The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Gov. Wes Moore Calls Out Congress, Talks Kilmar Abrego Garcia, Enriching Black Businesses + More

Episode Date: May 2, 2025

Today on The Breakfast Club, Gov. Wes Moore Calls Out Congress, Talks Kilmar Abrego Garcia, Enriching Black Businesses. Listen For More!YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BreakfastClubPower1051FMSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Charlamagne the God, Jess Hilarious, Envy is out, but Lauren LaRosa is in. And we have the two, a 2028 presidential candidate and the governor of Maryland. Wes Moore is here. How are you, my brother? It's gonna be back, man. It's gonna be back. Good to have you back, man. How you feeling, first of all?

I'm feeling great. Okay. I'm feeling great, man. Listen, and, first of all? I'm feeling great. Okay. I'm feeling great, man, listen, and contrary to everything else going on in the country, Maryland's doing great. Yes. We continue pushing, I mean, and honestly,

getting really big wins for our people, and so we're excited. I wanted to talk to you about all of that because I know that you're implementing a lot of great things in Maryland, and I wonder what could be replicated on a national level to protect us implementing a lot of great things in Maryland, and I wonder what could be replicated on a national level to protect us from a lot of things that this administration is doing,

working class people especially. Well, here's the thing, I mean, I think right now we're seeing people keep on talking about what's the power of the president and the power of the presidency. I think people would all see right now, what's the power of governors? You know what I'm saying, what's the power of states?

We have a whole lot more authority than people sometimes give us credit for, but frankly a whole lot more power and authority than I think a lot of governors understanding can take on. So for example, you know, Maryland has more exposure to these federal cuts, the federal public service cuts that the Trump administration is just arbitrarily, and in many cases, by the way, illegally doing. And so what Maryland has done, we've come up with the most aggressive plan to be able to say how are we gonna streamline and support our federal workers,

create advanced supports for them, but also making sure that we can streamline them into available state jobs that we need. So for example, there are tens of thousands of vacancies when it comes to credentialed educators inside of the state of Maryland. We have thousands of people in healthcare, nurses, et cetera, that we have as vacancies in the state of Maryland.

So I'm like, so if I have people who are qualified and who are interested, we're going to streamline them, get them trained up, credentialed, and get them inside of the classrooms, get them inside of our healthcare facilities, because you're solving two problems, right? You're solving a fact that we have a shortage of people in education, healthcare,

and at the same time, you're creating jobs, right? So I look at how Maryland has moved now in just these first months, where Maryland now is going on really the 14th straight month of amongst the lowest unemployment rates in the entire country. Maryland has now has an unemployment rate of 3%, which is below, well below the national average, despite the fact that we've had more federal cuts because of the Trump administration than most other states. And so I'm just like as as governors, you can be creative about making sure that you can get your economy moving. You can be creative about how you get new businesses on board, about how you're supporting your small businesses, how you're supporting your minority-owned businesses. And you don't have, like I don't wait for permission

from the federal government to do anything. And that's the thing, I think that's the kind of posture that you're watching governors now able to move in this moment. How do you continue to do that if somebody like Trump says, you know what, we're not sending no more federal aid to Maryland? Well, I mean, he's done that. Where does the money come from? He's done that. Okay, so where's the money coming from then?

Well, the money comes from you're actually having to build coalitions with the private sector. Okay. You're building coalitions with your other independent partners. It also comes from making sure that you're being creative about who your partners are actually going to be. So for example, I've said very clearly, we've got to make sure that we're focusing our economy on growth. We've gone from this year alone, Maryland has gone from a $3.5 billion structural deficit that I inherited. So now Maryland has a structural surplus, right? And part of the reason we were able to do it

is two reasons. One, we were able to be very strategic about our budget and really have some strategic cuts. There's about $2.5 billion of cuts in Maryland's budget, the largest amount of cuts that we've seen in 16 years. But also what we're doing is investing in new industries. I just came back from a trade mission in Japan and Korea, where we were talking with companies in life sciences

and IT and aerospace and defense. I'm going anywhere and everywhere where we think there's unique opportunities and partnerships to build our economy and to build an economy that diversifies off of Washington, D.C. And so we've just been very intentional and focused when I've said, listen, I will work with anyone

that includes the federal government, but I will bow down to no one. And we are going to make sure we're gonna protect our people and make sure that our economy grows. And you'll be wondering why I act like that. Me and him act the same way. Come on now, come on now. That was his version of Instagram Live.

You already know, you already know. Now, how would you grade Trump's first 100 days back in office? I mean, listen, I don't even need to, because I talk to the people. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? They told me to grade. Yeah, you can't lie to the people.

When I'm talking to the farmers in the Eastern shore who've watched all their prices get jacked up, whether you're the poultry farmer, whether you're the barley farmer, farms that have been around and agriculture is actually Maryland's largest industry. Farms that have been around for over a hundred years and now say I don't know if I can survive the next six months. Right? I go talk to the poor workers down at the Port of Baltimore.

You know, and that's one of the largest and most effective ports in the entire country. Two thirds of the country gets their goods from the port of Baltimore, either import or export, right? And I talk to them who are now watching a significant pullback in goods, which means less hours for them, which means less work for them. I talk to everybody who's going out to grocery stores and watching rising prices. I talk to people whose job it is to make sure that our food is protected, federal workers, making sure that they're doing folks on cybersecurity, making sure that veterans are getting a proper burial who now are out of a job.

