The Bossticks - Life Advice For Young Adults - A Roundtable Conversation Ft. Jordan Becerra & Nico Becerra

Episode Date: January 19, 2023

#536: On today's episode we are joined by Jordan & Nico Becerra. Many listeners may recognize Jordan (formerly Jordan Bosstick) as Michael's sister and a true TSC Him & Her OG! Jordan is an entrepreneur and founder of Influencer SEO & Nico Becerra is an entrepreneuer and lawyer specializing in business law and development. The married couple join the show today to help Lauryn and Michael answer listener questions and provide advice for a better life.  To connect with Jordan Becerra click HERE To connect with Nico Becerra click HERE To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential. Our PINK BALLS Face Massager and Hot Mess Ice Roller are the perfect dynamic duo to snatch your face and de-puff in the mornings and any time of day. Use code PINKICEQUEEN at shopskinnyconfidential.com for 15% off your purchase. This episode is brought to you by Pique Tea Pique's Sun Goddess Matcha is organic, ceremonial grade, and rich in chlorophyll that supports detoxification of the body + promotes clear skin. Go to piquelife.com/skinny to get 15% off + free shipping for life. This episode is brought to you by Ritual Ritual knows it's basically impossible to get all the nutrients you need from your diet 100% of the time, so they made a multivitamin that helps you focus on what's important. Like filling key nutrient gaps to support foundational health. Go to ritual.com/skinny to receive 10% off your first 3 months. This episode is brought to you by Timeline Nutrition Maintaining muscle health is critically important to longevity and enduring good health & clinical studies have shown that 500mg of Urolithin A alone significantly increases muscle strength & endurance with no other change in lifestyle. Head to Timelinenutrition.com/skinny or use code SKINNY at checkout to get 10% off your order of Mitopure now. This episode is brought to you by Caraway Caraway Home's non-toxic kitchen wares are all designed for the modern home and feature a chemical-free ceramic coating, so food can be prepared with peace of mind that no hard-to-pronounce compound will leach into your healthy ingredients. Go to Carawayhome.com/SKINNY  or use code SKINNY at checkout to get 10% off your next purchase.   This episode is brought to you by Jenni Kayne   You know that incredible feeling you get when someone compliments your outfit?  Jenni Kayne is that brand. Go to jennikayne.com and use code SKINNY at checkout for 15% off.  Produced by Dear Media

The following podcast is a dear media production. This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential. Okay. So here's the move if you're new to shop Skinny Confidential.com. I personally would start with the pink balls or the ice roller. If you don't have the ice roller, you're missing out because ice on your face in the morning, so anti-inflammatory and so amazing. And this ice roller is an ice roller that I designed for four years.

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These are tools and a planner that I created to seamlessly integrate into your morning routine and things that I do on a day-to-day basis that I think make a huge difference. Anyways, we have a very special code for you. So you're going to head over to shop skinny confidential.com. And you get $20 off any price. purchase of $100 or more. So all you have to do is intercode hot pink for $20 off, any $100 order or more. Let me know what you think of the ice roller. I'm always reading DMs, the pink balls, and the hot minute planner. Shop skinny confidential.com. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire.

Fantastic. And he's a serial entrepreneur. A very smart cookie. And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you alone for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to the confidential, him and her. So I think if you're going to go to school, it should be intentional. So when I decided this professional serving thing has really just been a big party, it's not a career move, I realized I need to go to college because I knew that we're going to be skills building opportunities there that were going to teach me things about what I eventually wanted to do, which was be a business owner.

Yeah, if you want to be a doctor, obviously you got to go get the degree and you got to go to school. But if you want to be a more creative person, it's not worth the debt. We're sitting here as four employers, and we are saying we don't care where someone went to school. I want to see what you can do. Hey, everybody. How we doing? We got a family affair going on today. For those long, long time, OG listeners, I'm talking early days, episodes, what, Lauren, one through maybe 10.

We have Jordan Piserra now. She was Jordan Bostic, my sister, but that part of her died when she got married to Niko, who's also on the show, Niko Pascara. And for the long, like I said, OG, OECA. OG TSC, him and her listeners. Jordan started the show with us. She was there. We had a fight because Lauren and I were the only two people on frame and Jordan was off to the side at one point. Lauren and I were talking. You can only hear her voice. But she helped us, you know, early days at the show and now she's back. We have her and her husband. They're so incredible. And this is a conversation that we would

have at happy hour. So it's kind of like you guys are tuning into our real life dinner. We are such good friends with my brother-in-law and my sister-in-law. So it totally made sense to have them on the podcast when they came out and visited Austin. Our kids are best friends. And this conversation is just like a very real, honest conversation, but also we simultaneously answered all of your questions. So I did like a Q&A on stories and we got your questions. We saw what you guys wanted answered. Nico Bacera is a top lawyer in California. You can check him out on Instagram at the new age lawyer. And my sister-in-law, Jordan, his wife, runs an incredible business. It's influencer SEO. I use her for The Skinny Confidential and Pinterest.

She's incredible. With that, let's welcome Jordan and Nico Bacera to the Skinny Confidential, him and her show. A real true family affair. This is the Skinny Confidential, him and her. Welcome back to the show, guys. It's been a minute. I have to turn my radio voice on. It's probably tripping you out because we're just, you know, you know me in real life.

But I was looking just now at the podcast app on Apple. And I was trying to say, like, when the fuck was Jordan and Nico on the show last? September 13th, 2016, episode number 28. You guys are OGs of the show. And for people that have been listening since the very beginning, there's maybe six or seven of you left. Jordan was here at the very beginning, like episodes of what, Jordan, one through 15? I think it was like one through 15. And Lauren and I weren't really quite sure.

Like we still, Lauren and I, like, you know, we wanted to be the stars. And so we had the camera on us and Jordan was back off to the side, like out of frame. But you were there. This is an upgrade. and Lauren. Yeah, this is an upgrade. There's no marble floors with the horrible sound

bouncing around. This is more professional. I think before we get into the questions, you guys should give context on who you are, for those of you guys who are listening that don't know you. So obviously you're married.

But we'll start with Jordan. Give us a little background. Give us your little like summary of who you are. Well, I've known Michael since the day I was born. We live together all our lives. You could say I've known him longer than Lauren.

You have. Yeah. Well, yeah. So I'm Michael's sister, little sister. I'm the middle sister. Yeah, that's pretty much where we go there. You have kids, your husband. Give us the full 4-1-1.

Mother of two. My youngest is six months old and my firstborn is three years old. And this guy right here gifted me those children. So thanks, hubby. I am. We almost have the same fuck cycle because their kids are so close. We might be thinking similar. We literally joke because our kids are so close.

an age. We had to have been on the same fuck cycle. There's no other, like, we were very close. I don't know what a fuck cycle is. But, but all right. I'm just thinking like our kids are so closer. It must be just something in the moon that just. I don't know. You guys have a group text fuck cycle. It gets the bostic blood boiling or something. The best part about it is Lauren keeps her pregnancy secret for a lot longer than I do. So I'm like, I'm pregnant. La la la. And she's just sitting there pregnant, not saying anything for months. I just want some. I just want I'm a little speck of privacy in my life when it comes to my kids. And I just try to like have that moment for myself as long as possible.

See, I think on our end, all we get is privacy. So Jordan gets pregnant. She's like, it's my turn. Motherfuckers, I'm pregnant. I'm back, bitches. No, yeah. So, okay, mother of two. This is my husband, Nico.

I'm the co-founder of influencer SEO. And I say co-founder because my husband helps me with a lot of things, business-related to it. Yeah, so that's pretty much me. Nico, you want to introduce yourself? Sure. Or should I talk for you? Whatever you want to do. No.

You make the rules here. No. So I'm Nico. I'm Jordan's husband. I'm a late entrant to the family in terms of comparing timelines here. Jordan knows Michael from birth. Lauren pretty close around birth. I came into the picture 11 years ago for Jordan, maybe like 45 minutes ago for Michael and a couple years ago for Lauren. And you met at my birthday party. Yeah, yeah, exactly. We did meet at yours and Weston's Woodstock party, and I wore an amazing leather vest that was actually a woman's vest that I didn't know that at the time. I rented a Buffalo Exchange last minute.

It was awesome. And Jordan and I, we've been in love ever since she met me because you told me to go talk to her. And I was like, yeah, I don't, I don't know. That's Michael's sister because I'd met you guys obviously before. And Michael's like, no, you're cool. I don't think he thought this is where it would end up, but here we are. I mean, you were wearing a lady's leather vest. I was a little concerned.

You know, but yeah. And what do you do? I am a lawyer. I'm also an entrepreneur. I really am just somebody who loves business and seeing businesses grow and helping people grow their businesses. And I'm an advocate for living a good life and having a good time. And just really quick, if someone wants to work with you guys and we can talk about this at the end, they can go, anyone can work with you anywhere. Yeah. Yeah. Lawyer SEO. Love it. Okay. Let's move right into these questions. So I asked you guys the audience. audience, what questions that you needed when it came to life advice? And these questions are all over the place in a way where some are about relationships, some are about business, some are about friends, some are about a job. First question. And I see this question a lot and I think this group will give you eclectic answers. You're going to get different answers from everyone.

