The Bossticks - Darin Olien On Fatal Conveniences, & How To Make Minor Changes That Massively Impact Your Life, Health, & Wellbeing

Episode Date: September 11, 2023

#608: Today, we're sitting down with superfood expert, author, and podcast host, Darin Olien. Darin spent nearly 20 years exploring the planet, discovering new and underutilized exotic foods and medicinal plants. With his years of experience learning about the world's healthiest and most sustainable practices, he wrote both "SuperLife: The five fixes that keep you healthy, fit, and eternally awesome" & "Fatal Conveniences." Today, Darin joins us to discuss all things clean products, how to make small and easy changes that will benefit your life in the long run, and all things plant-based diet, including how to address the root causes of common health issues. To connect with Darin Olien click HERE To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE To subscribe to our YouTube Page click HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential   This episode is brought to you by Barefaced  Exclusively for Skinny Confidential listeners, Barefaced is offering 15% your first purchase off by using code SKINNY at barefaced.com. This episode is brought to you by Westin Hotels At Westin hotels, there's amenities and offerings aimed to help you move well, eat well, and sleep well, so you can keep your well-being close, while away. Find wellness on your next stay at Westin. This episode is brought to you by Sakara Sakara delivers science-backed, plant-rich nutrition programs and wellness essentials right to your door. Their ready-to-eat meals are nutritionally designed to deliver results—from weight management and eased bloat to boosted energy and clearer skin. Go to Sakara.com/skinny or enter code SKINNY at checkout to receive 20% off your first order. This episode is brought to you by LMNT LMNT is a tasty electrolyte drink that has everything you need and nothing you don't. It contains a science-backed electrolyte ratio: 1000mg sodium, 200mg potassium, and 60mg magnesium. Get a free sample pack with any purchase at drinkLMNT.com/SKINNY This episode is brought to you by AG1 AG1 is way more than greens. It's all of your key multi-vitamins, minerals, pre-and probiotics, and more, working together as one. Go to drinkAG1.com/SKINNY to get a free 1 year supply of vitamin D and 5 free travel packs with your first purchase. This episode is brought to you by eBay Ensure your next purchase is the real deal with eBay Authenticity Guarantee. Everyone deserves real. Visit ebay.com for terms. This episode is brought to you by DraftKings DraftKings Sportsbook is an official sports betting partner of the NFL. Download the DraftKings Sportsbook app now and receive $200 in bonus bets immediately by betting $5 and using code SKINNY at checkout. Produced by Dear Media

The following podcast is a dear media production. I am someone who travels a lot. And I'm constantly trying to be healthy when I travel, but it is a struggle. But leave it to the Weston Hotels to fix this issue. Okay, you guys, first of all, they have over 200 destinations around the world and they're committed to all things wellness. So what they've done is they've made travel an opportunity to actually enhance your well-being.

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A very smart cookie. And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her. Everyone listening right now will have resistance to almost everything I have in that book. Because we have all gotten used to a way that we are. And then we prescribe that to ourselves every day. We anchor that in.

And now that habit is either helping us or it's harming us. We get so used to feeling a certain way that we don't have an impetus of change. But then when you look at the startling things in this book was the very fabric of our evolution as a human is being disrupted. Welcome back, everybody, to the skinny confidential him and her show. Today we are absolutely going down the rabbit hole once again with Darren O'Lean, the new author of Fatal Conveniences, the toxic products and harmful habits that are making you sick and the simple changes that will save your health. Many of you guys may know, Darren, he has been spending nearly 20 years exploring the planet

discovering new and underutilized exotic foods and medicinal plants as a superfood hunter. Yes, we get into that as well. He just did a series with Zach Ephron on. Netflix, which I'm sure many of you have seen. And we cover a lot of ground with Darren. I think this is one of our favorite episodes that we've done in a long time, whether it's environmental toxins, EMFs, we talk about superfoods, we talk about base levels of nutrition. We discuss the differences between plant-based and meat-based diets. And he's obviously a plant-based practitioner himself. And we talk about the proper nutrition needed if you're going to choose that diet. And we just had a ton of fun with

Darren. He's an open book. And like I said, we really went down the rabbit hole into so many different topics with him as we do on this show. Darren is also the host of the wildly popular podcast, the Darren O'Lean show, where he curiously explores people, solutions, and health as well as life's fatal conveniences. And like I said, we just had a ton of fun with this guy. So check it out. Check out his new book as well, fatal conveniences. It'll keep you up at night. Darren, welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her show. This is the skinny confidential, him and her. Darren, I have to say the office is buzzing with you coming in. R.E.A. Katie, I think, is your number one fan.

Number one. Not to put you on blast, Katie. I'm stoked to have the number one. She came in. She said, hey, I got them all warmed up. I was chatting them up out there. I don't know what she was saying to you. But thanks so much for making the trip out here, man, and coming on. I think we're going to go down the rabbit hole here a bit. Okay. So let's get some context and background of you. Talk to us about how you even got into this.

30 years ago. Wow. My father, who was a university professor and obviously my first male mentor in my life, I was in college, I was in college finishing nutrition, physiology degree. And all of a sudden, I kind of got a call. And he started explaining, I think I have pinned down why I'm having brain fog and lack of energy. And I can't think. I was like, because he was like talking about stuff like that. And through a few doctors of his, they, they diagnosed him with multiple chemical sensitivity.

So, and it was hard, it was frankly hard to believe because it's like I've known them obviously all my life. And all of a sudden he's talking about, I can't wear a T-shirt. I can't, I can't be in a room that has new carpets, new paints. I can't wear any fragrances, shampoos, conditioners, all of that. And then over time, before the internet, right, my dad would put VHS tapes and find research and start educating me on the chemicals that had no safety data. And cut to kind of reverse engineering, why him? he was one of the keepers of the dragon in the Cuban Missile Crisis with atomic bomb.

So he was exposed to a lot of radiation. And so his thyroid was compromised, which I knew. And so once you start altering your endocrine system, as we will talk more about, it's the operating system of the body. And so with an alcoholic background, with his liver being challenged, created an opportunity for him to have this happen in a sense. And I say opportunity because it educated me. It started.

