The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Darren Waller Talks Divorce From Kelsey Plum, Retiring From NFL, Self-Love, Music Interest + More

Episode Date: July 1, 2024

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Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey y'all, Nimany here. I'm the host of a brand new history podcast for kids and families called Historical Records. Executive produced by Questlove, The Story Pirates, and John Glickman, Historical Records brings history to life through hip-hop. Flash, slam, another one gone. Bash, bam, another one gone. The crack of the bat and another one gone. The tip of the cap, there's another one gone. Each episode is about a different inspiring figure from history.

Like this one about Claudette Colvin, a 15-year-old girl in Alabama who refused to give up her seat on the city bus nine whole months before Rosa Parks did the same thing. Check it. And it began with me. Did you know, did you know? I wouldn't give up my seat. Nine months before Rosa, it was Claudette Colvin. Get the kids in your life excited about history by tuning in to Historical Records.

Because in order to make history, you have to make some noise. Listen to Historical Records on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone. This is Courtney Thorne-Smith, Laura Layton, and Daphne Zuniga. On July 8, 1992, apartment buildings with pools were never quite the same as Melrose Place was introduced to the world. We are going to be reliving every hookup, every scandal, and every single wig removal together. So listen to Still the Place on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Hello, my undeadly darlings. It's Teresa, your resident ghost host. And do I have a treat for you. Haunting is crawling out from the shadows, and it's going to be devilishly good. We've got chills, thrills, and stories that'll make you wish the lights stayed on. So

join me, won't you? Let's dive into the eerie unknown together. Sleep tight, if you can. Listen to Haunting on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, five-year-old Cuban boy Elian Gonzalez was found off the coast of Florida. And the question was, should the boy go back to his father in Cuba? Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home, and he wanted to take his son with him. Or stay with his father in Cuba. Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son with him.

Or stay with his relatives in Miami. Imagine that your mother died trying to get you to freedom. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Wake that ass up. In the morning. The Breakfast Club. get your podcasts. time ladies and gentlemen Darren Waller good morning good morning man how you feeling I'm great man blessed to be here good good good happy to see you brother um for folks that don't know explain who is uh Darren Waller because you got a you got a very interesting story man Darren Waller that's something I'm still trying to figure out man oh I like that answer who I am you know I'm saying I don't got a concrete answer uh I'm somebody that's uh like I'm a creator I'm uh you know I've been an athlete but there's a lot of things that I want to do. A lot of things I want to try and just continue to go on this journey. Now you started off, how'd you get into the NFL for people that don't know? Was it the usual way that most athletes do so far?

How did you get into the NFL? Break down your story a little bit. Yeah. From the beginning, start playing football when I was four, my parents just kind of threw me in seeing what I wanted to do. And I, it was just a natural love for the game.

But I wasn't really that highly recruited out of high school. Wasn't that really known in college. Got in trouble a lot. What school did you go to? What college? Georgia Tech. Okay. I'm from Atlanta.

So snuck into the late rounds of the draft, six rounds. I had a lot of character red flags at the time. And from there, started with Baltimore, then moved to to the Raiders where I spent most of my career, and then spent the last year with the Giants. Did you know you had character red flags? Like, you know, because self-awareness is something a lot of people don't develop until later when they start doing internal work on themselves.

But did you know you had character red flags, or did they tell you you had them? At the time, I didn't believe I did. I was putting the blame on everybody else. And I was resentful at everybody else and thinking it was other people's fault that why I was doing the things I was doing they didn't understand why I needed to do drugs and drink

and shit like that so at the time I did not have that awareness no I read that you went from drug addiction to grocery store clerk to NFL star yeah so I went to rehab September of 2017 and right after I got sober when when I got back home, I moved in with my parents again, and I was like, all right, I got to get a job, got to get some structure to kind of get my life back in order.

And the dude that went to church with my parents worked at Sprouts, and I just got a job there working grocery clerk, making the aisles look nice, getting orders from the back stock in the back. And I was there for probably like seven months until I was like, all right, I kind of got my P's and Q's going for these drug tests and everything. I could get a chance to be reinstated into the league. So I started training again, and things just kind of went up from there. You said something that I want to expound on. You said you didn't know what led you to drugs. People didn't know what led you to drugs.

Yeah. What did lead you to drugs? what did lead what did you lead you to drugs um just a lot a lot of wounds from when i was younger man just like feeling like i wasn't enough feeling like i always had to overcompensate to please people or to look tough or have this you know tough exterior as a man improve myself and it was a lot of pressure a lot of anxiety and just wanted to change the way i felt i just wanted to have some peace in my life and i felt like that those kind of things brought that peace but it was kind of a counterfeit at the time. It worked for a bit, but in the end,

it ends up turning on you and all those problems you think you're getting rid of by using are still there when you wake up the next day, when you come down from that high, it's still waiting on you to deal with. And I was just putting stuff under the rug, but yeah, that's kind of why I kind of got into that lifestyle.

