The Bossticks - Nicole Lapin On How To Master Your Personal Finances & Establish Financial Independence Early

Episode Date: August 15, 2022

#487: On today's episode we are joined by Nicole Lapin. Nicole Lapin is an American television news anchor, author and businesswoman. She is known for being an American news anchor on CNBC, CNN and Bloomberg. Lapin also served as a finance correspondent for Morning Joe on MSNBC and The Today Show on NBC. Today we discuss how to master your personal finances and establish financial independence early.  To connect with Nicole Lapin click HERE To connect with Lauryn Evarts click HERE To connect with Michael Bosstick click HERE Read More on The Skinny Confidential HERE For Detailed Show Notes visit TSCPODCAST.COM To Call the Him & Her Hotline call: 1-833-SKINNYS (754-6697) This episode is brought to you by The Skinny Confidential The Hot Mess Ice Roller is here to help you contour, tighten, and de-puff your facial skin and It's paired alongside the Ice Queen Facial Oil which is packed with anti-oxidants that penetrates quickly to help hydrate, firm, and reduce the appearance of fine lines and wrinkles, leaving skin soft and supple. To check them out visit www.shopskinnyconfidential.com now. This episode is brought to you by BetterHelp BetterHelp is online therapy that offers video, phone, and even live chat-only therapy sessions. So you don't have to see anyone on camera if you don't want to. It's much more affordable than in-person therapy & you can be matched with a therapist in under 48 hours. Our listeners get 10% off their firs month at betterhelp.com/skinny . This episode is brought to you by Just Thrive These days, stress seems to hit us from every possible angle in any environment at any time, day after day. Enter Just Calm - the breakthrough new stress and mood support formula from Just Thrive. Yes, the same Just Thrive that produces our favorite probiotic! Get 15% off Just Thrive probiotic + Just Calm supplement dynamic duo bundle or any of their other scientifically proven products at justthrivehealth.com/Skinny or use code SKINNY at checkout. This episode is brought to you Tommy John Tommy John is overcoming the uncomfortable with premium fabrics, innovative fits and problem-solving functionality that make men and women feel comfortable in their skin. Get 20% off your first order at tommyjohn.com/SKINNY . This episode is brought to you by Beekeepers Naturals Beekeepers Naturals is female-founded and the products are clean and effective, third-party tested for all pesticides, and the brand is dedicated to sustainable beekeeping and helping save the bees. Get 25% off your first order at beekeepersnaturals.com/SKINNY or use code SKINNY at checkout. This episode is brought to you by That's it. That's it. Apple Crunchables have just one ingredient -- organic apples that are crisped to perfection. This snack has no added sugar, no preservatives, and no weird ingredients you can't pronounce. All their snacks have minimal ingredients, yet they're so tasty. Go to thatsitfruit.com and use code SKINNY at checkout for 25% off you order. Produced by Dear Media

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yourself, that's it is giving skinny confidential listeners this incredible exclusive discount. You're going to go to that's it fruit.com and use code skinny and you get 25% off your order. Enjoy. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire. Fantastic. And he's a serial entrepreneur. A very smart cookie. And now Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride. Get ready for some major realness. Welcome to the skinny confidential, him and her. Your primary house is not a good investment. This is a huge misconception in the financial world. You put a bunch of money into your house that you're not going to get back. When people say that renting is like throwing money away, there is a cost of living. It's like saying food is throwing a money away because you're not going to get back. When people say that renting is like throwing money away,

literally poop it out. There is a cost that you have to pay to live. And you might not get all of it back. Welcome back to the skinny confidential him and her show. Today we're talking money with Nicole Lappin. I know you guys love when we talk money, finance, everything in between. And who better to do it with Nicole? You love to talk money. It's one of your favorite subjects because you've gotten smart with money. Well, listen, I keep talking about this on the show. It's like one of the biggest regrets that I have in my life and I don't have very many at all. is that I didn't learn about personal finance earlier. It's something that so many of us struggle with. We don't understand it. We're not educated in it. It stresses us out. It makes us do erratic things. It makes us live in ways we don't want to live. And so I think just having these conversations and understanding more about personal finance, not to say you have to speak some money guru, but just understanding money and how it works and how you can save and how you can invest and how you can protect your future is so important. Well, it's funny because I was thinking about the book that kicked off your interest in money. And I would say, and I think you're going to be surprised at what I'm going to say, that it was Charlie Munger's book. I love Charlie Munger. That wasn't necessarily a money book. And I know this is going to sound cheesy, but the money book that really book that really kicked it off for me. And maybe this is actually not where I would tell people to start, but what really kind of drove at home was Tony Robbins book, which Tony Robbins of all people, Money Master of the Game. It is a really great personal finance book. It's a big book. It's a big book. It's a big book.

kind of got a lot in there. But if you want to get a well-rounded base of what investors are doing, people that really understand money, like that's a great place to start. Or you could just listen to this podcast and get an even better understanding because, you know, me and Tony, like, you know, who are you going to compare here? Well, Tony's been on the podcast. So if you want to go listen to that episode, you can. And today, Nicole is on the podcast. And I really like how Nicole Laplen explains money because she explains it in a way that's simple. Sometimes when you have these money gurus on a podcast or in a book, they overwhelm you. It's like they make it too complicated. And I'm a fan of just making things more simple. Digestable. Yes. Yes. Nobody wants you to come in and start

screaming about interest and compounding and these counts and index funds. People need to understand what it means. And honestly, it's all really simple. Complex topics, but they're very simple to understand if you actually just understand the basics. Nicole is all about financial freedom and independence for women. I love this. She is the New York Times bestselling author of Rich Bitch. You've seen it everywhere. She also wrote boss bitch and becoming superwoman. She's an American television news anchor, author and businesswoman. And let me tell you, meeting her in person, she just eludes confidence. Like she's a boss bitch. I can see why she wrote the book. She's also been on CNBC, CNN, and Bloomberg. She's served as a finance correspondent for Morning Joe on

MSNBC and the Today Show. She has an incredible resume. Anyway, she is currently Red Book Magazine's first ever money columnist and today she's here to give us money advice. With that, let's welcome Nicole Lapin to the skinny confidential him and her show. This is the skinny confidential him and her. Nicole, I'm very excited to have you on here because I think that I try to study and try to read, but I never position myself as a finance or whenever people come to me for investment advice or finance advice, I'm like, listen, this is what I've read, but don't take my advice. So happy to have you on the show, welcome to the show. Where should we start off here? Where do you feel you need the most help learn?

