, oh no, every minute of airtime, if you're not doing well, then Apple iPhone will or Dyson vacuum. It's a lot of pressure, but where the real, the real moment came down to, and really, I think the biggest life-changing lesson for me as an entrepreneur, we all know what we believe in our gut. And we all say, oh, this is my why.

I'm going to stick with this. But then when real business happens and when you're under massive pressure, that's when it's tempting to become incongruent with your morals, your beliefs, your why, your everything. And what had happened, you guys, is we got one shot. And so there's a lot of different consultants. They don't work at QVC, but they have these businesses and they help so many people become successful selling on television.

Because it's like a formula. It's like a foreign language I describe it as. And so we went with consultants and all of them were saying the same thing. And I understand why, but they were saying, okay, to do well selling in beauty on QVC, here's what you need to do. This type of a segment using this type of model. And I'm like, okay, that's what everyone else does, A. And B, I created this for women that actually have real skin issues, not for just models that don't have any skin challenges at all. And I'm like, and they go, okay, and we would fight about it. And they want us to win. They wanted me to win, but this had never been done before. And I'm like, I want to take my makeup off and show my

bright red rosacea and show live. And I kept thinking about, you know when your gut tells you one thing but experts tell you another? It was like, OK, I get that in the beauty industry this is all that's ever worked. But if I am a real woman and maybe I am 24 years old dealing with acne and I'm watching from Manhattan or maybe I'm a 75-year-old, whatever, I want women watching to look at that screen in my 10 minutes in my one shot. And even if they don't buy, I want them to see someone who looks like them, someone who I'm calling beautiful, somebody who I'm saying matters. And it was so hard because if we didn't make it in the 10 minutes, it was like we would

go bankrupt. So I was so stressed out. I flew out to QVC a week early before our one shot, before our 10 minute window. And I sat in this rental car in the parking lot of QVC every day for a week. And I was a freaking mess. Like I was crying. I remember this Oprah segment she did where she said like she wanted the color purple and she was running the track praying and crying. So I was like, and so I was in my car praying and crying. And like, it felt too big for me because I wasn't nervous for television.

I'd done that my whole career, but it was like the pressure of knowing we could go out of business. And it was like, okay, my gut kept saying one thing, you know, and I didn't want to lose all of our, everything that we had. We had to take a big loan out to pay for the 6,000 unit. It was like so much pressure. And it came down to like, okay, I'd rather stand for something than in that 10 minute window, whoever was going to turn on the television, I wanted them to look... Like I imagined a mom in Nebraska, like folding her laundry and looking up at her TV. I would imagine

these women, right? And like maybe she hasn't felt beautiful in a long time. And I just want her to like see herself. It was like, okay, I'd rather do that than sell a shitload of product and stand for nothing. And that was what it came down to. And I remember like the 10-minute clock started. We were live on set. And all of a sudden I was live in 100 million homes.

And I was like, oh, shit. I don't know if I can swear in here. Sorry. You can beep it. And I was like, oh. And I was praying like crazy. And all of a sudden I remember my bright red before a shot came up. And we had real women, all ages, skin tones, everything.

And I went live to them. And I remember we were down to the last minute of the show. And the host started announcing, the deep shade has sold out. The medium shade has sold out. I'm like, oh, and then all of a sudden, like this, the literally the second, the 10 minute marker hit the sold out sign came up across the screen and I start crying on air and my husband comes running in the studio and he's like, we're not going bankrupt. And I'm like, real women have spoken. And it was just this moment where I'm like, oh, because I feel like our biggest battle in life is like not diluting our own secret sauce, especially as entrepreneurs by getting distracted

over what the competition is doing or what the experts are saying or what's selling well right now. It's like, oh, no. It's like if you have something on your gut, it's there for a reason. And if I had ever veered away from that, our success would have never happened. And that day turned into five shows on QVC that year, then 101, then 151. And then for eight years, we did 250 live shows a year. And I did them all myself and then trained three other women who now carry this ginormous business and they rock it on QVC.

