The Boyscast with Ryan Long - Zuby on THE BOYSCAST

Episode Date: October 9, 2020

Zuby is a British rapper, podcaster, and ebook author. He was born in Luton, Bedfordshire, England and raised in Saudi Arabia. AND NOW HE HAS APPEARED ON THE BOYSCAST patreon.com/theboyscast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

And you can tell our friends, and they can have my things when we're dead But we don't live forever, but we don't live forever And you can tell our friends internet bad boy, modern day renaissance man. You are sort of like, because that is what people used to be, you know what I mean? Like musicians and artists used to do all sorts of different things and that's kind of where you are as well, right? Do you see yourself like that? Yeah, I guess so, man. You know, it all started out primarily with me just being a rapper and over time it's evolved into a lot of different things. People know me for a lot of different things now, so it's cool.

You know, I'm in this unique space where I am sort of the one and only Zuby. And I'm the only person who does what I do in the combination that I do, which is cool because it means people appreciate that. People can pick and choose what they want and what they need from that. And it means I just get to be me and earn a living being me, which is beautiful. And people don't know this, but Zuby said he doesn't do very many interviews, but he made an exception for the kid. So yeah, well, I'm traveling. I'm traveling soon. So I've been trying to wrap everything up before I go so that I'm not too distracted. I just want to go and focus on my music. And so I've declined like at least a dozen interviews over the next couple of weeks, just because i don't want to be distracted because if i if i once i'm away if i'm trying to write and i every day i'm having to do interviews

and stuff then i know i won't be able to tap into my creative side properly so yeah you're a special man ryan that's what that's what it is that stuff burns you out dude i was the same way it's like i was trying to figure that out i'm like okay maybe i'll just do interviews like monday and tuesday every second week like you try to figure it out because especially someone's like well it's an hour and you're like no it's not an hour it's four hours and potentially like half your day because it's a headspace thing right yeah so yeah it's trying to yeah clump it in whatever but it is cool to like i know that you probably do this all the time and so do i but it is kind of interesting like i kind of feel like i knew you because we were talking on twitter and i you know we've been sharing each other's stuff or whatever it's the internet that's the best thing

about quarantine like the other day i was talking about this this guy lou spears he's like a big comedian in australia and he's like a friend of mine and we've done some podcasts and stuff and then my chick was like so when was when did you guys actually meet and i was like i guess we haven't actually met in my mind i'm like yeah my mind i was like this is like a friend of mine she's like you've never met and i was like i don't know i guess yeah dude the internet is crazy i mean just before recording this i was just in town um changing some money and um i was just walking i was just walking through and there was just you know a guy maybe in his late 40s early 50s who just pointed at me and was like zoobie yeah from twitter i was like oh geez and then he just stopped me and he we ended

up having like a five-minute conversation and he like just wanted to like share his thoughts five minute conversation yeah he wanted to like big me up for just uh you know it's funny like this is you know like a you know white guy in his 50s he's just like man like I love what you stand for I love what you're saying you know like you've got so much support this and that he's like, it's so rare to have someone like you doing this and that. And it's dope. You know, I mean, it was the same. I went to the U S last year. Um, and I went to, you know, 10 cities I've never even been to before.

And every single city I got, I got recognized. I got stopped. I had people like, yeah. And just the amount of people that were like, I know you from Twitter. I was like, geez, this is, you're like, just let me piss. Stop yelling at me. Yeah. It's just weird, you know? Cause I, as know you from Twitter. I was like, geez, this is crazy. You're like, just let me piss. Stop yelling at me. Yeah, it's just weird, you know, because as an artist, right, I mean, obviously I figured the thing that people would know me for

would be my music. And it did used to be, and it still is to some degree. But it's just strange how over in the past sort of 20 months, not even two years, how things have just grown so much and grown through avenues that I didn't previously expect people to know me for. And that's been really fascinating. But it's cool. It's cool. It's beautiful. I mean, my goal is to have a positive impact on tens of millions of people. And so whatever puts me closer to that as long as people find some value in it and find it inspiring motivational entertaining interesting whatever then i'm doing

my job because i kind of put you in that category which i always like try to be a little bit where you it's like you're mad cynical but you're positive you know what i mean because you're you know i'm super positive yeah but you're talking about things are the problems with this and this and that and people might put you in some category. But at the end of the day, you're like, no, I'm telling people to be better. Yeah, exactly. The root of it all is in trying to encourage, motivate, and inspire people. And also encourage people to think freely and to be themselves and to challenge bad ideas and to not allow crazy people to run roughshod all over them. Right. Which is something I think you highlight as well in your comedy. Right. And a lot of the

power of comedy and simply just, you know, I'm not a comedian, but I have a sense of humor. Yeah. But you're like popular from, I'll talk about that in a second. Yeah, sure. But you know, it's like one thing that's been missing a lot is just a sense of humor, right? Like just the ability for people to laugh at life and to see the funny side of things and to not, sure, you know, some things need to be addressed head on in a serious manner. But oftentimes, even if you're trying to address something that's pretty serious, one of the best ways to do it is through satire or through comedy or through using people's own logic and arguments against them, et cetera. Right. So, you know, you had that video that totally blew up about how

the woke, woke people in racist agree, agree on it. And it's like, right. So many people have made, so many people have made that point. My deadlift video where I identified as a woman and I broke the British women's deadlift. So many people have made, have made that point in a very serious way and going into the biology and the science of, you know what? And I'm just like, you know what, actually, I'm just going to take what you're saying and I'm going to run with it. Yeah. And I will show you how absurd it is by running with it. You did the same thing. You're just like, okay, you guys are literally advocating for having like racially segregated spaces

and for, for uh you know judging people based on the the color of their skin instead of the and it's like hmm this sounds remarkably similar to so so it's like you just do a thing it's like yeah and then people can see it and be like yeah he's right you know like yeah fair enough and at the same time it's got that humorous element so one people share it more But then also even people who sort of like want to be angry or want to be upset, it sort of puts out that fire a little bit because they can't really they can't really say anything because they know it's like, oh, well, you know, like with my deadlift video, it's like, oh, well, if we say he's not actually a woman, then by their own definition, that's transphobic, right? Because you've been saying a woman's anyone who identifies as one. And so it's like, okay, either. Tell me what it was if they don't know. Okay. So, so this is going back to February last year, February, 2019. I posted a video of me doing a 230 kilogram deadlift. And I wrote something like, I keep hearing about how biological men have no strength advantage over women in 2019. So watch me destroy the British women's deadlift record without trying. P.S. I identified as a woman whilst lifting the weight. Don't be a bigot. Right. And the video went bananas, got over 3 million views. Now it got seen by millions and millions of people.

views now it got seen like by millions and millions of people and um yeah i mean that was the thing that really catalyzed my audience growth like to to a crazy degree and then you know off the back of that people sort of got to know me and discovered a lot more about me and my music and my podcast and the other they're like ah this guy's all positive yeah yeah yeah most definitely but um i i think the the humor and the ability to smile and the ability to laugh at things and like some people are starting to think that not not starting to think right. You've got this whole segment of the population now here in the West where people sort of feel like not having a sense of humor and being easily offended and being offended constantly on the behalf of other people who aren't offended is some sort of virtue, right? Like being weak, being fragile, being easily offended is some sort of virtue. And it's like, no, that's not a positive characteristic, right? Like I can't trust people who can't laugh at themselves, right? Who can't just like hear a

joke and be like, ha ha, that's funny. Or even if it's sort of messed up, it's like, okay, it's sort of messed, but it's funny, right? That's, that's the point of comedy. And when people just don't have the ability to do that or to laugh at themselves or to laugh at ideas or whatever, then I don't know. I think those are, those are the people who we need to be sort of concerned about and on guard for, because once people can't laugh at things, then yeah, you're sort of not in very

good territory it's also the mark of like a fragile you know like ideology or a system of the same thing as anything if you have like a girlfriend and you're everything's sensitive if people make a joke about you you're whatever but if you know she like she's mad down forever then it wouldn't be like that the same with exactly you know so if you if you're like oh i know one plus one's two and actually someone someone says it's three. You're like, okay, whatever. But if you're like, actually not sure you're like, well, the thing is, and you start going into your arguments because you're not that certain, you know, I have a, listen to this. My, um, uh, I was thinking that I should, um, identify as a woman and break the record for not crying for the longest amount of days you're definitely trying to get in trouble or you get a you get a girl that identify as a man

and break be like a trans man and break the nagging the men's nagging world record she's operating at an event oh man yeah like dude there's uh yeah the the world needs the world needs comedy it needs you people need the ability to you know be serious but also to be able to laugh at things i i think it's so important especially those because there's like the linchpins like the problem is again i can imagine you don't give a shit about trans stuff or whatever but it's like that became the linchpin that everything has to... They're like, this is the one that you really separates whether you're on our team or not. And you're like, well, I don't care about the thing, but I'm not going to be bullied around mentally.

Yeah, it's also just about the truth, right? It wasn't a political tweet. It wasn't even something that like there should... Honestly, it's such a... The truth It wasn't even something that like there should, honestly, it's such a truth. You're the strongest woman alive. Yeah. It's a, it's a dumb conversation, right? The, the concept that I can be a woman just because like I say I am is absurd, right? That, that, that is, that is an absurd idea.

Anyone who's like truly believes that is like, they actually need help. Like that doesn't make sense. You're saying that I like me with my beard and my deep voice and my large muscles etc and my my penis and my balls and everything or me with my penis and balls and small muscles like simply by saying i'm a woman that it's now totally cool for me to go and compete in sport in rugby in boxing in american football, in weightlifting against like women, like that is an absurd concept, right? It's an absurd idea.

