The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Emma Grede Talks New Book ‘Start With Yourself’, Balancing Work & Motherhood, Recognizing Your Worth + More 

Episode Date: April 15, 2026

Today on The Breakfast Club, Emma Grede Talks New Book ‘Start With Yourself’, Balancing Work & Motherhood, Recognizing Your Worth. Listen For More!YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BreakfastClubPower1051FMSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Just hilarious. Charlemagne de Guy. We are the Breakfast Club. La Rosa's here with us today. We got a special guest in the building. Yes, indeed. She has a new book. Start with yourself.

Emma Gritty, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome back. Thank you. Thank you. How are you feeling? I'm feeling great, actually. Great. The book comes out and I'm just like dying right now.

Big entourage, 50 people at least. Always, Charlemagne. I learned from the best. 51. I learn from the best. And when do you have time between running businesses? When do you have time to write this book? You know, I think it's like for me it was super important to do it.

And I've been thinking about it for the longest time because I've learned so much over the years. And it was important to me to answer the questions that I get asked over and over again. And there's no way that I can answer every DM. I can speak to every woman at the end of a conference. So this for me was actually something that was really important to get out there because I think the idea of what it means to build a business has been really warped by social media. And so then when I say things that upset people and they're like, oh, really?

I need to go to work. I'm like, yes. Like you need to work. Are you going to have to work? So, you know, I feel it was important to put down everything because you only see the glory side. And I've had a lot of things happen in my career, a lot of mistakes that I've made. And I thought that was equally important to share. Now, I know you're very intentional about design and things like that.

Like, what made you come up with this cover? Because it's fly, but it's simplistic, right? It's very simplistic, right? The material. Yeah, the material of the book is different. The fabric is different. Well, I'm an aesthetic person. You know, I wanted something that looked beautiful.

But also, I went with the publisher who would allow me to not put my face on the book because I don't want to read a book with the face on the book. But your face sells. I know. It's a nice face. No one's saying it's not, but to me it was important because, listen, I created a book that is here to use, not just to read. So I wanted it to feel like a workbook.

It's yours. It's not mine. It's not about me. It's about you. About the reader. Now, what's start with yourself? Is that starting with yourself professionally or personally when you say start with yourself? You know, I don't think that you can separate the two things because at the end of the day, we come

to work in into our work lives and our careers as people. And I've never been able to separate those two things myself. I come into my work as a mother of four, as a why, who, I'm, and I'm never been able to separate as a wife, as a woman that's been through a lot of things. And so I really try not to have that separation. It's like where you can figure your stuff out. And I talk so much in this book about having a vision for yourself and managing your emotions.

Because when you're coming at life from an emotional place, you will never make good decisions. That means you won't make good decisions in your life or in your career and your work. So I look at the two things as one of the same. What's a hard truth about yourself that you had to confront that changed the trajectory of your success? Well, you know, when I was a kid, I was a very angry kid.

When you're raised in the hood and when you're raised, you know, around a lot that's kind of going on around you and that's not something that you have a choice in, you get angry. And I really realized, I think in my late teens, that that wasn't going to serve me. The type of life that I dreamed of and all the things I wanted were not going to come if I kept kind of walking around blaming everybody else. So that was a real pivotal time for me to kind of get a hold. And again, it's about not allowing your emotions to do your decision making for you. And I think about that even in the sense for most women now, right?

A lot of us come from a place of fear. We're fearful about what's next or we're carrying guilt for our kids and for our family. And so I think managing your emotions more broadly is something that all of us, man or woman, really have to work on in order to get ahead.

What made you... I'm sorry, go ahead. I saw you say you're a max three-hour mom and that sparked a conversation. Didn't it spark a bit of a way? I mean, listen, I want to be really honest about this. I spend all my time working and I'm a mum of four. I think that I am a core memory mum.

I'm not going to walk it back. I'm somebody that really, really cares about the big things, the big moments, Christmas, Thanksgiving. But let's be honest, have I been at work all week, Monday through Friday, and I'm with my kids all morning on a Saturday? There's time that I need for me. And I say things that a lot of people think. I think that most moms, after playing with their kids

and taking their kids to the birthday parties and getting up on a Saturday and going through their house and running their errands are exhausted. So I'm just being honest. Any husband who's married, like I am, like envy is, we have four daughters. We understand exactly what you need.

