The Boyscast with Ryan Long - ANDREW DOYLE On Titania McGrath, Old Gays VS New Gays, & Working With John Cleese

Episode Date: December 20, 2022

Andrew Doyle is a writer, news host, and comedian most known for his satirical Twitter account Titania McGrath. SUPPORT THE BOYSCAST: https://www.patreon.com/theboyscast http://ryanlongcomedy.com MERCH - ryanlongstore.com Ryan @ryanlongcomedy Danny @dannyjokes Andrew @andrewdoyle34 LEAVE US A FIVE STAR REVIEW! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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The Homies! Just the Boys cast! The Dudes! It's the Eagles! Just the Boys cast! The Boys cast! I very much like your videos, so I'm very excited. Oh, thank you, man. Boris Vest and it was like, but it went like crazy viral. But then this week, I wrote an article as her which she tweeted out

and I got a lot of flack for it because she was comparing Elon Musk to Hitler and everything. Then the Jerusalem Post wrote this thing saying that I was stirring up hate and violence.

Oh buddy, right now that's a hot topic. I didn't understand it. I was like, but we're making the same point. Making the same point but you're making it from a satirical standpoint.

And they even acknowledged that it was satire. I saw that. And then they said, look at all these hate crimes on the rise and sort of blaming me. And I was like,

this is weird. I don't understand that. Is that your first time you're getting in trouble by the, like, any of the Jewish organizations? Yeah,

this never happened to me before. They're hot right now, man. Oh, okay. That's his people. That's my people who are out there. I was quite surprised. Danny said that

before he came on. He goes, I don't know if we want to this guy's a little anti-semitic I mean, maybe I can be if you want me to do I generally do the heavy lifting. Okay. Okay. Okay in the self-loathing For to tell you about you guys hasn't that account been suspended a bunch loads of times, right? Yeah, right. I was wondering about that because with all the Twitter files are are you back now yeah yeah but i like i said i don't generally tweet how come you're out of the game this should be the golden year with i know i'm too busy i'm too honestly i've got all this other stuff i'm doing so i'm just too busy you know did you put a ton of effort into those tweets yeah ages i mean like it was you know the thing is it's been going for

a while okay so this is in the past yeah i mean i'll do it every i only do it now if something really annoys me and i just think of something and i'll just do it that's fine i don't mind but i i just it's a distraction yeah yeah you also pioneered that thing and then i imagine there's like a lot of people who kind of copy it as well i don't i mean there's a lot of those sorts of accounts now so i don't know how effective it is yeah but although it seems to annoy people still so maybe i should do i bet you you should see if you could get uh some connections to see you like do you see what the twitter files where they released all that well again stuff yeah i saw it i mean i reported on it for my show because i've got a show on a tv channel yeah a news channel

and uh i was reporting on it mostly because no one else was that people are just aren't talking about it in in uh britain no the bbc has not mentioned the twitter files twitter files at all not once really and the bb BBC is our state broadcaster. They haven't mentioned it once. We're Canadian, so we have CBC. Okay, that's probably worse. I mean, I'm not making assumptions here. It is.

It is worse, yeah. Yeah, don't make fucking assumptions. All about the assumptions. Of course. Are we doing it? Are we starting? Yeah, is that cool? Oh, yeah, fine.

I didn't realize. I didn't realize. Normally, people do like an introduction and I understand oh now I've got to perform yeah I'm sorry I could have said anything then I could have been really

in New York we're fucking I mean if you said anything fuck we could have I could have libeled all sorts of people because I I thought we were

off the record oh okay no no no is that a problem did you did you not want on the record you talking shit

about the Jews like that I well no that was confusing though because their point was that you shouldn't I gave a half introduction Did you not want on the record you talking shit about the Jews like that? Well, no. That was confusing, though, because their point was that you shouldn't. I gave a half introduction. Is it Andrew Doyle to Tanya McGrath? Now he's got a fancy news show. You're like a proper news anchor.

Right. What do you call a presenter? So, yeah, it's a channel called GB News. And I've got a show that's a weekly show. And I just talk about the things that I want to talk about, really. But the Twitter files, I really wanted to mention, because like I say, the BBC not mentioning it, and I know over here MSNBC haven't mentioned it,

and also it doesn't really make sense. Basically, anybody where it makes them look bad, they just ignore it. But it's newsworthy, surely. Of course. Of course it's newsworthy. It's so funny, too, because a lot of it was just confirming

what people already thought. But that was a lot of it was just confirming what people yeah already thought yeah but that was me where i was just like i've i to be honest like looking at all the twitter stuff there wasn't any real part of it where i was like what when everything you're kind of like i guess yeah we all to what we were all suspecting yeah of course but it's but having it confirmed like that and seeing it in black and white it's and the play-by-play of the trump thing was yeah pretty it was like kind of interesting yeah to see that it's worthy to i mean again if it was on the other foot yeah but i mean the trump the trump covering heavily the trump team were also asking twitter to delete tweets yeah yeah but they just weren't doing it because they didn't support him, right? Yeah, yeah, we'll get right on that, pal.

Exactly. The orange man wants a tweet gun. But this shouldn't be a, isn't it a partisan issue? I mean, if either side are doing it, a collusion between a politician and big tech, that's bad. Sure.

So it doesn't matter who it is. Well, I think the problem is, you know, obviously a case can be made that all of this might have potentially influenced the results of the election maybe it didn't it wouldn't have swayed it but it could have i mean influenced it yeah although so the people who won why do they want to talk it's like almost understandable okay that but i'm not even i mean that is very serious if it's election interference but really for me

the point the bottom line is yeah what's the wildest part about it it's it's it's just you firstly you it's news it's politicians saying uh basically it's preventing other people from reading a news article because they don't think it's flattering to their team right so it doesn't matter about the substance of the news article i've been in rows on twitter about this people say why are you so obsessed with hunter biden's dick why why are you and i'm not i haven't seen it oh you are have you have you have you seen it? I've seen it. It's a nice one, is it? It's a nice one, yeah. Okay, well, then I might become obsessed with it.

So I'm going down the slide. You described it as tasty, was it? It was going down. He had the photo of him sliding down this slide. Really? There was a video of him going down the slide with like two escorts and a pool. He's a party boy.

But why? No one cares about that. No one cares. They care about the idea that someone can, the politicians, because you can't read this article because you couldn't even share the link, even in a DM. I know.

The DM ones are fucking wild. And the thing with the council for, I don't know if you saw the Jim Baker. So the guy who was the council for Twitter, like the head legal council for Twitter up until like a week ago, was up until 2018, week ago yeah was up until 2018 the legal counsel at the FBI yes I did say that so you're like that's

just regardless of what you think about any of this like the the fact that that person is clearly biased and compromised and all that stuff and then is you know doing this goes from FBI to Twitter it's maddeninging is how how political it all became and now but now people are sort of just lying about it like elton john said he's leaving the platform because it's full of disinformation now what what this is what you're talking about lots of people saying it's crawling with fascists now i haven't seen them that's fine that's funny out and john coming back from that i mean he was really angry elton john are you an elton john fan well i like some of his music i don't you know he's known for apparently he like tears through ass that's like

i'm not even no i'm i'm i'm not trying to be like does that phrase mean the same here as it is in the uk sir i think so no i heard like someone said that elton john's huge on like having like four like male prostitutes they're like 20 just like a hotel room I thought he was married and monogamous I know he's a Canadian guy actually this is what I this is what I heard

on the scene if we're allowed to do gossip about celebrities I've got all sorts of stuff you know none of it will be true but I've got some you got some hot gossip yeah do they

care more about is it because similar to I would assume because in Canada Canada cares way more about American politics than Canadian politics. It's much more interesting. It's written like that. Do we care more about American politics? No, we don't know anything about it. I mean, I'm interested in American politics. Most people in the UK aren't really that interested.

So when you bring up stuff about like Trump in America, they kind of like people don't care? They have a kind of two-dimensional version of it. They have a vague sense of it. But they're not really interested. Because there's enough going on in UK politics, which is very interesting. Because we keep changing prime ministers every couple of months.

It's all a bit mad. What's going on right now? It's hard to keep up. So at the moment, Boris Johnson, he got booted out because everyone in his party turned on him. Then Liz Truss became prime minister, but she got booted out within 40 days. It was maddening. Oh, yeah.

What did she do? Oh, well, she implemented this new, they called it a mini budget. She had this idea about economic growth. Did she like crash the pound or something? Well, yeah, because as soon as she implemented these ideas, her and her best friend, Kwasi Kwarteng, who was the chancellor, again, only for a few days. I'll be all right.

Having your chancellor be your best friend. Well, they were basically were basically very close and they implemented this idea and all of a sudden the markets got really spooked the pound crashed and basically the economy was screwed and so uh then they got rid of her and then how do you get rid of her basically well she did resign but everyone was sort of saying how terrible she was and then she had to get a new chancellor who basically said i'm going to reverse everything you've just done so she effectively had no power left anymore so she went and then rishi sunak uh became the prime minister and uh but they're gonna lose anyway isn't he a big proponent of uh central the digital currency yeah well that's what you got a crypto guy now that's like but not in a good way they say he's like a WAF shill and all that sort of stuff.

He's also one of the richest people in the country. He's really, really posh. He's an interesting guy. But I saw Trevor Noah sort of talking about how when he became prime minister, there was a big racist backlash against him because there's an Indian prime minister. And that was a lie. No one in Britain cared. No one.

I feel like Indian dudes in Britain is so common. No one cares. Isn't your number one food what curry yeah isn't it well we have a sort of uh an anglicized version of it but yeah so hang over from the uh the raj yeah the empire um but i think it was weird to me watching someone doing this satirical thing on american tv about something that just never happened and that to me is odd because you gotta have some basis in truth you know you can't just rail against the racist backlash that didn't happen because because it was a bit inconvenient that the people weren't right it really is you can make anything seem

like it happened because all you need is to be like maybe three where you go yeah three people said this and it's like those could be fake accounts anything it's funny there's a detachment from the truth in this country i mean i heard when i heard nancy pelosi talking about how the january 6th thing was the same as pearl harbor i mean i did laugh out loud i thought that there's no sort of connection with the truth you can't just say something that everyone knows not to be true and expect to get away with it you can though well you can i know but why why why have we reached that i think i think of it as like um probably the same way it's like if you had a buddy that was like your friend forever and then other people were like,

this guy's this and this and then you're like, nah, he's the man. I see, yeah. I think it's just that where it's like there's no amount of things that are going to change their minds.

So it's like, so once you're only talking to people that think what you think, I don't know, I feel like you can kind of say, your reasoning doesn't matter. I guess.

And their base, they just give them what they want to hear, you know. It's weird. I used to enjoy disagreeing with friends. It was a lot of fun. And they're based, they just give them what they want to hear, you know? It's weird. I used to enjoy disagreeing with friends. It was a lot of fun. Yeah.

In fact, my friendships were largely sort of fostered on disagreement and sort of mutual contempt. But now, now that doesn't happen. Mutual contempt's great. Yeah, we loved it.

No, I know you, man. But now it is like, I mean, I've lost so many friends now because they don't agree with me anymore. Even in the comedy clubs? Like, do you ever...

Oh, comedy. Comedians hate me in the UK. Oh, really? A lot of the sort of bile i get is from them or i hit worse still is when friends of mine all of them pretty much i mean i've had friends of mine say i was in canada i was in a green people say i was in a green room the other night gigging and everyone was slagging you off saying how evil you were and i think okay that's nice thanks for letting me know about that just want you to know it's crazy to think that any sort of anybody in comedy could be evil in any

sort of like so that another comedian could honestly say that they go that comedian's evil well the comedians in the uk are very sort of they all sort of bought into this we've got to all think the same way and express the same opinions and because i was pro-brexit and there were about three or four comedians who were pro-brexit back in the day 2016 so that automatically made me this pariah by their stance a lot of them don't care about me and in a way that's worse do they even care about people who are apathetic what no look whatever so what's the is there a post-mortem are we at that point where we're with brexit okay can we do one at this point okay so yeah do you do it's like you're trump as far as I'm concerned, right? Do people over here even care about Brexit?