And then throughout the years, I would run into researchers starting to talk about 25 years ago, starting to show me research on EMFs. And it scared the shit out of me on cell phones, up to the head and blood brain barrier and all of these things. So I have a on the path of the, health world I was in, this has been playing. And so now, you know, you spend, we spend all our time trying to, you know, eat great optimizer health, even biohacking. But if this invisible world

that even though my dad was a severe case, the evidence is very clear that it's affecting all of us. I think one of the problems of why people are so resistant to this is nostalgia. I, because when I try to have this conversation with like people who like use a certain cleaning supply, it's like they're almost nostalgic and romantic about the windex or the chlorox or the fucking tree in the car that smells like strawberries. And so they they almost have this like nostalgia, nostalgic association to the product. And I think like the conversation's starting to be more open. but at first it's jarring. So I guess my question for you is when he brought these things up about how he couldn't be in a room with new carpet or paint,

were you like you're crazy? Of course. Yeah. We all were, the whole family. So how did you guys take that in and actually open your mind to him saying that? Well, it was time and learning. I would be willing to read what he was sharing with me

and you'd see the data. And then you would see these news articles. that he would find or on the television and then started to talk to their doctors a little bit. Really, the biggest difference was if I was going to see him from college, so I'd drive back home an hour and a half in Minnesota, I would have to prepare myself to wear these things that didn't have sense, that he would send me. So the conditioner, what I would wash my clothing in,

I'd have to change all of that just so I could be in the same room with him. So upon doing it, I then realized, even though I didn't realize these things were affecting me. Because once you cut it out and then you bring it back in, you're immediately more sensitive. Like once for me, I cut like certain detergents out. And now when someone's around me that has a detergent, it's so off putting. I can't even give them a hug. Yeah. Yeah, you know, I, I would probably, I probably, before doing this show, fell into that resistant class of people. I was not nostalgic about the Windex, but. Are you sure?

I'm sure. I feel like it was in your soup. But you might, you might have. But I would probably, I met a lot of this stuff with, I'm sure, many of the responses that you see daily with people just being extremely skeptical and saying, hey, maybe this is in your mind. But it wasn't until Lauren, she moved all of our household cleaning supplies. She changed our detergent.

She changed what we sleep and all of it, and to her credit. And now, to your point, I notice. that stuff way more and I don't like it when I'm around. And I think it's one of those things where we're good at humans at adapting to our environments. And you kind of, if there's something uncomfortable, you just get used to it. I was talking to somebody about this as it relates to alcohol. I'm like, you know, a lot of people that drink frequently, you really don't know what it's like until you remove it for a extended period of time, you know, how much different your life is. And I imagine the same thing with some of this stuff that we're talking about are going to talk about,

which is it just becomes people's new norm and they don't realize how much better they can feel if they just make a couple changes. 100%. I think that's the plus and the minus of being human, right? It's like if you, if you, there was a survey done 15 years ago where you asked everyday average people, hey, how are you feeling? Most people say between one and 10, 10 being the best. Most people, no matter the economic class,

the matter of the job, they'll all say, yeah, pretty good, seven to eight. To that point, we get used to that stuff. Just like exercise, right? When you add up some exercise and you lose some weight or do whatever to make that adjustment, the challenge is the action and breaking that nostalgia, breaking that kind of apathy to then take a step. Everyone listening right now will have resistance to almost everything I have in that book, right?

Because we have all gotten used to a way that we are. and then we prescribe that to ourselves every day. We anchor that in, and now that habit is either helping us or it's harming us. But either way, we're used to it, and that's just what it smells like. My car is supposed to smell this way. My clothes, this is how my mom washed and it's what it smelled like before. So there is this very powerful dopamine thing that you're going against. but if you're willing to take a different step and to challenge that, then you have the

possibility of feeling better than you thought you were feeling. Yeah, so the point is that we get so used to feeling a certain way that we don't have an impetus of change. But then when you look at the startling things in this book was, you know, the very fabric of our evolution as a human is being disrupted, right? The endocrine system, the motility of sperm, the testosterone plummeting. So we're doing all of these things in the face of literally our existence, the very thing that moves us forward as a human species. And yet, we don't want to change those simple things. And that's, I don't know what the answer is because I know this book is intense in that way.

But if you're willing to take one of those things and suspend a little uncomfortable to align and integrate something that you know could be better, then you're gambling and betting that you will feel better. and then that snowball effect. And I love that scenario because during the book, I was like, moms have to know this information because they're running the household, right?

So we're stubborn. Most men, we just get locked in. And the fact that you took on this and then changed the household, and then you were able to reap the benefits in spite of yourself? I just want to take a minute to think myself. She's going to go on a tangent here.

This motherfucker had, you're going to die, had the trash, the trash, what's the bags? The scented trash bags. Those are the worst. Those are the worst because now you're taking trash, which is already gross and you're putting in a scented trash bag. But here's the thing. I didn't even know that existed. I think the majority, I don't want to say even, I think of people in the world go to in the cleaning aisle, specifically in the grocery store or supermarket wherever, and they just grab what they think, you know, what's on the shelves.

Yeah. And they just, well, we talked about this a lot on this other episode where it's like, you just assume if it's on a shelf that it must be healthy. And it's been tested. And then there's an agency that's got your back as much as your mom would, right? So I can spend my hard-earned money and get this product that, yeah, of course. So of course I want my trash to smell better. But you don't realize there's hundreds of chemicals likely carcinogenic and endocrine disrupting.

And there's a plausible deniability that allowed it to be there. That as long as that company's not testing it, they're like, I don't know if it's bad. Lauren and I have the benefit of speaking to people like yourself regularly. And I think that if we didn't, like one of the benefits of this show is I get to have these conversations and it gets drilled into my head. We had Ken Cook on the show, who's the head of the EWG. It went through all of the, and you just don't realize as a consumer, as a normal consumer, all the stuff that slips through the cracks. And I said this less eloquently on another show, and it got broken down to a clip. And by no means, am I an expert? I bring people like you on.

But I said that I have a hunch that our environment is far outpacing our evolution. And the environments we're creating for us. And our systems are just not built to be able to keep up with the pace of technology and chemicals that we're producing in the world now. And I think that's why people are having so many health issues. Bingo, not even close, right? Not even close being able to, where it's just this gnarly experiment. I love that you had Ken on because obviously, EWG's been kicking some ass for a long time trying to raise the alarm and we should,

it should be out there even more. The fact that we have to have agencies like this, books written like that, the fact that that is even a thing means that these systems have radically failed us, right? That we haven't had the testing, the proof of safety first before it is on that show. It's ridiculous. Just everyone for a second pause with that, that they don't have to prove that the product is safe before they market it, usually some sort of greenwash, and sell it to you. and your children.

