The Bossticks - If You Want A Career Change Listen To This - How Megan DiVincenzo Left Her Law Practice To Chase Her New Dream

Episode Date: April 15, 2021

#348: On today's episode we are joined by Megan DiVencenzo to discuss how to change career paths and pursue your dreams. Megan joins the show to discuss how she went from lawyer to founder. We also discuss what it takes to chase your passion and pursue your dreams.  This episode is brought to you by The Sis Kiss To check out the Sis Kiss click HERE To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Sis Kiss FOR 25% OFF SIS KISS ITEMS USE CODE SKINNYSIS25 AT CHECKOUT AT WWW.THESISKISS.COM  Produced by Dear Media

The following podcast is a dear media production. This episode is brought to you by The Sis Kiss. This episode is brought to you by Array. My God, we are on a theme of bloat here. We've talked all about how to fix facial bloat with the skinny confidential hot mess ice roller. And now we are going to talk about bloat in the body. I have talked about this product so much on Instagram.

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So go to array.com and use code TSC at checkout. You are going to be obsessed with these bloat capsules. They are all natural. Like I said, you're going to go to array.com and use code TSC at checkout for 10% off. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire. Fantastic. And he's a serial entrepreneur. A very smart cookie.

And now Lauren. Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her. She was one of the first people that I sent one of my name necklaces to. She was pregnant and I found out through whoever or on Instagram that she was going to name the baby Collins. So I was like, hey, I went to my manufacturers and I'm like, can we make this like I drew it? Like little charms that hang from a necklace and can you make it say, I don't know, Collins.

Maybe I'll send it to Brittany, Loverly Gray. I didn't know her and she didn't know me and I just sent it with like a card. Like I didn't speak for her company. I didn't speak to her. Well, the next thing I know, my phone was like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. And like to see how powerful that one story was, it turned my life around. Hello, hello. Welcome back to the skinny confidential him and her podcast.

It's Lauren. No Michael. I am hopped up on green juice. I just took my array. I'm having a little bone broth. and I could not be more excited about the guest that we are having on the podcast today. This is someone that has not taken no for an answer. She has hustled her face off.

She has been creative and strategic with her approach in social media. And it's no surprise that she's on the podcast today. She truly was an attorney. And one day just had had it. She had it with being a lawyer. And she said, I am going to do what I'm meant to do. and that is start a jewelry company. I am referring to Megan D. Vincenzo.

She is the owner of Cleveland-based women's accessory brand, The Sis Kiss. You guys, she has quite the story, and I personally think this is incredibly inspiring for anyone who wants to go after their goals. After working her fucking face off, she realized the side hustle wasn't just a side hustle, and her passion, her drama and desire

has returned with every order and every opportunity for growth with the cis kiss. I wear her jewelry all the time on stories. I'm a huge fan. If you're going to start with one of her pieces, I personally would recommend the little initial necklace. I have a Z. It's a little diamond.

And if you don't want to do diamond, I'm all about the boss necklace. My boss is for boss stick, but you could wear the necklace if you're a boss. And it's so beautiful. We're actually doing a giveaway. All you have to do to win is follow at the cis kiss on Instagram. and tell us your favorite part of this episode on my latest Instagram at Lauren Bostick.

The boss necklace is so cute. I cannot take it off. It's adorable. Most importantly, it saves time. And I know this sounds weird, but I wear mine in the shower, in the jacuzzi, whatever. And the integrity is still beautiful. I am such a fan of Megan's jewelry and such a fan of how her and her team have built this product line solely based, primarily based on social media.

I know you'll absolutely love meeting. Megan, with that, let's welcome the founder of the cis kiss, Megan, to the skinny confidential, him and her show. This is the skinny confidential, him and her. Okay. I am so excited for this interview. This is going to be such a hustler, entrepreneurial episode. I want to know what is going through your head when you're a criminal defense attorney and you decide, fuck it, I want to do something different. What's the epiphany? Well, it was actually pretty easy epiphany because I literally had a panic attack in court. And I had never had a panic attack before. And like it was like I almost knew what it was, but I didn't know what it was because I had never had one before. But I felt like my breath right, like quickening. And then like I saw myself out of my body like standing at the podium in front of the judge. And everything was yellow and my ears were ringing. And I knew I had to speak like like Megan, speak, speak. He's waiting for you to speak. And I couldn't. And I couldn't. And, I somehow pulled myself together and everything was fine and like I didn't mess anything up but like I knew it was time to go.

Like if anything would make me feel that anxious or unhappy because for the months leading up to that I was unhappy and feeling a lot of anxiety and a lot of stress. And that was like and I went home and like told my husband and he's like, you're pacing in the morning. Your breath is always like always always quickened. He's like you need to. It's time. Like you need to leave. So everyone's in COVID right now. maybe people are feeling similar to how you're feeling. Before you had the panic attack in court,

how were you dealing? Did you know that you wanted to do something creative? And was it that line of law work that was giving you the panic attacks, or was it just law in general? I think the line of work and some of the clients were a lot of it. Sometimes it just became too much. Like I did it for a really long time. I did it for about a year. It's not really long time. But it was a long time to be in criminal defense. And I think at some point, it's, like I was always dealing with someone else's problems and not really focusing on any of mine. And it was like, I want to focus on more my life and my family. And I had a son at this time. Like, I just had him. And I was dropping him off a daycare and sobbing. And I'm like, this isn't

happiness. And it's different now when I drop my kids off at school or the sitters because I love what I'm doing. And now I'm building a warehouse where there's a room for them. And there's a room for my employees that had children because I know that mom guilt and I know you're feeling it now too because I follow you and it's it's a real thing and I'm sure dad's feel it too but I don't I can't speak on behalf my husband's amazing so we're a team and if it wasn't for the team I don't know how we would be able to do it and I don't know how I got sidetracked on to that but the mom guilt and coupled with being unhappy and then having the panic attack was just like okay this is this is rumble strips I called it rumble strips because my son sent me an article that Oprah wrote

Like you veer off so many times before you ever like hit a wall. And then it's like, oh, that's what those rumble strips were. That's what the panic attack was. That was why you were sweating three weeks ago. Like those are all the rumble strips to get you off the path before you hit the wall. So I wanted to jump off before I hit the wall. I don't think we've ever had a former criminal defense attorney on the show. And I wonder morally, like if you're as a morally good person when you're defending criminals, like what's going through your mind?

because obviously you probably don't disagree with a lot of what you're defending, or you probably don't agree with a lot of what you're defending, but is it like you just kind of take it case by case, or are there some, you're just like, I can't defend, like how does that work? I viewed it as everyone not only received a defense to make sure that the system did everything that they were supposed to do. It starts with like, did the police do what they were supposed to do when they pulled you over.

So that doesn't really have anything to do with like what the crime was. Does, did your defendant, do they need some sort of help? do they need treatment? Can I help assist that? So I was very always on board with like, can we get him into rehab or her into rehab or a program that would help. So it's not just open and close to me. It was always like, well, what else is going on? And has anyone in the system ever tried to assist this person? So I felt like I was almost not like their, and I was. You know, you're their defender, but I'm also like assisting them through the system. Because the system is so, maybe you can speak on that a little bit. We both are friends.

friends with Ingrid, who if you guys have read her book, fuck my life. It's all about her experience with the prison system. And it sounds like it's so flawed. Even this is random, but even just watching this show that Michael and I watched called 60 Days In and seeing the way that the prisoners have no ability to be rehabilitated is wild. Yep. And yeah, it's been so long since I've been in law that I can't really speak to the system like as of today. But I tried to get them before they got into the system. Like, does that make sense? Like, if I was able to, like, wipe their record clean because they did, like, a program and then they come back in six months and we can take it off their record, that's like a complete win-win. So I never really thought of it as

what they did. Yeah, I guess, or if they didn't. I guess in my mind, I was going to, like, the extreme examples, like somebody that murdered their wife or something, like something crazy. But I think what you're talking to them is like someone maybe has a substance problem and they did something stupid that maybe they could recover from. So I was like, I think those are two completely separate things. And I wonder, like, on the extreme example, and maybe you didn't encounter me, you did, like, what do you do with those extreme examples if you fully, you know, like maybe you disagree with the behavior that that person performed? You have panic attacks in court. Yeah. Okay. So I just have to ask this, what is jail like? I'm such a voyeur when it comes to

jail. I just want to sit there and watch it. What is it like when you're walking through the jail? Or were you not doing that? No, I would go visit our clients in jail. But it's different. Then you're not going to the general population to have a meeting sit down. So you know, your client would be brought to you to a room. And it is different. And I've always been dressed like in pink and pink heels and nails. So I've always stood out a little bit. And so. Yeah, she looks hot. She has like a fierce ponytail right now. You're doing a red lip, a bold brow. If I'm sitting across from you in court and I'm in my scrubs, I mean, you're looking good. Or the prisoner's popping boners left and right. I will say that one time somebody in prison was jacking off when I was walking through. Oh my God. And I went home and I told my husband, I'm like, well, I had an interesting day at the jail today. I don't know if that was directed towards me or if I just caught him in the middle because you

kind of walk through and some of them have like glass windows. I would come home and say to Michael, sorry. I'm going to cheat if you keep acting like this. Someone's jacking off to me. It was interesting. And like to kind of circle back to the beginning, like I loved it. Like this is not like, like I had my own law firm when I first graduated law school. I've always been an entrepreneur. Like I got out of law school and it was like, boom, we're going to,

we're going to hang my shingle. And I loved it. Like, loved. Like, I loved it until I didn't. And then once, you know, people change. And when I didn't, it was time to go. And now I look back at it and it was an amazing experience. I don't have regrets. I think it's made me who I am today. Because sometimes I'm mad that I'm like 41 and I wish this journey would have happened sooner because I feel like, God, I'm already 41. Do you ever feel like, I'm not saying either of you are old, but do you ever feel like, man? Yeah, I wish I didn't go to college. I wish I just started blogging.