Well, I want to give context of how you even got interested in money because that's the first step for me is I have to get interested. So was there an epiphany in your life that you look back on where you're like, oh my God, I'm kind of interested in finance. I hated finance. and everything about money growing up. I grew up in an immigrant household. So I'm first generation American. So we didn't talk about stocks or bonds. I grew up in a broken home and I needed to start working super early.

So I just needed a job. And I wanted to be in broadcasting. At first I started as a poetry major. So this is what I said. If I could do this, you could do this. I started as a freaking poetry major. And then I went into journalism and wanted to go to local news back in the day. This is what old people.

had to do to get up to network news level. I wanted a job in Milwaukee, the CBS station. That's what I thought was going to be my big break. And the station chief who I stocked in Chicago, I went to Northwestern, said that I don't get that job, but if I know anything about business news. And I was like, my armpits were already sweating. I was breaking out into hives thinking about it. My boyfriend in high school said he wanted to be a hedge fund manager. I thought he wanted to be in gardening. Like I was the most clueless person in the history of the world. And I just said yes. And I lied. And I said, and I needed a job. And I was like, I could figure out harder things than life. It's ultimately a language just like anything else. And so I joined the floor of the Chicago Merck as a business reporter. And I figured it out just at the school of Hard Knocks. I love a lie when you are applying to jobs just to be like, I can do it. That's right. When I got my bartending job, they're like, do you know how to make a rusty nail?

I'm like, fuck, yeah. What the fuck is a rusty nail? Who the fuck? What's interesting about you, though, Lauren, is even when you were in the job, you never figured that out. You never learned. I take it until you make it, bitch. That's right.

First of all, Northwestern is very hard college to get into, which we're going to get to. You mentioned you grew up in a broken home. What do you mean your family was a broken home? Do you mean like the money was scarce? What does that mean? Both. My father was a drug addict and alcoholic died of an overdose. my mother I talk about in the book, I bailed her out of jail using cash under the sink behind the

maxi pads when I was in middle school, actually. And so the only connection I had with money was nefarious money or any immigrant family, forget about it being dark and all of that, only uses cash. Like there's no credit, there's no mortgage, none of that. That was never even something I knew. And so I had a really terrible relationship with money. Not only did I not know about it, but it was used for bad things. And, you know, I wanted it to do it better. Is your mom now good with money? No. Still not. That's interesting. So if someone's sitting here saying, well, my parents weren't good with money, so I'm bad with money, that's not an excuse. It's not an excuse. We tell ourselves so many excuses. Like, we didn't grow up with money or we don't

have enough money to start or we're bad at math. Like, dude, a fifth grader can do the math that's required to get your financial life together. It's all the shit inside your head. It's the mean girl inside your head that we need to tell to sit down because those are all excuses. Those are all stories. I think you're so right about the narrative that we tell ourselves. Even when you just came in, I said, I'm bad with money and I'm probably, I don't say I'm bad with money. I find it hard to understand and I find it hard to digest and not that fun. But I am telling myself a narrative about it when I could be telling myself something different. So you're right about that. Yeah. So what if we change that narrative?

We're changing. Lauren. Well, and what's interesting about you, Lauren, is that you are good at making money. You always have been, right? And I'm not talking about just like large amounts. Like since you were a kid, you've had jobs, you've supported yourself, you've been financially stable. You've always paid your own bills. And now obviously in the level of success you've reached, you've make money. So do you think it would be a benefit if you learn more about how to utilize it and things it could do now that you have money? Yes, I think, though, what you just said, I always make money and I always find a way to make money. money. So that's why I think it's never been like a theme for me. Because I always figure it out. You said it

earlier. You figure it out. I think that's where, you know what? If you guys want to do a therapy session on me for this episode, I'm totally fine with it. You can use me as the guinea. Intervention. Well, you have kids now. And so it's not about how much money you make. It's about how much money you keep. That matters. And it's also for me about how is my money working for me while I'm sleeping. It should. Yes. Because you work so hard for your money. Yeah. That's important. This is not. This is not. all rainbows and butterflies. You guys built this yourselves. Like you work so hard for all of that. It's time it

returned the favor, in my opinion. Yes. So, let's talk to a kindergartener that's listening, aka me. Where do you even start? Like, where is the place that you tell people, okay, this is the fundamental foundation?

Well, the first step to any recovery is admitting you have a problem. So we are done with step one. All my books are 12 steps. plans for that reason because the only money problem you can't fix is the one you don't admit you have. So, okay, we're good. Step one, done. And then it's really about coming up with a plan. If you're starting from the beginning, Rich Bitch was my first book and I thought it would either fail miserably or crush it. There was no middle ground. Like people were going to have feelings

about it. And it crushed it. Thankfully, it does the latter. But it showed me that there was a need for this information in a way a fifth grader could understand or a kindergartner could understand. And that didn't exist. So coming up with a basic spending plan, I even change some of the jargaining stuff from budget. Budget sounds really scary. And a budget, to me, sounds like a crash diet, right, where you allow yourself, don't allow yourself small indulgences, you end up binging later on. I change it to a spending plan that allows you to have like the equivalent of a Hershey's kiss so you don't end up gnawing on a big old hunk of chocolate cake in the middle of the night. Because you're so deprived. Totally. So,

I'm like the only person that argues for the latte. And so it drove me crazy. I, like, that's not the audience I want to reach. I want to reach Lauren. I want to reach everyone listening to this show because there isn't a voice that talks to that. And everybody who does says, cut out the morning latte. Go buy a house. Don't buy a latte. I'm like, this is bullshit. There actually has to be a better way. And there is. You can buy a latte. You can rent and the financial gods are not going to come down and get you. So for all the people that, I mean, I'm sure it's like ranges, but for the majority of people that seek you out, what do you see is the most common issue that they're dealing with to start? Mostly debt. And debt is the only four-letter word I don't like. So coming up with

a spending plan, I break that down into the three E's essentials, end game, and extras, where 70% of your overall take-home pay goes to the essentials. So your food, your housing, your transportation, all that stuff. No one's ever talked to us about this. And so no more than half of that. So 35% half of 70 goes to housing. And then 15% to the end game. So the future Michael, the future Lauren, your future family, retirement, investing, savings, all of that. And then 15% are no more than that to the extras. So allow yourself extras. Otherwise, you're just going to, you know, in the beginning of the year, somebody says, I cut out the morning latte, you'd be so proud of me. I'm like clipping coupons and whatever. I'm like, yeah, right, come May, they bought a Gucci purse. Okay. This is so

Where I get confused, though. You just broke up these percentages. My brain does not think of percentages. Think about it like this. If you make $100,000, so what you're saying, you make $100,000. Let's say, let's make $50,000. Basically, your housing should be 35% of 70. Was that like $12?