You didn't have nobody to talk to when you was younger, like your parents? I realize now how many people really wanted to help me and really wanted to be there for me. But I just, I don't know why I felt like there were such huge walls between me and everybody else in my life that it was just, you know, and as men, like I kind of grew up in that era where it was like, you know, rub some dirt on it.

Don't really show your feelings. We don't cry. You know, we pick ourselves up by the bootstraps and keep it moving and I'm a product of that type of mindset not really working now what was

so bad growing up as a kid like what was the bruises that you discuss of so the funny thing is it wasn't anything like external environment I grew up in a nice neighborhood

I had everything I ever wanted from my family but it was more so like fitting in with the people around me like around like people of my skin color it was, I wasn't black enough and around white

people. It was like, Oh, you're not really one of us, but you kind of are one of us. And I was like one of the only black kids that were in like the advanced classes at my school. So I was like, I don't feel black enough, but I'm the only black kid in these classes. When I was on a team with the athletes and stuff, I always felt like a nerd. So it was like these environments where I was like, damn, I don't feel like I fit in or I can just show up as myself in these environments. I always got to put this mask on or be somebody different. Is it what you biracial?

That was going to ask the same question. Nah, my dad's just really light-skinned. I think I got to do like an ancestor or something. I don't really know. Oh, got you, got you, got you. As far as I know, I'm just black. So you're black? Yeah.

Really? So I wonder why they thought you couldn't say nigga no more. He's got a straight face. He's got a straight face no more so you know I hear that story a lot and it is usually um why I had to say because you like into no I'm good okay so usually when you uh when you leave your neighborhood growing up you move into like most like your parents might have moved into a white neighborhood right with a better school education but now you're the only black family or very few of you in that situation.

So it happened with my daughter as well because when she went to the school, she felt like there was nobody there for her, right? She felt like all the white girls would get all of the attention because it was white boys. She felt confused. She felt not wanted. She was growing up with a lot of problems. Did you have that same situation, the same feeling? Yeah, that explains a lot of the environment that I was growing up in.

The first friends I made in my neighborhood growing up were white and um you know a lot of dudes at my school and it was just because they was outside playing ball like riding bikes like just doing stuff i like to do and uh you know kind of getting you know jokes made because of those type of things it's like all right i'm like i gotta like find a way and growing up in the south you know i'm saying football is like religion down there and i was like okay i'm good at this this is going going up in the South, you know what I'm saying? Football is like religion down there. And I was like, okay, I'm good at this. This is going to get me the acceptance that I've always wanted. And does that still bother you now? I was going to say, do you still have those feelings now fitting in, in those situations now?

I'm a lot more comfortable in my skin now. I still have thoughts of like, all right, like I need to be successful and attribute that to my worth in some ways. But it's a lot less present in my everyday thinking than it was back then. It's so interesting to hear you had this conversation because, like you said, you're from Atlanta. You don't hear this about black people in Atlanta. Black people in Atlanta is like the total opposite. They grew up around a bunch of black people, black affluent people, black people in positions of power, elected officials, police officers, everything. So it's like, wow. They're from Atlanta, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I say I'm from Ackworth, Georgia.

It's 30 minutes outside of Atlanta. So people that's really from Atlanta in the inner city. I'm not from the inner city, but I'm from that area. Got you. Now, recently you decided to retire from the NFL. Yeah. And you're only 31, right? But everybody says physically that you are still a beast,

that you should not retire. But one of the top tight ends in the league, what was the decision to say, you know what, I no longer want to do this? At the end of the day, I feel like you've got to evaluate your commitment level for the entire process. You know, there's certain things where it's like I can look at it and be like, yeah, the results of what could be the yards, the, you know, successful seasons, like they would look great

and they would feel great, but as far as going through the whole process, putting all the work in, going through the entire season, it's like I got to be willing to put forth that commitment level for teammates, for the organization. I don't feel like I can be able to do that anymore at this point in my life. I feel like that passion has kind of passed on. There's other things that I want to spend my time doing.