For sure. I even say to my son, sorry, mom, that that's not something that, like, I feel like when I was growing up, that was just known. It was the criteria. Like, you got to get into college. Yeah, I think it's changed in different fields, especially as like the world's evolved in new media, like, for Dear Media, for example, there's, even if you went to college, you can have a general, like, business degree, but there's not necessarily classes that had been taught for the medium that we're in, right? I mean, I guess broadcasting or communication, but

like, I'd never look at college resumes when I'm hiring. No. No, I don't even look at resumes at all. Yeah. I'm like, I can imagine that being a lawyer too helps you so much in business now, but I would love to go back to your childhood. Did you always know that you wanted to be a lawyer or did you also explore that creative side of you? Because you're creative, you're entrepreneurial, but then you became a lawyer. Like, what was your childhood like? I was always talkative and argumentative. And my mom always had wanted to go to law school, and I feel like that was always, she never pushed me. It was just she would tell me. So I feel like, and I'm loud and I'm boisterous and I'm argumentative.

It made sense. And like I said, law school was amazing. I loved law school. Like all that argument at work, yeah, I'm just, I feel like I'm just a different person now. But growing up, I was always like this. And what's great about my parents and like my husband now, they are similar to where be yourself. Like, of course they shake their head at the dumb stuff I do and the dumb shit I say. But it was always like, well, that's Megan.

Like, just do what makes you happy. I mean, I think my mom is a little bit disappointed. Like, don't you miss law? Like, just kind of like that. And I'm like, no. And I don't even need to think about it. Like, I can say, no, I don't at all. Like, I can't imagine doing anything but what I'm doing now.

Isn't it interesting how much pressure our parents can dictate the direction of our life? I am very, very lucky where my parents never tried to dictate that. the more people we interview, a lot of them wildly successful, had parents that put so much pressure on them to be someone who they weren't. And I feel like you want to please them. Yeah. Like, I had great parents. Like, I didn't want to disappoint them. Like, even if they weren't shoving it down my throat, I felt like that was the path that was supposed to be on college. And then what are you going to do after college? And I went to law school and then it was be a lawyer. So when I quit, it kind of came out of like, like, well, you're going to go back, right? Like,

it was kind of like that. Like, okay, she's just going through something, which they were so, supportive of. Like my dad came to stay with me. My mom came to stay with me. They helped me figure out what Zoloft to get on because I needed something like I became depressed and anxious. And they were so supportive. But I think after a while they're like, so you're going to go back? And I'm like, nope. And I just kept going and here like just kept going. So walk us through from the point that you have the panic attack to you launching your business. I want to know what the ugly struggle stuff looks like between there because I'm sure it wasn't easy. Well, and I had a baby at home. How old?

I bet he was like a one and a half too. I never used to ask ages of kids until you have one. Because then you have more context. And you're like, so what's, what was you doing when he was? Was he nine peas at you two? Yeah. He was like one and a half or two. And it didn't look pretty because I'm like a workaholic.

And like I don't sit down and watch TV. Not that I don't, I would like to. It's just that's not how my brain works. Like I'm like, what's next? Who's doing this? Like, we should brand this. Like even with my friends, I'm like, where are you going to brand that? Like, you're really good at it.

You should open a business. So my mind, when I quit law, was like, it didn't help. Like, I thought, like, I was going to be this, like, a moment where, but I was still pretty anxious in the past for a while. And I think getting on the proper medicine. And then I redecorated our house like 400 times. And my husband's like, okay, you need a job. Oh, God.

So I got a job in interior design. Michael won't even let me move the to where I want it. So that's impressive. He literally, I looked at the to my go, do you really want to fucking start a fight? with me on where the toaster's going. I told him to get busy. I know how this thing starts. It starts with the toaster and it goes the whole house.

That's really nice that your husband lets you decorate the house. I can't move the toaster. We would not get along. You have an opinion about pink colors and stuff? Like her version of can't is me saying, hey, do you really need to do that? And then she does it anyway. Like that's her version of I can't. You're going to move it anyway.

Yeah, of course she does. Yes, dear. Yes. Dear. Should be the name of this podcast. My husband does have opinions more recently if we're redoing the house for like the fourth time. And he's over it. And finally he put his foot down the other day.

He's like, this is not the tile I wanted for the bathroom. And I was like, who you? Like, who does? You show up after four renovations. And now we're going to cause a problem. He's had enough. Yeah, he's like, listen, I'm done. This is the last time I were doing this bitch. And it's going to be what I like. All they have to do is just be quiet. I know. So you're depressed. You're anxious at this point. I feel I've talked to some entrepreneurs on here. And a lot of them say the opposite of progression is depression. So you maybe felt like you weren't progressing in an area. So how did you channel all this energy to create? the successful business that you have now. And you have celebrities wearing your jewelry. I'm obsessed with it, specifically the nameplate necklace. It's so cute. And show it on Instagram stories. But how did you create this huge empire from feeling depressed and anxious? Who does not want their wine in a can? Bev is where it's at. I am throwing my friend Erica, fashion lush on Instagram, a bachelorette party at the end of this month. And we ordered all the Bev. I am obsessed. You guys have seen this all over Instagram, okay? It's a female first canned wine brand that was founded to change not only the way

products consumed, but the way an industry and culture has operated for generations. The industry with wine I found is very, very masculine. A lot of males are in it. But Bev is breaking norms and creating something from a female perspective. I'm so happy about this because they get the whole Instagram aesthetic, which is super important. I don't want to be drinking some ugly can of rosé on stories. okay, let's keep it cute. They have five varietals, which is why I wanted to bring it to the

bachelor's party. Everyone can have something. There's rosé, saviant, blanc, pinot gris, which pinot noir. And they also have this limited edition. It's like this extra fizzy, sparkling white wine. Out of all the varietals, my favorite is the rosé. I like to have it in the can with a straw. Their wines are dry, crisp, a little fizzy. They're not too sweet, which is a big, big thing for me. I don't like an overly sweet wine. They're so refreshing. crushing delicious zero sugar and only three carbs and 100 calories per serving. They also make a great gift for bachelorette parties, hosting, and social distance hangouts. Bev ships straight to your door and shipping's always free. Of course, as always, we worked out an exclusive deal for skinny

confidential podcast listeners. You're going to receive 20% off your first purchase plus free shipping on all orders. I personally suggest trying their best selling ladies night variety pack so you guys can check out all of their delicious varietals. That is the one I'm bringing to The Bachelorette. You're going to go to Drinkbev.com slash skinny or use code skinny at checkout to claim this deal. That's D-R-I-N-K-B-E-V-com slash skinny. Cheers.

So literally my sister and I wanted to buy wire-wrapped bracelets. Do you remember? They had the big stones on them. Yeah, totally. And we have tiny wrists. Like literally we would buy one and like we'd put our hand down and they'd just drop to the floor. And I was like so annoyed.

And she's like, well, maybe I can make this. And I'm like, because she's so crafty. My sister's like a perfectionist. She's like, I'm the thinker. She's like the perfect doer. And I don't have that ability. Like you could tell me to sit down and make a bracelet. I would have to give you like my two kids first because it ain't going to happen.

So I was like, Marley, you could totally make this. So she like literally like studied it because she's such a perfectionist. And she like bought the wire and then bought the beads and then made one. And I was like, oh. And then there goes my head. Like, we'll make me one and, like, make mom's friends ones. And, like, we should sell these. And she was like, no, man.