Ask them how Trump is doing. Ask them how the first hundred days is going. I'm no Joe Biden fan, but when I heard Trump say yesterday that the GDP, the falling GDP was Biden's fault, I'm like, well, that's just not true. What would you say to people? Cause you're, you know more about this than any of us. What would you say to people when you hear that? When people say, well, that's Biden's GDP. Listen, you can't, when, when, when the stock market jumps, you can't take credit. And when the stock market falls, you can't, you can't deploy, you know, deploy blame.

That's not the way this game goes. You know, when you're the chief executive, you take the good and the bad. That's part of the job. That's what leadership actually means. And you cannot look at the policies that have come on board thus far from this administration, the impact that it's had on people and pretend like, well, that's someone else's fault. It's just, it's fundamentally not true. And if Donald Trump wants to try to take credit for things that go well, he also

has to take blame for the fact that this is the first time that we've seen our economy contract, our economy gets smaller since 2002. So if you know, if Joe Biden in 2002 could have turned around and said, well, that's actually Trump's economy, but he didn't because he actually chose to lead. Well, Donald Trump, take on that same responsibility. Understand this is yours. What things, because I know you did the service year option. Yeah. So, you know, workforce is really important to you.

Huge. But in the first hundred days, I'm looking at an article that says, one of the big effects to Maryland is that one in every 10 workers in the state is employed by the federal government, and almost half of Maryland's federal workers live in Montgomery and Prince George's County. A lot of those people are going to lose jobs. It's going to heavily affect black people. That's right. So what initiatives are you preparing now because they want those hits are happening. They're going to fill it. And they are, you know what I mean? In real time, they're going to need

money and work. They are. And you know, and we've actually been really aggressive when it comes to not just protecting federal workers, but also looking at the, you know, when you look at the the racial wealth gap that is in the state of Maryland, for the, you know, when you look at the racial wealth gap that is in the state of Maryland, for example, when I was first inaugurated, and we've actually been able to address it when we come on board, but it was eight to one when I first became the governor.

And I'm the only black governor in the country, the first black governor in the history of the state of Maryland, and only the third African American ever elected governor in the history of this country. And so when I came on and said, we have to address the racial wealth gap, the fact that in our state, it's eight to one.

I was like, the reason we have a racial wealth gap of eight to one is not because one group is working eight times harder. Right. I mean, like, these are policies, these are systems that have been in place that have allowed certain groups to be able to gain wealth and certain groups not, right?

And so we came in very clear that we are coming to the focus of work, wages, and wealth when we came on board. And when we talk about work, it meant doing things like investing in the service year option for every high school graduate. Now has a chance to have a paid year service to the state of Maryland.

That we have made historic investments in apprenticeship programs. We have quadrupled the amount of apprentices in the state of Maryland. Basically saying that while four year college degrees are great, not everyone needs to have one in order to be economically successful. And we gotta pipeline people into real occupations.

Trade school. Trade schools, you know what I'm saying? And starting early with that process with young people because that, not every, like listen, I joined the army when I was 17. You know what I mean? And I went to a two year college and things worked out pretty well.

So we have to make sure that everybody knows that their path doesn't have to be the same, but their path can be uniquely theirs and they can benefit from it. That we've been able to pass, not just the most comprehensive procurement reform bill in the history of the state of Maryland, making sure that we're actually properly

and evenly allocating capital to small businesses, black businesses, over three billion dollars have gone to black businesses and MBE since I've been the governor, right? 86% of all Maryland contracts now require some form of MBE participation in it. And that number was at 35%. Was it MBE again? Sorry, Minority Business Enterprises. Okay. Yeah. So making sure we're being very clear that if we're going to use state dollars which by the way oftentimes is capital that's coming from from African-American taxpayers

that we need to make sure that we're being even and we're being fair about the way we're talking about allocation that capital that we have done and not just signed the largest pardon in the history of the United States 175,000 pardon the largest mass pardon in the history of this country

for misdemeanor cannabis convictions. I just signed a bill on expungement, on expungement reform, the most comprehensive expungement reform that our state has ever seen. On a bill that I introduced and that I proudly signed that focused on making sure we can give people a second chance and actually clean their records. And so we've been very clear that being able to add

a culture of repair is something that is really important to us because When when we all do better we all do better and and and and racism is really expensive And we're really trying to address that in the state of Maryland. I'm proud of the progress we're making Jess you're from Maryland you live in Maryland. I am and I want to ask you how is it working with Mayor Brandon Scott Baltimore. Yes, my, and I wanna ask you, how is it working with Mayor Brandon Scott in Baltimore? That's my guy. Yes. Maryland is leading right now with black excellence.

Shout out to Angela, also Brooke, shout out to yourself. The most talked about, most loved governor. Anthony Brown, AG. And we got a lot going on in Baltimore. We got the CIAA, is that continuing? Do you know that? That's continuing.

We want CIAA in, we want that to be CIAAB. Yeah. At Baltimore at the end of it. It was better in Charlotte though. that to be CIAAB. Yeah. At Baltimore at the end of it. It was better in Charlotte though. No it was not. Yes it was. A lot, I'm not gonna hold you, a lot of people said that to you.

