The Bossticks - Mark McGrath AKA Sugar Ray On Long Term Life Strategy, Personal Energy, Fame, The 90's & Celebrity Apprentice

Episode Date: May 8, 2023

#568: Today we're welcoming 90's icon Mark McGrath to the show. Beginning his career as the lead singer of hit band Sugar Ray, Mark has co-hosted EXTRA from 2004 until 2008 and hosted cultural staples such as The Victoria's Secret Fashion Show, NBC's Radio Music Awards, MTV's Rock N' Jock, and so many more. Plus, he starred in the first American season of Celebrity Big Brother, coming in 3rd for the season. Today we sat down with Mark McGrath to talk about all things 90's nostalgia, the rock and roll lifestyle, and how he made his marriage work in the world of fame & fortune and after infidelity. He also gets into how fame & work evolves as you get older, how the industry sometimes requires you to "sell your soul", & how he personally navigated life in the spotlight. He also gets into the details of how human interaction has been slowing in the last 2 decades, how personal branding has helped him remain relevant, and how to stay grounded in the music industry. To connect with Mark McGrath click HERE To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE Subscribe to our YouTube channel HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential This episode is brought to you by Vroom You can buy a car from Vroom entirely online. So, next time you need to buy a car, just grab your phone, go to Vroom.com, and check out thousands of cars. This episode is brought to you by Sakara Sakara delivers science-backed, plant-rich nutrition programs and wellness essentials right to your door. Their ready-to-eat meals are nutritionally designed to deliver results—from weight management and eased bloat to boosted energy and clearer skin. Go to Sakara.com/skinny or enter code SKINNY at checkout to receive 20% off your first order. This episode is brought to you by Just Thrive These days, stress seems to hit us from every possible angle in any environment at any time, day after day. Enter Just Calm - the breakthrough new stress and mood support formula from Just Thrive.  Go to justthrivehealth.com and use code SKINNY90 at checkout to save 20% on a bottle of Just Calm + Just Thrive Probiotic. This episode is brought to you by Wella Wella Professionals just released its most luxurious hair care line; Ultimate Repair. You can purchase The Ultimate Repair Miracle Hair Rescue at Ulta stores, or go to wella.com to learn more. This episode is brought to you by The Farmer's Dog It's never been easier to invest in your dog's health with fresh food. Get 50% off your first box & free shipping by going to thefarmersdog.com/skinny Produced by Dear Media

The following podcast is a dear media production. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire. Fantastic. And he's a serial entrepreneur. A very smart cookie. And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you alone for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her.

I would love to be a gigantic superstar playing stadiums around the world. How fun flying private is? I would say I would have adjusted to that. it's easy to go, yeah, I'm really happy I didn't become a gigantic superstar. Like, no, that was the goal and I had a little taste of it. It was fun. Does it claw it my soul every day? No, it doesn't. You know, because it was fun and it was great. I get enough wonderful things, like the Jampton Beach Boys or so I do these really killer things that are above my pay grade and skill set for sure. So I still get a little taste like to buy private every now and

it's fun. I'm not going to say I wouldn't have wanted that. It's just an interesting set of circumstances that's been bestowed upon me. Here we go, everybody. Welcome back to the Skinny Confidential him and her show. Today we have none other than Sugar Ray himself, Mark McGrath in the studio. I got to say, this is one of my favorite episodes that we've ever done. We have a 90s icon. Wait, scratch that. Not just a 90s icon, an absolute icon in the studio. And we cover so much ground. This was one of the most naturally flowing conversations that we've had in a long time. Mark is so down to earth, so humble, has had such a fascinating career. If you're a millennial,

like Lauren and I, not to age ourselves too much. You probably grew up on Sugar Ray's music. I mean, this was the soundtrack in middle school and high school. People don't realize how big of a role Sugar Ray played back in those 2000s, 90s days. I mean, this was the soundtrack. This was the summer jam. Mark does not fail to deliver on this episode. Like I said, one of the most down-to-earth, humble, exciting people we've had to talk. He's covered so much in his career. He's done so much. And he's just still so fucking cool and humble and just fun to talk to. With that, Mr. Sugar-Rae himself, Mark McGrath, welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her show. This is the skinny confidential, him and her.

The Gary Busey season was nuts. I do remember that. It was arguably, and it's gone down as like the most dramatic and top 10 reality moments ever, when Gary Bucie and Meatloaf gotten this like extreme anger shouting match that almost went to blows. I mean, you've got Meatloaf, a 100 million selling artist, Gary Busey. Academy Award nominee actor, acting like two-year-olds going, where's my paint? And I was in the middle. If you look at some of the video, I'm in the middle trying to block Meatloaf, who's a big dude who played like nose tackle

on his football team. And Gary Busey's not small either. And they were just in the middle of this, arguing over paint. I'm like, oh, my God, I'm in the middle of this. And my whole thing going on there was like, I'm not getting involved in the drama. I'm going to lay in the cut, just out of be the nice guy. And here I am, trying to referee between these two maniacs. But it was an incredible time. I'm glad I did it. But it wasn't easy. Like a Celebrity Apprentice is hard because you're begging your friends for money and you can't tell them why and they can't get a, it's not a tax reduction either. That's tough to do. Because they, because they like, it's like a charity aspect, right? It's complete charity aspect, but they can't know because it's the

surprise of a TV show. It's like, dude, give me 10 grand. I can't tell you why. And, you know, it'll be fun. You know, it'll be good for your brand. And like, that was tough to do because I'm, it's hard for me to beg people for money. But anyway, getting back to Gary, Gary, I love Gary. But after you do the point break dialogue, hey, Utah. Give me two. You know, after you do all that stuff, then he wears you about because he's like a little kid, which is ironic because I had twins at home. So he really prepared me for how to like take care of my two year, my two month old twins at the time, right? I've only ever seen Gary Bucie one time. That's enough.

I love you, Gary. Yeah. In person at Dantanis. I've never seen someone attack a plate of spaghetti and meatballs like Gary Bucie did in my life. Like it was incredible. He demolished this thing. Like, I don't even know how to. explain it. That's my only interaction with Gary Busey. That's like literally where the story ends. It's a familiar interaction because Gary will tear into some food. He's gnarly. And he like has no problem with like, he has, he kind of lost his social graces as he got older. And he'll just blow his like snod out under the ground. He'll, uh, he'll like, I need a Coca-Cola with ice right now. Like, why we're filming. I'm like, dude, we're, you know what I mean? So he just lost some of his

social graces a little bit. I love the guy. I don't get me wrong. I don't want to like gang up on him. But if you see Gary digging into a plate of like lasagna, it's not going to be Pretty. What was Gary Bucy in? I can't remember. Oh, my God. The Buddy Holly story is what he's really known for. That's where he got an Academy Award nomination.

Now that's pretty severe. And to like, to like, you know, portray someone such an icon like Buddy Holly or with James Brown or something like that, that can like really be on the precipice of parody. He did an amazing job. He deserved his Academy Award nomination. Later in life, he was in Point Break. Iconic. Yes, yes.

Iconic point break. It's been in a bunch of movies, really. So who else was on a Celebrity Apprentice B. you, Gary, and Meatlo. It was Nini from her Real Housewives Atlanta. She was a lot of fun. She was a hoot. Latoya Jackson.

Okay. John Rich, who ended up winning the whole thing, the country artist. We had Jose Canseco, David Cassidy. No am I missing. Lisa Rina was on it that year as well. So a lot of people who knew how to make good TV. That is so much energy of people. All of you guys have so much energy in different ways.

Yeah, we're all spazas. I feel like I need to go. I watched it, but I feel like I need to go back and watch it again. It's kind of weird. A lot of treachery involved in that game. A lot of backstabbing and then have Donald Trump being sort of the overlord of it all. That was a trip, too. I once, I tell people, this.

I spent eight hours in a room with three people once. It was me, Gary Busey, and Donald Trump. And four years later, one of us was president. And that's just scary thing right there. Disgust as you must. Was he nice? He was a gentleman to me. I'd love to say, in retrospect, he was this, he was that.

He was super cool. After I was fired, spoiler alert, he had me come to his office and he goes, anytime you need a recommendation or anything, I'm here for you. So he was a gentleman to me. People have had different experiences, you know, that's all I can say about it. Okay. Speaking of iconic, I got to say, dude, we've had some weird moments on this show. But when Dr. Gadir reached out and said, hey, you got my friend Mark and he wants to come on the show. And I was like, who's your friend Mark? He's like, Mark McGrath. I was like, Sugar Ray? I was like, Dr. Gere, what are you talking about? And then he put us on text.

And I wasn't yanking your chain. Like, Lauren and I grew up. listening to your music and so it was one of the the trippier moments of my life especially when you said that you guys have heard the show I mean you do this in this small room like this and you kind of it feels sometimes like it's just all of us in here and you know we just don't we don't get a lot of that instant feedback you know you go and play you see all the people and you see all so like for us we kind of see it online but if you paid me a million dollars and said hey Mark McGrath is listening I would there's no way I would have guessed that

no way Michael no way That to me? He was man. He made the ears fly to my mouth, man. Oh, my God. He's texting his mom. I really. I mean, well, because I mean, listen, I think like, I'm me.

So I never think that's possible. You know, and like, but people do that. It's like real rock stars and real platinum artists. You know what I mean? I, by the grace of God, I become one to some people. And so it's hard to rectify that for people that I really admired growing up or songs that really moved me when I was growing up over a part of my life's landscape, you know? Those are my stars.

When people tell me that, I get real embarrassed and, like, And like reticent, if you, reticent, if you will, I shouldn't try to use big words. To like accept that because it's like it's so big. I really appreciate what I'm trying to say, Michael. No, no, no. But I mean, we were born in 87. Yeah. Right.

So like right around the time and we met when we were 12 too and we were kind of like dating as kids. And it's like your music was like it was there. It was prominent during that time. And like we also were kind of that last cuss generation in the MTV days. Yes. So like, you know, maybe for the younger people they kind of forget this. But like that was also super impactful.

And that's what we would see before, after school. All the music videos were huge. And in movies. It was in movies, so many movies. Yeah. I mean, iconic, man. Well, the thing about the 90s to, you guys, as people forget, is like, we all received entertainment the same way.

You know, there weren't podcasts. There wasn't social media. There wasn't internet. So we'd go home and watch TRL. What video was coming out. And we all experienced it in real time. And I believe the 90s was the last decade. We all did that.

Now, whether it was TV was Seinfeld at 9 o'clock on Thursday and NBC. You remember that? We all shared it. And then the next morning, or wherever you were, we talked about it at school, at the water cooler, or wherever. So it was last time we shared things collectively. And I think that's what's going to make the 90s forever so special. And having these moments that you two had, like growing up or maybe finding its other with a little bit of sugar A being the soundtrack to your lives. I mean, that is a special stuff as a songwriter.