And then they name it, oh, like, green thumb. Right. That's the green washing. The green, they name it something green. And like you're saying, they make it white so it looks really clean. And they make it, they'll say like no paraben's or some shit on it. And it's just a hoax. Yeah.

So you really do have to be your own guru. I would love to know when you started learning all this information from your father. What were some really easy, tangible things that you did to kick this off? Because I love how intense everything you say is, but I want to first give the audience some easy little things that they can immediately change that worked for you. Vinegar in the laundry as a laundry detergent. And that's an easy one, essential oils, right? That's a super simple one to do, especially when I have dogs, right? So around my dad, it was, oh, coconut oil, right?

And also has a natural SPF of seven, right? Roughly five to nine, people say. And the research shows. So those kinds of things. And then one thing I would recommend for anybody, people are going to hate this, fragrance-free. Just get rid of it all. Get rid of because the loopholes around fragrances, because of the proprietary language, they get a pass, right?

So they get a pass to they don't have to disclose. And so many studies that I cited in the book show that there are likely carcinogens of over 100 different chemicals as well as endocrine disruptors. So just get rid of the fragrance, right? And if you want a fragrance, then go to an essential oil, go to a rose hydrosol, like go that direction. So imagine it's, you know, it's ultra processed food is one thing, but it's also ultra processed products and all of this stuff where the greatest part about, I think, this book in EWG is the elimination of toxicity over time. And then the inclusion of products like an essential oil in terms of this example of a fragrance, it can actually lower your sympathetic response, your stress response, and up-regulate your your parasympathetic response, calm you down.

So you're eliminating as well as up-regulating your body and your body system at the same time. What are the three most intense, gnarliest things that you say in this book? Give us some, give us some ones that you were like, this is going to be disruptive, this is taboo, this is nuts. People are going to think I'm nuts, but I don't give a shit I'm going to say it. As I wave my Sharpie that I'm now like, oh, I needed a non-toxic marker. Yeah, yeah. There's so many, you know how many times I swore writing this book? I was on my deck outside writing on the weekends. usually I could get a lot done. And I just staring at this research so, you know,

and I know a little bit about this stuff, but you're reading the studies and going, how is this possible? You know, earlier, even before the book, the dental floss pissed me off so bad. I don't know why. That glide dental floss that's easy to slide in between. Goodbye.

I'm done. It's full of Phafoss. Oh, great. You think you're doing your gums a favor and you're literally putting all these chemicals up into your gums. Do you do water pick? Waterpick's great. What about a toothpick? Yeah, good old fashioned toothpicks.

I love a guy with a toothpick. There is nothing hotter than a guy with his windows rolled down, his arms up, and he's got a toothpick. Carson, please make a note to grab me a pack of toothpicks, please. Non-toxic toothpicks. Okay, go ahead. Are you going to change the, I'm investing in toothpicture. Let's just make sure that they don't have formaldehyde and everything else, right? So let's get a good wood source.

I'm good at sourcing so we can source and we're in, done side project. There's a lot of business I've gone into that I never thought toothaches would be right up there. So that's a really good one, the dental floss. Give us another one. Well, the rabbit hole of electromagnetic fields. Great. It is so gnarly. Let me just say, I don't know if we have time to unpack the telecommunication system.

Let's do it. But this is bigger, I believe, than the tobacco industry punting that research lying to the public for 40 years. When I was looking into, again, some of the first studies I was exposed to, pun intended, was 25 years ago around electromagnetic radiation of a cell phone. So when I started this chapter, the more I would dig in, the more I would like, okay, there's telecommunication, there's 5G, but then there's the history of electrification. So I have to consume a lot of information so I can kind of more appropriately make a chapter out of it. So I went all the way into the history of electrification that scared the shit out of me.

They knew when you put a wire in a wall, it has magnetic radiation and frequency generation, right? And there was studies I was reading of schoolhouses not grounded properly. cell phone towers, even regular electric towers next to houses and homes and schools connected to children's leukemia. So this stuff went and it went the history went all the way back to the first telegraph. They started to see mammals and birds being affected by this stuff. So it goes so deep. And then when you start talking about 1G, 2G, 3G, 4G, 5G, the data of safety is based on your proximity of thermal burning.

It's not even taking into the effect, the field effect that it has a frequency. What is that frequency? What is the magnetic radiation coming off of that? And I'll just say this. In 1993, and I was reading like PDF faxes, naturally the EMFs fell on, the electrification EMFs, the 1G2G, all this stuff, the emerging of that world fell on the EPA, Environmental Protection Agency.

So they started doing their own studies. There was a researcher that was also from the telecommunication companies that was leading a lot of the research. He came back seeing all these issues with exposure, proximal exposure. The closer these EMFs are to us, the closer the cell phone is, the closer the Wi-Fi router, and duration, and I'll unpack some of the issues. with that really creates problems. It's non-ionizing, and that's where this whole

crap gets thrown around. ionizing radiation, we know, acutely rips apart DNA. What's like an example of ionizing radiation? What would a source be? An x-ray. That's why they put freaking lead on your lap. It's like that meme of the doctor saying,

no problem and then he runs in hindsight behind the wall. Or not they casually x-ray you when you go to the dentist, which is like so pointless in my opinion. Right. Blast your face full of radiation, right? So, okay. But then they say non-ionizing.

But through the research, it is, in many of these studies I cite, there's hundreds of studies that, okay, let me finish the story of the EPA. So he came back with all of this information about stress response in the body, and I'll unpack some of what that is. And he wrote a letter.

I was reading the PDF letter. I don't know how I found it. I couldn't find it again after I kind of wrote it. So I'm not saying that. It was a conspiracy. I'm just saying I just couldn't find it. It took me days and days and days to find some of the stuff. And he said, okay, here's the warning we should tell people.

So they have informed consent on devices that clearly now are coming out and the internet and all of this stuff. overnight the funding was let go of of the EPA the FCC the Federal Communication Commission took on all of the safety and it's still 20 years old the safety data is based on thermal proximity it's not based on any of the frequency or the magnetic radiation so are you saying they almost kind of don't want to investigate it because if they investigate it, they know something's going to show up. Possible deniability. If you don't let, and that's throughout this book, from your deodorant to a cell phone,

if they don't, do we need more tests? Yes. Yeah, that's a good idea. Punt it. That's what the, that's what the tobacco industry did. Yes, of course, we need more tests. Punt it. And they just keep saying that.