No, a little bit more, $17,000 or whatever. It should be your rent payment a year. Yeah. But, okay. So you broke down the percentages, but am I looking at these percentages per month on like the 30th or? am I looking at it per week? How do you make sure you're staying on track with these percentages? Well, you could do it either. And then if you're not making a consistent income, like a lot of

people don't freelancers, or if their income is precarious, if they're models or real estate agents or whatever, you can come up with a general estimate, either monthly, yearly, whatever that is, come up with a plan and set it and forget it. I don't look at stock charts all day long. I mean, I come up with a basic plan, index funds and chill, which we can get to or investing. Like, I don't day trade. There's none of that type of stuff. Index funds and chill.

Yeah, like you're probably not even looking at the market right now and stress at all. Yeah, same, right? You're just like, because you know you're not getting out of it anyway. But we'll get to this. But so debt, let's talk about debt, because I think so many people are overwhelmed by this and they carry credit card debt or they carry, you know, all sorts of different debt, student loans, whatever it may be. What is your first step or sets of advice to give someone to get out of debt?

Because it sounds like that's, and I think you would agree, that's the most important part is clearing your debt. Yeah. So not all debt is created equal. And when I got my first credit card, I got into a boatload of debt. I started at CNN when I was 21. I needed clothes, of course. And so got into $5,000 of credit card debt and figured out how to get out of it by

prioritizing to pulverize. And so if you look at all of your debt, you have to rank it by highest interest rate first. So let's say you have $100. bucks. Like you found a hundred bucks on the ground and you have, you know, a $100 magical student loan bill. Then you want to pay that off, rip it up. It's cathartic. Call it a day. Actually, you should take that $100. And if you have credit card debt and it's not a perfect number, you should put it toward that because that debt is accumulating the fastest. So the highest interest rate debt is always going to be credit card debt. So that's the thing you want to get rid of first. And then, you know, after that, if you have a car note or car loan,

then you want to attack that because car is a depreciating asset. So you don't want to be borrowing on that. And then a mortgage. And then finally your student debt because last. Yeah, last. You can creditors can take away your house. They can take away your car. They can't take away your brain.

Do you know that I never had a credit card until I got married? Like a debit card? I had a debit card where I would put my bartending tips. But I never had a credit card. But I want to talk about that as well. Yeah. Is that a bad thing? or a good thing. Well, it's probably good you didn't accumulate bad debt, but it's

weird, right? That you didn't build credit. But I built credit through leasing my car. Now, I just want to know if, yeah, I didn't, like I said, I don't know a lot about this. Is that a bad thing or a good thing? Or neither or. I think it's all case specific. I don't think it's a bad thing for you. I mean, has it hurt you in some way? No, but Michael said, Michael said, Michael said I needed one to even build my credit stronger. For a period of time, it wasn't helping her. right? Because she didn't, she didn't have a credit history, right? So like she couldn't utilize credit in the way she, you know, she couldn't have used credit if she wanted to. I mean, that's just. So would your former self have been responsible with that credit card? Would you have paid it off every month? I don't know. I just felt that I didn't, it was kind of like heroin. I just wasn't going to try it. Okay. You know what I mean? Like it was just I wasn't going to, it's not that I would or I wouldn't. I don't know. I just didn't want to. I just didn't want to. even try it. And because it just made me nervous. I would rather just take my tips, know how much I was making, put it in my debit card, and then build my credit with my lease payment for my car.

And I'm just wondering. Well, I think it is relevant to maybe scare some people that are carrying debt and paying the minimum thinking that that's okay. Because I think a lot of people just haven't done the math exercise to understand what that means. It means that it snowballs out of control. I mean, the compounding interest, we've been seeing how we've seen how we've seen how. We've seen how it's worked against us with credit cards. And the index funds in show, which we can get to, is how it can work in your favor. You can use that same force of compound interest where your money makes money for you, interest on top of interest. And you can use that same force in your favor. But yeah, if you were scared of using credit cards, then that's fine. You know, now have a credit

card, I assume, and pay it off every month? Or how does it work? Yeah. That's how it works. Yeah, I have a credit card and I pay it off. Yeah. So personally what Lauren and I do, we both carry credit cards, both on the business and personal, but every month we pay the balance in full. Okay. And we try not to spend more than we can afford to pay. Let me ask you this. Where is the, what is the best credit card to get if you're starting out? Like say you're 18 years old, you're out of high school, you want to get a credit card. What's the best one that you would recommend? So if you can't get a credit card, you can get a secured credit card, which is basically like a credit card with trading wheels. So you pay it off essentially in full. And then it's like a credit builder for you. And then as far as like which credit card, I mean, that's that's sort of up to you as to what you're going to need for points or whatever. Credit cards are awesome though if you can use them responsibly because they have all sorts of protections, like warranties that you don't even know about insurance or travel insurance and stuff like.

like that. If somebody steals your debit card, then you're fucked. If somebody steals your credit card, then you have a lot more protection. And also points, right? Yeah. Like points to trap. We had the points guy on and he was telling him. We have the same birthday. You do? You guys, we need to hear you guys do a podcast like a hundred times together. Yes. There's synergy, I feel like the best. So, so what you're saying is if you're going to get a credit card, make sure you look, you kind of look at all of the different ones before you pick. Totally. And, And your APR is negotiable. So the APR is your interest rate on your credit card. And even if you're paying that off in full or you think you are, you can always negotiate it. Just because it comes on a

fancy piece of paper, it doesn't mean it's gospel. So if they come back to you with a certain percentage, 15%, then you can negotiate that down. Not a lot of people know that and not a lot of people think that any of that is negotiable. And if you are using it responsibly, ideally you would want to not max it out because your credit score is calculated with your utilization rate, which is a fancy term for just saying how much you use of the credit available to you. So if you have a $10,000 credit limit, you should only be using about $2,000 because then the creditors, the people that are analyzing your credit score know that you're responsible with it. How important is your credit score? It's like your financial report card. It's connected to so much. I mean, it's connected

to whether you're getting a higher interest rate or not. Not a lot of people share their credit interest rate. You know, it's all based on how good your credit score is. This is a complicated subject because I think if you are in a place where you're not financially stable, maybe you're maxing cards or you're indebt or you're saving out. Like, maybe credit is not as important for you. And there's probably examples where it could work for you. But where it becomes very important for you is once you get a little financially stable and then you do want to go make that purchase on a home or you want to get that car, you want to get that thing, then it is very important because you could have good cash and good income, but if you

have terrible credit, like, one, it's going to affect your interest rate on your mortgage. And two, you might not even get approved. Well, some financial experts say don't have a credit score. Like use cash and have, you know, a zero credit score. And then I'm like, that is not realistic because shit happens, a pandemic happens. You get laid off. Stuff goes wrong. You want to have good credit just when you need it. And, you know, getting approved for an apartment or sometimes a job. Your credit score is basically like how responsible you are. And so the higher it is, it shows creditors. So whether those are the people giving you a mortgage or a credit card or a car note or a business loan or whatever kind of loan, just how responsible you are.