There's no bigger compliment you give me. How did you even get into music? Like, take us back to when you were little. Have you always been inspired since you were really tiny? I've always loved music. My mom loved music. She had a bunch of, not I'm really gonna date myself,

she had a bunch of 45s. I don't know if you guys didn't know what those were. No, what's that? Forty-fives were the singles and set up a 33, a big LP, a record album. The tiny, the tiny record.

The smaller ones were called 45s. Okay. She had a million 45s of all the hits, and she would listen to them and drink her crevasia at night and just kind of groove. And so that was like my imagery of my mom. And I would listen to her 45s too,

and I always love music. I'm the biggest fan of music you'll ever know in your life. I'm the three-time rock and roll jeopardy champion for a reason, Lauren, okay? So I just love music. Never in a million years did I think I could be part of music, never in a professional capacity as well. I like to say there's goals you have. Like I want to be a doctor when I get over and like these are like realistic goals or there's dreams. You know when you're three years old, you have dreams. I want to be an astronaut, you know, like I've never gotten rid of those three-year-old dreams. I wanted to be an astronaut for about six months.

Then I want to be the point guard for the LA Lakers. I found out around eighth grade that probably wasn't going to happen. At the same time, David Lee Roth was dropping off a kick drum on MTV. I go, that looks fun, but here's a problem. I can't play an instrument. I can't write songs and I can't sing. Minor obstacles on my way to be having any success in the music business. So I just had this fantasy dream in the back of my head, which I think we all do. Whether you commit it to yourself or others or not, that's the key right there. In the back of my head, I just always wanted to be around music. There was a band in our high school called the Tories and Newport Beach, California. Shout out to Corona Morrow High School. And they were the cool sort of band

at school. They'd play all the parties. And I figured out by carrying their instruments, I could get into all the parties. And if that was the extent of my, you know, musical career, that would have been fine. I never really knew what I wanted to do until I got to college and I got into a band. I went to USC and major in communications. And that's very broad, you know, especially when I was going there. I looked around. I saw the football players and cheerleaders. And I go, oh, this is the degree for me. So I just love music, Lauren, to answer your question the most roundabout way. And I found myself just loving music, being gravitated to the easiest things about it, maybe carrying musicians equipment around, and slowly building and building until I got to my band. So was,

was I born with any sort of talent? No, you can argue, I still don't have any. But there was never going to be anything to stop me from at least trying to pursue my career in music, you know? And so when you say you didn't, I mean, obviously you went on to have a lot of success in music, when you say you didn't have any musical talent, like how did you develop that talent to obviously one day front of band? Two things happened. Nirvana happened.

Okay? In the early 90s, Nirvana just blew up the record industry sideways. Like a punk rock band out of Seattle all of a sudden becomes as big as Led Zeppelin. How did that happen? Well, the record labels didn't know, but they knew they had martial amps,

Les Paul guitars, a bass and a drum. And let's sign every band and not miss this again if it happens. So the phenomenon of Nirvana let every major label sign every band. If you could walk and talk and had a at Les Paul, you got signed. So we were caught up in that phenomenon. So Atlantic Records gave us the chance. Technology. In the mid-90s, there was a thing called Pro Tools that came along. Pro Tools helps

everybody sing. They can tweak your voice to keep you on key and show you where your voice is going to be. So it was a perfect storm of Nirvana happening, letting us get signed to Atlantic Records, and then Pro Tools happening in the tech world, which led us to David Kahn, who did what I got by Sublime, that little song you might have heard it. And we just had a song on deck called Fly and it felt similar to that. And thank God, David Con felt the same way. And he led me to water in terms of recording. He said one day, we're in there. And I'm jumping around you guys. It's what I do because I'm excited to be here. No, no, no, no. Keep jumping. We're using Pro Tools now too to record this. Well, there you know. See, I told you I was off key. He knows. So I'm about to record

fly. And I'm in the recording booth there. And David Con, who was producing the record, said to me, Mark, I got some good news and some bad news for you. And I go, okay, David, being the Irishman that I am, what's the bad news? He goes, the bad news is you can't sing. Now, I'm about to record fly. The only, you probably bought Florida. It's the anomaly on the record. It doesn't sound like anything else.

And I go, David, call me a pessimist, but what could possibly be the good thing? He goes, I've got this new thing called Pro Tools. It hasn't come out yet to let me kind of try it out an artist that I feel that might work on. And I'm going to show you where your voice is. Does that sound good? And I just got down on my knees and I said, Calgon, take me away, man. Show me the path. And what he did was he showed me where my voice was.

My voice is my speaking voice. It's got a little bit of grit, a little bit of tone. And thankfully, people responded the same way. And that little son there, he actually finished it up with this. He said, Mark, if you listen to me, I promise you will sell two million copies of this record. I go, I'm all yours, David. That's a big promise. We sold two million copies of four off that one song, fly it.

And he basically gave me the biggest gift to showing me where my voice was. And subsequently, Michael and Lauren, you know, because we got signed, we were traveling around the world. So you get better at your instruments. You get better at songwriting. And it was just a perfect storm with three things happening that led to our success. I also think, too, I remember your album art. I remember the way you looked. All the girls went crazy.

I mean, all the girls went crazy. But it was like, it was, I feel like you were like the whole package. It was the song. It was the art. It was you. You really did a good job of branding yourself. Was there a strategy there? Absolutely.

My good friend, Mick G., we've been best friends for 45 years. He said, you know, back in the early night... Hold on. Is Mick G? Mick Jigger? No, not Mick Jagger. Okay, I'm like, I'm like, is Mick J, Lois? Oh, Mick J. Sorry, sorry, sorry. I'm like, what?

That's something she would do. But he's a good friend of ours. He's kind of like the fifth member of Sugar A, if you will. I hate saying that, but I don't know how some, like, really, you know, articulate how important he was in success of Sugar A. He was the visual component. It's like, you guys kind of suck. Your music sucks, but there's a visual thing here.

Let's make a video. I'm kind of backtracking now. And this is how we got signed to Atlantic Records. So there was sort of a video component already within the team, if you will, of Sugar A. So that was completely thought out, Lauren, you know, looking at little like entities of how we put a video together with little vignettes as opposed to having one running thread, when we thought we just make a video of things that looked cool.

Hey, let's ice skate in hockey gear with no shirts on on the skating rink. let's go to the comedy store and mimic an Iggy Pop video. You know, let's, oh, let's break dance and all. Just stupid things we thought kind of looked cool. We were doing for more like a cool visual as opposed to our running thread. And then it's like, great, let's make a video. But we want to see what the storyboard is. We have $400,000 for you.

We're not just let you make cool things. Luckily, they let us just film cool things in that first video because the video we made to get assigned has sort of the aesthetic they wanted to see. You know, they liked it. And so that was built in already. The visual thing, you know, look, Father time is undefeated. It was a lot of fun. You know, I was skinny back then. I had a unparalleled self-confidence back then of myself, really that was driven by insecurities and fear. Let's be honest, like most of those are, any confidence level is. And we just, we had been a band

for a while, so our chemistry was in point. We kind of knew each other's roles. So a lot of things were in place, Lauren, maybe just subconsciously. But a lot of it was like, okay, we know where the Easter eggs are of this band. Another Easter egg was that you made bleached tips. The thing. That was you. Frosted Tip gang. All of a sudden. I never had him, but I had this, I had the spike.

I should have done him. You should have done him. Everybody did him then. Everyone did him, but you. I didn't think I knew. I couldn't figure out how to go get him. I don't think. You made it.

Was that strategic or was that just like your look? I feel that was a very like OC thing. That like started in the OC. Yeah, yeah. Because of him. Because we grew up in San Diego, so not far off. San Diego. I mean, we cut our teeth from San Diego all the way up to Malibu in terms of playing on

every beach bar up and down there. So the aesthetic, Michael, like, not that I started anything, but there was my osmosis part of it, you know. I had a friend who was going to be beauty school at the time. He had no business being in beauty school at the time. And I saw a picture of Scott Weiland playing at Madison Square. Legend from Stone Temple Pilots, a huge fan, rest of soul. And there was this great picture of him in Rolling Stone.

And he had a three-piece suit on. It was pinstrived. He was skinny and just, look, he looked like David Bowie. You know, like our generation's David Bowie. and he had a little skunk, like tip in his hair. It was all black and a little skunk tip. I told my friend the night before we're going to film the fly video, that's what I want.

So he walked in with a case of beer. I'm like, maybe that's not the best idea. From a guy in beauty school, about to dye my hair. We're about to make a video the next day. Long story short, he put all this, like bleach in my hair all over the place. I'm like, dude, I just wanted in the front. He goes, we've got to do this to get to the front. Don't right.

I know what I'm doing. He passes out. All the burn stuff is still on my hair. I don't know what I'm doing. I try to wash it out. I blister my hands. all that. It's a big nightmare. And it was just completely ruined. My hair was straw. I was sticking out all over. Half of it was gone. And there was giant orange spots all over. You can see it in the

fly video. That was a complete accident. And I thought everybody was going to be mad at me. I show up to the video and go, hey, your hair looks great. I'm like, oh, my God, such a mistake. It was a mistake. So you accidentally started a trend. Yes, absolutely. Anything good that's ever happened to me has been by serendipity and accident, Lauren. That's for sure. Nothing I ever did. That's crazy. Yeah. How did you? also that trend is also something like, you know, Hammerpants were probably pretty cool for a second. Yeah. And to be known for that forever is kind of funny.

I lean into it now. You know, for a second, I was trying to get away from the stink of the 90s as, you know, remember a hair metal in the 80s and when that kind of went out of vogue was like, oh, God, I can't believe ever did that. And we were part of that in the 90s. After that, when bands like Interpol and the strokes were coming in, it was like, oh, my God, I can't believe we ever did that. Listen to Sugar, right, and those bands.

So you got to wait like 10 to 15 years for the stink of a certain decade to go away. And now we're in it again. And I'm going back for the frosted tips. You're in it. Well, it's either Anderson Cooper Gray or Seacrest Frosted Tips. I like the Frosted Tips. You can guess which one my wife, my wife likes better. And you know what else? It's iconic.

It's nostalgic. But everything comes back into trend. It's like the new metal resurgence, which was right after that. Now New Metal Olives and is really popular again. You're so right, dude. All those bands are coming back. There's actually a new metal festival. So anything old and stinky comes back once again.

So if you're stuck with a, you know, a trend that if you lean into it, while you stick around 20 years, it comes back. Because I miss, like, we, I mean, so the moment I felt, I think the first, you know, I hear my parents listen to rock and roll and stuff. The first thing I heard was like Sabbath, bloody Sabbath. Nice. And it, like, it just changed my life and then, you know, get into all of that metal. But then I think in the 90s, you know, Nirvana, you all these people that came along.

