The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Jason Wilson Breaks Down 'The Man The Moment Demands,' Talks Intergenerational Trauma +More

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

The Breakfast Club Sits Down With Jason Wilson And He Breaks Down 'The Man The Moment Demands,' Talks Intergenerational Trauma. Listen For More! See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy informatio...n.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Hi, I'm Arturo Castro, and I've been lucky enough to do stuff like Broad City and Narcos and Roadhouse. And now I'm starting a podcast because honestly, guys, I don't feel the space is crowded enough. Get Ready for Greatest Escapes, a new comedy podcast about the wildest true escape stories in history. Each week, I'll be sitting down with some of the most hilarious actors and writers and comedians, people like Ed Helms, Diane Guerrero, and Joseph Gordon-Levitt. I love storytelling and I love you, so I can't wait. Listen and subscribe to Greatest Escapes on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Starting point is 00:00:34 John Stewart is back at The Daily Show and he's bringing his signature wit and insight straight to your ears with The Daily Show Ears Edition podcast. Dive into John's unique take on the biggest topics in politics, entertainment, sports, and more. Joined by the sharp voices of the shows, correspondents, and contributors.
Starting point is 00:00:52 And with extended interviews and exclusive weekly headline roundups, this podcast gives you content you won't find anywhere else. Ready to laugh and stay informed? Listen on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. $1.4 billion in NFL quarterback contracts. The untold stories behind the biggest deals in football history. I'm A.J. Stevens, Vice President of Client Strategy at Athletes First, introducing the Athletes First Family Podcast, the quarterback series.
Starting point is 00:01:27 My co-host, Brian Murphy, Athletes First CEO, and I are sitting down with the agents who have negotiated contracts for Justin Herbert, Deshaun Watson, Dak Prescott, Tua Tunga-Vaioloa, and Jordan Love. Listen to Athletes First Family Podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You are cordially invited to the hottest party in professional sports. I'm Tisha Olin, former golf professional and the host of Welcome to the Party, your newest obsession about the wonderful world that is women's golf.
Starting point is 00:02:02 Featuring interviews with top players on tour, tips to help improve your swing, and the craziest stories to come out of your friendly neighborhood country club. Welcome to the Party with Tisha Olin is an iHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. Listen to Welcome to the Party, that's P-A-R-T-E-E on the iHeart radio app,
Starting point is 00:02:22 Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. on the planet man brother Jason Wilson welcome brother welcome back I'm doing well all is well what's up brother is a nice beard you got thank you okay appreciate it You be loving Jason Wilson. I'll never see that. You crazy. They always be texting me like, you know Jason? I'm like, man, that man is happily married. Calm down.
Starting point is 00:03:09 I never see any of that. Not supposed to. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, that's good. That's good, yeah, man. But how are you, though? I'm doing well, man. Fought the flu and sinus infection.
Starting point is 00:03:20 I was bedridden for six or seven days at the beginning of the year. Couldn't work out, couldn't do anything and just had to allow my body to heal and practice what I preach and just rest and stop allowing my life to be centered around what I gotta do. That's interesting, your new book is called
Starting point is 00:03:36 The Man, The Moment, The Man's Master, The 10 Characteristics of the Comprehensive Man. So the start of the year, right? Start of the year, that's a reset for a lot of people, but you started the year, you know, in sick for six, seven days. So in that moment- It's kind of a reset.
Starting point is 00:03:51 Yeah, you had to be completely still. What did you realize in that moment? I realized, you know, that, you know, as men, you know, we can't keep our foot to the throttle. You know, we stay in first gear of manhood, which I call just the masculine mode, which gets us from stop to start. But. We stay in first gear of manhood, which I call just the masculine mode, which gets us from stop to start. But if we stay in that gear, we're gonna burn the clutch out.