And then we got a yes from Ulta Beauty and grew to be their number one brand. So it was like years of no to their number one brand. Then we got a yes from Sephora. And then we sold to L'Oreal and it's like every person, every person told us to change, whether it was that our packaging wasn't prestigious enough or whatever it was. But it was like, for me, the biggest thing was that your gut is better than anyone else's advice. I love that so much. I teared up so many times during that because I can just so relate. And I, I think that's so fundamentally important. And a lot of people say that naivety in business is one

of your superpowers where there's experts with all these opinions but you're just like you know what I have no reason not to believe myself I'm just gonna go do it and then and it sounds like that was a bit of a tipping point for you where things started to fall into place yeah what was that like when you started getting yeses and obviously you've got to pay for product well ahead of shipping it out and you probably had a lot of invoices coming at you. Did you then decide to take investment and what was that process like? Yeah, exactly. It's like, oh, wow, we're selling so much and yet we have no money. It's like, oh, everything's tied up in working capital. And I mean, we were doing 30, I can share this because it's pre-L'Oreal.

I remember this point when we were doing $30 million in sales off of three employees, me, my husband, one other employee. Oh, my God. Then we started interviewing people from this site called Craigslist. And we still had no real office. So we were interviewing them. We moved to the East Coast at this point for QVC mainly. We were interviewing them at Jersey Diner.

And then they would come to work in our living room. And we still could not afford to hire really experienced people because every penny was tied up in working capital. And that was super tough as we were growing. The blessing that ended up happening was QVC doesn't require a ton of infrastructure. Whereas in retail, it actually does because you need education teams and you need to support all the stores. So I didn't know what I didn't know. It just got lucky there that it worked out that way that QVC was first. And the

other big thing was we couldn't afford advertising. Well, QVC, because we were going on the air so much, it was also driving awareness and driving people into stores and to our website. So the way it happened was super amazing that way in reverse. But yeah, here's the thing I struggled with early on. I don't know if you guys ever feel this way. I freaked out for a minute when we started getting successful and I was like, wait, is this going to last? Is this like, I want to strike while the iron's hot. I want to like freaking out. Right. And so we didn't even need to bring on investors per se, but we partnered with private equity four years in, five years in to the business. We stay the largest shareholders. So if you can do that, always do that. And the other thing, if, you know, talk about actionable, I don't think I've ever talked about this in an interview, but hey, let's do it.

I want to give this advice for anybody in your guys' community, oh my gosh, that is thinking about taking on investors. For me, this is so important. When we started doing well in QVC, it was the first time ever people were coming to us wanting to invest, right? So private equity firms were reaching out to us. And when I would research them, I'd be like, oh, wow private equity firms were reaching out to us. And when I would research them, I'd be like, oh, wow, they did this company and that company. And I'd be like,

this is crazy. And I would get so excited. And somebody gave me and my husband, Paulo, this advice. And it was the best thing we ever did. They said, don't just meet with who's in their portfolio now or who works with them now, whoever you're considering as an investor coming into your business, meet with people who have already exited, already exited. And what I mean by that is they've sold off to the next person or they've gone public or they've been acquired and they've gone through that process. And here's why this is such a big deal. When we started looking into all these firms reaching out to us and meeting with really cool brand founders that had already exited or whether they'd gone public or they had just sold to a strategic or whatever their path was, so many of them had nightmare stories

about how they thought they had a great partnership, but when they went through that exit process, they were kind of screwed over or they didn't realize certain legal things or waterfalls were in the contracts or preferential shares, all that stuff that can happen. There were a couple founders that we reached out to to go, oh, we would just love to talk about your experience with so-and-so. And they're like, oh, I would love to, but we're in litigation, right? You're just like, oh my gosh. And I can't even explain how many times that happened. And so our private equity company we partnered with, we chose them because all the founders we had talked to that had exited with them would say things like, oh, our board meetings were like working sessions and they

never bogged us down with all these, you know, this and that. And then here's how our exit went. And they had our back during this process. And so it's like, okay. And then we went through the journey and we partnered with TSG, Consumer Partners out of San Francisco. And we were with them for three and a half years. And when L'Oreal acquired us, we sold 100% of our business to L'Oreal. And guys, let me just to share this, like it was a three-year courtship-ish thing with L'Oreal. And they also gave us a lot of advice, like, change this, change that. And I'm like, but, like, had we changed it, we would be doing what everyone else was doing. And they probably would have never acquired us because we wouldn't have created anything super special and different.