Like, I think after the 90s, we like, we don't get as much of that anymore. And I miss those times when you actually went and you went to a show and you watched a band. And it's great. like, listen, there's an amazing artist out there now, but there was a weird period of time where it, like, kind of left, and now I feel like it's coming back a little bit. I think you're right, you know?

I think a lot of had to do with the internet, you know, like scenes left. You remember San Diego was a scene for a little bit with cargo records and rocket from the crypt, Drive like Jayhu and all these great bands from down there. They had a scene. Seattle had a scene, of course. New York had a scene in the early 2000s

with Interpol, the Strokes, all these cool, the yeah, yeah, yeah, is really cool, hip scene. But then everything went to the internet. You know, so the internet is your scene now. Where do you want to find it? You find it there. But it's nice to see people getting a little bit of retro fever, if you will,

and starting their little, whatever it is, might be on your block, but it's cool for people to have their own vibes. And, you know, rock and roll is still out there. You just got to go find it now. I remember sitting in the 90s, and this is before, you know, you had DVRs and, like, you would sit there and you would watch TRL, and you'd wait for songs to come on and you'd see, like, what the top 10 were. And that was how you kind of got your music.

And I remember, you know, like getting the CD players, one of the ones that wouldn't skip. And if you had one of those, you were you were a boss totally totally and so like i i just think my appreciation for that stuff is is different and it's obviously not this current generation's fault it's just we kind of had to wait you need to wait on the radio or t rl to like hear one of your hits we didn't we couldn't go and just like download it any second like it wasn't available at all the time you that the cd or you hear it that's how you discovered music too is like something would pop up on cheerale and like holy shit

who's that band totally totally and there's a little bit self-discovery and yet it work a little bit what was that let me go check it out i mean i remember growing up in the 80s here in southern California. I like these shoes called creepers. You ever heard of them creepers? They have a big thick soul. Rihanna, like, reintroduced Fenty Puma creepers, and they have the big, thick kind of crepe soul. Rockabilly guys wear them, punk rockers wear their suede. They're like blue suede. Anyway, there were these really cool shoes, and you only could get them in England or a place called Let It Rock and Melrose. And Let It Rock didn't have mine. And I signed, like, a coupon and sent it in the mail with a certified check to London to get these cool shoes.

They came back six months later. I bought a pair of these same she was about a year ago online, they came to my door three days later from London. I just think, like, you know how to be cool now. If you want to, the aesthetic, if you want to look a certain way, if you, if Apple calls you, what's your playlist? You know how to curate a playlist. You might not even listen to, but you might think that others think it's cool. So I think there's one kind of aesthetic now that we all subscribe to that we think is cool.

And that's fine. That's fine. But it's interesting. There's not as much self-discovery as there used to be when I was growing up. It's not better. It's not worse. It's just interesting. Yeah.

And you couldn't, I mean, you couldn't find. all the same stuff that everybody else could find, right? You're going to have to develop your own thing. When you're performing now, is it so different than when you used to perform because of the cell phone? Do you just look out and it's all cell phones? You know, there is a lot more cell phones, of course, you know, and I understand that.

I'm grateful for everybody that comes there. I'm absolutely honored that I still get to perform music for a living. I mean, I never thought that 25 years ago when we started. Even when we had a couple of hits, I'm like, well, this is going to go away and I'm really enjoying this and bummer. People can do whatever they want. Once they buy that ticket and come on the show, do your thing, have some fun. I think also, though, that people that are fans with Sugar Air, a little older generation.

So you see people more, you know, digging the moment as maybe the younger generation when I see, like, say, Coachella last weekend. All I saw was a million phones in the air. You know, I go, that's the how they get down. That's how they do it, you know. So I don't see as much as you would see, obviously, like at Post Malone show or something, but there's certainly enough out there. And I say, knock yourself out, you know? How did you manage to stay so grounded and not get into drugs and alcohol like so many. of the rock stars do?

Who said it in getting drugs and alcohol? Who said they had fun, aren't? I know you had fun, but I had a good time. I think I had a good time. Listen, I joined a band to have fun. I was raised in Newport Beach, California. You know what I mean? We got in to go, come on, let's party!

It's my noble rights. Give me my wares. So you did get into it. I did. I made mistakes. I became a moron a couple times. And, you know, there was a precipice of like, which way do you want to go here?

I always had great friends and great family. And my wife now has been with her for years, has put up with all my bullshit forever. I've always had people bringing me back. And also, our success happened to me a little later. I was 27 when fly hit. You know, so it wasn't like, if I was 21, it would not be speaking to you to right now.

So I'd seen a bunch of my friends go up the hill, you know, and some hip hop acts and buy a house, and they were down two years later. So I knew the fragility of being in the music business. So that always kept me on point. But I certainly made my mistakes. rock and roll and the music business gives you a long leash to hang yourself. And I was like a junkyard dog on the end of that leash, like frothing.

But somehow it would always just come back in time. So it's a constant battle, Lauren, you know, and I show up to work. And there's two cases of beer, three bottles of Jameson, a couple of things of vodka. And they're like, come on, drink up. And everybody wants to party. So what you need to do when you get in a band or you have success in music is you need to find out how you do the road. Because the road does you.

You don't go there and go, I'll show you. a party. I've seen people that come out of the gate. Just the road just will nullify that. And the end of the day, you figure out it's a business, if you're lucky enough to make it a business. So that's what really separates people and like, you know, are you going to do this for a living or not? How you can handle the road? It's lonely out there. I know I'm jumping around a lot. What's the hardest part about going on the road? Because I don't think people realize how much work and energy that takes. But obviously, we don't. We've never experienced. But I can only-

travel enough. Yeah, but even this show kind of sometimes we bounce from here to Texas. New York, it kind of gets a little exhausting, but we're not in front of all these people screaming and singing and playing instruments and getting on a bus and our plane every single different city. It's a lot of energy. It's a lot. The performing is the easy part. I always say it's a cheesy old showbiz adage that I'll use. They pay me to travel, not to perform. The 90 minutes on stage, that's free to get me from L.A. to Manchester, Iowa, to fly there, to get on a plane, to fly at another one, to get out on a bus, to take three hours. You're going to pay me for that, especially being away from my family. And I've done it differently as I've gone through

stages of my life. You know, when I started in my early 20s, well, mid-20s, I should say, it was like, let's go. I don't even care. Let's get on the road. That's the best part about it. I didn't have any real tentacles, you know, keeping me at home. I was chasing my dream still. The dream was to have some success in the music business. So it was all about chasing that dream. Once we had a little success, money comes into play, you hopefully buy a house, you do whatever you do, you start having things that kind of have tentacles to keep you at home. So then that push and pull comes between me, like, wanted to stay at home. If you have a girlfriend, if you have a wife, you have kids. And as I've gotten older, I had kids when I was

42. So that's a real thing that, you know, to keep me away from them, miss basketball games, miss birthdays, you are going to pay me for that for sure. Again, I'll perform for free. So it's been a, it's been a Lauren, it's been kind of an evolving way of checking myself and learning how to do the road after I'm getting older. I'm finally in a really comfortable spot. Travel a lot. It's what I do, and I'm grateful for it. But I finally learned this is what I do, and this is how I do it. And I can expect a certain amount of income each year, give or take. You know, there's a margin of error, but I know I'm going to be making. And the last, That really just happened in the last five years.

When you're raising kids, that's scary. You can go from making, say, X amount of dollars to one year and then an exponentially large amount the next year. That's kind of scary how to plan going forward. It was all learning curve. I'm very comfortable where I'm at now. How did you meet your wife? This is funny.

We met at the Viper Room. One of the most unlikely stories to have any. That's a cool place to meet. It was, but it's very unlikely for, let's say, a relationship that has any legs, if you will. She was the only one with legs. Hey, oh, dad, you're not. So I was sitting there like my way to that I don't know about you Michael you might have the same game

but you guys didn't be in the way your thing I would play at the wall at a club I thought I was so cool you're gonna come talk to me so I sat there once at the viper room and I had a botch of cranberry in my hand I'll never forget it and I was leaning up against this post you know and I was sitting there doing my best Luke Perry you know it's 94 I'm gonna do my Beverly Hills 1-902-0 reference so I'm sitting there doing this thing like eyebrow and looking around doing my thing And then I guess I was there a while because a couple hours later, I guess, she came up to me, Karen came out to me and goes, are you going to hold that post up all night? And I went, oh, inside. I go, you got me. And my first thing I said to her was, I love you. The first thing I said was, I love at first side.

I just, she had this energy about her. And I go, where are you going, blah, blah, blah. She was, well, after this, I'm going to Domiano's. It was an old all night pizza spot in Fairfax. What's it called now, honey? John and Vinnie's. Oh, it's John and Vinnis. Yeah, John of Viz.

It was called Domiano's back in the day. And she goes, I'm going there after the club closes meet me there. I'm like, oh, my God, of course. My heart's going to boom, boom, poops, girl. So I go to Domiano's 2 in the morning. My friends drop me off. They don't want any part of it. I go back there.

I don't see her in the main room. Like, oh, she bells on me, man, bummer. And I looked on the side room. I go in there. And there she is by herself with like a gigantic meatball sub and a gigantic large pepperoni pizza. And I go, where are your friends? She goes, I'm by myself.

I go, oh, now I really love you. This girl, like, she just was a rail, eating a meatball sandwich and a pizza. And now I really love you. And that was it. And, you know, you've been together ever since. And it's been rocky and gnarly. And we did everything wrong in the first 10 years. Tons of infidelities, really hurt each other.

Stuff were still rectifying two days. We sit and speak. And it rears its ugly head every now and then. Someone's had too much of the room. You know, but I just thought, I did a show called Extra in 2004. Oh, yeah. Entertainment news show. Love it.

The stars are out in Hollywood. last night. Let's take a look. I love extra. I was really happy to be there. But when I started doing that, my day started being like, I had a day job, like a nine to five job, had a commute. I just came off the tour of us. I'm like, what is happening here? And I looked over one day and Karin was still there. I go, you still here? She was like, yeah, are you still here? I go, do you want to get it's a real shot? It's like in 2004, 2005, we said, let's really commit to this. Let's stop like half-assing this relationship. I think it deserves a lot because, you know, The friendship was so important, you know.

I've always loved her forever, forever, but the friendship was like something that, that takes you the distance. That gets you in that rocking chair when you're 72 and you're holding a hand. You know what I mean? That gets you looking at that sunset. So luckily we both invested in that,

but I think Extra was the one that really let me settle down and get off the road and really give it a chance, you know? How do you recover from infidelity? Well, that's very subjective, okay, because a lot of people, and probably you two, and wouldn't have gone through or wouldn't have accepted what we accepted from each other.

And I'll tell you one thing, it's easy to look like I was the big, bad wolf in that. Now, she was doing her thing. You know, she's no wallflower. She's no shrinking violet. You know, she's out there, you know, she's had her own bodies in the back of her way. Believe me.