Know it. We know exactly what our wives need breaks. Right? Yes, they do. All women need breaks. And what I want to do is destigmatize the idea of what it means to be a mother who works.

And at the end of the day, it's like if I'm good, the whole family. But that it takes a village and I think this idea that we're all doing everything ourselves, that you have to constantly be in service as a woman to your family, to everyone around you, is unrealistic if you're going to be successful. So let's just call it what it is. It's like I am a really great hands-on mum, but I also need to look after myself.

And I prioritize myself often and I don't want to have to walk around feeling ashamed at doing that. Do you think that women ever really get to a point where they don't feel ashamed though, like fully? Like, do you have no mom guilt ever? No, that's the truth is no I don't, but it's my guilt. So I think what's really important, and when I talk about holding a vision for yourself, you have to hold a vision for yourself, the type of woman you want to be, the type of mother you want to be, the type of friend you want to be. And once that vision is aligned with what you're doing, you're fine. And what I mean by that is I know what type of parent I want to be. I'm out the door most mornings because I have to leave to go to the office. But I am always at my house at 5.30 because I like to do bedtime and story time, put my kids to bed. That's my choice. That's what I like to do. So I measure myself by my own set of standards, by my principles, by the way I want a parent, not by what I see on Instagram or what I see other moms at the school do. That's what makes you miserable. That's what gives you this heavy sense that I'm, you know, I'm in some sense of guilt. So I think hold a vision for yourself and work

towards your own vision and version of your life and don't be held to anyone else's standards. Now break down what the three-hour max mom is. So for people that don't know, that's listening. I mean, you could clarify, but the comment that I read, Wall Street Journal, right? It was the Wall Street Journal. Good old Wall Street Journal. Thank you. So she was basically saying... Let her explain.

She's sitting right here, Lauren. He asked me out. So what I actually said, just to make it very, very clear, is that on a Saturday, after five days at work, I go in the office every single day. I come home every single day. By the time it gets to midday on a weekend, I'm pretty done.

I'm ready to go and do something for myself. That doesn't mean I'm sitting out by the pool, lounging around. Anyone who's a mum of four knows that that's not the case. But it's like, do I want to be down on the floor, like driving cars with my four-year-olds all day? No, that's the honest truth. And so what I try to do is think about what do my kids really need from me, right? They need someone that they can rely on.

They need a mom that loves them. They need somebody who creates the best, you know, life for them. That doesn't mean that I need to spend every single waking hour orientating myself around their needs. Because my job and my life is bigger than that. Just because you're a mama four, I don't think we all need to sit here going, that's the only thing that I do. It isn't. Can you tell that to my four-year-old?

When this is over. Can you please? Because I'm tired of playing Barbies on the weekend. And it goes. Listen, I love playing Barbies for an hour. It's facts. Any parent who says any different, it's probably lying to themselves.

But also, what is, it's not like the father is doing stuff with them. The father is doing stuff for them. We have a big extended family. They're not sitting there languishing. But also, let's just get, but let's get really straight about this, right? Parenting hasn't gotten more difficult.

The expectations around parenting has got really difficult. And I think that we are all kidding ourselves when we think it's our full-time job to manage every single play date, every activity your kid does, everything that they ingest, everything that they do. Are you crazy? When I was a kid, if there was an apple and a packet of chips in the house, my mom was like, job done. It is not our jobs to usher our kids through every single moment of the day. They will figure it out. It's fine for them to get bored and put on the TV. Oh, my goodness. So you don't think we should micromanage. No, I don't think we could micromanage anything. And again, I think that my dad, it's fine. I think that my

job as a mom is to really make sure that my kids are safe and well and fed and looked after and loved. But I don't think that every waking moment of their 24 hours is my responsibility to manage. No. And would I be this successful if I did? No. When did that mindset switch though? Because I'm not a parent yet, but I always hear them talk about like the anxiety of like you're sending your kids out and you're not micromanaging. So when does that switch for you? I don't think it was ever part of how I was raised. You know, I was raised by a single mom. I'm one of four. So by the time I was 12, I could make dinner for the whole family. I was raised in such a way where I was very much left to my own devices. Do I think there's a happy medium? Absolutely. But I definitely don't,

I never thought that when I had kids, I would suddenly drop all of my ambition and become a different woman. I've always been somebody that was in creation mode for herself. And actually, when I had my first kid, that was the moment my ambition really made sense, because all of a sudden I was like, wow, now I understand what all of this is for. I have these beautiful four children who are relying on me for their lives. And I think the best thing that they see is that I go out every single day and I'm creating a life for all of us. I think that's an amazing role model.