Starting point is 00:04:10 And in the process, I believe, I was burning my life clutch out, just working really hard on this book and other things. And so it gave me a lot of time to sit with the most high and just meditate on allowing myself to just be instead of performing. And that's what so many men struggle with, just living performance-based lives and it's taking us out. But they gave me time to reflect and then what's crazy, I had to beat Sister B. Simone,
Starting point is 00:04:38 which I call like my daughter now. I had to do her podcast and the Holy Spirit was like, I need you. You're going to be weak, but you got to go. I got something you got to tell her. And the Holy Spirit was like, I need you, you're gonna be weak, but you gotta go. I got something you gotta tell her. And so I barely could make the flight. I wanted to make sure I wasn't contagious. Went down to the podcast, brother and sister, within a matter of maybe 20 minutes,
Starting point is 00:04:57 the interview shifted from that to her. And I was able to answer one of her prayers. But if I wasn't weak, because I'm like, man, why would I get sick in this time when I need to promote this message? Most I was like, I needed you weak for my daughter. Because if you're strong, you may not be broken enough for me to speak to you
Starting point is 00:05:16 and to speak the words I need to say to her. The episode ended with us praying. And it was very powerful. But that weakness allowed me to be the man in that moment for her. And a lot of times, it's, man, but that weakness allowed me to be the man in that moment for her. And a lot of times, as men, we miss those moments because we feel we have to be perpetually strong, which we know by now with research that is killing us.
Starting point is 00:05:36 And so that weakness in that moment was needed, and I'm thankful that I surrendered to that so I can be the man in the moment for B. Simone. I'm absolutely grateful that you got to do that. That's one of my friends. She's always the one who is spiritually strong for everybody else. She'll hit me out the blue. Even, you know, she may get just,
Starting point is 00:05:56 because we connected in that way. Me, her, and Pretty V, a few other people, but she's always spiritually strong and the one praying for everybody all the time and just like putting her, whatever she got going on to the side to make sure we're all good. So I'm happy that she was able to do that. It was deep. I had shared with her and I had no idea what my daughter was dealing with. And I refer to her as my daughter. She's like my daughter's age, but she, and a lot of women I I believe, who are single, especially if your life
Starting point is 00:06:26 is renewed in Christ, you feel that you being hidden is that you're not valuable. And I had to let her know that no one puts anything in the safe that's not valuable, and he's protecting you. And it was a very powerful moment because it liberated her from the lies in her head. And so, I've adopted her, so she's a family now, but I'm glad I was able to meet that moment for her.
Starting point is 00:06:49 Wow, you got the book broken down into three parts, dynamic, deeper, and devotion. Can you explain the difference? For sure, the dynamic is what we as men are used to fighting. Of course, we're used to that, and Atheist in us to protect. The problem is many of us are fighting the wrong way. I mean, think of how many intellectually gifted men who are incarcerated,
Starting point is 00:07:09 because they couldn't rule their emotions in the moment. The next one, of course, is number two, which we tend to just gravitate to, is the provider. Providing for our families, making sure they have the care they need, not just the money, because as we know, once you get it, it's not really fulfilling, it's what you do. What is your presence really,
Starting point is 00:07:30 is your presence really present? Are you really active with your children, your wife and your family and your community? Then I go to the leader. Like many of us wanna be leaders, all right? But a lot of us don't lead by example, we lead by intimidation. So I unpack that.
Starting point is 00:07:44 And then we go to the deeper, which is the lover, I start with the lover characteristic, But a lot of us don't lead by example, we lead by intimidation. So I unpack that. And then we go to the deeper, which is the lover. I start with the lover characteristic because many men we believe love is sex only. And I share an intimate moment with my wife when she had, my wife had five miscarriages. And as a result of our last one, they had to make an incision vertically on her stomach. And she, you know, as a woman you become self-conscious of that scar. And so one evening while we were, you know, intimate, the Holy Spirit said, I want you to kiss that scar from the top of it to the bottom.