And I say that with love and affection. But that's the only reason why I could never, like, was never, you know, it was never do as I say, not as I do type of situation. So I think we both hurt each other, but we've also been responsible in building each other back up through helping each other. Though it was hell getting to where we are, I wouldn't want to be with anybody else at this point. You know what I mean? We kind of got all that out of the way. If you're in the market for a new car, you have to check out one of our favorite new partners, one of our favorite platforms, and that is Room.

With Room, you can shop thousands of cars right from your phone and have your next ride delivered straight to you. I love all of these industry, groundbreaking, disruptive companies that are creating better technology with more choices for consumers, and Vroom is definitely doing that. Broom is just the better way to buy your next car. No more haggling or negotiating the price of a car so you know you're getting a great deal. There are thousands of cars available on Broom.com so you can make sure that you get the ride that you really want.

Another great feature about shopping for a car with Broom is that you have a full week or 250 miles, whichever comes first to make sure your new ride is right for you. This is an amazing feature that protects you as a consumer and make sure you get exactly what you want. Broom cars also come with a 90-day limited warranty and a one year of roadside's assistance nationwide to give you that piece of mind on the road. If you have an old car, you can also trade that car in when you buy your new car,

or you can even just sell it to Broom right off the bat. It's an amazing service as they give you your price instantly and will even come pick up your old car. No more meeting up with strangers and haggling over the price with somebody you don't know. Vroom is just a better way to buy your car. So if you're a car lover and you're looking for something new and unique, just visit Broom.com. You can buy a car from Broom entirely online. So next time you need to buy a car, just grab your phone.

Go to Vroom.com and check out thousands of cars. Again, that's broom.com. You can buy a car from Vroom entirely online. So next time you need to buy a car, just grab your phone. Go to Vroom.com and check out thousands of cars. Again, that's broom.com. Sokara, are you looking for ready to eat delivered to your door? Meals.

They're ready to go and they're actually healthy for you. So every single meal that delivers to your door from Sakara is all of you. about clearer skin, boosted energy, a healthy gut, and they even hone in on weight management. So a lot of us are busy. We're on the go. We want something fresh to our door that we can seamlessly integrate into our day, and that is Sakara. Think plant-rich meals to help you look and feel your best. They also have like a little wellness section. I'm obsessed with their wellness essentials. And then the beauty water drops are minerals. And I put them in my water every single day. Sikara delivers science back, plant-rich nutrition programs, and wellness essentials

right to your door. They're ready to eat meals are nutritionally designed to deliver results from weight management and eased bloat to boosted energy and clearer skin. It's literally like having a nutritionist and a chef in one. Everything is designed to support your goals. Right now, Sakara is offering our listeners a 20% off your first order when they go to sakara.com slash Skinny or intercode skinny at checkout. That's Sakara, S-K-A-R-A-R-A-com.com slash skinny, and you get 20% off your first order. Sikara.com slash skinny. Right now, Sikara is offering our listeners a 20% off your first order when they go to Sakara.com slash skinny or intercode skinny at checkout.

That's Sakara, S-K-A-R-A dot com slash skinny, and you get 20% off your first order. Sakara.com slash skinny. When you're a rock star and your inner relationship, is it difficult with like women throwing themselves at you for the wrong reasons? No. Why? I mean, when you're married. It's a funny thing that she was expecting you to say something completely different.

That's amazing. She knows he well. That's like a joke about it. Look, look. I was a moron. I was immature. I'm still all those things. But I was really those things back then.

And, you know, we almost had understanding. Like, we're out of town, out of side, out of my, you know, just it was a terrible thing. We never really verbalized what this thing was. that we have. I met her three weeks after I signed her record deal with Atlantic Records and moved up to Los Angeles. It was not looking for a wife. Never mind a girlfriend, you know, but we just, there was something about our relationship just kept holding us together. So yeah, I made a lot of mistakes, but like she was doing her wrong thing too. Again, I cannot stress this enough because I know it's easy to go, you were the big rock star. She was in LA, model, go run around doing her thing. So it's not recommended. There's no

way to, like, infidelity's cheating. It's the most hurtful thing ever. You never get it out of your soul. or your heart. It's always there. And it rears its ugly head every now and then. If you learn how to deal with, you can push it back down. If you haven't, it's going to stay there a while. So you're saying that you're dealing with things from years and years and years and years ago still. So it still comes up even though it's not a thing anymore. Absolutely. Though I won't even verbalize it sometimes. She won't even know it. You know what I mean? It's my own like, you know, trials and tribulations. It's my own demons, if you will, you know. Sometimes I haven't articulated to her how bad she's hurt me and probably the same way, you know? You know,

Well, I think that doesn't just apply to things that happen in relationships. I think we're constantly as humans going through and having demons from our past rear its head, right? Like that happens, I think, with everything, right? Yeah, for sure. And we're probably not the best species at verbalizing those kind of things, right? Because people don't like to show their vulnerabilities. You're totally right, Michael. Like, my parents got divorced when I was 12.

It hurt me, like, more than I've ever been, like, even rectified in my soul. The 12 is that. My kids are 12 now, is what's why I'm saying. So, like, I'm like, wow. And like sometimes we fight and stuff. And so then I'm like, oh my God, I got divorced at 12. I'm manifesting the own behavior in my own experiences. So you just said, Michael, is bull's eye, dude.

You never forget. You never, you learn how to, it's almost like with the death or something. You learn how to live with, but you never forget. You know, these things that hurt you tremendously, I'm talking about in the deep recesses of your soul hurt, you know, that you learn to just live with or you don't learn to live with. Do you think don't ask, don't tell works in any scenario? Does it ever work?

It does work. I do. How does it work? It's also like I don't think, I think Lauren, it's a very subjective thing to say that. So if I say, don't ask, don't tell, I'm talking about, does it work for me? Yeah. Right. But what I say it works for you or anybody else listening?

Absolutely not. So it works, you feel like it works for you, but it doesn't work for everybody. I can see it not working from everybody. Exactly. Yeah. We had someone come on here that what that did don't ask, don't tell. to get, no, they did, they did ask, right? What are you talking about?

Aubrey Marcus came on with his significant other. I mean, if they've been on the show, oh yeah, well, they had a very, very open thing. Like it was very open. They knew that they were openly having other. Right, right. Well, I think we almost had that in the early. Like, you know, we didn't talk or tell or, you know, there was no like sharing. We never said, let's have an open relationship.

And I certainly not involved in that now. I do not want that. But, you know, I think it's kind of ironic, too, I say that because I put up with it. And like, if it happened now, what I put, what I don't know, I can't say. Well, I also think you can't change. I say this, Lord, it's not good. It's not good for the soul. It's not good for the family.

It's a treacherous path to walk down. So be prepared for all that that gives. And by the way, you might think you're cool for a year or two. Great. And something rears is ugly a hood. It never goes away. I think the difficulty is even say Lauren and I were into that and we're on the same exact page. Yeah.

That might work. But then you add any third, fourth party. Like they might, like, they may, like, they may, say they're cool, but they're going to mess it up for you, dude. Yeah, I don't think it's too hard. I mean, it's hard enough as you know in a marriage to manage one. Like I, you know, managing to another person, which is impossible. Yeah, imagine two of me. I do all, I do all the time. Come on. Come on. There be times I knew I was losing her because she'd like have another guy. Like, I go, are you busy? Yeah. I'm like, what you're, and so like I got to go like,

go get her again and just put on that Irish charm, if you will. I will say, though, I think that there is something kind of hot about a woman that's like kind of puts her foot down to a rock star in a way. I'm sure the reason that you were attracted to her is because she didn't let you walk all over her. Absolutely. Absolutely. That had probably had a big thing to do with it. If she was available for you all the time, I'm just, this is a hunch. No. I think you would have got bored.

You're so correct. I've always been attracted to independent women. Always been. That's the most attractive. So you want to know the most attractive quality in a female for me. Okay. And for others and friends of mine, independence, having your own thing, whatever that is and being passionate about anything.

I go feed people in downtown LA. I croquet. Whatever your passion is, be something that isn't me or that your significant other. You know, I don't want to specifically it to me. But like, that's why I was so attracted to her. She's like, you can't hurt me. I think you do to me. I'm a two to you, 10.

You know what he was like? And it was like, it was like gangster power hers. You know what I mean? I will say this, Lord. It's like this was behavior earlier. our relationship. And you guys, I've listened to this podcast enough, you know, you guys don't kid glove anything here. And if you get to know me in our relationship, that's, that's all part of it. It's a huge part of it. I'm happy to say we're out of that world now. Like,

I'm not saying, hey, you want to go pick up a chick tonight at the bar or do? I mean, that's not happening. That's, but by the way, that was never part of our get down. We were never swingers. That was never. I have another question for you in another lane. He just blew by the swingers name, Michael. We could, we can stay on. Please get a. Please get a. So, Taylor's available. If you start having success at 27, which to your point is like, I guess maybe later for some musicians. But you are also on this weird cusp of time where I feel like if you made it in that era, it was almost like from a fame standpoint, from a notoriety standpoint, from people actually like being aware of who you are standpoint. Does it, to me it felt like it was almost, it can become like an overnight thing where all of a sudden you have national.

and international presence if you get put on the right platform. And I wonder how you manage that being maybe lesser known to all of a sudden being on a national, international stage quickly. Because when I was talking about TRL earlier, MTV, like once people saw that, like everybody knew and everybody talked about it. But sometimes you didn't, like, if you didn't have that, you just were unknown. Right now, it's like what Lauren and I do, it's been a very slow, slow, gradual build. And so you kind of, you take it in little kind of spoonfuls.

Where with you, I feel like it's just like, boom, all of a sudden. had you guys asked the most insightful questions. You always do. I was listening to Barbara's podcast the other day. I had questions in my head coming up, and you guys both hit them. It's why your podcast is so extremely successful. You guys know how to get to the court, ask questions.

That's such an incredibly astute question, Michael, because I could walk into the Beverly Center on a Friday. Okay? And that Monday, I couldn't walk into the Beverly Center. It was literally overnight, especially in the world where video was such a huge component of what we did. The only way you can prepare for fame is by going through it.

And your whatever characteristics, whatever building blocks you have that made up the good stuff and the bad stuff is how you're going to handle that. There is no textbook to go, this is how you handle it because everything is so subjective in that world. So you have to go through it to handle it. It's something I always yearn for. I wanted that. I wasn't a guy that wanted just swam my art out there and I want to be back in the cut. Nobody knows. I wanted it all.

I wanted all of that. So I was enjoying it all because I also know how quickly you'd go away. You know, you've seen people. Vanilla Ice was the biggest superstar in the world in 91. There was none bigger. International. A year later, you know, you couldn't get a table at California chicken cafe. You know what I'm saying?