I hate my job, but I need money. How do I get out of this? I'll take a first stab at that if It's all right. Okay. So for me, I always looked at every experience in my professional life as an opportunity to build skills. So I think that if you're in a place where you don't really know what you want to do in terms of your professional ambitions or your career path or whatever it is, if you're going to be in a shitty job, which at the end of the day, almost all jobs can be shitty, pick one that's going to give you an opportunity to pick up skills that will get you close to whatever it is you think you want to do. So I've talked to a lot of people. people who have entrepreneurial ambitions. And obviously to start a business, it's usually going to start

as a side hustle unless you go into the round of, you know, I'm going to go get funding and I'm going to build a startup and I'm going to do all that. Most people bootstrap it and they start, you know, from the ground up by themselves with their laptop. So I always say, look, you're going to need money. You're going to need to be able to have a life where you can eat and enjoy life. So go get a job that's going to give you skills that you'll need once you're running your business, your new venture, whatever it is that you want to do. So if you have a shitty job and you need the money, then find a shitty job that's going to help you get to that next level. Find the shitty job that is going to give you opportunity to develop skills that will allow you to then succeed

in whatever it is you want to do. And if you don't know what you want to do, then if you're going to have a job, because all jobs should pay you, find jobs that give you exposure to the things you think you're interested in so that you can at least try, I think I want to be in the medical field, go get a job somewhere. I mean, as much as it's being a receptionist, just get exposure to the things that you think you like. I worked, I was a barista at Starbucks. I did that because it was a means to an end, but I learned so much about training and business organization and just how really a business should be run because of how well that organization runs its business, that I have used more in my past work experience. I've used more what I learned at Starbucks as I build businesses or as I help

other people build businesses from that experience, then I have if I would have been like, oh, I want to go do the coolest job and be, you know, doing something cool. It was a shit job, but I learned a shit ton. I think it really depends on there. I think there's two different scenarios. If you hate your job and you need the money, but you're like, you know what, I don't like being responsible for my own job. Like you don't want to be an entrepreneur or a freelancer. And I think it might be smart to really look about like how much do you hate this job. And maybe you do need to go find another job. But if you're like, you know what, I could freelance, take an audit of your skills. And there's so many ways to go out and like pitch yourself and get these quick little odd

jobs. Like I don't know, it depends on what you do. Like I said, but if you're on like a graphic artist or something, you can use upwork. You can get random things. So you don't have to be so miserable in that situation to have income. My advice is a little blunt. If you hate your job and you're sitting and asking this question, I think you should do something about it. And And what I would do if I was in your position, and I've said this a lot, but I think it's important to go back to is I would go get a service industry job at night. So work from five to 11, five to midnight, work in the service industry job. And then during the day, put your energy and productivity towards something that you want to do that moves the needle. So you have, you're at night,

you're working, you're learning to multitask, you're learning how to deal with lots of different energies because say you're bartending, you're cocktailing, your hostessing, you're getting that social aspect. But then during the day, you're actually having the whole day to be able to leverage whatever it is you want to do in your life. So say you want to be a writer. Take four hours one to four to write. Then go to work in your service industry job, make the money, then wake up and do a strategy session in the morning. Like really plan your day around what it is you actually want to be doing. with your job instead of working nine to five. Because you guys answered that well, and I agree with everything you said, Nico, in the

beginning is like if you're going to have something you don't like doing, at least make sure that it's pushing you towards something that eventually you're going to want doing. So I'll give maybe some side advice to the good advice that was given previous to this. One, I believe that if you hate your job, you will never be that good at that job. And the people that you're in that workspace with will outpace you, which means they'll probably be entitled to a promotion faster, a raise faster, growth faster. right because you just hate it and they may love it right could be doing the same thing but one person may hate it one person who love it so if you hate it. I would just at least be honest with yourself to say

I'm never really going to be phenomenal at this and so might be time to look for something else especially if it's something that's not going to propel you towards something you eventually want to be doing and the other thing is like what I would remind people is think about the position you were in before you had that job I think sometimes people get stuck in this mindset where it's like well now that I'm earning this amount like human beings do not like the feeling of going backwards right and I try to remind people all the time that you started without that job or you started without that paycheck or you started without that bank account with that bankroll. You can always go back, but people feel like going back is failing.

But I think sometimes it's okay to say, you know what, this is not the right move for me. I'm going back. Maybe bills are going to get tight. Maybe I can't afford certain things for a while and maybe I have to cut back. But you can go back and reset, you know. And I get it. People have responsibilities and they have children and they have obligations. But I don't think any of those reasons are enough to lock you in for a miserable life that

you're going to be unhappy with. Yeah, and come in it from a place of abundance. Like, if you hate your job, what's the reason? If you hate your job because of a boss or literally because of the work that you do, there are other opportunities. Look for another job. Like, there's, just look at it from a place of abundance and don't feel like this is my only chance to have an income. There are many ways to have an income doing the same thing for a different company. Like I said, freelance. Like, just figure out what you need to do in order to like remove that unhappiness. Well, and speaking directly to that and also kind of with what Lauren said before. I mean, I'm, I'm a lawyer by trade. I was trained to be a lawyer. I went to law school. I exist in that space. And I think a lot of lawyers, a lot of people

who do, who follow that path go the big firm route or they get stuck in that perpetual cycle of, I can only be a lawyer. It was what I was trained to do. But being a lawyer is a significant and it's a huge skill. I mean, it's an asset for anybody. And so if you can be creative like that and identify other skills that complement that skill, I mean, I mean, lawyers is a, a, a, licensed profession. It could be anything. I mean, if you're sitting at home and you hate your job, what are you doing about it? Are you going on YouTube and finding videos that can teach? I mean, there's so much free information and education out there that you can develop skills that'll get you a better job without even having to get a job. You can just learn stuff. And if you,

the more you add to your skills bucket, the more exciting opportunities will be presented to you. If you are sitting around complaining over and over and over that you hate your job, you're putting your energy towards that. You need to go execute on and find. a solution and an opportunity to get yourself out of it. So I think you and I are definitely saying the same thing with that. One of the things that I think is so great about you, you just said this, is you went to school to be a lawyer, but you found ways to be multifaceted within that profession. And I think that with the internet, you can be a lawyer, a podcaster, a blog, or an influencer, but you can find different ways to make it work for you and get creative to just be like,

oh, I'm a lawyer, so I'm going to work nine to five and that's it. I think that there's so many different ways to add layers to careers now. 100%. And it also, it's easy to get bored because you're not mixing it up. Right. Yeah. Speaking of mixing it up, the next question says, newly married, eight years together.

I'm 27 and I feel like there's no zest in life. It's monotomous. God, I can't pronounce any. Monotonous. Like monopoly. Monotonous. a day. Things are boring. I'm to spice it up. Is that like

boring in the marriage or boring in life or boring just everywhere? I think that there are eight years together and things are not spicy anymore. But the question's written as like there's just no zest for life in any aspect. I think there's no zest for life in the marriage. Okay. Sounds like we need to bring some energy and I think it sounds like we need to bring some energy and I think that's, you can't put that on your husband if this is coming

from a girl. I don't know who wrote it. That's put on both of you. Nico wrote it. Nico wrote it. Are you trying to send me a hint here? No, I'm not 27. I wish I was, but I'm not. Yeah, bring some energy to it.

Spice it up. I mean, it's hard to know if this is sex life or social life or what exactly is missing the energy. But I think both of you should put some energy into it. And I think that you can, Lauren and I talk about this a lot. Women can be the captain of the ship, so to speak. And if you bring the energy, hopefully he'll match you. And you can bring that energy into every part of, whatever you're unhappy with. If it's sex, if it's relationally, if you guys need to talk more,

I mean, just start working on it. I don't think it was Nico. I'm reading the account now and it says Nico's big booty burner account. It's not, it's not definitely not Nico. I think that what you said too, like you have to be the change you wish to see in the world. Yeah, like be the leader. If you want more love, be more love. I notice when I'm like being a bitch, I'm going to get maybe like Michael being feisty back to me. But if I come from like a loving area, I have to mix it up because I like to keep him guessing. But if I come from a loving space or like I make an effort in certain areas, it always works well. I feel like if you're just sitting around again complaining about how there's no zest in the marriage, maybe you're part of the problem and you need to take some accountability

that you're contributing to no zest. I mean, accountability is a huge aspect of a lot of people's unhappiness. It's like the locus of control. They feel like the world is happening to them. instead of them happening to the world. I think that relationships, I think, I mean, frankly, almost every single problem that exists in the world can be deduced all the way down to a communication issue, not being able to properly express your needs to your spouse or your needs to your friends or whoever, your family, whoever it might be. But going back on the accountability thing, there is a way to approach life where if you wake up

every single day and hold yourself accountable to the life that you want, and if it's relationship, if it's in a job, if it's in anything that you're doing, which is what I try to do is wake up every day and say, I'm going to fall in love with my wife again today. And you approach it that way and you're looking for things that remind you of what that spark was, what that zest was, what that thing was that drove you to have that excitement in your relationship. The excitement is not gone. You're just not participating. You decided to take a step back and not be in that. And so if you thought you could just coast for the rest of the marriage and that it was going to stay spicy, food gets bland if the spice isn't added all the time. And so you got to keep

adding that spice, keep bringing that self to the relationship so that you can continue to fall in love with each other every day. The same thing goes for your life, for your job, for whatever it is. You have to show up and bring the spice. The spice doesn't come for you. Michael, how are you adding zest to our marriage? You know, we have a lot of people on this show, talk relationships all the time, both on the mic, off the mic. And I think there's bad partners, obviously, at times. You can you can end up with somebody that's not actively participating anymore. A million reasons you don't have. But most of the time when you have these conversations,

you realize that the majority of time the partner that's complaining is waiting for the other person to completely change before they decide I'm going to change one thing about myself. So like I think about this podcast has been very informative in our life because we get to sit with so many people all the time and hear their stories. And so you obviously pick up some things along the way. And a lot of things you pick up our themes. So one of the common themes you pick up is how common it is for people to expect other people to change without changing a single thing about themselves.