Not really. I mean, I know about it. I understand. So the biggest issue I saw from anybody- You were crying, you said. You were upset about it. No, I didn't give two shits. He cried.

The only thing that I saw anybody have an issue with, and it was very selfish, was that they go, I want to be able to go live all over Europe. Right, you can still do that. Okay, well, that's what, at the time, people were people were like well i remember meeting a guy and he lived in london yeah he goes i guess i can't live in england anymore that's really ridiculous i mean uh basically it was about freedom of movement so you could you could sort of go okay well that's

what people thought so now you just got to queue a little bit longer for the passport control okay it's an extra 10 minutes it is inconvenient it's an extra 10 minutes basically but you can live you can live anywhere In the European Union Yeah I mean Well it's a It's a more complicated process But just in the same way

That I could live in America You know But there'd be more applications More kind of things to do But that's what I'm saying Pre-Brexit Yeah you could work You could just go

Move to Italy And you could work there And you could work there Exactly That's what I'm saying So that's a legitimate grievance Okay that's fair enough But really what happened was

To put it in a nutshell If I can, basically around 2016, for many, many years, there's been campaigns, people saying that we want to get out of the EU, the European Union, and we finally got this referendum. And the reason we got a referendum is because the Conservative Party thought they're going to vote to stay in because all the polls said that. And then I think just to piss the Conservatives off,

people voted to leave. You know, that was part of it. So we had this big vote. The Conservatives wanted to stay. Everyone wanted to stay. Conservatives off, people voted to leave. You know, that was part of it. So we had this big vote. The Conservatives wanted to stay. Everyone wanted to stay. Conservatives, Labour, Lib Dem, every major party wanted to stay. I thought it was more like Conservatives wanted to leave. No, no.

Because it was like an immigration thing. The Conservatives spent 10 million pounds on a leaflet campaign, which they sent to every household in the UK, telling you must, you have to vote to stay in. This is so important. So it's like bipartisan. All the politicians wanted this not so it's like bipartisan all the politicians wanted this not to happen yeah all the politicians so why do they even let them do the referendum because they thought it would like settle this once and for all democracy i mean i do know the answer to that but it's a bit boring it's because the conservatives were in a coalition

with a party called the liberal democrats and i think what they did is they sort of used this as a bargaining chip they had this in their manifesto not expecting to have to use it effectively and um and in the eventuality they had to go to the but they they were convinced the vote would go the way they wanted it to go and it didn't and what happened was everyone suddenly decided that if you wanted to leave the eu you were a racist stupid reactionary unreconstructed big and is the reason for that be essentially it was like we don't want other people like immigrants coming into britain is that the sort of the that was the reason it was became like a build the wall situation right that was the perception of it but it's a very false perception then the reason why look this is also everything's

everything too like i'm sure there was some people that were just like we don't want immigrants and then there's probably maybe there was more reason like different people had different reasons i'm sure there were some people who voted because they didn't want immigrants that's you know that i'm sure there were and there were there's always going to be some racists or whatever um but that wasn't the reason all of the polling told us the main reason why people wanted to leave the eu was because they wanted the laws that govern the uk to be made within the uk rather than outsourcing a democracy to a bunch of unelected bureaucrats in brussels right so that's that's really what it was about so they have like is there someone that's in charge of the whole eu

right well i mean there's a person in charge of the commission which is ursula von der leyen and then they make laws for the whole deal well it's difficult the european parliament and the european commission it's a bit complicated because the parliament has various representatives from the various countries and they sort of vote ostensibly uh but the commission is where they sort of draw the new laws up and impose them and those people are not elected they're appointed so you're so by who by each other so effectively right so you have a situation where we can't vote out the people who are making laws in our own country. And that's not an appropriate situation as far as I can see.

So, right. So that's the, anyway, for me, you're in America right now, you're preaching to the choir. Right.

Exactly. So what's the argument? What's the argument? What's their argument? Like if you were to be like a steel man or whatever. Yeah. Their argument is that we're going to be more financially sound if we're in the eu okay so it was like a like a trade argument yeah it was about being richer uh but they they misunderstood the reason why people left people

didn't want to leave they understood that we might take a financial hit but they they were voting for the principle of democracy and sovereignty which is actually you know it's not a racist thing but is it kind of what happened uh it was like let's say the politicians or you know it's not a racist thing but is it kind of what happened uh it was like let's say the politicians or you know globalization people were like hey this is gonna go against what we want which is more like money yeah and then they're like well let's call them racist because that'll be the best way to like get our way and it's really important to understand it's it's really well when you say this because the eu has a capitalism at the heart of its constitution it is a pro-corporate body unaccountable unelected it it has various sort of major corporations lobbying the eu to make it

harder for smaller businesses this is not a left-wing utopia this is a very right-wing very conservative body and you're not right-wing and i'm not right-wing and yet people in the uk thought that it was a left-wing thing to vote to stay in the eu that's incoherent they like tricked them almost it makes no sense and then all of us and by the way most people didn't even know what the eu was right before 2016 most people didn't know anything about it and then all of a sudden all these left-wing activists are painting their faces in the flag colors of the eu they got them in yeah and they're like you don't even know what this means their faces oh they were they were going it was like a cult eu yeah that is very they were going and doing like marches with these flags and painting their faces

and and with effigies of theresa may all this weird stuff and like you don't even know what the eu is i mean if you ask these people they wouldn't be able to describe what they do they just got obsessed with it i'm sure although most of those people can tell you anything about ukraine now right no i guess but it's like they're just latching themselves no i mean it's the same thing because they've decided one side is good and one side is evil and we want to be the goodies and that's effectively it's so that's so pathetic a lot of stuff it was everything now and that's what i mean it didn't used to be that you know you can use that like sentiment of you know get your policies that you want or whatever well that's happening here with trump and you know that's

it's a good evil situation it's disney it's villains and heroes right and the villains are all ugly and the heroes are all you know well built and all the way like so it's very easy to identify but that's not how real the real life works right it's really no there are nuances in morality and you know i'd like to have those discussions again but what happens now is so what happens when you do you argue with your friends now well they don't argue me they just block me uh oh really sort of how it works yeah so but that's okay i feel like this is where i kind of argued not not argued but like you know francis foster yes he was kind of saying that no one uh those guys were maybe it was constant but they were kind of saying this to me about like the

british comedy scene but then adam rowe told me he was like well it's not really like that so maybe there's like to me i feel like 2015-16 was like the peak but uh and now it's like to me, I feel like 2015, 16 was like the peak. But now it's like sort of a little, you know, I feel like most of my friends that were like really crazy were kind of like, yeah, I got a little wild there. Like in Britain, do you feel like it's as bad now as it ever was? Or do you feel like it kind of. It's pretty bad. I mean, I don't know Adam Rowe, but I imagine it's because he has the correct opinions that maybe he hasn't experienced this. But if you if you have the opinions that are not deemed acceptable, people are very nervous around you.

Like now, if I go into, there's like at the Edinburgh Fringe Festival, there's a performer's bar. And if I go in there, people will literally, people I've known for years will scurry away to avoid being near me in case people think that we know each other. And that's still the case. I do that with them.

Maybe they just hate me for good reason. Maybe I'm a bit boring. Maybe they're homophobic. Maybe they're homophobicobic i should really dine out on that a little bit more i need to play that card a lot more i'll say the whole thing is rooted in homophobia sure but there is that issue um and and also i get messages from things are changing like so i'm getting more messages from comedian friends who used to be friends sort of saying oh yeah but maybe you got this right and maybe maybe things have been overreacting and all the rest of it so there's something like a bit of an olive branch yeah but but you got you got this right and maybe things have been overreacting and all the rest of it. So there's something.

Like a bit of an olive branch? Yeah, but they won't. You got this whole fucking dudes thing right because my girl has been annoying me. The old wife was on my case today. But they won't say it publicly though. That's the thing. There's no benefit.

No, I get it. You know, it's like being back at school. You know, it's like people have decided that certain kids are the ones that you shouldn't hang around with and that's fine i'm just that kid now i'm that kid so bizarre and maybe that's fair enough so that's when you come to america it's like coming to a new school no one knows me here it's quite good i haven't made any enemies here so i mean i know you from the internet and like i know rogan was always like talking about detainee mcgrath that's how i found out about it yeah and so i it's like it's nice

because i'm doing a book launch tomorrow and there's all these people have been and the guy said to me you know which journalists shouldn't i invite which people don't like him like it's fine here no one knows who nobody cares no one cares so it's great it's liberating yeah i had similar stuff in canada and then you come here and you're like oh yeah nobody cares here no no like nobody cares about the petty stuff to the no i also found that like i mean in britain i would almost assume that it would be like i get why you know as soon as you like are a comedian that's sort of getting into politics in general that you know some people might feel a certain way about that yeah but in britain i feel like but not left-wing politics well even i mean i don't know i'd feel

like your average comedian's still just like oh a, a little bit smarty pants comedy. But I feel like in Britain, it was all the comedy smarty pants comedy. Like, I feel like all of the, you know, even like your biggest guys, like Ricky Gervais or Russell Brand, like the biggest people in comedy, even John Cleese, like all those people were always kind of like,

like intellectuals in some sort of way, or at least like in part of that world more, in a more so than America, which is why it, like, surprises me that people wouldn't like it. I would have thought that they do like it. There's always been political, yeah, politics and comedy have always sort of dovetailed,

I suppose, in the UK, but I think more than anything because of the class system, I think it's because of class. So that's always been something that's really important. Oh, what do you mean? Well, what I mean is, you know we we have an awareness of class and status and hierarchy social hierarchy which is really built into our politics in a big way so like labor and the left are always considered to be about supporting working-class

people and social mobility and that kind of thing and the right are perceived as being sort of sustaining the economic privilege of the powerful and the rich right um but that's all sort of been upended by the culture war. It's really weird now. So Labour is now a weirdly middle-class party. That's sort of happening in Canada now. The one that used to be about the steel workers is now about, like, whatever, like, gay bride parade expanding or whatever.

Exactly. You've got Trudeau calling the working-class truckers fascists, effectively, right? Didn't like the truckers. Likes the Chinese truckers, though. But didn't they say that when class truckers fascists effectively right and like the truckers likes the chinese truckers though but didn't they say that when the truckers were pressing their horns that the honk honk was a dog whistle because hh means how i'll hit yeah yeah someone didn't say that that was and it wasn't just someone on the internet but someone quite like the cbc no it's like someone at the cbc like that's insane that's that's a mentally ill they also said

i think it was Rosemary Barton, who was one of the main people at the CBC. She was saying that the whole... It was all Russian. Again, you can't make something up. But this is like primetime CBC news. And she's like, yeah, I'm pretty sure this whole trucker thing

is set up by the Russians. It just says it. They have thoughts on air. yeah I'm pretty sure this whole trucker thing is like set up by the Russians right it just says it like she just they have thoughts but on air we saw some of the truckers was drinking vodka we know this is a Russian

based plan isn't it just that they don't like working class people I mean isn't that part of it I think they just want to get what they want and they'll do

they'll say anything yeah so the CBC is just it's I'm sure the BBC is similar where everybody there is it's a very cushy existence they don't do a lot once you're, it's a very cushy existence.

They don't do a lot. Once you're in, it's probably hard to get out. And they say what they need to say to stay there. Does BBC make anything good now or do you find it's crappy? Well. Oh, you're on a competitor. No, no, no. I don't mind slacking off. I'm not.

Well, I used to be on a panel show on BBC Radio, which was called The Moral Maze which I really enjoyed but I thought that was one of the few good shows still left on the BBC but the problem

with the BBC is they do actually make some very good programs and they have some very very talented people there but everyone I speak to who works there says that there is

this kind of ideological capture going on like there are certain parameters about what you you can explore and what you can't explore

and it's particularly rooted in this sort of critical social justice world which as, as you know, Justin Trudeau is bought into as well. He's the guy who provides the funding. Why did he not get voted out for all the blackface stuff? They like him. Because they decided that it was the lesser of evils. If you did blackface, they'd never hear the end of it. Maybe you have.