You said you had a near-death experience. I read an article that said that. Yeah, this past year. It was weird, man. I was going to, we actually shot a video, me and my boy A-Rod, and I was coming back to my condo in Jersey, and I felt a fever coming on, and I had COVID two times before that,

and I was like, I feel like I'm just gonna have COVID, gotta sort it out and just thug it. But I started to lose consciousness, and I was fighting for my breath when i got back to my condo and i called 9-1-1 and they finally made out what i was trying to say because i guess i wasn't speaking clear enough and i was just fighting for my breath so the paramedics showed up i think i kind of like passed out before they got there and they woke me up and i had like oxygen mask on they took me into the hospital i was in there for three days couldn't go to the

bathroom on my own couldn't stand up like i had like a viral infection in my lungs or something. So that was pretty wild. It made me kind of think and reflect and be like, all right, what am I doing with my life? Am I really doing what I want to do? And at that time I didn't feel like I was really doing that. I felt like I was doing things because I felt like I should be doing them. So it was a viral infection that caused it.

Yeah. Wow, that's interesting. So clearly you didn't think football was your purpose. Like it's hard to do anything if you don't feel like this is your purpose. Yeah. Wow, that's interesting. So clearly you didn't think football was your purpose. Like it's hard to do anything if you don't feel like this is your purpose. Yeah. You felt like you had to go find your actual purpose. Yeah, I feel like in a way football did serve a purpose. It did give me the ability to find my voice,

to share through my pain and my struggle to help other people through theirs. And it also showed me that through hard work and patience and just staying with the process I can be excellent at whatever I want to do because people were not checking for me for a long period of time in football but you know just by sticking with the process I was able to make a name for myself and be successful so I feel like I could carry those principles to whatever I want to do. How do the people around you feel about your decision to retire because you know NFL is not easy to get into and not even just your family but the organization i'm sure people are trying to stop you from yeah yeah i get it from yeah people with the team and uh you know just just people that love the

game like and uh respect the way that i play they're like man you can't retire like you can't do this but uh you know the people that are close to me and uh you know see what all that i've given to the game all that i've worked and just like poured everything I had. They support me. Now, I see you since retiring, you've been fiddling a lot with music. Is that where you want to go next? You want to be a musician and artist? Yeah, I feel like there's definitely a journey for me there. You know, my great grandfather was a legendary jazz musician and I loved music as a kid, playing piano, being in band. And I'm just kind of circling back to those things I loved as a kid. And, you know know just really want to go that route i feel something like in a way like spiritually pulling me in that direction and so you know i don't have any expectations with it

for real but uh i believe in myself and the growth that i'm having as an artist with the stuff i'm gonna be putting out so uh yeah something i want to definitely devote time to among a lot of other things i feel like you are looking for peace yeah that's what you're at you want to you want to do things that bring you peace yeah if it don't make you happy you don't want to do it yeah man because it's like you know uh it's like a Jim Carrey quote out there he was like you know uh I wish people could get everything they ever wanted to realize it's uh not what's gonna give them that sense of fulfillment you know especially if you're doing things You know pertain to somebody else's dream of success because I was like, okay football like damn I get I get this money

I have this longevity like I'm gonna be happy I'm be fulfilled and it's still like I make it happen It's still kind of like yes. I feel like it's still gotta be more out there for me, you know So it's gotta be something that's authentically aligned with me and that's why I saying like I'm still trying to figure that out Is that why you got the serenity tattoo yeah man um you know since uh got getting sober like serenity prayer is like a big tool that's right as far as like going through my day you know because there's a lot of things that you got to accept things as they are god grant me the serenity to accept the things i cannot change courage to change things i can and the wisdom to know the difference yeah you wear yourself out trying to change things as you can't man so it's something that I try

to carry to everything I do. Now you talk about peace, so what gives Darren Wall a peace, like what puts you in your happy place if it's not football anymore? I would say being in nature man, as a kid growing up in Atlanta, there wasn't really no mountains around, you got like Kennesaw Mountain and Stone Mountain, they really just like hills though, but going out

to a place like Vegas and going to a place like Utah, Colorado, like being in nature nature, those things really, I feel like get me closer to God than anything else. Making music as well, just being in the process of that, writing, creating, coming up with ideas. Being around my family more, I feel like just with the grind that I've had through the game, I feel like I've missed out on a lot.

For the fourth, I'll be going to my first family function with all the extended family since before I got sober. That was almost seven years ago because it's always when I'm training or getting ready for training camp. You ready for that though? Because you know it's going to be a bunch of, oh man, why are you retiring, man?

What's up, man? Yeah, man. You still give me tickets? Yeah, it's a lot of that. But yeah, it's just like getting people to see me as I am now. Like football is always going to be a part of me. it has been a major part but uh there's more to my story i still got god willing 60 more years to live so uh there's more chapters to be told i want you to go back to the nature part because uh you know i write books so in my new book which is

called get honest or die lying i have a chapter called tree hug the block and it's literally about how we need to get reconnected to nature because i grew up in south carolina i'm from the south so i grew up running around on the dirt road running through the corn field running through the woods you know actually looking up at the sun walking around barefoot so i was doing grounding and earthing because before i even knew what that was so talk about just that connection to nature and how important that is for your mental and emotional well-being yeah man for me just being outside being in nature is something's something that allows me to see where I stand in the grand scheme of things.