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now I have a financially stable job. I'm making an income. What would you tell those people in order to invest in their future? Like, where do they start? I know a lot of people say 10%. If you start doing a savings account, do you go into index funds? Like, how do you start telling people to structure their financial life? Starting with the reason as to why you're doing this, right? So The reason is because inflation typically is at 3% over time. Right now it's higher. And so you at least want to make more than that. So you're not essentially losing money in the future.

To clarify that, because I think people need to understand. Meaning if your money is sitting in a savings account and inflation's out of control like it is right now, your cash is actually becoming less valuable every day. That's right. Because you're not able to buy the same things tomorrow that you were yesterday. It's why your grandpa says like, hey, you see, get that for a nickel. Right? Obviously, you can't do that. Totally. So when we were kids, how much more movie tickets? Five bucks or something like that? And now they're, I don't even know, $20. That's inflation. And so you at least want to make sure that you're inflation proof in your money. And right now, interest rates are going up slightly, but you're not making that much money in a bank account. So you have to do something else to at least make 3% so that you're not losing money. If you go in knowing that, you want to protect yourself. The more you're making with interest, the risk you're, it becomes. So in the second part of Miss Independent, my last book, I talk about different things you

can do based on risk. So the lowest risk is the lowest reward. So savings accounts, CDs, money market funds, money market accounts. Those are all sort of like growing on top of each other. Which is probably where the majority of like people's parents and grandparents tell them to put their savings. Right. Exactly. So a CD is certificate of deposit. You go to a bank. You tie up your money, they give you a little bit more of an interest rate in order to do stuff with your money. And then you get to index funds and then beyond that, there's more risky stuff, crypto and other things. So when I say index funds and chill, I am all about index funds or ETF and chill. And so what is an index fund? Have we heard on the news like the Dow is up, the Dow is down,

the NASDAQ is up or the S&P 500? Those are all indexes. And so you guys, like I'm not just telling you what you said e what f i'm gonna i'll be the guinea pig here guy i i e what so etf is an exchange traded fund okay people are probably laughing at me no you're not they're not they're not they're not the same thing it's like it was my bad you guys are like speaking japanese it's it totally sounds like japanese when you first start it's true and then it's like you go to japan and you don't speak the language you'd be super confused if you go to wall street you don't speak the language of money you'll be super confused until you speak it and you're like done that's not complicated anymore. And just for people like high level, why people start to freak out when

the market's up or down is if most people with money are investing in these markets. And obviously, and you see a downturn like this if you're not diversified and you're not investing, as you say, a lot of your net worth and your cash is now off the table, especially if you sell, right? So that's why people are freaking out up and down, up and down, right? I do love Charlie Munger. I do. I love Charlie Munger. What's an ETF? I love Charlie Munger. And you've talked to me about how they seem to not give energy if it's up or down and if it's down they buy. Yeah, because it's on sale. Okay. So let's like go with this because I get this. So high level, maybe we can talk about, we've talked about savings accounts and, you know, money market and all that

stuff, but we can maybe talk about index funds because I think this is what I proclaim and I never tell people which ones, but say like if you have savings and you're starting to, like I think this is best. I would tell me if I'm wrong. I think this is a blanketly, the best bet for the majority of people that don't want to get into day trading and picking individual stocks. Which he shouldn't if you're just starting. Yeah. I mean, I had a lot of slips into my DMs about what to buy in the pandemic. Zoom or Peloton or whatever, crypto, this and that. No, no, no stock picking, especially if you're just starting out. There's no get rich quick anything. There's like an old dad joke if you want to double your money folded in half. Like,

there's no get rich quick thing, period, end of story. And so it takes a minute. And And so index funds, over time, the market has returned 7% inflation adjusted, right? So if you're trying to make more than 3%, you need to make more than inflation in order to just keep the same amount of money. So that's why going toward the market over time and not the day-to-day stuff, which you need to put your blinders on or take a volume or whatever you need to do and not look at it because over time, that's what it's yielded. Can you correct me if I butcher this?

But, and Lauren, we're in index fund. So the way that this works is... Okay, Michael, I'm not that. Come on. I know we're in index fund. Say you have like the S&P 500. Tell me if I'm wrong. They take the top 500 performing companies and you have basically unlimited upside.

Amazon goes and they grow, grow, grow, great. But if the number 500 starts to crash and tumble, it is replaced by something that's below it. So you have limited downside. Is that correct? Yeah. Because so the Dow is like the 30 biggest stocks. The SMP 500 is the 500 or 500 and five technically biggest companies and or stocks. And so yeah, absolutely when if they go in the shitter, then they get replaced. It gets replaced. And the other thing is you're and maybe you could talk about this. You're very, you're diversified in these index funds because so for right now targets tumbling. Yeah. Right. But if you're in an index fund, all of your net worth is not tied to target. Maybe that's like one percent.

or 0.25% of your overall index funds. So you get the benefit when it's carrying up, but when it's going down, it doesn't drag your whole net worth down because other things are still carrying. So you have a little piece of all of those 500 companies, essentially, but without having to buy all of them. So there's not one place people should buy is what you're saying. It's like it's not a get rich quick. You don't want to just go for Zoom. You want to spread it across. That's right. Okay, this might be the most stupid question you've ever heard in your life. talking about my friend like that. How does one even go about buying an index funds? Like such a good question. Is there an app? Like, do I call, do I call a 1-800 number?

What am I doing here? It's such a good question. So in all my books, I'm like, here's step by step, literally get a brokerage. So there's a difference between a bank and a brokerage. So the bank is where you put your savings. A brokerage is like, again, I'm not recommending one or the other. The one that you should go to is the one that you like. For whatever reason, you like the UX, UI of the app, I don't care. Like, you like the colors, get after it. Schwab, E-Trade, ally, those are all places that you can buy index funds or E-TFs. So-Fidelity, wealth, from places like that. Exactly. So you get it. So, okay, so basically- Wait, hold on, hold on, hold on. So you pick the app and then what? No, it's not just the app.