I have not, no. I mean, just think of it as this, when, like, it was Trump, Joe Biden, and people wanted to vote out Trump. Like, was there much that Biden could do that would make them vote for Trump? Well, that's it. Almost nothing.

They forgive a lot, don't they? Yeah, they're just like, there's no scenario where I'm voting for the other one. Exactly, exactly. But BBC has that mindset. It's so embedded, so rooted in. There's a new director general who said he's going to try and promote more diversity of opinion at the BBC.

But he hasn't been able to do it. It's been a couple of years now. And he just hasn't because it's so ingrained. You know, if someone says, oh, maybe we want to do a program about why gender identity ideology might be a threat to women's rights, you know, that will get kiboshed. I can't imagine BBC's coming out with the like anti-trans thing. But that's not an anti-trans thing. That's the thing. No, no, but just like something that would appear like that.

You're just like, I would, I would, I feel like I wouldn't even try to pitch something like that. Something that would be, something that would be misrepresented as being anti-trans. No, I understand what you mean. I wasn't saying that. I'm just like, there's no, there's no scenario. Yeah. Where you go to BBC and you're just like, there might be some stuff that they're wrong about in the trans stuff.

There's the door, pal. But as a public broadcaster, you should be fairly... You should at least attempt to be unbiased. They should at least try to pretend. Like pretend. But they do a pretty good job of being politically non-partisan when it comes to their news reporting.

I think they do. Oh, see, in Canada they don't at all. I think they do. People will argue with in Canada, they don't at all. I think they do. I mean, like, people will argue with me. I've heard, I've also heard that, though, that, like, their actual news isn't the same thing. It's just when it comes to this stuff, they can't help but preach and sermonize. But, yeah, on the, I mean, look,

and a lot of people will disagree with me for saying that, by the way, but I do think they do. It's a hard thing to be completely politically neutral or to be perceived as politically neutral. But when it to the the woke stuff uh they're very much on board on one side and they can't disguise it so it's not good and it's not good path of least resistance i guess yeah i guess but it's not good for a state broadcaster like you say no it shouldn't be that way so state broadcaster is gonna stink period well we all pay for it as well because we all have the license fee which is compulsory so you can you can same with the

canada yeah you go to prison if you don't pay for it so uh even if you don't watch it we don't need to go to license do it no but he's saying you have to buy a license like you have to buy a tv license yeah what yeah everyone has to buy even if you're homeless i think you have a home i think you have to have a tv so if you're a homeless person with a tv you'd have to is it like when you go to buy a tv that just a portion of no no no you have to you have to go online or send a check and and pay every year and if you don't someone comes around to your house and uh they used to have vans that could detect your signal coming from your tv that and they put out these creepy adverts i remember when i was a kid there was creepy out of these

vans trundling at night saying we can find you if you're watching tv without your license we will we will find you and that money just goes to goes to the bbc and that's why they've got so much money to make the programs right so that's the idea it will go good racket how many channels does the bbc have one just well no way sorry it has bbc one and bbc two it has uh bbc three which is an in sort of internet digital thing okay and bbc four is another digital they used to crank out hits though right it was like the office the comedy stuff was brilliant like so all like like faulty towers and the office and Monty Python and all this yeah so can we talk about working with John Cleese yes of course yeah how did that happen uh well we asked him basically so I'm part of this new channel called GB

news which again is one of those things that been completely monster does this evil okay it's the so they can't like John Cleese doing that or is he already they already don't like him the point is well they gave him a lot of flack

when it was announced but the point is that we've just said to him you can make the show you want to make do whatever you want to do no one's going to try and impose

and say no you can't say this can't say that would it be like being on Fox News or something here that's the way it's perceived perceived that's the way it's perceived but it's not like that.

It's simply that. I mean, on my show, we get people in for more different opinions. I was watching some yesterday and it's like you bring one guy on one side, one guy on the other.

That's what we do. It's like a debate show. But it's not like here's four people on one side, let's talk about this issue. No, it's not. I do my best to get all opinions heard.

It seems like journalism, I guess. What happened with GB News is about four months before we aired, we announced it and basically all these activists, there's an activist group in england called i think called hope not hate or stop funding hate or one of those yeah they have the best names though it's always right because they always they have these games these names where they go stop hate and you go

well i don't want to be the person who's going up against stop hate well there's that but also they're very hateful in their own rhetoric they're like stop hate you evil fucker you know it's so there was those people and um they said it's going to be an evil far-right fascist channel and then we went to air and it wasn't it was just various people with different opinions talking and they still stuck with the fantasy that they created for all those months because they couldn't i guess they couldn't afford to admit they couldn't say actually it's not that bad yeah so they just want to admit that it's exactly the same as exactly um but but but then ultimately and now things are getting a bit better because what happens is when people actually watch the channel they they think oh actually it's not what

they said it was um so the the hysteria tends to be perpetuated at the moment by the people who just never watch the channel refuse to watch the channel everything right like i have this all that when i invite someone on and they come back and say no i'm not going on an evil far right thing and i'm like well you know i'm not even right wing and uh i i'm not evil um it's fine um you know i'm a little well we're all a little as solzhenitsyn said we're all partly evil but you know i rein that in for the purposes of broadcasting you know so um this is the this is the issue that i can't get the guests that i really want on the people who would be my complete detractors because they won't also they don't believe in debate they don't believe in yeah well generally i think what

happens is though they realize they'll kind of get picked apart just well maybe but i'm not a combative yeah yeah yeah well i think they probably just realize that their their talking points are not that solid well they're not based on reason or yeah exactly yeah exactly i mean the fact that john cleese the way he's perceived now as right wing is crazy yeah what does that look like in britain because he was like he's like the biggest guy there right yeah but it's because he's this could be like our bill cause he's like one of the biggest guys here yeah yeah no i know but like in britain he's got to be like real i think it's because he's done so many major things. It's not just, it's Fawlty Towers, but it's also Monty Python,

but it's also Fish Called Wanda. It's like there's so much, and he's so respected and so brilliant and undeniably a genius. And so- He had this like speech on YouTube that I would like, I used to always watch. About the writing? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Our buddy, Gary Joyce, he's our author. He sent it to me that he's like, this best yeah best thing on writing that he's ever he's great and so we're you know and we've just said look we it's going to be a show where he gets to talk to the people that he finds most interesting about the subjects that maybe other channels don't like to talk about um and it will be funny and it'll be light but it will also be serious bits and we you know we're not doing it for another few months so we've just been knocking ideas about at the moment but it's just you and him hanging out we're just talking most days about what what elements we could do what we couldn't do and yeah so i think it'll be really it'll be really enjoyable and it'll be really interesting

and the and the idea that it's going to be a right wing like he's not right wing so yeah he's not i mean he's very anti-trump and he's very kind of yeah he was like a never trump or type and he's anti-taurian or so it's gonna if Yeah, he was like a never-Trumper type of... And he's anti-Tory and all. So it's going to... If people want to watch this show and then stick with this fantasy... Same thing as like Russell Brand, I guess. I mean, isn't he essentially just so pro-free speech?

It's free speech. Which was like Monty Python, that's the whole thing. Yeah, he wants to have discussions with people. Yeah. Sometimes about difficult things and he wants to maybe disagree sometimes. It's fine. It's very old-fashioned, right?

Right, yeah. I mean, that's exactly what it is. So, uh yeah it should be a lot of fun i mean i'm looking forward to that that's cool yeah what kind of what is there anything that sticks out that about this is the corny question but like is there anything that sticks out with his like that you kind of when working with him be like oh that's interesting how he does that like john clee specifically like about comedy or how he like makes a tv show where you're just like oh that's interesting how he does that like john clee specifically like about comedy or how he like makes a tv show where you're just like oh that's interesting okay well i'll come back to you on that when we've actually started making it okay so you're at the moment it is just about we're just discussing and writing notes just talking basically getting getting the ideas out there

is jk rowling still like uh who she's a big one too right, she's another one. I mean, she's so misrepresented. It's unbelievable. But is she like a villain there now? Among, look, not among most people. I mean, the Harry Potter books are selling more than they ever did. Okay. People on Twitter, you know, people who call themselves left wing on Twitter, they think she's a villain.

But they, again, are indulging in a collective fantasy. And it's really weird. It's a hysteria. Yeah. You know, I think it's worse here, isn't't it when it comes to her what not liking her well yeah because wasn't there a new york times advert about oh imagine harry potter without the creator yeah yeah remember there was that was like a whole campaign like that was all over the subways and stuff it's so weird you know because this is a woman who you know gave so much money of her

of her own money away to charity that she sort of brought herself out of billionaire status because she's so sort of philanthropic. And she's just concerned about women's rights. She wrote a really long, compassionate article about how she supports trans rights and equal rights for everyone. But as a victim of domestic abuse, she has concerns about women's safety and single-sex basis, all really reasonable and measured.

And that's why when you get in an argument with an activist and you say, you know, can you just quote the transphobic thing that she said and they never can and then you say well look as an adult shouldn't you therefore revise your position on this and they say well you're an evil bigot transphobe for arguing i mean it's just religious yeah yeah it's zealotry essentially yeah she's and she obviously seems like just a really nice person yeah like quite obviously i was just wondering because over there like if the how they because she must be obviously a... Do you know her? No.

No, never met her. I just assume everyone in Britain knows each other. Because it's quite small. It's quite small. I mean, like, there is something to be said about, like, you know, in a country where at least all the, like, famous people know each other or whatever, you know? There's a lot of famous people in Britain as well. Yeah, but I'm, yeah, I'm just saying in Canada, I would, you know, if they know this person, at the very at the very least you're like well I hung out with them at a party well that is the

classic Canada thing where everybody's like oh you're from Canada you know Jeff oh you do and you're like oh just because I'm Canada I know Jeff

Jeff Wilson okay I do know Jeff do you know some like Celine Dion and Justin Trudeau I would if she was more my age okay yeah

probably yeah I would yeah I would do celine dion do you know i've been at a thing with her all right you don't know her maybe the terrible thing is i'm trying to think of famous canadians and i can't really there are more there are more aren't there and then there's some yeah well i mean in the new york comedy scene if you're like you know this person generally you're like oh yeah i've done maybe that's true that's true but jk rowling, in the New York comedy scene, if you're like, you know, this person generally, you're like, oh, yeah, I've done. That's true. But J.K. Rowling's in the comedy.

She's not. She's got a solid 10. And that's about it, you know. But no, I haven't. I bet she lives on some estate somewhere. Probably. I don't. No, she's got a house because I know that because activists tweeted a picture of her house with the door sign clearly visible so that people would know the address.

You know, this is how they behave. Does she have guards? I imagine she's got lasers and robots robots i would have thought so if you're that rich yeah i mean even if you don't need them have you ever had any consequences like in real life of people you know trying to get at me or something yeah no uh the the i mean look i've often had people saying they're going to come and protest stuff i know no one ever does the one that came closest, I guess, was when we did a pilot for radio for again, BBC.

This was last year, I think early last year. And it was, uh, we were doing a standup night and I was doing a set. Various other comics were doing a set. And all these activists said that they were going to turn up with air horns. They were going to disrupt the recording and they just didn't.