They keep saying that. They keep saying that. And they don't reveal. And they don't test their own product. Because if they did, all of these other tests, hundreds of tests that have been done on it, would show that this is dangerous. Some of the dangers, going back to one of the things that freak me out, we have barriers in the body. Of course, leaky gut, the barriers in the body, exposure to glyphosate and stress can open up the gut barrier. So we know what can happen there. placental barrier. We used to think I heard in the 70s and even the 80s, the baby's pretty much always fine, right? Because the evolution is going to protect that baby.

Nothing's going to pass through the placental border. All those things, the gut, placental border, we now know that EWG did a great research and showed that there. There was over 200 mostly carcinogenic chemicals and compounds in the placenta and the umbilical cord of every child being born. So that's a lie. The EMF, this is what scared me. It opened up the blood brain barrier. You start opening up that, you're going to have all kinds of problems, right?

And so that exposure, it was showing things like proteins, albumin, that wasn't supposed to be in the brain and the brain. Those kinds of things scared this shit out of me. And so the other stress response was clear just cellular stress response. Free radical oxygen species increased. Motility, proxamation, cell phone proxamation to genitals. Like you got to take the cell phone off the dick. Off the dick. There was another study.

Huberman just said that too. People are finally starting to actually take that seriously. I think so. Yeah. I was actually, I am not, it was a real thing. So Andrew Huberman, I saw him at a party, mutual friend of ours party, and he started to dive into the EMFs. And it was right when I finished that chapter. And he turned to me and he said, well, after the research I saw as well, and we were going back and forth,

I'm never putting my cell phone in my pocket. He did an episode on it. Yeah. And the car, when he puts his phone on his nuts, I say, please take those off my future children. Yeah, yeah. It's a thing. When I see people around me and they just casually hear, and there was another study with a woman in the breast tissue, and right where the actual antenna was for the phone,

she had a tumor. And that's just end of one, but there was many studies also showing the stress response of the breast tissue. and again, proxamation, right? It's on your body. The fine print of a cell phone says never put it on your body. No one knows that. It's in the fine print of your owner's manual of your cell phone.

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If we're going into the sauna like so many people are doing now, we take it then as well. If you're just going through the day and you feel a little lethargic, you feel a little brain fog, you feel a little slow. You're probably depleted in electrolyte. So this is also a great time to do it. You just dump it in a glass of water and boom, you're good to go. So right now, Element is offering our listeners a free sample pack with any purchase, that's eight single serving packets free with any element order. This is a great way

to try all eight flavors or share element with a salty friend. Get yours at drink element.com slash skinny. This deal is only available through our link. You must go to D-R-I-N-K-L-M-N-T.com slash skinny. Element offers no questions-ask refunds. Try it totally risk-free. If you don't like it, share it with a salty friend, and they will give your money back. No questions asked. You have nothing to lose. DrinkElement.com slash skinny. What is your, after writing this book and seeing all this research relationship to your cell phone? How do you have boundaries around your phone to make it still work for you? Because obviously we're going to be on our phone.

What do you do? Yeah. Great question. When I'm, I just did this at dinner, right? Last night. I do it all the time. When I stand up and I'm going to walk somewhere, I put my phone on airplane. If I'm going to put it on in my pocket, it's on airplane mode.

Right. So I'm never leaving it on my body. Or I don't. I never take a call up to my head. Ever, never will never happen. I'm never an air pod, I'm assuming. No, Bluetooth, no. Bluetooth is the same frequency as the cell phone just not as much of the strength. So what are you? A speakerphone guy? Speaker phone or air tubes. So air tube number one, plug back in. Is air tube? They're just a corded one? Yes. So cord, fine. If you have air tubes, there's actually an air tube that break the cord and the volume and the, you can still hear, right? But the EMFs don't go through it. So I wear those or I'm on a speaker. Okay. And where is your phone when you wake up and where is your phone when you go to bed?

My phone is off on my desk. Okay. And my wireless is, my Wi-Fi is off when I go to bed. So, so it's a great company, tech wellness. Is like a kill switch? Yeah, she's, August is amazing. So I found her while I was digging for solutions and all of this stuff. I mean, plugging back in at your home, plugging back in, you can do.

do all of that stuff, but air tubes. There's also an amazing device, again, a big solution. I found this guy digging into the research, a German guy made this incredible toroidal field. I know it sounds woo-woo, but it's scientifically backed. It makes a field effect and it depolarizes the polarizing radiation. So it has less harm on the physical body. It's a device, I travel with it.

I travel with the one on the plane and I have one in my home. So I do all things. I turn it off. I turn the Wi-Fi off and I have these devices that help. What's this device called exactly? Waveguard, a key shield. QI. I want to ask you a question as it relates to your father because I'm sure there's still some people listening to this thing.

Hey, I don't feel any effects. And I wonder if in your father's case, he was exposed to so many things that his system just was overridden. And it couldn't then handle it. So I guess what I'm asking is, are some people's constitutions not able to handle things and others are maybe less sensitive and they're able to not notice some of the effects of this? Because maybe some people are listening.

Like, I've never felt anything. I guess there's some nuance there. Totally. And that's going back to the human strength of us. Just because we don't feel it doesn't mean it's not occurring. Why do you take a vitamin? Do you feel the vitamin when you consume it? No.

but you're trusting it, right? So that's kind of the thing. So my dad, yeah, he was, his liver was compromised, his thyroid was compromised. So it's like, think of it as a cup that's full. Any extra stress? This is stress. If anything, anyone walks away, all of these things are perceived stress on the body. And so he couldn't deal with anything else.

So that's where it was really challenging. but it doesn't mean that these things aren't causing your body harm. Sure. And that's where the motility, do you feel when your sperm isn't working? Well, you know, do you know that your testosterone is low unless you test it or your energy's low and even females, bone density and testosterone, metabolism, all of that stuff? You don't, it's a slow hurt over time. endometriosis doesn't just show up.

These things are estrogen-related dominances that have been hitting us in a multitude of directions. I also think you don't know what you don't know. If you've never gotten all these things, if you've never been in the right environment for these things not to thrive, you maybe don't know how it feels.