So the best way to deal with absurd ideas, I think, is to just to sort of run with them, right? Because if someone reaches a place that they haven't reached through any sort of logic or reason, then you can't, you're not going to get them out of any sort of logic or reason, then you can't, you're not going to get them out of it with any logic or reason, right? You just kind of have to show them like, okay, let's go with what you're saying. And let's see how this, let's see how this pans out. Like, let's see if this makes sense. And there are a lot of things which are much more, you know, gray areas. And again, even that whole issue, like that's the thing about like

biology and physicality and sports. It's not even really anything about like trans people as individuals or whatever. Like most people, whether they're more liberal or more conservative, most people don't really care. Firstly, most people don't even know anybody who's trans. And for the most part, people are like, look, if you're an adult, you know, like you do, if you're not harming other people, you know, people can have their own individual personal feelings about stuff. But it's like, you know, like you do you. Not a lot of people. People aren't going to come in, you know, bother you about it or harass you or call you names or whatever. Like most people, certainly in the West, most people actually very, very deeply tolerant, like regardless of their political orientation. regardless of their political orientation. But when it comes to things like sports or like sex segregated spaces or stuff involving children,

then that's when you're going to get people who are like, wait, hang on a minute. Like, no, you know, putting your four-year-old on hormones or puberty blockers. No, that's a bad idea. You know, four-year-olds shouldn't be picking their gender.

Yeah, it becomes less funny too. Because even like, because they're doing it to someone else where it's like, like because even like no because you're they're doing it to someone else where it's like exactly like when they were going oh we're gonna have like you know trans men in the olympic trans women in the olympics i was like hilarious like i love it like there was a there was a few meets where you saw the competition and the podium was like two trans people that won like the track meets and i was like this is amazing like i love just i just love watching the whole thing be like such a mess. Yeah. But then when they're like, Hey, we're going to do kids. You're like, I'd still funny to me. I still find it funny,

but like, it's a little less funny. Yeah. Yeah. Like, I mean, I think, you know, jokes can be made about anything, but like, I don't think that's to me, like, that's not, it's not funny. Like, I think you can deal with it with humor humor but i think like the actual thing that is being pushed is actually i don't just think it's i think it's evil i think it's insidious i think it's deeply insidious i think it's like very morally and ethically incorrect well you know what it's it works it's i was thinking about this yesterday it's like and first of all it is funny like everyone's into politics yesterday like i don't know we had the vice presidential debate oh yeah and dude my entire who cares my entire timeline was like tweeting about the vice presidential debate oh yeah and do my entire who cares my

entire timeline was like tweeting about the vice president i'm like these people that weren't into politics years ago i'm like you're into the vice presidential debate now that's a like as if they're watching as if it's like the nba finals like you don't care so much about this now well that's you now right but it was so funny because pence they're like beating him up over the, the, cause he liked the gay conversion therapy. Right. Which he said, he said, you can be in a,

if you want to do it, but it's like by their logic, if you want to do that, why can't you do that? You can make yourself into a lizard. So if you're a gay dude and you're like, ah, I want to go convert.

Why is that? My, actually my friend had a funny thing. He was saying that like, uh, we were doing videos and he gave me this idea that saying that this idea that's saying that if they make gay conversion therapy illegal, do you think it's going to create a black market for gay conversion therapy? People are going to have to go to alleyways to get their gay conversion therapy. Why on earth should – why would it be illegal, right?

If you're forcing it on people, that's a whole different story. Obviously, yeah. But why should it be illegal? If someone wants to do that, whether or not it works, that's a whole different story. Obviously, yeah. But like why should it be illegal? If someone wants to do that, like whether or not it works, that's a whole different conversation as well. But like – It doesn't work the other way. I've tried to convert myself to be gay.

Lord, have I tried. I'm not going to ask how you've tried. There's money to be made. There's bags of cash waiting. If only I could gargle. Oh, geez. Okay. I'm not on that one, but you do you, man, like we said.

Yeah. But there's like the same thing. It's like, you know, and that's why it's like with all this stuff. I mean, this is probably how you kind of found yourself. Like, you know, I mean, you do so much things and you've always been like a political voice and entrepreneur and all that stuff. But even with me with comedy, it's like the problem is they want it. Like the people that have this ideology want to like take over little pockets. They want to take over music and then they want to take over this and they want to take over comedy.

And it's kind of like, all right, well, I'm not going to like let you take over my thing and like tell me what to say. And that's kind of like all it is. Like, I'm not going to like, let you take over my thing and like, tell me what to say. And that's kind of like all it is like, where's that? Yeah. You're a comedian. I'm a rapper. We are, we are like people in our fields should be the absolute bastions of free speech. Yeah. If you've got rappers or comedians who are like suggesting that free speech should be limited or something, then we've entered crazy land. And see with music, like other types of music, it music it's a little you know if you're like in a folk band or whatever and they and you're singing about you know girls and stuff and they go oh you need to do this stuff you're like okay whatever it doesn't really affect me the same as you're an athlete but if you're a rapper and this is like every song is like here's a bunch of things that i think like i'm literally

on stage telling the truth like telling my opinions and they're like yeah also you can't like you need to say these things and you're like yeah eat a dick if you think that you know what i mean i think yeah it's actually funny you know it's funny how much i defend free speech as someone who doesn't even as someone who doesn't even like use profanity like someone who doesn't even like cuss or talk about like any crazy stuff in my music or whatever no like i don't do my music not in real life like i don't know in your music you know and um no i don't swear in real life either how come so it's um how i was raised and i just don't think it's necessary i don't like it you're still afraid mom's gonna beat you no she probably wouldn't hesitate no yeah she calls you she doesn't want to buy no no one in my family no one in my family

cusses like i've got a big family like no one my family cusses. Like I've got a big family. No one cusses how I was raised. Like it's unnecessary. You know, like again, if other people cuss, like I'm not going to generally make some massive deal about it. I get it. You're better than me. Of course, Ryan.

So, no, but so it's kind of funny how I often find myself being the one in certain conversations where like I'm this ardent defender of people like having the right to tell offensive jokes or having the right to rap about or sing about like messed up stuff and not be coming under censorship or prosecution, you know, in the UK, like, you know, people get prosecuted, you can be prosecuted for telling the wrong joke, man. Yeah, again, you have to remember, I'm someone who grew up in Saudi Arabia. So I grew up, I didn't exactly grow up in, you know, some, some super liberal free speech society or something like that. So like, I've got like a whole different view on this thing. And I just find it amazing how one thing I've noticed an observation I've sort of made over the especially

very solidified over the past year, is in countries where people are, in countries where people have more liberty and freedom, here's a great way to tell how much liberty and freedom people have in different countries. Because when people have a lot of liberty and freedom, they will actively fight to have their own rights and freedoms restricted. Yeah, I know.

And when people don't have a lot of them, they will fight, they'll fight for those liberties and freedoms. But once you've got like a really like a sort of free society, people will actually like do what they can to have like rights taken away from them. And so like have more restrictions, like people are begging for more lockdowns, begging for more mask mandates, begging for like, you know, like no government, like government step on me more like, no, what do you mean I have a Second Amendment? Like, no, take it from me. I don't want the First Amendment either. Take this from me, like restricts me. It's very bizarre. And then if you go to places where you know, like there are much more like more restrictions and more authoritarian regimes, etc. It's like the total opposite. So that's just something I find, I find incredibly fascinating, something weird about human nature.

Is that because that, you know, when you have all this stuff, you don't know what it's like when you don't have it? Yeah, it is. I think also that, you know, liberty and freedom are kind of dangerous. You know, they're kind of messy. Yeah. Right there. They are messy. Especially when you do have like a very ideologically and ethnically and racially and religiously like diverse society. I mean, take somewhere like the USA best example. I mean, the USA is the most diverse across every dimension. The USA is the most diverse country in the world. It's also the third biggest country in the world in terms of population. So the U S is like some huge experiment of 330 million people who in many ways, in many ways, I don't have a lot in common with each other. And it's also the most Liberty oriented society to the

point where, you know, you can walk into a store and just, you know, buy an AR-15, right? In many states, which I think is cool personally, but that's, that's messy, right? Like that, that, that is messy, right? That's a, that's a, it's a cocktail where, you know, you're going to get a lot of cool things. You're going to get a lot of dynamism. You're going to got a lot of entrepreneurship and amazing things, which is what comes out of the USA, but it's also going to be more dangerous in certain ways, you know, both ideologically, but also like physically, you know, like levels of violence and murder in the U S compared to most places in Europe are like many, like many, many, many times over. Right. Um, and so with all these freedoms and, you know, like absolute freedom of speech, et cetera. So it's it's dangerous. Right.

Like people. Yeah. Rights are one things. But rights have to come with responsibilities. And we're obsessed with talking about rights, you know, what you're what you can do. But there's not a lot of conversation in the past decade, I think, about about responsibility. You know, like, yeah, you do have you have a right. You know, I think you should have the right to say virtually whatever you want. Does that mean that everything should be said? Right? No, it doesn't. Right. I think you should have a right to like, if you want to go and you know, you live in the US, you have a right to go and buy like, all types of firearms. That doesn't

mean but you have the responsibility to be responsible with those guns, though, right? Like, it doesn't mean you have a right to own a gun you don't have to a right to go outside and just start spraying people yeah shoot it up in the air at a wedding you're in saudi arabia exactly you know as an adult we have rights to do a lot of things but with those rights come responsibilities like yeah okay you can do this you can do that but you've got to be careful with it with every freedom comes um a responsibility and i think that when people have a lot of those freedoms and when other people have those freedoms right it sort of freaks people out because you're like well i mean what's the argument people always use

against you know against free speech right it's like oh well hurts what about what about a nazi what about a nazi who wants to like say something like racist what about someone who wants to say something racist? What about someone who wants to say something that's mean to gay people or mean to black people? That's the argument against it. Or what if you were to tell a joke on stage which somehow incites someone to go and commit a crime? And it's like I sort of get those arguments on an emotional level. But I think something people don't really like to just accept. And I feel like this, even with this whole coronavirus pandemic situation, where you have to accept that some things are just messy and there's not always just like a clean, perfect answer and solution that you're going to get, right? Even when it comes to the

virus itself, no one wants to just say, certainly no politician wants to just say like, look, viruses kill people. Some people are going to die. Yeah. Right. It's, it's, it's like that, right? People are saying, oh, wow. You know, in the U S over 200,000 people have died. That's Trump's fault. It's like, no, it's a virus, right? And it didn't just infect the USA, like worldwide. This, the USA doesn't even have the every country thinks it's just them. Yeah, exactly. And it's like, no, you, you can't a virus. It's, it's sad to say that if you get a pandemic with a virus that can kill people, that if you get a pandemic with a virus that can kill people, some people will die.