It was better in Charlotte. Why? I'm sorry y'all. Don't talk about sorry, you gotta sorry. My boat has never come to Delaware, so. You feel me? But she from Delaware. Okay, you got that one.

Baltimore's got a better buildup right now. Baltimore's gonna generate more economic activity. Baltimore City, for example, right now has the seventh fastest growing economy in the entire country. If you look at what's happening in Baltimore City, Baltimore City is on a rise. And we were very clear, you know, it's funny,

when I first ran, I was like, we've gotta put a real focus on Baltimore. And people was like, of course you said that, you're a Baltimorean, you're a Homer. I was like, I'm not saying it because I'm a Baltimorean. I said it because I'm very good at math. Tell me a single state that is clicking on all cylinders and the city and the state's largest city is not. And the answer is it doesn't exist. That you've got to invest in your largest city. In that case, in the state of Maryland, it's Baltimore. And so Baltimore,

if you look at what's happening, again, the seventh fastest growing economy in the entire country. The violent crime rate in Baltimore City, in the state of Maryland, Maryland's having amongst the fastest and most impressive drops in violent crime anywhere in the entire country. Baltimore City, before I became the governor, went eight straight years of 300 plus homicides

in Baltimore City. Now, the homicide rate in Baltimore City, the last time it was this low, I wasn't born yet. It is literally having amongst the fastest drops in violent crime anywhere in America. So, shout out to Mayor Scott, shout out to the entire team because, you know, this is really is,

this is gonna be Maryland's decade, but in order for it to be Maryland's decade, it's gotta be Baltimore's time. Sleuthe Baltimore, Sleuthe Nick's Fish House in Baltimore. They just show me some loving out there so I want to shout them out. Yep. Shout out to Nick's. In the middle of an interview with the governor just because. The only thing that can hurt you in Maryland right now is the pollen so what are we doing about that? The pollen is bad. I wish there was an executive order I could sound on that one. Right damn. The pollen is bad. You know what I love about Maryland? About a couple of months ago

I was in Maryland for my daughter's cheerleading competition. I was at, what's that place called, Jess? National Harbor, was it? National Harbor, yeah. Yeah, you were in that town. And literally, that's the first time people were coming up to me saying, yo, with everything that Elon Musk and Doge is doing,

I don't know if I'm gonna have a job. My wife don't know if she's gonna have a job. And these were just regular everyday working class people that was so concerned. And they probably did end up losing their jobs because 10,000 of jobs got lost. And so I was like, damn, man. That's what really made me realize what they were doing

was impacting everyday working class people in that way. And what they're doing is illegal. Yes. I mean, listen, if you look at every one of these decisions that Donald Trump is making, and let's be clear, when people say he's passing all these bills, no, he's not. Actually, there's hardly any bills. Yeah, it's just executive orders.

It's executive orders, right? Over 150 executive orders. And all of his executive orders can really fall into three different categories, right? It's ineffective, it's performative, or it's illegal. Those are the three buckets that every one It's ineffective, it's performative, or it's illegal. Right? Those are the three buckets that every one of his executive orders really pretty much fall into.

And the problem is, is when you're talking about all these cuts, you're talking about the elimination of the Department of Education, do you know what Donald Trump does not have? The authority to eliminate the Department of Education unilaterally. That's Congress, right? Because Congress is the one that allocates the capital for it. So this is actually a moment when we need to see Congress have a spine. We need to see Congress step up because right now, Congress, the president is chomping you.

He's pretending like you don't even exist. So I'm really curious to see, is Congress going to step up and do its job? Well, no, they already, I mean, a lot of them have already bent the knee. Completely bent the knee. already bent the knee. Completely bent the knee. Completely bent the knee. Do y'all have conversations like that? Is it worth you calling them out publicly, especially Democrats in Congress?

Oh, yeah, and not only is it worth it, we do. And I think, and actually, shout out, our congressional delegation, actually led by Senator Chris Van Hollen, Angela Also Brooks, is actually doing a really good job because I think our congressional delegation is really helping to hold the line on a lot of these things, on a whole collection of different issues. But Congress is the one that fundamentally

has to pass a budget. Congress is the one that fundamentally has to make sure that laws can get to a president's desk. Congress is the one that needs to make sure they actually hold on to their authority. And we need in this moment, we need leaders to lead. That's what we need. And that's again, one of the really, I think, unique things that we're seeing about governors right now

is that we have a chance to uniquely show a different way. We have a chance to show, you know what, even in this time of chaos, we can still drive the fact that in Maryland, we're having historically low unemployment rates, that even in this time of chaos, that we are having historic drops in violent crime within our state, that even in this time,

even in this time of chaos, we're still able to pass legislation that is not just important, but also is scalable and can take place around the country. So that's a great thing about being a chief executive in this moment, but we still need Congress to do his job. Well when you see the power that Trump wields, right? Like we had Congressman Al Green up here, and I was like, I said to him, I said,

man I didn't even know presidents had this kind of power. And he was like, neither did I. So when you see the kind of power that he wields, does it make you push the levels of your power as governor to use? Like, well damn, let me see what I can do? Well, you know, I actually, I think the things that we were doing even before Donald Trump came out is,

I've always been one to say, I'm always gonna push to make sure that we are doing justice to a job. You know, I keep a clock that sits on my desk every single day that tells me how many days I have left in my first term, and I'm gonna run it back because I'm running for reelection in 26, but it tells me, in fact, right now it's 634 days left before my reelection.