So like I could sit here and be like, I've lost interest in the marriage. I've lost the zest because Lauren's not doing X, Y, and Z when 90% of the issues we face in life to your point, Nico, could be solved with us changing something about ourselves or taking more accountability for ourselves. And people have a really difficult time taking personal accountability. So, like, my advice is maybe if you're struggling with a zest for life, like, you have to change something about yourself first before you start externally expecting other people to do it for you. How about someone makes that a TikTok? How about someone makes that a TikTok sound? And I just play it back to you. To that point, though, in terms of the experiences of different people's, you know, lives and their opinions and their insights into it. I mean, I've, people say that, you know,

your psyche, your personality, everything changes in every 10 years. They say that you're, your identity goes through like a pretty significant shift every 10 years. And so people can grow out of a relationship. I mean, it's not. Sure, it happens. Yeah. But I think that the way I look at that is if I know that there's a 10-year cycle that I'm going to be a different person in 10 years, I think one of the biggest things I've

looked at is I want to be holding my wife's hand and her to be a part of that change and me to be a part of hers. If you're not in it together, if you're not, you know, we, like she said in the beginning, we're in business together. Everything I do, we do it together. It's our journey together in life. Now, we're both uniquely interesting in our own right and our own ways and we have our own lives, but we're doing this together.

And I think that point where you start asking, what is the other person not doing for me, you're starting to create a separate identity that is not, what are we doing together to make this work? And I think that goes to your point, Michael, of like, what you do is dependent on what you bring to the table, but it has to be matched. I love a coffee in the morning, but I don't. like to do coffee later in the day because I feel like it makes me stay awake. So instead of a second cup of coffee, I've switched it out for Peake's Sun Goddess Macha. This is the best

matcha you will ever have. It's organic. It's ceremonial grade. And it's been screened for toxins four times for purity. So they really thought of everything. Peak T's matcha is rich in chlorophyll and this supports detoxification of the body and promotes clear skin. And most importantly, it gives me like a sustained, really calm, even energy as opposed to making me spike like coffee. So I'll get the energy that I get from coffee later in the day. But I won't feel too awake to go to bed, if you know what I mean. I also feel like I have a lot of mental clarity with a super zen focus when I take matcha.

I like to froth my matcha. So what I'll do is I'll steam some milk. Just do like an inch. I'll put in my peak macha. It's absolutely delicious. While you're on their site, definitely grab their elderberry little packets. They're amazing for the immune system. The gender tea is the best that I've ever had. And then they also have these little beauty electrolyte packets. So those are the moves. They're on the site. PeakT.com slash skinny. That's P-I-Q-U-E-L-I-F-E dot com slash skinny. And you get 15% off plus free shipping for life. when you start on any of my peak favorites. That's peak life.com slash skinny.

I have been talking about ritual since we launched this podcast. I'm a huge fan of their protein powder. I love it. I use it to make my protein oats. But I'm also a huge fan of their multivitamin. So it's a clinically backed multivitamin for women 18 plus with high quality and traceable key ingredients. This is really important because a lot of brands use ingredients that you can't trace. With ritual, you can go on their site. and you can see where the key ingredients come from. And they're all clean and bioavailable, which is super important. This specific multivitamin has nine key nutrients. And one of them, for me is really important and I'm sure it is for you too. And that's vitamin D. They're big on

vitamin D. They also have obviously another eight key nutrients in the multivitamin, which you can see on their site. I do two capsules per day. The best part about this though is the vitamin tastes like mint. So it's like a minty essence in every. bottle, and this keeps things really fresh. Ritual knows that it's basically impossible to get all the nutrients you need from your diet 100% of the time. So they invented a multivitamin that helps you focus on what's important. Of course, we have a code for you. Instead of striving for perfect help, aim for supporting foundational health. And we have incredible news for you. Ritual is offering all Skinny Confidential him and her listeners 10% off during your first three months. So you're going to

visit ritual.com slash skinny to start your ritual or add essential for women 18 plus to your subscription today. I also would recommend the protein powder. It's insane. I also think, and this is just a little tippity tip for both you guys here, that it's nice when a guy does a little, a little something. Yeah. Just a little, make a little effort. Like, it doesn't always have to be this big shrie. And here's a little tippity tip for you. It's also nice when the woman does something or the partner in general. Yeah. So, A little love note in the morning. A little smack on the ass. I don't know if you know this.

Nico's mastered the smack on the ass. He always randomly always gives me a little smack on the ass. I mean, if you don't want to fuck your wife, there's a problem. And I'll say. I think both men and women want to feel desired. So I think you're right. Like I said, Nico every once in a while, he gives me a little smack on the ass. And it's just like, oh, he's thinking, he's like feeling it.

You know, I think women can do that too. You can grab your guys ass. I grab Michael's ass all the time when he bends over. People know on the show if they listen to me. I'm a huge equal opportunity guy. So I think like meet me in the middle also. Or even like looking over when you're when you're like looking at your husband and he's like looking good. Like tell him, be like you look hot tonight.

Like that for a guy, that's a big, that's a big game changer in the moment. Like all of a sudden they're like, ooh. She's feeling it. Men, I can't speak for all men, but at least myself. Confidence, if you get a confidence boost like that, it encourages that response too. So if you feel like your husband isn't, you know, going out of his way to show that love, show that affection, boosting their confidence becomes that catalyst to do it. Like if she tells me I look good, I'm like, oh, fuck yeah, all right. Like, you look smoking too.

Let's go. Let's fucking do something something really, really sweet. We were at a candy store, like an old candy store in Coronado. And he went and he got me, this was so cute. You got me mince that said number one mom. And that's such a little thing. But I think that's important as you go on in a relationship to do little things like that. Yeah, it doesn't have to be a huge gesture.

It's like those little moments that are like, hey, you know, I'm feeling spicy or like even I'm thinking of you. Even that little gesture of getting those little tic tacks or what were they tic tic tacks? Little mince. Same thing. It just showed that you were thinking of her. And that's cute. Michael's like, fuck, I shouldn't have got her a push present. I should have just got her number one moment.

Yeah. You would have saved a few bucks. All right. The next question is, this is a great question for you two and for Michael and I. Tips on making it work in a relationship when you're working with your partner in business. Who wants to go first? I would start, I said this a thousand.

I said this a thousand times. I would tell the high, high majority of couples listening or thinking about this to not consider working together. I've said that a thousand times on this show. I think that's my default. Most of the time you should never even entertain working with your significant other unless there are about 18 things that you align on before, right? Because it is very hard. Actually, I was talking to my accountant the other day and I don't want to put him on blast, but he was saying he sees, he's obviously on the other side. He's on the side of divorce a lot where he sees families go through divorce or breakups.

And he was basically like talking through like the ugliness of what that looks like when you're dividing, you know, your lawyers, you understand. Like when you're dividing all the assets and this and it's a lot. It's ugly. Yeah, it's ugly. But we were talking about how before Lauren and I got married, we figured out kind of how to work together. And he was saying in a lot of ways figuring that out first is maybe giving, we'll give the

marriage a better chance because it's so much harder to figure out than a marriage. And I'm not saying that like bragging. I'm just saying like I'm using it as a cautionary tale because in a marriage it's an equal partnership, right? Like you get into it or hopefully it's equal. You get into it. It's like the way you raise your children. It's equal say.

The way you manage your household is equal say. The way you go about life. It's like you're two people joining in a life together to have an equal relationship with respect. In business, and this is just the truth, there can't be two people in charge at the same time. And there can't be two people in charge. of the same process within a business at the same time. So, for example, if I'm the CEO of Dear Media, I could not have another CEO of Dear Media because it makes it very difficult to manage an organization. If she's the CEO of Skinny Confidential, she can't have me being, so there's that dynamic.

And when you're in a relationship, and I'm shut up because I'm long-winded here, that's hard because you're used to having equal say. And all of a sudden, now it's like, well, who's in charge here? I'm making the decisions on the finances. I'm making a decision on the hires. I'm in Lauren's case, like we're using skinny confidential branding. She's the creative. Like there's a lot of dynamics that cause a lot of rub and pull. And also on the other, the last thing,

you may have two different visions of what a successful business venture is. One person in a marriage version, meaning they might want to build a fucking empire and never stop working and have a thousand people and whatever. And another person may say like, I want to have enough to like just kind of support and go on vacation. So it's just difficult. And so I think unless you align on like defining the line,

figuring out who's doing what, being on the same page of what the business is going to be, who's in charge, who's not in charge, who gets to make decisions here, all that dynamic. If you can do that ahead of time, then maybe consider working together. But if you're not aligned on that from the beginning, I think don't do it. Like if Michael tried to tell me what color pink my ice roller was going to be. Yeah, it wouldn't work. No way. Yeah, you're the creative.