Starting point is 00:08:20 And I allowed myself, because I'm emotionally intelligent and I'm a comprehensive man, you know, sex to me isn't, a lot of men we think about the ground and pound like MMA, like it's about force, but it's not always about that. It's about sensitivity and connecting. And so when I started kissing the scar, my wife started weeping and crying. And in that moment, I was able to allow her to release this self-consciousness, well self-conscious feeling about this scar and I just share where she's always beautiful but those kisses confirmed that, you know, it wasn't just words in that moment.
Starting point is 00:08:56 Then I moved from the lover characteristic to the nurturer. Many of us as men we believe that being a nurturer is a feminine attribute. First and foremost, where you're supposed to be human, masculine and feminine are just adjectives, all right? Being masculine means you exude strength, boldness, and aggression, which we have to have. And so if I'm a nurturer, does that mean I'm feminine? No. The goal for us as humans is to be human, to exercise humanity.
Starting point is 00:09:24 Many of the greatest cultures are nurturers, cattle herders, farmers are nurturers, any teacher, mentor, you're a nurturer, you have to nurture to develop anything. And then from the nurturer I go to the gentleman. When I discovered I unpacked chivalry, we have been misled to believe that that's a system to pander to women. It's not. It was actually a code of honor for medieval knights, warriors. And so how do we relinquish that? Then I go to unpack the alpha male myth. Like there is no battle between two wolves to see who will lead the wolf pack.
Starting point is 00:10:01 First and foremost, that study was done on wolves in captivity. What they come to realize is that the leaders or the alphas in this pack were the male and female wolf. So in essence, in a human sense, the alphas are the husband and wife leading a family. So I tell my brothers, look, if you really want to be an alpha, get married, lead your family, build the community. And that's what it's about. So from the gentleman, I go to the friend. Many of us, we say we're friends, but we don't understand really what that means.
Starting point is 00:10:33 Like you say, I'll be Simone. She sacrifices her life for you guys, you know, her time. And I give an example of the Winnie the Pooh series, you know, where you'll see Eeyore clearly depressed or always in a bad mood or in a funk sad. Did his friends say, you toxic, I'm going to put up a boundary here. You're ruining my energy. No, they always accepted him for who he was because they knew he was their friend.
Starting point is 00:10:57 And that's what we need now in times like this is a friend who will endure all that adversity and challenge. So from those characteristics, I go to the devotion. The first is the husband. What does it look like to sacrificially love your wife and honor her the way that you want to be honored? And that's where I really take time to help men unpack their emotions and how we allow the way we were raised
Starting point is 00:11:21 to prevent us from truly living from our hearts and giving our all to our wives. We stay guarded and often say, brothers, there is no freedom in the facade. And as a man been married 26 years, because of the way I grew up, I still have to fight to hold my wife's hand in public or to be romantic because it was like I'm dropping my guard.
Starting point is 00:11:41 And so that's something I'm still working to improve on. And the last two, of course, is the father. I can't tell you how many times as a father I passed down the harshness of my dad onto my own daughter. And as a result of that, we had to go through a lot of therapy, prayer, and a lot of I'm sorry's for me to say, hey Lex, I apologize for passing on to you what I got from my dad and I'll make it better. And so the father's helping me learn how to parent, not from what we didn't get from our father,
Starting point is 00:12:15 but give our children what we long for. And the last one, I close with the son characteristic because that's the one that made me into a comprehensive man. I tell men all the time, if you wanna become comprehensive, run to the areas in your life that make you feel what they would say are unmasculine emotions. This world, this society is in dire need of a man's nurturing love, our patience. What does long suffering look like from a man?
Starting point is 00:12:42 So when I had to care for my mother, she needed more than a protective provider. She needed someone who would nurture her, who would file her nails when the caregiver couldn't, paint her nails, wash her hair, wash her. And I couldn't do that the way I was. And so I end with that one because it puts men in positions where we have to be transparent. How many of us have, you know, family members that are aging parents or children in the community that bring out emotions that make you feel weak or sad? Those are not times we run from as men. That's when you, what they would say, man up, that's when you use the masculine attributes. Run towards that, move past your fears
Starting point is 00:13:25 of being transparent or perceived as weak because you may shed a tear or you may shed empathy and be the man you need to be in that moment for those in need. A very intentional, like a very intentional person about what you wrote. I imagine that a lot of this was written from your personal experience.