That's the reality. But, you know, saying that, a politician saying that, like, you know, they'll get fried. And the next day people will be screaming at them for telling the truth. But it's like, that's just what it is. Sure, you want to do everything you can within reason. You want to take the precautions. You want to do what you can to make sure that death is minimized and less people are impacted and people have the health care act like i i 100 get all that but you also just sometimes have to accept reality of things like you know some things are just messy and some things are unfortunate and try as we may um we we can't just nerf the entire we can't just

nerf the entire world so that nobody ever gets it. Nobody dies ever. Or dies ever again of anything. Of anything, yeah. If that's the case, we need to drop the speed limit to 20 miles per hour. We need to ban alcohol. We need to ban cigarettes. We need to ban sugar.

We need to close certainly a lot of restaurants and fast food joints, especially in the USA. We need to do a whole bunch of things. Absolutely, you need to close certainly a lot of restaurants and fast food joints, especially in the USA. We need to we need to do a whole bunch of things. Absolutely. You need to ban guns. You need to curtail free speech. You need to, you know, but jerking off with a tie around your neck. But the more you try to sort of protect people from themselves, the more authoritarianism you you create. And yeah, they're also they're also full of shit though too like

it's almost like you know and again you're like a positive dude and you're like almost being generous with these people it's like but you know when you saw the like they just don't even see because remember when uh trump like got corona like you know i don't know if you saw that like whatever yeah i'm i don't know i'm from canada i'm not from america by the way so i'm like i'm kind of in between i of in between like what UK is and, and America in terms of Canada. Yeah. Well, I don't live there now. I'm in New York, but the, the like is I saw every person, you know, I tweeted stuff about this, but every person was like, I hope he dies,

this and that. And I'm just like, and then I saw literal people that I have seen post this stuff. And they said right on their on their timelines they were like people saying that uh that it's calling for violence to you know saying trump like when twitter's saying they're gonna take down the tweets like wishing for his death or whatever they're like it's just words it's not the same and i'm like look up three stupid idiot it's like okay fine i don't care if you want to be a hypocrite but like i don't want to hear a peep about microaggressions you know you, you don't, you don't get it both ways. So it's like, they don't even, I don't think that anyone on like any of these sides. It's disingenuous.

Yeah. They're all just like, I want this for my lot, but it's the way I've always been, which is I'm very much about principles. I'm about principles more than I'm about sides. And you have a lot of people who have a code to live your life by. Yeah, exactly. So I'm not just like, okay. you know, politics, gosh, like people become so warped because they will just do and say anything and they will just switch their positions and be hypocrites and whatever, like whatever advances their side advances their cause or whatever lie, cheat, steal, bend the rules. They don't care. Whereas someone like me, I'm like, look, I've just got principles.

So like I support free speech and someone who supports free speech. It's not like, okay, I support it for me or for things I like. Yeah, unless they trash your last album. Yeah, yeah, exactly. But then, you know, if it's something I don't like, like, I'm going to come after that. It's like, no, like, I'm not, I'm not like that. I try my best to be fair and to be consistent and to not sort of prove myself to be a massive hypocrite every, every three days. Yeah. And we've seen so many absurd examples of that recently. I mean, a fantastic example, fantastic example would be like, I would love to see the Venn diagram between people who were pushing for more lockdowns and mask mandates and people who were freaking out at the anti lockdown protesters,

both in the UK and the USA, and the people who were participating in or condoning the Black Lives Matter protests and riots. Yeah, I want to see that Venn diagram because I think it's a circle. Right. I think like in the same people two weeks ago, two weeks ago, you are screaming people's heads off and virtue signaling about how this pandemic is going to kill everyone and people are being irresponsible. People are not socially distancing correctly. You're yelling at people for going to the beach. You're yelling at people for not wearing masks, whatever. And then two weeks later, there's thousands upon thousands upon thousands of people out in the street, even people in the medical community. thousands upon thousands upon thousands of people out in the street, even people in the medical community, over a thousand medical doctors and other workers in the U.S. signed that letter

talking about how racism is a bigger pandemic than the coronavirus. And so they're greenlighting the Black Lives Matter protests. And then they switch back. And then when people have anti-lockdown protests again, they're coming back down hard on them and saying that they're trying to kill grandma. And I'm just like, you people are clowns, all of you, you're idiots. I don't, I'm not even at that stage, like any benefit of the doubt is just gone for me. I'm like, this is totally politicized. You're just weaponizing things now. It's not about, you know, either, either the coronavirus is real or, or, and it's deadly and it's crazy or, or it's not. But you can't keep flip-flopping on these narratives and expect people like myself who have more than a three-minute memory to not think that you're idiots and that you're malicious and that you're just disingenuous because it's got to be one or the other.

This must have been the golden era for like white people in their twenties telling you like what's best for you. Right. Don't even start. Don't, don't get me started on that. Let me start all these people who think like I did, like I wasn't aware that black lives matter until they told me three months ago. Honestly, man, it's, it's, it's actually embarrassing. Like, honestly, that was some of my favorite stuff. Like the trans stuff. When you see like the white girls yelling at black cops. Oh, my gosh. The lack of any sort of self-awareness is just amazing to me.

I don't know how people can lack such self-awareness and not just be for a second like, wait, what do I look like here, right? I'm here. I'm here screaming in the face. I'm here. I'm here screaming in the face of, of, I'm just like, what is, it's so strange. That's probably why, like, you know, a lot of people, I mean, I'm not in any other, I'm not in, I don't get to be in any cool guy groups. That's why I need to be gay. But there, no, but there is with you, it's like with anyone, it's like, if, if people say like, Hey, this is what your group thinks. thinks and it's like all it takes is for you to like not think one before you're like i'm out you know if they're like hey black people like this and we think this and you're like well i don't think that one and you're like you're not a black guy anymore then yeah yeah you'll take your black card away and joe biden joe biden did that one that's why i thought that statement he made was so egregious with charlamagne with charlamagne when he was like yeah you know if

you're considering if you need to actually consider whether you should vote for me or vote for Trump, then you ain't black. I was like, whoa. Like, that was audacious. Did you take your do-rag off? You're like, all right, I'm out. Man, that was audacious. I'm not even American. I'm not even American, but like, yeah, I was just like, geez, man, because do you know what's crazy about that is in one way?

In one way. He is. Hmm. How would I put this? I don't want to say he's right, but he knows that black Americans, for the most part, black Americans who vote, vote overwhelmingly for the Democratic Party and have done for several decades now, right? So he is using the fact that he knows that as a weapon, right? He's sort of trying to pass it off like it's some kind of joke, but it's actually a really deeply insidious statement, right? It's a very, very insidious statement. And it's not something that people are like, oh, he's just whatever, you know, Trump says worse things. I'm like, No, Trump doesn't say worse things than that. Trump has never said anything as bad about black people as that, right? Like, and then his other comment later on down the line, where he said, you know, unlike,

unlike the black community, the Latino community is actually very ideologically diverse. And you know, they actually have like different ideas. I'm like holy crap like this is unbelievable but you know but people will prove him right right because most black americans will then probably go and still vote for him but statements like that i'm just like wow to me as an outsider i'm just like well well there you go man i've never heard trump say any y'all are calling trump racist and whatever. I've never heard Trump say anything, anything remotely as disparaging about black people as a whole. That's those kinds of statements, right? Well, they also like, sorry. Yeah. Yeah. No, I was going to say, I mean, because I think that the, you know, one of the most pernicious, not just pernicious, but one of the most,

the most sort of commonplace type of racism that actually still exists in the modern western world is it's not the type of racism that people sort of think of like you know people calling you like you know calling you the end i mean if people are going to call you racial slurs in my experience it's normally going to come from the left wing um but it's not like it's not like that sort of old school very sort of harsh in your face type of racism it's this whole expecting all black people or people of color hate that term like to to think the same and so and to walk in lockstep and the idea that if someone just looks at me they know what i believe and they know my experiences and they know my capabilities and they know everything

about me just because they know my skin color like Like to me in my own life, in my own experience, that by far is the most sort of that's the most commonplace and widely accepted type type of racism that you see perpetuated every single day. This whole idea that, oh, like, you know, there's a billion black people in the world, but like, oh, they all they all think the same. And there's just like, yeah, there's there's this one community and hive mind that we're all magically tapped into and it runs the other way as well right this whole concept of you know like white privilege and white fragile that's critical race theory bullcrap to be honest um the idea that oh all my favorite book are all of course white fragility right um you know all white people are x all and i'm just like seriously like is this what we're is this what we're doing now right is this how we're it's just such a huge gigantic step backwards and i find it extremely um ironic that

it's called progressivism well yeah it's and again, you can make like, uh, obviously judgments about someone by how they look, but like, it's not about race. Like, I feel like UK is a little more like Toronto where I grew up, where it's like, you know, if, if a black guy just dressed like a, you know, a basketball player versus dressed like a skateboarder, you like, you might know a little bit more about what band, what kind of music he's like based on looking at him. You might know what kind of girls he likes based on whether you know what i mean like whether he's dressed like a rapper or whether he's dressed like a i don't know like a wearing a polo shirt and all that stuff you know what i mean and that's kind of how i grew up it's like you know everyone was

divided by groups like always but they weren't racial you know no no, no. That's the... And look, I know in the US, most people also are not like this. And for the most part, people get on and things are harmonious, etc. Otherwise, you know, a city like New York City, people would be fighting all the time. In comedy, you're divided by your class of comedy like way more.