So, and I love you, Ice, you know, we do a lot of shows together. And he's talked about this. So it was very hard and strange to go through. It is still strange for someone to say, hey, man. But I went through this thing in the 90s where I had a little cup of coffee in that real needs. security type of fame, which is very scary, which is very claustrophobic and something I, I, thank God, and not by my design, believe I'd still be there if we were selling 10 million's a record a day. But I got a little taste and I got to fall and I fell back because it's just the

evolution of the band, but having to call security where you go and like, that's just too much. Like I like to go to 7-Eleven and get a cup of coffee, you know, and I've got a fame now, which is like, oh, there's that guy. You know, it's very unintrusive. It's very friendly. 99.99% of people I meet are super cool and super easy, but it took me a way to sort of figure out how I'm going to navigate the world of fame. That's the, that's the simplest way. You know, like, what did you do when it was intrusive? Because it seems like it was. Like, if you say you can't go to the mall on a Monday. Like, how did you handle when it was intrusive and you're, and maybe even when you're sitting down with someone in your family and people are coming up to you while you're

eating? Like, how did you handle that? You know, it's funny, the people around me handled it worse than I did. You know, because I'm super, I'm gregarious. I tend to like people and I'm, you want to come up and say hello. You know, now people just want a picture and they want to go. Back then, they give me like a miniature golf pencil and a wet napkin and go, can you sign this out to my brother or my dad? You know, I'm like, so if you can't take a picture, man, don't, don't be in this. You know what I'm saying, just don't do it because that's, that's all part of it.

I understand privacy. I totally get it. And especially these A-listers, they can find it if they want it. You can go, it's easy to do. But that I was, I, having security and all that I was bad at, I felt a little bit trapped, you know, because I like to go out. I like to watch the first bands play. I like to say hello to people. So I was just bad at. I was bad at being an A-level celebrity. It wasn't good at it. I probably drank too much and did stupid things. I was probably shitty to the people around me that I

shouldn't have been. In fact, that I was, you know, I'm glad because having a cup of coffee up there, like I said, it kind of proved to me that I really can't probably handle that level. And so I just organically back to a spot that, like, it's kind of comfortable, you know? But you know, like, who was I? I can't remember because I just can't remember up to my head, but we were talking to somebody on this show, and I was saying there's a certain level that once you get to it, you can't peel it back. That's right. And that is a scary thought because, you know, I feel like what you're talking about is you kind of get there, you taste it, but then you kind of like step back a little bit and you can have a, you know. But I didn't, Michael, you know,

that the world, the business around me said, yeah, sugar egg, yeah, you're mid-level, you're mid, you're not going to be a superstar act. You know what I mean? So organically happened at the same time I was looking at and going, wow, this is gnarly. This is the rest of my life. It's going to be heavy. Sorry for it. But you know, like, there's not, like, I'll just, like, Michael Jackson is an extreme example because he was so that. But there's certain people once they, there's no peeling aback, no matter what. And you can't. In retrospect, are you glad that it didn't go to that Britney Spears level?

Because to me, I feel like I would be glad looking back. Well, I mean, no. I would love to be a gigantic superstar playing stadiums around the world, flying. You know, fun flying private is? I mean, it's very underrated. You guys know it's so much. Now listen, I'm not going to be with those people because I can't do it all the time. I'm in Southwest when I leave her today, trust me.

But when you fly it, it's just it changes the game. Well, it saves you time. It saves time. I'll say aggravation. Don't do TSA in airports. You guys know it's amazing. So I would say I would have adjusted to that. It's easy to go, yeah, I'm really happy.

It didn't become a gigantic super star. Like, no, that was the goal. And I had a little taste of it. It was fun. Am I on it? Does it, does it claw it? my soul every day. No, it doesn't. You know, because it was fun and it was great. And I get enough wonderful things. I'll get the jam with the beach boys or, I mean, that's pretty fucking cool. It's killer.

It's killer. So I do these really killer things that are above my pay grade and skill set, for sure. So it's still got a little taste. I fly private every now and it's fun. You know, so I'm not going to say I wouldn't have wanted that. It's just an interesting set of circumstances that's been bestowed upon me, you know, but, you know, I would have handled that. There's some part, though, to me, that seems like sometimes when you reach a certain level, not all the time that you almost have to sell a little bit of your soul. Yeah. Well, I think you're right about that. I don't, and I don't know. I'm not, I'm not at that level. You're on your way. You're on your way. So I'm just saying like, it just seems like there's a little part that it's like

there's a lot of sacrifice, sacrificing seeing your kids, sacrificing seeing your family. It seems like there's a little bit of soul selling. I think you're right. But then in every job there is. You're right. You know what I mean? It's like, I get, but it's all relevant to the job. So if to sit up her and go, oh my God, I'm a superstar and complaining about that, I understand why superstars complain about that because I had a little cup of coffee up there. I understand why someone, you know, hanging drywall right now is going, God, I can listen to these people complain about their problems. I totally understand that too. Everything is relevant to where you are at your place. So I can't say, Lauren, whether I'd be unhappy or not being at that level, you know, I certainly

tried to. I won't say I didn't try to be there. You know, I was having number one songs selling millions of records. It's really fun. You know, I think it just was fascinating to me because I think about that period of time and it really was, I think it's gone for forever now, that period of time where like it's instantly overnight where somebody, you know, just pops and like they were unknown to your point on a Friday. You don't think that happens now? Sometimes.

Yeah, Michael, sometimes. No, but not, no, because. Remember they do with the feather and the, and the drinking the crayon apple and listening to free with Mac? I mean, that guy was going down a freeway off ramp the wrong way one day. Where is it now? I think he's got seven million followers. He's probably making a dumb thing.

I think it's okay. It happens, but I feel like it happens in smaller pockets. But what fascinates me about the internet all the time. Yeah. is I hear about people that may have hundreds or 30 or 40, 50 million people follow that I have never heard of in my entire life, right? Like, everyone has that. Like, there's so many people out there and there's so much attention and there's so much visibility with this thing. Back then and what I think was like, and I don't want to use the term gatekeeper, but there was platforms like an MTV or a record label or a movie studio where like that was the only way to really kind of reach that level of attention was these kind of platforms put you on.

Now, like, you know, there's people all the time that I get shot. I'm like, I've never heard of who that is my entire life. And they are massive. Yeah. And so I think that's just like an interesting thing to observe where like the entire world or the entire country would turn its attention to whoever was on these platforms of the past. You're completely right, Michael. And also you can have this viral fame immediately.

And there's nothing to support that viral fame, meaning it goes away just as quick as it was bestowed upon you. You know, to your point, we had a record company behind us, making sure we didn't fall out with their publicity department, with their radio plugging department, to make sure we stayed where we were and it sustained a career. I mean, I am still eating off the success we have from 97, 2001. You know, I don't know how many people that went viral, say, today, overnight, are going to be having a career 20 years from now.

Pretty fucking cool. Yeah. So, well, I'm grateful for those who really propped me up, as I'm trying to say, not to my doing. We have the systems in place, the gatekeepers, if you will, that said, yes, you are worthy of coming on a radio station or our network and video network station, you know, so I'm grateful for that. But I was just talking about that yesterday. You know, you can have the hit song on, like a viral hit song and it just goes away immediately.

You know, it's like a poison apple. You want to bite of this? Careful what you asked for. There's going to be a great six months. And then, you're like, live the rest of your life chasing that six months. It's, it is astronaut syndrome. Yes. 100%. Boy, that's well put. It's 100%. They go to the moon. They go to the moon, the rest of your life. It goes at the moon, which is kind of cool. Or were you? You have a lot of wisdom and a lot of, you're very smart, though, when it comes to talking about fame and it being fleeting. Like, I think it's, it's, it's, you have a good grasp on it.

Like, it's impressive. Did you get that from just looking at other artists or musicians that came through before you? How did you know that? A lot of that has to do with that. I've just always understood the fragility of being in this business. I mean, do you know how hard it is to become a one-hit wonder? Do you understand the odds you had to be to become this one? one-hit wonder that a lot of us look back now and go, oh, one-hit wonder, funny.

Like, that's funny. I laugh at you. The one-hit wonder, you got the lottery ticket. You are charling the chocolate factory. You got in the factory and got one hit. Do you know how hard it is to have a couple hits? I always say the hardest part of success is achieving success. Achieving success is the second hardest part.

The hardest part of success is staying there. It's impossible. So if you're in the entertainment business, it's almost the Hasselhoff effect, the Hasselhoff effect, I call it. You go through like roller coasters where you're up, you're down, you have to survive those things. A lot of egos can't. A lot of like skill sets can't. So I think I saw enough people in front of me go up the hill and come right back down.

A year and a half later, Michael, they literally bought a house up there and Lookout Mountain. Hey, hey, having fun. Twelve months later, bankrupt coming down. I saw that happen to many, many people. So I understood that right away. My dad was a finance guy in Orange County. So he always told me the value money. You know, it was never a guy that chased the seasons at Gucci once I had some money.

I wasn't that guy. I was still on my dickies and A-frame T-shirts, to be politically correct. Money was never something that was going to be my downfall. And I understood that there would be a bit of a roller coaster ride. And I was willing to try new things and stay here. I saw the value being on extra when a lot of people wouldn't. And a lot of people didn't think it was very cool to do that.

And I understand that. I think it's so cool. I thought it was cool. You know, especially in 2003 when our last record... It's unexpected. Well, it didn't set our last record in 2003. It didn't set the charts on fire. And a couple of guys in our band had just had kids, and they said, Mark, we want to kick back,

raise our kids a little bit, and take a break. We don't want to go into the cycle of making a record, going on tour, and just chasing our tails. And I go, okay, what am I going to do? So because of the ride we had at Sugar A, there was a couple phone calls that reached out to me. One of them was at Extra. And I went down there on a Friday, and then two weeks later, I was hosting Extra. I mean, literally, I didn't know what I was doing. I went down there for a meeting, but was really an audition because my manager at the time knew

I was not going to do audition for anything. And I went down there and they gave me a mic because I was so loose. I was like, hey guys, welcome to X-R. I'm Mark McGrath. Tonight we have Jason Mamoa from Baywatch Nights. Hey, and I was so loose. I didn't care.

I could never do that again if I tried to a million years. And I got the job. And I remember I had to learn in front of America. So I have no problem learning things in front of people and failing. My first six months at extra, if you look at that, I mean, I was like, I'm a bit of a spaz if you can tell.

So I gesticulate like this. And this is, you know, on stage, you want big movements to hit the last row in the arena. And Extra, it's small movements, you know, it's TV. I mean, Clint Eastwood made a career of raising his eyebrow. You know what I mean? So I had to learn how to like settle down a little bit. And I remember six months into my gig at Extra, I'll never forget this. I was getting my coffee at 7-11.

It's like five in the morning, super early. Now, I was up because I was being a good boy, not up because I was being a bad boy. But there were some bad boys in there. And one guy had like a neck tattoo. And this is 2004 when those were, it's still kind of scary. And he comes out to me, staring at me, and I'm like, oh, God, here we go. And he gets his coffee, looks at me. And he goes, hey, Mark, you sucked when you started extra, but you're getting better, bro.