They just didn't. My, actually one of my favorite things is Jordan Peterson said recently where he was getting protested so he's just started doing his things at eight in the morning. Yeah, they'll never get up. He goes, I just started doing those things

at eight in the morning and problem solved. I think that's so funny. Because if they turn up, what are they going to do? What are they protesting? I mean, I did it in Toronto. I called it,

it was like literally tongue-in-cheek joke, a free speech comedy show. Yeah, literally i got the locks of the venue broken for the first time around and then we did in this theater where jordan peterson actually would do his bible lectures or whatever and they pulled the fire alarm like during the okay so it's really important that's because this comedy was so fun i had to put out the heat. No, I haven't had any of that. I must have been on stage. I'd quite like some of that maybe. It might be quite fun to have a few protesters. It was, except for that I'm not a producer of comedy,

but I was forced to just because I got myself into this mess of just this whole thing. And then the school was like, oh, because they're threatening you, so then you have to spend all this money on security but i'm like but they're threatening me why do i have to spend all this money on extra security and well they're like well if you don't then we won't do the show well that's the way they get it like so they're saying they're not anti-free speech but the security costs are going to be

so prohibitive that you end up having to cancel the show this is a really standard i mean these are the same people who say well free speech has limits because you're not allowed to yell fire in a crowded theater. And then they pull the fire alarm in a crowded theater. It doesn't make sense. You are actually allowed to shout fire in a crowded theater. But I'm saying they say that. If there's a fire, you better bloody shout that. Right.

But I'm saying that's their defense. And then they pull the fire alarm in a crowded theater. I always thought that was a really sort of bad analogy anyway. Because, you know, if you do, you are free to shout fire in a theater. But when you buy a ticket to a live show, you sort of enter into a contract to behave in a certain way i mean if you they can chuck you out you can shout fire but they can chuck you out that's not illegal it's not legal if you go watch comedy at like the apollo there's people shouting fire all the time yeah are they i should probably be on showtime at the ap just with the hook, just pulling me off stage for that one.

Do you mean the one in London? No, no, the Apollo in Harlem. Yeah, it was like the notorious, where everybody blues. Oh, yeah, yeah. Like people have been shot on stage before. Really? Yeah, someone's been shot on stage.

Yeah, it's like people get booed off a stage, but they have, I forget, they have an Apollo. There's a couple of clubs like that in London. There's one called Up the Creek that used to be very bad for people but like people would go along to deliberately try and and i saw someone get booed off there so badly i it was it was like a murder it was absolutely it was an american guy he started saying well why don't you come up and

you come up come up and fight me sort of it was a bit like that that was a bit weird yeah i don't like that sort of thing no i think that courtesy is is where i'm at sit there and watch the show and you know very british do you find that the race stuff is different in like britain than it is in america because i feel like people always say that like even the thing you said before where it's so much more based on like class and stuff like that yeah i've always hear people say that but like kind of does that seem there's just you know yeah because it's just not as big an issue in the uk as it is you're way more identified with the person that's like makes as much money as you versus exactly i mean you know i you don't hear racist comments very much at all you know it's

it's a it's a it's just a very tolerant open country you know um here i think because you've got much more of a history of uh racial division and things that's true too yeah is it very uncommon that people sort of uh is it like really uncommon where someone was like kind of born poor and ends up like not poor uh i mean okay well that's the american dream the american dream well we used to have a thing called the grammar school system which meant that if you were poor but smart you you could go to this elite school that was like the equivalent people aren't smart though uh it's a genetic thing mostly yeah there is that um and then so there was a way to become you know uh upper class effectively because you could you could do it but they got rid of all of those so

now why did they get rid of them i don't know it was a bad idea i guess because they thought it was elitist that you know but it was elitist but in a good way because it felt a little like oh we'll pluck one little poor person out right but the alternatives were but but now the alternative exactly is if you're born poor you're probably going to die poor because it's really hard to get anywhere because there's so much because you can't go to college or it's not just that it's like it's your schools suck if you're rich i mean okay so the internet must have helped it can do if you're creative but like if like i'll give an example so i used to teach at a private school at a posh school um oh really you were a teacher before yeah i was a school teacher and then what did you teach english and drama interesting yeah so um i wasn't used to these posh kind of schools

because i went to a comprehensive school so i went to normal school and then everyone there was so rich uh and they all there was an assembly i remember where kids were coming up talking about what they did in the summer and they've all been given these internships unpaid internships at like top magazines gq bbc etc because their parents just made a phone call so then they've got that experience and of course they can afford to do an unpaid internship which most working class people can't do anyway so you end up in this situation where it's nepotism and it's you know and it's and it's you end up with it it's pointless to deny that if you're born into that kind of society and that kind of background, you have so many advantages.

The cards are sort of weighed in your favor. It's pointless to deny it. And things I think on that basis are worse than they've ever been. I think it's harder if you come from a working class background to get anywhere. Yeah, yeah.

No, I mean, it just makes logical sense. Yeah. I think that's a pretty common story. You gotta be like the person that really is like, I'm moving to a different place. You know, you're changing the way i talk right yeah like you probably tell more the way that people talk like even that uh all these guys you know of course yeah i mean it's like it's the southern accent here or something well there's rich people with the southern but i

mean you can tell the difference between the rich ones and i mean yeah yeah but also too in america like they have a lot of the race stuff, but at the end of the day, it still is class based. I think, yeah. That people just don't want to admit. But like you say,

with comedy and with, you know, if you're creative, it's different, isn't it? Because if you're funny, you're funny. And if you put stuff out there,

you know, it doesn't really matter. You can get, you can get on. Well, I always heard that like, and maybe that changed now that kind of, people used to say,

because a lot of Canadians would decide whether to come to like america or britain yeah you come to britain uh for there's a visa there's a special commonwealth visa like perfect like comedy visa no commonwealth oh i see so if you're not if you're under the age of 30 you can immigrate to britain got it okay yeah yeah you can go it's for like i think it's a three-year visa okay you can straight up just like yeah if you're less than 30 you guys you know you're letting everyone in you were trying to stop it i personally was trying to stop it i was circling the shores in a boat yeah i was like turn back you're not coming around um i have the thing with the paint swatch on their skin yeah no there was like you can go i'm sure same with you like you can go to Australia can I I mean maybe I like what yeah I think it was a for a certain age just like the Commonwealth countries

okay sort of packed yeah so yeah a lot a lot of comics were a lot of Canadian comics wanted to do the London circuit well not that they wanted to it's just you could do it a lot easier than coming to America's heart and Canada but it's still it's still hard I mean I'd still say that there's a disproportionate number of sort of independently wealthy people on the comedy circuit because if you think about right well that's what i was going to ask is because people used to say that like well on britain uh comedians almost like a working class job in a lot of ways and then but maybe maybe now it's not or it's not already it's because it was maybe maybe it used to be maybe when it was like

maybe that's bullshit but they used to be like working men's clubs and and sort of where it was maybe maybe it used to be maybe when it was so maybe that's bullshit when I've been here but there used to be like working men's clubs and sort of where working men's clubs yeah your kind of thing you know where yeah there's a lot of

working class comics from that sort of era whereas now it's different I think what happens is because with comedy you know if you're if your parents have bought you a flat

in London and you don't have to work you can spend all day writing you can well you can sleep till like 1pm I think that question you're at an advantage and then you can develop material quicker and you'll get through the circuit quicker and etc and you can pay for edinburgh fringe shows which cost thousands and thousands of pounds which you don't make back so you have huge advantages and that is why there's a disproportionate amount of posh people on the circuit right that's it

because when i was a teacher i was gonna live in london and not have to yeah yeah exactly it's just a hard well i was gigging i was gigging when i was a teacher in ipswich which is a town further north from london so i was gigging in london at night but then i was working during the day as a teacher and i'd get back really late at 2 a.m and so i was constantly exhausted and constantly tired and you know if i could have just given up that job and just didn't stand up that would have been much better much easier yeah it feels like it accelerates like it's almost i always kind of was thinking, money seems to accelerate what you...

You know the same way that COVID, almost the lazy people got lazier and the hardworking people got more successful in a lot of ways? Yeah. It's almost like, that's the same thing as take a 19-year-old and give them money.

If that was a super driven 19-year-old, it'll accelerate. It'll just save them years that they would have had to spend. But if they're a lazy person it'll just they'll just party and not work and no one wants to it'll accelerate their downfall that's it yeah i mean it's made people lazier like people don't want to go back to work now there was a survey last week in the uk that said that one in 10 young people have decided never to work they've decided they're not they've decided they're not going to get a job ever no that no that is what they're saying yeah they're

saying they've decided to opt out of employment that reminds me of i had a friend when i was in college and uh he used to smoke yeah and then he wanted to quit smoking so he just said you know what i'm not gonna buy cigarettes anymore yeah but he didn't say i'm gonna quit smoking he's like i'm just gonna and you're like so that's everyone but he said that but he's like there's one thing to do that but he's he goes this is my plan he goes so what everybody's just gonna give you cigarettes like he didn't if you don't work you don't get to eat right i don't understand this idea i'm just gonna not do that well then you're gonna starve to death does and you deserve do they have the social

nets there that can allow that like a welfare state i guess i do yeah we do but don't you have to sort of prove that you're looking for work yeah and if you decided that that is just against your principles and i don't know why they're going to give you money you know yeah you can't tell them that though we're probably not saying that in the interviews but also they don't want they don't quite want that they don't want to be poor they just don't want to work it's not going to work theoretically this thing might sound great i have a reality is i know a couple dudes that are scheming the system pretty good.

Really? And they have a very like, yeah, obviously what I'm doing is not good, but don't hate the player, hate the game. No, but I once tried to go on the dole, which is the sort of when I was out of work before I started teaching and I had no money and I tried to claim unemployment benefit, but there was so much bureaucracy. Oh, it's not as easy as you say.

It's so hard. And actually, I couldn't even understand the forms I was meant to fill in. So in the end, I just thought, I just won't eat. I just won't bother. You know, I'd rather starve because this is torture. And if you're going to get another job, you're like, I'm doing all this for two months. Yeah. You've got to be like a bit of a lifer to really fucking crack that system.

Yeah, exactly. You're putting as much effort into the job that you would have been at. It's harder than a real job. It's much harder. So why not just get the job? I wonder if that's by design. Of course it is. Yeah, of course.

They want to put people off. You think getting a job's hard. Try getting free money from us. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, no, absolutely. Well, a lot of times you kind of know the system where you're like, hey, I have to make this. I can make this much.

I have to have this many kids. And you have to wait till this kid's this old to have this other one. And if I have a husband, he can't technically live here. They know all the system, right? That's what I should have done other one and if I have a husband he can't technically live here like all they have all the sort of they know all the system right that's what I should have I should have had children

children that's their cash machines if you're on the dole yeah that's what I should have done I didn't think of it and I didn't have a womb to create one of the children

that's the issue yeah you need one of those you need a womb generally yeah I'm sure the government could provide one at some point I saw you talking about the China stuff recently and we've sort of talked about it a bit but we

don't really know what we're talking about neither do i the protests but what was i talking about social credit stuff i think no no no the surveillance and this is where you posted something where they have essentially like the government has what was it like 10 million cameras or something set up yeah it's just like some i don't know the number it's basically there's one camera for every three citizens okay and what that means and they've also developed technology that can identify what kind of camera is it like just like hidden cameras it's hidden but it's more it's worse than that it can zoom right in and it can detect your emotions and then therefore it can predict if you guys do happy if

you're yeah well if you're contemplating crime it will detect it well that's what they claim no so there is effectively pre-crime minority report minority report and and and as we're i was saying how can they tell like you've got just got like a little sinister look on your face yeah exactly yeah they probably modeled it and they figured out but it's called skynet yeah yeah it is like skynet no it's called sky oh it's not called skynet surely it's called skynet what yes it's so crazy that's like the craziest thing he says yeah it is called skynet okay well then that's i mean that's how like that's how we're gonna die that is how we're gonna die i've no no doubt about it but that that is scary because they also have they monitor the internet as you know so it's very difficult for people to get around it and get the information

that they want. They have two million state agents monitoring the internet and not only do they monitor your activity, they go into chat rooms and try and steer

the conversation in a certain way so that you are celebrating the regime. I mean, it is completely... So they have like, I guess they sort of do that

a little bit here somewhere. Do they? Well, I mean, that's a conspiracy, I guess. But like there's all the bots and all that stuff. Yeah, but that's not being funded by the government. Well, it's being funded by the parties, I guess. So what's the difference?