Being around mountains and things like that, I'm in awe of God's creation, realizing I'm a part of this world. I have something to give, but at the same time, not taking myself so seriously. But yeah, also being in nature, I feel like that's what our ancestors did. That's what we all did. And just being out there, just getting outside of yourself, being able to enjoy the beauty of the world around you.

I feel like it can affect your mindset and help you live with more gratitude. Is that where you were when you decided to retire? Yeah, so the week before I made my decision, we actually hit all the national parks in Utah for five days. We just hopped in the RV, us and a couple other homies, and we just went for it. Wow. like you know we a lot of a lot of folks saying ain't really doing that especially like where we come from people that look like us so you know we just try and do things that uh you know

that's new you know what i'm saying were you high or anything like i'm not damn i mean to say hi drugs but like you don't smoke weed or nothing do you no i smoke i like smoking cigars but that's pretty much it now so you just was like you know you know what? I think I'm going to retire. You just turned to your man and said, I think I'm going to retire. It wasn't like a decision that just hit me at that moment. It was something that was being considered over that time. But as I was out there, it was like, yeah, that was kind of the stamp. I feel like I've given this all I have to give as far as me wanting to play the game.

I feel like the only thing that would bring me back was wanting to impress other people. You've made a lot of real big life choices lately, right? You retired from the NFL, and then you got married last year to Kelsey Plum, star of Las Vegas Aces point card, but then you filed for divorce a year later. Right. What happened? Man, you talk about get honest or die lying.

You kind of got to look at yourself and realize, what happened? Man, that's a, you talk about get honest or die lying. You know, you kind of got to look at yourself and realize like, all right, like, you know, what role am I playing that all the relationships in my life have always had the same patterns. And it kind of plays into everything else.

I was mentioning earlier, like the codependency aspect of like, anytime I'm in a relationship, I feel like I got to, you know, dance or do a certain thing for, to keep this person around, you know,

almost like a tying myself worth to the success of a relationship. And you realize how much you lose yourself and doing the things that you love and things that, that take care of you on a daily basis, making this person kind of like the center of your universe and how unhealthy that is for everybody involved. You know what I'm saying? So, um, realizing that, realizing the impact that it was having on me and, uh, you know know as far as making decisions that were authentic for the life that i wanted these are things that i couldn't say 100 yes to you have certain conversations and realize there's so much life ahead of both of us you know might as well just go ahead and uh and live it and

uh move on with no type of hostility you didn't think that like before marriage like before you proposed and before you got married like you didn't have that before marriage? Before you proposed and before you got married, you didn't have that conversation with yourself? Yeah, I like to think that I did, but there's certain situations, kind of like I said earlier, where I didn't really have that self-awareness. That spreads into other areas of my life as well where I'm like, okay, I thought I was ready to have a commitment like that and be involved, but really it's like there's a part of

me that's like okay like the pursuit the the chase the the building of it um seemed more appealing of than when things you know get extremely difficult and the same patterns continue to come out and it's like bro at the end of the day you got to heal bro because or the same things are going to continue to happen i saw will sm Smith say recently, he said, it's impossible to make somebody else happy. He said, you have to have happiness, she has to have happiness, and then y'all come together. Exactly. You know?

Is that what it was, you think? Absolutely, man. I feel like in a way there was a reliance of me on the relationship to give me something that, of course, I needed to come to the table without that extra baggage and with that healing already in place, and I didn't. What was harder to do, retire from the NFL or get a divorce? I think both, man.

Both were difficult. You know, both are a part of who I am, things that meant a lot to me at the time, and to have them both happen at the same time, it's like a lot of emotions you've got to process, a lot of talking, a lot of writing, a lot of time being spent reflecting and being by yourself. And, uh, that's real life stuff, man. Cause I've had a lot of, uh, success, a lot of great moments in my life, but these are, this year has been one that has really forced me

to look in the mirror and, and dig deep into, um, you know, express myself in ways that are healthy and just really get to, you know what I'm saying? Who is, who is Darren Waller at the core without all these things that I try to reach for, for, you know, express myself in ways that are healthy and just really get to, you know what I'm saying, who is Darren Waller at the core without all these things that I try to reach for, for, you know, fulfillment or validation. And it was a mutual thing or like, it was you saying I want to leave or her saying she want to leave? It was conversations had to the end where it was mutual.