You said something that's interesting. You say you don't believe in micromanaging anything? No, I'm not a micromanager. Wow. I wouldn't get things done. You know, I have extremely high standards, but I hire the best people and I know what my strengths are and then I hire everyone else for everything else. I don't think that I do everything the best and actually you can't build a big company if that's the way you're coming into things.

You need to know where your strengths are and then just get the best possible people. But do you always like that or did you go through issues with like hiring, firing, trying to do everything? You know, you always imagine or I always imagined back in the day that there was somebody better than me. I remember in my first company actually hiring a guy that came in as the managing director and while I was paying myself one salary, I paid him maybe double, maybe even treble. And that was because my idea of what somebody at that age and that experience could come in and do was kind of actually so far from the truth. But I kind of got it in my head that, you know, he was more experienced, that he would have

a, you know, a better ability to bring in business. And of course, none of that is true. But that was about my own self-doubt. That was about my own fear of, like, whether or not I'm born to be a leader. and I think what I've learned over the years and once as I've got kind of older and more comfortable one for myself is that you just need to have faith in your own abilities

and if you are scared of something and don't get me wrong like I still have a lot of fear but to me I use it as a signal fear to me signals that something incredible is on the other side and that I need to go through it not shy away from it so now every time I get that feeling I know and I use it in a way to kind of like pull me closer to whatever it is that I want to do.

You know, in a lot of conversations, especially up here, when is the right time to have a family? Could you talk about that? Break that down a little bit. Well, you know, I think that what's happened in the culture very largely is that, you know, we really have started to tell people that, you know, you have to wait. You have to wait.

And I think, what are you waiting for? Like, you have to wait for Prince Charming. You have to wait for the ideal time. And the reality is that there is no such thing as a perfect time, you know? And fertility is. is a really, really tricky thing. And so what we're seeing are so many people that wait and wait and wait and this happened to me.

And then it was no longer your choice. I had two children completely fine and naturally and then really, really struggled to get pregnant again in my kind of late 30s. And so I think that what we've got to do is be honest about when the right time is from a fertility perspective. Because if we all wait until we're 38, 39 years old,

the chance is dwindle. And we, again, we've kind of set ourselves up in corporate America to say, freeze your eggs, don't worry, there are options down the line, when in fact, those options aren't really options for women. They are just hopes and promises that maybe something will happen in the future. And so I really think that you should do, you know, have your 20s as the years that you put the pedal to the medal, that you absolutely like do everything that you can in your career. And you have to think about kids in your only 30s.

That's just the reality of it. And every time you lay down to have sex, you know, it's potential that, you know, you could get, There is that, Charlemagne. Yeah. That happens. I'm just saying, so when you say it, wait, it's like, it's not like people are, it does happen, Shaleman. It's not like you abstain it from sex?

No, people are not abstain from sex, but we have to just, like, put this as what it is, right? We are seeing marriage rates decline, birth rates decline. A lot of women are making decisions not to have children or to wait until they're much, much later. Because again, we've built it up that you have to wait until you're successful in your career before you even think about having a baby. having a baby. The reality is it's not either or. It's both and. Like, you have to just decide that, you know, for a moment, your career might have to take a little back seat. But if you wait and wait, listen, I'm not sitting here advocating for teenage pregnancy. What I'm saying is wait until you're 38 years old is probably not a good idea. Hey, I'm 34. I was just looking at this thing

on New York Times, me and Mimi Brown, who does our front page. I'm 34, right? So me and me and How time should you go outside of the country with a man after the age of 30 something? Damn. I just came back from Italy and he thinks I should have come back with a ring and a baby. Oh, well, no. It's the second or third time she's been out of the country with this guy.