The reason I keep that clock on my desk is it reminds me, do not waste a day, man. You got 634 days right now until this time is up, and someone else eventually will sit in the seat as the Governor of Maryland. I'm not going to waste a day and so I do think that our ability to be able to be creative about the levers that we're using to make change, the levers that we're using to make sure that we're doing important things like raising a minimum wage in the state of Maryland

because gone should be the days when you have people who are working jobs and in some cases multiple jobs and still some cases multiple jobs and still living at or below a poverty line, right? That we are gonna make sure we are aggressive about doing things like funding, having historic funding of childcare because parents shouldn't have to decide between is my kid gonna be okay

or can I go back to the workforce? That's right, that's why Jess was off for so long. That's what I noticed, but this is real. This is a real thing. I mean, it's situations like my mom. My mom, I was raised by an immigrant single mother who worked three different jobs and did not get her first job that gave her benefits

until I was 14 years old. She was Jamaican, right? That's right. You already know. Yeah, that's common for Jamaicans to have more than one job. That's the fault. That's the privilege of that.

She wanted to do that. She's done three jobs in part time. Yes, yes. But I mean, like, but, but, and here's the thing about it. This is a woman who went on to earn a master's degree and didn't get her first job that gave her benefits until her son was 14.

So when people are having conversations about inequitable pay between men and women or the racial wealth gap, I tell people like, I don't need a white paper to explain it. You know what I mean? Like I grew up in this. That when we're doing the work that we're doing right now in the state of Maryland around young men and boys, about making sure that we are protecting our young men and boys and making sure we are lifting them up. Because it's not just because when you look at the data, how drastic and staggering some of this data is that we're seeing right now around our young men and boys.

It's because I came up in this. I was 11 years old when I had handcuffs on my wrists. So I get this. And so our ability to now use these seats and use these moments and not waste a single day is something that I take very, very seriously. And frankly, I didn't need Donald Trump to show me the power of the executive because I think in Maryland, day is something that I take very, very seriously. And frankly, I didn't need Donald Trump to

show me the power of the executive, because I think in Maryland, we've been showing the power of executive, you know, for the past two years. What are your thoughts on Trump not wanting to bring home Kilmar Garcia, because he was living in Maryland, that was the guy that was wrong for being deported. And here's the thing for me, this actually has nothing to do with immigration. Because people talk about this as an, I love what he's doing with immigration. I said, well, first of all,

if Donald Trump really wanted to fix immigration, he could do it simply by calling up Speaker Johnson and saying, I need a comprehensive immigration bill on my desk next week. And you know what will be on his desk next week? A comprehensive immigration bill. Because Donald Trump is the votes. He's got the House and he's got the Senate. This has nothing to do with immigration.

This just simply has to do with violating the Constitution. That's what this is. And so when I think about the case of, of, of, of Kilmar Obrego Garcia, my point is this. Due process matters in this. He needs to come home. He needs to stand trial and then let a judge decide

what his, what the long-term, what is, what is, what is long-term, you know, situation is going to be. Not Donald Trump. You know, if they say, well, he was doing X, Y, and Z. Okay, fine. Let him come home. Let him stand trial and let him do what basic due process offers to every single person. And if all of that determined is true, then absolutely. He should then face consequences and face a sentencing. But not because Donald Trump looked at a Photoshop picture

and said, this is going to be his fate, because that is a very, very dangerous slippery slope. And so my whole thing is this. Just follow the Constitution, follow due process, and follow what the Supreme Court in a nine zero decision said, that he needs to come home and stand trial. I stand with the law on this,

and I stand with the Constitution. Correct me on some things, right? Because Mr. Garcia has acknowledged that he entered the US illegally in 2012. So he was here illegally? He was undocumented, that's right. So if he's undocumented, does the Constitution still apply to him?

Yes, there's still constitutional protections. And not only, and especially because what he is being held for or tried for right now are things that he has not not only not been convicted for, not even had a formal accusation of, so this is the problem, is that, so Donald Trump right now is trying to rewrite is that so Donald Trump right now is trying to rewrite the Constitution. Donald Trump right now is violating the Constitution by not allowing him to come home and have due process. So yes so the

Constitution still offers you know still offers what is the guidance around the federal government's responsibility, around states responsibility and that still does fall under the situation of of of Kimar or Briego Garcia. I think that's what's missing in this whole conversation. The fact that, you know, like Martin Luther King Jr. said, injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere. So if you see somebody not receiving due process when they're supposed to, that could impact any of us

at any given time. And none of us wanna just be snatched off the street and deported to another country just because. And listen, here's the danger. Today it's Kilmar or Brieger Garcia. Who is it tomorrow? Lauren LaRosa. Oh my gosh, because of your last name.

Yes. You know what I'm just saying, it could be, is what we're saying, I'm using an example. Because you know Trump tried to get him, and you can't tell them that you from Delaware, because they're gonna be like, oh please. Yeah, he don't think that's right. And then nobody's gonna even respect that.