Like, they're just like for us. And then we, people were like, well, can you make it in our size? Like somebody who maybe had a larger wrist. So we started making them for people who needed special sizing. And then, like, literally we used to write down at the end of each day, like, mom's friend, Susie wants a bracelet and this size brown beads. And then, like, Megan wants a new one that's a size small and blue beads. And like, we would just find the blue beads.

or brown beads. We didn't have like any for you to pick from. And then we'd make them and they would buy them. And then I just decided to run with it, man. Like I was like, let's do this. I remember the feeling. Break it down for someone who's sitting right now in quarantine and wants to leave their job that they don't like. Break, break it down. Did you have, did you get quickbooks? Did you do paperwork? Like, what did you do? We wrote on the pizza box. Like a business plan. My dad wrote it on a pizza box. I came up with the name because. So I'm like, it has to buy. I'm like a cutesy.

And we came up with the name and then I had a local boutique in our hometown by a few of them. And like literally I took champagne because that was like our first, she bought like 10 bracelets at a time. And I was like. I can tell that you're very like even when you show up today. You're very detail oriented. You have the stickers on the present. I'm not surprised you bought champagne. Well, it was for me.

Oh, for you? I thought you meant for the store. I'm like, I'm not surprised. No, girl. I like literally popped it in their show. You know what? Good for you. That's even fucking better. I was like, can I drink in here? And that was our first, like, wholesale order. And then I joined the boutique hub. I don't know if you're familiar with them. They're online. And it's a bunch of people who own boutiques. And they started buying them. And literally here I am. Like, literally. How many years later? So this was 2013. Okay. I really want you to get in depth and very micro on how you've grown your business on Instagram. Because I've watched you from the beginning from afar really.

work with influencers in a powerful way, work with micro influencers in a powerful way. How have you used Instagram to build this brand? I mean, the most cliche answer is you. I mean, you were my number one. Thank you. I didn't know that. Yeah. Well, geez. Literally, my branding and everything I learned from you. Like, literally. I remember, like, having this as a side hustle and listening to your podcast in the gym. Because I've always used working out as like my therapy. And then I used to always just blast rap music. And I'm like, one day I was like, man, what the fuck? What's this doing for me? Like, learn something. Raising cortisol, Ingrid would say. Oh, I don't know. Some of that music gives you some good hustle. No, no, no. That raises cortisol. I just listened to this

podcast and I like throughout. I was like, I'm doing this all fucking wrong. Like, I'm eating all the tofu. The dogs are barking every time I ring the door or somebody rings the doorbell. No, and listening to your pot and like branding, branding, branding, branding, branding. And like, that's always been who I am. Like, I always had my name on things when I was little. Like, why not paint my name on it? Like, this is me. Like, I want everybody to fucking know it. But like, you like, pinpointed it to like how you can make it be part of your brand. Like I could sell the worst jewelry ever, but if it comes in the branded pretty package, that's what you're selling. Now, trust me, I'm not selling the worst jewelry ever. Quality means everything to me. That's not

what I mean at all. I just mean the business is branding. It's not jewelry. I think everything's branding, right? And if you take it to a macro level, a lot of, you know, everyone hears the success stories of venture scale business that raise a lot of money and they, you know, become a unicorn. But what they don't here is like 95% of these things go to zero. And it's because most people don't put enough thought into brand. They go and they put thoughts into like, how am I going to sell? Who are my retailers? Who my wholesal? They put all of the control in other people's hands. They'll use something like, oh, I'm going to run traffic on Facebook or Instagram or Google. But as soon as that changes or overcrowded, that channel goes away. And if you don't build brand, then you can't survive any of

those bumps. Or if you don't build brand and you're reliant on a bunch of retailers or wholesalers, then again, you can't survive the bump. So brand is the most important thing. to think about in any business. And I feel like some people will pass it over if they're starting out and they're new. Like I don't have the extra money to make gifts or Jiffs. That's how old I am that I never know. I don't know what it is either. My son corrects me every fucking time.

Leo, is it Jips? I think it's Jips. Okay. And it does get expensive. And I can understand if you're starting out as a small business, why you're going to take things like that might not seem huge at the time and not put the extra money into it. Like, no, I have.

People think that they need to spend the money and get the immediate sale to keep the cash going, but it's also it's a short-sighted play because if you don't build a strong brand from the beginning, all that eventually those plays are going to fall over and you're not going to be able to keep up. 100%. And I always say like some of my girls on my team get mad like, hey, we sent this necklace to so-and-so and they've never worn it. I'm like, this is a long game. This is not, this is not a sprint. This is maybe in two years she's going to put it on and it's going to be at the Grammys. I do that all the time too. Sometimes a brand will send me something like in January and I won't wear it until June. As a digital creator, you do get a lot of stuff.

Some stuff I try to give back to the audience. Some stuff I wear myself. But the way you wear it is not necessarily the second you get it. And it's got to fit what you're doing on the feed. Yeah. Like I almost didn't wear this red skirt because it doesn't fit my feed. It sure doesn't fit your feed. Yeah, red doesn't.

Maybe we can turn it pink. So like my team like had a meeting about it. Like, well, now she's wearing a red skirt. Like, what the fuck? I got to switch the feed. I'm sure Erica would be excited about hearing all that too. I was going to say something about the micro. Oh, I want to know how you leveraged influencers and micro influencers and how you built this big

Instagram platform and this brand through Instagram because I feel like a lot of it is through Instagram. So can I give like a little shout out to a blogger? Okay. So Loverly Gray is one of the first people. I don't know if you guys follow her. She's amazing. She's a mom and she's so good at what she does. And she was one of the first people that I sent one of my name necklaces to.

She was pregnant and I found out through whoever or on Instagram that she was going to name the baby Collins. So I was like, it was a sample. That was my sample necklace. Like, hey, I went to my, you know, manufacturers. And I'm like, can we make this like I drew it? Like little charms that hang from a necklace. And can you make it say, I don't know, Collins. Maybe I'll send it to Britney, Leverly Gray. I didn't know her and she didn't know me. And I just sent it with like a card. Like, congratulations on your upcoming. It was personal. Oh, it was personal. I didn't speak to her company. I didn't speak to her. Well, the next thing I know, my, I was like having dinner with my husband and Leo, my son, and my phone was like, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. And she had come

home from a trip, and she immediately put it on and, like, took to Instagram. And, like, to see how powerful that one story was said, it turned my life around. And not, and she knows how forever grateful I am for her. And, like, she wasn't paid to do that. Like, she just really loved it. And I think it showed, it showed through, shown through on the feed that was like, holy shit, I just got home from the trip and look at this necklace. And like that translates to me. So like sometimes like yes, I think you need to spend money on influencers 100,000 percent. But if it's not going to come across as like authentic or something that you would really wear, then I think your audience knows that. So I think not only is it paying, but it's doing it the right way with the right people with the right products.

Something that you said is really important. I see a lot of influencers and bloggers, that they won't post unless they're paid. And that's a very ask, ask, ask mentality. My mentality has always been... Jab, jab, jab. Just support and give and show what you like. And guess what? So many of the things that I've shown 100 times

have turned in to sponsorships and partnerships. And it's a win for everyone because the audience likes it. I really like it and I'm using it. And the brand sees that, like, it's organic. So I think if you're out there and you're listening, what you said, Megan, is so smart. It's just post what you like. Yep. Even if it's not paid.

Even if it's not paid. Even if it's not fun. Cares. Just post it. If you like it, don't only post stuff you're paid for. Well, it goes back to that like long and short-sighted viewpoint, right? I think like I wish more people going into any venture where it's a creative venture or a podcast, a business or whatever, would look at it as like, okay, this is going to be a 20-year run or a 10-year run minimum. And I think if people did that, they would make smarter decision.

But the problem is this is a new medium when you think about influencers. But it's history repeating itself. There was the traditional celebrities before that runs its course. And I always try to point out of all those traditional celebrities in the 80s, 90s, how many of them are still at the top? Very few. Same thing with influencers. Like there's going to be people that catch fire really quick. But unless they have a long view approach of this, they'll be flashes in the pants too.

And so I think just like anything else, you have to have a long approach and you can't do things that are short-sighted along the way like only do things for pay or only shout out people that are hot at the time. go to work, because you never know who's behind you on that path that's going to be huge one day. Well, and I feel like a lot of it now are genuine friendships. Like I, you're either in my life or you're out of my life. And I don't mean to be like that. That's just how I'm built. Like you're like, like, you're like family to me or like, you're like my acquaintance. And that's just the way I am. So it's like, when I like love someone, it's like wholeheartedly. And when I send these presents, like a lot of this is not ciscus because that's not how I give presents. This isn't not like, here's your sponsor box. Like, no. I know. I know.

know what you like. I've followed you for song. I respect you. I picked things that I think you would love. It has nothing to do with the ciscus. We need more people like you. I do have my eye on that Brnello. Well, I knew you guys. Yeah, the Bernou, that's very, very sweet. She brought us a burnello and you really, really must know us because that is our favorite varietal wine. I do. I do. Well, my husband's a big, big wino and he picked it for you. That is so, so sweet. What's your husband's name? Brian. Hey, Brian. Thank you, Brian. Thank you, Brian. You got good taste, brother. I want to really, really talk a little bit more about how you used Instagram.