With the guy? Yeah. I mean, it's coming. I'm sure it is. I'm not worried for you. So here's the thing, though. I love about the first time he went out to country. Be quiet.

And he asked you just to be his girlfriend. Oh, but that's romantic. What's wrong with you, Shalame? He was kind of crazy. He made a big production of it though. He put the rolls. I like it. Because when the proposal comes,

when the proposal comes, that's going to be a nice big production too. He listens to what I like. But anyway, so me and Mimi Brown, right? We were talking about the New York Times did this study, that fertility last year was at like a record low. And one of the reasons people are like, you know, women are thinking about career more, but also being able to afford things has like really scare people into like waiting

and they're trying to save money and do all these things. And that's something that I go through in my head all the time. Like, when do you know that you have enough even like money to be like, all right, I can afford a kid? But that's what I'm talking about, the expectations around parenting. Because if you think that you need to change your life, change your apartment,

buy all of this equipment, you know, like you it's crazy. You don't need all of that. Kids don't require all of that. We've built ourselves up in society to somehow imagine that if you don't have like X, then you can't have a baby. We have to check that.

Our parents never had all of that stuff. Why would we think that we do? This is just a construct of like modern society. You don't need all of that stuff. It's just a fact. When you talk about old thoughts and still thinking, right? And then you talk about the constructs that we have today. Where do you fall in the middle of like, all right, I'm going to let go of like what my parents did,

bringing what I need to do for now, but like not push myself into fear because I'm leaning too much into what society says I need to do today? You got to be somewhat secure to make sure you have a child. You can't be sitting there like yolo and not have enough to cover your... Of course, but you need that for yourself. Because people only hear certain things. No, but you need that for yourself. I said I can have a baby right now after money.

No, they're not, the people are not that stupid. Here's the thing. Give people some credit. I think this, I think at the end of the day, nobody is sitting here saying that you should go out if you have nothing. All I'm saying is just waiting at women. There's a reality around your fertility window. And if you work in corporate America right now

and you have the benefit of freezing your eggs, like you might hold onto that as like, okay, that means I can wait and wait. and wait when the reality is how many women do you know that have had pregnancies from frozen embryos or from wait a minute frozen eggs that then need to turn into frozen embryos that then need to turn into babies it's actually really it's actually really really difficult and so when we talk about these things it's just a lot of nuance to them we can't just think about uh you know wanting to be a parent and say well i'll just kick that down it's all i'm saying in my book is that it's something

for consideration for thought and again we don't talk about that these things enough because the common wisdom is I will just wait until I'm ready. I'll just wait until I've got enough money. I'll just wait until, you know, I'm in a better job. I'll just wait until this. And the choice is no longer yours. It's 42 and it's not your choice. But we would never have kids if that was the case because I mean, even now in America, I think 60% of all people live paycheck to paycheck. When was there ever been a time in America where majority of people can afford to have a baby? I think one of the constructs of today that you, I know you talk about like isn't really

possible is work life balance. Right. And like people, for me, one of the things I always think about is like, all right, I don't know what a pregnancy is going to be like if I'm physically going to be capable of getting up and appearing somewhere every single day. So then what happens? And I can't predict that. And for a lot of people, that part of it, but also when you have the kids, how your schedule changes and everything you have to adjust to, what do you lose? What do you gain? Like, it's like fear of the unknown. It's called a tradeoff. It's called life. Like, seriously, women have been having babies for century. Like, you think they couldn't make them way into the radio. and sit down to like have a shitty chat. I've had forking. No, but I'm deadly serious about this because that is how people think. But what if I have to sacrifice? But what if I can't do something?

Yeah, and yeah, and yeah, that you have to sacrifice. There has to be a trade off. Everything you get in life comes with something else you have to give. I just think that we're in a generation. We're all sitting here going, oh my God, something has to change. Yeah, it has to change.

You have to say, I'm going to sacrifice something because there's this other thing on the other side. But that's no difference than when we're in business. everything that you want is on the other side of fear. Every good thing that's going to come to you requires a bit of a trade-off. Why we think that we're going to get everything that we want and give nothing is just setting people up to fail.