Why would y'all put me in it? No, but we're just using this as an example to say it could be anybody. You could've said Charlamagne the guy. No, but it could be anybody. Because you know he's coming for you. Why you couldn't come for me? No, he's coming for me. Did you watch the interview that when Trump sat down with Terry Moran? I didn't watch the whole thing. Okay, but did you see the part I said the tattoo thing because they went back over for about the tattoos or whatever. When you see stuff like that because then media picks it up the other way and uses these tattoos

that Trump, there's evidence that doesn't support what Trump is saying, but they use it as a, well, he deserved what he got. How do you guys in the government then fight that because the public opinion sways so much? It's, I didn't see the whole interview. I saw, I did see clips of it and I saw that part. And what's really sad to me is it isn't just the fact

that we have a president of the United States who was literally buying into conspiracy theories and Photoshop pictures in front of our eyes. What really also bothers me about it is it's the people around him who enable this. It's the people around him who tell them this is true. The people around him who feed him these pictures and say, yes, Mr. President,

he had MS-13 on his knuckles. Well, he didn't. And this goes back to the idea that, in many ways, this has nothing actually to do with Kilmar or Briego Garcia. This has nothing even to do with his situation. This just simply has to do with Kilmar or Briego Garcia. This has nothing even to do with his situation. This just simply has to do with, are we willing to follow the law? Are we a country of laws? Or are we now a country where the president of the United States gets to

pick and choose which laws we follow and which laws we don't? Are we a country that actually follows the constitution? Are we a country that listens when the Supreme Court in a unanimous decision and let me be clear, this Supreme Court hardly ever decides anything you're gonna do. It's Trump's court. Exactly. This is Trump's court, he put three people on it.

Nine, zero. The man needs to come home and stay in trial. And we have an administration right now that's literally using the Constitution as a suggestion box. You know what I'm saying? So that's fundamentally the problem and what we continue to deal with and the fact that the relationship between the federal government

and our states really has been ruptured. So when you run for president in 2028, I have not run for president. When you run for president in 2028, I have not run for president in 2028 and Trump runs again for his third term, what is the point of even running? Because you know, it's just going to be all for show West. Like you know it. Cause literally the thing that bothers me the most is people are

normalizing that conversation. Like Trump running for a third time. Well, then Obama can run again. If Trump runs for a third term, it's over. The fight is fixed. We know this. I, um, so third term, it's over. The fight is fixed. We know this. So one, I'm not running. But also, I also believe that anyone who's talking about 2028

is really delusional because they don't understand what's going on in 2025. I agree. I think anybody that's talking about 2028 right now doesn't understand the situation we are in right now. Well, we have people who are getting laid off, who have devoted their life to public service, who are getting laid off because someone who wasn't willing to take the same oath that they took

now tells them their job is useless, right? That we have situations where we have small businesses, some cases generational small businesses, that are going to go out of business simply because we have these arbitrary tariff policies that have nothing to do with economics but have everything to do with ideology. That we have children who rely on the Department of Education, children who are receiving special needs, kids who are in rural areas and parts of my state

who now are gonna watch their funding not just cut, but in many ways evaporated because we have a president of the United States who somehow believes that the Department of Education is not important anymore, right? So I think for anyone who's talking about 2028 or trying to make moves for 2028, my answer is this, I really hope you wake up and realize the world we're living in right now

and understanding what's at stake. I think that they're talking about 2028 because they really don't have any plans for now. Like they've never seen this before, right? And they don't know how to fight it. So they're just resorting back to what they know, which is the next election, midterms in 2026, presidential election in 2028.

But that's why I think leadership matters, right? And that's why I think, that's why I'm really proud of the work that we're doing inside of the state of Maryland. Because in the state of Maryland, we basically just said, you know, I'm gonna lead regardless. And our state's gonna lead regardless. And so when you're looking at the momentum that we now have within the state of Maryland,

the fact that we have gone from a structural deficit to a structural surplus, that for the first time in 10 years, we're watching labor force participation actually increase and new jobs, new business starts actually increasing in the state of Maryland for the first time in 10 years. The fact that we are watching new partnerships and new builds, things like the service year option,

things like making sure that we're giving people second chances when they're coming back home. That kind of stuff matters because I think people, one thing I always learned in the military was this, no one pays attention to how you perform when times are easy. Because when you're easy, you can show me anything. I mean, if you ever wanna learn anything about anybody,

watch them when it was hard. That's right. Watch them when it was tough. Watch them when the heat got turned up. Watch them, did they curl up in the fetal position and just sit there and take it? Or do they actually mobilize? And I think what you're seeing in the state of Maryland, when we knew we had this crisis, for example, of violence that I walked into and saying, I refuse to be a governor that will just sit there and attend funerals and

offer thoughts and prayers Why my people are dying on the streets Right and so we came in and we said we were going to have the most aggressive push to be able To curtail violence in our state and now maryland has amongst the fastest drops in violence anywhere in the country When we saw what happened in the key bridge When we saw ship the size of three football fields slam into the key bridge, knocking out the Port of Baltimore. And when people said it's gonna take 11 months to be able to clear the channel, and we got together, we supported those families of the six people who we lost that day, and we got that channel cleared

in 11 weeks. And when we watch this onslaught, we're now seeing from the Trump administration, where it is very clear, my state has become public enemy number one for these folks. I get it. Why? Is it because of you? Well, I think also there's a lot of proximity and just look at the decisions that they're making.