Well, that's different. Well, the parties, once the party's in power and they're funding stuff like that, isn't the same? They're fundraising externally. I don't think the government, the United States government, is funding like these bot farms.

Or at least not. There's some sort of like, you know. I think we're still relatively free here. And I think there's a lot to be said for freedom. And I think there's a lot to be said for looking at China. I think we do not want to become that. But then, you know, the way that Trudeau, for instance, has behaved. I mean, he was literally taking away the bank accounts of people who peacefully protested, right?

And has not returned the money in many instances. He was saying that they were going to give the money to a worthy cause how dare you crypto he's going to give him back it's worth nothing it's worth nothing now exactly but he's i mean what i mean he's also had the gall to come out and condemn the chinese government for all of these measures and that's what we're saying really hilarious he goes yeah go ahead who the hell does he think he is it's nuts yeah why don't they vote him out i still can't you're a. He's a fellow drama teacher too. Oh, of course he fucking is. Unbelievable. Because what happened is the last election,

he won a minority and then he made a deal with another party, the NDP party, which is the further left of the liberals. They basically made a deal that would just allow him to stay in office. Okay. But there's going to be some sort of backlash

at some point, right? I mean, you know what? a lot of people are not oddly i don't know if it's some sort of stockholm syndrome type deal or what but a lot of people they're like yeah it's fine isn't that in your nature as well yeah most people don't care about that kind of shit too where they're like your average person they're like hey remember that protest the truckers they stole their money everyone's like okay i don't know yeah okay people just yeah but that's why i was surprised by the canadian trucker thing because like canadians don't generally get angry do you quite placid gentle people yeah and it worked that's another thing yeah it's true is like i think a lot of people trying to say that was a coincidence

but they did that thing and then the the you know the truckers and all the honking and then a lot of those restrictions started to ease well that's what the chinese government's finding out now is actually there's a lot of Chinese people. I mean, activism works. They started rioting in New York. They got rid of police. Yeah. There's a lot of people.

Activism does. If there's enough people doing it, protesting works. Exactly. There's enough. And maybe even in China it could work. Yeah. It seems like they actually did. They restricted the zero COVID policy from the.

Yeah, they did. And they were finding ways to post footage of their protests that were getting around the system. Like it was a sort of cat and mouse thing between the people trying to monitor the internet and the protesters trying to get around it and actually they will find a way yeah so i i have hope power of the people will always win i was saying i don't know if i think i said to ryan maybe uh on a previous episode i don't know if it was real but there was a video of somebody with their covid pass and they would like stick it out the window and it would go red

oh is that right did you see that i didn't say it no no it was like legitimately oh oh small bladder you've had enough yeah he's had a small bladder did i say something no no just he's just got a tiny bladder it's a regular regular doctor about that uh i don't know if you know the health care system in america oh yeah oh that's right if you're a goddamn nightmare if you're poor and you're ill you die is that sort of no it's it's so it's actually that's a bit of a misconception so if you're poor you're fine okay because they'll never turn anybody away here and if you don't have money then you just can't afford services you might not get the best services it's when you're in the middle so because i saw the middle here that gets absolutely like when you hear about medical bankruptcy.

Yeah. It's the people in the middle. Okay. You have just enough money where you don't qualify for full subsidy. Yeah. But you not enough money to not go bankrupt. Okay. Because I watched that Michael Moore film about the health service in America and it looked pretty bad.

So fucking hard. It's it's no, I think it's probably one of uh like if you have money it's probably one of the best in the world okay but the problem is the insurance like i have some weird insurance currently where i don't know it's only for i'm raw talking right now i got nothing yeah this guy's living on the edge it's more risk-taking behavior it yeah we were discussing testosterone earlier. Were you? Yeah.

I know absolutely nothing about it. Well, apparently... I'm happy to blag it if you want to talk about it. I feel like, though, that's the new gays versus old gays. The older... The, like, the new generation of gays

is very, like, less testosterone. Yeah, the old... I feel like your generation of gays is, like, tons of testosterone. I think the generation above me, like the sort of old muscle queens. Ooh, muscle queen. That's a funny one. I mean, you wouldn't mess with them because they could pound you into the ground.

Yo, muscle queen is so funny. That's a great term. I mean, that's what they are. It's like a gym, like super gym, super jab. And scary. Exactly. Also, they lived through when it was illegal. You're a bit of a bad boy, too.

They were in fights all the time, actual physical fights. Dude, that would be the funniest thing if you were an old school guy that was like, yo, let's go gay bash those guys. And you come back, you just get the shit kicked out of you. You're just like, how did the gay bashing go? You have two black eyes. You're just like, it didn't work out. I think it sort of happened that way sometimes.

Yeah, it's so great. I mean, justly so. Yeah, exactly. But yeah, the healthcare system is some rugby player just gets the shit kicked out muscle queen muscle queen but yeah the healthcare system here is i guess it just depends who you are but yeah it's the people in the middle who gets okay oh so because he michael moore was interviewing somewhere but he'd had two of his fingers cut off with an electric saw and he said that he had to choose between one of the fingers because he couldn't afford to have both that's the thing so that guy was probably like a blue collar guy okay who like he wasn't you know destitute yeah he probably had some money and

stuff so that never happened in britain that would never happen the nhs i'm gonna say choose a finger no there's no there's just not i've heard the nhs is very good well it's it's very good and it has flaws and you know ultimately he could just say like yeah you're right though but if you own a house the problem is you're they're like hey it's 100 grand and you're like i don't have it and they're like well you do though like you know what i mean so you have to become poor otherwise you go bankrupt they'll do it okay like just otherwise like yeah go do it and then go bankrupt you know what i mean i think we have a great system i think the nhs is fantastic like you know i can get ill in any way at all.

And I can go in and it's free. And I get cured. My dad's big on the Britain one being good. It's good. It is good. But here people are terrified. They call it socialized medicine, don't they? And they think it's a really terrifying idea.

But that's the thing is it is like the way it's discussed. I think I agree with your synopsis of it. Because it is socialized here. Well, here it is. It is. They say it's not, but you're like, because when I lived in Canada,

I was under the assumption that if you were poor and you got sick here, they let you die. Right, but they don't. They do not at all. Okay. But they do make you

choose between fingers if you saw them off. If you happen to be middle class. Well, that's not good either. No. Middle class people have rights. That's the thing, but nobody ever would talk about that,

that it's the people in the middle who are getting sick. Yeah, well, that's not good either. But you also have those sort of insurance but nobody ever would talk about that, that it's the people in the middle who are getting screwed. Yeah, well, that's not good either. But you also have those sort of insurance. If you've got health insurance, you've got those people who are employed to try and discredit you. So when you put an application, they try and find any kind of pre-existing condition at any point.

Yeah, it's like an insurance adjuster. Not just deeply immoral. Imagine having that job. Absolutely, it is. That is funny. You go on to the guy and be like, we know you got cancer, but we just found out how much Diet Coke you drink.

Perfect example is Ryan said he had a bump on his head, and then he went to go check it out. I still have the bump, too. Yeah, but- Well, then you, or any kind of claim you make in later life, they'll say, well, you had a bump. Yeah, you broke your leg? Well, what about that bump on your head?

I was weighing you down properly. It was what, 500 bucks? It was- What? To have a bump. Buddy, I wanted to you down properly. It was what, 500 bucks? It was. What? To have a bump. Buddy, I wanted to kill the guy. However, this chump's paying $500 a month. Here's the difference, though, is I have insurance.

500 bucks for him to look at the bump. It took him four seconds. I pay $300 a month or something for my insurance, which is like the cheapest insurance that you could possibly get. It's for only catastrophes. If I was in Ryan's position and I did the same thing, I would still pay the $500. Okay.

It's not like the insurance is, all the insurance is preventing me from. Okay. So as far as I understand is if I get hit by a bus. Okay. And I have like a quarter of a million dollar bill. But when you like, if I get hit by a bus and I do all this damage to the bus,

then I have insurance coverage. Wouldn't you prefer a system like the UK where, you know you don't have to pay any of it i mean 100 i mean my my whole like part of my contingency plan is if i get really screwed up i'm like i just got to get over that border right you know like i just have to get to buff like to niagara falls yeah on ontario and then i'll then you're okay yeah but sometimes you know like if it's really bad you can't right but that's in the back of my mind that's your fault you moved

away you made that decision no but if you get like cancer or something you go right back yeah but the problem is you're right if you get hit by a car basically you just don't want to get hit by a car just avoid cars which is difficult here in new york i didn't realize how crowded your roads on everyone's just screaming at each other oh and all the people biking on the sidewalks here. If I could criminalize one thing in New York City. My buddy got hit by a bus, and he was fine. He was all right. He literally was drunk,

and then walked in front of a bus, and the bus hit him, or a streetcar, sorry, and then he flew, and he walked it off, and it was just like, man. Was he a muscle queen? He was honestly a pretty normal guy.

He was like, one of those things where everyone was like, holy shit, he's going to be dead, and then he got up? He was, like, honestly a pretty normal guy. He was, like, one of those things where everyone was, like, holy shit, like, he's going to be dead. And then he got up and we're, like, yeah! That's pretty tough. Yeah, it was just, like, we just hit him the right... Rock and roll! He was, like, what an idiot.

He got hit in the right place and fell the right way and whatever it was. Wow, he's very fortunate. We're super fortunate. But, no, I was, like, that's my contingency, too. So I've been living on the edge right now. Yeah, I was like, that's my contingency too. So I've been living on the edge right now. Yeah,

I can't do that. Okay. I can't live that way. But the system here is a mess. Did you ever get, actually, I was going to ask,

did you ever get for your personal Twitter ever suspensions or is that? No, I never did. I got, so when the Titania McGrath

character got suspended. I wonder if the back end they link them. Well, yeah, but I evaded that because I bought a second phone um i was behaving like a drug dealer basically so that i could do satire um that's so crazy because i knew that twitter were like this so i had this second phone with a different number and i never connected it through the same ip dress

so so i did all of that and then that's why when titania got first she got a seven day but she got two or three seven day bands and then a couple of day bands and then a complete permanent suspension which they call it a permanent suspension but that's semantic contradiction you can't be permanently anyway right but they emailed her saying you're not coming back you're that's it and then a few people complained like some prominent people complained and then she came back so uh yeah they hit her a lot but i never got any of it because also because i'm not i'm not a naturally offensive person so the stuff i tweet is really anodyne um and then and also what what she was tweeting and getting suspended for was nothing it didn't make any sense it was just they didn't like it they just didn't like her they just didn't like it but i just wonder seeing with the twitter files and

like the back end stuff like i i do wonder like, cause you see the extent, I always assumed it was all automated. No, I mean, basically these people's jobs effectively was to censor every day. Yeah, like they were just censors. Just go through and sort of get rid of things. But like you, I don't, in my mind, I always thought all of this stuff,

maybe I was naive, but every time something happened, I'd be like, oh, just got caught up in the net. Sometimes it was. I mean, sometimes I i got like bands or temporary bands when i mentioned things relating to violence so you know what i mean so like if she was saying she's gonna punch people even if it was a obvious joke yeah if you use the word punch it would get flagged and then it would get but imagine you would appeal that right because there was always

a thing where you could say like hey i think what happened is the algorithm picked it up and then someone looked at it and they saw the word punch misunderstood it yeah yeah yeah i think that's what happened really that's the version here of that job is like looking through these that's the version of being the chinese guy and the in the forums being like so government's pretty sick right yeah so the better the better system is just to do what elon's done which is to sack everyone yeah and don't censor it at all i mean he's still talking about how he wants to sort of restrict reach on certain hateful tweets or indeed but the tweet's not the person that's what yeah i actually think for all all of them that's such a better thing because it's like i i've honestly

don't really have that much of a problem in my mind if i was like okay someone posted this thing and they really don't like that thing so then they but like now it's like the next thing is not affected that to me is like i'd way prefer that they, but like, now it's like the next thing is not affected. That to me is like, I'd way prefer that. But wouldn't it be better system just to say that this is a platform which is open to everyone and the user takes responsibility for what they want to see and what they don't want to see. That's the easiest thing.