And that was the biggest compliment, backhanded conflict you could ever give me. I was like, dude, thank you. I feel the same way. So I was like learning in front of people and not afraid to fail. And I think that's what's been my biggest success being, just in Hollywood in general, just being not afraid to fail. If they don't try things, how do you know? And don't let people's, like, you know, perceptions.

I've said this forever. and I knew this intuitively at eight years old, half the people in the world are going to love you for no reason. And the other half are going to hate you for no reason. That's the way the world works. It's your job to go out the front door and find out who really loves you. That's your job. And that's it. I think that's sound advice, especially in a time now where, you know, especially doing what we do here at Dear Media, we work with not just Arshope, but a lot of talent. And I am always kind of sharing, you know, my perspective on longevity, because if you're a young person and people are throwing dollars at you in a year and you all start to get a little

a little bit of a platform. It's fun. It's fun. But if you don't have the experience, you feel like, hey, this is going to last for forever. I was fortunate that I got to do a lot of things in, you know, behind the scenes in my business career before doing this and before this venture. And I saw ups and downs and ups and down. So I've kind of like, I don't take any of this for granted.

I'm like, hey, this may never last forever. The job is to kind of, you know, try to keep it going and, you know, be positive and put in the work. But I see a lot of people, they kind of hit this, what Lauren would call astronaut syndrome in this digital kind of space. and they think it's just the money's picket is on for forever. And they don't do the things they don't save. They don't invest.

They don't think about how to pivot or how to evolve. It's not sexy. It's not sexy to invest in when you're in the 20s. No, unsexy it is to go, what's my 401k? Let me set up something for the future. It's not fun and sexy. And when someone throws you 25 years old, like $2 million, like, you know, for that year, you're like, wow, this is how it works.

Like, you're thinking like, this is going to go on forever. And it just doesn't. It ends. And historically, it's always ended for 99% of the bands that were successful. So what makes you different? And actresses and actors. Everybody. I think it's, I always say like we can all talk about the people that have kind of been there forever,

but I don't think people talk enough about the people that kind of got there and then you don't hear from anymore. And I think it's a cautionary tale for anybody that's kind of putting themselves out there as a personality where they just think it's going to last forever and it may not. You're so right. And especially in this day and age, guys, where everybody's on social media, thank God that wasn't there when I was when I had my first bit of money, because everybody wants to flex. Everybody wants to show their stuff and look at me.

And that's what gets lights and followers. And that also generates money. So it's a weird conundrum that today's generation's in. You know, so you are going to buy that Ferrari before you buy a home. You know what I mean? Which is just like, but you got to make your own mistake. Money is a lot like the road, like I talked about. If you get money, you got to figure out how you have money.

Not how anybody else has money. How do you live and work with money? How do you plan? Because people can tell you how to do it, but it's how you're going to do it. And that's one thing about money. It's like celebrity. You don't know what celebrity is until you have it, you know, and same with money to me. If you, all the wisdom that you have now could tell your 27-year-old self some three core principles,

what are those principles that you would go back and tell you that you didn't maybe know at 27? How about ones that I sort of knew? Yeah. Okay. One that I always knew is be nice to people. Yeah. Just because, I know that sounds like so easy, but just be nice. When I say be nice, take the time to be nice.

remember people's names. I got jobs in this six figure, high six figure job. I'd had no business doing because I remembered the names of the crew. You know, Holly and Jade out here, and you have wonderful staff here. Oh, dear a wonderful people. It's a testament to you guys. I just wanted to prove to it. That's pretty good. Holly and Jade. I walk and talk it, though. You know what I'm saying the same way. So just be nice and kind of people. I tell my

kids that, you know, if you're nice and kind of people, you're probably going to have a really good life. It doesn't mean you're going to be a billionaire, but you're probably can have a really good life because that, that, that, you know, when you're nice and you throw it out there, the universe owes you a karmic debt. They owe you some niceties. That's unique, though, because a lot of, not all celebrities, but a lot of celebrities, you know, maybe aren't known for sometimes being nice. Absolutely. And I understand that. That's why I'm saying it's a commodity. I'm giving you, I'm giving you the tea here, ladies and gentlemen. I'm giving you these jewels here. Be nice. Even if you don't want to be. Yeah. Be nice. What's your second core principle?

The second core principle is you got to work hard. You got to show up early. You got to be the first one up. And if no matter what you're in, if you're bullshit in yourself, I don't really belong here, then how are we going to believe you don't belong here? Meaning like, be the first one up. Be the last one to go to sleep. Be the first one to pick up a check at a table.

I guess that's kind of being nice too. Mine are all under that umbrella, just having manners in being nice. And also watch your dough. We kind of just tap down a little bit. you know, when you get money for the first time, you're going to do some stupid things, and that's okay. Just don't continue to do the stupid things. You might think you need, you know, the Gucci's, you know, Rick Owens' 24 line is coming out with the, you know, the cones in the head. You might just need that to get into the cabana. Where if you're going tonight? You know what I'm saying?

I get it. Do that once and you're going to figure out, wow, it's a tough game to play. And just, you know, be smart with your dough. Third principles, call your mom. Tell your mom. That might follow the nice thing, too. as well. What's the, no, no, also, I'm sorry, sorry. Go. Surround yourself with good people and good friends.

And I know that's another cliche. You know why cliches are cliches? Because they work. Yeah. Does they work? Yeah. They're, you know, oh, it's so boring to say passion or cliché. They work.

It's what it's about. If it's not that what, I mean, mystify me with your newness. Right. You know? So surround yourself with good people because that old adage, you know, show me a man's friend. I'll show you the man. There are so many choices when it comes to a probiotic that's going to be best

for your gut. we obviously stand by Just Thrive probiotics. We have had the founder Tina on this show so many times talking about the importance of gut health and the importance of a solid probiotic, which is why we love Just Thrive so much. Just Thrive Probiotic is like a gardener for your gut, safely eliminating bad bacteria and replenishing the good and it actually produces antioxidants too. It can be open and sprinkled into any food or drink so it's the perfect probiotic for the whole family.

Anyone can take it. Lauren and I have been taking it for three years now, and our gut loves us for it. If you remember a few years back, I talked about on the show, I went and actually did a bunch of blood tests, and the results were honestly phenomenal. I'm not saying that to brag. I'm just telling the truth. But I still felt something was off. So I went and did a gut test with my friend Dr. Daryl Joffrey. And sure enough, I had gut issues. So what I did immediately was I started a super strong gut regimen. All in all, you're just going to improve every aspect of your life if you get your gut health under control. So if you're looking to jump into a great probiotic and you want to get that gut health

under control, we've learned so much about the importance of gut health. Definitely check out Just Thrive. Go to Just Thrivehealth.com slash discount slash Skinny 90 and use promo code Skinny 90 for 20% off a 90 day bottle of Just Thrive probiotic and JustCom at Justthrivehealth com promo code Skinny 90. Again, that's justthrivehealth.com promo code Skinny 90. You can also still use promo skinny if you just want to get the probiotic and 15% off. Again, Justthrivehealth.com, promo code skinny. Or you can use code Skinny 90 for the Just Thrive Probiotic and the Just Calm product. Both phenomenal. Enjoy. I recently was on vacation and I'm not very good at doing my own hair. But you know what I am good at?

Taking a great product and putting it all over my hair and then wrapping it in a bun and leaving it there. And you can see that from my Instagram. But I love a multitasking moment where I am sitting with like a leave in conditioner spray. So my hair is reaping all the benefits. And the leave and conditioner spray that I used is by Wella professionals. They just released its most luxurious hair care line. It's called Ultimate Repair. That is the one that I used. I like to use it on wet hair. So I have would take a shower and then I would put a ton of their ultimate repair miracle hair rescue in my hair and just like let it sit in the bun. I would wrap it in a clip and then the leave and spray that I was using has omega-9s in it. So this would replenish the outside layer and smooth my hair. This is like amazing. It has AHA in it, which rebuilds hair bonds from the inside out. And like I would just be in this bun. It's like a wet bun. Like I said, you can see it on my Instagram. and in the bun would be sitting all of this luxurious leave-in spray.

You should know that Wella Professionals is vegan, cruelty-free, dermatology-tested, and safe for colored hair. It's also formulated without artificial dyes, so my hair was just sitting in goodness. You can purchase Ultimate Repair, Miracle Hair Rescue at Ulta Now. You can also go to wella.com. That's W-E-L-L-A-D-com to learn more. There is one thing that drives me absolutely nuts about people owning pets and dogs specifically. that they give them no variety in their food choices. They serve them the same nasty food over and over,

most likely from a big gross bag that's been sitting in a laundry room or a pantry for months and months. And that dog has to eat that slop every single day. It's like that meme with that happy dog. And it said, hey, my dog's face when he realizes that he's eating the same thing every single day. Well, not any longer, not with the farmer's dog. Real food, feed your dog, the farmer's dog. It's real, fresh, healthy food with whole meat and veggies,

gently cooked in human-grade kitchens to preserve their nutritional value. Why would you not want to serve your dog great food and keep them as healthy and happy as possible? Just make them feel good. Know that you're giving them something that's going to create longevity for them, keep their fur shining, just keep them happy and healthy, like I said. All the food comes personalized, just tell them about your dog, and they'll deliver personalized vet-developed recipes for as little as $2 a day. So cost-effective.

Pre-portioned meals arrive and pre-portioned, ready-to-serve packs, conveniently delivered on your schedule, convenient and fresh. Dog people all across the country have ordered millions of meals from the farmer's dog. It's never been easier to invest in your dog's health with fresh food. So check out the farmer's dog. Get 50% off your first box of fresh, healthy food at the farmersdog.com slash skinny. Plus you get free shipping. Just go to farmer's dog.com slash skinny to get 50%. That's the farmersdog.com slash skinny. Go to the farmer's dog.com slash skinny to get 50% off your first box plus free shipping. What is the coolest thing that you've got to do?

I know there's been so, give us a couple. Oh, without a doubt. Because I can't say one, but there's a zillion cool things I've gotten to do. Well, one of the coolest things that happened in the band was receiving a gold record from Atlantic Records from Amit Erdogan who started Atlantic Records. He is a titan in our industry. And he was a little bit older there. and, you know, Mc Jagger, Led Zeppelin, he was there on the planes, he was there party with the guys,

but he's also an incredible businessman and a great artist as well. So him giving us a gold record in the hollowed halls of Atlantic Records in New York City was pretty amazing. I may or may not have shed a tear. I probably did. The second greatest thing was in 1999, we got to open for the Rolling Stones in Las Vegas. Oh, that's rad. The Rolling Stones. Yeah.