Starting point is 00:13:43 Absolutely. Right. Okay, and would you feel like the husband part that a lot of this was written from your personal experience. Absolutely. Right. Okay. And would you feel like the husband part, did that, did all of that transpire within like the 26 years or were you ever married before or? That's a good question. I wasn't married before, thankfully, but I mean, you know, 2015, I think we got married in 1998. So in 2015, my wife and I were considering separation
Starting point is 00:14:10 because I was only a masculine male. I could only express my emotions through hitting the table, hitting the refrigerator, raising my voice, lacking the control needed to really communicate with her. And so that's when I realized that I needed some help, that I was holding on to a lot of trauma, unresolved anger from my father wound, the death of both of my brothers, my best friend.
Starting point is 00:14:33 I could go down the line, and I got tired of allowing that trauma to time travel and ruin my present blessings. And so the husband chapter basically, it shares how I evolved, but even who I am now, that it's constantly a fight. We married, you know what I mean? You gotta make sure your heart is there.
Starting point is 00:14:52 I keep a picture of my wife on my phone when she was young, during a time when she was very vulnerable, when she didn't feel things were stable in her own life. And that keeps my heart tender towards her in the moments when we may not get along. And so I also share an analogy of the crayons for men so we can have a practical understanding
Starting point is 00:15:14 of how we're so limited in who we are as men. We've allowed society to define us. So I use a 64 box of crayons as the amount of emotions women have access to, or actually choose to express because we both have access to both of them. But we as men, we lock ourselves in the eight box of crayons and we probably only express four.
Starting point is 00:15:39 So we get frustrated when we're communicating with our women, like why don't you understand me? Well my brother, she's expressing violet. All you got is purple. She's expressing lime. Now you got to grab a green and a yellow to try to meet the moment. And so I'm encouraging men like, look,
Starting point is 00:15:55 I'm not telling you to relinquish your masculine attributes, because then now you'll be deficient in that area. You got to be the lion and the lamb. And so what I'm telling men is to be human, express what you feel. All of us as men want to be more available, want to be more transparent, want to be more emotionally open, but we fear being admonished or impassively dismissed by those that we love. So then we go into a suffering and silence, and then that leads to emotional incarceration, then that leads to suicidal ideations,
Starting point is 00:16:26 and then our wives don't even know what we were dealing with until they planned in our funerals. And so that's why I pour my heart into this book because I mean, just recently brother, my best close friend called me and said, you know, for the first time he looked at his gun and thought about it. And so this is what a lot of men are going through, but when you meet him, he's smiling. He's jovial. He's happy. And so what's the saying? Don't miss the forest for the trees.
Starting point is 00:16:55 I'm telling people, not just our wives, but the brothers who have friends, don't miss the struggle for the smile. Just because a brother says, I'm good, I'm all right, doesn't mean that he's good and we should check on each other. I do have two questions at something you said. One was, you talked about your relationship with your daughter and you said, not sure the term you used,
Starting point is 00:17:15 I guess you had to apologize or change because what you learned from your father, you were teaching your daughter and you realized it was wrong. What was that? My father, I had no idea at the time that he had a lot of unresolved anger from the way he was raised in the South,
Starting point is 00:17:30 had to deal with a lot of racism, and he carried that back to Detroit. And I remember one time, brother, he asked me, he ran a barbershop, he asked me just simply to cut the air on it, I accidentally cut the heat on. Think I may have been 10 years old. He cursed me out in front of everybody in the barbershop. That right there shattered my confidence as a man.