But in the process of L'Oreal acquiring us, TSG was awesome. And I remember, like, at one point they said to me and Paolo, like, okay, well, I know they're offering a lot of money, but if you guys want to stay on this bus and keep building, we're in with you. And they could have just – yeah. So it's like those are the kind of people you're going to partner with, right? So like doing your homework on people that have already gone through the exit, I can't even explain how powerful that is. And as the years went on, we have over a thousand employees across the country in education sales and the corporate office. And I met a lot of really incredible executives that I interviewed for to hire. And so many of them have stories of things not going as they expected with their last company with investors and it affecting their entire future. And it's like,

wow. So anyways, I can't stress that enough. Because I feel like sometimes like when you're in that stage of, oh my gosh, people want to invest and we're doing well. And it's like exciting, but really do your homework because it's kind of like a marriage where you can't really divorce. And it's like, do you know what I mean? So like really do your homework. Yeah. And often that other, you know, they've been through the divorces several times. So they're going to play the game better if it does come to divorce. They know what they're doing. And I think there is always that, like, I think we started off this conversation

by talking about the naivety of going into business. But I do think, like you say, with getting investors on, you have to kind of do your own due diligence. So I think that's just really important to flag because I think, you know, a lot of us, we really see the best in people and that's really nice. But sometimes you kind of need to take your shades off and go, okay, under the covers here like what do I need to find out that I don't want to find out but it's better if I find out now and I think just being really transparent about that and it's also really nice to hear that you had a good experience yeah but you know what's so great it's like it's free you can do your homework and just reach out to every single

founder that is excellent I mean it's at least. You don't even have to do it through lawyers, which is good just to really sit down and say, can I, I even, we even flew to some of the places and said, can we just have coffee? Like we are going to fly to you. And just like, it would be the biggest gift if you could share your experience. And it was wild, the stuff that people shared, because everyone wants to help each other at the end of the day. They don't want you to go through a bad experience if they did. And so founders are usually pretty open, especially once they've exited to share. And so, I mean, that would be my biggest piece of advice in terms of investors. And then it was just a crazy, crazy journey after that. I mean, one thing that I know is close to your guys' hearts too is like when we started growing and growing and growing,

I did a hundred hour weeks for 10 years and was so burnt out. And it wasn't – it's obviously a choice, but I also kind of realized like I'm addicted to work. Like I love it. I'm addicted to it. And I didn't – and we thought about going public, but I didn't trust myself to not keep working 100-hour weeks. And so that's when we decided, okay, let's sell to a company that can help make our mission spread faster. And so that's when we started talks with L'Oreal and it went on for three years. And it was just a very, the moment that they actually bought our company was really cool.

They had finally made an offer after saying no for a few years. And the moment they made an offer, all of a sudden was the first time ever in 10 years where, or I guess it was eight years, where other companies were out of the blue starting to be interested in buying us. And so because we had a really great private equity partner, we brought on Goldman Sachs and they all worked together to make sure that everyone knew everyone was making offers. And that just drove, yeah. Well, it was great because there's competitive tension and they were all super legit and they were real offers.

And then it got into a cool situation where it was like I went from nobody wanting us or thinking we were cool for like the first like three to five years. And then all of a sudden it was like, whoa. And so L'Oreal acquired it for $1.2 billion. Dollars is all cash. And they made me their first female to hold a CEO title. They're 100 plus year history. And they love the brand. And like they have 30 plus, almost 40 brands, but nobody was doing the positioning and the stories and the consumer base and the everything that IT Cosmetics was doing. And like, that's what's so cool about doing your own thing,

even if it's different, even if nobody gets it. Because one day, if you do want to sell your company, you're going to be complementary to whatever they've got going on then. And so that all worked out that way, which was kind of weird to say out loud and look at both of you, but it's super cool. I'm excited for what you guys are building, by the way. I'm so excited about it. It's such a blessing. I was in this big conversation this week with a group of women about how powerful it is

to bring another woman with you who may not have access to a boardroom or may not have access to an event. And it's like, I was thinking about this today. You guys do that with your community every single day. That's so powerful. And I'm so, as another woman, so proud of what you guys are doing. Thank you. That's nice because it is really intentional as well. That's like really, you know, how Nati and I want to help other people. And we always say people have reached back to us and given us hands. And so it's our turn to do it for other people.