Wouldn't work. A lot of what Michael was saying is, you know, I deal with business divorce a lot. I deal with business partners who go into business together and didn't do exactly what you're talking about as objective, hopefully not, well, not hopefully not, but just not romantically involved individuals who wanted to go into business together. And the dynamics associated with being business partners carries with it all kinds of opportunities for tension, for stress, for, you know, just trigger points that can create problems. And so when you're starting a business with anyone, you've got to do what Michael was just talking about. I mean, you should clearly define

roles, delegate responsibilities, be very transparent about, you know, whose authority, where and make sure that you have a system for how that business is going to operate. Now, if you are romantically linked and you start a business together, first and foremost, I think the biggest advice that I could give is leave your marriage or your relationship out of the business and leave the business out of your marriage. I think that when you go to work together, you're at work. Put your work suit on and your work set mindset on and you're working. And this is your business partner. You love them. You care for them deeply in different ways, but don't bring like, they never clean the dishes to the boardroom table. You know, and if you're at home,

don't, don't argue over the kids and to be like, you fucking do this at work too. You never, you know, manage people correctly. And now you're telling our kids they can't do this or what have you. So it's like, you have to have that ability to separate or you're going to have, like, they're going to bleed into each other and neither one is like the business will end the marriage or the marriage will end the business. But it likes for the example, like say you and I did a business venture together. Like, I'm not going home and laying in bed with you. No, exactly. Right? And I'm not waking up with you in the morning and like rubbing your back, right? Are you sure? There's just dynamics. And here's the other thing. You guys did. You guys did try to go on a little

private date the other day. So maybe there's a little hanky-panky going on. That's why we're not in business together because we don't want to mess up with our personal relationship. But the point is, is I think that the hardest thing that Lauren and I have had, I think, to figure out in our relationship, harder than kids, harder is, has been the working dynamic. And it was like when you stop talking about work, you know, because we go to dinner, it's like if you're, if you're a couple that's not in business together, you go and you talk about what happened at work. But like if you're in business together, you don't have that. You're just talking about it all the time and just can't. So it's been a luckily, I think we've figured it out. This point,

it's been a long time of figuring it out. But it's not been easy. I mean, when I'm asleep at 3 a.m. and you're hanging from the ceiling. But I'm better now. I don't do that anymore. You used to be gnarly. You'd be whispering, what does your five year plan look like? I still want to know that. As long as he's not using it as foreplay, that would be creepy. That would be really weirded out. I'm dying to know what Jordan's take on this is because for me, like, I think we work together successfully.

I also have very defined roles within the business because she's the visionary. She's the creative behind the concept. She's the product ideator. She's the one that it's her business. And that's, I guess, one thing I would say is like, know your role and slow your role. Like, don't try to overstep. don't try to be the king of the castle. If you're coming in, especially if it's someone else's business, like, I want Jordan's

advice in my legal and business consulting business, but she knows that that's my business, so she's not going to try to overstep and tell me how to run my services. Same for me. I might be able to help her with the business structure and the legal structure, but I'm not going to go in there and be like, you should be doing the services this way. If she asks for my insight, I'll give it, but I know my role. I'm not going to overstep because I respect it as if it were, even if she wasn't my wife. Like, you don't go into somebody's business and just because you have a leg up in a

relationship standpoint, start talking like it's your business and you have the right to make changes. Yeah, I also think you got to decide what kind of person are. So for example, I'm not, I don't think what people would consider a guy's guy, meaning like I'm not going on the guy's trip. I don't want to go over for the fucking ball game. I don't care who's playing. I don't want to be invited to the bachelor party. I don't want to do much, right? And so like, but I like being around my wife a lot. And so like in that regardless, I want to create an opportunity in a business venture that enables me to spend a lot of time. That's one version. Another version, and there's nothing wrong with this. And I'm actually, I'm not passing any judgment. There's guys like, listen, I need time outside doing my thing, managing. Like, and it's not. Your time like that is like a lone time, I feel like. Yeah, but I'm saying like, and there's nothing. I actually, I think that's healthy too. And I think it's healthy when guys go on the guy's trip and get and go to the games. And like, I think that is very healthy. If that's the type of guy you are and that's what makes you happy in life, go golfing or whatever.

the fuck it is. But so I think like if you are not, if you're somebody that needs that kind of individual time, you know, where you have stuff outside of the home with the boys or with your company, whatever it is. And like you get you have part of your identity being outside of like the household. Like you then would not want to be in some business with your wife where you don't get that. Right. And so I think these are like these are questions that people really need to think about before getting into business. And I would say not only in a marriage or relationship, but. maybe Nico you would agree with this. Any business venture when you're considering taking on a partner. Most of the mistakes I've made in business and I made a few have been on not being thoughtful with

the business partners and the in the lining up front, right? Like I just think like you don't realize like in a way you're marrying somebody anytime you start a venture. I almost feel like, oh sorry, go ahead. No, I was just going to say I think you made a really great point. And I think it's very interesting that I feel like you guys successfully work together. And I think Nico and I successfully work together. And you are similar in that sense. He doesn't need the guy's nights either. He likes to be with his wife. And so he doesn't need that alone time as much. And his alone time, he doesn't need the guy time. His alone time is where he gets his own thing going on. And I think that's interesting that, you know, you guys both have that kind of dynamic and you're both able to

work with your significant others. Well, we also both have significant others that are ambitious, entrepreneurial visionaries in their own right and they have big ideas and we can we can be supportive in that sense i think that's the key difference too it's like if your wife is helping you with your business because you need help right or if your wife or you're helping like as an example let's say you open a gym or your wife opens a bakery and she just needs administrative support you're not really going into business together you're just a backstop you're helping pick up slack because the business is maybe early stage and you can't afford to hire an assistant or you can't afford to hire a bookkeeper yet.

So your husband and your wife is helping with those things. That's not going into business together. That's you having access to someone who can help you with a labor-intensive business, right? So I think that there's a difference between we're starting a business together or I'm going to help you launch your business. And then I have a business and I need help. So I'm asking my wife to help me or my husband to help me. That's very different, right?

Because if you're not going in as partners, then one person will feel like, well, this isn't my shit. I don't like I'm being, I got to spend my Saturdays doing bookkeeping for my wife's bakery because she can't afford to hire anyone. It's taking something away from me. I don't feel like I'm invested in this. And that's what I think is different, at least in this perspective, is with us, I'm investing in my wife. I'm investing in us.

She's investing in me and we're investing in each other. And that's going to grow our life. That's going to grow. It's additive. It brings value to the relationship. I think if you feel like your wife or your husband asking you to help in their business is taking away from your life. life, meaning it's an opportunity now that you don't have to go have that alone time, like Michael

was saying. That's where it's becoming a negative and it's taking, it's subtracting from the value of your life as opposed to giving you guys an opportunity to have a shared bond and a shared passion. Well said. I have a little micro tip. I think when it comes to working together, there's this thing called request for coaching. And what I try to do with my husband is if he is at request for coaching when it comes to business, I'll give my advice or my two cents. But if he's not at request for coaching, sometimes I'll just let him vent. And I think that's really important within a relationship and a marriage to know when someone is at request for coaching and when they're not. And we've all had the friend that comes to us and starts telling us every single thing that's wrong, but they're not

open to getting feedback. And I think that that little request for coaching, little line, can really change working together within a business and a relationship. Because sometimes people just want to talk and vent and sometimes they actually want advice. And I think there's two very, very different things. Well, one last thing from my perspective, too. I mean, I deal with business breakups. I deal with like as a business lawyer. Most of the time I'm working with people to build their business. But a lot of the time, they're coming to me because there's a dispute with the partners or there's a problem with the business that was overlooked and it creates a challenge. And so a lot of the intensity in the issues that I deal with are elevated because you typically

if you're smart, you get a lawyer before there's a problem. Most of the time it's remedial. People are coming to me to help them fix something. And I look at us being in business together as an asset. I don't look like a lot of people look at getting going into a business with a significant other as a risk. I look at it as a benefit. I know her so well and she knows me so well that we can use that as an advantage in our business together. Because I see people who are in business together that don't know each other like a husband and wife do. And they can't figure out how to move past something because they don't know how to communicate with each other. Yes, it's easy for a husband and a wife or two significant others to fight over issues within the business, but leverage the strength that you

have because you know each other. Like that's, that is intangible value that you can't get with a random person. Totally. And I just to add to that, I think there's always in business, whether it's with your significant other or not, there's going to be times where one person is going to take the lead and make a decision, whether, like, for him, for example, he takes the lead on anything related to, like, administrative systems, hiring, legal, more the, like, business stuff. And I take the lead on, like, the creative side, the client side, the services side, the branding side, things like that. But throughout that process, we obviously talk and we have had disagreements about various things within both of those realms.

And sometimes one person's right and sometimes another person's right. And over time, you might learn, hey, you know, even though I'm the branding person, he was right at that point. I should have listened to him. But let's not dwell on it. Let's just keep learning and moving forward and moving on and moving towards the goal and not like letting it create resentment or anything like that. But just being self-aware and learning together, growing together within the business.

Yeah. Being right for the sake of being right is wrong. It's just true. You're just trying to win the argument and be the right, be the person who is right. What's the point? Your goal is to build something together. If what you're bringing to the table isn't actually helping build it, it's actually just tearing down your relationship, you're fucked. Next question.