Starting point is 00:17:53 It demeaned me and it didn't stop there. He loved me, but he thought giving me gifts. Hi, I'm Arturo Castro, and I've been lucky enough to do stuff like Brat City and Narcos and Roadhouse and so many commercials about back pain. And now I'm Arturo Castro, and I've been lucky enough to do stuff like Broad City, and Narcos, and Roadhouse, and so many commercials about back pain. And now, I'm starting a podcast because honestly guys, I don't feel the space is crowded enough. Get Ready for Greatest Escapes, a new comedy podcast about the wildest true escape stories in history.
Starting point is 00:18:18 Each week, I'll be sitting down with some of the most hilarious actors and writers and comedians to tell them a buckwild tale from across history and time. People like Ed Helms, Diane Guerrero, Joseph Gordon-Levitt, and Zoe Chao. Titanic. Charles Manson. Alcatraz. Sarah Shacor. The sketchy guy named Steve.
Starting point is 00:18:34 It's giving funny true crime. I love storytelling and I love you, so I can't wait. Listen and subscribe to Greatest Escapes on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Tisha Olin, former golf professional and the host of Welcome to the Party, your newest obsession about the wonderful world that is women's golf. Featuring interviews with top players on tour like LPGA superstar Angel Yin. I really just sat myself down at the end of 2022 and I was like, look, either we make it or we quit.
Starting point is 00:19:12 Expert tips to help improve your swing and the craziest stories to come out of your friendly neighborhood country club. The drinks were flowing, torquing all over the place, vaping, they're shotgunning. Twerking all over the place, vaping, they're shotgunning. Women's Golf is a wild ride, full of big personalities, remarkable athleticism, fierce competition, and a generation of women hell-bent on shanking that glass ceiling. Welcome to the Party with Tisha Olin
Starting point is 00:19:35 is an iHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. Listen to Welcome to the Party, that's P-A-R-T-E-E, on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. Hey, it's Alec Baldwin.
Starting point is 00:19:54 This season on my podcast, Here's the Thing, I speak with musician, photographer, and philanthropist, Julian Lennon. One of the really important things that happened to me in my relationship with photography and the images was that I would have people write to me, people that couldn't financially afford to travel the world or go anywhere, couldn't or were disabled and couldn't travel the world or go anywhere.
Starting point is 00:20:19 And what they had all said to me is that you bring these stories to us. You bring the truth, you bring life to us of cultures that we would never necessarily know anything about. Photography really does allow me to do that. Have empathy for people on the other side of the world that you'll never ever meet, but you'll at least have some understanding of what their life is and what they went through or are still going through. Listen to the new season of Here's the Thing on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
Starting point is 00:20:52 John Stewart is back at The Daily Show and he's bringing his signature wit and insight straight to your ears with The Daily Show Ears Edition podcast. Dive into John's unique take on the biggest topics in politics, entertainment, sports, and more. Joined by the sharp voices of the show's correspondents and contributors. And with extended interviews and exclusive weekly headline roundups, this podcast gives you content you won't find anywhere else. Ready to laugh and stay informed? Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Would suffice and it didn't. I needed him to be active in my life, but he couldn't because of all the pain that he'd
Starting point is 00:21:37 been through. And so what the, it's called intergenerational trauma where you pass down what you've received. So before I knew it, this anger that he even had toward my mother, he said he, he told my mother one day they had gotten divorced and she accidentally opened one of his letters were mailed it came to the house. And here it is, I'm going to middle school and my mother shows me her gun and her purse and she says, your father just called and said he's gonna do something to me because I opened his letter. So here it is as a young boy trying to focus in class,
Starting point is 00:22:10 I gotta think about my mother's life. But that's how much anger my father had. And brother, I hope my transparency frees some brothers listening or watching, it's like, you don't want to create a legacy of wounds. You wanna fight and do whatever you can to get healed because if not, now you're gonna see that same behavior in your children, then you're mad at them
Starting point is 00:22:32 and all they did was become who you were. That's why I think apologizing to your kids is so important because that's something that, you know, I feel like I never got from my father. And I always say my father raised me out of fear and not love. And I think say my father raised me out of fear and not love. And I think that's what we gotta avoid doing, raising our kids out of fear.