Do I log in? Yeah, then log in. Okay. So like, you download, step by front or Schwab or whatever. Download that. Set up an account. Take some money from your bank account. Transfer that into your brokerage account and then buy an index fund. So there are a lot of different tickers. SPY is one of them. I'm not suggesting it. There's a bunch. They're all essentially the same. But where I think this gets interesting and this is where I think this is going to be a huge unlock for a lot of people listening. Say, you know, they made $1,000 this month in their paycheck. How much you suggesting they set aside. And what I think is interesting and what a great hack is, is when we started implementing this years ago, it's like you pick a percentage and it goes into

that brokerage account and you just don't even think about it or touch it. It's almost like it's not your money anymore. But it is. Yeah. 15% ideally or any percent. You could do 5%. You can do 2%. You can do 1%. You can do $100. It doesn't even matter. Hello, can we talk about Warren Buffett for a second. Warren Buffett said the greatest investment Americans can make our low-cost S&P 500 index funds. Warren Buffett, your BFF, put in his will to his own wife to put a majority of their money in index funds. Do I have a will that says stuff like that?

Yes, which we could talk about it. But does your will give me Warren Buffett vibes? Yeah. But I think in what she's touching on is this is like that said it and forget it. And I think this would benefit so many of our listeners where they, you know, so many people like, where do I save? Where do I invest? And if you have this brokerage account and you're in these index funds, you literally don't have to look at it.

Like it could automatically every month go out of your checking account there. It's automatically invested and you're done. That's it. Because and the reason that Warren were on first new basis, it Warren and Charlie say stuff like this is because it's really, really hard to beat the market. It's hard for any of these fund manager folks who have, you know, like a publicist or whatever and saying they're making so much more than what the market is returning. 7% inflation adjusted to actually work. Any hedge fund who says they're going to beat the market, historically, you invest in the market because it doesn't require work. It's hard to beat it. So just join it. Okay. This is another stupid question. Once you're all signed up.

I'm not answering any more questions. If they're prefaced with they're stupid. This is an intelligent question. Perfect. Is this an app that you're checking like Instagram and and adding to every day? like is how much do you have to water your index fund? Like do you check it once a week? Do you check it every morning, every night? What does that look like? The great intelligent. Beautiful question. Nicole, Michael doesn't say that when I ask questions like this. Oh God. Here we go. Michael's like, Lauren, don't say that out loud in front of anywhere. We're going to go in a tangent. No, what did I say that about the other day? No, he says that all the time. He goes, Lauren, you can't ask that question. I can ask the question. I don't mind to look. I'm going to remember the question and it was something that

we should pretend we'd never. No, I'm learning about it. I'm asking as I learned. It had nothing to do with finance or something even crazier. But anyways, go ahead. So you're asking about rebalancing. And so it's kind of like pruning a hedge, right? You don't do it all the time. But like when it gets out of control, you want to trim it. So it's organized. Right. And so once a year or something, if you have a certain amount set in stocks versus bonds. So like a really easy way to determine And stocks versus bonds is take your age in bonds and then do the rest in stocks, for instance. I'm 38. So like 40% let's say in bonds would be something that's textbook.

And then the rest in stocks because stocks are more risky. And so the older you get, the less risky you want to be. And so at the end of the year, if you look and you're like, okay, well, now, you know, 45% are in bonds based on how the market has gone. Then you want to trim a little bit of that to get back to the 40%. percent that you had started with. And so at the end of the year, you kind of rebalance. You don't really look at it. I don't look at it often. One of my friends put a bunch of money into Facebook. It was doing well. And then he needed money. So he took stuff out of Facebook. After how long?

It was quick. Do you recommend like making money quick in index funds and taking it out? No. Okay. I would love for you to speak on patients. Patience is a whole other thing. And for doctors and not for me. But for staying in any investment for tax reasons is really, really important. Okay. So if you sell anything before a year, then you're paying short-term capital gains tax. And all that means is that you're paying a shitload in taxes. And if you sell after a year, you're not.

You're paying at ordinary income. So what you would normally pay with the rest of your money. And so, you know, when people are doing all this like game stop stuff, I had somebody on my show who made a million dollars, you know, in a few days, but then got totally fucked by taxes. And probably had no idea that they even had the tax obligation. Huge, huge taxes. If they had kept it for a year, but that's not how those types of thing.

The stocks worked, then they wouldn't. What's old crusty ball sack financial advice that people in your space keep saying that you disagree with? I know you mentioned the latte. But like, what are some things that you're just like, this is so outdated? How are they not evolving and pivoting? The idea that you should buy a house. I think a house is a home. It's a place to nest your face off. It has all sorts of psychological things. A house is not a good investment. Your primary house is not a good investment. This is a huge, I think, misconception in the Balsack financial world. it's when they say like you can make a killing in your house.

There is that misconception because inflation is not accounted for. When you say grandma bought a house for 50 grand and then sold it for 250 grand, when grandma bought that house movie tickets were 15 cents or whatever. 50 grand was worth the 250 grand. That's right. And that's not what's accounted for. And you guys now know, right? You look in the mirror and you're the landlord.

You don't get that back. You put a bunch of money into your house that you're not going to get back. When people say that renting is like throwing money away and like there is a cost of living. It's like saying food is throwing a money away because you literally poop it out. Like there is a cost that you have to pay to live and you might not get all of it back. And that's okay. Also with leasing, I have like a different mindset on this. I get bored with things and sometimes I don't want to keep them.

Like I might get bored with Michael and want a second husband. Like I want things to be like like so I'll figure out the financial literacy part first. I know. I'm taking fucking notes. I got you. I'm going to call Nicole. If we ever get divorced, I'm going to call Nicole. Yeah, I mean, call somebody.

Okay. Call anyone. Call the police. Don't even know. I'm attracted to leasing when it comes to like I loved when I leased my apartments when I was single. Wait to put it out there too. Lauren and I, this, I mean, we bought a condo, but that was different because we were

using it as an income property. But this is the first home that we bought. And we did it for very different reasons than for an investment. Right. Like we did it because we had a kid. We wanted to move. We knew like I look at this as a luxury at this point. And I also look at it as a big money pin. Like the yard has to be done. This maintenance thing. Something breaks here. Like people don't account for all of those things too. And also they don't account for the unexpected. Right. Like there's stuff all the time that we have to fix in the house that changes. If you were, if I was just renting, you could just call the landlord enough to worry about it. Yeah, and this opportunity cost idea, right? So a lot of people become house poor. So let's say they've saved their money, they save

$200 grand and buy a million dollar house. And then they have no money left in savings. And then God forbid something happens. You can't go to the grocery store or to Sun Life with your mortgage. You just can't. And so what ends up happening is that you tie up all of your money in bricks and mortar. I don't know what houses are made of, all the stuff that houses are made of, and then you have no money left. Where, at essence, you could take that money. And I talk about a lot of celebrities in this book. Beyonce's dad is hilarious if you go online and watch some of his videos about bringing sexy back to renting, because you can take that 200 grand and make a lot more with it if you invest it. I totally agree. And also, like I said, I get bored. Maybe one day I want to live, you know,

here and the next day I want to live there. And you can switch it up. Maybe one day you want a fireplace. And the next day, you're like, no, I don't want a fireplace. I want a great backyard. Can you talk about that for a bit? Like, say you're buying a $500,000 house and you're putting $100,000 down. Can you talk about what that $100,000 could actually potentially do in an index fund over, let's say, a period of 10, 15 years? Yeah. So I'll give you an easy example.