And an example is we had the guy from Test My Home. He's amazing. Oh, nice. He's totally your vibe. come over to our house and he said, I'm going to kill your power and your EMF. And I want you to see if you feel a difference. So we stood in the kitchen and he killed everything in the house. The Wi-Fi, the power, everything. And immediately your body, your parasympathetic, I think, relaxes. And I can't explain it. And I wouldn't have known that my body wasn't relaxed until he did that. Exactly. It goes back to full circle what we were just talking about. You don't know what you don't know and you get used to it, right? It's like when I go from my hills in Malibu to New York, holy shit, right? Even in here, it's this different stress. So even though Austin's, you know, it's a nice city. But that is the issue. That's the thing that you're walking around in this stress. You're a mammal. you're a biological frequency machine that's what you are we have we have electrical things that we have created that are showing up in all of this research that's showing stress and i think it is important

to do there's there's there's there's building by i just did this for a friend of mine in colorado he was like yeah i i'm not sleeping well and i don't know what's going on i go do you sleep with your Wi-Fi on And so I said, call this guy as a building biologist. He came to his house. His house was a, might as well been a power station, right? It was just whacked because he had all of the biohacking and the saunas and the thing and everything was on and the little devices he was wearing for his sleep. So the guy came in and shut it all down.

The guy slept for like 11 hours the next day. So he didn't know what he didn't know unless he was willing to take that action. So that's the tough quote unquote pill to swallow is that you don't know. But if you're willing to take at least one step, then you can have an opportunity to maybe realize that I wonder maybe my migraine is contributing or is being affected by some of these things. maybe my sleep patterns, maybe my trying to get pregnant. If you start to eliminate some of this stuff, it's amazing what the change could be. How do you inform people the way you do without having them go off the edge and just be scared of the world? I mean, obviously, you're scaring them to a degree and informing them.

But how do you make it so that somebody is not going to bed in a tinfoil hat and wrapping themselves in a space blanket? I would go to bed in a tinfoil hat, though, if it got really. right of the there's fair day there's fair day cages or canopies you can put on your bed and i know many people especially people in apartments and stuff you can't turn off someone else's Wi-Fi they do that and you and you've got 12 like even in this building if i brought my meter we'd all you'd be be jacked up yeah yeah be jacked i mean listen i think because i know when people look at this stuff and you start reading, even though it's like you don't know what you don't know. And then once you know it, you're like, holy shit, every direction. It's a weird world because you and I and all of us

listening were born into these systems. And these systems were here well before us. And so let's not be a victim to them. Let's empower ourselves for them. If people are overwhelmed, hell, open the book, read one page. Learn something and just apply that. The last third of this book is all solutions. I'm not saying, I have a cell phone. I use it. I just use it more wisely. I think of this as stress, all of this stuff.

So I minimize my stress. And when you, it's like exercise. Once you start feeling stronger, once you start having better clarity of mind, once you start integrating, then you can take the next step and the next step. And just adding, I think of this as the other side of biohacking.

We need to hack our way out of the modern world that we're unconsciously walking into because it is affecting those very systems that people are doing blood tests for, tracking their sleep for, but the elimination of this modern day products that have no interest in your best interest is kind of the pushback. and my optimism ultimately comes by way of these conversations and of your audience listening because they're listening to you because you're giving them good information. Right. And so those people, if they tell their people and they, similar to you, they go home and make a change,

they're turning the Wi-Fi off. No one knew that. The mom just decided to do it and their kids are sleeping better. They're deeper in sleep. like their husband's less angry. Mom's turning off the Wi-Fi tonight. I don't know how the fuck I'm doing it. You're going to have to tell me what to do.

You just hit the switch. Where's the switch? Unplug it. I'm going to unplug it. I'm unplugging it. Yeah, if you don't have the remote, because you can plug it right into a remote or a timer. Like a kill switch type thing.

Kill switch. Yeah. Or just literally go and unplug it. So when it comes to how all this relates to food and beverage, Do you have similar information there? Ultra-processed food. If people took away one thing to do in their eating routine, I don't care if whatever people get wacky about paleo and carnivore and vegan and all of that stuff.

I've been plant-based for 17 years or so. It's just about, again, this ultra-processed food that is literally created. created as hyper palatable food so that you consume more of it. So if you just took that away, you would take care of most of those. What foods are the biggest offenders when you're hypercast? I mean fast food, clearly. And then the little twist of it is is that food doesn't stick to the packaging. This is where another zinger happened.

Takeaway, the food wrapping, guess what that's dosed in? Here comes P-FOS again. So P-FOS is heat-resistant, it's slippery. This is just for context. This is a derivative of Teflon. This is connected to kidney disease, testicular cancer, diabetes, endocrine disrupting. So it's the food. Ultra-processed food, have been showing P-FosS in it, thallates in it, parabins,

like all kinds of stuff. not to mention just the fake food that it is. Let's say you order, I'm just making this up. You order the broccoli salad with all the good vegetables and maybe you get some grass-fed meat on top and the meat's hot. And you order this beautiful $25 lunch and you get it. And then there's plastic around it that's hot. It's melting into your food.

And also, who knows what kind of pan it's been cooked in. I mean, you really have to. be aware and do your own research. Yeah. And think about, I mean, a lot of this stuff we've gotten used to. If I were given one thing to do, if I could gently or maybe not so gently shake back the common sense in people, because you're right, plastic is petroleum. right so it's oil and then to make it into a shape they use allates plasticizers chemicals solvents all of that stuff it's really good at its job obviously it's really cheap so then when you take something hot and you put it up against it it naturally is going to come into the food you know good buddy of mine

Troy Swope started a company and he came from Yale and then he worked at Intel. And I'll get to the incredible work that he's doing right now. He was working on circuit boards. And they were testing chemicals of off gassing of all kinds of adhesives, plastics, and it would hurt the circuit board. So they had a chemistry profile and a testing protocol that was, like nothing anyone's seen. He had takeaway show up one day.

He saw his food wrapped in plastic. And because all these plasticizers and plastics he was working with and it was hurting the circuit. And all of a sudden, light bulb went off. He took the food and started testing it on in his lab. And he saw all of the same chemicals in his food. He started a new company using plant fibers and everything else, creating new packaging, Walmart, McDonald's, ConAgra, all these companies signing on. He's now creating another company.

He's doing that right now. Yeah. He's creating another company where they've already cracked the code on an healthy form of PFOS using algae. Right. So this is the hope. We are a victim of the system. So we are, it comes in plastic, our hot soup is like, you know, it's crazy. So we're just consuming endocrine disrupting chemicals and plasticizers and likely carcinogens.