If we're saying like, if I got my perfect way, sure, I might say something like that, right? But I'm just saying like, this is like me compromising. Yeah. I'm saying like, listen. I get it, I get get it so you're saying this is a better than the alternative but you know you don't you don't need to block kanye west i can block kanye west if i don't want to see his tweet yeah i don't need someone up there telling me what i can and can't i agree with that but i don't think i don't think they see it that way no they don't well no the reason they don't see it that way is

because they bought into this ridiculous idea uh that if uh there are hateful ideas out there or people express views that are pernicious, that that will spread and contaminate other people. And we know that's not true. So, I mean, that's... Well, Kanye West was a good litmus test of that because you're just like, okay, when he was everywhere

and he was starting to say this stuff, because it's almost like there's a spectrum of how bad this stuff is, like how aggressive this stuff is versus how popular, because the truth is, he was probably probably not as saying not as aggressive stuff when he was allowed everywhere like if you watch drink jams versus what he's saying now so it's like the more you censor him the usually the more aggressive the message gets yeah because people naturally the

more you know if you're talking to uh tons of people you're going to be less aggressive than when you're talking to small men of people because so it's like would you think that it was uh it made people were like if you say that kanye was spreading anti-semitism right yeah if that's the argument do you think that it was spread more before he was kicked off or more after he was kicked off but what do you mean like from the stuff he did that makes sense what i'm saying okay if you were like i know what you mean you know what i stuff he did? Does that make sense what I'm saying? Okay, if you were like... Yes, I know what you mean. You know what I mean, right? So that's a good case study of like, did kicking him off of things make it worse or better in terms of like,

I don't like people talking about Jewish people? Like for his specific instance? Okay, if you were the ADL and you go, hey, look at everyone's anti-Semitism, it's Kanye West's fault. Was it... You are the ADL. Did you make it worse?

Was it worse? Did Kanye West make anti-Semitism worse in their opinion before he was kicked off everything or after? I think their opinion would be like the worst things he said made it worse. It's irrelevant whether he's kicked off. Yeah. I know. It's just,

I mean, but I mean, if he's kicked off, I mean, his reaches like less people. If you put like the rankings of everything, I'm sure the last thing he did with Gavin McInnes was the least the least seen thing he did and the and the alex like it probably went like yeah but the people who saw it are going to be the diehards the sort of the most pernicious and

they and those are the people who have those beliefs regardless exactly there is that exactly but you know i mean historically whenever you censor something it drives those things underground and they grow yeah pretty much all the time where. Where I would prefer him to just say this stuff out in the open. Yeah, and we all know now what he is. We know he's an anti-Semite and we know what he thinks

and it's quite good that we know that. It also does kind of become like laughable as opposed to, like if someone's like crazy, crazy, like let's say

head of the KKK, like back in the day like when Howard Stern used to have him on, it almost was kind of like you didn't roll your eyes at it. Yeah. But you're right,

when they're like, the more underground it is, the more it is kind of like a serious taboo topic sure well yeah exactly and you know why can't we talk about it it's great when they have some like good point i can't hear these people out themselves don't they that's why like with the westboro baptist church it wasn't good when people tried to censor them you know uh you want to hear who these people are and what they want to say and also they thought the videos they did were really funny i don't know if you remember there was a funny era yeah those signs it was whoever was in charge of their sign making really propelled them into like a different stratosphere i mean i thought they were trolling for a while like i couldn't because

it's so extreme and and ridiculous but they weren't were they sincerely held i mean you got to be a next level troll to go at a funeral protesting a funeral the army's just a goof but there are some next level trolls there's that dylan mulvaney guy who's pretending to be a girl you think that's a troll you think of course it is of course it is yes absolutely it is i think that's like a maybe a get famous scheme more than a troll oh no but like he's playing on such obviously misogynistic stereotypes he knows that's that it's got to be a lie it's got to be i think i think there might be like i'm i know this will piss off republicans maybe that's like the troll aspect you don't think oh come on nobody thinks when he goes home he's like this is

all a bit have you seen his videos like that that he thinks that being a girl like invited to the white house he thinks it being a girl is being ditzy and falling over being scared of dragonflies and so do i so you know and so do i well i know you do but you're a misogynist right so that's a thing but i mean you're basically describing my girlfriend right now but you know you you can't believe he's being serious like and isn't that an amazing deep deep cover troll to get to the white house that's amazing it's like that guy ollie london who said he was trans korean right and then you know and then now you think it's in that category well i mean he got surgery to change his face to look korean he even started talking about how he's going to get surgery to have a smaller penis so he could be more career so that's deep level i was thinking about having a smaller penis just so i could be

average you should do that actually because it is cumbersome isn't it it is it gets in the way but so do you think then there's a this does this troll require some sort of reveal yeah i'm waiting for the reveal am i wrong about i think oh i don't think i don't i don't uh i'm not it's a theory i don't have the answer absolutely but like this is the question i guess like when they is there anyone they've let in on the bit like do they have is there a confidant do you think where where uh i would love it is going to their person like yeah obviously it's working house yeah can you believe this? It's working. I don't know. I think...

I know people that are that cooked. Really? No, but I'm just thinking in terms of Occam's razor, right? What is more likely? That this guy genuinely thinks that perpetuate these old stereotypes, 1950s stereotypes

of what it means to be a woman is progressive or he's taking the piss. And I think the latter is more likely. I think there is a third option. Okay, go on. So the third option is they, you know, did like a little bit of like feminine stuff on TikTok.

Everyone told them how great it was. And then they had a video where they're like, I'm actually transitioning into a girl. It went viral. You know, half the people hated, half the, and then like you kind of like, you slowly become more and more. I mean, have you seen this with anything, right?

Like how many comedians you've said, you know, Jim Jefferies makes a bit about guns, now you're the gun guy. They might have been dipping her toe into this sort of waters, and then it's working, and all of a sudden you're making money, and then maybe, I don't know, maybe it's that too.

And then all of a sudden the president's like, you can come to the White House, and then you're like, yeah, I am a girl. I don't know. Maybe there's that. I'd like to uh i'd like to talk to him about it i really would i'd be fascinated i don't think he wants to talk about

it no i know but it'd be interesting okay well i'm willing i'm not saying that i'm wrong either i'm right i could be wrong of course i hope you're right i just think it makes more sense it's funnier yeah it's funny yeah because the videos are funny. Yeah. If he's joking, they are really funny. Yeah, that is super funny if you're just like, I'm going to barely change anything and I'm going to become the most famous girl. I'm going to go to the White House as a girl. Yeah, that is funny. Still going to have the dick, like fucking the whole package.

Just everything. Just barely change anything. One of the most respected women in America right now. Yeah. Yeah, yeah yeah yeah yeah no and probably getting rich that's the part that we're getting rich absolutely yeah that's where that's the part where i was like yeah i get the troll but you're just like once you're like hey i'm like rich now maybe it's like is this a troll or is this my business model yeah but could you really live with i mean like even doing sort of tampon uh promoting

tampons like at some point you would say to yourself look this is just too offensive isn't it like it's just it's you know sure like you kind of get home at night you close the door you're by yourself like cut the shade you're like what am i doing what are we doing here this is getting that i'm fascinated by people people who devote their lives to a complete fantasy. I mean, it is interesting, but maybe he's brought into it. That's comedy. That is comedy right there. That is...

I never thought about that, but I hope you're right. That would be good if also... Imagine Prince Harry was trolling too. He comes over and he goes, jokes, hate this bitch. So do you all really love Meghan over here? I love her yeah

show them the tattoo show them the tattoo i have the tattoos i got her photos not once i moved to america i don't want people to know about me when i was in canada i was a big god

save the queen guy i had uh i love the monarchy i'm a bit of a merkle head i don't know what to tell you do you have a queen tattoo no no no oh okay i don't take it seriously we did have the queen on a queen tattoo? No, no, no. Oh, okay. I'm just taking you seriously. I'm taking you for piss.

We did have the queen on money in Canada, but that's about it. Of course we did. Yeah, yeah. But I will say the hairy thing, it's sort of captivated America, I guess. But to me, my take on it was just like, hairy can't handle a girl like that.

I do find it... Those sheltered guys, he doesn't know how to handle a Hollywood woman like that. I feel like it i do find it i mean those sheltered guys he doesn't he doesn't know how to handle the hollywood woman like that well i'm not i feel like i could kick her i haven't seen i haven't seen the document i've no i i really don't have any interest in it well the only thing i watch my my the limit of my interest is how i love that she keeps getting caught lying i mean that's really that's really funny what were the lies that you could go oh my god she said that when she went to the premiere of the lion king in london the south african actor in the show came to her and said you know when you married harry uh the

people out in the streets of africa were dancing like they did when mandela was released no that's what she said right here and then it just we did we then discovered that the actor the only south african actor in that show didn't go to the premiere and wasn't even in town and never met her oh she's like a pathological pathological liar the thing is we i love it no actors and stuff she also said that they got married a few days in secret before the wedding they got married a few days in secret with the archbishop of canterbury right and the archbishop of canterbury said that did not happen this i mean that's an insane lie and she's got this really great life she has this anecdote she always trots out about writing to hillary clinton and hillary clinton writing to her and and then variety fact checked it and took it out of the article because they realized it

wasn't true so i think she has a pa i think she just keeps getting caught in lies well she's an actor but but working for her but why would anyone trust what she's got to say i'm telling you i feel like i've dated multiple girls like her. Really? They just go like, okay, well, whatever. They just keep moving. Just keep moving until you get what you want. Are you saying that women have a propensity for falsehood?

I'm saying there's a certain type of woman. It's that kind of Hollywood, Instagram model type. I'm going to be rich and famous, and a guy's going to help, and I don't care any of the other parts yeah all i know is that i'm getting rich i mean she was pretty rich and famous before him not at this level oh come on if you she was in a big series she was in that suits thing right yeah she must be making quite a bit of money from that but then nothing nothing compared to what like a million dollars no exactly exactly yeah not like but it's owning the kind of i'm sure real estate yeah of course and but maybe i mean you're i think they own half of netflix now but you're putting a motive on it and the motive is

money i'm more interested in the power is it power yeah but what about these winning people who just lie i love i'm really interested by people who just instantly lie you're saying i got i think there's something about that i mean i've known people like that who would just automatically jump to a lie and you don't know. Did you see this movie? Yes. Yeah, exactly. They just do it.

And I am interested in that kind of person. But I don't know why they exist or what they're doing. Ego maybe? They just, they, I don't know. I don't know why you just do that. There's something about that sort of mind that I find quite interesting. That you just like, this infallibility.

You don't want to be ever like seen as weak or wrong wrong or yeah well maybe maybe it is to do with control maybe it's to do with the fact that you you get the satisfaction of knowing that everyone else is buying into an untruth and you've got the control over that truth i mean that's an interesting psychological prospect you know maybe i should try i'll just try a week of lying do one week of your show where you're just like all just said oh well i know i do lie on stage i mean of course as a stand-up but you're lying all the time you know and that's kind of that's kind of fun as well because it's well i don't know it might be different what type of stand-up you are but like because my stand-up is a sort of warped persona of who i am sure so then you get you get to lie and it is fun yeah mine's more just like a

bigger piece of shit like yeah exactly i just do like the more of like villainous version of myself. Exactly. So why do so many stand-ups, they sort of take the worst aspects of their own personality and accentuate them? I just do because it's funny. Sometimes I'll say awful things. The quirks are the funny parts.