And I'm not even talking about a lot of money. You don't need a lot of money to start. You need the most time possible. Nobody in the history of the world has ever been upset that they invested early. earlier. No one has ever said, I'm glad I didn't invest earlier, right? If you start when you're 25 and put a hundred bucks in an S&P 500 index fund that tracks the market, by the time you're 65 and the time you retire, you have a million dollars. If you start just 10 years later when you're 35 and you still put that hundred bucks in the market, and that's only a $12,000 difference. So $100 times 12 months

year times $10, it's $12,000. You have $350,000 by the time you're $60,000. Because that extra years of 10 years of compounding interest is astronomical. Totally. And $350,000 is a lot of money. It's not a million bucks. And you're missing out on that time. So when you're younger, I think that's the time you should be putting your money to work for you more so. Yep. It's one of my bigger, and you can't even really call it a regret, but I was never taught these things. Like I went on this whole thing, you know, when I was about 27, 28 where I started reading like every like your types of books. Right. I started to. learning because nobody teaches people in school, which is a shame. Parents didn't really teach, you know, a lot of people think that investing in the market is picking individual stocks. They don't know about index. And I really wish that somebody had taught me because I would have been investing. And I was making money since I was, you know, 18 years old. So I would have been

doing it since then. And I tell all of our young friends and, you know, her sister, my sister, like start now because it's such an advantage. Yeah. Have you started one for Saza? Yep. We have. Cool. Yeah, we have. That's news to me. No, Zoss's It's awesome. If you want to be efficient, just marry a husband that knows this. No, that's horrible advice. I'm just kidding.

Which leads me to my next question. Do we need a secret fund away from our husbands? And how do we do it? Michael, plug your ears. Like, do we need like a fun that we're like funneling money into just in case he does something creepy fund? I come from the school of Hard Knocks and that I've always, always had to have my own back in life. And so I'm not going to give advice that is all super buttoned up

and probably what everyone else is going to say. And I think yes, I think yes, you should always have your own back. No matter what, you could be in love. You know, you could stay together forever. Fantastic. I also really advocate for preempts. I love this discussion. And I love taking back the narrative, right? Because a lot of women say, oh, he's asking me for a pre-nip. No, bitch. Like, you bring up a pre-up. You've worked really hard. You've created. your own equity. You, I mean, people are marrying later in life. And so if you flip it around and say, no, I want to have a pre-up, then I think it changes the power dynamic. It's more empowering. And so typically, I would say for any relationship, you should have this financial talk at different

stages. When you're moving in together, you should figure out whose name the bills are under because the person who's name is not on the bills is not accumulating credit if the bills are paid on time. The bills aren't paid on time and your name is on the bills and your credit is fucked. I've advised a lot of women going through divorce who've been in both situations. And then when you get married, you know, split it up. I say yours, mine and hours. So joint account and separate accounts. And so sometimes, you know, you're going to have a situation where you make a lot different amounts of money. So instead of putting the same percentage in, I like to wait, wait it. No, instead of putting the same amount, I like to weight it. So putting 10% in feels the same to somebody making $100,000 versus

a million bucks. And so you're putting it into like all the shared stuff. And then you have your own accounts. When I got out of the hospital, I wanted things to be real comfortable, especially because it's hot in Austin. And Tommy John sent me a bunch of their pajamas and their tagless bras. And I was comfortable. I was letting everything hang out. They sent like dresses, t-shirts, all these comfortable clothes. When I'm home, I am like just wanting to be comfortable. That's all I care about. There's nothing worse than having like a bra that's digging into your back. And Tommy John has all the things. They have sold 17 million pairs. That is crazy of their comfortable clothes. People love their underwear, their lounge wear, their bras. If you're about comfort like me, this is it. This was like the

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Another thing I think that you could speak on is like a Teresa Judi's situation where her husband was just giving her papers with things to sign and she was signing. I can see how that happened. Like everyone was like, I can't believe she signed all this paperwork and she ended up in jail. I could see how your husband could be like, hey, or wife. Or wife. They sign this. Like it's for like the con make something up, whatever. And people sign it. Like how much due diligence should we be putting into what we're signing, what we're doing? The bill one was a great tip. Are you paying your bills on time?

Yeah. And they're in our name. And we have, you have personal and joined and they both get money. But the thing is you need to know whether I, do even know what our accounts are? Yeah, I do. Do you know the password? I think I could guess. Yeah, you probably can. But don't announce it on the show. Let's not do that. Okay. I'm just being honest. But how important is it that we're like being our own, and you mentioned this a little bit earlier, but like signing stuff, how important is it that we're being our own sort of cheerleader and guru within the relationship with money?

It's so important. Even if somebody else is handling it and it's fine. Like divide and conquer it. You should definitely still know what's going on, even if somebody handles it. So like go over together maybe once a year, all the accounts. else. Oh my God. I would love it. Sit down. Do you have a financial advisor? You know the throw-up emoji? No, I'm going to. You're inspiring me. Oh, no, you're inspiring me. Good. You can tell me off air which banking I should go to to do my own private way. I want to pivot here and talk about. Offshore. I don't what I want to pivot here and talk about. So say somebody is now, they've got their index funds. They've got this kind of state. Whatever mistakes you see people making.

With investing? But not just with investing, but just their whole financial life. Say, you know, they finally have got a little nest day. It's like, where do you see people going wrong? Lately, it's with crypto. Go off. Perfect show. Here, I'm going to sit back and file my nails. The finance pros, like, yeah, I have words for them. I think it's really, it's really dangerous. Crypto is the riskiest of all. And so, yeah, there are other risky investments. I talk about reits, even you can invest in real estate by not having a house or not having people live in a house investment property isn't for everyone. I don't like to deal with humans a lot and being their landlord. So you can invest in different things that could be risky. Crypto is the riskiest of all of them. And so I think if you're going into crypto, limit it to 1% of your net worth. And everybody has a net worth. It's not just for rich people. So it's your assets minus your liability. So everything you own minus everything you owe is your net worth. And so if you want to play with crypto, crypto, Bitcoin, then 1% know more than that, in my opinion. And so you can afford to lose

1% of your net worth. You kind of can't afford, in quotes, to miss out on the growth if 1% becomes 100%. But it is super, super risky. And that's what I'm worried about right now. When you go to Vegas, do you gamble? I'm just curious, as someone who's so into money, do you gamble? I have an ex that was a big gamble. So it's not for you. That's not my name. Okay. But I just have a side question.