These are the things. So what do you do? Right. Well, eliminate as much as you can take away food and ultra-process food. go back into the kitchen, prepare your meals, right? We really, it sounds like what you're saying is we really have to get back to the basics. Like we've, we've almost optimized and biohacked our way into oblivion. Oblivion.

You're going the wrong way. Yeah, we got to come back. We got to come back. What, you mentioned saunas. Is there something weird about the sauna that we need to know? Well, infrared sonnas can be a, electro-bolemen. magnetic radiation. Great. I did it for an hour this morning.

Right. Well, but, but most of them are on to it. I haven't dug into all of them. Most of them are doing proper grounding, remediation techniques, so you're not sitting in a EMF soup. So it doesn't mean that what you're sitting in is harmful. So just just go back to the company and see what they're saying about it and see. And also, easiest thing to do, if you really want to know, it'll a little device. I can share the one that I use and just go in there and turn it on.

And then you'll turn it on. If you're walking around my house with this device, Michael's going to think I... It's a sunlight and we have no partnership with them. So I'm... Sunlighten, I think they're pretty good though. Yeah, I think they are because I, it was 2016, I had a sunlighten and I think I did some tests on it. I do like the barrels better. Not to, I just like that the barrels get hotter. We just had someone on who was really into eating meat. and we've yet to have someone who is plant-based for as long as you have been plant-based. I have no opinion on either way. I just, I know what works for me.

You obviously know what works for you. I would love to hear your experience with being plant-based for 17 years. I'm really interested in that. Well, I'll tell you the context. You know, I have a physiology and nutrition background, and I was a normal kid from Minnesota. Like, I was an athlete, and I always bought into the idea, too. my digestion, I was maybe, started to bug me around 26 or something. So then I started kind of reading food stacking, when to eat proteins, when to not.

And then I was like, I remember, you know, when autophagy happens and senescence happens, the body doesn't want to get rid of amino acids. When you're in a fasted state? Any state. So when that's happening, yeah, when senescence essentially is happening, when your body is no law, it's done with that cell. That's made of proteins, lipids, everything else. It upcycles amino acids as a part of the preservation because it's harder. There's a lot of effort it takes to get proteins.

Sure. So I remember that. I'm like, huh, interesting. And so as I was kind of not feeling good, this was when I was 26 years old. And I was, I remembered that and I said, well,

you know, there's a lot of toxins in food. And there in lies the fatal convenience. I'm like, it's heavy metals and the fish and like, and the hormones and antibiotic resistant activity and the meat and everything else. So then I was like,

I may not need as much. And so I started eliminating. the, you know, animal based proteins. Then I started working out more. I put on weightlifting or endurance? You're a buff guy. Yeah. Yeah.

And I put on like back then, I put on 20 pounds of muscle. Wow. And I went completely the other way. And all my joints and everything else were just feeling incredible. And then of course, when I integrate and there's another big part of, of the story here, when I am able to integrate, like, I don't want to kill anything. I don't want to kill an animal. I don't think they're here for us. I think it's a ridiculous, unbelievably arrogant statement for anyone to say animals are here for us to slit their throats and eat. It's ridiculous.

Now, I just think that that's a bad argument. People can live how they want. I am not here to try to convince anyone. You just don't like the argument that people assume that the animals are here to sustain us. Yeah, it's a stupid. It's a ridiculous thing. You got to try AG1. Michael drinks this every single morning without fail and he absolutely loves it. He has like everything laid out. So when I come down super early, he has like his shaker and all the things. He has been talking about AG1 forever. He has it first thing in the morning. I like it a little bit later in the morning. So I'll wake up. I'll do my morning routine. I'll scrape my tongue. I'll get my lemon water. And then I'll do it usually like when I'm on the way to the gym. It gives me and makes me feel like I have more energy.

But I also just find it to be a really efficient, seamless way to get more vitamins, probiotics, make it drinkable. It's whole food source nutrients. And I feel like it's something healthy that I do for my self-care every day. I am a fan of frothing it with a frother. I mean, I love a frother. I like a brother. I like it over ice, a lot of water, but you could mix it up. You could also have it warm. I mean, you could do whatever you want here. If you want to up your self-care, then check out AG1. Also, if you want to take ownership of your health, it starts with AG1. Try AG1 and get a free one-year supply of vitamin D and you get five free AG1 travel packets with your first purchase. I love these little packets. They're so easy to put in your handbag.

great for travel. You're going to go to drinkag1.com slash skinny. That's drinkag1.com slash skinny. Check it out. I was just in Italy. And my vibe in Italy was like really bright colors mixed with a lot of white. And one of the colors that I was doing was orange. And so I went on eBay and I bought the most amazing authentic Celine clutch bag in orange. It's so cute. It has like a little handle. I could put it on my wrist. And the reason that I use eBay when I buy a handbag is because eBay has authenticity guarantee that protects buyers from fakes. So you know you're getting the real deal and you'll never get faked over again. This has happened to me before where I went on this random site and bought something and it was fake and I was very upset. So I really like that about eBay. The service

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Void and O&T. C-sportsbook.draftkings.com slash football terms for eligibility, terms and responsible gaming resources. Bonus bets expire seven days after issuance. Eligibility and deposit restrictions apply. So then cut to I'm superfood hunting for 20 years. I'm literally running around the globe, fascinated and curious, finding the most nutrient. And how does one begin to superfood hunt?

I know. It's funny. It's funny even saying that as it comes out of my mouth because I didn't give myself that title. It came by a business week article came and this guy. And maybe even just describe what. Yeah. So it came about innocently. When I lost my father in 2003, I was formulating. I was playing around with stuff and food and optimizing for training and for I was doing some triathlons and everything else. So I was optimizing. I was playing around with superfoods at the time. I lost my dad and it was just like, stop messing around. Like get to work, right? So I shifted gears and I really was like, I'm going to make this a business because I want to make this a business because what I'm really finding is incredibly fascinating in terms of nutrient dense foods, foods that people weren't using.

I was sick of looking at supplements and not seeing the integrity line up. Because I was like, why are they using this flow agent, this paraben, this glycol, why are they using these things that are clearly not healthy? And then the product itself was so neutered by the time the product it was in the bottle or the package, it just a light bulb went off. and the Minnesota kind of simple kid came out and said, well, where is the maca? Where is the sasha inchi? Where is the Unidigado? Where is the Incanberry? Where is the Kamu Kama?