Got you. Now you did a- Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys,

and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High.

It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Marie. And I'm Sydney. And we're Mess.

Well, not a mess, but on our podcast called Mess, we celebrate all things messy. But the gag is not everything is a mess. Sometimes it's just living. Yeah, things like J-Lo on her third divorce. Living. Girls trip to Miami. Mess. Ozempic.

Messy, skinny living. Restaurant stealing a birthday cake mess wait what flavor was the cake though okay that's a good question hooking up with someone in accounting and then getting a promotion living breaking up with your girlfriend

while on instagram live living it's kind of mess yeah well you get it got it live love mess listen to mess with sydney washington and marie faustin on iheart radio app Mmm, it's kind of mess. Yeah. Well, you get it. Got it? Live, love, mess. Listen to Mess with Sidney Washington and Marie Faustin on iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

What's up, y'all? This is Questlove, and I'm here to tell you about a new podcast I've been working on with the Story Pirates and John Glickman called Historical Records. It's a family-friendly podcast. Yeah, you heard that right. A podcast for all ages. One you can listen to and enjoy with your kids starting on September 27th. I'm going to toss it over to the host of Historical Records, Nimany, to tell you all about it. Make sure you check it out. Hey y'all, Nimany here. I'm the host of a brand new history podcast for kids and families called Historical Records. Historical Records brings history to life through hip hop.

Each episode is about a different inspiring figure from history. Like this one about Claudette Colvin, a 15-year-old girl in Alabama who refused to give up her seat on the city bus nine whole months before Rosa Parks did the same thing. Check it. Did you know, did you know, I wouldn't give up my seat. Nine months before Rosa, it was Claudette Coleman. Get the kids in your life excited about history by tuning in to Historical Records. Because in order to make history, you have to make some noise. Listen to Historical Records on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. in the heart of Zaire, Africa. Three days of music and then the boxing event.

What was going on in the world at the time made this fight as important that anything else is going on on the planet. My grandfather laid on the ropes and let George Foreman basically just punch himself out. Welcome to Rumble, the story of a world in transformation. The 60s and prior to that,

you couldn't call a person black. And how we arrived at this peak moment. I don't have to be what you want me to be. We all came from the continent of Africa. Listen to Rumble, Ali, Foreman, and the Soul of 74 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, a five-year-old boy floated alone in the ocean. He had lost his mother trying to reach Florida from Cuba. He looked like a little angel. I mean, he looked so fresh.

And his name, Elian Gonzalez, will make headlines everywhere. Elian Gonzalez. Elian Gonzalez. Elian Gonzalez. Elian. Elian. Elian Gonzalez. At the heart of the story

is a young boy and the question of who he belongs with. His father in Cuba. Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son with him. Or his relatives with him. Imagine that your mother died trying to get you to freedom.

At the heart of it all is still this painful family separation. Something that as a Cuban, I know all too well. Listen to Chess Feast, the Elian González story, as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A song called Who Knew? Yeah. Now, that was in dedication to the situation relationship? So, yeah. So, I had an idea as we were winding down and separating that I was like, okay,

I keep finding myself in these positions, these same patterns, and I had this idea of like, if the girl that I was in a relationship with, because I mean, you can look at her and say, she's the public one that people can know that I was with, but that's the same pattern

of a lot of relationships that I've been in. It's like, if they had the pen and would write me a song, what would they say? And so it's like, you're taking a risk making a song like that. It's very vulnerable, very different than anything I've ever made before. But, you know, I try to make stuff that's authentic to me, where I'm at,

and just put myself out there, take risks. Did you hear the song? What was her thoughts on the song? Did y'all speak after? Nah, that was after. Yeah, ain't really been no discussion. So y'all don't speak at all? Y'all don't communicate or have conversations at all.

No. It's the rap. I mean, you're saying the song, you know, why you want to run away, why can't you just stay? So was it something you was trying to keep together? So it's really the song is like her perspective. So it's from the perspective of the woman that's been in a relationship with me.

So she's like, why do you keep running? Like really speaking to me. I love this perspective man because men a lot of times don't take accountability for our bullshit yeah we try to project and put it on the other person so for you to be like no it ain't you it's me right sometimes a lot of dudes say that just when they really want to be out here doing some b, but you really knew you had to go do the internal work. Yeah, yeah. It's a lot of work on my behalf for me to try to look at somebody else and focus on them when there's plenty of stuff on my side of the street

that I got to clean up. Yeah, that's not what men do. That's not the example that we trying to set. So I'm out here trying to do better just like everybody else is. Was it therapeutic to do that record? Yeah, absolutely. It was definitely a good way to express myself and to, you know, have empathy not only for her but everybody I've been in a relationship with

and to honor them as I go forward and try to change my ways, change my thinking, and heal myself. You think you'll be ready for a relationship? Like the more internal work you're doing, do you think you'll be ready for a relationship in the future? I believe so, yeah, if that's what God has in the cards for me. But it's definitely going to take a lot more patience than I've had before and moving slowly because a lot of times I feel like I want to move fast.