Okay. Okay. So let's like get very, very detailed. So let's say there's someone who's building a brand just like you. Are you going into influencers' DMs and just DMing them and saying, hey, I want to send you something, looking at their feed and personalize something? Like, explain it to someone who wants to start a business, how, what your strategy was. And I'll give you an example of what I mean. When I first started the Skinny Confidential to, I would go on Twitter and I would DM or on my Twitter feed, go to like a housewife and say, I'm dying to interview you on the Skinny Confidential. I want to share blank, link and blank to make it personal. Who can I email? So I would do a hundred of those a day. And what ended up happening is I got 80 knows, 10 crickets and then 10 yeses. So I leveraged the 10 crickets to get the neck or the 10 yeses to get the next.

10 yeses. What did you do, like, those little things every day, those little habits that helped build the brand? So you did the Gary V method. Very Gary V. Yeah. Everything I do is very Gary V. Same-ish. Like, I was the same, like, oh, I love her. Like, how edgy she is. Like, I love that she says, fuck. Like, I like people that are so real. And, like, if I'm following you and I love your vibe, then, like, yeah, I'm going to DM you and be like, I'd love to, like, send you some jewels. Would you like to work together? It's a little different now because now I feel like I get a lot of, can you email my agent, which is fine because it's a business. But I like to create the personal relationship. Like, I get that you have an agent and that you have to go through people.

And, but I miss a lot of that building relationships via like a chat. Quick break because I need to discuss birth control. I've recently had so many DMs from women all over the world asking for more resources and information and discussion around birth control. So I learned recently that there are more than 21 million women who are not using hormonal birth control, and I'm one of them. But now the FDA recently approved a birth control option that's completely hormone-free. You guys may have seen me talk about this on Instagram already. So it's called fexy. And it's this combination of lactic acid 1.8%, citric acid 1%, potassium biderate, 0.4%.

it's this vaginal birth control gel that comes in a small applicator like a tampon and it works immediately and can be used up to an hour before sex. So basically you apply the gel before you have sex and only use it when you need it. But you have to apply it again before each act of vaginal sex. So when you try it, remember, one dose, one hour, one act. And I have to tell you guys how it works because it's insane really. Like I kind of geeked out when I learned this. And you know me, I had to over share. We're going to go there. Normally, without Fexi, when a guy comes and semen enters the vagina, it causes the pH of your vagina to increase, which allows sperm to keep swimming and make their way up there to fertilize your egg. Are you listening, Michael and Taylor? So Fexe works by

maintaining the vaginal pH to a level that reduces the mobility of the sperm, reducing the chance of the sperm reaching the egg. How awesome is that? While Fexe could be a great option for many women like me who are seeking hormone-free birth control, it isn't right for everyone. So be sure to tell your health care provider if you have a recent history of three or more urinary tract infections per year. And obviously, as with any new birth control, be sure to check for any ingredients in Fexi you or your partner may be allergic to. The most common side effects reported by clinical trial participants are vaginal burning, itching, and yeast infection. Some male partners also reported local discomfort. And remember, Fexe only works when used before sex and it doesn't

protect against STIs, including HIV. To learn more about Fexi, ask your healthcare provider and visit Fexi.com for complete product information. That is PHEXXXI.com. And Michael, don't pop a boner. Another thing, too, I think is important. If you're an influencer or a digital creator and someone says, I want to send you something, I always go and look at their page.

I'm like, okay, is this a small business? There's a girl the other day that spun into my DMs and she said, I want to send you this beautiful cheese plate. make cheese plates. And so I went on her page. She's just starting out. She has a thousand followers. I'm not going to say email my manager. You're not going to go to the agent for the cheese plate. It's just like I like the cheese plate. I'll use the cheese plate. I want to put the cheese plate up. Just send me a cheese plate and it's natural. I think as creators like you have to suss out what makes sense. If a huge brand comes to you Walmart and they're like, we want to send you stuff, sure.

Bring the manager in. Of course. Can you talk a little bit about small business and how important it is to support small business. Well, everything. I mean, like, if Brittany wouldn't have put that necklace on, where would we be? Like, literally, I have no idea, and I'm just so grateful. Like, I say it all the time, and I'm sure she gets tired of hearing it because I talk about her on every podcast because people want to know, well, what happened? Well, that's what happened, literally. And you got to shoot your shot. Like, my friend Alexa, who's here and I talk about it all the time. Like, it might be, you got to shoot your shot. So, like, maybe you're right. If I send out 100 presents or promo packages, 80 of them don't get open.

or not seen, 20 might, and those 20 can make the hugest impact. That is such a good mentality. Yeah. And what you have. Like I said with my girls, sometimes I get really frustrated. I'm like, you're going to miss every package you don't send. So send them. Send them.

And even we started a new diamond line recently. And of course, it's a little bit more expensive to send those packages. But you got to. You know what's hard about jewelry that I think about this a lot. It's small. Yep. So there's been many times where I've worn your jewelry. but you can't see it on my Instagram feed. So I'll show it on stories, but you can't see it on

Instagram. How do you battle that? If someone has a product that's small, what are the tips and tricks to fix that? My polymailer bag is so branded. My stickers are so, so edgy and like we have a middle finger. And so guess what? And then our organza bag matches. And there's a free hair tie with every purchase. Then we have cards that say, like, are you a baddie? Are you a classy? Are you, you know, we ask questions on the inserts. So guess what? People don't get the jewelry and say, like, look what she just sent me. They lay out the packaging.

So then it's like the bram. So it's not about the small piece of jewelry. It's about the ciscus. Like when, you know, when I'm flying away in my private jet that says the siskis on it, it's not going to be. What color is it going to be because red doesn't fit the feet? It's black mat. Okay. Or we could go pink.

And if you want to come on, we can like talk about it. What's the tone of pink? Can I move the toaster in the jet? I like a, I like a blue tone of pink. I am going to fucking do it anyway. So it's not the piece of jewelry. I think they're Instagramming the brand. And I love it.

Like, I am like, if I knew how to do the graphics, I would be 24-7, like, cranking them out. I'm going to say something and you can agree or disagree, and please disagree if you do. I think Instagram stories are more powerful than Instagram. And blogs. 100%. Can you talk on that? Who's reading them? I don't have a fucking time to watch the Housewives, let her own read a blog.

Now, if you're wearing something and you're like, it's linked in my blog, I'm going to go to the blog, find the link, and click on it. I'm not saying I'm not reading your blog, and I'm not. I hope you're not taking offense to that. I don't take offense to that. And I know you guys are big readers. And like, I love to read. I just literally, if I have five minutes, it's not going to be, I'm not going to be reading. I'm going to be creating my next sticker.

That's just, you know what really pisses me off. Sorry, I just got like really angry. I don't read blogs. What? I don't read blogs either. I just read books. Yeah, I know you do. And books are fucking amazing.

I think I've read most of the ones you've recommended. Thank you. But the thing is now that I'm so, like, I get so annoyed when people are like, you need a break, you need to take a vacation, you need to meditate, you can't look at your phone in the first hour that you wake up. Oh, shit, I say that. Well, okay, I'm putting it all together. My point is this, the second I open my eyes and I start talking to my vendors, because they've

created something for me overnight that was in my head the night before gives me the most joy. And it starts my day so creative. I cannot, like I tried meditating. and not looking at my phone, because I'm obviously always like this energetic. It makes me happy. And when I go on vacation and I'm checking my Instagram and talking to my team, that makes me so happy. And like all the things that we're getting done and checking off our list and seeing new pictures

and seeing new influencers and new filters, like, that's the shit that keeps me going. I don't need a vacation from my life. Yeah. Well, I think that the distinction there is that you're happy doing all those things. I am. A lot of people are waking up and doing those things. and they're miserable, but they continue to do it. So it's like, this is why we all say, like, to each his own, everyone's got to take what works for them.

But if you're somebody that's doing all these things and you're miserable, whether it's in your line of work or because you're seeing something on your phone that you don't like or like, that's this hot new word triggered because you watch something or read something. Like you got to change it up. That's on you. It's not anybody else. No, but I think that most important thing you said, and this is what I hope that everyone gets to in life is that you don't need a vacation from your work. Right. And that to me, that to me, like, is like a theme of this podcast. It's you're creating your own future.