Yeah, I guess. Sometimes I'll say awful things because I go, that's the funniest thing to say. And then I'll be like, uh. Awful things are really funny. I mean, if you say the worst possible thing, which is why, you know, the kind of woke thing is so mirthless because to say the worst possible thing is the worst possible thing in their mind so they they right and it's strange because we

never used i you know heckles it might be different here but in the uk heckles have changed in tone heckles used to be probably drunk someone trying to be funny someone trying to be funnier than you someone trying to do that kind of thing and the new kind of heckle is the kind of pearl clutching. How dare you say that? This is morally objectionable. It's a weird development. We had a friend of ours, actually, Aaron Berg, who just did a Gotham comedy last week,

and he posted the video in this one. It was like, you're a racist and all this. It turns out she's like a blogger, the whole thing. Yeah, she's a blogger. They always have some sort of skin in the game. But the trouble is it kind of works in the UK. I mean, a friend of mine was performing at a club

in Brighton and a couple of activists tweeted the venue and said, her material makes us feel unsafe. And they did pull her gig and she lost a couple of hundred quid.

You know what I mean? So it does have that power. You don't want to be working at the venues where the owners are pussy. No, New York. But there's more of them in the UK than here.

Most people would pull it. Canada, the same. But New York, you legitimately have to commit actual crime. Really? For them to care. I feel, yeah, I remember that even like the guy would be like, yeah, a lot of the club owners like might be like, oh my God.

Then they come back and they're like, yeah, I'll put this in the recycling bin. Things are better here. Like your promoters are tougher. Your promoters will tell people to fuck off if they are being unreasonable. The industry works how you're describing. Yeah. I always think the industry, like the actual like tv networks and like if you had a commercial and you know whatever it doesn't take much to get you fired but i think comedy club owners like

they feel like they hate that shit too you know what i mean yeah that's why they started a comedy club i wonder why it's happened over the uk then that's weird to me but it has it's it is like that now among many promoters and i don't know maybe it's just because they're they don't want the risk because of course now with social media at that point though why on a why like be in the comedy club business like if you're if you're like hey i want like there's nothing probably that sucks more as like owning a store or whatever than dealing with like complainers yeah exactly exactly and if you're like hey imagine running any other thing where you go okay i'm to have a store and someone complains. Be like, can't get rid of that.

Someone's like, hey, I didn't like this flavor. Oh my God, that's gone. And all your employees like actively court these complainers because they think it's funny. Yeah. Although that is how most businesses work. When people complain, they say, oh, well, we'll do anything to sort of solve it and sort you out. That is how most businesses work.

But comedy shouldn't work that way. No, no, no, no. Comedy is like the thing that specifically should not work that way yeah exactly i guess it depends on what the thing is though like okay so if you were i guess this is where it's different because the person if you were at a store like walmart yeah and you were like if you came and said hey you know what i really uh didn't like this person they were rude to me yes and you might reprimand that person but if you said hey i really hate this bucket you shouldn't hate this bucket.

You shouldn't sell this bucket. And you're like, yeah, it's our number one selling bucket. Thanks for the tip, but we're going to keep selling the bucket. Sure, yeah. So it's different. But it's about levels of being unreasonable. It's the product versus the person.

And I guess with stand-up, you're both. That's the problem. Well, it's like MyPillow. What about it? How is it like MyPillow? Well, MyPillow was the person and there was a product

and then they hated the person so much that they stopped selling the product. Okay. What was MyPillow? It's Mike there was a product and then they hated the person so much that they stopped selling the product. Okay. What was MyPillow? It's Mike Lindell. It's the guy who was like a Trump sycophant. Okay. And he had a pillow.

So he's famous. He used to be a crackhead. And then he turned his life around and he started selling this pillow. He's a very religious Christian guy. And it's like a huge product. It was massive. Like everywhere. Made in America pillow, very popular.

And then he started supporting Trump. And then with the January 6th stuff, he's like, the election was stolen. He got kicked off everywhere for saying the elections were stolen. And it just got to the point where all these companies were like, we can't even carry your pillows anymore. Okay. Well, that's tragic. Yeah, yeah.

Were they good pillows? Not really. It depends who you ask. No, I've heard good things. Well, that's tragic. Yeah, yeah. Were they good pillows? Not really. It depends who you ask. No, I've heard good things. It depends who you ask. They were like, you know, some people say they were good, some people say they're average.

Danny was doing My Pillow Bet on stage and you'd always talk to people and every single person said they liked the pillow. No, no, no. That's not true. Really?

The odd person would say they liked the pillow. I could make my piece having a nice pillow if I knew the person who made the pillow had horrible opinions. I could deal with that. I could square that If I knew the person who made the pillow had a horrible opinions, I could deal with that.

I could square that circle. They weren't even like, he wasn't even like, it's not Kanye West opinions. They're just like, Hey, I think there was some improprieties in the election. I could even have,

what does this have to do with pillow? I could even have a fascist's pillow. If it was, if it was a nice pillow and I was getting a good night's sleep, I could, I could sleep like him. Yeah, that's a great new brand yeah and like

and now all his ads are just on because i think his ads were generally on fox okay but we're spread around and now he's just like yeah he can only advertise and like all his like he's like use like uh promo code stolen election like he's so okay didn't you have something with chicka phil as well chick-fil-a you see this is how i know nothing about america but didn't they say something because i thought that was the most man he does it the sort of the way that someone's like justin bieber never heard of them no i'm literally very ignorant about this country no chick-fil-a was one of the most manufactured uh things what was their thing so the Chick-fil-A was one of the most manufactured things. What was their thing?

So the Chick-fil-A scandal was, so Chick-fil-A is owned by a Christian family. Okay. And they're closed on Sundays, which is like crazy for a company of their size. But it's the Sabbath. But it's the Sabbath and they're religious or whatever. And then it was determined that the CEO gave a donation of his thousand donations

to some cause that was one of their things was anti-gay marriage. But it was one of many donations that he made as a civilian. Do people boycott? Yeah. Now nobody cares. It's over. They boycotted very temporarily. as a civilian do people boycott yeah so if you now have chicken

now nobody cares it's over this is five years but they were saying that if you ate there you're a homophobe literally I remember I posted

when I moved to New York because at the time there was no Chick-fil-A in Canada and I posted because they had these I think I posted because they have these

like really high-tech garbage cans there or whatever it's like a compactor or whatever and I posted and someone actually messaged me being like someone or whatever it's like a compactor or whatever and i posted and someone actually messaged me being like someone i knew who's like you're still like supporting homophobia okay a comic no no just some girl but girl but they've forgotten it now that's weird everything why aren't they every scandal there's very few scandals that have any sort of

uh life okay like almost everything but also that one doesn't make sense anyway i mean there were loads of sort of old school gay activists who were against gay marriage i mean that that was like a pretty standard view in the uk yeah you mean sorry i don't mess well because because marriage was seen as a sort of heteronormative institution oh and and so the idea of being gay and in a marriage is almost self-defeating of course so you know there were loads of gay activists who were against it's also like's also like the guy that has a guy he's been with for 10 years. Well, there's also that. But it's funny being like, hey, you're going pretty hard on this anti-gay marriage stuff. You're just like, I just.

Well, there is also that, but it's a really conservative thing, marriage, right? And that's why it was a conservative party in the UK that pushed through gay marriage. Yeah. And it wasn't the left. So, you know, I get why. I mean, I think it's a no brainer. I think if you're going to have state partnerships enshrined in marriage, you have to offer it to everyone. I think it's a no-brainer. I think if you're gonna have state partnerships enshrined in marriage, you have to offer it to everyone.

I think it's a no-brainer. Me too. But I don't think it's automatically homophobic to say that you disapprove of gay marriage. And also, if you're religious and you see marriage as a religious thing, I don't think it's homophobic either. I think it's, I don't think, some of those arguments I see is like not necessarily like homophobic,

but I see it more like ideological and like not set in reality. Do you know what I mean? I feel like some of that stuff you're just, you know, it's when people are like arguing for certain things and you're like, okay, well, good luck with that. But like, it's just so, yeah, America, like maybe America will roll it back that way. But it's like, that's not, I'll tell you what,

that's not going to be free if you did roll that back for four years and then it would go back again. But also it's all, it all happens so quickly, hasn't it? I mean, because even Obama was against gay marriage. Yeah.

You know, Hillary Clinton, everyone was, and then all of a sudden it's, it's just, it's just a seat check. So you've got to accept that some people are going to take a while

to catch up with that or accept that, you know, it's too quick. it's this purity thing. That for sure, yeah. Like it's this, it's, you know, it's a a purity thing where you're like if you have this one wrong thought

then you're probably cancel your whole chain of chicken sandwiches yeah or whatever like this i don't know we had a similar thing with a gay cake i don't know if you've it's in bell we've talked about the gay cake all right no not the not in the uk they're a different one we had a gay cake in belfast in northern ire Yeah, it was a Christian bakery. I wonder if that was like a copycat gay cake scandal. I think it came first, you know.

So the American one was a copycat. Oh, but actually, no, that's it. I don't know which, is it the same story?

Well, Colorado was, there was a baker and he's very religious and he refused to make it. And they keep dragging it back into the courts because he refuses to do it.

And then they keep going there to ask him. Oh, it's still going on? Well, it seems like it's perpetual because he'll say like a gay couple will say like, hey, can you make me a cake? Wait, more people just keep going? No, and then so then like a trans person shows up and they're like, we want a trans birthday cake.

And he's like, no. And then they go, okay. And then they sue him again. I mean, gay people should be making their own cakes anyway yeah it's just uh yeah they're tormenting this guy in belfast it was it was really innocuous that they wanted something to do with a support of gay marriage and they had uh who are the two puppets from the muppet show who share a bed eric and burton right so there was a picture of them and so it was really sort of innocent it was and they said no we're not gonna it's just about the design you know and we it doesn't so you know and i think

everyone comes out badly there like the gay the gay guy could have just gone next door to the next bakery and they could or they could have just baked the cake you know it's so i i just feel like no one could and it's a it's a very odd one as well because i do get the point that they weren't discriminating against him for being gay they didn't say i'm not baking this cake because you're gay they're saying i'm not baking the cake because i don't support the the message on sesame street i don't like sesame street which i think is legitimate what if you came in and said you know i want a pro-isis cake i think it would be okay to say i don't want to bake sure well they're i guess their idea is you're not allowed to they make a list of things

that you can't discriminate against right right okay so it's like you actually you're allowed yeah and you go isis is not in that list. Well, maybe it should be in that list. Maybe it should be. ISIS should be a protected class. Well, I mean, they've got their rights and their beliefs. Yeah.

I think they're very misunderstood. So what happened? I just want to say this podcast is officially pro, no. Sponsored by. Pro everybody. We love Kanye West. We love everybody.

Yeah. Is that you? Are you on record saying you also love hitler i love every no i just i love everybody you're just leaving it at that yeah it's a very problematic statement i know because there's a lot of people included in that statement which i mean everybody's included yeah quite literally you love pedophiles i love everybody you love pedophiles equally the same i mean i'm gonna stopping i'm gonna not one i'm gonna clip you saying love pedophiles there you're the one that says you love them but uh i'm pretty sure i love everybody there you go yeah you heard it here first so what happened with the ernie and bird thing what was the legislation who won uh who won that one i think uh the cake yeah the baker one here too but it was very weird because i was in

belfast uh very soon after it and there was a pride parade on that day and they had armed police outside the bakery because they were scared of the gays sort of trashing the bakery uh you know which i think is inappropriate behavior for gay people for a pride parade you're meant to be about peace and love and harmony not trashing yeah the problem is is once you start taking these ideas that are like the forcing things you know yeah once you start extrapolating it you eventually wind up at something that everybody hates everybody will wind up at one thing where they go like yeah i guess you shouldn't force this business to participate in this thing yeah eventually but as i kind of i've obtusely kind of want to be on the side of the baker because i don't like pride

i don't i stay well clear of it. You don't go to the pride parade? I hate it. Did you used to like it or never liked it? Never really. I don't really like crowds, but also, Are you single?