You know, I was calling my second grade soccer team friends going, hey, what are you doing tonight? Nothing. I'm opening for the stones, bro, and it was hanging up on. So check this out. We're opening for the stones. And like, I've always been super conscious and, and sort of cognizant about being in the moment on these. Kind of like knowing about like, you know, what to do with money and stuff. Like, just this is amazing.

Okay. Opening for the stones in Vegas is pretty amazing. Okay. So we're opening for the stones and it was so fun. And the stones, the stones crowd is a store notoriously like a little bit difficult because they want to see the stones. Kind of like Metallica's audience. They want Metallica. They want the stones.

They want nothing else. So I think they saw like five puppies on stage. They were kind of amused by it. And they saw just how happy we were to be there. And we're about to play every morning, which was number one at the country at the time, too, to just keep adding on to the incredible experience of the story. I'm like, well, I got to say, I've got to thank the Rolling Stones for having us open here tonight in Las Vegas.

This next song is number one in the country right now. I can't think of a better way to celebrate. I don't know how this could get any better, but hold on. It just got a little bit better. Mick Jagger and Keith Richards are watching us perform right there from the monitor world. So I'm just sitting there going, oh my God, this is, and to myself, I said self, this might be the best moment of your musical career. And we played the song.

It's incredible. We came down the steps. There they were thanking us for hoping for them. And I'm like, this is pretty rad. Now, I've had moments that came close, but never as cool as that moment. That was incredible. But I've also learned got to, I've got to perform with the Beach Boys a bunch of times. I've got to perform with Run DMC

with the Sex Pistols is my all-time favorite band. I got to play a song remaining members of the Sex Pistols, Steve Jones, Glenn Matlock, and Paul Cooks. Like I played Johnny Rotten to their sex pistols.

And that was incredible. So all these wonderful moments and there's so many more, Lauren, you could probably ask me in 10 minutes and I'm grateful for everyone. We had triple platinum records, number one songs in TRL, talking to Carson Daley,

and all those things are just great. It was all fun. And I loved every moment of it. Steve, Do you follow him on Instagram? Of course, yeah, he's the best. And he plays a, he's always, Lauren, has no idea what I'm talking about,

playing in his bathtub, his guitar, ripping. It's so great. And he plays these interesting country songs. The songs you wouldn't think the guy who started punk rock would play. And that's why I love Steve. Steve's a great character. I'm a good friend of his.

I love how he just rips that guitar out and plays in his, he's in his bathroom, in the bathtub just playing. The acoustics are so good in there. Who is Steve Jones? Oh, Lauren, come on. Who's Steve Jones? Steve Jones is a guitar player for the Sex Pistles.

Okay, okay. And he just had a series released last year in Hulu that Danny Boyle did called, they're called Eye Pistol. Forgive me if I said it wrong. And it's really fascinating. And it's about his journey in the sex pistols. It's incredible. I named my son Liden.

The sex pistols mean a lot to me. I'll tell you why. The sex pistols were a band that kind of kicked against the industry, like, tried to, like, tear it all down. That bloated Genesis, Eagles, cocaine, fueled, like, country rock. It was, like, so unattainable. And what they did is they came in and they just, they whipped it all down and said, no, you don't have to be that talented. You don't have to do that.

If you just have the nerve to get on stage, you can do it. And that was kind of the impetus that got me on the stage. If these guys can do it, I'm just going to get on stage. So it was a huge part of me and my willingness to try and not be scared of failing. So I named my son, Liden, because Johnny Rod and the lead singer, his surname is Liden. My son is named Lydden. That is such a cool name. I think that's one of the coolest boy names I've ever heard.

Do you really? Yeah. I'm really specific with names. I like something that's unique and short and strong, and that is unique and short and strong. We named our son after Towns Van Zant. Oh, that's pretty cool. I mean, you kidding me?

I know, but Liden's pretty cute. Lidens pretty cool. It comes from the same sort of energy in DNA where it means that much to you. Well, that's like, I feel like there's like, I miss the attitude of all that stuff. Like there was the punk stuff. There was the metal stuff. Yeah. I would categorize the Poges in there, Shane McGowan.

Oh, for sure. Like that kind of. But then also like in a weird way, you can also loop a towns van Zant or a Blaise Foley kind of character in there. Most punk rock guys ever. Yeah. Are you kidding me? That's what I love about music is like you could have attitude. It's attitude. Yes, it's an attitude. It's your daughter's name. Her name is Hartley. Cute. What's another interesting story? We were driving by the Roxy. We go by these venues in Los Angeles and bad things happened to us or good things, depending on you look at it. We were going down Sunset Boulevard and we looked up on the Roxy venue up there. You know on the Who's Playing Tonight thing? And it said, Igloo and Hartley.

And I looked at her. I go, are you thinking what I'm thinking? She goes, Yeah, I go, Igloo? She'll say, no, Hartley. No, no, Hartley's great. Crowley's great, of course. I thought Igloo is cool. But that might have been one of those names like where you're like, oh, gosh, look at these guys' name and their son like, you know, like, assel blossom, pumpkin, whatever the hell is. You know what I mean?

But Hartley's great. It just fits. Hartley McGaradden, it's awesome. You have to tell. So Towns is a strong name. I like that it's just like a towns. Yes. People like, what are you doing?

That's because, again, like, people have, you know, they don't know towns vans anymore. One awesome Texas they do. Believe that. Believe that. You mentioned earlier about your parents getting divorced. Yeah. Are you close to your parents now? You know, they're both no longer with us.

They were the last generation that smoked their asses off, you know, and you couldn't tell my dad nothing. Cigarettes. Yeah, cigarette, yeah, not weed. And there's nothing I can't stand more than cigarettes. And physically I can't, but I know it's also psychological to as well. You know, because cigarettes killed my mom and dad. and kind of robbed them of their chance to be grandparents.

And it bums me out to think about it, you know. Because my dad passed when he's 68 and my mom passed when she was 70. And I come from a long line of single, angry Irish people. So I don't think they ever thought I was going to have kids. You know what I mean? And they both, thank God, were alive when the kids were born. And I could see my dad was really deteriorating in their first year. And I could see him getting skinnier and skinnier.

I could see him holding his grandson going, I wish I took a little bit care of myself, better care of myself. He didn't say that because he never would. He was sort of a Don Draper, old school, madman type of guy. Couldn't tell him nothing. But I could tell he was a little bit bummed out. But I'm glad we gave him the gift of grandkids and you got to be a granddad for a year, you know? And can you tell us the story of how you met Dr. Gidear?

Absolutely. My wonderful wife here, like I said, anything good happens in my life is always a result of her and her research. But she said, 2009, I'm going to leave you if we don't have kids. And as I kind of mentioned a little while ago, I was on the fence. I come from a long line of single people that it was never, there was never any pressure. Like my mom was like, when are you going to get me grandkids? She never said it once. Karin said to me, I'm going to leave you if we don't have kids.

After I threw up and came back and said, well, let's give it a try. And, you know, she has her own complications. Like she had one ovary and the whole thing. And she went through a hell trying to make it happen. We tried the normal way. And I thought, you know, I'm on there rocking and rolling. I've never been good to my body. It's probably half me, half her, blah, blah, blah, you know,

we're never having babies, so we tried, didn't happen. So then she did a little research and found this guy, Dr. Gideer, who's like the most eloquent, well-spoken, articulate. And I've heard your podcast with me so well-spoken. I love that guy. I know you guys have infinity tours as well. So he was our guy that we went to to get orientation and figure out what it was, and I found out what it meant.

The weirdest thing is when I gave my sample, if you will, I'll never forget the playboy was a Kim Kardashian playboy. Oh my goodness. I mean, finished. And she was in like a gladiator uniform. And I'm like, I can't. This is too weird. I know her.

So I went to my mind Rolodex real quick. It didn't work. I'm back to Kim. Anyway, so got a sample. But he, like, led us to this whole process and such a gentleman, such a good guy. And, you know, it's a precarious thing. And I know everybody's got their own opinion on IVF. I get it.

For us, it gave us the best. biggest two gifts of our life. And, you know, I had kids when I was 42, so I came late. And at 42, I was up in my house in the Hollywood Hills going, is that it? I've had this incredible career, and I'm super grateful for every moment, but is that it? And I realized I wasn't on a journey anymore, you know, and once you have kids, you want to raise your kids and hope you become grandparents, just the eternal journey, and I'm grateful for it all. But she kind of went through the how the IVF works. It was too much science for me. I'm like, I don't get it, you know. Yeah, I was not actually on tour, and she did all the big shots on her own, the hormone

shots where are shots this big, literally gigantic, and she had her friend come over and administer them. And she went through all the hard stuff. And she worked hard to have these babies. And, you know, it made me fall in love with her all over and all that kind of stuff. So we're going to the day to find out if she's pregnant. It's a big day. I fly off the road. I come to, I come get her at the house. And I'm fully ready to tell her. I'm sorry, honey. We tried. You know, IVF is expensive. I only had one shot at this, expensive, you know, showbiz in her a little but, you know, and I go, if it doesn't happen, I'm really sorry, but we tried, and you gave it your best. I'm very proud of you, and I'm, you know, I saw how hard you wanted this, and I'm sorry if it

doesn't work. Fully expecting the doctor goes, it's not going to happen. So we go over there, and I'll never forget this, wonderful nurse, and she's got the ultrasound. Ultrasound. We thought it was bright. The ultrasound, she's looking and she goes, I don't see. Oh, oh, there's a little, oh, congratulations, you're pregnant. I'm like, oh, my God. It worked. It worked. Having a baby. Oh, my God. And then, She goes, hold on a second. What's this back? Oh, my God.

Congratulations. You're having twins. I literally went from about to console her and say, sorry, it didn't work to being the father of twins in 30 seconds. And all because of Dr. Goddier. Thank you, Dr. Goddier. Dr. Goddier was waiting for his name. If he's listening, you know he's waiting for his name right now.

The chief meatbeater, Dr. The chief meat beater. He'll throw you in the closet with a Kim Kardashian-Leguian gladiator. Oh, yeah. He knows what you need. He throws you in that broom closet and you get to. And it's weird. It's anything but fun. It's crazy and weird. And, you know, I wanted the romantic way to have kids. And we tried hard and all that. But, you know, the weird science way was the way it went for us, you know, and I'm super grateful for it. And how hard was it to have twins? Was it hard? I guess you don't know anything different. So you don't have anything to compare it to. But it seems like it's a lot of work. I'm not going to, I'm not going to lie. It's a ton of work. You know, we had night nurses and nannies and people on standby. I'm not, you can say what you want. I'm not built like that. I need my sleep, especially I was older too, so it was tough.

And we kind of touched on it earlier before we jumped on here, but you really need to keep twins on a schedule. You need to keep on a schedule or you're going to be up, you're going to be up for 24 hours straight. Because if you're like, if one wakes up at two, one wakes up at three in the morning, one's wake at four, because it takes about 35 minutes, 40 minutes to change everything and get back to sleep, as you guys know, that would have been impossible. It's so important, keep twins on a schedule.