Starting point is 00:22:50 I mean, we gotta raise our kids out of love and not fear. The fear of that they might end up falling victim to the street or end up, if we were in the street doing the same things that we were doing, we gotta relinquish that. That's true, I call it fear-based parenting. My mother was that way way which is understandably I understand why she was because she just lost her son you know and then my other brother
Starting point is 00:23:12 from my father he was murdered so she she was terrified that I would die the same way and because of that fear she had checked out you know meaning the affirmation that you typically get from your mother, the nurturing. I didn't get that. My mother loved me. Like everyone who knew my mother knew she loved me, but I realized in therapy one session when the therapist asked me who would get the bandaid
Starting point is 00:23:37 when you got hurt. And I said, I will. My mother would just tell me where it was. And in that moment I realized, man, this is why I'm misusing women because I never understood the importance of having my mother, the understanding of what nurturing is, the value with the affirmation, and I unpacked the mother wound as well in that book because many of us, what we're seeking is the love
Starting point is 00:24:01 for my mothers and women and they'll never be able to match what we're seeking is the love for my mothers and women, and they'll never be able to match what we didn't get, and it's unfair to them. And so I had to unpack all of that, brother, because I didn't want to transfer that onto my children. And so I've allowed myself to be more tender in that area. My son by far has the best father, because I've become the embodiment of what I teach. And so to your point, yes, absolutely important for us as parents to not be fear-based, especially
Starting point is 00:24:33 my son's, he's driving now. Why do I have to teach him how to get pulled over by the police? Why am I focused on that? What is that teaching him? Is that really making it better or is it making it worse when he gets pulled over? But those are the things we have to teach in our community, but at the end of the day, making sure you balance that with some positive reinforcement and to teach them how to live in the moment. Because
Starting point is 00:25:04 when we teach our children, we got to understand we're also teaching them how to live in the moment. Because when we teach our children, we gotta understand we're also teaching them how to miss the moment because they're programming themselves. Like, okay, if this happened, this probably gonna happen because that happened to dad, that happened to mom, this probably gonna happen to me. And so in that moment, if they're not open to be able to meet the moment, to do what's necessary,
Starting point is 00:25:23 they may fail in that moment. Now I know you're oh, okay one last question You talk about turning it off, right? And this is important because I see it with Jess I see what myself and I see it with a lot of other brothers Talk about the importance of turning it off, right? I think we we come from a place where we had to get it, right? And if you listen to just story just tell your times when the lights were off. And so I know for herself, it's hard to turn things down now because you never want to go back to that place.
Starting point is 00:25:50 I feel the same way, and a lot of my friends around me feel the same way. It's like we can't stop because you never know when it's over. So talk about the importance of that because you said, you know, beginning of the year, you had to turn it off. And for some, it's difficult to turn it off.
Starting point is 00:26:03 I mean, I seen just recently in the hospital still doing stories because it's like, it's hard to turn the shit off. That's real, brother. For me, I remember the concept of balanced life. We hear that a lot. You know, for me, Envy, I live an imbalanced life. So the things that hold the greatest importance
Starting point is 00:26:23 must always tip the scale. So when you live a balanced life, nothing truly claims priority. So for me it's my, of course the most high, my family, my calling, my health. See when it's leveled, everything gets the same attention. So I tell people make sure that scale always tips in favor of what matters the most. When I started living that way and stopped living from what I do, stopped living from fear again not having, I understand that brother. I stopped worrying about those things and realizing I could only do so much man. And then what's most important is to ask yourself, why am I doing this?