I'm just wondering. I've been at the blackjack tables all night. Okay. I was just wondering. Michael, Michael likes, what do you like poker? Yeah,

but I mean, well, poker I categorize a little bit differently. That's a debate, but I would argue it's a game of skill. But I'll go to Vegas sometimes. And if I'm having fun, like I'm going with the expectation

that I'm probably losing, but I'm not in it. I'm playing for fun with friends or whatever, having a couple. Like, I think it's different. I don't ever go there with the expectation like this is a money-making endeavor for me. If it happens, great.

But if I lose it, it's not something I'm losing sleep over. Yeah, it's part of your fun money. It's your 15% fun stuff. Manny Petty poker, whatever does for you. Manny Petty, Michael. What's a story and you don't have to name names of a celebrity or influencer or someone that people think is so wealthy, but you've seen behind the scenes? I feel like you've seen things that a lot of people haven't seen.

maybe you can kind of expose like sometimes what's actually going on. I mean, forget about being house poor. I mean, a lot of people are poor, poor and don't have any savings or don't have any nest egg. And kind of, you know, just like we've all seen on social media, make it out to be something else. Like renting private jets as scenes to take pictures on. Like, it's all gross. You can do that. You can rent a private jet just to take the photo.

Yeah. I think a lot of people too, and this is where a lot of people, I think, get in trouble is they think that the money spicket is always going to be there, right? And I've been through personally a couple cycles where things are going very well and you just think it's going to keep going, going, going. And I think same, like podcast-based influencers. Like you never know when it's going to dry up or market's going to turn or it's going to get tough or even like overnight, maybe an industry is going to get obliterated.

And so people that think that it's never going to end and the cash is going to keep coming and they're not investing as they're making cash. That's always the saddest to me, right? It's like someone's worked so hard. They've made a killing. They haven't invested. They haven't saved. They have debt. And then all of a sudden it dries up. But they solve the debt. I mean, I think it was Kim Basinger who bought like a town and then went bankrupt. I mean, there are so many celebrities who do that and sports figures when the going is good. Athletes. Yeah. And again, it goes back to the thing. That's not about how much you make. And yes, You have this great earning potential, but it's how much you keep that really matters in the end of the day.

Because also there's this thing called lifestyle creep. You guys have experienced those. Tell us about this. Tell us. So when you get a raise or, you know, you come into a windfall, which is the fancy word for making more money, whether it's an inheritance or, you know, a good night in Vegas or whatever, then your lifestyle goes up. So the things that were nice to haves are now need to have. So like daycare was a nice to have. and now it's just the baseline or other things within a house that used to be nice to

haves are now just like bottom line. And so the more you make and the more your lifestyle goes up, the less you actually really have. I think people who get raises should try to live by the standard of living that they had before because that's really where you're making money. If you make money and then everything goes up there you're spending, it's a wash. That is such a good point. It's like experience stretching. That's a really, really good point. Experience stretching. What's that? Well, people that listen are going to get mad at me, but it's experience stretching is like you and I could be walking on the beach one day and say like, this is the best experience we've ever had. And then a year goes by and you're walking on a different beach and you maybe have a glass of wine. Like, this is going to be so great. And then another time goes by and you're like on a boat by that beach. And you're happy, happy, happy, happy. And you just keep leveling, leveling, leveling. And then one day, you know, maybe losing. You're on that same beach that used to make you the happiest in the world. It actually depresses you because you've stretched it so far that. something that used to be something that was this great experience is now something that's actually a source of pain or depression. And that's basically what people do with lifestyle

creep too. We were just talking about it on the show. There was a time when we're all like, you know, right out of high school, broke college kids, living with roommates, best time of your life, right? No money, but drinking shitty paps beer or whatever it was. But it was like the best time ever. Noddy light, Chuck. Yeah. And if you went back to that now as a 35, whatever year old You might think that this is the worst, most depressing experience in the world. And I think people forget, they forget out to contextualize these kind of moments in life, especially when you get a raise or a big windfall or cash or whatever. Why are people going to be mad at you?

Well, because they've just heard me to talk about that story a few times. Oh, I like that story. Do you think more money, more problems? It depends. Money is a tool. It can be used like a hammer to build a house or to tear it down. It can be used like superpowers for good or evil. It's really how you use it.

I think in the end of the day, money without meaning is just paper or numbers in your bank account. Bankruptcy. When is it strategic for someone to declare bankruptcy or do you advise against it completely? It's really, really tough to come back from bankruptcy. I think there has been a lot of rhetoric that bankruptcy just makes everything magically go away, all of your credit card debt. it really can screw you for a lot of years. So that's something you have to weigh very, very carefully and talk to experts about with your specific situation. If someone wanted to like hire you as an expert, I'm sure you're packed jammed now. What is what would you say is the is the

expertise? Do you look at someone's finances, their banks, everything? Like what do you look at when you're looking at someone's finances. Yeah, it's important to do it holistically. And also, you don't need to be rich to have a financial advisor. By the way, not all financial people are created. I want you to talk about this. So you must, must, must find a fiduciary. Ask if this person is a fiduciary because they're working for you and not for the stuff they're selling. And there's a legal obligation. Yes. So it's a difference between like a stylist and a woman at the bloomies. So the woman at Blumies is working on commission, working to sell you the stuff. The stylist, you pay a flat fee.

Or a butcher versus a dietician. The dietitian is working for you, and then the butcher just wants to sell their stuff. Right. And so a fiduciary is working for you for a flat fee. A broker or somebody like that, vice president of blah blah, blah, blah bank is selling their own stuff. And so if you're looking for a financial advisor and you can, there's a lot of of great ones out there. You don't need to go all the time. You can treat it like a personal trainer also. Go get the moves. Do it yourself. And go, you know, once a year if you want.