So it was very difficult, even with the night nurse and all that. We were very fortunate that we had a night nurse. we thought we'd have her for two weeks. And we started with the parents of the year. You know, no gluten, no nothing, never going to have any fast food ever. How dare they candy? Never blah, blah, blah, blah. Six months into it's like fast food, night nurses.

We were meeting family members. We never met, to have them come over and spend some time with the kids. You know, it was all hands on deck with twins. And I don't know now. We've kind of been talking about this. I don't know babies who are harder or going into the teen years. They're going to be 13 in a month. But because of TikTok and social media, they've been teenagers for two years,

especially our daughter. That scares the shit out of me. Oh, bro, it should. It should because she's 5'10, already boy crazy like her mom. And it's just a rap and all the drama and all my God and all that. It's just crazy. So the psychological warfare is a lot more hardcore with teenagers than it was physical warfare when they were babies. She's 510.

Oh, yeah. She's gigantic. At 13? She's a supermodel, the whole thing. Yeah, she's amazing. You got to show us a picture. Yeah. I think I've got one from the war.

Well, good luck to you, my. Yeah, I know, dude. It's been rough. It's been nice knowing you guys, you know, but let's see if I can just get this one real quick. Yeah, I love to see a picture. That's my daughter and that's my son. We're statue of liberty. When you guys were in, where were they, Karen, you told me there.

We're not stalking you guys, but you guys went to, when we were in New York, you just told me on the way over here. They were in. Where were we? Yeah, we were. Yeah, we were. Yeah, we were. Where did you guys stay in St. Pardt? We were on a boat with some friends.

Oh, did you ever go to that funky resort on the other side? It's red. It's got, it's right on the beach. A side note on St. Bartz, did you play a birthday party down there? That's what I'm getting it. But are they still talking about us, Michael? No, because I, and it was like they rented the whole hotel. The whole resort.

That's why I'm asking. So it's a friend of mine. Close on my parents. We will talk about that later. Wait, a friend of yours was the birthday? Was the person that got married? Oh, wait, I didn't know that. I can't really, I can't really, I don't want to say the name.

Wait, his parents were there. My parents were there. They were there. And they told me. And they told me that. I remember that your mom said, oh my God. Because I didn't. So I forgot about that.

I'll just say floor mats, right? Yes, yes, exactly. Exactly. Nicest people in the world. Yes. And they had Cheryl Crow. Oh, no, no. That was, you were at Eden Rock.

Eden Rock. That was, that was trying to get that beautiful spot. Amazing. But I heard, so my mom came back and she's telling me about this wedding. Okay, I got to be careful of her. But she's like, Sugar Ray, at Cheryl Crow. And I think there was, who else was the other? B-52s?

Train was there? Yeah, train. This wedding. But like four nights in a row of this. not just one night. They went all out these folks. Oh, no, I talked to the manager of the hotel and he's like, yeah, this guy, he said he's going to do all this stuff.

And he's like, oh, it's going to be something like you've never seen before down here. And the manager's like, oh, yeah, okay, good one. We've seen a few things, yeah. But the manager said it was like nothing we've ever fucking seen before. I don't know how they pulled it off, especially on the other side of the island and putting their production in there because these bands demand production, you know, especially train Cheryl Crow. And they were just so amazing, the nicest human beings.

So again, this is like, I mean, the world's a small world. But again, when we got connected over text, I was just tripping the fuck out. Me too. I felt the same way. But that's weird for me to hear it. Because, I mean, again, like, imagine being 11, 12, 13, 14, like, seeing you for so long. And it's just weird.

The world takes into weird directions. We love your music. We're such big fans. I appreciate that so much. And we love your podcast. We really do. I mean, we were going to, we got married to San Diego Ranch, right? I just wanted a famous favorite spot.

If I had to get married in the United States, that's where I would get married. Well, she's so smart again. She's like, well, that's what I'll have her anniversary there. every year. So last year on anniversary, she goes, okay, I want you to listen to the podcast online, you know, and so like, okay, I won't you put on skinny confidence. I think you were talking to Gabby Reese or something. Oh, yeah. Love Gabby. And it was great. And you guys just effort, like, oh, these guys are really whip smart and articulate and the questions are amazing. She goes, I've tried to tell you that. So I've been a fan ever since that. And for me to figure out that

I'm on here talking to you guys. It's like, because I hold you guys in the same selfless, you know, same esteem. You know, I'm like, these guys are just rock stars in the podcast world. And it's an honor for me to be invited. And I want to thank you both. We're going to retire after this one. I'm going to tell you this. You are damn good on a mic, which is not a surprise at all. You can come back on the podcast anytime you want. Open invite.

You guys can come on together. Maybe we're going to bring your wife. I'm going to get the other side of the story. She's the. Oh. She said we can talk about the infidelity. Maybe he'll bring her on alone. Didn't we talk about that? No, you totally, next time you come on, you guys can come on together and we can do a him and her thing.

That'd be awesome. There's so many different directions, too, that we'll be. we can go because you have so much to say and you're so interesting. So you guys understand though. I've done enough podcast. It has to be like a give and take. And you have such a what you guys actually, you have an interest in what you're saying and you have no problem taking the conversation somewhere else. You don't have to stare at you. It's like it's an effortless thing that you guys do. So you bring out the best in your guest. I want don't, don't give the credit to your guest. You guys keep the conversation alive and interesting and fun. So my hat's off to you both.

You guys are invited back on in July. We're here. You hit the nail on your head. And I think this is for anything you do. You have to, I mean, you know this. You said it earlier. You have to love what you do and you actually have to be interested in which, like, we have this brief here and I have it, you know, for notes. But sure, it's really we're interested in your life and what you do. And I think if you don't have that and if you're not passionate about what you're doing, it makes it really difficult, right? Makes it a job. Yeah, makes it a job. Yeah, it makes it a job. You're very sweet. I mean, you should have you, do you have a podcast? I do not have a podcast because I, I could just think like, oh God, the guy from Sugar Ray has a podcast. But, you know, I mean, I mean, I,

Listen, I think I've fooled you today. But you know what's fun? It's like, we talked about music. But we talked about music today, but I think we talked more like life. Like music will always be the foundation when you talk to me. And I'm super grateful for that. But I've got stuff out of you guys today that you don't even know. One of little little little facts and fact toys.

Listen, obviously on the surface and all the accolades and all that, I think like, and I don't mean this offensively, but people can Google a lot of that stuff and figure out who you. I want to know the person, right? I want to know like why. You can tell. You don't have those first three questions. So, you have a natural interest, which is just, I mean, I'll tell you guys. It's what feeds.

This makes you guys number one of what you do. It's no surprise. You are welcome back to come on anytime you want. You're a great interview. This interview was giving Rob Dearduk vibes. Deerdeck is the king of that. He's the king. He's the best, doesn't he?

He makes you believe in life and humanity. Let's go kick some ass, you know? There's just certain people that come on that are just great interviews. And I really appreciate you taking the time today. Thank you, Lauren. One of my favorites by far. Where can everyone find what you're doing, support you, go to your concerts, all the things. And what are you playing in Austin so we can come?

You just played. We just, we did a private show. We did it. Austin has become like the convention capital of the world. Used to be Vegas. Used to be Orlando. And it still is. But now Austin and Nashville, both these cities, which, you know, are just, I love both

those cities. A lot of conventions are there. So I'm going on tour this summer with the gin blossoms and vertical horizon. Ironic. And fastball. So if you like 90s, come on out. I'm also doing a fun little one with Brett Michael. So I love, you should get Brett on. He's got so much. Talk about a guy that would change your life. I would love to have Brett Michaels on here. He's, he's great. He would love to be on here. I'll put her in a, you guys don't need much help, but he's just the best dude. I think we might need help for Brett Michaels.

Oh, trust me. He's got no problem. He's the greatest guy. He's got so much positivity. And he's got some wonderful stories, obviously about music. So I'm going out with him and Night Ranger, Jefferson Airplane. Which is so cool because when you think about that, I'm going out with some 80s bands, you know what I mean? And then I'll go some 90s bands. I just think that's where my career has taken me. Like, it's letting me open these doors like necessarily not just in the 90s lane, whether it's extra, whether it's playing with 80s bands, whether it's forming with the sex pistols, whether it's going out with Jim Blossoms, you know, people in our fraternity. I just feel super grateful for it all. And I still willing to try it.

Where can everyone buy tickets? You can go to Mark McGrath.com. Okay. Or you can go to the real Mark McGrath on Twitter. I hate that. I had to do something. Do you guys lose your blue check marks? I ended up.

It's not a political thing. Have you seen the sort of freak out on now? Did you pay for it? Oh my God, it's a political thing now. I'm like, you either pay for it? You don't. Instagram just did it too, right? They just...

Instagram did it too? Yeah, they just rolled it out. Everyone's going to pay. Today? Yeah, listen, say what you want about it. No one wants to lose Instagram one. No, no, no. But you know, it's hard for me now, and I don't mean, listen, I,

equal opportunity. I hope everybody gets a blue, but sometimes it's hard now for me to siphon through the messages because I can't, everyone's, everyone's blue now. I totally agree. But you also want the validity of, like, this is the real home in place of that. And I guess that isn't that anymore. I'll do you one better, Michael Lauren.

I paid for the blue checkmark. Not afraid it. And I don't have it. They didn't give it to me. How about that? On Twitter Blue? That's the story of my show biz life. Played for Twitter Blue.

I'm like, all right, here we go. But you know, Michael Lewis Wine. And it just went yesterday. And I was like, yeah, I didn't pay for it either. I'm fully paid for it. Everyone find you on Instagram. At the real Mark McGrath, again, on IG. And, you know, I like talking to people on there.

I will respond if you reach out. I'd love hearing from everybody. I don't do DMs very well because it's a bit of a vicious viper net. But if you, you know, reach out to me on either one of those Twitter or most on TikTok, too, got to be on TikTok. You know, it's my biggest platform by far. I did a couple stupid videos and I've got X amount of followers on there. And then markrodot.com, you can, like, find out what I'm doing. And it's not hard to find.

And I'm super glad for it all. Are you going to Austin on your tour? That's first thing, no. Like a lot of it's back east and the Midwest, you know? That's fine. Yeah, we'll go, we'll go check it out. I'm going to keep you all posted. Thank you so much for coming on. Truly, you are welcome back on the show. If you want to do a him and her podcast, it's awesome. It's open invite. Thank you, Mark. You're incredible. Thank you, Lauren. Thank you, Lauren. Thank you, Michael. Thank you, thank you, Michael. Thank you, thank you, Michael. Thank you, thank you,

we want to do a little Mother's Day giveaway. We want to give one of your mothers an ice roller. All you have to do is say hello on my latest post at Warren Bostic, and I will send one of you an ice roller to gift your mom. And if you're looking for a mother's day gift, definitely check out shopskin confidential.com.