Where is it? I got to meet the farmer, right? So I come from farmers. My dad taught at the university, taught a lot of farmers how to have managed. I'm going to the source. Yeah. So it innocently started, well, I'm going to create some product. I'm going to bring these things out, but I got to meet the farmer. I got to know how it's processed. We've got to preserve the incredible compounds that are there, really there, and that have been used for potentially 20,000 years when you look at Ayurveda and ashaeganda and things like that. So I was like, I'm not going to just create a product and then market it. I'm going to create a product that works. So I went, you know, first first trips.

went to South America and hired a guy Miguel Baruman. He still works for me, works for barucas. I think they give you guys barucas. I got to give you guys my, I got to give you guys my nuts. I would love them. I would love some of your nuts. I've never been excited, this excited, to have nuts. I cannot wait to try. Yeah, these are these. I don't know, Lauren. You look pretty excited the other night. Anyways. So that started the journey of You go to South America, you go to the Amazon, you go to the Andes. Next day you know, I walk away with not only knowledge of the certain botanicals I was looking into, but 25 other ones that I was able to look, feel, touch, see, understand, meet the farmer,

meet the collector, meet the forge, or meet the medicine man. And so it just became this. And so I got more formulating. I got, and then I, then the parts of it were like, wow, I could affect. their life if I can make a product for them because they're doing it authentically. So then it became this mission of- Effect the farmer's life you mean. Effect their life in a positive way.

Do this right so that the consumer actually is consuming the medicinal, powerful compounds that is innately in these plants. So cut to all over the freaking world, got hired by Beachbody, created Shakeology, kept formulating stuff, kept doing stuff, all these things. So that's a long way of answering the plant-based thing. So I'm exposed and exposing myself to some of the greatest nutrient-dense plants in the world. So then I was always like, okay, there's nutrients and meat, but how did it get there? In relation to that conversation, I see, I was reading the back of your book and two of the endorsements are Richel and Max Louvrevere who have both, they've both been on this show and we know

them, but both have completely different perspectives on diet as you all know. And I think this is a question that's very relevant, especially with someone who's practiced a plant-based diet as long as you have. What mistakes do you think people who practice plant-based make in terms of getting proper nutrients? Because I think some of the people that have come on and have maybe gone the other way and failed is it sounds like some of them don't get the nutrient sustainability that they need and it might be because maybe they're not practicing the way that you do. Totally. I think the ultra-processed part of it, the fake meats I have no, I think is ridiculous too.

Like when they're home-growing. No, like beyond. Yeah, the beyond and all of that stuff. It's just an ultra-processed version of ultra-processed food that I'm like, I just, I think it's horrible. Like they make, Michael, they take like pepperoni and they make it like, a fake process. No, no, I've seen it. The packaging in itself is questionable. Yeah. So, so if you, if you're, if you're a plant-based person and not eating many plants and just eating a bunch of

ultra-processing, you're going to sprint towards your own demise, for sure. And if you're not eating a wide variety of food, which is the demise of us anyway, we all have a handful of fruits and vegetables that we eat when our ancestors ate from 30 to 300 throughout the year, right? So we've lost that foraging. We've lost the flow, the rhythm of what is available at nature, you know, from nature at the time that it is. We're not growing our own food. So I think people should grow their own food, or at least know where their food's from, go to the farmer's markets, eat whole food, whole fresh food. So that's usually where people lose. And then from a superfood side of it, from a nutrient dense side of it, from we are all under stress. From 1930s, 1940s, there

was a study from 1950 to 1999. All of these things, they looked at soil. They knew that the nutrient density, the way we were farming, they knew that we were losing nutrients. So we all are losing nutrients by the way our system is. So that's where the superfood side of it is like let's get packed nutrient density to fill the gaps not only from an adaptogenic standpoint because of stress and stress response and remediation of some of that stress and the stress on the body. But the, but I think mostly it's the ultra processed kind of side of things where people start losing the qualities of and you can do that both plants or or animals what are three superfoods that someone can go online and order today that are super easy to order maybe you could share brands

well it depends on what they want i mean do we plump skin we want things that support toning that's very very clear in weight loss we want what else do we want we want to feel good we want to have energy. We want to sleep well. We want everything to be solved. And I want my husband to foyage. Forage. Forage. Forage. Forage. Forage. There's one superfood that can do it all. Just kidding. I'm like where.

Well, since we're moving into the fall season and collagen, the hot topic. But if you don't have high amounts of vitamin C, you can't you cannot produce natural collagen. Oh. So you say vitamin C. Scorbic acid, no bueno, right?

So go to high nutrient rich vitamin C. So a superfood that comes from the Amazon, one of my favorites, Camu Camus, right? Camus Camus. So that's a great... You just did some great PR for Camus Camus. Yeah, yeah.

So, I mean, I've known Zach, the owner of Navitas, over there. He sources great. He's known some of the people I've known in the Amazon for over 15 years as well. I'm not affiliated with Zach other than I'm a fan of those guys over there. So you can get a pack of whole bag of powdered camu camu that has a certain high amount of vitamin C. And you can add it to smoothies and you can add it to that. And you can mix it with your collagen because it's going to make. that work better, right? Potentially.

So would you mix it with collagen or would you just have it plain? I wouldn't. Okay. Yeah. But you're saying if you have high vitamin C, you'll be able to produce collagen on your own efficiently. Got it. I'm always about the foundation first.

Got it. Right? So many people jump steps. You jump steps of health. And you haven't, you know, you know, testosterone replacement therapy for men is so huge right now. But if they're not looking at the fatal convenience, of cell phones off the pocket,

parabins, thallates, everything that's lowering testosterone. Also, some great research. I know you can find research for anything, but some of the research I saw over 10 years ago was high amounts of meat. I was actually involved in a study where we took people, men and women, men off of meat and dairy for three weeks.

their testosterone, men's testosterone went up by over 30%. And then I looked at other studies and it was peer-reviewed studies that backed up our little study that showed eliminating meat increased men's testosterone. So, you know, points to ponder on that stuff. So that to say, we jump steps. There's a guys my age 30 years old using testosterone, for example, because we're, we're, we're, we're low in testosterone, there's a lot of foundational things in our systems, in our global system and in our body systems that we need to deal with. But then what are you eating? What are you exposed to? What are you not exposed to? Deal with that first before you start throwing

exogenous. A testosterone booster superfood. Oh, there's a, you know, rodeola is a fantastic one. For working out. It's good for working out. Poncat Ali is a great one. If you want another one that can help, if you want to produce babies. Podosia? Yeah. Don't get any idea.