And that just feels really good. So thank you for recognizing that. And thank you for sharing so much of your story. I know Nati's got it. Yeah, we always say that success is way more fun when it's shared. And so why would you not want to help other women or other people that you know in any way that you can because danielle and i both experienced i'm sure you did too the loneliness of entrepreneurship when no one really is as invested as you are and it's exhausting and you're trying to google everything but google can only

give you so much we just wanted to solve that problem and we had no idea how to go about it. And so we just slowly started doing it like, okay, let's bring together women and they can just talk and then, okay, let's bring really great experts in to teach on one specific topic. And it slowly started like that. But I would love to ask, so it was 10 years of working 100 hour weeks. And like you said, you didn't even pay yourself for three years. What kept you going in that period where there would have been so many times when you just thought it would be way easier for me to go get a job? Yeah. What kept you going through that?

So for me, faith is a big deal. And you know, you'll see by my circle of friends, they have every different faith, no faith. I love them to death, like all of them. But for me, faith's a big deal. And so for me, like it was this constant focus of like praying, keeping my faith bigger than my fear and knowing and listening for what I'm supposed to be doing. And I knew what I was doing was bigger than myself. I knew it. I mean, it didn't look like that for many years, but like I knew it. And the other thing that was, and like my whole why,

I think your why has to be so strong enough that you can get through those tough days when you feel like no one gets it and you don't know how you're – if you're going to make payroll. And other people are trusting you with their livelihood and their family and their health insurance. And you're just like it's so much, but your why has to be worth all of it. And then there's simple things I would do. Like I would always keep a stack of messages from customers that would share their stories and how, not just the products, but how what we were doing and the messaging impacted their lives or how they were like dating with confidence because not because of the makeup, but because like, oh, they felt beautiful. Like for the first time, for the first time in a long time, or they would get out of toxic

situations and tell you about it and tell you like how they, you know what I mean? And it's just these stories. The power of community is huge, as you guys know. And so I would often, like if I was doing a 36 hour stretch on QVC with no sleep, and sometimes you walk in and it's the biggest blessing for your business because you can move so much inventory there. I mean, it's just the volumes are amazing. The pressure though is crazy hard. And so there were days where I would do like a 36-hour where I walk in the building, I don't leave for 36 hours and you're doing our shows live every couple hours. And it's not just that you are – like if somebody spent their

precious time watching me on QVC, I never want to take a second of that for granted. So it's like I wanted to show up for her. And so I just like gave everything I had. And then on top of that, you have this massive sales number. And if you don't hit it, you can get your other hours pulled or you can lose a product launch that you know you just brought in millions of dollars of image. So you have that pressure and sometimes it just felt like it was too much. So it was little things like that where I would just read that would bring me right back to my why of why I'm doing it. And I would read those letters and I'm like, okay, this is why I'm here. This is why I have to show up. This is why I have to get off the green room couch,

even though I slept for 20 minutes in the past 36 hours. And I've got to like show up for her. You know what I mean? It was like those little things sometimes are the most powerful. Did you have any energy management hacks back then? I feel like you would have had to be on your A game. I wish I was as sophisticated as y'all are and as I am starting to be now. I wish I had a red light next to me in the KBC green room. I wish I was like super into my morning routine then. No, the truth is I pray

every day I did not totally mess up my body because I was burnt out all in. I felt like a hamster on a wheel running as fast as I could. And I just, for me, it was prayer and it was my why. But physical hacks, I didn't have any. I was living on like five Venti Starbucks coffees a day and then the green room coffee and then like no physical hacks, just a whole lot of mindset and big why and a lot of prayer that got me through all that. I bet you I would really crush it now if I had a red light back then. I know. Imagine. Right?

But I think the power of your mind as well. It just goes to show if you've got that, you don't always need the fancy tech. So to bring it full circle for the women that are listening and they heard that only five women have grown a business from their living room to a billion dollar company. They're listening and they're like, I want to make that number six. I want to be one of those women. But that journey just looks so far away, so impossible, so hard. What would you say to her? I would say my single biggest piece of advice, and especially right now in this time that we're in with social media and with everything out there feeling like

it's visible more than ever is you have to keep your blinders on to distraction of what anyone else is doing. And I would tell this to my teams, oh my gosh. And thank God they started trusting me over the years because they saw it for themselves. If you allow yourself to get distracted by what your competition's doing, even if they're crushing you right now, even if they have a big launch, you're like, oh, wait a minute, that just killed it. Oh, uh-uh. If you for a second allow yourself to get distracted