When you're going after the NIH, the National Institute of Health, when you're going after Social Security, right? You know what those also are? In addition to things that are some of America's crown jewels, they're also Maryland assets. When you stand up there at a press conference and say, yeah, the FBI building, which by the way, was going to be responsible for about $4 billion of economic activity, 7,000 jobs,

something that we worked on for a decade, independent of politics, and Maryland won that bid fair and square and to watch a president of the United States in a press conference stand up there and say, yeah, that's not going to the state of Maryland because they are a liberal state. At least he showed himself. Have you met him yet?

Have y'all spoken? We have. Okay, and what were those conversations like? You know, they were interesting. Spiritive. Yeah, yeah. Because you never see the photo ops. You stay away from the cameras when you're around him,

huh, Wes? Well, no, you know, it's funny. I actually met with him during the Army-Navy game, because I go to the Army-Navy game almost every year. And when he came to the Army-Navy game last year, we had a chance to meet, and we talked about the bridge. And I explained to him why the 100% financing, why the cost share for the bridge was so important, because this was a port that really serves the entire country

that this was a unique situation because we are currently in litigation. The reason that the port, the reason that the key bridge collapsed was not because of an act of God or because of a storm. It was because of negligence. Because a ship the size of three football fields slammed into it, right?

And we're currently in litigation. And so the American people are going to be made whole on that, so I walked them through it, I talked about the economics, I was thankful that Congress actually passed the 100% cost share, and so we're in the process right now of making sure we're gonna fulfill the commitment to the American people.

But I've met with them before, and again, I will work with anybody, but partnership only works when it's both ways. Partnership doesn't work when you're given and you're getting nothing back in return. Yeah, I've heard you talk about the importance of finding common ground with the Trump administration. But when you think about all the moves

that they've currently made, what opportunities do you see for y'all to collab? I don't, I can't see it. Partnership only works when it's both ways. And if you're coming after my people, if you're literally trying to crater our economy, that's not partnership. And so it's just very, very difficult to be able to say that this administration has been a good part, and forget about to me, to my people, to the people of Maryland. And I think when you go around the state of Maryland,

you will hear exactly what I am saying. There is a level of frustration that people have right now about the situation where we as a state are actually moving, not because of our relationship with the federal government, but in many ways in spite of. Yeah, you signed into the second looked act and the expungement reform act, right? And some people feel that expunging records

may heighten the public safety, giving some people a second chance and you give some criminals a second chance, they feel like it's gonna make it hard for certain people or hard for those who, you know what I mean? Like, they shouldn't give second chances. You know what I'm saying? No, I get it.

A lot of times, that's the case. A lot of times, it's not. What would you say to the people that feel that way? Yeah, I mean, first I would say, I understand the concern of some, I really do. I also know this, like, I'm a child of God, and my faith teaches me that we believe in second chances, and we should offer second chances.

I also know that when you look at things like the Second Chance Act, not only are there certain crimes that are not eligible for the Second Chance Act. So there are some specific carve outs about people who, when it's had something dealing with sexual assault, dealing with children or something dealing with law enforcement.

So there's certain things that do not fall into the category. But also what the second chance act does do, it's not saying it's automatic that you happen, it's just simply saying you have a chance to petition to have a second chance and have a second look. And so it's just simply giving an opportunity

for people who in many ways have now been caught up in this system for a long period of time. And for us to say that we don't believe that every sentence should be a life sentence. And that again, my faith does teach me that second chances should actually mean something and there should be pathways for it in certain cases. And people should have again,

just the opportunity to petition. This is not automatic, but it is the opportunity to petition. And I do think for the people who then will then qualify, these are people who are ready to enter back into society and be contributing members to society. You know people forget about the second chance? They forget the number after that. Three. There's a three strike law too. So if you dumb ass don't learn.

Okay, Maryland does have the three strike law right? Well and here's the thing it's like we have to, who of us haven't needed second chances? That's right. And if you mess that up, that's on you. I mean, like again, I'm a person who has needed second and third and eighth chances. And it's because people gave me a second chance. It's because people helped me to understand that the world was bigger than what was just directly in front of me. And that not all of my prior decisions helped to determine my future, that I'm now standing here as a 63rd governor

of my state. I believe in second chances, and I believe that people should earn the right to be able to have a second chance. As long as you have those certain things that are in place, and people should have the right to petition for it. And so I just find it really, you know,

at times when people are like, no, no, no, no, no, I just find it really rich because for a lot of times that people who are like, no, no, no, no, no, who are people who are standing there because someone in their life said yes. That's right, that's right. Talking of, second chance is right. Going back to Kymar Garcia, so I know that Senator Hollen,

like he went and visit then El Salvador and people were upset that you quickly said that you weren't going planning to go there. Why were people upset about you not going there when you already have boots on the ground? Yeah I mean and that's thing I was I've been in very close touch with Senator Van Holland. I applauded him when he went we spoke before before before he went and so you know I know that as a member of the Senate, there are certain responsibilities and there are certain pathways that they have

that I, as a governor, do not, that they have certain jobs that they can do as a governor. I know my job is different. We have always been completely aligned on making sure that due process is followed, making sure that we can bring Kilmar back home so he can then stand trial. And so I've been standing in lockstep with Senator Van Hollen the whole time. I applaud him going down and making sure that he could come back and report back to the family that he had, that he put eyes on him

and said that he's physically okay. Because remember, when Chris went down there, nobody was sure because no one had heard from him. And so Chris going down there to say, I now have seen him, I know he's okay, was a really important thing, not just for the large society, but was really important for the family. But I also know as a governor,