You know, you're divided by like where you are as a comedian. If you're like this, you're hanging out with these people and this people. It's like not about race or gender. It's about like whether you're good at comedy yeah exactly and i think you know one thing that the uk and canada i think do better and have over the u.s there's a lot of things i love about the u.s but one thing i definitely prefer in the uk is that there's a

lot less racialization shall we call it right Like there's just less of an obsession. In the US, there's always just that like underlying obsession with race. That's, you know, it exists to a degree in the UK. It exists to a degree. Well, it's getting worse. Isn't this kind of infecting it almost? That's what I've seen looking back at Toronto.

You're right. And that's why it's important to, know stand up against it right i would love to look man i used to be like very apolitical in the public sphere until 2018 and i would never but it just reached the stage where i was like you know what i have thoughts and things i want to share and perspectives that i'm not hearing a lot of people voicing. And also I can see where a lot of this stuff is going, right? And it's not going in a direction that I'm morally comfortable with. And again, as someone with certain principles, it's like, okay, I cannot be quiet in the face of this. Once I'm starting hearing people using certain rhetoric and start like sliding back into certain

ideas, like again, once you start seeing universities advocating for racially segregated spaces, then I think that's when you people need to be like, wait a second. Um, this is a bad idea. Like we shouldn't do this. Right. Once you start seeing kill all white men trending on Twitter, that was me. Sorry. That was me. I started this. You guys are crazy. Right. That's when you need to be like, Hmm, actually, maybe that's like maybe that's not good. Like, you know, yeah, maybe we shouldn't be saying those sort of things like, you know, maybe that maybe that's going a little bit far. Because if you were to replace like, you know, either the word white or the word man with like, you know, the other sex or any other race. How would that sound? Yeah, like that's not good. And when you start seeing like, you know,

places having mandatory training for, you know, this or just all of this stuff sort of creeping in, you know, people trying to force people to use pronouns under the threat of law and going to prison if you misgender somebody. How's that been in the UK? Like if you've seen people that have, you i know there was like count dankula and there's a few other people that you know they did something and they went to jail like do you because you're kind of

in that circle of people like to some degree what are some of the craziest i know count dankula yeah what are some of the craziest ones in like the uk that happen man so i mean the count dankula one was a big one of course. I think he was the first person in, I think he was, I think he may have been one of the first people in British history to be prosecuted. Go to jail for a joke? No, he didn't go to jail. He had to pay an 800 pound fine. But he was potentially facing jail time.

I thought that if you do it, you should have to have sex with an 800 pound girl. That's what I said. Oh, wow. I was, I'm, that's what I said. Oh, wow. That's what I'm advocating. I mean, he's married, but if he weren't, maybe he wouldn't be opposed. But I don't want to speak on his behalf. But no, he's a good dude, man.

He's a good dude, Mark. Yeah, he seems funny. And then what was the other one? There was the one with Harry the Owl. That's what he's kind of nicknamed. What did he do? And then what was the other one? There was the one with like Harry the Owl. That's what he's kind of nicknamed. What did he do?

He wrote or he retweeted a poem on Twitter that was something about being transgender. It was like a poem. It was like a limerick. Yeah. And the police, did they either come to his house or they rang him up

and they literally said that we want to check your thinking. And you have to remember that literally those words, right? Like 1994. And you have to remember that in the UK, like they have a new category, which, uh, the police use, which is called, um, non-crime hate incidents. Right. So something that's not a crime, but which is like potentially offensive could be logged as a non-crime hate incident. So you literally have the police going around looking at people's tweets and Facebook posts, etc. And these non-crime hate incidents could also show up on your record, right? So if you haven't committed any crime, but if you apply for a job or something, they can see that there's a police record that you you ryan have committed a non-crime hate incident it goes on your record yeah maybe you told and

again it's not a crime non-crime hate incident like think of what that means right yeah they just know that you're a hater yeah so maybe you told a joke that was a little bit sexist or something on stage and that's not that's not a crime right that's not a crime but it's a non-crime hate incident and then that gets logged on a police record. And now you're trying to do a gig somewhere and they're like, hmm, there's something here saying that you committed, you know, had some hateful speeches. of. And of course, like most people are never going to be affected by, but they're things people should be, should be aware of, right? If you're supposed to live in a free society and you're supposed to live in a place where you can, you can, you can tell jokes, have the freedom to be offensive, you know, whether or not people like it or whatever, people can have their opinions on that. But in terms of it being like a legal issue or something that the

police should be getting involved in or coming to visit your house to ask about you know the joke you told on stage that should creep people out um yeah they like the cops when it comes to that yeah yeah that should that should freak people out um in canada there's some crazy like so in canada they have the the human rights tribunal so that one of the famous ones is mike ward where where he made a joke about a kid or whatever, and he got fined like $100,000 or something. Wow. Yeah, it was a big publicity thing. And Mike Ward, he's a badass, and he's pretty successful. So it was one of those things.

For him, aggregate was fine. He's doing well, and he could afford it and whatever. And everyone always kind of references that, where they're like, well, whatever. Look, he's doing fine. It's like yeah it wasn't just him it happened to there's this other guy that was in like calgary he's a comic and he basically was like talking shit about someone in the audience i can't remember the exact joke but she went to the human rights chamber he got thirty thousand dollar fine or something he's like a barback so this guy you know this this the ones you don't hear about you hear about the famous ones and you're like oh so and so uh count dank you had to pay a thousand dollars big deal and

you're like okay but there's a lot of people that happens to that had to pay thirty thousand dollars bankrupts them essentially yeah oh dude and and you know i mean i've had i've had count dank on my podcast and um you know he was he wasn't able to get a job like he's a successful youtuber now but he couldn't he couldn't get a job he was just able to get a job. Like, he's a successful YouTuber now, but he couldn't get a job. He was just trying to get, like, basic. He got fired from his job, of course. What was his job? I can't remember.

I can't remember. I think he was. I can't remember. I think maybe he was working in a shop or something like that. But he was just trying to get basic. He worked at the ADL. I can't remember. He was just trying to get basic jobs.

He was just trying to get basic jobs in Scotland. And, you know, every time they'd look him up, right? And they'd see, oh my gosh, Nazi. Like they just see the word Nazi, right? Yeah. And they're just like, oh my gosh, Nazi. Like, you know, of course he's not a Nazi or anything like it, right? No.

He made a joke with his girlfriend's dog. At most he's a Hitler's youth. And you know when he posted that thing? think he had three subscribers on youtube yeah i think his mistake was that he made the video public instead of private because he just it was supposed to be he was very small when he i thought he had like a few no no he had three subscribers come on so that whole thing put him right on the map yeah exactly he wasn't like a known it wasn't like he was a known personality and he wasn't even in the country when it was blowing up. He was traveling. He was in Iceland, I believe. And he came back and he came back in the following morning.

He got arrested. Like he didn't even know what was going on. Right. So he's, he's come back from vacation after, you know, and then he comes back and the police are at his door. Like, you're under arrest and he doesn't even know. He doesn't even know what he's done, right? Yeah. And in the meantime, this video has been going crazy and going viral and racking up a million views over the weekend or whatever. And he wasn't even aware of all this stuff.

It was meant to be for a very, very small audience. He wanted his girlfriend to see it when she got back and to be mortified there's few boys down at the local nazi club like come on and not everyone to see i'm doing a video this week that uh the kind of saying that it's about the you know the idea they're like you know nazis are bad but then they're like okay well now let's put everyone in that category but i'm doing a video i'd like make the joke i don't explicitly say it but the joke is that all the people that are saying telling everyone's a nazi are doing all the same thing that the germans did they're like you know he doesn't want the government to take the guns away nazi like oh you know all this stuff so wait your dad you were telling your dad that there's a certain racial group that has too much wealth

and he was getting he was saying you're wrong your dad's a nazi like stuff like that and we're like saying we want to take their payment processes away but it's hard right now because the nazis run the banks but yeah like we did like we were saying earlier in the conversation that's the way to do it man you got to take the arguments and show how ridiculous they are by running them in the other direction yeah i know it's so but there is like if you look at like canada and uk it's like they're america sets the culture but because they have stuff that you know they have these like stops in place for the actual policy but and a lot of these other places don't have that so it trickles down to canada and america and they're and in uk and stuff like that and

they're just like well yeah we'll do all the stuff that they would like to do here but they can't so it's almost like you're right yeah no you're you're right i mean i think the american political system for as much as people want to scream and rant and ravens and yell about the american political system it's actually extremely robust it's extremely robust and pretty anti-fragile like the way that stuff is set up with, you know, the constitution and the bill of rights and, you know, the different branches of governments, et cetera. Like it's actually, it's got so many checks and balances, which yet means it can be hard for someone to get stuff done, right? A president can come in and they may have

all these ideas and it's hard for them to implement them all because they get, they get blocked at every corner. But, um, I think the way that they've at every corner but um i think the way that they've done stuff is like i think the founding fathers of america um you know despite some of their hypocrisies at the time the country was founded of course with you know obvious things like uh like slavery the the sort of vision that they set up and the and the way they sort of laid it out i think was extremely extremely intelligent and i had incredible foresight incredible foresight to sort of limit the scope and and check the government in certain ways so that it's not like other countries you know lots of countries don't don't have any constitution or anything so like yeah the

government can really just do whatever it can really just do whatever i mean they kind of don't give too much of a shit about it now, but you are right. And you know, it all goes back to like, even if you look at on a micro level, like I know you talk a lot about productivity and all that, you know, kind of how to live your life in a better way. But if you think about it kind of from a basic level of how do you be more productive, you would limit your decisions and you kind of, so they're made for you. You know what I mean?

