The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Attorney Ben Crump On Mississippi Man Who Was Killed And Buried By Police

Episode Date: October 27, 2023

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On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, five-year-old Cuban boy Elian Gonzalez was found off the coast of Florida. And the question was, should the boy go back to his father in Cuba? Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home, and he wanted to take his son with him. Or stay with his relatives in Miami? Imagine that your mother died trying to get you to freedom. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone.

This is Courtney Thorne-Smith, Laura Layton, and Daphne Zuniga. On July 8th, 1992, apartment buildings with pools were never quite the same as Melrose Place was introduced to the world. We are going to be reliving every hookup, every scandal and every single wig removal together. So listen to Still the Place on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hey, y'all. Niminy here.

I'm the host of a brand new history podcast for kids and families called Historical Records. Executive produced by Questlove, The Story Pirates, and John Glickman, Historical Records brings history to life through hip-hop. Each episode is about a different inspiring figure from history, like this one about Claudette Colvin, a 15-year-old girl in Alabama who refused to give up her seat on the city bus nine whole months before Rosa Parks did the same thing. Check it. Get the kids in your life excited about history by tuning in to Historical Records. Because in order to make history,

you have to make some noise. Listen to Historical Records on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Muhammad Ali, George Foreman, 1974. George Foreman was champion of the world. Ali was smart and he was handsome.

The story behind The Rumble in the Jungle is like a Hollywood movie. But that is only half the world. Ali was smart and he was handsome. The story behind the Rumble in the Jungle is like a Hollywood movie. But that is only half the story. There's also James Brown, Bill Withers, B.B. King, Miriam Akiba. All the biggest black artists on the planet. Together in Africa. It was a big deal. Listen to Rumble, Ali,

Foreman, and the Soul of 74 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's up? This is Ramses Jha. And I go by the name Q Ward. And we'd like you to join us each week for our show Civic Cipher. That's right. We discuss social issues, especially those that affect black and brown people, but in a way that informs and empowers all people. We discuss everything from prejudice to politics to police violence.

And we try to give you the tools to create positive change in your home, workplace, and social circle. We're going to learn how to become better allies to each other. So join us each Saturday for Civic Cipher on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Wake that ass up early in the morning. The Breakfast Club. Morning, everybody. It's DJ Envy, Charlemagne the guy. We are The Breakfast Club. Morning, everybody. It's DJ Envy, Charlemagne the guy. We are the Breakfast Club. We got our guest co-host, Lauren LaRosa here.

And we got a special guest on the line, Attorney Benjamin Crump. Good morning. Hey, good morning, Envy, Charlemagne. Always good to see you, Kings. Lauren, good morning. Good morning, Attorney Crump. Attorney Ben Crump, he's here.

You know, Ben Crump is always on the front lines, man. And, man, there's a really sad story coming out of Jackson, Mississippi, about Dexter Wade. You know, 37-year-old Dexter Wade. He left his mom's house on March 5, 2023, and didn't return home. Let him break it down. Yeah, let him break it down what happened. Well, I want to tell him who the story is.

Yeah, he's going to tell him the facts. He knows the facts. I'm going to get to that, but let me at it down what happened. Well, I want to tell him who the story is. Yeah, he going to tell him the facts. So he knows the facts. I'm going to get to that. But let me at least do the headline. His mother, Betterstein Wade, said she reported him missing on March 14th and didn't know he was deceased until August 24th. What happened there, Mr. Crump? Yeah, you know, Charlemagne, you're exactly right.

It's tragic. This brother goes missing. He gets hit. We now know by a police call from the Jackson, Mississippi police. And his mother reports him missing about a week later. And they know because he has medication in his pocket. The coroner calls the police department and say his next of kin is his mother.

And they do not contact her until NBC reporter does an exhaustive investigative report. And almost seven months later, she's finally taken to a barrier ground for poor unknown people in destitute who the city pays so what it says to me uh charlemagne envio at best is gross malfeasance at worst this was intentional because his mother absolutely believes the jackson police department knew who her and her family were because two years later, I'm sorry, two years before, they sued for her brother being killed by the Jackson Police Department. Wow.