Ideas for a quick 15 minute morning routine. Working mom of two, I leave at 6.30 and home by five. And I feel like everyone in this group that I'm sitting with has very, I think that everyone is very disciplined when it comes to. their routine. So this will be an interesting question to answer separately. My whole day is thrown off. If I don't get up in the morning, put my baby in the baby v. Yorn and go for my morning walk, listening to my podcast. Your morning routine is so, so important. So mine's a little bit longer than 15 minutes personally. But I go for a walk outside with the baby. Then I come back. I make a coffee, I take my vitamins, and then I work out, and then I'm getting the kids ready for school,

with one kid ready for school. And then I have breakfast. And like, that's my morning routine. And it's very simple. It's very simple. There's not even really anything crazy. It's mostly just the walk, the kids and my workout. For me with my morning routine, and this is the advice I give everyone, and I know that I'm like, do 6,000 things and it can be overwhelming. But this is where I would start. What are your five or even three non-negotiables? For you. what like what are those non-negotiables? If it were me, one non-negotiable and Michael Bostic taught me this is you got to get light in your eyes. You got to, you got to, you got to. That's why I love the walk. The walk is great. So like sometimes I'll sit outside and have coffee. Sometimes I'll take

a walk. And I can't take credit for that. Andrew Heberman taught me that. I just think like light. Light is a good, a good good thing. And then also like hydration, like huge hydroflask full of water. Cameron Diaz said that your body is like a flower. And in the morning, the flower needs to be watered. Like you got to water, water, water, water, water, minerals, vitamins, whatever that looks like, like hydrate the body. And then for me, you know, just like a micro one is I like to make the bed. I think it sets the tone. It organizes my space. It organizes my mind. I'm meditating or listening to an audio book. I also always recommend if you're going to listen to something in the morning, don't listen to something that's gossipy or not going to stimulate your brain. Like I try to listen to something that is is going to uplift me where I'm

going to have a great day. And then motivation. The third the fourth one for me and I think everyone at this table can agree whatever it is move move. Workout weights. You know, Melissa Woodhouse, get in the gym, take a walk, whatever it is. I'll let Nika go. I'll go last. So I have had numerous different hardcore morning routines. And I think that they've evolved. Obviously, when you have kids, that changes the dynamic of what your options are when you have your set routines. I think that what was the hardest lesson for me to learn, definitely find the things that get your energy levels up in the morning. You want to have positive, whether it's like ignoring your phone until you've had a moment to yourself or whatever it is. But I think the piece for me that is the most important

is do everything you can to eliminate judgment in the first 15 minutes of your day. And what I mean by that is don't start thinking about what you did or didn't do or what you do have to do or what, don't project your day in your mind and create judgments associated with it. Like, oh, today's going to suck because I have to go do this, that, and whatever. Or, oh, shit, I overslept a little bit. Now I don't get to have my morning routine. I think that routines are great, but you want to be mindful of your attitude and your mindset are going to have a bigger impact, in my opinion, on your day than your ability to get that walk. Just because you didn't get the walk doesn't mean your day is going to suck. So I think definitely set up a routine. I'm not, I'm pro routine. I'm pro routine. But I think what I had to learn was I would get really down on myself when I couldn't do my routine. And it would fuck my whole day up. And so I had to say, look, you get it when you can. So eliminate that judgment. Your day is not going to be shit because you didn't get to get that walk in or read the paper or whatever it is that you like to do. So if you can wake up and just say, I'm going to have the best fucking day today, no matter what I do.

and set your mindset that way and then get into whatever you got to do. I think that the mindset will make the routines easier and will also make your day better. Okay, everyone, this year, Lauren and I are all about kicking it up a notch when it comes to our overall health and fitness. We're actually starting this year with an extensive workout and health routine coming off the back of last year where we put in a ton of work. And of course, this also includes proper supplementation. One of our favorite new products is from timeline nutrition and it's called mitopure.

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still. It is an absolute game changer. Mitopure comes in three forms, berry powder, protein powder, and soft shells. I like the soft shells because you can just take them with the rest of your supplements very easily. You can take them on the go, travel with them. For me, they're just the easiest form to take it. So check it out. This is a game changer. Timeline is offering 10% off your first order of mitochondear.

Go to timelinenutrition.com slash skinny and use code skinny. Get 10% off your order. That's T-I-M-E-L-I-N-U-T-R-I-O-N-N-T-R-I-N.com slash skinny. and trying their starter pack with all three formats to see what you like the best. I like the soft gels, but try that one out. Timelinenutrition.com slash skinny. Since moving to Austin, I really made over my whole life. I wanted Austin to be like a sanctuary and a retreat.

And I wanted everything to be clean and fresh and non-chaotic. And one of the things that I switched out was my cleaning supplies. I've talked about this. But I also switched out my kitchenware. I have been learning from a lot of people who come on the podcast that there's a lot of toxic kitchenware on the market. And so I found this brand. It's called Caraway. And basically, it's a non-toxic kitchenware so you can ditch the chemicals and make healthier cooking a piece of cake. There's toxic materials in a lot of this kitchenware. It's like P-F-A-S, P-T-F-E, and P-F-O-A. You guys can go Google this and go down the rabbit hole. A lot of hard-to-pronounce chemicals that are in a lot of cookware. Anyways, they have like ceramic, naturally sleek surfaces, so you don't need a ton of oil or butter. Michael makes Saza an egg in the morning on the cream set. It's so beautiful. It matches perfectly with

the house. It's limited stock, so I would check that out. They also have ones in white and black and even pink. It's just so cute. Very well branded. Anyways, of course, we have a code for you. They have 30,000 people raving about this. You're going to visit careway home.com slash skinny to take advantage of this limited time offer for 10% off your next purchase. This deal is exclusive for our listeners, so visit carewayhome.com slash skinny or use skinny at checkout. Caraway, non-toxic cookware made modern. Hot tip, I have a recommendation for the most amazing everyday sweater, okay? It's by Jenny Kane. It's actually called the everyday sweater. I got it in tope. It comes in ivory and Heather gray too. You could honestly go with any color on their site. Everything is very neutral, which I appreciate.

I got a medium in this sweater because I wanted it to fit a little tight. Normally I go large because I like things oversized. But in this sweater, I went medium and I'm really happy about it. This sweater is just everything you could want in a sweater. It's lightweight. It's easy. It's great for layering. You could layer it over like a white button up shirt or you could wear it alone. I've worn this sweater with a tight black pant in a really high stiletto. But I also wore it the other day with like a baggy vintage gene and a little. over and it's just magical, dressed up or dressed down. Anyway, if you haven't heard of Jenny King, you have to check them out, especially if you're into classics. They have so many classics on their sites. Lots of neutrals, lots of blacks, lots of whites. They have like amazing textured items. And I just feel like they've really evolved with the times and they get it. So if you're looking for like some amazing sweaters, tops, outerwear's dress, lounge, sleep, bottom, shoes, accessories, they even have men's and kids. But the colors are right. The shapes are right. The fit is right. It's stuff that you can wear all the time, which I appreciate. So like when I traveled to

L.A., I brought my everyday sweater, and I literally could have worn it any time. Like I could have worn it to podcast or out to dinner. It was just a great sweater to bring, especially when I was traveling. Anyway, if you want to elevate your everyday basics and wardrobe essentials, you have to check them out. Of course, we have a code for you. Find your forever pieces at jennycane.com. All skinny confidential him and her listeners get 15% off your first order when you use code skinny at check. Checkout. Go get the everyday sweater. That is like the moment. That's 15% off your first order at J-E-N-N-N-I-K-K-A-Y.com promo code Skinny. New Year, New Me, and new clothes with Jenny Kane. Don't forget to use code Skinny at checkout. Three things. One, Lauren's done phenomenally well. Find yourself a partner. Actually, here's the thing. Everybody in this table or at this table has young children. Luna's a little older and three. But around three and younger. And I don't care what anyone says. all the parents out there listening knows, like when that happens, like, I don't care who you are.

Like, you're playing defense a lot of the time. It just is. So step one is implement a little bit more discipline and get your ass up earlier. If you have only 15 minutes, you got to get up earlier. I'm sorry, it just is. I was not getting a morning routine at all. And I realized there was no way for me to get one unless I started waking up earlier. I was a 637 wake up guy. I am now a 5.5.30 guy because I have to in order to get the time alone. Even when he was hung over today, he's up at 5.30 because he needs time to himself. But it's because I realized I was just doing the same thing that this person that asked a question. I was playing defense, running around, cooking breakfast, trying to keep up with the kids.

And it was impossible. So if I really want a morning routine to set my day, I have no choice but to implement a little more discipline and get up. Now it's natural. Second thing, if you're Lauren, you're very smart, Lauren, find yourself a partner that'll get up and handle the kids in the morning. Because I get up and I do the breakfast. Find yourself a partner who do the diet. I do the bottles. That's why I get my walk-in with the baby.

You know what? I don't give a fuck. No, here's my thing. I do a lot. But I also carried the babies for 10 months. So if you have to wake up an hour early, suck a dick. Like, I'm sorry. I'm not complaining.

But I'm saying so with Lauren has an 11-hour routine because I'm up ahead. No, I don't. But no. I'm going for walks, working out, having water. And he goes over there with Luna. And listen, to Nico's point. Getting her up, changing her morning. diaper. Not every day is the same, but if I can get up early, get some time to myself,

journal, meditate. Like my routine changes your letters, but, but I don't judge myself anymore. I basically judge the end of my day on, and we talked about this little bit last night after dinner, like, was I productive or unproductive that day? And as long as I feel at the end of the day that I've been productive in some area, whether in my marriage, as a dad, as a business owner, as a podcast, if I've been productive, it's a win. If I, whether I've got a workout in, unproductive would be like, okay, I didn't really move the needle. I wasn't really good to my marriage. I kind of sat around. I was lazy. Like, so to me, now what drives happiness and fulfillment is productivity. And it doesn't mean productivity just from a business monetary sense.