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Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A silver 40-caliber handgun was recovered at the scene. From IHeart podcasts and Best Case Studios. This is Worshack, murder at City Hall. How could this have happened in City Hall?

Somebody tell me that. July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest. both men are carrying concealed weapons and in less than 30 minutes both of them will be dead now everybody in the chambers a shocking public murder

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That may or may not have been political. It may have been about sex. Listen to Rorschach, murder at City Hall, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. How do you check your ego when the world is constantly rewarding you? Because success can reinforce bad habits just as much as the ones can. I think that that comes from my upbringing. I was raised in East London. And so there is like a basic, like there's a moral compass.

and a sort of operating manual of how you should behave. I was raised to tell the truth. I was raised to very much come true on my word, to not talk and not mean things. And so I think the way that I operate every day, what I come back to and the way that I behave in business is very much about the foundation of where I come from. And so I just think that that's who I am.

I also think what you realize is that life is very long. Like even on this press tour, you know, I was laughing this morning with my team saying I've met three journalists that used to work for me. You know, if you are not a good person and if you've treated people bad, like it will come and it will kill you. And so I am able to keep those things in check just because that's who I am. And I also know that like, you know, things change like really, really quickly. One minute you're on the up and the other minute you're not, you know, and I've seen those cycles. I've had that

in my life. And I try and in this book to talk a lot about all of the failures that I've had, because what you see on Instagram, what you see in the press is almost like the real of greatness, right? It's all this amazing stuff and all these lovely outfits and all these good glam days. When the reality is I've had a lot of failures, I had a lot of things in my life that didn't work out. I had a bunch of businesses that I had to have really like steep learnings from. And so what I did in this book was try to be really honest about that so that other people can learn from it and can see that it's just you don't always have this linear path of up and up and up. Like, you do something great and then it kind of stagnates a little bit and then it goes down a bit

and then something else amazing happens. But our life happens in seasons. I think the more that we can be really honest about that, the easier it is for people to see and track their own journeys because we have like unrealistic expectations on ourselves, which also I think really stifles women, this idea that everything should be perfection. And the reality is that in my own life, it has never been there. And how do you handle the failures? You talk about the failures. How do you re-approach whether it's personally or business to make sure that it doesn't happen again. Is it firing people? Is it hiring the right people? Is it not listening to your gut, listening to the finances? So how does that work? There's two pieces of it. The first one is that

I'm always in learning mode, right? Every day I'm trying to learn. And so whenever there's a failure, I look not on the outside, but I go inside. I'm like, what part did I have to play in that failure? What did I do? What was uniquely my fault? And so I kind of absorb that. I take that in and I go, okay, like, what could I have done differently? Who am I? So I really think about that. The other part is that I don't attach it to myself because men will fail. They'll lose money. They'll close a business and they're like, boom, onto the next one. Whereas a woman will go, oh, that was me. I missed my one chance. I know you don't have one chance. You have many, many, many chances. So I try to separate what is me from what actually happened. And when you're able to

do that, it's a really amazing tool because you start not to look at these things as verdicts on yourself, but rather like a set of circumstances, you take the learnings, you move on, you go again. That's just a fact. That's what you have to do. It's called resilience. And it's like a muscle. It builds the more stuff you do. What I won't ever let it do is stop me from doing something. And that's a really important message for women because you can fail and fail and fail and fail and fail, you need is that one win. You just need that one thing to work out. And that's what we have to train ourselves for, to know that there's a lot of chances in life and that you don't have to get everything right. And you shouldn't, you know, wait for this perfect moment and this perfect set of

circumstances. Because my experience tells me that never come. That's what I love about you and I love about the book. I feel like you teach strategy. And I think that sometimes the self-help industry sometimes sells hope without teaching strategy. Yeah. Yeah, that's what you know for me was really easy, I wrote the book almost back to front in typical dyslexic fashion because it was so easy to write about building a brand and a business and career. You know, I spent 15 years working in corporate, leadership, all of that, money, trade-offs, easy for me to write. But the reason I've been able to do that is because I've managed my emotions. And this part about holding a vision for yourself is very important because it isn't about manifestation. It's not about vision boards.

when you have a clear vision for yourself, meaning who you are and what is important to you and what do you want in your life, it really crystallises how you should spend your time. What are the ways that you should use your energy and use your gifts? But it's really important to have that vision for yourself and to hold it in high regard. And so the book really starts in that place of figuring out, not like, my vision is I want to be rich. No, it's like, how do you want to live? How do you want to spend your time? What type of person do you want to be? And then you make your decisions and you create your goals coming out of that. You talk a bit about, well, one of your interviews I saw, you talked about how women don't want to talk about money. Yeah. And you talk about just now right, being rich.