Starting point is 00:27:05 You know so many of us especially in the era of social media and how everything is broadcast and content creation, it's like our lives are becoming that instead of you know really being authentic. And it's like no I'm pregnant, I don't have time to do this. And just let people know that but when we allow society to say hey Envy I need you to do this, you demand, have time to do this. And just let people know that, but when we allow society to say, hey Envy, I need you to do this, you the man, you gotta do this, and promote this, can you go here? Man, your life feels like it's not worth living,
Starting point is 00:27:34 and often tell men, you're not tired of living, you're tired of not living. And the same thing with our women. So many of our sisters have to be so strong that they can't even be human either. They can't cry. They gotta work. Am I right? And so even for them I'm like, man, I hope we never lose a woman's empathy and love. This world is over.
Starting point is 00:27:56 When she has to become stoic and hide behind a facade, we can forget about it. And so my freedom started when I started prioritizing what mattered the most. Everything else I let it, you know, end where it may. But my identity is first and the most high in Christ. After that, man, my affirmation come from my home, man. And so, if I could shut down now, I'm cool. I was sad when COVID was over because that meant I had to go back to the norm. I couldn't be with my family all day.
Starting point is 00:28:29 You see what I'm saying? And so I just tell people to live from that. Make sure that, don't live a balanced life. Make sure the skill always tips in favor of what you love and matters the most. I knew you had a question. I knew you had a question. I did, I had one more question.
Starting point is 00:28:46 Because you seem to, like you've done the self work, like to be all of these, to play all of these roles, the husband, the son, the father, but you're still not perfect and you still can fall short at times as well. What happens when like, you know, if you're mad as a dad one day and you react the wrong way, is it ever a point where the husband has to talk to the husband you are, have to speak to the father or you have to relate to your kids on a son level because you're
Starting point is 00:29:16 somebody's son. Do you ever merge the roles to, you know what I'm saying, like pull from different places because you can't always operate in the move. I agree with you. No, absolutely. I morph between all of them. Again, I remember the mental health, mental wealth expo when the brother asked me, how do you define a man? I said, you can't. And so I have to be anything and everything at any given moment. And so to your point, Charlamagne, you know, I always reconcile. I tell brothers, we can always make mistakes.
Starting point is 00:29:46 Mistakes are great teachers. The only worst mistake is the one we don't learn from. And so I always apologize immediately. I try to reconcile and make sure that, you know, the day doesn't end with me and my children being at odds or even me and my wife, because it's not that deep, you know? And so yeah, even with my son, you son, when he doesn't want to talk, he's a teenager and I'm concerned.
Starting point is 00:30:10 I don't want to invade his space because he has his own life, but I want to let him know that I'm here for him. So some days I just walk to his room door and I see him laying there maybe on his phone and I say, son, do you mind if I just lay down in the room and read? I ask for his permission. He typically always says, sure, dad, and I lay down. And that opens the door to a conversation and lets him know that he's very important to me,
Starting point is 00:30:36 not what I do, not who I am in society, but who I am in that home. And I prioritize that. And being the son in that moment to him is giving him what I wanted as a son. If my father would have gave me that attention, that affirmation, I probably would be even further in life than I am now. And so I make sure I'm there for him in all aspects that I can.
Starting point is 00:30:58 I got two quick questions. I know you got to go. You removed the word vulnerable from the book completely. What words can we use? Number one, why did you do that? What words can we use instead of vulnerable? When I discovered that, when I read the dictionary, the word itself means susceptible to harm, danger, or even death. And so when you think about being in a vulnerable situation or you hear it on the news, vulnerable citizens were defenseless against the gunman. No good man ever wants to be vulnerable.
Starting point is 00:31:30 I don't want my wife, my children, anyone I love in a vulnerable position. So what we're trying to tell men is to be emotionally open, to be transparent with how you feel. And that way is to do away to you becoming more human, becoming more of a verbal process or emotionally intelligent. And that's why I took the word out. That's why it's so hard for us as brothers to say it, because it goes against the way we were created as men.
Starting point is 00:31:55 We don't want anyone that we love to be in a vulnerable position. However, what is hindering us as men is that we're not emotionally open with those who love us. And so as a result of that, the suffering and silence piece is really taking us down. And so I just encourage by being the example of being transparent and emotionally open and showing my men that just because you can express how you feel doesn't mean you'll be taken advantage of.