No. Okay, it's more of a fun thing when you're single. No, but I, you know, when I was young and single and I would avoid the pride thing,

I don't like that if everyone's sort of being collected together. You don't like being lumped in. Yeah, expressing the same views. There's a thing in my mind when everyone's together and they're all enjoying the same thing or saying the same thing i get nervous i had to walk out of the um lady gaga concert for the same reason like

because everyone was enjoying themselves and i thought that's some there should be more diversity there should be some people objecting and saying this is bad there should be more dissent i feel like it's got a kind of fascistic you know a bit like a rally yeah i mean i do kind of know what you mean yeah like if everyone loves something you're just like i mean it's not that great yeah exactly you want you want to put the other side across. Yeah, you're at like a funeral and everyone's just one after another talking about how great they are. Not as haters.

One extent of it is I didn't like him. I didn't like him. Although someone did that recently. Did you see that viral funeral clip? Yeah, we did, yeah. What she said about her dad. They're going on about her dad, yeah. Do you think she was just a contrarian?

She's like, I mean, she actually had something really nice planned and then she's like, well, I'll be a hack at this point I think she was just like I want to play devil's advocate here

right okay what if he was a horrible guy he's just a hipster yeah maybe that's what it was but yeah pride

I don't do pride I mean I accidentally got caught in a one year I was at a I was near a pride parade and I got locked in a restaurant at Pizza Express

because fascists turned up to attack the gay people at the pride but that was back in the day oh when you had that fascist actually like but they never they don't do that anymore they they probably join in you know it's a big change but also i don't know because the pride has sort of morphed into this weird it's mostly straight people now it's corporate it's like a straight day out and you bring your family and your kids and you know there's nothing subversive about it it's so and i hate going into corporate thing yeah it's like the santa claus parade basically your thanksgiving parade yeah and i hate going into like going to a restaurant i've got the pride the rainbow flag

all over my you know and i'm like i don't need to be told well i went into a wagamama and there was a sign saying you know we're proud to hire gay people but why wouldn't you be like were you not before i would assume that you're that you don't hate gays. You don't need to tell me. Just so you know, we don't hate gays. The problem is we have good pancakes and we even hire gays. Just don't tell me that because it makes me suspicious. Someone says to me, I really don't hate gays.

I think you hate gays. Why would you have to say that? You know what it is? It's because there's one chain that started doing that. And then they were the first ones. They go, hey, we don't hate gays. And everybody were the first ones they go hey we don't hate gays and everybody's like wait so do we if we don't say it does that mean right exactly you shouldn't have to say what is the default expectation right and then everybody has to

just start saying the default thing yeah yeah exactly yeah just so you know we are gays i remember the my first memory that i always think of when i went to the gay pride parade was we got stuck in the parade like we were my family was driving home and I was like eight and this guy with like nipple tassels and the whole thing comes up to the window and he goes we're proud we're gay so get out of our way that was his chant that he was saying to every car why like what is this and my dad's like just kids like don't worry about it but the fetishy thing is quite weird as well like you know that's they got a little much yeah that's not your who you are innately that's just something you like to do yeah i think it's true yeah yeah i find it a bit odd because it's not just gay pride you've

also got the pride for the various different identities and flags and there's a bear pride per you know bears yeah yeah are you quite a bear are you quite berry i would be i would be i think you would be I think I would be. If he was true to himself. Oh, you're not gay. I'm not gay. You're not gay. Okay, fine.

But you would make a decent bear. I think so, yeah. Yeah, definitely. You would make a decent bear. You would be an otter, right? Probably. What's an otter? Is that an old twink otter?

An otter is like a sort of athletic semi-hairy. I think I've heard this before. Yeah, sort of semi-hairy athletic. It's like a twink. Athletic. You hear that? That ages out you seem quite athletic

thank you so athletic is so like if you're if you're a bear like an otter is a subcategory otter is sort of like jacked and gated like

but you can be like a wolf wolf is sort of semi-hairy muscular and sexually aggressive that would be a wolf you can be a gym rat if you go to the gym you can be a pup a pup is like

oh a cub a cub is like a bear a young bear a sort of hairy twink I think a hairy twink would be a pup. A pup is like, oh, a cub. A cub is like a bear, a young bear, a sort of hairy twink. A hairy twink would be a cub. Too old for her to be a cub. So it is like a menagerie. There's very specific

classifications of the game. Everything just always gets chopped up. Let's hear more about Otter again. Otters are very sought after. You would be very, I think you would do well

do people self identify as these things and then people are like you're not that like is it similar where they go like hey I'm an otter

come on no it's one of those things where people probably put it in their Reiner profiles and like I'm an otter and you show up you go an otter huh yeah

that's you get catfished more like a catfish yeah you look like an otter that got eaten by a bear you look like the bearter that got eaten by a bear. You look like the bear that ate the otter. I don't mind the bears getting together and having their parade.

But, you know, they've never been discriminated against as a group. Is there a bear parade? Yeah, there's a bear pride. They've got their own flag. It's got a little paw on the flag. Bear pride. Really? And they go on a march. But they haven't been discriminated against.

There isn't a history of people burning fat, hairy men at the state. I guess because they're physically imposing. Could be that. But I think they've always been fine. I understood gay pride in the early years when it's illegal, there's discrimination. You're going to get locked away. I mean, the Stonewall is very close to here.

Right. So it makes complete sense that they have that. So that's why pride to me makes no sense at all now complete sense that they have that. So that's why pride to me makes no sense at all now because we have complete equal rights. So what's the point? What are you marching for? And then eventually

when they were like, we can't have police and you're like, this is like a giant parade. Like we have to have somebody. Well, it just became a dead parade for all those causes too. It's anything now

and it's anything and nothing and it's just a big excuse for a party and it's corporate. It just feels so... That's the part of it that's like fine though. The excuse for a party. And it's corporate. It just feels so... But that's the part of it that's like, fine, though. The excuse for a party where you're like, I don't know, if you're like 20 and live in the city and it's an excuse for this big party.

Yeah, it is, but they... Anything can be... That part I get. Yeah, but then why carry all these placards about how oppressed you are? Well, that's the part where it's... Yeah, that's what they... Because you're not.

I'm back out. Yeah, yeah. The oppression element is probably waning as the years go by. But it's just not true. Not in a metropolitan, I guess. I mean, it's true in Saudi Arabia, and it's true in the Middle East and all those sorts of places. But, you know, they don't fly the flags over there where it would actually make a difference.

You know, I mean, the corporations that have the gay pride flag over here, and then they discreetly remove it when it comes to their Middle East branches you know yeah i know all the time that happens well what i always think of it like okay so whenever you see a guy like you remember how i don't know if you saw this but there was like a a guy that um uh there was like a shooter and his dad you remember his dad was like a homophobe no it was recently in colorado spring the colorado spring so it was a shooter i did a bad job explaining but his dad basically came out and he was like no my son's not gay people were yeah right and i go my point is that like so there was this guy that was homophobic and everyone in the world's seen it if something was common when one happened we wouldn't everyone in the whole

country wouldn't see it right you go right if you go everyone thinks this you go well then why anytime they find one, it is like the number one topic. That's obviously something that's rare. And it's, yeah, exactly. It's rare to even hear, like when you hear that out of someone's mouth, you go like, oh, crazy.

Like I didn't know those people still existed. I just really mistrust this idea of wanting to be a victim. I just, I think it's really vulgar. Like why deny all the progress that's been made and pretend you're a victim? What is the allure of it? What's the appeal of it? I don't, you know. Advancement in your comedy career.

Yeah, advancement in your career. Oh, there career yeah advancement social status of some sort yeah yeah but i don't think it's quite perverse acceptance it is but why have we reached a situation where that would where you could garner social status out of being a victim why why is that rewarded in that well i would i i think it's like a part of culture that's always existed and if you look back to um not not in the same way but if you look at like okay think about like music when it was like everyone was emo right

yeah like being the depressed guy would like gain social status in that community but that's not very long ago that's not a big historical no but I mean like you can pick communities

like I'm sure that there was like the beatnik era probably being like the depressed guy was like a badge of honor almost so there's I think there's it's not the first time

that like maybe not putting your being like what you would think of as like a badge of honor almost so there's i think there's it's not the first time that like maybe not putting your being like uh what you would think of as like a bad quality was a positive quality well i mean some people have argued this about christianity is that christianity promoted the idea of the triumph of the victim you know you've got christ on the cross and the symbol of the cross is you know i am the victim sorry i won't i'm not going near kanye but uh and that this is that and that's where i mean there's even it's been it's been proposed that that's where this idea comes from i guess you could say you're like i'm this guy that took all this stuff that's christ

he's very he's up there very dramatically he's like christ is trying to be a victim it's very exactly it's very dramatic like my friend my friend scott caporo who's a stand-up he does this bit about christ on the cross you know forgetting his safe word that's why it was up there and it's like but there is this sort of yeah and there is a case to this that the woke ideology could be said to have been birthed by christianity the remnants of christianity because it does follow those those ideas even though ostensibly it's dead against allah was like yeah no my son's not doing none of that shit yeah but i just find it really like self-pity is a really

unattractive quality anyway you know and i i i just i just i'm when i hear people complain when they've got so much and we're all so pampered we're just all so pampered can't we just accept that we're you know we've got it pretty well oh i guess we should okay so i guess we'll wrap up here you know what we'll tell you we're gonna get you out of here but we'll tell you what what the ones you want to talk about your book like i don't need to talk well just maybe whip it out can we just say the title of it because that's you're kind of doing like a tour for it right it's coming out it's called the new puritans it's sort of uh it's about the religion of social justice and it's about the way in which it's captured the world but the other thing about it is what i was trying

to do in the book is sort of explain you know people are really baffled by the fact that they can see that society has changed that this ideology has gripped every major institution even the corporate world you know media the arts entertainment politics the judiciary the army everything you know um and they're confused because it describes itself as progressive as liberal and for social justice against racism and it seems to do the opposite of what it says so so really the books are trying to talk through where it's come from how you get through sort of the linguistic minefields how is it that an anti-racist activist ends up making society more racist and racially divided so it's it's it's really about the cultural and predictions of where we wind up i've i've suggested a way out in the book you know

well i'm also interested i tried to draw a direct comparison with what happened at salem because i think it's kind of similar insofar as you had a community of very good decent people in salem you know it only lasted for a year they weren't witch hunters that's not what they did they just got caught in this major hysteria and it was just these children saying they saw witches everywhere which wouldn't have mattered if all the adults said no you don't That's not happening. Okay. What happened was the elites the magistrates the ministers. They all said yes It's true and we're gonna hang and kill the people that you can that's the similar thing That's what happening today. If you think of all the activists online

Screaming about fascists being everywhere or turfs or whatever word they want to use uh the only reason they have any power is because the elites say yes okay we're going to take that seriously and we're going to punish all these people that you want us to punish and it's also a similar in salem all of the prosecutions were secured on what they called spectral evidence which is what we call lived experience so so the girls didn't have any evidence they just had their own truth uh their way of knowing so so the message really if you look at what happened in salem and the way they got out of it is that eventually the elite started saying oh we're not going along with what you're doing and that's that is the sort of more anonymous tips from

six-year-olds right exactly and don't you know so when these people are screaming about turfs and all the rest just say you're. Sure. But probably the first people to stick their necks out to say we're not doing this anymore probably was not an easy position. Well, in Salem, they got hanged. Right. So the people who said the girls are lying or the girls are deluded. Oh, that sounds like some witch bullshit. They died. Right.

Yeah, exactly. But what I find very interesting about Salem is most, the more I read about it. All I'm hearing is hocus pocus. Most of the elites didn't really believe it like most of the magistrates didn't because when the girls accused one of the rich guys they said oh that you're probably mistaken so they they never so they they accused the acting head of Harvard and and the the judges say no you're wrong you've got it wrong you've got it wrong you're right about all the other ones yeah you're right about the ones we don't care about sure all right on that note yes thank you that was it wrong you're right about all the other ones yeah you're right about the ones we don't care about sure alright on that note

yes thank you that was fun dude you're super funny thank you thanks for having me alright peace thank you

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