So Forbes named you one of America's richest self-made women in 2025, right? So they did. She get into it. Yes, they did. Okay, clock it. But the conversation you were having is about how women, and a lot of times black women, don't you want to have a conversation when they deserve raises or to be paid for something?

At what point in your life were you ever not asking for what you deserved? Never. And I tell you where that comes from. That's an East London thing. Like when you don't have much, like I was raised with audacity. Meaning, you know, it's like when I did my first paper round, they were like, we want to pay you £10 a week. I was like, that is crazy.

And I worked out how much it would cost for me to like visit every single house. And I went back and I was like, that's wrong. You guys should pay me £15, £50 or whatever it was. Like something crazy. Because I value myself so highly. And if you don't, it's very hard for other people to value. So the first thing is do the work and understand your value. When we talk about, for example,

we all know that women get less than 3% of venture capital funding. What I'm interested in is not what's happening in culture and society, right? That stuff we know about. We know about systemic barriers. We understand that there are systems that keep us out of those conversations. I'm talking about what can we do. Where can we start with ourselves and use what we, we have to get what we need. And if you hide behind soft ambition, performative purpose, meaning

if you have an idea for a business and you give me a proposal and it takes you six pages before you've even spoken about profit because you're too busy giving the money away and supporting your community and all of this stuff because you've dressed the idea up in performative purpose, that isn't getting to the point. That's not getting to the point of business. So what I'm saying is we have to put money in the centre of our plans. We have to make sure that what we need we are asking for. And we're being very, very clear about where we're making money. And I mean, I talk about this all the time on my podcast.

A Spire with Emma Greed is full of lessons. I bring in money experts. I bring in investment experts. I ask every single founder that's ever been on that show, how? How did you raise the money? How did you make the money? How does the company work? How profitable is it?

What are you doing with the money? It's very important because we are not taught. this. And so what I want to do is make sure and part of my mission is to teach women that. Teach us how to speak about it. Teach us how to ask for it and get us like really used to the language because the language is something that

you know, I listen to my husband on the phone every day and he's having conversations about where to invest and how much you're putting in like this crypto or you know, this kind of financial construct conversation. I never have conversations like that with my girlfriend. And so I want us

as women to start having those conversations. Because once you understand it and you learn it, it's like exposure therapy. It means that you are then able to ask for what you need. Can we talk about how important relationships are? Yeah. Because, you know, when I look at... Which ones?

Well, I look at your business. Because, you know, I look at skims, I look at Good America, and I look at safely, they've all been successful. All with folks from the same family, the Kardashian-Gen. What is it about your connection with them that makes what y'all do so successful? Well, you know, I think that relationships are really important.

And it doesn't matter if they are, are your business relationships. You know, I'm also in a relationship with my husband, who I'm also in business with. I mentioned to you earlier, like meeting three journalists on this, you know, press tour that have worked for me in one way or another. I think that who you are and how you keep your relationships is a business imperative, right? How you treat people, how you're seeing, how you speak to people, what you put out. And I've been very, very careful about all of my partnerships throughout my whole life. I think what people don't understand and they look at me and I'm very aware of the privilege of my partnerships. The most important partners that I have are

the banks, the lawyers, my vendors, the people that you would never think about. Because when I need to get something done, I'm not calling my investment partners. I'm calling the guy at the pocket line in factory because I'm like, that's the guy that I need to hustle with, right? That's why I get it over another person getting it. So when you think about the strength of, and I hear this all the time, I need a mentor, I need a partner. Don't overlook the things that actually are going to allow you to be flexible and good and move forward in business because partnerships happen in the most unlikely places. They don't need to be glossy.