I have certain responsibilities and restrictions on things that I can do, and I'm gonna make sure that we're leading from the perch that I sit at. I think y'all have to stop making it about Garcia and just start making it about the issue of due process. That's all it is. Yeah, because it's too, you know, they love to do that to folks,

they'll point to things in his character, and I really don't know. But let's talk about the constitutional violation that's happening. And Shona, you're absolutely right because I am not, and I won't defend him. I don't know his situation. I don't know his background.

I don't know, I have never met with him. So I'm not defending the person. I'm defending the constitution, right? I'm defending the fact that there is due process, and we've got to be able to follow that. And frankly, once due process happens, again, if a judge rules that, no, you know, he is a threat to society, he is this, he is that, he needs to be sent back,

then you know what? Go ahead. Because there is nothing that I care about more, and I think people are seeing that with our track record in Maryland. There's nothing I care care about more. And I think people are seeing that with our track record in Maryland. There's nothing I care more than about than public safety. Like I make sure that our people are safe. I will make sure we have made historic investments in local law enforcement. We have made historic investments in not just in not just our state's attorneys, but also

Maryland's one of the only states that actually puts balance sheet into the US attorney to make sure we're getting trigger pullers off the street to make sure we're getting violent offenders off the street that we've made historic Investments in in in in violence prevention programs and violence interrupters You know people like we are us and safety so they're down in Baltimore So so no one can ever question my commitment to public safety But also I think you can be committed to public safety and committed to the Constitution, and I don't think that those two things are at odds with one another.

I got two more questions, because I know you gotta go. I love the fact that governors have their boots on the ground, and I saw Governor Josh Shapiro on Bill Maher, and I forgot what Bill asked him, but he was just like, look, I'm not focused on what they got going on in D.C., I'm focused on what I got going on in Pennsylvania. So I like that.

How do we keep you from being a corny DC type? He will never. Them DC guys are so corny, man. Listen, you know how I guess is I didn't come from that. You know what I mean, like listen, when I first ran for governor, I ran against statewide elected officials, I ran against cabinet secretaries,

the former head of the DNC, the former head of the Democratic Party ran for governor. And then me, a guy who would never run for office for my life, but I was connected to the people. It was the people that made me the governor. It wasn't a party. It wasn't a political establishment. In fact, the political establishment

wanted somebody else. Mm-hmm. So when I got into that seat, I decided I'm not going to turn into something that I never was in the first place. You know what I mean? So the way I have continued to lead is I am about the people.

I will always stand with the people. A political party does not give me my talking points. Good, don't let them change you because they already talking about you with 2028 and they'll be like, Wes, come over here, start saying this and start doing that and meet this person and take money from this person. And then you know what I mean?

I don't play that game because I didn't get here. That's not how I got here in the first place, man. All right. I mean, I am the most improbable governor in this country when you think about my journey, right? When you think about my life path. And again, I'm a person of faith, and Hezekiah Walker, you know, he's got a line where he says,

when I think about my story, I can't help but give God glory. There you go. I know where my strength comes from. My strength doesn't come from a political party. My strength don't come from political bosses. I don't follow that. I follow the people that got me here in the first place,

the people who bucked the political system, which was the people. And so I'm not at all concerned about becoming a creature of something that didn't create me in the first place. And actually I think that the main thing that people can do right now is stay true and stay committed and stay authentic. When people say, well what direction should people go in or how should people talk or whatever like that,

I always find that question so confusing. I'm like, be authentic because if you're not authentic, the people will suss it out and the people will snuff it out and they'll take care of you the way they take care of you. My final question, this is something that I love about you, it's something that Dr. Umar Johnson loves about you, the fact that you have a black woman. Because so many people in positions of power

like you in government, especially black people, they don't. Now love is love, love who you wanna love, but as a man who loves to see black men with black women, having beautiful black families, I love it. What is the importance of that? with black women, having beautiful black families. I love it. What is the importance of that? You know it's funny, when I got married,

we've been married now about 18 years, my wife, she's beautiful, man. And she's just an amazing human being. And I remember when we said our vows, this shows you how corny I was when we first got married. We give our vows and I'm like, my vows, I'm gonna keep it fresh and sexy. Jesus Christ.

That's what you say in front of her family. That's what I said, but that's my vow. I'm gonna keep it fresh and sexy. All you had to do was hit a little two step after that. That sound like a $2 Tuesday party. That sound like someone would fly in a party. Jess was not. That sound like someone would fly in a party. Come there fresh and sexy Friday.

Fresh and sexy Friday. But you know what her vow was to Fresh and Sexy Friday. Fresh and Sexy Friday. In Baltimore. But you know what her vow was to me? She said, I will be your greatest defender. Wow. I will be your greatest defender. That's what black women are for us though. And that's what they've always been.