Her brother was killed by the police department as well? He was. He was body slammed and died. The officers were charged. Right now, they're under civil litigation. So his mother absolutely believes they knew who she was. So do they think this was some type of retaliation for her winning the lawsuit? Revenge, yeah.

Well, she thinks that it was a conspiracy, Charlemagne. And that's why she's so brokenhearted that her son was buried in the ground for seven months. And she's begging them because she's like, who else you call when your person, your loved one is missing other than the police? And so even though she was suing them, she said, I'm still a citizen of Jackson, Mississippi. You all still have to protect and serve us. But it's just tragic upon tragic. And as I was talking to Tess and Figaro, she was talking about a lot of people are saying that we should make sure he's exhumed and have a proper funeral.

So a lot of people, Reverend Al and Benny Thompson, the congressman, they're all reaching out now saying, what can we do to try to give this young man some dignity and respect? And what I'm saying is, what can we do to make sure there's accountability and justice so they don't do this again? Now, what's the protocol usually? Now, we're talking to Attorney Benjamin Crump, if you're just joining us. What's the proper protocol usually when somebody's hit and they're killed, they're taken to to the coroner's office so there is actual like there's paperwork to say where this body was so this is an open and shut case right because there's there's a lead right you know i absolutely think it's an open and shut case envy but when you're dealing with the police in america y'all and black people dying in highly suspicious, controversial manners. Nothing is clear cut. We have to fight for justice at every point, every turn. And I

am waiting, Charlemagne, to see what their story is. You know, they don't have an official response. I was going to ask you, what are they saying? Like, how are they explaining this? Yeah, the mayor said, obviously, there was a great miscommunication there. But we have the Mississippi Bureau of Investigations, they said, is going to do an investigation. But I don't really trust them as much. I think we're going to have to do our own parallel investigation. We may have to get the feds to come in because, man, if this was your loved one and you had a lawsuit against the city and they didn't tell you about, they had a car accident with your son

who was a pedestrian and then they buried him in an unknown funeral cemetery and then say, just give us the benefit of the doubt. Right. Who in America would say, no, no, we're going to give you the benefit of the doubt? Because every day I go in courtrooms across America and I see black people who, if you

take them at their word, make mistakes, but they never get the benefit of the doubt. It's always no, no. We got to make sure we administer justice and have accountability because we got to send the message. I think Jackson, Mississippi, there needs to be a message sent over Dexter Wade for his family, his two little children, his mother, all these people for seven months. Can you imagine the agony of not knowing where your son is, where your father is?

Yeah, we say we say nobody's above the law, but it always seems like the law is above the law because I don't understand how this is legal. I feel like this should be criminal off top. Just just the fact that she had to look for her son for all of that time. In fact, the cop knew exactly what was going on. I have a question for you, though. So if the body is exhumed, I know that they're talking about possibly doing that just for a proper funeral for the family. Is it too late to do an, like, you know, in your separate investigation, additional autopsy? Like, cause you know, the longer you wait, things get different. Now that's a great question, Lauren. In fact, Colin Kaepernick's, uh, uh, group Institute, we've worked a lot on doing, uh, uh, group Institute. We've worked a lot on doing, uh, independent autopsies. And to his

credit, he has done almost a dozen with my law firm where, uh, I remember the case in Georgia where the bed bug infestation killed the brother in the jail, Colin stepped up and offered to pay for that autopsy. And so I know he's his people already talking about doing that here. But one of the things we got to do, we got to go get a court, uh, petition to exhume the body because you just can't go dig up a body without getting permission from the court. So my office is going to have to jump through some hoops, but we do intend on getting an independent autopsy and having a proper funeral

for this young man so his children would know that his life mattered. And hopefully, you know, Jackson, Mississippi would know that they can't sweep this under the rug. Because had that mother given up Charlemagne Envy,

it would have just been swept under the rug. Like, it didn didn't matter but that lady kept saying somebody knows what happened to my child right now attorney benjamin crump what about cameras right we talked so much about cameras being on police officers so they had to move the body we talked so much about dashboard cameras on the police car so that would have seen him actually got hit uh do we have any of that footage now? Was it erased or how does that look? You know, DJ Envy, they have, they're supposed to have

dash cam videos on their car. I would suspect what they're going to try to defend or articulate is they didn't have their emergency cameras on their flashing lights and sirens so the dash cam video would not have come on but we're going to look at every aspect of it certainly when they hit them somebody body cameras should have been put on or something we should be able to see what happened to this brother. And we understand that he died from the injuries from the car accident. We are not even sure if they took him to the hospital.