In fact, very rarely do they need to look good? Building a network is very, very different from networking. And when you build a network, you are building the people that allow you to get stuff done, that allow you to interact, to do business. It's very rarely about sitting at a dinner, going to a conference. If you've got a pass around your neck, that's not it. If you've got a name tag on, that's not what you need to be doing, right? It's like building your network is going to see your bank manager and knowing him by name

so that when you need something, you can call them and you can speak to them. I just think people are overlooking the partnership piece and overlooking the network piece and misunderstanding how you actually use it to become successful. That's fantastic advice. Do you talk to the people who make the draws? And make the what? Underwear. All the time.

I don't know what it is about your drawers. Y'all draws a different level of comfortable. Yeah, different level of comfortable, aren't they? I don't get, you know, you don't realize the difference in drawers until you get old. No, no, then you know. Yes, man. Every country, say draws. Every foot draws.

Yeah, you know, in England we say knickers. Like, so I have to. Yeah, yeah, no, no, I know. So I have trained myself. I have trained myself. Always got knickers on his ass. We have to be real. It's with a K.

I just want to say that. Yeah, it's one of those things. Listen, I am a product obsessive, right? What I believe in is excellence. And so when you say that, there's nothing in this conversation that makes me happier. Because when you have, like, when you do one thing really, really well, that's when you have an incredible business.

So you saying that to me is like the single best thing. And I think that the reason I'm good is because I have a connection to the customer. I know that if you spend that, 30 bucks on a pair of drawers, they need to be good. They need to be your favorite ones. If they're your favorite ones, you're going to come back again. And so, again, I think in business we've kind of, we say to ourselves right now, when you look out, you know, people are obsessed with marketing, they're obsessed with social, they're obsessed

with influencer. That's not what business is about. Business is about creating something that people are going to love so much, a product that they'll come back to you time and time again. So when you shift that energy from the marketing, the flash stuff in the, you know, the product into how can I make something excellent? How can I just be so good at something that people love it and they're obsessed and they come back time and time again?

That's the business. The other stuff is just a distraction. When you focus on distribution and finances and logistics, not sexy, but that's the stuff, excellent, right? Don't get distracted by all that other stuff. It is just not the right way to think about companies. My wife told me to throw out every single other pair of underwear, I own because she likes how I look in skims.

And they watch well too. I'm telling you. And it's just gives you a confidence. Even as a man, you look in the mirror, you're like, damn, where I get all that from? Look at the way of instruction. That's a same. That's a seam, right?

Yeah, I know, I know it ain't me. You gotta tell me, you know, I know it's not. I didn't even allow you. I swear to go to share. It's all you. I have just one. I want to ask a business question. I watch your interview with Cardi,

and then I watch your interview with, Camara Lee Simmons. And the biggest thing that I took away from both of those is like learning from the mistakes, right? But with Camorra, she talks about she made $20 million. The brand was a like value, like a billion dollars. Right? No, it wasn't no billion. No, no, no, no, no, it was, it was, it was valued at a billion dollars. So she had a billion dollars in sales, right? Let's get this right. She had a billion dollars of sales. She had a hundred and forty million dollar valuation and she ended up with 20. And this is where people get it twisted. A billion dollar of the sales is not always created equal.

Because what people do is they look at retail sales, they look at everything that's coming through in licensing where you're getting what, between three and eight percent. And then they look at how the market values it. Now the market only valued it at 140 million because they had lots of subsidiaries, they weren't really in charge of their business,

they had dying parts of it. So 140 million, but my girl should have got more of that because it was all baby fat. Yes. And just hearing all of that, though, is like at the end of it, once you realize all of that and I guess you're learning from it in a real time, but Like, that has to hurt, like, making those decisions or looking back at those decisions from a rear view, like, damn, all of that money. I mean, she was really honest about it.

And you got to love Camorra because she came on and she was so open. Like, where did it go? She didn't make all that money. Her husband made that money. And so when you're in a partnership, as I am, and you're in a business partnership alongside it, what are you doing? Are you outsourcing your decision making? Because you shouldn't be. You have to trust one person.