It means like, was I just, was I putting something out into the world that was greater than was was was in there yesterday. And just a hot tip taping my mouth shut at night has really helped my morning be better because I wake up with more energy. Just to really recap and concisely put my answer to this person that's only got 15 minutes because she's getting a get up. Get up. You got to get up earlier. Well, it's funny that you say that because for me just, I mean, I, I, you said you switched to a 5 to 5.30 routine. I kind of went the opposite direction. I used to be a 4.4.30 in the morning person and I would have three or four hours before anybody in the house was awake to do everything. He would have a whole day before I would watch the sunrise every day. And it was

very peaceful. It was great. It was all the things for self-development, self-growth, you know, all that. It was like this pocket of time. But I think one thing people underestimate is how much time they waste. And so, you know, morning routines are great. But don't try to stack. your whole routine or all of your self-care in the morning. You're going to, I mean, look at your screen time on your phone. You're probably fucking off three or four hours a day. And I think one thing that I do now is I'm more of a 637 wake up. So I lost two hours, but I gained them because I realize my values have changed a little bit.

I want to be there when my daughter wakes up. I want to hang out with her when I get home from work. And back when I was getting up at 4.30 in the morning, after 8 p.m., I'm fucked. I'm going to sleep. So now I gain two hours at night to spend time with my kids. I have the energy and I have all of that. And yeah, I've sacrificed my 5 a.m. workout. But I find a way to get the workout in because I was bullshitting for two hours in the middle

of the day, you know, scrolling through a blog or, you know, watching Instagram or whatever it was. And so now I'm like, my routines are maximizing so that I can get that productivity you're talking about. You know what? I've changed my mind now. Now they've been making a lot of sense. Lord, I think you should start getting up at five and I can have the 11 hour routine.

I'm just not. I'm just not. Listen, I'm self-aware. 7 a.m. I'm good. I'm not going to, you know. I think I've changing it. So now I'll make.

Maybe I'll get up. I'll make the bed. I'll like listen to birds. I'll get some light in my eyes. I get the energy going. Like the vibes are on point in my house thanks to me. I will say. Yeah, the mood. The tone is set. Like everything is chill, low cortisol. We have like some flutes going. Like I've got the energy set. Like, sorry. Okay. This is a great one. How to not feel guilty about not following parents' advice about university instead of working? my answer is going to be super blunt on this one. I think people know how I feel about this.

I think if you are doing anything in your life to appease someone else, it's a recipe for disaster. And I am a very, very big, I talk a lot about how I think it's so important to beat to your own drum and put your blinders on and not give a fuck what anyone thinks. I think if you're living your life and planning your life of how your parents want you to do it, you're setting yourself up for disaster. So my answer is pretty.

Hold a bandaid off. Play this for your parents. I hate to say this. but it's the truth. Not in all professions, doctor or lawyer, places where you actually need to go and, you know, learn a trade. Learn a trade gets certified. You get actually have a license, you know, that's different. And I hate to say this, but it's the truth. The value placed on college degrees from a business hiring standpoint is not what it was when our parents were coming up. It just isn't. I have. And like, don't project that generational situation onto me. I have, you know, however many people here now work at Dear Media, and I don't know where one of them went to school. I have not looked at one college degree.

In fact, they could have gone to clown school. I don't, as a matter of fact, and here's what actually really matters now. There's a new generation of people that have a different kind of skill set that wasn't taught in a lot of the schools that we were all in school. Like, when I was in school, social media influencer, podcaster, YouTuber, gamer, digital creator, all of the e-com businesses. These weren't like things that people did. So there was no, there was no way to learn this in school. So now a lot of times when I'm hiring, I'm like, shit, if I need that graphic designer, I need that video creator, I need someone that understands SEO,

or I need someone that knows how to run an e-com store. Like, I'm going and looking at people that are actually doing this and know how to do it and have built a skill set. That might be an 18-year-old kid that didn't ever go to school, but they're just, they're a killer on some of these platforms that I'm not. And so I think like, again, if you're going into a specific trade that requires a very specific license or degree. Like, that's one thing. But if your parents just want you to go to college or that one day you can get a great job, I really think you've got to think about what field of work you're going into. Yeah, if you want to be a doctor, obviously, you got to go get the degree and you got to go to school. But if you want to be a more creative person, yeah, it's not worth the debt. It's not worth the debt.

It's a huge expense. It's just not worth it. It doesn't make logical sense anymore. And I think, you know, we're sitting, we're sitting here as four employers. And we are saying, we don't care. We're someone went to school. I want to see what you can do. People get really upset for me and you'll probably agree with this. And I think everyone agree. If your parents will pay for you to go to school and you can just go for four years and not take on a debt and they're happy to fund it like between the ages of 18 and 22 and you can have a side hustle and like you don't have to take on debt like go to fucking school. It's great, right? Go have the college experience. But if you're somebody that's got to take on a shitload of debt, you're not really sure what you want to do from a career standpoint

yet. And you have to take on all that and you're doing it just to appease your parents who are not going to foot the bill, then I would say for sure don't do it. You know what I look for on a resume? I don't look at it. Same. I don't look at it. You know what I look for? I look for. Are you resourceful? Can you figure it out? If I give you a task, can you find the opportunity. If you can't, if someone comes to me and I can't do it this way, find another way to do it. What's the door? Come through the chimney. I want to see how your brain thinks of strategy. I also want to know, are you dependable? Are you reliable? Are you organized? Can you execute? you can do those things. If you literally went to college for sea monkeys, I don't care. You can have a different take on this because obviously you went to school to become a lawyer.

I mean, and I also have a, I have a few interesting perspectives on this issue. One, because as far, like I think a big part of this question was the, you know, the influence from from the parents and maybe the pressure from the parents. Like, I, I am at this table, have gone to school the longest because I had to go get a graduate degree and become a licensed professional. And obviously, it has not had an impact on, frankly, on anybody's ability to succeed. Life education is a means to an end. It should have some goal at the end. For me, it was become a licensed attorney because that's a skill in my toolbox that I can use in my life.

So I think it needs to be intentional. The other side of it with the parents thing, I mean, my dad is a lawyer. And so there was a lot of, not pressure, but a lot of influence in what guided my decision because I wanted to follow in those footsteps. But I also was fortunate enough to serve professionally after high school. So I was able to not go straight into college at 18 years old and I got to travel and surf and party and be a complete asshole for four years. And so I didn't go to undergraduate college until, I think I was 23 when I started.

And I went to law school. I was one of the oldest people in my law school because everybody else was like 21, 22, just got out of their undergrad. Most of them lost. I had no fucking idea why they were there other than it was just they did their Polly sigh and now they're going to be lawyers. When I was surfing, I was partying, but I always had in the back of my mind, this isn't going to be it.

I'm not good enough to be a lifelong surfer. It's not a career opportunity. I just took advantage in the moment of an opportunity to get paid to travel and surf and frankly be a irresponsible human being, which you should take if those options are available. So on one hand, what's in front of you? Is it like you were saying, is it the parents are going to pay and you can go and kind of fuck off and party in college and have fun. But what's the point there? At that point, you don't have to go to college to party and fuck off. You can do that anywhere. So I think if you're

going to go to school, whether it's because you're being influenced by your parents or not, it should be intentional. So when I decided, okay, this professional serving thing has really just been a big party. It's not a career move. I realized, okay, I need to go to college. So I went to business. I majored in business because I knew there were going to be skills building opportunities there that were going to teach me things about what I eventually wanted to do, which was be a business owner. After that, I had an opportunity after I graduated my undergrad to take over my dad's law firm. So going to law school wasn't like, I'm going to be a lawyer because I want to sit in the high-rise office like if I was on that show suits. It was, this is another thing I need to do to achieve something.

I can't own my dad's law firm unless I'm a lawyer. You have to be licensed to own a law firm. So it was a means to an end. It was another skill development opportunity that had a, certificate and then an opportunity to be licensed after it. So me going to school was intentional, like you're saying. It was, yeah, it wasn't to be a lawyer. It was to pick up a skill that was going to be an asset. So if you're going to school for political science or communications or something that are generic and don't really have an end result, again, if it's like I'm going to go to law school after so I'm going to be a polysci major, I don't know what people learned as political science majors, but I'm set up better for success as a business major than I

would have been if I studied political science. It's what I tell people. Yeah, that's a good point because I think a lot of people do go to college because they're trying to get that check mark of like, I went to college. I'm going to get the job. And I think that's the thing we're kind of saying too. I wish that I didn't, I wish that I had the tides are turning. The tides are not necessarily, employers are not necessarily obsessed with the degree. No, because because the problem is, is a lot of the degree doesn't translate into what's actually taking place in the workplace nowadays. right like so like if you worked in an entity like this there's not like a there's not a there's not a school I go to and say give me your best candidates that graduated with this degree because even now like

this is a new like podcasting's been around for a while but the way that we're married into digital and e-com business all these things like there's not like a person that I can be like hey give me your best pool of legal candidates that came out or give me your best doctors or give me your best business finance majors like I can't really go there so I think there's that but I one thing I talk to my business partner Weston about all the time is I wish and listen I'm not really living wishes but if I could have it my way or I could tell my kid something about school we had no clue what we wanted to do from a career standpoint and I think a lot of young people don't and you get in this weird stressed environment where you feel like you have to have your your life mapped out at 18 years old and

you have to know what you're going to do from a career standpoint if I could go back now like I was a regional development major with a business minor what the fuck is regional development that's nothing to do with what I'm doing now. But if I could go back now, there's a lot of things. I would have definitely taken a bunch of finance courses because I had to learn that the hard way, understanding capital, understanding or raise capital, understanding, all of that. And nobody taught me I to just like learn it the hard way. I would have probably gone into some coding or engineering degree so that I could learn how to code websites so that I could learn how to build stuff online. That would be one of mine too. Being an SEO coding.