I'm trying to get Peter Malook to come on here, but we haven't aligned schedules. He's a fiduciary, right? So. Yeah. Nicole, do you have a fiduciary? Fiduciary? Faduciary. Sounds like a douche. Do you have a fiduciary yourself? Or do you feel like you're, a fiduciary yourself? Or do you feel like you're so skilled with money that you don't even need that. Oh, I totally do. Yeah, and I talk about that because shrinks need shrinks. Trainers need trainers. Absolutely. I think that's very, very, very smart. So say someone knows nothing about money. They pick up your book, Miss Independent. What are they going to get out of it? It's a 12-step situation. Tell us what they can expect after closing the book, the value that they're going to extract. Well, all of the jargon stuff I define,

hopefully in plain English. I think. going into growing wealth is a really important thing to start as soon as possible and know what you're working toward. So goals have price tags, but not a lot of people even know how much money they want or what their number is for, you know, when they retire or whatever. You know, somebody says to me, hey, I just want a million dollars. Cool. Maybe you need more than million dollars. Maybe you need less than a million dollars. First, figure out the life you want and then reverse engineer to figure out how to get the money to live the life you want. That is really, really good advice.

That is great advice because you're right. People are wishy-washy. Michael and I were just talking about this the other day. Gary V put out a video where he was like, 35-year-olds will come to me and be like, I want to sell my company for $100 million. But there's no context of the hundred. It's just like a number that they shot out of their asshole. I think that's really, really smart to have like what kind of lifestyle do you want?

How do you want to live? do you want to own a yacht or do you want to own a boat or do you want to just own a house? Like whatever it is, like you should really have a clear picture and work backwards. I think that's good advice. Or rent a boat. Or rent a boat. Because sometimes these goals that you think you have are without, without, not within your reach. And that's not always true.

You have to kind of double click on what you really want to use that for. Is it a boat like once a year? Can you then rent a boat? And how much does the yacht cost? And I actually break those down too. Can you get like a helicopter rental every once in a while? And does that fulfill it? They're not as expensive as you might think.

Also, if you buy a boat and I've been observing this, Michael Bostic, it seems like it's a lot of fucking maintenance and work. So is a house. That's what that's, I think that's a misconception. People don't know. So is a house. Like any kind of thing that you have to manage, right? And that you're responsible for that is potentially a depreciating asset because you

never know if it's appreciating is, is work, right? Like, I mean, now, like, that house takes up a good amount of my time, right? Like, I got to figure out the maintenance. I got to figure out the lands guy. Like, when you rent, you don't have to think about any of this stuff. Yeah. You furnish it.

You leave and leave it or something. And we had our condos, we'd just, like, lock the door, leave. I don't even think about it. Now I go, like, oh, what's going on here? They're like, people don't think about that stuff. I mean, it's really important to think about it. And I also, to your point, the best guy to be is the best friend of the guy that owns the boat, right? You know, all of these things. Yeah, exactly. Before you go, can you speak on

the difference between being rich and being wealthy? Hmm. So I think poor people stay poor by acting like they're rich and rich people or wealthy people stay wealthy by acting like they're poor. And so oftentimes the wealthiest people are the ones you don't even realize because they're the millionaires next door that aren't, you know, shooting their wad load on like the newest, coolest bags and things like that, but are actually buying assets and not liabilities. My boyfriend, Warren Buffett, goes to McDonald's every day. He gets a $3 burger. No, Omaha.

Yeah, he gets a $3 burger and a Coca-Cola. He doesn't have any name brands or a Hermes belt. Well, I mean, he also may be a little bit of a freak of nature because he doesn't. If he's really eating that much McDonald's and like still kicking and going. I love him. I love the just deposition of Warren Buffett eating McDonald's. Nothing makes me happier than that. And you know, I love how he wears the same shirt every day.

He's so cute. Warren, call me. You can teach me about money. Warren, warn, call me on shit. Okay. So who needs your book? Where can you find your book?

Tell us your Instagram account. What can we get from your Instagram account if we know nothing about money? Give us all the details. You can find me at Nicole Lapin, wherever social media is served. And I talk about, you know, what's going on right now in the economy and the market and what you need to know and call bullshit on stuff that is bullshit. What's coming up for you? In what sense? This weekend. What's coming up for you with your business? Like, what are we going to see from you? I feel like we're going to see big things. Thank you. You know, I've reached a lot of goals already. And so now I just, I really am all about helping. my former self, the girl who was so, so clueless and didn't know anything. And I'm not here to, you know, make friends with all the financial services companies. I'm here to like tell the real

story about, you know, the lies that we've been told. Like the, you know, we don't learn this stuff in school. And so it's a huge issue that we, you know, even go to fancy colleges like I did and learn about, you know, macro economics and not know how to write a check or something coming out of it. And so it's become my mission. I know it sounds polly. And But it's become my mission to make financial literacy accessible. I have six more books coming out, which won't be 10 altogether. 10 and a half. Is a journal a book? That's like a baby. Like a half baby. Is it? Oh my God. Yeah. And you were the Vala Victorian. Is that how you say it? Yeah. The Western, which is a big fucking deal. That's a hard school. I have so much respect for you because I think

you're totally disrupting this industry. You're making it sexy. If you look at you, you would never even like think oh my gosh she's so smart with finance it's probably a tool that you use in your toolbox when you go in the boardroom i love being underestimated if michael and i divorce i'm gonna call you and warren charlie can come to i'm gonna i'm gonna marry warren kill mary fuck i don't know if you're gonna be doing any of that with any of those guys at this point i can i can probably say that sprinkle a little viagra but you know i i definitely think everybody should go check you out and dive into all of your stuff because i know we bounced around here a lot and cover different things. Some of them high level. Someone kind of, if you're not familiar,

it could maybe seem not as digestible. But all of this stuff, and I just want to reiterate, is a lot simpler at times than it sounds, right? And anyone can implement it at any stage. Totally. Retirement, insurance. I mean, it goes on and on. And it changes, you know, at different stages of your life. And so there are women who have rich bitch for years and go back and like check different sections out because you know some things will be relevant to you at different points in your life everyone go get your own fund miss independent the simple 12 step plan to start investing and grow your own wealth Nicole where can everyone find your Instagram and can we do a giveaway of your book signed copy let's do it okay at Nicole Lappin

love it you guys go follow her and tell us your favorite part of this episode on my latest post at Lauren Bostic go check out her book I would also recommend rich bitch which is I found you in the first place. And thank you for my birthday flowers. Thanks, Nicole. Step it up, Michael. Yeah, step it up, Michael. Do you want to win a signed copy of Nicole Lapin's New York Times bestselling book?

All you have to do is tell us your favorite part of this podcast on my latest post at Lauren Bostick. And definitely check out Nicole's podcast. It's called Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin. Thanks for listening. And we'll see you next time. Apple Crunchables have saved our lives. I'm not joking. There have been so many meltdowns and tantrums in airports, on walks. For no reason.

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