Even as far as like what you're having for breakfast, what your days are going to look like, what are you going to do? And you kind of, when you start thinking about like. You know what I mean? Even as far as like what you're having for breakfast, what your days are going to look like, what are you going to do? And you kind of, when you start thinking about like, okay, Wednesdays, I do this Thursdays, I do this. Like when you're talking about interviews, it's like, okay, this week I'm not doing them. Then the decision's kind of made for you. So a lot of times they all want to change everything and they kind of are always like, maybe we'll do this, maybe we'll do this.

But if it is set for you, it's like on a micro level and a macro level, it's kind of like the best way to operate. definitely man um you know again coming back to what we were saying saying earlier people need some restrictions and checks and balances and you know like absolute freedom is actually sort of you know it feels like bondage right because you you need some nice you need some you need some guidance you need some it's it's like bondage, right? Because you need some guidance. You need some... It's like, look at sport, right? In every sport, you have rules, okay? And if without those rules, the sport will rapidly disintegrate into something more resembling like MMA, right? If you don't have certain rules. So within those rules, there's so much that can be done

right i don't know look at from whether you're talking about i don't consider chess a sport but whether you're talking about chess or you're talking about like rugby or you're talking about basketball you're talking about football like whatever the rules the rules allow for the freedom right the rules allow for the for the freedom i mean? The rules allow for the, for the freedom. I mean, same on, on a basic level with any country, right? What are laws? So you need laws because if you just don't have any, and it's just anarchy and someone can just, you know, Oh, that guy's got something I want. You can just walk up to him and like shoot him and take it. Then that's a restriction on freedom, right? You're, you're now not free to, to, to live and to exist and to get on with things. If you're constantly in fear that someone is going to, you know, rob you or kill you or take stuff from you.

So, you know, and I think to different people, what those restrictions and rules and laws, et cetera, should be like. That's that's what politics is. Right. Like that's that's all the that's all the debate. That's all the discussion. But there's always a there's always a balance and if you look at every single country every single society different times in history that balance can be really different and it can go to an extreme in one way it can go to an extreme in another way etc um but yeah there's there's always that balance between freedom and liberty and safety and security and rights and responsibilities. Yeah, it's the trade-offs, right?

Yeah, it's all those trade-offs. And they're all lying. Like, if you see, even just watching the president debates or whatever, it's like they both do the exact same thing, where you see the left being like, dude, we're not trying to take your guns, but like, talk to any of them for two seconds. They're like, yeah, they want to take the guns.

And then the right's like, you know what? We don't want to take abortions. Like, we have no, like, talk to any of them for two seconds. They're like, want to take the guns and then the right's like you know we don't want to take abortions like we have no and like talk to any of them for two seconds they're like fuck yeah we want to take abortions so it's like it's whether you can think whatever you want but it's like if the if the systems weren't there it was like all of those things they they have you have a system where they have to pretend they don't want to take guns and abortions when of course they do what is it like like in Saudi Arabia? Do you see like, because they must not, like what's the political system in those places where you grew up?

Or did you live differently because you're like, you know, Western or something like that? Yeah, sure. So I was somewhat insulated from it because I'm in a bit of a bubble. But well, I was, you know, as an expat, as an expat,

you're kind of- Did you wear the dress? No, I have done. But I didn't have to. Nice. I have worn it. What about the it's called uh it's called a gutra nice yeah gutra and the white the white thing is called a thobe um so i i have i have worn it before um and uh but i actually i actually blend in pretty well like with especially now i would with the beard and everything.

But man, what was Saudi like? Saudi was awesome. I love living in Saudi. But in terms of the way the society and the culture and everything is set up from top to bottom, it's totally different. It's very, very different to a country like the U.S. And the thing that people are aspiring to is different. And this is the way I often try to explain somewhere like Saudi to Westerners, especially to someone who hasn't been there, is, you know, people need to understand and realize that not every country and every society has the same ideal that they are striving towards. Right. towards. Right. So if you were to take a country like the USA, what would you say is the core value that is being aspired to? I mean, right now, activism, but I mean,

at the end of the day, like the truth is probably for normal people, it's like success. Okay. Oh, okay. So, so say, so what would you say that society is? I would say that the U.S. society, almost everything is based to maximize liberty. Oh, you mean the, like the structure of the rule? Yeah, the structure, right? Like what are they aspiring towards? Liberty, right? Liberty is- I guess that would have been at the core, but I think right now, culturally, that's probably a pretty even split yeah well i think liberty is what america strives for america is built on the concept of the most out of anywhere

else at least at the very least yeah yeah yeah yeah certainly um but i guess i'd always compared to what right yeah you're right yeah compared to anything else yeah even more so than the uk more so than canada yes right that's why the UK and the Canada, you don't have something like the second amendment or even the first amendment proper. Right. You have more, you have more restrictions on your liberty in that sense. Whereas in America, like go to Arizona, go to Texas, you can be strapped. So, so it's different.

And then in other societies, people are aspiring towards different things. So in a country like Saudi, so from a Western perspective, it's extremely easy to criticize, you know, a country like Saudi or lots of other Islamic countries, etc., because you're judging them sort of under the assumption that they are trying to maximize freedom and liberty, etc., which is not even their aspiration. What is their aspiration to get into heaven? Yeah, well, the country is like 99.9% Islamic. It's not like some diverse community where you've got like all these atheists and Christians and Muslims and Jews and like different. It's like, no, it's like totally Islamic country. So the goal is to generally abide by the law, right?

There's not this whole separation of church and state. It's like, no, if it's against the Quran, it's generally against the law, right? There's not like, so it's a whole different, it's like coming from it from a whole different angle. Like the roots are different. Like, so, and if you understand that, then the way a lot of things are done,

whether you agree, disagree, strongly disagree, it at least makes more sense because it's like, okay, that's why. That's why they do that because they're not aspiring towards the same thing. If you were to take a country like China, like I don't, China's main goal is clearly not maximization of freedom and liberty.

What's their goal, sweet iPhones? You know, I don't know deeply about china but i would say something it's more about like safety and cohesion okay yeah and safety like like societal cohesion and like a unit it's much yeah yeah it's much more collectivist like bees yeah it's much more collectivist it's not like okay each individual you go out you go out and you fly and you do your thing. And you, it's like, no, it's like, everything's about like the greater good. And if someone steps too far out of line of that and that jeopardizes it, then, then they'll

crack down on you, et cetera. Um, so it's different. It also seems to be about like, again, like overall economic growth, not individuals necessarily like thriving and becoming successful, but China as a whole progressing and 100 year plan. Exactly. Right. So and different countries are different. They all have different scales, different balances. If you go to some of the, you know, the Nordic countries like, I don't know, Sweden, Norway, Denmark, where they have like much bigger welfare states, much higher taxation. You know, you can be being taxed 60, 65 percent of your income is going to tax. Right. But then, you know, but then at the point of at the point of service, you know, health care is I'm not even going to say it's free because obviously it's being paid for, but it's free at the point of service education, even university level education, you don't pay for it. Right. Or like it comes out the taxes, but, and so what

they're trying to maximize is something pretty different to even the UK or to USA, et cetera. So from the USA perspective, it's like, oh my gosh, this is fricking like hardcore socialism. But if you talk to a lot of people from like Sweden or Finland or what, like, you know, they like it and they're happy. It depends on who you talk to, right? Like if you talk to someone, it's like the same. It's's like if you were like a homeless guy in America it's probably better to be a homeless guy in Canada but if you're like a guy that wants to start a business and exactly it depends on like what your goals are and you know whether you're like getting from the bottom or the top you know what I mean yeah did you have to do the

sorry just quick question did I do is it true Cause I did a joke about this, but I actually like didn't fact check it. Do they, when they do the prayer five times a day, do they legit play it on loudspeakers five times a day from most places? Uh, yeah. If you're in the, if you're in the proper, one of the proper cities. Yeah. Yeah. Cause that was my like joke that every, and everything, and everything closes five times a day. All the shops close. They shut her up. Yeah. It's so wild, right? Like everything shuts.

It's just so much like whoever wrote that Bible, they should be like, dude, like he probably was like three. Why don't we just go five? And then everyone's like for the, for the rest of time, all people have to shut down their life five times a day. I walked into a store in Toronto once and I was buying, I was buying a, like a lamp or something like that. I just moved into a new place and walked in and I guess the guy, the guy had, he was praying and then the

music's playing. He goes, dude, no, wait. And I was like, Oh, I'll come back. And no, no, no, just wait one second. And he made me wait one second while I like watched him finish prayer. He did it for a good, like three minutes and then finished praying and then got right up and he goes, all right, we got this on sale. We got the best deals. He hopped like right into being a salesman. He's rolling up his rug. He's like, we got the best deals in town he hopped like right i love that right into being a salesman he's rolling up his rug he's like we got the best deals in town what do you need you need a lamp you know but that's brilliant and you know when they pray and you know when they pray they they face mecca right yeah i guess they gotta figure out so yeah so they have to know like which which direction mecca is in like you know i mean i'm not a muslim myself i'm a christian but

like you know growing up in saudi arabia i mean i have a you know of I mean, I'm not a Muslim myself. I'm a Christian. But like, you know, growing up in Saudi Arabia, I mean, I have a, you know, of course I have my criticisms, but, um, well, we're the biggest, I have a lot of, sorry. What's the biggest criticism? Like, what's the biggest thing that you left there being like, yeah, they got to change that. That sucks or not. They got to change that, but I don't like it. I'll tell you what I would say that Saudi is a country where, depending on who you are and what you are, your experience, I think, could differ quite wildly.