Because now everything that I'm doing is highly dependent on working with a lot of people like that. even things like, you know, in a weird way, graphic design or, you know, video creation, things like that, which you can actually hire a lot of that and outsource for what I do. But the point is, is like, my degree at the time did not correlate into any way that I could translate into something that I was passionate about in business. And so I had, I learned a lot of things in college, mostly out of party and mostly I have some independence and like do all that. And luckily, I didn't have to foot the bill.

But if I would have had context like you had and maybe tasted a little bit more real life experience, I would have gone back like, okay. now I need to get this type of degree or this type of certification or this type of course because it would have helped me. There's a lot of shit I just had to find out a hard way. There's a lot of people that are right now pushing, and I think it's smart to push this, they're talking about doing a gap year. They're saying, look, after you graduate high school, whatever you think you want to go study in college, if college is the route that you want to go, go do it for a year. Go, you know, get an internship. If you have an opportunity, yeah, go work for a nonprofit if you want to save the

world and you want to be an environmentalist, go work in a nonprofit before you go and get the debt and then maybe change your mind. I mean, you know many kids I knew in law school that were like, I'm here to save the planet and now work at an insurance firm because they need to make some fucking money? Like at the end of the day, there's nothing wrong with being altruistic. There's nothing wrong with wanting to change the world, but you don't have to go to school to do that. I was lucky. I was 24 years old when I started my education. I was learning how to read financial statements in business school that most people that I have hired. You had an idea of what you wanted to do. And I was working in a, I was working for my dad at the time. So when I was

sitting in a meeting with him looking at financial statements, I actually knew what the fuck I was looking at. Other people are like, well, dad, you want to talk about political science? He's like, no, fuck you. I need to make money. Let's talk about your, let's talk about the businesses and the operations. I think one of the more fucked up things they do in this country is make people take on a lot of debt before they know what to do. No, and to bring it back to the question of dealing with parents that might be pressuring you, I think another thing that like dealing directly with your parents, you need to figure out what it is like, what is the reason that they are so obsessed with this education. Is it the education? Is it the checkmark? Because that's what society is.

is saying, like know what that is and then attack it a little bit logically, because if it's the education, we have the internet now. You can learn anything. You can build your own degree for free on YouTube, basically. I mean, you won't have the certification, but you'll have the education. And when you go to an employer and you say, I have all these skills, I can, I can code, I can do graphic design, I can do SEO, I can do whatever. That's what we're looking for. That's what employers are looking for. We're not looking for whether you went to, you know, ASU, which that's a where I went. Go Devils. Hold on.

But one thing I do have to say, because it's, it's, maybe it's because I have exposure to it. There are businesses and there are like law firms and even businesses like that are looking for Harvard MBAs. I mean, there is a, like, let's not, and I know we're all, we all understand this. And if that's what you want to do, then fine. But there's a, but there's a prestige aspect to that. That starts becoming clout chasing as opposed to skill building. Like if you're going to go, if your mom and dad went to Harvard and they want you to go

to Harvard and you're like, no, fuck you, I want to go be an influencer. That's going to be a hard sell to them. But like, if you want to be a rebel, do it. Like, you don't have to go to Harvard to be successful in every space. But like that doesn't mean that, like, again, know why you're going to college. Don't just, like, if you're just going there for the prestige, then, then you're not asking, should I go to college? You're asking, does this matter? And that's a question you have to ask yourself. Let's also distinguish between Harvard, Stanford, MIT, places like that compared to like the local community college, or where Jordan went ASU or where I went you. They call it the Harvard of the desert.

I thought they called my school the Harvard. I thought they called my school the Harvard. Real quick. Some of those schools that those people go to, the graduates, the families that have been involved, the money that's in there is like you're getting a master's in networking right off the batch just because of the people and the families and the money and the opportunity they're there. But the high, high majority of people that are listening to this show do not have the opportunity to go to Stanford, Harvard, MIT.

like some of these places that it's just like, I mean, if you can go there and get in there, I say take it. But most people. Well, and if you can't go to those schools, right, whether it's access, financials, whatever, then I'll agree with what everybody's saying here. It doesn't fucking matter what school you go to. Like, that's why for me, like, I didn't care what law school I went to. Luckily, I was able to stay in San Diego and go to one of the better schools there. But I didn't really give a shit because it was a means to an end. I didn't matter. Like my dad, to take over his firm, it didn't matter if I went to Harvard or fucking Tijuana law school. It doesn't matter.

Like, I just needed to be able to sit for the bar and become a licensed attorney. So it was a means to an end. I also think, and then we can move on with this question because we have other ones. Sometimes parents are projecting their own shit onto you. And I think, and you mentioned this earlier, it's really important to understand why, like, why they're doing that and not maybe we take that on because for me, I don't want to go project on to Zaza and towns what I want for them. I want them to come to the conclusion of what they want for themselves. And I want to deal with it in a non-judgmental way. And last point on that real quick, there comes a point too where you

don't even have to prove yourself. If they're not, you know, like, you don't have to make your case. You just got to do you. It's your life. And it's your debt if you take it on. So caught my husband texting another woman two years ago, still can't get over it. What the fuck? Is that a question? Is that a question? Wait, is that? Are we, Michael exposed?

That's a plot twist. Someone just asked that. Okay. I think I have a feeling all of us are going to feel pretty much the same about it. This was two years ago. If I caught you cheating or caught you talking to another woman, texting, not cheating. Wait, wait. What do you mean?

Oh, the question was two years ago. I was like, what do you mean two years ago? No, no. Wait, the question was read more as a statement. Yeah. Okay, she said she caught her husband texting two years ago. She caught her husband texting another woman. She caught her husband texting another woman two years ago and she's not over it.

Okay. I probably, and this is going to come off real harsh, but I think if you caught your husband texting another woman two years ago, two years ago, you should have been peace out, bye. I know that can be complicated. Maybe you have children, maybe all those things. But I think once the trust is broken, it's very hard to repair. if you guys are not actively seeking to repair that, then yeah, of course you're still going to be angry about it. Of course. I think everyone's different. I think some people, you know, aren't going to care as much if your husband's texting another woman for me. Like what's what you just said, it's, I feel like it speaks to the person's character and it's a lack of integrity. And if you're going to do that, what else are you going to do? As far as not being able to get over it, I think that the past to get over it. I think that the past to get over, it has expired. So you either, in my opinion, you either really got to get over it or you should

take an exit. Yeah. I need a little more context. Did he just say hello? Was he? It was texting. No, it was a texting conversation. Well, I mean, listen, I think again, people get irritated when I say this. Screenshots. Did you know, I feel. In 2022, you guys, there's screenshots. You can't do it. You can't cheat in 2020. People get irritated when I say this, but I said it a thousand times on this show. There's windows of opportunity and everything in life. If this happened at the time and you chose not to do anything about it or voice concern or leave or go to counseling or whatever, it's like you've kind of said, I've accepted this and I moved on.

To bring it up two years later, it's like a little too late, a little too little too little. And so it's hard to go back two years later and say, because if this bothered you then, you should have done something then as opposed to sit here and complain about it two years later, right? People get really upset because, of course, you're not have kids. I mean, I know there's, yeah, I get there's life. and there's complications, but harboring resentment for two years without some kind of solution or some kind of conversation, maybe that has. I mean, this question is very just like quick. To me, I don't know what else you can do. Now, you can either, I guess, leave or not.

Okay, let me ask you, what would you do if you caught me texting a man back and forth in a very flirty way? I think that, I mean, it's a very complicated question. I would address it right then and there. One, I would try to understand, like, is this a moment of weakness? Is this something more where there's like an emotional affair? It's emotional. I think an emotional affair is worse than a physical affair. That's my personal take. Because a physical affair, like, you can have a moment where like,

I like something like lust hit me. But an emotional affair means like you are not, like you are seeking something from emotional mind standpoint outside of the relationship that you're not currently getting that you, that you're craving. Like everyone has sexual cravings and you can have a slip up, especially like in different environments. And like I could probably work through that. Like what happened?

Like, okay, kiss somebody. fuck somebody, whatever. You could be like that. So you're saying I can go fuck somebody. No, I'm not. Lauren, you just got a hot tonight. I wouldn't be pumped on it. But I think emotional cheating.

I'm too tired. I think intentionally carrying another relationship from an emotional standpoint is a worse betrayal. That's the way I feel about it. Probably other people don't feel about it. Like some people think physical is worse. I think emotional is more intimate. I think whenever a problem is presented to me in my life

in this situation being a possibility, the first thing I always ask myself is like, what the fuck did I do that may have influenced this outcome? What have I done to influence this outcome? And that's not to like shift the blame to myself. It's more to say, what could I have done to maybe eliminate this outcome?

And if at the end of the day, there is nothing that this girl or woman could have done to change the outcome, then she can accept that the problem isn't her, it's him. And when the problem is him, it's up to him to change. And if he hasn't changed, which is presumably why there's still resentment or anger, because she hasn't seen the change she wants to see,

then at the end of the day, you know, like shit or get off the pot, you're not getting whatever you thought you were going to get. You're not just harboring resentment. You're seeing, presumably you're still with this person. You see them every day. And whatever they're doing now hasn't allowed you to move past it. Either you still don't believe the full story that you got, you still think they're doing it or whatever it is.