That is yourself. And when I talk about this idea of starting with yourself, it's like, we all know intrinsically inside, like, you know, what we're good at. She at that time wasn't somebody that was checking the contract. She wasn't in charge of the money. You have to make sure when you are the person that is front and center, when it's your face, when it's your work ethic, when it's your name, you've got to be having 50% of that.

Russell Simmons said she came in and she blasted him, but initially she wasn't doing a lot of that stuff. Well, let's be clear. Russell said he also said he gave her the brand, which already existed. Yeah. So he said, I made her famous and marketed the brand with her face. Now, I don't think it's the same with what you're doing. But he said that she's awesome. I can compare it to me.

Oh, okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. By the way, I would never, I would never in. You were never coming on that end? No. No, no, no, no. But what if that's the only entry point for some people? Well, here's the thing that, and often it is, right? And so I think that what she was actually saying there, like, very, very clearly was

she had to take the seat that, was given to her and the seat that was given to her was the backseat. And so my thing is that you have to, again, look at what she's done now. She's been able to invest in Celsius. She's been able to bribeck the brand. So she'll do it all differently. So she has learned from those mistakes. Everyone has to get their foot in the door in whichever way.

And it was imperfect for her. But she took it anyway. She learned, listen, she didn't walk out with nothing. She walked out with $20 million. It's not, it's not nothing. Should she have got more? In my view, absolutely she should have got more. But she was not in their place to be able to advocate for her.

And again, it's about knowing your value. So when you come into something initially, you might be worth one thing. I don't think you can't go back in and negotiate because pre-sale, I would have been there, hello, you want me involved in this transaction? Because in order to sell it to a buyer, I'm sure they wanted some kind of lock-in, you could have to do a separate deal there. And again, this is like what you have to learn about negotiation. What you have at one spot is not necessarily what you need to leave with.

What you can negotiate with in the beginning, in the beginning can change year two, year three, year four, you just got to know your points of leverage. So ahead of that sale, I would have said to them, hi, you want me to stay here? You want to keep using Kamara? You need this name, image and likeness. Here's what I need.

Right. Right? But that's, again, that stuff is not taught to us. That's why you have to listen to the podcast because I am talking about negotiating on your own behalf. I'm talking about how to interview. I'm talking about contracts. Nobody teaches this to us.

And we need this information. I've written a whole book about it and it's really important to me that regardless of where you come from regardless of whether you went to school we all come into life and to business in different ways but we all deserve the information

every single one of us thought with yourself. It's out right now go pick it up do yourself in favor man a new vision for work and life Emma I love you man I really do appreciate you and the information you put out there

I appreciate you so much and I have to say I am so happy that you're doing my show in New York you were literally. I wanted to make sure that a man was going to be in. And the idea that you're there with Martha Stewart tomorrow is like literally, he's the man. He's the man. He's the man.

Shut up. She said that she said that. She said that. Martha Stewart, Charlemagne. I'm just waiting for it. I'm just like I'm loving it. But it's important. Listen.

I'm hoping your people have told you, Charlemagne. Don't worry. You'll be there. No, I know about it. I just can you give us there for me? I want to come. Oh, yeah, you should come. It's sold out, right?

But we'll make it. It's at Adler Hall and it's tomorrow. 7 p.m. right? 7 p.m. Thank you very much. Adler Hall, 7 p.m. tomorrow. We're having a conversation myself and Emma about her book. Start with yourself. A new vision for work in life.

No, I knew about that. Hey, he's a maximum two hour know what he's supposed to do person. I really relate to that. I'm the same. That's why I'm looking around. I'm going to tell him. I know what's happening next. He's always punctual, though, and he's going to show up.

He read the book. Listen, he's great and we're going to have a great conversation. And I think it's very, very important because we also, you know, I'm all about women, supporting women, but we will need men to. Yeah, period. I need to get somebody in there too. That's so funny. I promise you somebody asked me to, if I can get them in. I love that.

Yes, you can. All right. Well, it's the breakfast club. It's emigreedy, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you, darling. Oh, no. Every day I wake up. Wake your ass up.

The breakfast club. Do you all finish or y'all done? When a group of women discover they've all. dated the same prolific con artist. They take matters into their own hands. I vowed. I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's Nora Jones, and my podcast playing along is back with more

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