And I know some people will try to make the same claim about a country like the U.S. or U.K. They'll try to say, oh, you know, it's horrible to be black in the USA or it's terrible to be a woman, which is garbage, right? Nonsense. I mean, you still do good, but I agree it would be terrible to be a woman. Yeah. You're trying to get me canceled, man. I didn't say it.

It was him. I didn't say it. It was him. Yeah. So I think in Saudi, Saudi, one of my biggest criticisms, I guess, would be that your experience would be different depending on on who you are and what you are. So it's not it's not a society where, you know, the UK and the US and look, it took a long time for those countries to get there. Like, let's be real about it. This is a relatively new in the past, you know, past 60, 70 years sort of thing, where you have actual like true equality under the law. And then even beyond the law, general sort of societal treatment, people are generally treated equally, right? Like, so we were saying earlier on in the conversation that look, you know, in the UK, US, you know, even if someone is like, like, being trans is very,

very rare, right? You know, we've got a man who is, you know, converting or living as a woman or vice versa, or whatever. Like, that's pretty, that's very rare and unique and sort of radical in a way, but people are people are tolerant to that, right? People aren't going to see that person and, you know, want to attack them or discriminate against them or, you know, not employ them or whatever the case may be. Whereas in a country like Saudi or, you know, in a lot of other countries, you know, even lots of parts of Africa, you know, lots of parts of Asia, et cetera, your experience will vary more depending on who you are. Right. So a straight white male may have a totally different experience to a, a Brown woman or what's the worst thing to be there?

A gay person or whatever, you know, what'd be the worst thing? What's the worst thing to be in Saudi Arabia? Who's got the Ross deal? Oh boy. I don't know. Is it like, I'll maybe like LGBTgbt okay um yeah and i heard what didn't they say in a lot of those places didn't the president say there's no gay people there so it's all fine yeah of course he said they checked and there's zero people there's zero homosexuals right and and to be honest and even out of the islamic countries i don't think saudi is like the worst in that regard right i think somewhere like from what i know places like places like Iran, Pakistan, et cetera,

are, you know, even more harsh in that regard. So I'd say that would be like my biggest criticism would be that, so for me, I can say, yeah, my experience of Saudi was great and cool. You know, number one part of that is just being an expat, but I don't know if you were a national. They treat you different, right? In a different thing.

You might be treated very differently and, you know, some of the laws may be different for you, even if you were a national they treat you different right and a different thing yeah you might you might be treated very differently and you know some of the laws may be different for you even if you're just a woman um you know saudi has progressed a lot even since i left i left in 2008 and from what i understand um you know things have you know liberalized quite a bit just in the past 12 years especially under uh mbs so was there a lot of 16 year olds with like million dollar cars driving around? Like you hear about, like, well, you just, you know what I mean? You see some Saudi Prince, just like, Ooh, this is you see, you see them in London. Oh, they come to London to show off. Yeah. You'll see it in London, but I'm in Saudi. No, no, not, not, not a lot. Um,

so yeah, that would be the thing, but then, you know, they can't really have internet in the same way. Right. Is that like the case? There's some restrictions, obviously, like, you know, you're not getting on a porn hub or anything like that. Absolutely. Yeah. I can't get a three prints on the boys cat. I don't think it's as restricted as somewhere like China. But you know, there, there are some restrictions with that, et cetera. So, you know, and then of course, like freedom of religion again, is also a thing that's, that's different.

Like, again, as an expat, you know, I could, um, you know, I went to church when I was in Saudi, but there's no church buildings, there's no churches. And as far as I'm aware, there's not a single church in Saudi Arabia in terms of actual buildings. Um, but you know, as expats, you can, you can congregate, you can do your thing. It's just not in a church building. It'll be in a theater or a school gymnasium etc so some of those sort of like freedoms and liberties etc that people sort of have and take for granted in you know the anglosphere in western

countries etc certainly are more curtailed and then but you know, there are also things that they do there, which are, you know, great. And which, which I respect and which I'm like, okay. Um, so when it comes to, so there are a lot of, I'd say there are a lot of like major social issues that exist in Western countries, which are, which are far more rare in Saudi. So I think one of the biggest problems in the West, if I were to talk about like a big societal problem, would be like broken families,

absent fathers, single motherhood, right? And then also other things, right? Alcoholism, homelessness, drug addiction, gun violence. All of these things, you addiction, gun violence. Yeah. All of these things, you know, certain aspects of criminality. Big problems in the UK. Big problems in the USA. These are the biggest problems.

I guess crime too, right? Saudi, very low crime. Yeah. Very low crime in Saudi. Very, very little homelessness. You know, very few broken families. Like people just, you know, alcohol is illegal, right? So you don't have to deal with massive alcoholism, right?

You don't have people strewn out. Like you go to LA, you go to San Francisco, you go to New York, you've seen drug addicts and homeless people just living out there on the street. Like, you know, people from Saudi might look at that and be like, oh my gosh, you guys are calling us the backwards ones. You're letting your own citizens like rot here on the street with heroin needles in their arm. You see what I mean? So there are, you know, it's, and, and those are the sort of side of things that a lot of people don't really think about or don't consider they can, you know, it's easy to look at a country like Saudi and sort of just look down on them

from this Western perspective and say, Oh my gosh, we do everything better than them. I'm like, no, no. And you know, even if someone is coming from it from a more sort of like lefty perspective, right, they do have free healthcare. They do have free education, right? Yeah, they do. They do look after their citizens, this coronavirus thing, they were sending out jets to bring their citizens back to the country. Right? You're not going to see a Western government doing that. They're not looking after their citizens like that. And then people be like, yeah, but it's because they have oil in this. It's like, yeah, sure, they have natural resources, but they've also set things up in a way that they really sort of do look out for each other more.

So yeah, there's a, you know, there, so it's give and take. It's not like, you know, it's not like it's all good and everything is perfect and everything is wonderful, but it's also not like, oh my gosh, this place is just like this horrible, oppressive hell hole where everything is just terrible. And, you know, and it's just like, no. And like I said, even in Saudi, I mean, for the most part, I mean, it's like, it's way safer. You'll be safer in any city in Saudi

than you'll be in Toronto or London or New York or LA, like way safer, right? You don't even need to lock your car door. Yeah, it is true. There is like, because I know what you're saying. And a lot of people don't think of that stuff like even when you just look at like all the stuff that you're like oh it's so great we have this and then you're like was it though you know if you're like in a relationship and two people are both separately like instagramming

all day long you're like you know they can't do that and you're like well you know they're not allowed to do that and you're like yeah good like that's right you know so you're like yeah so it really depends on your your perspective and um family yeah so like yeah the family values and like i said you know it's a it's a very religious country so um if someone is like you know depending on someone's view of religion if like i'm someone who generally has a positive view of religion. I think like that's generally a good thing. Yeah. And people are observing, like you said, like that guy in the store you were talking about, like, I respect that. Like to some people that might be kind of weird, but I'm like, I respect that. And as a result of it, I mean, I've had things happen in Saudi where I was like, that would not happen in England.

Right. So let me, let me give an example. So, um, I went to a store, so I wasn't, I wasn't one of the big shopping malls and I went to a store and I bought a t-shirt and, um, it was supposed to be on sale, but I got charged the full price. So I ended up paying, I don't know, say an extra $20. Okay. And then, um, I didn't even know this. And so i'm like going around doing my thing and then like later on like an hour later one of the guys in the shop he he's been he's walking around the mall trying to find me come on so he can give me the money back right i was like that would not happen in england hell no exactly right so but people people people have that honesty right because people fear god right so so people so people are you know someone might say oh you Hell no. your mind would be blown by how welcome you'd be. You'd be like, wow, like there is no hospitality. Because it's in their brain and their psyche.

Yeah, people are very welcoming. Like you go to a store, they're like, what would you like? Tea, coffee, like just in a store, like you're going to buying sneakers, right? People are like, do you want tea? Do you want coffee? Like, you know, like they'll be, you know, talking to you, engaging you. And like people are just so hospitable. Zuby's working for the Saudi Arabia Tourism Board right now.

You love these guys. No, like people are extremely hospitable. Arabia tourism board right now. You love these guys. No, people are extremely hospitable. People are just like very welcoming and, and they, and they like the fact that, and again, you know, you also have to remember that a lot of Saudis, especially like the younger ones, like they are, they are conscious of what other people around the world seem to think of them and what the stereotypes are.

Degeneracy. Yeah, exactly. So if you go and visit there, like they want to show you like, look, no, we're not these like. Right. Okay. We're not these like, you know, horrible, backwards, barbaric, crazy people or something like.