And at the end of the day, you have to, for your own life, and if you have children, especially, if you're carrying that shit around with you all day, yeah, it is better to just get it, get out of it. I mean, if you're, I don't know, I mean, there's so many, like you're saying, varying degrees of, like, cheating, whether it's emotional cheating, whether it's like, oh, I just met this girl. Like, how the fuck does that even happen? Like, in my mind, like, at the end of the day, I don't want to fucking talk to anybody other than my wife. And when it's not my wife, it's no one.

Like, I, like, I'm sorry. Like, I, I told him to say that. I trained him. Two relationships? Get the fuck out of here, dude. Cheating? Yeah, I'm cheating in the closet by myself hiding from you guys.

With my hand. Literally, I'm like, all right, I'm just... I'm cheating on you with red two. My naps are cheating. Like, I'm just going to take a fucking nice nap in the other room. Leave me alone for 15 minutes. The idea of having a side chick.

Your long showers? You're long showers? Who knows what you're doing in there? Dude, like a side chick. Do you fucking kidding me? I can barely manage the text that I get from Jordan, let alone another woman. Keep them on their toes.

ladies. This is what I'm saying. Torturing himself, this guy. I've been able in my life to have meaningless sex where I had no physical or no emotional connection whatsoever. I hate to say it, but it's true. They might as well care as much about the person as this glass of water. I know it's fucked up, but it's true. When I was drunk and running around and being young and dumb, like it was meaningless sex. It was physical. Young people do it, right? It just happens. But I've never been able to carry a relationship, an emotional relationship with a, with a connection where you're with a mind without having, without caring, right? So that's why, why what I was trying to say earlier, like, the physical stuff doesn't bother me as much because

like it's kind of like you do the acts like good game goodbye, like handshake and leave. But like if it's an emotional thing, that means like you're like there's something that is it's more intimate in a way to me. Let's even go deeper though. Why do people cheat? So here's one thing. Because they're insecure. Yeah. But from my, well, yes and no. When I was growing up, my dad was very clear about this. He said, get your demons out before you get married. He was like, he literally said, he's like, don't get a girl pregnant, but get your demons out. Like, go have as much sex as you can before you get married because you don't want to be that guy that marries the first girl he's with and then is always looking over his shoulder to see

where's the next chick. The second lesson I learned in life was show me a hot chick and I'll show you a doo-doos sick of fucking her. And, and the reason is, because going to what Michael said, is that if your connection isn't beyond physicality, if you guys, like, why? Why? Is he texting another woman? Is it because he didn't have fun when he was younger like Michael was talking about? Or is it because your relationship sucks and you're just not willing to admit that. So you're holding on to the idea of your relationship. You're in love with an idea of this person, but he's actually a piece of shit.

So maybe realize who you're with. Fuck that guy and go find love. That's kind of what I'm saying. I'm saying instead of talking about the act and if you did this and if you did that, what is his character? what is his vibe that he's cheating on you? Why is he cheating? Let's get to the root of the issue here.

Instead of just chopping the branch down, what is the root? And the root to me sounds like there's an insecurity going on. There's something more to this picture that maybe it's worth leaving the relationship because this is in the roots. This is in the ground. This splits the audience every time. I would say 50, 50, 60, 40. And it splits them in the, you have people that are like, fuck yeah, rah, raw. Like, this is exactly the advice.

Like, leave them if they're not treating you right. But then unfortunately. and this is just the truth of the matter. A lot of people are in bad relationships and a lot of people when they get pot committed into a relationship, they know deep down it's not the right one,

but they don't want to face that hard truth. And so they make excuses and they stick around and they call and they do carve outs. And this hits a nerve because when you're saying these kind of blunt things and they know it's the truth and they don't want to face it, it's like kill the messenger type of vibes. Fine, fine.

But at the end of the day, if that's what it is, your pot committed, then accept the fact that you're choosing to be in a shitty relationship and shut the fuck up. My vibration. Enjoy the misery. This is what you chose.

You're choosing to be there. My vibration in life is do not settle in any area of my life. And I don't care if that offends anyone. This is my vibration. And I want to show my daughter, do not settle. And if that meant that I did not have my husband here now, then I would be single. Because I don't want to settle for anything better. I want the best.

I'm sorry. And so I think when you have that standard and you go into it like that, this sounds like the person that you're with is maybe needs to go do some work separately on himself. Well, and let's, let's validate it. No one deserves to be betrayed like that. You were betrayed. You are, I am validating what you feel, but what you do is your decision. It's not, you can't, you can't be like, oh, he was texting another girl. So now it's up to him to fix the problem. No, it's your fucking problem to fix. You either need to fix whatever it is that you, you're in, like, I'm in a shitty relationship, so I need to get out of it. Or you need to make very clear

expectations and then hold them hold that person to account like we have guidelines we should have guidelines and rules in our lives guidelines are the things that the strategies are the things that we're trying to do the rules are where you draw the line if if in your mind draw you drew the line that you can't text another woman then what the fuck are you doing the game's over you drew that line but if you're going to be like no it's a guideline he kind of shouldn't text other women and it's like well you've created that space for that to happen i'm also going to give a hot tip here this is just a little nudge nudge girl girl if you caught him texting a girl a girl another girl having an emotional affair.

There's probably more. With there's smoke, there's fire. Yeah. And let me tell you that. If you see him doing something like that, there's something else you're not seeing. 100%. 100%. And I think, like I said, in the beginning, if there's no trust and you're sitting there still

harboring this, the relationship probably has many other holes outside of just he texted another woman. And we don't know because we don't know the exact situation. But I'm assuming that the relationship has many. other issues and that both of you probably aren't happy if that's happening. People get past this, though. There are people who have gone through affairs and their relationship survive. So it's not, I don't want to say that it's not possible, but if it doesn't sound like it's whatever you're trying to do is working. Well, no, and I think if you are still harboring the anger, then I don't know if

that is you. I don't know if you are the couple that can get over this because it's two years later and you're still upset. It's like what I said, listen, and I'm not putting this out there, but like I can see how like okay if I put less importance on the on the topic of I'm just going to say use sex if I put less importance on that and then Lauren was in had some infidelity and had meaningless sex for some reason like it would be easier for me to work through that than if she'd having an emotional affair and it would be and I would be more inclined to work through that with everything we've built everything we've been through with children so I think like to your point but at the same time if like you haven't been if you haven't if you haven't

if you don't have a lot of reason to keep hanging out outside of like you have this idea. Like there's a lot. There's a lot at stake is what I'm saying for her and I at this point. There's kids. There's businesses. This is like, listen, don't,

I'm not giving you a homeless. But my point is I can see why people would work with it. But what I would hate to do is like, okay, it's fine and then not say anything for two years and then be pissed off. Like I didn't solve it. Well, it's a new relationship at that point.

Yes. It's not, you're not going back. I think ending this on the note too that listen to your intuition. Like, we're so like trained lately to listen to like, what other people tell us and what the news tells us and the media and this and that what does your intuition tell you sit and be introspective and really think about that Jordan and Nico that was

so much fun to give advice we have so many more questions we literally got hundreds of questions so you guys will have to come back on this is like a vintage episode you know we'll have to do like it started as the him ask him and her show remember that back in the day we had the hashtag ask him and her and I was the one reading the reader questions we don't do this we don't do a lot of these kind of things anymore. It's mostly just talking to people. This is for someone's great. We'll have to do it again. Definitely you guys will do like another Instagram story and another podcast like this next time they're in town. Where can everyone find you guys if you guys, I just want to say like before we go, Jordan's SEO business has

changed the skinny confidential. We've used her SEO services for Pinterest for my blog. And also one more thing I feel like. Pinterest in my blog. No, Pinterest in your blog. interest in my blog. And her services are absolutely amazing. If you're an influencer, you need SEO. It's so important. It's such an important part of the business. And then Nico is an incredible lawyer. He has helped so many people in my family. He's helped me. Save my ass multiple times. Yes. If you guys are looking for a lawyer, obviously you can tell he's very articulate, well spoken. Definitely check him out. Where can everyone contact you guys if they want to reach out? I mean, you can find me on Instagram. Nico Bacera ESQ is my handle. You can also go to plastichuman.com. That's my fun hobby, side gig blog thing that I do where I just throw up ideas and some random content up there. But other than that, I mean, it's easy to find me. And I'd love working with entrepreneurs and working with people.

And I just like networking and connecting. So reach out, definitely. You can find me at Jordan T. Becerra on Instagram. That's my personal Instagram. And then on Influencer SEO's Instagram, which is just Influencer SEO. Thanks for coming on. You guys can come back anytime and give advice to shoot the shit. Yeah, thanks for having us.

This is actually really cool, I guess, for what it's worth to see the evolution of what this podcast has become and then just the evolution of everything else. I mean, it's awesome to see it and be a part of it and be able to play with you guys here and have fun with you. So thank you. Thanks for having us. Love you both. Thank you for coming on.

Love you. Love you. Love you. We are giving away the hot minute planner. It's available at shopskinyconfidential.com. It's the cutest planner on the market. but most importantly, it keeps you accountable. All you have to do is tell us your favorite part of this episode with Jordan and Nico

on my latest post. And make sure you're following at TSC Podcast on Instagram.