You know what I'm saying? Like I'm an addict. I got that thinking. It's like, you know, I want what I want now and I want things to happen quickly. And those kind of thought process got to change. And I believe that they will. And in time, whenever that is.

But like I said, I got a lot of things I want to figure out for myself. And it'll happen when it's supposed to. It's my last question about that. But what do you say to people, especially a lot of guys who be like, damn, Darren, you fumbled Kelsey. Because they like Kelsey. They think Kelsey is beautiful. Yeah. Do you feel like you fumbled her?

Not really, man. In a lot of ways, I feel like, man, was that even really for me to pick up in the first place? You know, as approaching a relationship and wanting to speed through things and, you know, make a connection happen quickly with some of the things I talked about earlier. It's like you look at it and it's like, hmm, was that even for me? So you can talk about fumbling or whatever, that's not really anything that I try to think about. I never thought about that in terms of relationships

with people. Like if you have an addiction, right? If you're an addict, right? So you said you want what you want and you want it now. So you can kind of like trauma bond with a lot of people and not even realize exactly not even be aware of that shit yeah crazy damn i do want to ask about the uh nfl i do see sometimes players in the nfl that play sports uh get addicted to things easier and i was going to ask

is that to take away the pain is that to take away the the feeling the trauma the hurt the crowd the fan is that why you feel like some of that addiction came from yeah so like mine started really early but if you're talking like in the general population of guys in the league yeah there's an insane amount of pressure on you on a day in day out you know just to perform at your job or somebody's gonna take your place you know people gonna talk crazy about you if you on the internet and so people just want that relief you know I'm saying like I I Somebody's going to take your place. People are going to talk crazy about you if you're on the Internet. And so people just want that relief. You know what I'm saying?

I never set out, none of these guys ever set out to be addicts or to be people that abuse substances, but they're just like, man, I just want to change the way that I feel, give myself some sense of peace when I get home because it's a stressful day, it's a stressful career, and I just want some relief. So that's where I feel like guys kind of get started down that path without even having bad intentions. You know what I'm saying? Does the league try to help the players when they're going through things career and I just want some relief. So that's where I feel like guys kind of get started down that path without even having bad intentions.

You know what I'm saying? Does the league try to help the players when they're going through things? Because, I mean, it has to be difficult. Like you said, the pressure, I mean, the pain to, you know, to play through it. Do they offer services to help players or not too much or a lot? Yeah, they offer services. Like the teams that will offer like, you know, like pain management,

like you got massages you got needles i'll talk about mentally but yeah they have um they got team counselors like team clinicians that are available for guys um some guys use them some guys don't um but there's a lot of guys that are leaning more towards having therapists outside of the building um so they can kind of just like cut that tie from having it with the team um like even when i went to rehab like the league paid for there was like a a guy that was, like, a case manager for me who was calling my phone, blowing my phone up, just, like, seeing how I was doing what I needed.

So they definitely really helped me. And I feel like whenever guys are, like, willing to, like, okay, like, I want to help myself, then they can take advantage of the resources at hand. Is the reason they don't want to use a team counselor because they don't trust them? Like, I don't want to share too much information with them because they might take it back to the yeah

they're they're a lot of there are a lot of guys that feel that way of like yeah i don't know if this is going to go back to the team and the team says like that that's not going to happen but you know it's like you know as men it's like in especially in this hyper masculine environment of football it's like if i show any sign of weakness other teams people across me are going to try to take advantage of that. I don't feel safe to share that here. And, you know, that's a legit emotion. What's been the most effective healing tool for you?

Man, it's hard to pick one, man. I would say meditation played a huge role for me just because, you know, making that a daily part of my routine, it kind of gives me like a space and like a pause when it comes to moments where it's time to make decisions. In my day-to-day life, a lot of times where I would make bad decisions, it was kind of like I was just reacting to things super fast, whereas meditation kind of gives you that pause to allow you to be like, okay, like let me take a deep breath. Is this really what I want to do? And like it gives you an opportunity to evaluate your decisions more.