Look, Starbucks. You know, like, come on, let me show you around, whatever. Like, come around, you know, come join my family, have a meal with us, you know. Have sex with my wife. don't know about that one um but yeah no people are people are welcoming um and the hospitality is is great interesting yeah that was one of the the big things that like i used to always because toronto's like has people from everywhere so like a lot of my friends are like second generation immigrants or whatever right but that was one of the biggest things that i always talked about on stage which people that were not from here would go i would always talk about how like family doesn't matter for white

people and for you know what i mean like i used to talk about how like when i came here there's all there's all these people that like send money home to their families in other countries like a white person would never do that i might send my mom a picture of my money being like yeah i'm crushing it have fun being poor in canada like right because it's just like it's such a different culture where they have such yeah they're but it is it works the other way around it's like you know my friend uh monty used to have a joke where he's like white people raise their kids like wolves where where they're like, get the hell out of here. Whereas it's kind of interesting where you'll see it's like an obligation. So that's why you wouldn't see as many unhappy old people

because it's obligation that when your parents turn a certain age, you move them into the basement and take care of them. But it never works the other way around. Your parents don't take care of you like that the same way. So there is definitely like positives and benefits that are like, are positives and negatives to each of the cultural things. Yeah, absolutely. And I'm very blessed to have grown up with exposure to four very different cultures, right? So my family background is originally from Nigeria. And then of course,

I grew up in Saudi Arabia. I was born in the UK, and I went to secondary school and university here. And then when I was in Saudi, I was surrounded by Americans, I was in the American school system. I was basically being raised like an American from kindergarten up till fifth grade until I went to the UK. So I've sort of, I can appreciate all four different cultures and you know, their pros and their cons. And I can, I can sort of like cherry pick the things I like from different ones. You know, there's things I like more in the UK than in the States. There's things I like more about the States than in the UK.

There's things I like a lot about, you know, Nigerian culture. There's things I like about some of the ways they do certain things in Saudi. So it's like, okay, cool. I can take the little bits that I like, but, oh no, I take the little bits that I like, but Oh no, I don't, I don't like that or no, I don't think that's good. Yeah. Sort of balance it out. I'm in Manhattan and it's like,

I have internet from Saudi Arabia is what's going on. It's ridiculous, dude. It's it's I'm going on the internet and people are like mad about it. But the, the one thing I didn't want to ask you about by the end because like you know you're obviously like this inspirational dude and you're talking about productivity and how you live your life like what's your philosophy on like what people could do better and even if it's like whether it's your days or like um what are some of like your fundamental philosophies on like how to better yourself oh wow man that's a big one um i think the number one is to know know purpose, like know what you're trying to know what you're trying to do and what

you're trying to achieve just in general in life. So I want to have a positive impact and influence on over 10 million people. So everything I do, whether it's my music, my podcast, my books, my social media posts, whatever it is, I'm trying to have a positive impact and influence on millions of people. I'd like to reach a stage, you know, I don't know, five years, 10 years down the line where every month, you know, every week, every day, maybe I'm reaching millions and millions of people and helping them in some sort of positive way. So that is my personal why. So, you know, I don't think that's most people's ambition, but I think people need to know why, why they're doing what they're doing. So I think that's the big one. Cause then even if you, cause once you know that you don't need to be, you don't need to like, people often ask how I

stay motivated. And it's like, that's easy. Like once I know that, then the motivation comes with it. Like every day it's like, okay, cool. This is what I'm striving towards. If I'm doing this. And I also know when I'm going off track, like if I'm doing something that doesn't align with that, or maybe even takes away from it, then it's like, Ooh, I shouldn't be doing that thing. So I think that's the first one. And then, um, for me, the next thing is to seek to maximize your own potential. So I mean that mentally, physically, emotionally, your skills, your abilities, your relationships, your network, everything like tap into your own potential. We've all got so, so, so much potential, which is impossible to totally fulfill. Um, but at least strive towards doing it. So if you're

eating a bad diet, get your diet in check. If you're not sleeping enough, get your sleep in check. If you're not drinking enough water, drink water. If you don't lift weights, get in the gym, start lifting weights. Um, if you've got stuff you want to learn skills, you want to, you want to acquire, do it. I mean, there's never, we've never had a better time to do it than this year. Um, this year sort of separated who's talking and who actually wants to do these things because everybody's had the time. Um, and then once you have, you know, once you're in the process of doing that, then number three to me is to help other people do the same. That's why I wrote my fitness book, Strong Advice last year. It's why I started

my podcast. It's why I do so many things I do. It's why I do coaching because I want to now help other people. Like I'm still in the process of fulfilling my own potential, but part of doing that is, is helping other people to do the same. So whatever I can put out there, anything from a tweet to a video to a song to a podcast to this conversation, my interviews, whatever it is, I want people to be able to listen to them or take something from it or read it and be like, OK, cool. Like this has added some value to my life. Like I've learned something new. I'm thinking about something different.

I feel inspired. I feel motivated. I know how to do this thing that I didn't know how to do before. Whatever it is, to me, that's the key. I think if we all try to fulfill our own potential and then try to encourage and push other people to do the same. Number one, great way to become successful because the way to become massively successful is to impact a lot of people and to have a significant impact on them and add value to their lives. That's how you become successful. But also just in terms of fulfilling your purpose and living a meaningful life, I just think that that's a great way to do it. And each person's potential is different. We all bring different skills and abilities and experiences to the table. But if we all did that and focused a little bit more on that rather than focusing on nonsense and certainly

not focusing on trying to rip each other down and tear each other down all the time and try to build each other up, then yeah, I think that is what would legitimately make the world like a something, something closer to we're never going to get a utopia, but I think it would make the world quite a lot better and people would uh, people wouldn't have the time to be trying to, do you avoid Twitter? Do you avoid like, do you, do you have like rules for social media and things like that? Like how do you organize your days? And yeah. Oh, okay. Um, so each day for me tends to be dedicated towards cause I, cause I do a lot of things. You pick one thing a day. Yeah. I tend to do like one thing a day so i'll have like an interview like a day where i do interviews yeah

right so like thursday it's like okay cool i'm gonna do these four podcasts um i'm gonna exactly i'm in that headspace i try not to switch gears too much so i don't try to have a day where okay i'm gonna spend two hours writing music and then two hours doing podcasts. You can't. No, the gear changes. It's too inefficient. So I'll have a day where it's like, okay, cool. Monday, I'm just doing admin. I'm just doing like emails and responding to people. That's the best day for that.

Replying to DMs, et cetera, right? Tuesday, okay, cool. Tuesday, I'm going to focus on the podcast. Wednesday, I'm just focusing on merch. I'm going to design some new merchandise. I'm going to run some promotions. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do that. Then I might have another day where it's like, okay, cool. Um, I'm going to put all my coaching clients on this day. I'm going to like talk to four coaching clients and I'm going to do

this. So I try not to flip flop, um, within the day too much. And that's the, for me, I found is the best way to do it. And, and also, uh, you know, starting the day right by going to the gym. Cause that's your, that's your new book, right? It's like a fitness book. Yeah. It's a fitness book. I always had a theory. I mean, you could tell me if I'm wrong, but I always had a theory that a lot easier than

getting in shape was just staying really skinny. So I'm on. So my theory was always like, get fat for two months and then starve yourself to death for two weeks. And in the last little while, tattooed skinny guys have like sort of made a comeback in the social consciousness. Oh, interesting. Yeah, but like I know that...

Antifa? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was thinking more like the kind of like city, like fuckboy bartender type. A lot of like rappers that are you know people like that musicians they're like skinny skinny tattooed dudes you know what i mean but there's there was uh my own the reason that these are the reasons i thought it was going to work out is that i felt like i had a little more like testosterone like i legit especially as i got

older i did feel like it kind of made me like a little more hyped as normally so and then i felt like i needed less sleep so i was less tired so i mean if even if i didn't want to like get a you know jack to get a six pack you know that idea of like i don't want to get too big and my friends are all like yeah i don't think that's in like i don't think that's gonna be an issue i love when people say that yeah you're like yeah you're not it's like reading a book and being like well i don't want to be einstein but like i not going to read too many books. I don't want to get too rich by working this extra day. Yeah, exactly.

But what's your main philosophy for working out? What is your system? What do they have to pay for it? No, no, no. I can give some away, man. So focus on progressive overload. Um, if you want to get strong. So progressive overload is the concept that you need to push your body beyond its current capabilities and outside of its normal comfort zone. So if I just dropped to the ground

right now and I did 20 pushups, that has no effect on my, that sounds a lot like my system. It's like, you know, I'm curl maybe a leg all right it has no effect because i can already do that right so you need to push yourself that's why you up the weights as you get stronger right the progressive overloads you keep you know if someone wants to learn a run learn sorry not learn but get fit enough to run a marathon right you start with a mile and then you get to two three you work your way up to 26 right didn't some didn't some coaches kind of like say that, isn't there a bit of a divergence of opinion?

Like some people think you shouldn't be pushing until your muscles rip or whatever, or is that just for specific training? Well, you don't ever want to push until your muscles rip. Is that sort of the old school way of- A muscle rip is a very serious injury. Not rip, but you know what I mean? Wasn't that the whole thing is that you kind of like

break your muscles and then they rebuild better? Have you never heard that? I have, but it's, it's not actually what happens in your body. So it's okay. So that's, that's a lie. Like they're saying, it's like, that's not actually what happens. Like if you're like, yeah, train until your muscle rips. I'm like, no, please.

That's when you need surgery. Please don't rip a muscle. Um, yeah. So I think what you were talking about, maybe is like training to failure. Yeah, I guess. Okay. So you don't need to train to failure. I don't normally train to failure. I normally keep a couple in the tank and you can get stronger and you can get bigger without training to failure. So when I, when I talk about progressive overload, a great way to do that is to focus on strength gains because muscle gains tend to follow strength gains so if you

go to the stage from being able to deadlift 100 kilos for five reps to being able to deadlift 200 kilos for five reps you're probably gonna look different right if you if you double your bench press you're probably gonna look different you're not gonna be benching double this is the opposite of what I'm doing every time I work out. Yeah, dude, you're right. Even when I'm at the gym, I'm like, I know I'm doing this crappy, but I always have that attitude of like, at least it's not nothing.