by what your competition's doing or anyone else and you risk diluting your own secret sauce, your own why, your own authenticity, you're done, you're done. Like that's it. And for me, the only way to grow anything that lasts, anything that makes a true impact, anything that is novel, anything that's meaningful is when you do it only the way you can do it, 100% authentically who you

are and you keep your blinders on. Because not only is it an energy suck to worry what anyone else is doing, And of course, like the famous saying comparison is a thief of joy. It's all true. It is the biggest risk to your business, not what the competition's doing. It's you diluting your own secret sauce, right? And the truth is, and every study out there will prove this. Every researcher proves this, that you can only have authentic human connection when you show up authentically, right? So if you're out there building a business, whether it's online, whether it's in stores, and you want a true connection with your customers, you have to show up authentically. The second you start showing up as your own representative or like someone else or influenced

by somebody else and what they're doing, you're going to lose your own customers because people feel it. You can't fake authenticity. So for me, when you fully not just hear that, but embrace it, it's freaking freedom. It's freedom too, because you're like, oh, wait, okay, I can show up imperfect. I can show up messy. I can show up all in and without this pressure of conforming or what everyone else is doing. And that is where your magic is.

Like that is where your magic is. that is where your magic is that's where your connection with customers is that's where and it's freedom on top of it all and you have so much energy when you're not worried about all that other stuff yeah because you're not trying to put that mask on you're just being yourself and you're showing up there's something and that's i think one of the reasons that we have created the community that we have because not only do natty and i live by that but then we see that in the society like they don't pretend to have these perfect lives they share their struggles and they share their wins and i think that's really important and you know we do live in a society now where there's the kind of like highlight reel and it's important to recognize that is that and i think you know what we always try and do and what natty and i have always been

really loyal with when we first started and right until now we're like okay let's share the behind the scenes let's share when we're struggling and let's share you know when we are winning and let's just kind of have that open that conversation because that is important and just like you started this whole thing and why you created the makeup and actually saying hey this is my face right now this is what's happening to me and you know I was in Sephora the other day and I was buying a new CC cream and there your face was and I was like you know just how amazing to just kind of authentically build something and stand behind it, knowing that it's helped your life, but it's actually going to help other people's. And, you know, as someone who's used your product and

someone who's suffered from acne and whose confidence is really destroyed with skincare stuff. And actually, you know, when you hear about products and you learn these products and you hear about these other women that it's changed their lives, that's what just makes it all worthwhile, isn't it? Just like, yeah, i'm having an impact yeah and you know one more thing too is like danielle when you had i saw the picture that you um sent me from sephora and when i see that picture it's like i feel the sense of victory for every entrepreneur out there like i love that you just shared that because i'm just putting two and two together for a second too where i just shared how like oh wait just a two and two together for a second too, where I just shared how like, oh wait, just a few years earlier, I was riding

down the elevator crying, like holding back tears from this big no that felt like life crushing at Sephora. And now like, oh, there's my face in a store. It's like, I love that because I'm just imagining all of your listeners right now and your viewers and your community. And it's, I just feel like sometimes we have to see, and I love that you guys share this stuff. It's like, you have to see what's possible to then you can go, oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I got this. Like I'm going to do it too. Oh, they said no. Oh, just wait, just wait. You know what I mean? I just love this. And I also needed that reminder for sure, because I think it can be so easy sometimes to get distracted, especially by people who perhaps have more

experience my husband steven tells me off for this constantly he's like stop putting people on a pedestal just because they have more experience just stay in your own lane just do what you want to do because that's gotten you here and you know deep down why you're doing what you're doing and you can serve these women in the best way because you are here and you've been here so thank you for that reminder i really needed it and i i just want to say thank you for being such a strong example of feminine leadership like you do things differently and since the moment Danielle and I met you we just fell in love with your heart because you really do lead in that way and that's what's going to change the world that example of feminine leadership and doing things differently and

leading with our heart leading with service that's what changes the world so thank you so much for showing up like that and showing all of the women in our community too that they don't have to change to build billion dollar companies or to build a business that suits their lifestyle where they're at they don't need to change or be anyone else so thank you so much for being on here thank you thank you guys thank you so much for being on here. Thank you. Thank you guys. Thank you so much. If you loved this episode, please subscribe, download a few more, and please leave us a review.

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