We're done on babies for a second. Yeah. Horny goat weed. You know, there's, but again, all the adaptogens too will help to deal with some of the stress and that can help also regulate. One of the issues I have with some of the people that come on this show is, to your point, they jump to these extremes before they take care of the foundation. I'm going all meat or I'm going to all plant.

And I think, you know, I've heard people come on to see you have to have meat. And I've heard people come on and see you don't. And I think if you look at, I mean, this is a compliment. Guys like you and Rich are mutual friend Rich role. Like you guys are in phenomenal shape as you're continuing to grow older and as you continue to, you know, and you're continuing to perform. And I think like you're an example of someone who's not had meat and continue to thrive. And so I think my issue with a lot of people prescribing a lot of,

of these diets or even supplements that we're talking about. It's like maybe they're not doing the base level of things to just get themselves in decent shape, right, or in decent condition. Like, we could talk all about testosterone boosting, but how many men are actually going out there and being active and being physical and, you know, getting their mind right? Or eating horny go. Yeah, or like if people want to lose weight, like how many people are eating processed food or living in a shitty environment. Like, you can't just jump to the supplement. We just had Peter Atio on as well. We were talking about it. The jumping to these things right away before you clear the foundation, I think is causing a lot of problems.

Yeah, I mean, it's it's it's it's it's you know, we we constantly and we're marketed to, we want that thing and we all fall victim to it. We want that thing that's going to do the the magic testosterone, the the collagen boosting, but always going back to hey, I just sleep less. I mean people are sleeping like shit. hydration level. I mean, the chronic hydration, dehydration is so crazy that, you know, we, I think the latest is about 10% of Americans don't even drink an ounce of water a day. And then you can, of course, unpack what kind of water, right? And that's a whole other rabbit hole. Our friend share beans on some spring what right now doing, you know, gathering spring water somewhere.

Exactly. Exactly. So again, then you, so now you're talking about. skin health but your skin will give up its water well before it's going to have any vital organs be affected right so you want to look good I get freaking hydrated you want to look good sleep good you want to look good eat hydrating foods you know watermelons papaya things in season like all of the an exercise sweat go in the sauna all of these things and then Then, maybe. And then you get some blood work done and you see where you're optimized or not optimized.

And then you can make adjustments. But jumping over those steps, I think it's quite dangerous in a lot of ways. I want to know before you go how it was to work with Zach Ephron. Because I have to ask you that. All the girls want to know. And what did you exactly help? Oh, my God. His abs were just so.

How's his jawline? He has a great jawline. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean... What's his superfood intake? Does he mouth tape. Does he what? Mouth tape. Mouth tape.

I'm glad I didn't. I thought I heard you say that I thought you said, does he manscape? Oh, well, you could tell us that too. And I'm grateful not to know that. Listen, Zach and I started as friends. He had reached out from Rich Roll's podcast back in the day. and he connected because he heard something I was talking about and wanted to know what I was up to and superfoods and stuff like that.

So he's always taken care of himself. So it started by way of that. So, you know, when we did this show, you know, the thing that the last thing, honestly, I wanted to do was do something that I really care about, which is health of people and health of the world, and do it with a celebrity. It's the last thing I wanted to do.

but the way this happened serendipitously because of his heart because of him sharing what he cared about I was sharing the idea that I had for this show and he was able to walk it basically in that meant a lot to me and he's a sweet kid I mean I think you know he has a hell of a we got into it a little bit on the show but you know at 15 you're thrown into a world no one can understand except someone else may be close to what he went through. And so you see that that's intense, man. It's really intense. And that happened young. And for him to just keep his life on together and to also commit to things that are beyond him, which he did on the show. I was super grateful for it. So he's, you know, he's a sweet, sweet kid. So it was his brother, Dylan.

I think everyone should go by your book. I'm going to use this as my Bible. I'm going to highlight. I don't know if I can read this then and get some good sleep, though. I'm going to, you know. Oh, well, there's going to be no Wi-Fi in our house tonight. That's getting turned off. So don't even think about it.

That is definitely, and there's no phone next to your ear. No AirPods. We're getting Camu Camus. I have all this stuff written down. If you even put a glide flostick next to my head, Oh, really quick. Little tip for Michael. Michael loves hair paste.

He goes. No, I go to the EWG now. He goes. Oh, that's good. Yes. Okay. That's okay. Okay.

I didn't know that. Is that new? Yes, I got different kinds. Okay, but do you have to wear the hair paste to bed on the pillow? And then he comes over and he wants an itch on the hair paste because he likes his head itch, not that head. Listen. He likes his head itch.

And I'm like, I think that's a marital thing. I don't know if I can help you. Can we just go natural? I read the outsiders by S.E. Hinton, right? Is that the writer when I was 13 and now I just greased it back ever since? Why don't you use this? How about? How about this?

How about this for a great up level hack? Try oxygenated olive oil. Oxygenated? I've never heard that. I will try that. So it's going to be super good for your skin, your head. And it's going to smell like a, it's going to smell like a, it's going to smell like ozone. The Italian side of me, he's really going to love it. Yeah, it's going to smell like

fresh rain. That's my last thing with him. He's doing everything right besides the flostick and the hair paints. See, let me know how it works. I've got to change this name back, you know. Yeah, oxygenated olive oil. Oxygenated. Okay. And it's good for you. You can use it as it's nice utility. Rub it everywhere. Yeah. Nobody's giving me a tip for the hair yet. So now, Darren, I got to keep you a little more often. The whole entire podcast, I was like, I can't wait to ask him for a step. Fatal conveniences, the toxic products and harmful habits that are making you sick and the simple changes that will save your help available on Amazon. Where else? Where can we find you? Where can we DM you, stock you, ask you all the questions.

Yeah, yeah. Anywhere we're Darinolene.com, social, all of that stuff. Yeah. And anywhere you love to buy books. Thank you for coming on. You're welcome back anytime. I could have talked with you for days. You can listen and watch our podcast on YouTube. All you have to do is search the skinny confidential him and her show. It is on YouTube. You can watch. You can see reactions in real time. It's kind of fun to have us in your living room, too, like on TV.

It's like we're all hanging out. Go to YouTube and search the skinny confidential him and her podcast and make sure you've read it and reviewed us on iTunes. See you next time.