Like I'm telling you man, when you think about what black women have meant to us, the whole, we was raised by women, got a game for women. You know, the whole, you know, we was, you know, raised by women, got a game for women. You know what I'm saying? Like black women have always been our anchor. Black women have always been our guide. Black women have always been the ones to when the whole world denied us, they defended us. And they lifted us up. And you know, and I think about this where, um, even the work that we're doing right now in Maryland around our young men and boys,

do you know who beautifully have been some of the greatest champions of the work that Maryland is doing, really the nation leading work on supporting our young men and boys? Women. Because they know that's talking about their sons. And their husbands husbands and their fathers and their uncles and their friends.

And it's so beautiful to watch because it is very indicative of how black women and women as a whole have always been our greatest offenders. That when the whole world came at us, oftentimes it was women who stood in front of us with shields and say, not today. And I'm so, I cannot be more lucky about the fact that I've married my best friend. I married someone who I love and who I respect and who I adore and someone who, you know,

I'm so thankful is on my side because I never want to be on the other side of her spirit. Ever. But someone who I, who I will ride for because she's always wrote for me. She about to slap the shit out of you for something? Oh my god. She said what 18 years ago? What you did this morning?

She's a darned whore, a beautiful darned whore. She's the first African American first lady of the state? She is. She sure is. She sure is. She's a beast too. She's a beast. Y'all gotta come down.

You gonna have crabs if we come? Oh absolutely. Okay, I'll come. Absolutely. And in fact, she is the co-chair of the Pregnus Festival. So for y'all, so you know, you know Pregnus. So Pregnus is. I thought you said Freaknik.

I was like, what? I'm like, oh, she blacked out for it. Y'all put your current name back with her? Pregnus. Pregnus, okay. You said keep your fresh and sexy. Yes, it's the second leg of the Triple Crown, one of the biggest horse races inside of the entire country.

But it's also a big deal because it's a whole festival around it. And it's in beautiful Park Heights, Baltimore, the home of Brandon Scott. But my amazing wife, our state's first lady, is the co-chair. You gotta see what she is doing, the build-out she's having, club quarantine,

D Nice is coming down there, bringing up, bringing Jadakiss, bringing Too Short, I mean, bringing everybody. It's gonna be a party. From May 10th to May 17th. Come on now. Yes. I'll be there May 14th. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. It's a whole lot of weaker stuff. Well, Governor Westmore, thank you, brother. We appreciate you, man. We love the work you're doing in Maryland. I mean, you know, somebody needs to replicate it on the national stage, and I hope that, you brother, we appreciate you man. We love the work you're doing in Maryland. I mean, somebody need to replicate it on the national stage and I hope that somebody gets the opportunity to.

Because I don't know if we will have a democracy in 2028 or not, but we'll see. Oh we will as long as we don't forfeit it. Yeah, now. That's what I'm saying. I mean, we have to understand man, it's like the power does belong to the people. That's the beauty of Where we're at right now, and and I'll say this one thing for our close to and this is why

Maryland I think actually is really important in this situation. I'm a big I'm a big history buff so like especially in really difficult times, I generally tend to lean on history and I like a lot of Maryland history and You know in really difficult times like now I'll read about famous Marylanders like Harriet Tubman, or Frederick Douglass, or Thurgood Marshall. And I think to myself, imagine having a conversation with Harriet Tubman, who by the way, one of the great things about being governor is I have the power to commission

and I made Harriet Tubman a general last year. So she's now general Harriet Tubman. And I think about what would a conversation be like with general Tubman telling her about the dangers of this moment. And I think about the way she would look at me and say, do you know what I've been through? Do you know what it was like when I had to

run from my life, from my freedom in the middle of the night, running from dogs and people with guns. And then when I finally made it to Pennsylvania and I got my freedom, I then decided to go back to bring more people. And where she became one of the greatest conductors in the Underground Railroad, right? And I think to myself, what a conversation

where Harriet Tubman will be like telling her how tough my job is. How difficult we've got it. And watch her look at me and say. I would have shot him. Yeah. That's right. Yeah, why you arguing with him?

Why, I was just. Exactly. You like me. No, man. Why you arguing with these people in Congress? You know what I mean? I was shooting him. In the middle of the night. Exactly. Like me. We all been lying to each other. Why are you arguing with these people in Congress? You know what I mean? In the middle of the night.

In the middle of the night. In the middle of the night. In the middle of the night. In the middle of the night. Now I get what you're saying. You know what I'm saying? But like let's not forget where we come from. That's right.

Like for all these people who like, oh this is tough and oh this we going to go. Please don't forget our history. Yeah. Please don't forget our ancestors. Yeah. Please don't forget what they had to go through and listen I you know as KDOT says we gonna be all right. We gonna be all right. Look at me at you. And don't take the Harriet Tubman thing out of context that was a nice black joke. Oh yeah right. We all got it. We loves it. That was in Fox News, that was inside Black Joe. No, I didn't think about how I could be perceived.

I mean, I'm black and I'm here, but Fox News, you know, you're tell. Okay, I know you gotta go. Do you listen to Vato? Shut up, Jesse. I appreciate you, Wes. Thank you for coming. This is Governor Westmore. Wake that ass up. In the morning. The Breakfast Club.

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