So I feel like that's something that definitely gave me a jump to, to start along with other things. But that was probably one of the first ones learning that it was just like, wow, like I really have a chance to sit here and not just have the world just have me blowing about in the wind and the storms that come on a day-to-day. I can actually stand firm and make decisions I want to make. I'm trying to figure out when you made these decisions,

whether it was to retire from the NFL or get a divorce, had you already started your healing journey? And that's when you started, I guess, peeling back those layers when you realized, you know what, I need to move on from these things or was it before um get rid of those things then start your healing journey the healing journey was kind of going all along and you kind of realized like um getting sober from drugs and alcohol was really just the beginning of that journey but in ways i thought like that was like the completion because it was like those were my problems like oh he's got he drinks too much there's a lot of drugs like okay i that that was like the completion because it was like, those were my problems. Like, Oh, he's got, he drinks too much.

Like, okay, I changed that. But like there's still like this feeling of uneasiness and like things that I'm reaching for to make me feel better. And so that journey is always going on, has always been going on the last seven years and just new unfoldings of that new, um, things I learned from like, Oh wow. From my childhood. Like that's why I am the way that I am. That's why I seek worth out of relationships or from pleasing other people. Like it's connecting all those dots now. And it's like, okay,

it's starting to make sense. And now it's like, all right, I actually have the courage now to make decisions for me and knowing that I'm trying to be a better man in the process of making them. So you have that feeling of a self-worth that you've been looking for now yeah it's growing man i can honestly say it's growing and uh whereas before it was like non-existent this is like you know i'm one of the best players in my position in the league and still you know trying to find that like there was a vivid memory i had of like a 200 yard game in 2020 and the wednesday practice after that i'm lining up for routes on air. There ain't even no defense out there.

And I'm like, all right, don't drop this pass in my mind. When really I just did something like only five other people in my position have ever done in the history of the league. So it's been a lifelong thing, man, and I can finally say it's starting to grow. And sometimes it takes making courageous decisions and standing up on something that a lot of people may not agree with, but that's the way. What about your foundation, the Darren Waller Foundation?

Yeah, man, that's a decision that, like I talked about, the league giving me an opportunity to go to treatment for free. And it's like through getting sober I kind of realized my world is a lot better, a lot more full when it's just bigger than me. I'm doing a lot being able to do things for other people and so through my foundation we are able to give people scholarships to go to treatment uh for 30 days and also have like sober living opportunities uh just just opportunities to get back on their feet and we've sent like 60 people through um 30 day stays um

and that number is continuing to go up continuing to uh build resources in the Vegas community, just, you know, trying to give people opportunity. Because, I mean, I didn't know that I'd be able to have the impact that I've been able to have in my life back when I was, you know, kind of stuck in that hole. And, you know, all you got to do is impact one person because through me being impacted, a lot of other people will be able to be helped. So it's just like giving that person a chance. So you still live in Vegas? Yeah, I still live in Vegas. Is that hard? Being that your ex-wife plays there?

Like you probably got to see posters and stuff of her all the time? No, I mean, it's not anything of wishing any type of ill will or any type of resentment. Like I want her to be great. I want her to be happy. I want her to be at peace and feel fulfilled in her life just like anybody else, you know. And I have a lot of great connections in Vegas, I want her to be happy, I want her to be at peace and feel fulfilled in her life just like anybody else.

And I have a lot of great connections in Vegas, people that I've met and formed friendships with that are there for me, that community's been there for me and I've done a lot in that community so I feel like that's somewhere I wanna be for a little while. Do you love yourself? I do love myself.

Okay. Did you just get to that place or you've always? Oh yeah, it's relatively new for sure. It's taken like struggles and seeing myself like really as I am with, with all the, all the good, all the bad, like whatever you want to call it. But it's like, I can look at myself now and it's like, there is no more voice inside of me that wants to beat me down. It's one that wants to build me up and encourage myself because it's like,

yeah, maybe walking paths now that um a lot of people may look at me like i'm crazy like my life has fallen apart in a way but it's it's it's funny and ironic how when it looks like things are falling apart for me it feels like things are coming together so that's all you can ask for the only reason i ask that is because you know your first last and best love is self-love so it's like until you get that self-love you can't love anything else or anybody else. That's a fact. Football, a wife, nothing.

That's a fact. That's why I asked that question. For sure. What did you think? And I knew I said this was going to be the last question, but when you saw her statement about I'm devastated, I walked through fire for that man, but now I see it's time to go. And she said one day I'm going to share my story.

Today is not that day. What did you think of that whole statement? I feel like she has every right to express herself in whichever way that she chooses. Because, like I said, I know I was never perfect. And, you know, some of the reasons that motivated me to leave, they caused harm. They hurt. You know what I'm saying? So I respect whatever way she wants to express herself.