Starting point is 00:32:24 And if someone misuses your emotions, be thankful. Now you know who's in front of you and you got a decision to make. My last question, because I love when you talk about your relationship with your wife and I saw a video where you said happy wife, happy life isn't about love. What is it about? Well, you know, it never was a term of endearment.
Starting point is 00:32:43 We know that as men. It was a way, what was it saying? Give her what she want, keep her mouth shut so you can have peace, all right? And now women are realizing this is not a happy life for neither of us. And so I call it a misleading mantra, brother. And there's another one too.
Starting point is 00:32:59 If you're out with your wife, this happened to me a few times. I'm addressed as the lesser half and she's the better half. So I had no idea until I was meeting with a psychologist, well no, a psychotherapist of what that does to a man's mind that you are the lesser half and the resentment that silently builds within your heart. And so my wife and I vowed not to use that mantra ever. So instead Nicole and I say happy houses, happy spouses.
Starting point is 00:33:28 And it takes for both of us to meet the moment in marriage together, every moment. We're always willing to cross the line. If she's not doing well mentally and emotionally, I have to cross the line. If I'm falling short, like you were saying, Jess, she crosses the line. And that's why our marriage is, we call it a beautiful struggle. We're pushing through, we won't give up on each other. And the biggest game changer was when we both decided
Starting point is 00:33:56 that we know we're not intentionally hurting each other. There has to be just some miscommunication and let's be patient and work through it. And we're going on 27 years this year and 33 years together. Thank you, brother. Well there you have it. Pick up the new book out now.
Starting point is 00:34:12 Jason Cat Daddy Wilson. The man the moment demands. And no cat daddy. It's the Breakfast Club, good morning. Wake that ass up. Early in the morning. The Breakfast Club. Hi, I'm Arturo Castro, and I've been lucky enough to do stuff like Broad City and Narcos
Starting point is 00:34:32 and Roadhouse. And now I'm starting a podcast because honestly, guys, I don't feel the space is crowded enough. Get Ready for Greatest Escapes, a new comedy podcast about the wildest true escape stories in history. Each week, I'll be sitting down with some of the most hilarious actors and writers and comedians, people like Ed Helms, Diane Guerrero, and Joseph Gordon-Levitt. I love storytelling and I love you, so I can't wait. Listen and subscribe to Greatest Escapes on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
Starting point is 00:34:58 or wherever you get your podcasts. Catch Jon Stewart back in action on The Daily Show, and in your ears with The Daily Show and In Your Ears with The Daily Show Ears Edition podcast. From his hilarious satirical takes on today's politics and entertainment to the unique voices of correspondents and contributors, it's your perfect companion to stay on top of what's happening now. Plus, you'll get special content just for podcast listeners, like in-depth interviews
Starting point is 00:35:24 and a roundup of the week's top headlines. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. $1.4 billion in NFL quarterback contracts, the untold stories behind the biggest deals in football history. I'm AJ Stevens, Vice President of Client Strategy at Athletes First, introducing the Athletes First Family Podcast, the quarterback series.
Starting point is 00:35:51 My cohost, Brian Murphy, Athletes First CEO, and I are sitting down with the agents who have negotiated contracts for Justin Herbert, Deshaun Watson, Dak Prescott, Tua Tunga-Vaioloa, and Jordan Love. Listen to Athletes's First Family podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Starting point is 00:36:09 You are cordially invited to... Oh! Oh! Oh! The hottest party in professional sports. I'm Tisha Allen, former golf professional and the host of Welcome to the Party, your newest obsession about the wonderful world
Starting point is 00:36:24 that is women's golf, featuring interviews with top players on tour, tips to help improve your swing, and the craziest stories to come out of your friendly neighborhood country club. Welcome to the Party with Tisha Allen is an iHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. Listen to Welcome to the Party. That's P-A-R-T-E-E on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcast, or
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