You're creating your own life. You don't need to take a vacation. There's so many people that can't wait for the weekend. And it's like, I don't even know what day it is. Like, I don't care if it's the weekend or it's this. And listen, I am not like judging. If that's what you like to do, that's what you like to do. But if you are an entrepreneur to be able to create your own future and not have to take a vacation from it,

It's very powerful. But you know what else? We're really lucky. We can take a vacation and work on vacation and take our family with us. We can take our work anywhere we are. Like, how can you not be any happier? If you love what you do and you're doing it on a beach for one week a year or two weeks a year, like that's even more blessed to me. Like I'm going to take the vacation, but I don't need to like put my phone down for five days in a row. Like, because they'll be like, oh, so sorry to bother you. I know you're away. And I'm like, no, no, what is it? Like, show me. Show me what you designed. flawed American dream where people think like they have to be miserable for part of their life so that they can be happy later in life. But the thing is like if you can't be happy now, you're not going to be happy later. And I think that's what happened with me. That's when I was like, why are you doing this? Like I feel like you went to law school, you become a lawyer. You're supposed to be a lawyer. Like no. No, I'm not. I'm not going to be a lawyer anymore. And the second this makes me feel like that, I'm not going to do this either. But I don't see that happening. And I'm not like a quitter. Trust me, like we weren't allowed to quit anything growing up. Like you want. You want to pay piano, you're going to fucking play the piano. You asked to get swim lessons,

you're going to finish the swim lessons. And I'm the same way with my kids. But when something makes you physically sick or I don't think it's the mentality anymore, like, well, I have to retire in 10 more years, so I got to stick it out. But why do we have to be doing what we're supposed to be doing? Who's the person that's telling us we're supposed to be doing that? That's my entire life. I feel like I've questioned that status quo. Who's telling you what I'm supposed to be doing? You have to sit down. Yeah, where the toaster goes. Don't tell me where the fucking toaster goes. It's going to go in the bathroom if you're not careful.

I love this. You're going to get a toaster for me. In the bathtub with you. In the bathtub with you? Plugged in or unplugged. This is getting dark. No, I fully agree with you. Listen, I love doing this show right now, but better believe if there's ever a day where

I don't like it, I'm just going to quit. And I know there's an audience and people that like it. But I promise, if one day I'm like, hey, I don't like doing this anymore, I'll quit. And you're going to have days. Yeah. Well, you have days that get rough. Right. I don't want anyone to think that I don't.

I have days, and I'm like, shit, this is so annoying. Like, of course. But that's what I want to do. Yeah, I think people think they got to hang on to, like, life is short. And for me, I don't necessarily, I'm not so spiritual. I think, like, this is the one shot that I got, like, after. I think not a lot for me. So my whole thing is like, better be happy while you're here because if not, what's the point?

What is the difference? And I need to know this between the power of influencer and the power of celebrity with marketing. Because you've had Gigi Heddeed wear your jewelry. What's the differences? Let's be honest. You're smiling. You're doing a face. Influencers are much more influential.

Like what specifically, though, an Instagram story, a swipe up, a tag, a what? Stories and swipe ups. When you're talking like you and I, like you're talking to your audience, like you and I are speaking right now. Like that hits me. Like that's how I buy shit. Like, oh yeah, Lauren like is literally talking about this because she just like wasn't paid and she like literally threw it on last night. And she was like, guys, I woke up and this shit was so amazing and you have to buy it. Like, that's what gets me.

And when you write a blog post, I don't think anyone's reading it. And then on an Instagram page, I'm just looking at the picture. What about celebrities? Celebrities, that's not their job. Right. I think they... Ah, I've never heard that before. Yeah.

I think for celebrities, it's worth it because it gives you brand... That's not their job. It gives your brand like that oomful. Like, who's, who the fuck is she? Well, Gigi had her necklace on. Oh, Gigi had her necklace on? But does that mean I'm selling necklaces? No.

It's the influencer sell of the neckluster. sell the necklaces. Gigi gives the brand credit and gives it that oomph, that like, oh, that's, that's a real thing. You're just honored that she liked it enough to wear it. It's a great repost. It's a great. Yes, it is a great. And I just yelled in your mic. It is a repost, but it's not, that's not their job. An influencer does their job. Wow. I think they're absolutely amazing. You're so creative. You're killing it. But let's talk about the business side. Okay. You're obviously, we're a lawyer. so that's pretty nice.

You don't need someone to read your contracts. No, I absolutely do. You do? I don't read any. Criminal law was always dead. It's because it's a waste of your time. No. Just a different spiel of law.

It'd be like a dentist doing your gynaecology appointment. I mean, it's going to save me time. The dentist can get up there while I'm getting my teeth cleaned, like let's get it all time. I'm also asking. I got to go talk to your fucking dentist. Yeah. What's going on over there? My dentist is like kind of hot.

Uh-oh. You know what she's doing when she's got all these dental appointments. I was like, I'm just kidding. My business is a girl, but she is hot. Yeah, so tell us about the business side. How much are you hands on? Like, is it something that you're in QuickBooks? Do you have accountants? Do you do what I do and like to save time and hire out and delegate? What do you do? I'm a super good delegator. Like, I don't need all the control. I am a big picture person. And like I can see the big forest. Don't get me stuck in the trees. So somebody sends me a UPS bill and I can't log in in the first attempt. It's going to one of my, it's going to my. What's a log in? Yeah. No, I have no idea what my passwords are. No clue. Thankfully, my team is fantastic. I could not do any of this without the team. So, yes, I give, and I don't mean delegate because I'm too big for that. I'm just saying I can't get stuck in the trees because I am focused and the forest is big and I don't have time for my login. And my girls are phenomenal. I hired people who aren't anything at all like me because I'm good at what I'm good at. They're really good at what they're good at. Let them do what they're good at. So business side, I don't do a lot of. That's something really smart to point out hiring people that are different than you that have different skill sets.

I think a lot of people, especially when they're new to business, they want people that are like them, that think like them, that like have the same kind of vibe. And that's the last thing I would want is someone that's exactly like me because I'm already, I'm already me and I'm already doing what I can do. Yeah. And so I need somebody to do to help me do the things that I can't do. We just had a whole creative meeting at your meeting. I'm like, I am the least creative person on this call. I know we should be doing this, you know, thing for the brand, but I can't do it. You're just not creative in like an artistic way.

Well, you're creative and artist. But I do think for people that are thinking about starting businesses, they fall into that trap because you recognize someone that's like you. And you're like, oh, that would be fun to work with them. But you really want to kind of go the opposite direction. Complete opposite. Like I have somebody really good at like the law stuff. I have somebody really good at all the wordy stuff. Like don't give me words.

That's why I went into criminal law. There's no words. I mean, you read a case and then you stand up and you talk to the judge. You talk to the prosecutor. You talk to your client. There was no words. Like, I can't, I'm really bad at those small details, but I can like sell something and use my words. And then my other team's really good at shipping. If I try to help them with shipping at Christmas and they were like, please don't touch that.

Like, no, I let them do what they're really good at because they're really good at it. If someone wants to start a business right now, let's say they want to do jewelry just like you. They look up to you. They look up to what you've built. What would you say are some important things to have in the infrastructure? Like, would you say hire a graphic designer right now? Hire someone to help you with branding. Like, what are the important key components? Photography. Okay.

Love that. And not just like pictures on white. Like, you make, don't even make it about the jewelry. Also, user-generated content is where we're headed, which means people are sick of this editorial high-end $5 million photo shoot lights and everything filtered stuff. people want more the jewelry at home having coffee, like on an iPhone. Yeah. And so pictures and like creating a story with the pictures. So not just like a professional photo. And then like the graphic designs. Come on. Brand it. Like graphic design is

where it's at. And then I think if you're starting a small business and it's jewelry, then your shipping needs to be on point because that's the first thing they see. So not only is that branding, but to figure out speed. Because what we run into is our custom necklaces take a long time. And it's not because we can't get it made tomorrow. It's because there's so many orders in front of you. We're actual humans that are shipping these necklaces out. People don't understand, like, I don't know why it takes four to five weeks or six weeks. Well, as soon as they all come in, we have to find which one goes with which order, and then we physically stuff them all and we ship them all. And at some point, obviously, I'd like to have more shippers, but at this point, this is what we're dealing with.

And timing is something that I think if you're going to open a small business, you don't think about those things. But it's those experiences that bring the customers back. And then customer service. I was answering all my emails at first. Can you imagine? I was like, no, fuck you. And they were like, okay, okay, I'll take over the emails.

And then I hired girls that do just emails. And they're so good. And so I think customer service, like even days that I want to be like, really, like really, really lady. it's if you turn that attitude around and give them what they want to hear, it makes the world. I know you like me like to be pretty hands on with your DMs. Yes. How important do you think that is in building a business?

Because I would say that's the top three. Well, especially for you. I don't think people are coming to me for advice. And they're not asking me for links unless it's like we couldn't find this bracelet on your page. Do you have the link. So it's completely different from my brand. I think than an influencer. I think an influencer puts their face out there and all these recommendations and you become everyone's best friend. So I would DM you like I would DM her to be like,

hey, what do you, what did you eat when you went to blah, blah, blah? Like, so I don't know how you keep up with that, to be honest. And I don't know if I could. But if it was like important enough in somebody that like you were working with or you would like to work with or you respected, then I think you take the time to make those DMs. But I don't know how you would answer what everybody wants to know what you drank at the restaurant last night. I try to answer. as many as I can. I obviously don't get to everyone, but if I see a question being asked over and over and over, I always address it. But I do think the first five years, at least as an influencer, you should answer all your DMs. And people are like, look at me like with their eyes popped out.

I mean, that was my strategy. I answered every single DM. Your strategy worked. Well, we'll see. Well, we don't know if it worked yet. We'll see at the end of all this. Give it a little bit more time. Another decade. We'll circle back around. Another decade. Micro-influencers. I'm not talking about big influencers, micro-influencers. So important. Okay, a little bit on that would be amazing because I was just having a huge conversation about micro-influencers the other day. They are amazing. Like, they're really good at their, they're hungry. They're really good at their job. They take amazing photos, and they might take 100 of them instead of two. They are grateful. I mean, I'm not saying the big girls aren't, because they are too. This is not a micro-vers,

micro-versmackro, but I feel like you have to pay attention to both. There's an importance to both sides. and that micro influencer will be a macro influencer if they're hustling. Yep. So if you find a micro that's hustling, you're a win-win. Because you get them while they're in micro, and then they're going to become someone big because you notice their hustle. So I think they're equally as important. What was your, I'm interested in know what your conversation was.

Just that people overlook how important micro influencers are and they try to go to these people with 4 million followers that don't translate because they've recommended too many things. Whereas like someone with 2,000 followers who has a very big niche, like say they're just just talking about Walmart. And you have something that's in the Walmart price range and they put it on their story. It's the translation and conversion is insane. I also think for brands, like we encounter brands that, like say they're an up-and-coming brand, they're just starting on.

They're like really, they have to watch their budget. And not just with this show, but say they want to work with a bigger influence or a bigger show. And they want to take like this limited budget they have and throw it at this huge platform that they might not be able to afford yet. And then when you work on any online platform, it doesn't always just translate to immediate sales. Like it's a slow build. So smaller brands go, okay, I'm going to go and work with the top most expensive creator here. And then they don't see the sales. And they're like, they burn their whole budget. I think it's better to start slower, see what works with things you can afford.

And then as you grow as a business, then you can start doing things with the bigger creators. But I think a lot of brands don't get the power of working with smaller platforms in the beginning. And it's trial and error. Yep. It really is. And like, you have to trial and air everything. Obviously, influencers are are where it's at? Like, everybody's like, well, where else do you market? I'm like, well, I mean, there are other little things that we do, but that's where it's at. And I think that, and this is like a conversation that we would have at dinner, but let's just have it on here. I think that you would, like, with your jewelry is so beautiful, I do think that you advertising on certain podcasts would

really crush it. Yes. Well, and I... Like the bitch Bible or something. I think she would crush for you. Yes. No, I, well, and I'm also privy to the fact of that's where it's going and the clubhouse. And I have my eyes on all this up and coming things because I'm always trying to get on there. Like maybe I'm not like completely active, but at least I have an idea of what's going on. You're on the pulse. Yeah.

I mean, I try to be like one step ahead, although anymore it's so hard. Whenever there's emerging platforms, though, for brands, like I always find, it's so funny. Like businesses, this is like through the history of time. People like, well, I'm not going to try that until it like really proves until like it's happened in podcast. The brands that were smart and got in three, four, five years ago, they got it so cheap and now they're so established. And I never got the mentality of like, I'm going to wait until it takes off before a test because by the time it takes off, you're going to spend four or five X. Well, even like Gary V with like, I know he bought into like almost everything. Not everything worked.

But the ones that worked worked. Yep. So what's wrong with that? And the ones that he bought into that didn't work were cheap. Right. Because at the time they were brand new. Yeah, and it doesn't hurt you. Like, podcasting now, it's obviously getting crazy.

Yeah. And you guys are OGs. Yeah, I mean, there's people that are way more OG than us. But yeah, we are early. But I even think about the growth since we've been in the space. And for the brands that got in early with us, like they got a great deal. The brands that are coming now,

it's still a deal because obviously the space is on fire, but it's much more expensive. I'm not going to lie. Yes, it is. And, but it's, again, trial and error. Like maybe one podcast is going to be amazing for advertising on And maybe it's not. But like, you're right.

The bitch Bible, like, hey, shout out. Well, I'll tell you all. I'll give you some things that I think would really work with podcast advertising. I can see your stuff. It's so cute. I wanted you to tell the audience, a lot of millennials listening, what you think makes a person successful. What are the ingredients? Hustle.

Okay. Hustle. Hustle. Hustle. Drive. Hustle, hustle, hustle. Like, no days off. And I don't mean that in the sense of, like, you cannot take a day off.

Like, you just hustle your ass off, man. And I like the hustle. Like, when it gets too easy or like easy street, I'm like, what's going on? Like, what's wrong? You seem like you're a very hustler. Like, what time are you waking up in the morning? Like 5.30. Okay.

And what time are you going to bed? Like 10, 30. And you're, like, working all day. Yeah, well, I'm like checking my messages, scrolling. No, I mean, yes. I am designing in my head or I'm talking to somebody about putting it down on paper, or I am looking at somebody else's style. see what's new. But I love it. So I would do that anyway. With your process, are you the one that's

designing each piece of jewelry? Yes. So that's your focus is the creative design. Yes. Yes. And now I don't design every piece. If somebody, if one of my vendors or manufacturers comes at me with something amazing, I buy it. Like it's not all from scratch. But that's my favorite part. Like designing, seeing it like drawn on my chicken scratch at night and then waking up to seeing like a sample is it's my wet dream. It's just that's what makes me really happy. And I don't even know it's 5.30 in the morning and I'm sending it out to the team.

I mean, I'm sure they freaking hate me. I mean, I don't think they hate me. But I always say to them, when I'm messaging you, that doesn't mean I need a response. I'm the same way. I'm the kind of person that's like, I got to get it out. Right now, because there's going to be

4,000 other thoughts in a minute. But that don't mean you need to talk to me on a Sunday. I just need to tell you like, look how cute this is. And I think they know that now. Like they know like, oh, okay, Megan's texting me. I need to text back. No. It's just like, oh my God, did you see how cute this is? It came to fruition. Like, I'm just so excited all the time. So I think that shines through in a business. So if you happiness and hustle, what else can you do? Maybe share some tools that you use in your business. Is it like Slack? Do you like email? Are you working over text? What is the most effective strategies for you? I am like, I don't even know how to open Excel. Okay. Neither do I. My team does all the Excel sheets. Excel is the opposite of my way. what dream. An Excel sheet, it's making me sweat. I'm perspiring right now. When someone tells me to open an Excel sheet, I'm like, Excel who? Yeah. Is that a celebrity?

I am the same exact. Like, they almost have to open it and screenshot what they need me to look at. Because right now, right? I'm like, what are you talking about? I can't open this. I'm like, what line? I don't know how to get to the line. So, yeah, no. We just got on G-chat because I was texting. And my brand manager was like, oh my God, I cannot anymore. Lauren does this thing where we all, We're like we're all on Zoom with the team. There's like four or five or something. I don't ever do video on Zoom. She comes five, ten minutes late and we've all been talking.

We all can all see each other. She comes in with no camera. She goes, all right, so who do we got here? You're like, we've been here. We've been here. We can all see each other. I don't come 10 minutes late. It's more like three minutes late.

And I don't think that we need to be on video all the time. Why do we have to be on video? No, we don't. But I'm just, I think it's funny. Michael just thought a fucking diva light. Like, his whole room is like a diva light with a blur in the background. You know they're like blur the like. We did this interview with Priyanka Chopra and she had this like camera that was so clear.

And Lauren and I just looked like these old grainy figures. Right. And your masturbation came. So I got this DSLR camera. It's just like, so it actually come through clear. Because I was just done. Listen, I live in Zoom now. Like it's, which is my cross to bear.

Yes. A lot of people. And it's going to probably be around. One of the points of this interview to me is you can create your own future. Yes. So what would you tell someone who's stuck and unhappy in life right now? But I also can't, like, take all the credit. Like, what if I had a husband that was like, no?

Like, you have... You would have still done it. I wouldn't have married. I probably wouldn't have married someone who would have been like, you would have to stay home with the kids. Yeah. But I have to say, like, that's part of the ingredient. Like, somebody who's supposed to be, like, cooking a meal, I don't cook.

Or, like, going to the grocery store, I don't go the grocery store. And, like, doing mommy playgroups, that's not... How would I be where I am? Like, I was thankful that he was like, go. Girl, go. Like, live your dream. Like, he is my biggest fan. If you don't have that support, I'm not saying it's your husband. Maybe it's your significant other. It's your boyfriend. Your sister is your parents. Like, that's so needed. And I think a lot of people maybe don't have that or don't know that they have it. But you're right. I probably would have done it anyway. You would have done it anyway? It's just a personality type. So if someone feels like they're stuck and they're unhappy in their career, would you tell them to just go for it? Would you tell them to launch fast? Would you tell them to launch fast? You will never have everything worked out. I am how many years in and I still don't have everything worked out you just fucking launch it

because you're going to figure it out as you go if you wait around to do something there's always going to be something else it's like people that are like it's not the right time to have a baby there ain't never a right time to have a baby like you're always going to be busy you're always going to have something planned

you're always going to launch the brand and figure it out as you go because it'll never be the perfect time because there is no perfect time yeah I can't tell you how many people over the years doing this show that we've met that unfortunately I've said hey I'm going to do this and you still like a year goes by two years because they're saying the same thing and it's like at some point you you kind of just zone out and you're just like all but do you think Michael that like those people are so detail oriented that maybe they're not supposed to be entrepreneurs like I'm not saying you can't be detailed oriented and an entrepreneur like I'm not saying that at all but I'm saying like I think you need if you're going to be an entrepreneur you have to be okay with seeing the big picture and just going for the big picture rather than my new details every second like of course you're you have to pay attention to that stuff. Yeah, I think people who say the perfectionists are just

copying out. Like, I actually don't believe that. I think that's just an excuse of why they're not doing something. Right. Right. Like I want to be, like if I, I want things to be as perfect as possible, but I'm not going to let perfect hold me back from something. And so he'll say, well, I haven't done it because it's not perfect. I'm a perfectionist. Like, no, you haven't done it yet because you're scared. Right. That's just the truth. And but, but my point is maybe they're never going to be, then they're not, that's okay. Because that's being an entrepreneur then, it's okay. You just can't keep complaining about it and talking about it. Right. But there are some people. that I think that they get off on that.

That's who they are. Their shtick is to complain and it's part of the identity. Sure. I just can't listen to those people personally. No, I can't either. You did complain that you were tired on the way here and I was like, sack it up. She smacked me in the mouth and then I was like, oh, all right. You're trying to get out of our interview?

No, not out of like. We could drink your wine. No, no, no, not before the podcast. He was just complaining today that he, that he was tired and I don't want to hear it. I don't want it in my ether. I don't care. Listen, we have a, you know what it's like. We have this baby.

Lauren sleeps through. The house could be on fire and she would sleep. If a pin drops in the house, I'm awake. So I hear the baby stirring. Can I tell you? No, I taught the baby only to say, papa. So whenever she needs something, all you hear throughout the house is screaming. Papa, Papa, Papa. This is so strategic because in the morning, when instead of saying, Mom or crying, she says,

Papa, Papa, I mean, it does warm my heart. It's like, it warms his heart. I'm like going to go running. His grinchy heart gets warm. He runs to the baby. I get to still sleep. It's actually like, why are you tired? One of my best collaboration.

When you hear Papa at all hours of the night. Was it paid? I mean, you know, I'm not, it was a sponsored post. It was a swipe up, hashtag ad. I don't need to be hard on those people that. I think like when I say things like that, I'm trying to get people out of them being stuck. And it's like if you're going to do it

and you're going to talk about like, do it because the worst that could happen is you try and you end up exactly where you are. That's true. And there's even things that I want to do that. I'm like, well, I don't know if that'll work. But like, like, I'm not. I'm always working on something.

I think we need a jewelry piece for our ponytail that we're wearing like that. Yes. Like a little piece of jewelry right up here. See? By tomorrow morning, I'll have a drawing for you. Okay. I think we need a jewelry ponytail holder. Yeah, okay. Something.

I saw this, it was a cheap one at Forever 21 that was like a gold-plated, but I think you need to do something. Oh, and it kind of like goes around. Something better. Yeah, okay. I got you. I would rock that. Okay.

I want to talk about my favorite piece in your line, and then I want to ask you a couple other people that I admire who wear your jewelry's favorite. So my favorite, if you guys are shopping her line, is, and I want to make sure I say the right verbiage, but it's a necklace that says boss and it's sterling silver, right? And it's very, very simple and delicate. It's a necklace. And I wear it all the time I wear mine that says Zaza too. I had one made for my friend. And the reason I like it is because it's light, it's delicate, it's pretty, you can wear it in the shower, you can do whatever. But it's also such a great. gift. Right. It's so personal. So we got, I worked with you to make one of my best friends

Faith, one that said Aspen, because she has a baby, Aspen, and she went wild. What is that piece called so they can check that piece out? It's called, it's all in a name necklace. Amazing. Yes. And you know what? And it's a good price point for a gift. Because you know, like, if you ever bought a gift for like $40 and you're like, what else should I get? Yeah. How much is it? It's 72. 72. And then you can find a coupon code, I'm sure. Okay. And you also do it in diamonds. That's like the big We do. We do a 14-carat and real diamond line, which is new. We just launched this line. And I finally had to launch it. Is it ready? No. But it's there. It's beautiful. The diamonds are beautiful. Thank you. But honestly, if you want to get a great $72 gift, this is it. And it's custom. Because I like, like, I want you to know I thought of you when I bought you a present. And I think that's the perfect thing. Like for Michael's birthday, March 28th, I want to do like a penis chain. I'm just kidding. That says Lauren around it. Like her. perfect, like, just like that you can wear. I don't know if I'm going to be wearing that. It's your birthday. Happy birthday. What is, what is that sign? Aries. He's an Aries. What is

favorite piece? Because Ingrid is obsessed with your jewelry. She was just on this podcast talking about hormones. One of my favorite friends. What's her favorite piece? All the evil eyes. And we just made her a ton of like pavela crystals and rose gold. Okay. With the emerald green, like emerald green Pavels like the chombers. She has a bracelet, right? And she has, yeah, she's getting quite outfitted. Yeah, I love her. You know why? Because she's real. She also is amazing at being authentic and selling in a way that translates, I think. I absolutely agree. She's not going to say it if she doesn't mean it. Yeah. Ingrid doesn't give her fuck. No, she's got... I love that. That's literally why we're... That's why we're... I say that in the best way, in the most heart. That way. I love it. People say that about me too. Like, without being like, like, oh, she's too much. Like, no, this is just... Like, I'm even nervous now. Like, why? Just like, I don't. I don't. ever mean to offend anybody. Like, really, I come from a good place. It's just sometimes I think I just, I'm a big personality. And you never know anymore what could offend somebody. And I'm never feeling like,

when I say like no vacations, like, that's not what I mean. It just means like what makes me happy might not make you happy. And this is what makes me tick. And this is my formula. And my formula happens to work. And I happen to be super happy from it. So if that's not your schick, good. Go do what makes you happy. If you want a vacation around the road and not pick up your phone for three weeks, fucking do it. I mean, if you're able to afford it, I'm not. So I think just being happy. And like, I do get a little worried, though, that I'm very much like quit your job. Like, maybe people can't quit their job.

Maybe they're single parents. Why do we live in this culture where they say go to college, do this, do this, and I can't be the other side and be polarizing? Yes, you can. I am. Why can't I be the complete other end of that and say what I think, which is for me, I think, I think college was a waste of time. Listen, I could have been creating content.

I learned how to get around college. But I think the disclaimer on all of this at the end is for me. Like, I think college is a waste of time for me. Right, like this, I wouldn't do this for. That's true. I always try to, one thing I know that my perspective on life is not necessarily someone else's. And I'm sure, like speaking to your point, that if you were to just turn on this show and have no familiar. with Lauren or me, like we can be abrasive, we could be out, especially me, right? If you turn on the thing and you hear me saying like, hey, you suck or you're not starting something, what the hell is this guy saying? But I think people, like, if you give it a little bit of time with anyone and you put it in context and you see someone's intention is not to hurt, but to help, like, that comes with time, right? But at the same time, I can't change who I am and be inauthentic because then, then you turn in and you're like, hey, I don't trust this person. No, that's true. It's just hard. And yeah, you're right. It's whatever works for you. But like when Lauren asks, like, what you're

advice for someone starting a business, like, well, it depends. Who are they? Yeah. What's their, what are they like? No, but I do think there's a lot of people that are listening to now that your formula will work for them. And like, those are the people you're speaking to. And maybe they just need the push. Yes. Because what if they don't have a Brian at home that's like, babe, do it. So maybe that's us. Or it's you saying you can do it. And it's never going to be perfect. Just go. And really, even if you fail, if it made you happy, you're going to learn something from it. And you're going to put it towards whatever you're doing next. And same thing is with the law, I loved it until I didn't. And I took everything that I loved from it and I've learned

from it and here I am. And that's your journey and whatever your journey is, that's okay. That's right. I just wish it would have been like 10 years prior. No, that's okay. I know. That wasn't it. You probably learned valuable skills. I did. You probably learned so many skills. I look back when I was a bartender and I learned how to finesse all different kinds of energy. For sure. And I learned how to listen because I was sitting across from the bar with a very intimate setting. And I learned how to multitask. There's so many things that you probably learned. I learned. I learned. more bartending than at college. 100%.

Makes sense. I'm sure there's things that being a criminal defense attorney that you learned that you wouldn't have those tools in your toolbox. And you probably wouldn't appreciate what you do now as much if you didn't do the thing before because now you have something to compare it against. No, because it's easy to complain, right? Like, everybody has a bad day or like their job gets them down. Like, I get to look back and be like, but it's not, you know, like, I can, I have a scale

of like what was unhappy to me. Like, this little bump in the road sucks, but I'm not an unhappy person. anymore. And like, I have that to compare it to. Maybe. If you started this and you didn't have that and then it got tough, you'd be like, oh, I'm going to quit this. This is tough. I'm going to like, yeah, but you don't. Yeah. Yeah. I hope, like, I'm grateful for all the times I've eaten shit in life because now, like, I can compare it against that. But at the time, I thought you think it's the worst thing ever. But now you're like, oh, okay, it's not that. A hundred percent. Can you, before you give us your book, podcaster, resource, tell us what another big influencer is loving from your line.

That I'm loving? Yeah. So, no, that another big influence. You can tell us what you're loving too. But I also, you mentioned what I like, what Ingrid likes. Oh, I'm sorry. What product? Yeah, give us one that you like and another influencer. Like a product, not an influencer. Either.

Or just anything that's true. Yeah, tell us something that people are loving. Oh, what people are loving. Yeah. I'm listening. I really am. Oh, my God. It's just the personalized stuff goes crazy.

It's like the noops are cute too. Your hoops like remind me of like a very, very high-end hoop, but they're affordable. Yes. Yes. There's some in your box. And they're new. They're new. So you'll have to give me your feedback on it.

I love. I can't wait to see them. Our hoops are popular, and then green. Green's been huge. I love green. Yeah, it's so rich. Isn't green good luck this year? Green is, like, amazing.

We just bought those green bracelet. Is green the color that's good luck this year with the Chinese? That's so funny that. I'm so, you know, what looks so pretty, too, is green and gold together. Well, wait to see Ingrid's new necklace stack. I can't wait. I can't either. Okay.

We should fly in person and see her stack. Let's go podcast in month. I know. Like, I just want to sit on your couch with my feet up and how are you bringing a drink and and then eat. I know. I know she doesn't get drunk and like hung over, which is annoying. I know. She told me she's never been hung over in her life. But I think we could make it happen.

She's an amazing chef. I know. I am. Yeah. She watched her stories. You were eating. Maybe go spend some more time over there alone. Yeah. Come back. That's not nice. I made you a very good salad and sandwich the other day. So screw you. Okay. A book, podcast or resource that you would leave our audience with that's brought you a lot of value. All right. Gary V. I'm sorry. He's just hands down the best. He's totally like your energy. I could totally see why you like him. And, like, I think he's brilliant. I think every, like, anyway, you, I mean, you're of my inspiration from day one. I thought I was going to puke for the first three months leading up to this.

Why? Oh, yeah, it's been a big thing. What? Why? Just, you've always, you're like a branding machine. Yeah, but you've taught me everything. You're such a natural on the mic. Oh, I can talk.

But I can't, I learn to brand from you. I'll take that, but there's a lot more to it, I'm sure. There's a lot more to it. I can see. Anyone who knows me knows I'm sitting here and like complete glee. Oh my God. You're so sweet.

Anybody who know, like, if you know that I'm where I want to be. Oh my God. To me, this is my goal. Like, so I don't know where I'm going to go from here.

You're going to get on the Gary V. Show. That's where the fuck you're going to go. It doesn't matter because here. Gary? It's like he wants to buy the Jets, but he's never going to buy the Jets. He will.

He will. And you'll get on his show. But you know what I'm saying? Like, then he's like, then what? I like the fact that he's not going to buy it. Why don't you make him a penis chain? Oh.

If he's going to like, that'd be really hard to show off on stories. Unless he's sliding into someone's DMs. Just show the outskirts of it. Michael has these pajamas that shows every detail of it the other day. Well, I didn't realize this until it was. These pajamas that you have showed the whole. It's like a clay mold or something. It's like a ceramic cafe situation.

Can I just wear some comfortable pajamas for Christ's sake? Well, I mean, Jesus. That was not on stories either. We can show that on stories You really don't show your her whole life She tried to put that on stories And I was like

This is maybe not the thing to do It was like Whoa Things are bigger in Texas God damn Hey We're learning We're learning

We're learning while we're here I'm just more relaxed out here I think Are you? I know we're gonna do a giveaway It's a good and a bad thing Can we talk about the giveaway Or should I post it after?

We can talk about it Okay What are we giving away Why don't we give away Your favorite necklace And make it They can either customize it Or we can make it a boss

Okay. So that could be up to you. Yeah, you can write boss. Mine says boss for Bostic, but it could also mean boss like you're a boss. No, for sure. Yeah. So let's do a customized necklace. All they have to do is follow you at the Sis Kiss on Instagram. Tell us your favorite part of this episode on my latest Instagram at Lauren Bostic, handle change. And we'll drop into your inbox. And one of you will win my absolute favorite necklace. So easy to win, I feel like, right? For sure. Okay. And then also if they want to use your code, code, which we'll put in the show notes. Love it. Then we also will get a free gift that you picked. Can we do the skinny kiss? Yeah. Let's do the skinny kiss. The skinny kiss.

That's the code. What do they get off? Yeah, we're going to put it in the show notes. Yeah, we'll put it in the show notes. We're going to put it in the show notes. So it's launch fast and adjust. I'm pretty sure it's 25%, but my team already made it. So I will double check.

And we'll put the for sure in this. This is no secret at this point. We do the intro and outro after this. I listen. And how can everyone find you, follow you on Instagram, drop in your DM box, your website, all the things? Yep. Just the cis-kiss.com, which is s-is-k-I-S-S, because sometimes that gets janky. And then we're at the cis kiss kiss on Instagram. You can find us at TSK-Atlea. That's our new diamond line. And that is a sub-brand of us, so you can find us all together. And then www.com.com. I am a huge fan of supporting small businesses. I've had a very warm place in my heart from you, since. you started. I love your jewelry. I'm such a fan. Thank you for taking the time to fly all the way from Cleveland. I will be drinking my Bernello tonight wearing my new pink ring. What is this ring you gave me? I'm obsessed. It's our new line. Lusite and colors will be our trends for the summer months. Really, really into this, you guys. It's like a lusite ring. It's pink. Fits the feed. It fits the feed.

And I like how it's like big around the finger. Yep. You can also wear it with another ring too. I was just playing layer. Yeah, I was layer. Yeah, I was layer. it with a gold ring. Thank you so much for coming on. Come back. I will. Thank you. We got to do it with Ingrid. That would be a lot of a good thing you don't censor. Yeah. Beep. Totally answer to the whole episode. Three of us. Oh my God. Like Morris Code. Yes. At the cis kiss. Follow her. Love you guys. Wait, don't go. The cis kiss is doing such a fun giveaway. This is a good one, you guys.

You win a boss necklace. It is so cute. I have one. I'll show you on stories. And it's this beautiful thin chain with the word boss across it. Very simple. You can wear it all the time. It goes in the shower. It goes in the jacuzzi. And it's such a cute gift. All you have to do is follow at the cis kiss on Instagram and tell us your favorite part of this episode on my Instagram at Lauren Bostic. Please rate and review the show. We appreciate it and we want to continue to grow the community. I have to tell you that they made a code for you guys. It is skinny cis 25. That is skinny. cis 25. For 25% off, all orders use skinny cis 25. That's skinny cis 25. With that, I will see you guys next time. This episode was brought to you by the cis kiss.