He may have been dead on arrival when the ambulance got there. Just a couple more questions, Mr. Cormier. One really, how often do independent autopsies change the course of cases? Oh, Charlamagne, it's so important. Anybody who can afford it, if there's a death in custody case, I implore you to please get an independent autopsy because you cannot trust the medical examiner or the coroner, the local coroner, because they work with the police every day.

It's like the prosecutors work with the police every day. It's like the prosecutors work with the police every day. So there's an implicit bias in favor of trying to help craft the narrative that best and is most advantageous to the police want to probably say here, Charlemagne, is that we didn't know it was, you know, we did everything we could. We just didn't know who the young man was and all this stuff. And then we didn't see need to get an autopsy or if we got an autopsy, they're going to try to craft it where it helps the Jacksonville police not be charged with homicide. They're going to try to make it some easier charge if we get charges at all. where it helps the Jacksonville police not be charged with homicide. They're going to try to make it some easier charge if we get charges at all. Right. Okay.

Question for you, Ben Crump. Oh, we got a wrap. Oh, shoot. Oh, go ahead. Thank you. You know, we can keep going all day. Yeah, please keep us posted. Yeah, please keep us involved. I'll let y'all know when we do the funeral, M.B. Charlemagne.

Thank y'all always, Lauren. And tell my sister, Tess, and figure, say what's up, y'all. Absolutely. Definitely will. All right. With the history of Mississippi, there's no telling how many missing black people just buried somewhere in Mississippi.

That's right. Very sad. Very sad. All right. When we come back, we got your rumor reports. Don't move. It's The Breakfast Club. Good morning.

Wake that ass up. Early in the morning. The Breakfast Club. Good morning. Wake that ass up. The Breakfast Club. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, five-year-old Cuban boy Elian Gonzalez was found off the coast of Florida. And the question was, should the boy go back to his father in Cuba? Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home, and he wanted to take his son with him. Or stay with his relatives in Miami. Imagine that your mother

died trying to get you to freedom. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey everyone, This is Courtney Thorne-Smith, Laura Layton, and Daphne Zuniga. On July 8th, 1992, apartment buildings with pools were never quite the same as Melrose Place was introduced to the world. We are going to be reliving every hookup,

every scandal, and every single wig removal together. So listen to Still the Place on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hey, y'all. Niminy here. I'm the host of a brand new history podcast for kids and families called Historical Records. Executive produced by Questlove, the Story Pirates, and John Glickman, Historical Records brings history to life through hip-hop. Flash, slam, another one gone.

Bash, bam, another one gone. The crack of the bat and another one gone. The tip of the cap, there's another one gone. Each episode is about a different, inspiring figure from history, like this one about Claudette Colvin, a 15-year-old girl in Alabama who refused to give up her seat on the city bus nine whole months before Rosa Parks did the same thing.

Check it. Get the kids in your life excited about history by tuning in to Historical Records. Because in order to make history, you have to make some noise. Listen to Historical Records on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Muhammad Ali, George Foreman, 1974.

George Foreman was champion of the world. Ali was smart and he was handsome. The story behind The Rumble in the Jungle is like a Hollywood movie. But that is only half the story. There's also James Brown, Bill Withers, B.B. King, Miriam Akiba. All the biggest black artists on the planet. Together in Africa. It was a big deal.

Listen to Rumble, Ali, Foreman, and the Soul of 74 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's up? This is Ramses Jha. And I go by the name Q. Ward. And we'd like you to join us each week for our show, Civic Cipher. That's right. We discuss social issues, especially those that affect black and brown people but in a way that informs and empowers all people. We discuss everything from prejudice to politics to police violence

and we try to give you the tools to create positive change in your home, workplace, and social circle. We're going to learn how to become better allies to each other. So join us each Saturday for Civic Cipher on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.