Yeah. Yeah. So you have to push yourself. I mean, if you want to get stronger. How many days a week is your system? I mean, I normally train about five times a week. First thing in the morning? Yeah, on empty. No morning? Uh, yeah.

On empty. No food? No, no. I've been, I, I, I intermittent fast. I've been training on an empty stomach for like 12 years. Right. So almost any video you ever see of me, like deadlifting or benching, like I'm, I'm on empty stomach, no coffee or anything like straight to the gym. Um, I don't drink coffee, so I don't like coffee.

I might have like, um, occasionally like a pre-workout with some caffeine or something but um yeah no no foods for sure sometimes i'll have like one banana that's kind of my you know something like that but yeah yeah no that's fine man i mean that's fine like it's just because i do intermittent fasting and that's like a personal preference okay so say you're me and like i don't work out at almost at all my system is more like i run most days and then i'll get i'll like do one day a week usually where i do like a bunch of push-ups a bunch of sit-ups like whatever just something and and if i do do weights i essentially my system is just like look what girls are doing and try to do a few more plates like like if i if there's a girl on the machine and i come next

and i have to i try to put it at least a couple more plates but what would you switch to like okay because i if i was to switch back and right now there's the pandemic so it's kind of annoying to like go to the gym and wear the mask and that whole thing but if i was to switch back to be like okay i'm gonna up it to working out three times a week what would you start with yeah Yeah, well, what's your goal? I think to get, like, no fat and to be the most, like, have my brain work the best. And to be, like, there's things I'm saying, like, to feel the best, like, to be, need less sleep, be really good in shape. But as far as what I look like, I don't think I care about any of that stuff. Okay.

What about, like, strength or anything? No, I don't think I care about any of that stuff. Okay. What about, like, strength or anything? No, I don't think I need more strength. I'm already, like, mad strong. But I don't do – but I'm only doing this, so I'm not playing, like, sports. Like, I used to play, you know, competitive sports, but I don't need strength for anything really. Like, to hold a microphone to bug people on the streets, I don't need strength. Yeah.

Well, you might be surprised. I mean, you've got to remember that you're, you know, as your body, as you get older specifically, like your body does degrade. So strength training is important. Strength training is also important like to maintain, like if you, if you people, a lot of people don't understand that if you don't strength train, like after the age of 30, like you're going to be getting like weaker and fatter consistently. Right. Right. It's not like in your, in your teens, in your twenties, your body's like building up, but then after 30, it's like breaking down. Right. So you're saying I kind of, it's one thing is just by strengthening, like you're naturally going to make your body not get as fat and stuff like that.

Yeah, of course. Of course. Yeah. Cause as, as time goes on, your metabolism slows down, your body naturally like, you know, loses muscle, especially as a man, right? Like, I mean, look, look at any man between, you know, from compare any, anyone old, I don't know, like, you know, a father, an uncle, whatever, like look at them when they're 30 versus when they're like 60 or 70, right? Like unless they go to the gym, like they look pretty different. Right right yeah so as a man like your testosterone levels start to start to drop off after like your late 20s um and lots of this is like can be reversed or paused like through weight

training right so your testosterone level starts to dip um you start losing lean body mass you start gaining body fat um and it's a very slow process, but that's why you get people who, you know, suddenly they're 45 and it's like, oh, you've got the dad bod now. Right. You know, someone who like in 25, like they were a stud. And in 45, you're like, hmm, you know, like their stomach is now sticking out and they kind of got the man boobs. Dude, our friend Lev Fur, he's like 25 and he's already getting fat. Like he's already pretty fat and we're just killing him on it. It's like when you're 35, you're going to be a bull. You're going to be a, uh, like a air balloon

that can be totally reversed. See that that's a, that's a, that can be totally reversed diet and training totally reversible. Um, which is amazing, which is amazing. Um, so you, if I'm doing, am I just pretending that I'm doing something? If I do like a hundred pushups, a hundred sit ups and like that sort of stuff, like, is that, is that like busy work or is that, is there anything to that? No, like it's better than nothing. Everything, like something is always better than nothing as long as you're not like training in a way that's going to injure yourself. Okay. But, um, if you wanted to, you know, actually get stronger or gain a bit of muscle, then yeah, you have to focus on progressive overload. Yeah. You have to focus on progressive overload. You have to, you know, push your body

beyond what it's used to. If, if you know, you can very happily and easily. So take for example, like if you had someone who's like really out of shape, who can only do like five pushups, getting them from like five up to 20, that's progressive overload, right? But if you can already do, if you can already blast out 20 pushups very easily and you do 20 and you just keep doing like your body has no reason to change. So it's not going to change anything. It's not bad for you. It's good to do it and to maintain, but it's almost cardio at that point. Yeah. If you wanted to get stronger,

you'd either need to add the, add some weight or, you know, you'd need to up it, increase the reps. But at some point, do you say free weights over machines? Like a lot of people have been saying that to me.

And I did switch from that when I was doing it. People were like, the machines are like bullshit. You have you say free weights over machines like a lot of people have been saying that to me and i did switch from that when i was doing it people were like the machines are like bullshit you have to do free weights yeah you want to focus on big heavy you want to focus on big compound exercises you want to focus on you know your bench press incline press pull-ups push-ups rows um squats deadlifts i mean you can build a fantastic physique with like five or six exercises you don't need i already have a physique. I just want to be in better shape. Yeah. So yeah. So focusing on progressive overload, focus on compound exercises and getting stronger. And then and then also the diet, you know, diet, water, rest make sure those are, those are adequate and you're going towards your

goal. If someone is trying to lose weight, then they need a calorie deficit. If someone is trying to gain weight, you need a slight caloric surplus. If someone's just about maintaining, then you want to eat around your maintenance level. And then you couple that with the training and you just, you want the two things to be aligned. If someone is trying to lose weight, but they're eating more calories than they're burning, then they're barking up the wrong tree yeah vice versa if someone's trying to get big but you know they're refusing to eat then it's like well your body's not going to magically add body mass without having the sufficient calories to do it like you need to eat the training alone is the training is just the stimulus the food is what but if someone's a total fat slob they can't help it that's a known fact as you can everyone can be

helped man everyone can be helped i've seen some very serious trends i always that must bug people that are like in fitness so much where they're like this is like a great body and they're 600 pounds and you're you're like no it's not i like literally do this. I've written, I've written a book on how to get rid of this. And they're like, she can't help it. It's perfect. No, no. Like, and, and it's important, man. I mean, again, this year you, this, this is a year where like, if you think about it, like this has been like the most health conscious year we've had in a way, or it should have been right. All this stuff that's going on. I have my own theories, but you know, supposedly it's about our health. Supposedly it's about public health. So if we want to talk about about health and importance, you know, health being important, then yeah, we need to talk about nutrition and we need to talk about exercise.

Like what percent of the majority of Americans are overweight? Like that's, that's crazy. That's not good. You know, like it's got like 30 or 40% obesity level or something and always rising. That's, that's a, that's a massive problem. So if people really want to, like, if you're worried about saving lives and having people live better lives and just be healthier and be happier as well because you have to remember how connected your mind and your body are people are talking about mental health all the time and I'm like well

if you want to talk about mental health let's talk about physical health too because these things are intertwined if someone is having mental health issues in certain ways then first thing I'm looking at is their nutrition and their exercise and their sleep and their water intake. And they're like, you know, are you drinking loads? Are you doing drugs? Yeah. It's so crazy when someone's like, I'm depressed and you're like, Oh, well maybe you lose weight. Yeah. Maybe you should be like, no, I'm not going to do

any of that stuff. But I'm like a therapist that tells me I'm great. Exactly. It's like, you know, if you've done all these things, if you are like physically healthy and you've still got, you know, some mental health issues, then OK, yeah, that probably is a true depression. Right. That's probably some some some kind of imbalance. But if it's just like you don't exercise and you eat trash and you barely sleep and you hate your job and you don't like your girlfriend to wrap it up. Your last words were if you have mental illness, you're faking it. Oh, my gosh. Yeah dude yeah we'll wrap up because of this bad manhattan internet but dude thanks for coming that was great you have like yeah next time you next time you see me i'm gonna be like shredded and i'm gonna i'm gonna tell everyone i was on the zoobie platform and i'm like, dude, I'm so shredded now, but I'm also mentally ill. You didn't tell me about that.

It's quite a combo. Okay. Tell people where they can find you before I get kicked out again. Yeah, sure thing. So you can find me, zubymusic.com is my main website. If you want to check out my book or music or any merchandise, teamzuby.com. You can find me on all social media at Zuby Music, Z-U-B-Y Music. I'm on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, and YouTube. And my podcast, Real Talk with Zuby, and my music albums are all available on iTunes, Spotify. You can find me on YouTube and everywhere else. Just search for Zuby.

Yeah, dude. A real new renaissance, like, I really do think the future of like, this is the good part about everything where everything's going is there's going to be more people kind of like you that do like five, six different things. And I think it's kind of a cool place for the world going back to the way that like, you know, artists and good people that have like good minds, for lack of better word, kind of do just a bunch of things at once. Yeah, man. Hell yeah, dude. Okay. Awesome meeting you.

I appreciate it, Ryan. Take care. That has been the boys cast with Ryan long boys, boys, boys, boys, boys. Support me at patrion.com slash the boys cast. There's new episodes. They're solo episodes every two weeks. And as now at this point, there's like a ton of new ton of episodes there that aren't anywhere else.

And tell a friend about the boys' cast. Take a screenshot of this and post it on Instagram, Twitter, anything like that. Tag me in it so I can repost. And I will see you guys next week. Peace!