You know, I'm out here trying to improve and by no means claiming to be a victim in any way you know so uh i'm all good with it absolutely all right well darren waller ladies and gentlemen do you believe there's a script that owners and refs are a part of the outcome of games because that's been a thing that we've been hearing and you're retired now i don't know if you plan to go back but feel free to spill any secrets that you know is there a script keep in mind he's a The outcome of games. Because that's been a thing that we've been hearing. And you're retired now. I don't know if you plan to go back. But feel free to spill any secrets that you know. Is there a script? Keep in mind, he's a Cowboys fan.

I just want to throw that out there. I don't believe in a script. Because I believe if there was a script, Cowboys would have been Super Bowl champions at least three or four times over the last 24 years. Yeah, the Cowboys are way too talented to not have won one yet, in my opinion. And make too much money. Forget the talent.

I'm just saying, if there was a script, you don't think Jerry Jones would pay to win a Super Bowl? I don't know, man. I don't know of any script. If I had a script, man, I would have had one that had me at least win one playoff game in my career. Damn. But, yeah, no, I don't know of any script.

And out of the three teams you played for, the Ravens, Raiders, and Giants, which was the best organization for you? Man, in a way, they all were, to be honest. The Ravens taught me – being. The Ravens taught me, being with the Ravens taught me a lot of hard lessons, really forced me to grow up in a lot of ways. And, you know, that last year being there on the practice squad,

it gave me the tools and the work ethic to be able to sustain the level of success that I did once I got it. So I'm grateful for that. But the Raiders had all the great memories, man, like the great seasons, just like the guys that form relationships with, coaches that I had. That was the fun ride. But, I mean, I had a blast with the Giants this last year too, man,

like all the coaches and the guys in that locker room, man. I had a great time. And my decision to retire had nothing to do with my time there. You know, I had a great time with them and wished them nothing but the best. But if I had to pick one, it'd probably be the Raiders for sure. I mean, that's where my career took off, my life changed. I was able to do things for my family, for the community, through just having a chance that they gave me.

And you know you're completely done with football? Yeah. Really? Yeah, a thousand percent. Wow. You're not going gonna miss nothing about the game or oh no that that the game is always going to be something i hold in high regard and love and uh i'll miss that locker room environment you know i'm saying being in there with those guys and just cutting up man just uh and and walking through the struggles together because it's like you know you might go out there and get your ass whooped on a sunday but

those moments where you're there in there picking guys up in the locker room and and and standing firm when a lot of people may be pointing fingers and doing that but as men you kind of lock arms and walk through life like those are those are cool moments man those are moments that a lot of people don't get to experience so i'll definitely miss those i'll miss playing you know you get a rush from making a big play making a difference in the game but um you know i can get that feeling in a lot of other ways now and just ready to move on. We'll see when the season starts.

We'll see when you're sitting at home watching on Sunday if you get that itch. Yeah, we'll see. That's what I don't believe. I don't believe a person's truly retired until they can watch it and be like, okay, I'm good. For sure. All right, well, it's Darren Waller. It's The Breakfast Club.

Good morning. Thank you. Wake that ass up. Early in the morning. The Breakfast Club. Good morning. Thank you. and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast Post Run High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, y'all. Niminy here. I'm the host of a brand new history podcast for kids and families called Historical Records. Executive produced by Questlove, The Story Pirates, and John Glickman, Historical Records brings history to life through hip-hop. Each episode is about a different inspiring figure from history. Like this one about Claudette Colvin, a 15-year-old girl in Alabama who refused to give up her seat on the city bus nine whole months before Rosa Parks did the same thing.

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Hey, everyone. This is Courtney Thorne-Smith, Laura Layton, and Daphne Zuniga. On July 8th, 1992, apartment buildings with pools were never quite the same as Melrose Place was introduced to the world. We are going to be reliving every hookup, every scandal, and every single wig removal together. So listen to Still the Place on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hello, my undeadly darlings. It's Teresa, your resident ghost host. And do I have a treat for you.

Haunting is crawling out from the shadows, and it's going to be devilishly good. We've got chills, thrills, and stories that'll make you wish the lights stayed on. So join me, won't you? Let's dive into the eerie unknown together. Sleep tight, if you can. Listen to Haunting on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, what's up? This is Ramses Jha. And I go by the name Q Ward.

And we'd like you to join us each week for our show, Civic Cipher. That's right. We discuss social issues, especially those that affect black and brown people, but in a way that informs and empowers all people. We discuss everything from prejudice to politics to police violence. And we try to give you the tools to create positive change in your home, workplace and social circle. We're going to learn how to become better allies to each other. So join us each Saturday for Civic Cipher on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast.