The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Kai Ca$h Talks 'Bars Not Dead.,' Rap Career, Industry Collabs, Signing With DJ Drama, Anxiety, Fasting & Discipline + More

Episode Date: September 11, 2026

Today on The Breakfast Club, Kai Ca$h Talks 'Bars Not Dead.,' Rap Career, Industry Collabs, Signing With DJ Drama, Anxiety, Fasting & Discipline. Listen For More!YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BreakfastClubPower1051FMSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Wake your ass up. The Breakfast Club. You're on finish or y'all's done. Morning, everybody, it's DJ Envy. Just hilarious. Sholamine the guy. We are the Breakfast Club. Long of the Roses here as well.

We got a special guest in the building. The dope is lyric is in New York City right now. Dope is young rapper in New York City. Stop playing with him. There you go. Kodcast. Welcome, brother. How are you feeling?

Great. I'm glad to be here. How are you feeling? Happy that you here, brother. Thank you for having me. You got the merch on, boss, not dead. Pushing, campaigning, got to. You went to Del State?

Yeah, I did. When did you go? Oh, you were like. 2014. Well, yeah, he didn't go with you? I know. I never even whispered. I said, you were like, you're like, you're like me.

Nah, I went, I went for one year. I went to, um, I went 2014 and then I went to Hampton. Can you tell them Del State is lit? Nah, Dale State is lit. Like, they're in. No. But don't lie. But don't act like, they act like we don't have nothing.

Like, Del State is lit. So you're like the both day alma mater. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's crazy. What did you graduate from? Hempton. Unfortunately. Unfortunately.

All the extra money for none. Let's start from beginning. This is first time Kyle's up here. Facts. Of course, Kai gets busy with the bars. So let's start what got you into rap. And I heard a story. Okay.

That when you were five years old, yeah. I guess in school, everybody said what they want to be. And kids were like police officers and firemen. And you said you wanted to be wordy like little Wayne. I don't know where you heard that story from that. I'm going to say, That's a lot of words.

No. Who the hell told you that story? Yeah, that's a crazy story. His pop's told me that story. That's he told me that story. I call his pops and say, tell me some questions about. You're so old. You called me with that.

I don't know, maybe he remembered better than I do. But really, it's from the upbringing for real, like, as you know, pops, it's just like a behind-the-scenes guy in the industry and just coming up and being privy to what the lifestyle was. For me, that was the eye opener. That's like, I know y'all got some money and it's from this thing. And who doesn't like music? So it's just like, I'm around it all the time. And I always express myself through art. Like, I hated sports.

I wasn't trying to be a firefighter or police officer. I'm not doing none of that. Like, rap, I always been good with words. And I just took it there and I kept going. Now, I mean. When you call a project, Baws, not dead. Are you defending lyricism? Are you challenging the people who keep saying

this generation don't care about lyrics anymore? I think it's just a bit of both. I'm defending it because I like the rap a lot. And it's like it gets frowned upon sometimes, especially now. It's just like, I don't want to hear all that rapy rap. It's just like, damn. Why do people say that? I don't know.

I don't know. When everybody, to me, I don't know. I look at the last 15 years, the guys who really thrived are rapidy rappers. The Kendrick is a rapidly rap. The legacy acts. It's just like they're a lot more booked than the newcomers. That's right. Because of what they did.

Cole is a rapidy rapper. Cole is a rapidy rapper His shows look crazy Every night Yeah So it's just like I don't know But yeah it's a little bit of both It's like I want you all to stop saying this thing

And then I'm challenging Everything else at the same time But you came up in the era where I hate to say the rapidy rap But the rap wasn't necessarily As big as some of the other stuff that came out You can point to a lot of major It wasn't like a Jay Cole

Like it was few and far between But look this is the thing too Because it wasn't But at the same time we had it And it still was like something that people look to. Like I had an argument with one of my peers. And he was just like, yeah, 07, Lafey Taffy was number one. I'm just like, but Tia was still rally.

Little Wayne was just going into the car of three. Like, it was balanced. Now it's just like there's no balance. No and none. Hold was still outside. Hold was still outside. How old was the person you was going back before? We're the same age.

So in 07, I'm 29. In 07, I was what? 10? Because I feel like it's a taste level. Like, there are people that probably were listening to Lafey Teffi that weren't listening to like, if you did hear Tia, it was like, you had to skate and ring. But I'm not going to lie.

Tiya was lit. Yeah, 100%. You know, Kanye West's graduation without no seven. It's a taste level thing. It has to be. It has to be. And that's my whole point. Lubei Fiasco.

But not everybody listening to Lupe Fiasco. And a lot of people that would listen to Kanye West and would listen to like a last. There's a lot, a little synergy there, but a lot of people, y'all, if you, if somebody said, do you point it to Laffey Taffy first, that's a whole different, like, mind you, the person I was talking to is a rapy rapper. Oh, wow. Exactly. Case and point, it's just like, how do we, okay, and let's just bring it back to a space and place where everything can coexist.

I'm not trying to say, like, nah, it's over for that. Who am I to dictate that? It's just like, let's not shy away from this thing as well, because this is. is how we got it. And what got you into rapping? Because you got your degree from Hampton.

And what was your major? Business management. To be honest, I went to school because it just seemed like the right thing to do. I'm not even going to lie to you. If I could have went to school for hip hop

because I went to school for hip-hop. So you knew this is what you wanted to do. I never had a job. This is just my only thing. It's crazy because I asked my pops for a job one summer. He had reopened world.

on wheels in LA. I just wanted to make some bread. I used to go there. Yeah. And I was just like, yo, I just need a job. And he was like,

you got a job. Keep doing it. I was like, wow. All right. Wow. That's great. Yeah,

I was like, I'm fired. I bet. Yeah. You just like, nah, do this, you got a job,

do it. You figure out to make some money, you do it the right way. Now, when speaking to your pops in, and. B.K.

Robe too. Yeah, let's say, can we talk through, like, who is that. His dad is the BK. Rube, of course, one of Biggie's best friends. I'm a pseudo-nepo baby.

That's right. And there's nothing wrong with that at all, no. I used to look at it like, no, no, I don't want. Nah, now it's just like, yeah. Yeah, period. I mean, he was the first person to play me your record. I am who I am. I was like, you know what I am.

Exactly. You see what I'm saying? But also, too, I feel like you, like, when you say you're a pseudo-nepo baby, it's like, but I know because of the type of cloth that that means you came from that. Like, you still worked. Like, you still had to work for something. And you know how to fight. I worked for everything, exactly.

I worked for everything. That's what a lot of people get confused. Like, I can speak for myself. I worked for everything. But that's also how I was brought up. It's like, I'm also a person. I don't like things handed to me. It's naturally.

I don't want you to just come with your hand out. Like, oh, yeah, here's this thing. Go do it because it's just like people can tell. Like, I don't even know who this kid is. Where he came from, at least now I got a little bit of a history. People can go back and be like, oh, he's been doing this for a little minute. and it's just now finally clicking with people. It takes a long time.

That's how I felt. I didn't know what rule was your pops. You know what I mean? I had heard your music before, but over the holidays, Nala was just letting me hear a much of the same. Shalameh was not a fan in the beginning. Tell us about it.

Everybody had the experience with Shalami. I think Nala might have played the last tape, and he was just like, eh, it is what it is. But you got to admit, you stepped up literally. No, 1,000%. I feel like you was making records that you thought.

we're going to be, I guess, that radio would want to hear. I did do a lot of that. A lot of conforming. You were doing down your pen. I did a lot of that. Yeah, it's just like, I've completely stepped out of it. That whole person that was doing that is, I don't even know. No, but the first time I think Nala played it was, it was May 2025, right?

And I remember listening to it. I remember hearing and I was like, yo, this kid is dope. And that's when your pop sitting here, he's like, yo, you know, that's my son. That's the kid I've been telling you about. That was a lyrical cop. May 225 was lyrical. Did your dad want you in the industry? seeing that everything he's seen through Biggie and Bad Boy,

did he want you in the industry? He never told me he didn't. More than anything, he just like, that's what you asked for. Like, when I call him like, yo, I'm cooked. I've been out five days. He's like, and? Like, yeah, you're going to be out a lot more days.

You keep doing what you're doing. So my mom's was more so like, oh, you don't want to, you don't want to go get a job. I'm just saying, you're tripping. I know. I'm sorry. I don't knock nobody that has a job. I just, I'm not doing it.

What's on your path? Yeah, I just, you dream. Yeah, like, I gotta do it. But Pops was always like, yo, I see it. Like, you can do this. Keep doing it. Let's go. What do you tell you, the most difficult thing was, and the reason I asked is he's seen big

when nobody believe. And big had to go to rounds of rapping outside and freestyle and to the world court. So what was his advice to you? Just keep the most cliche advice. It's just like, keep doing it. Because you just, exactly. Like, you see it all. You see from one day.

It's just like, your man's is just a hustle on the corner. And then he's the biggest thing in the world before he passes away. And then when he passes away, he's even bigger. It's just like, I've seen this for my own two eyes. You can definitely do this. Like, you just keep doing what you got to do. I'm just here doing what I got to do to the best of my abilities. What made you say, you know what, I'm going to be a straight lyricist?

Like I said, you know, you weren't, you weren't whack. You was just making, I said, you was dumbing down your pen. Say, how he talking to you wasn't wax of strass. You wasn't my comp a trash. You were just dumbing down. What made you be like, nah, I got to show these dudes I can really get busy.

I started just paying attention how far I've come by being myself. And more than anything, I think just in just being younger, it's just like you get somewhere and you see so many things happen for other people and how it worked. And it's just like,

maybe if I tried that, it'll work for me this way. And it's just like, most of them people got there just doing what they was doing. Somebody in the world is going to like what I'm doing and how I'm doing it. So it's just like, why not continue to push that forward

But rather than trying to figure out, oh, let me jump on this wave or do this thing. And then it's just like when the wave is gone, it's gone. I'm just somebody that got caught in the wave. Now I'm burnt, cook. It's like, I'd rather be, if I am going to be burnt or cook, I'd rather be burnt and cooked doing what I was doing. What was the ball for you? What was the person that you said that was like, that's the lane I want to go through? It's always been Jay-Z for me since I was a kid.

Like, I didn't like Nause. Damn, tell them how you feel. Yeah, like that. That's how biased I was. Jay Z was just like, he's the guy. But getting older, it's like, like Kendrick and Cole. Kendrick is somebody that I feel like never conformed to nothing.

And he figured it out. It's mad people that don't like Kendrick. Even before the Drake Beef, it's like, we don't want to listen to that. There's too many words. I don't know what he's talking about. To pimper butterfly, I don't get it. Whatever the case may be.

And it's just like, look at them. Why not? Just do what you got to do. Because everybody that's super successful, even though the legacy acts that we were just talking about, it's like, they all did their own thing. And that's why they're still here, 50 years old, selling out of stadiums.

It's like, we got four or five of us my age and I can do that right now. And they being themselves. So it's just like, all right. There's a difference between being able to rap and being able to make people care that you can rap. Yeah. When did you learn that distinction?

Are you still learning? I think I'm still learning. I think now I'm, I'm more in tune with it than that was before, though. That's why I'm just locked into it. Like, okay, it's people in the world that do kid. Especially when I see women, Karen, it's like, oh, yeah, nah. Ooh, this is a bag.

That's like the, you got to sell it to the women. I find women and they like, yo, I love this song. I'm just like, listen to it. But I feel like most time women with songs with us, it's like, if you can talk through it, like, we with you. And that's the thing. I've gotten to that point now. I'm so good at this thing that I can talk through it

and affect y'all in a greater way than I've ever done before. That's how I used to, when I used to watch, or not used to, when I be watching the interviews that a lot of the OG artists you're talking about, like an L.L. Kooj and all these people, they talk about how when they would get through and break through with the women and the records there, how that would, like, take their career to, like, a whole different, like, place. That's where I'm at. I'm on that way.

What made you believe it? What was the moment that you said this could really happen? What was that moment? You want to know it was crazy? I dropped my first song on, like, all the DSPs in 2018, right? By the third song, I went viral. I dropped the song Calla West with King Columville, O3Grito. That went up.

That was like it, because after that, I got a feature from Chris Brown. just because he liked the song. Just out of GP, he just heard it. You feel me? Just being around the right people, they're playing my music. I was in Hampton, stress. Just like, oh, my gosh.

Like, my man Ralph calling me like, yo, CB, he wants to get on this song. I'm like, stop calling me about this. Do it. Like, I'm not going to say, no. I don't want a Chris Brown feature. And it just kept going from there. I got to push your T feature after that.

But this is all out of, like, the respect of how I'm operating in this space. Like, okay, This kid is actually nice. Yeah, we do know who he is, but that's not everything. That's just extras. So for me, it's just like it's always been little points that I made that just shows me like, all right, you got, you got something. If you keep doing what you're supposed to do, whatever's supposed to happen and click is going to click and you'll be straight.

Who from Chris Brown's camp called you? Somebody called you or did they call you? My man Ralph, my man Ralph is actually from my camp, but he on some just L.A. hanging around he got cool with CB so he started hanging with CB's camp and hanging with CB's camp he's playing the music you feel me he playing the back home stuff and CB

it's just like yo I already know this nigga like I know him I know it's pops I know the whole crew I like this song and CB's one of those people like if he likes a so he's he will get on your song if he likes it he did it and me being in school he's like yo let's shoot the video next week

I'm like ah bro like I got class tomorrow And business every Thursday. You got a way of a suit on the top. I got class. And now I look back like, damn, I should have left. I definitely should have left. I swear there wasn't a video.

I was following the rules so much. No, there was no video. I thought that there was a something. You buggy. But I understand. Yo, I tweet. You could have said you were sick. I could have been emergency.

You could have missed a day or two. I could have did anything. Yeah. But what was like at that point, it's like you knew you had something, but you didn't know that you had something enough where you was like, I got to go shoot. Now, let me tell you what it was. I was about to graduate.

Okay. So I'm so close. I'm just like, if I leave now, I'm never coming back. I think I respect that. I get you. That was my logic behind the relationship. I'm like, if I leave, no, let me tell you something. If I left for that day, I was never going back to school.

Got you. And you wanted that to me. And it's just like, I've already wasted this much money and time. I barely wanted to be here. I'll be damned if I don't finish it. I'm right here. I respect that. You feel me?

So it's just like, that's, that's, it was like a, it wasn't a dream deferred, but it was kind of a dream deferred because once we put it out, it was just like, well, that's that. Did you understand, because you was on a college campus and it can be like such a bubble? Did you understand the virality of the song? Like, did you feel it? I dropped the song with CB during COVID, so no. Okay, because I remember, like, that was a first, I didn't, it's crazy because I,

that song, they would play it a lot in L. I was living in L.A. at the time when y'all dropped it. The tank song, or the West. No, the West. Oh, no, that song? I experienced that vitality. That was my first time hearing.

But I didn't know you were the same person when Nilell started talking about you. This is how crazy it was, right? The song was so much bigger than me, and I was in school, I wasn't about to graduate. This is like prime time school. I would escape every other weekend or so. The song was so much bigger to me.

They would perform it at live in my man's V. He used to be my manager. He's one of my best friends. He would perform for me, because nobody knew what I looked like. That's crazy. So the people that I would go to school with, they know what's my song

because I go to school with y'all. But outside of the world, like I would be just outside and people are listening to the song. I mean, we would be at hookah bars, everything that song was going crazy. People didn't start recognizing what I look like until this year. Wow.

I mean, yeah, not this year. I forget the first time I mentioned you and I asked her. I literally said to her, I remember being like, is that the boy that did the song with Christian? Yeah, because I didn't know. I didn't know that you were,

I didn't know that you had. like this whole like lyrical I just remember that song yeah yeah yeah it was a whole collective and that it like ah man it's just a lot but I witnessed that virality like I was outside active I remember the day we played it it might have been like what's that club in L.A.? it's like outside but it's inside nah nah it's closed down I think it might have been the supper club or something like that they used to do the toxic day part you y'all wasn't coming for the toxic dayprick that was inside

outside. I was outside. I was outside very early. And we played that song out there. Outside and LA just went up and from that point it was just like, oh, okay. It was a Hollywood? Yeah. On Hollywood Boulevard? Yeah. But there was a lot of New York people that went to that club. That's a fact. Yeah, and they would play, that's what I'm saying. That's how I knew. That's how I knew it was, it was going to go up. And then by time we dropped it, we was on like a press run, we dropped it. Christian was promoting. Love You Better. This is so crazy.

dropped it and bad boy had called me and it was like yo we want to figure out how to how to get a deal going so on and so forth Chris Brown was supposed to post the love you better video we on a plane we land he posts the West video I was just like oh yeah we're going somewhere with this one Chris was tight he was like yo we just dropped love you better better I'm like hey word y'all y'all did have that pocket of a run though now I'm thinking about For sure. Yes. Like it was, so y'all shot,

there was one of the videos, what was the group called that you had? C-YN. Yes, okay, y'all shot a video in between, it was in New York, but it was like in between the houses. Like, it was like,

kind of like a- It might have been paid in full. I just remember, y'all were running around for some time. Now, we was running around for a minute. And the music was moving. Like, it was like, like, we were younger,

so I don't know if like radio moving and stuff, but y'all had a way. It was like, it was more so, I'm not going to lie. We was like the first group a young niggas

I don't know if I can curse but we was like the first group of youngens with that with the three letter click like we did the CYN thing and then you started seeing the YBNs and the other ends and it's just like okay that's that's way like I'm for the Migos

Migos had the YRN Migos is there it was Migos was the Migos they were like they were huge already they was out of here like they were like I'm talking about young yeah like I thought like I might even found your song maybe on SoundCloud like it was like you had to really like I thought it was just like,

Christian and his friends just running crazy. And the song started getting played places. But do people, like, not connect you to that time period? Because I literally do. They still do, but I'm, respectfully, I'm so far removed from that time period. It's just like, you got tired of hogging. Yeah, I don't, I don't really connect them to that day.

You feel me? It's crazy because I would have never. And I'd be, I'd be letting it go. Like, you don't connect. Cool. If you do, we can talk about it, but it's, let's keep it to a minimum. But I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm so far removed.

Now, now, you know, talk about it now, I'll remember, but I've never, like, because that was a time when they had fun and they would do, but I don't know. Yeah, you like, to practice.

It'd be like, one, two, three, jump. Y'all would do the one, two, three, that I'm, I'm sure, I was a day at the time. We was outside. Now I remember,

we were outside. But now, it's like, damn, but how come you didn't sign a bad boy there? Because if they tried to do the deal. Nah, that was cool. I was, it just wasn't. Respectfully,

like, it just, I just, it just was like, And this is the first In my brain I'm just like I do Never take the first deal That's just in my brain too Like I don't care who it is

So what got you to To drama generation now Because they are a southern label Yeah You are East Coast rapper Yeah What that mean? So now look

I ended up After I graduated I was like I don't really know What else I can do in New York I was born and raised here It's time for me To spread my wings and fly

Atlanta was like the next best best thing. I moved to Atlanta December 20th, 2019. I kid you not. I had a sold-out show at SOBs. Then I drove down to Atlanta, started working, getting, you know, the studio in Atlanta is like the stoop in New York. Everybody's, you can catch anybody at any studio. Bucca, wings, everything. Literally. So I'm, do you know, me and my manager, we just jugging around Atlanta. We're finding studios to record in for free, just building, doing all that. And by, I see. say 2022.

One of my uncles moved around with Lakin'em a lot. And he was just like, yo, I know y'all looking for like a real rapper. I gotta check how. Like, I got to check how. And even my pops would double down like,

yo. 22, right? 22. Jack Hall Lord, he was looking for a real rapper. That's crazy. That's a fact. They're like,

they're like, they're like, they're like, He really He's a little bit. That's a rapper. And

Lake's like there. Don't put me in this. Like, no, yeah, Lake is here right away. Lake,

Lake told me to come to the office. And this is how I knew I was, I was going to Janem. I went to the office. I played 15 songs. Have you ever been to a label meeting, guys?

They'll never let you play more than three. Ever. Never get more than three. I play 15. and they just locked in like okay and then after the last song

was done like was like yeah I want to sign you I started recording and he was like the last person you got to get to is Canon Canon is a tough critic he doesn't like anything if he likes you we're good

Canon came to studio one day he's like yo what up here it's a beat he gave me a beat it was like a rendition of song cry I might have did the whole song in 20 minutes he was like oh no

all right but the craziest thing is a year before that I had DM Cannon, like, yo, I got a song. He opened the DM. He was like, this shit is trash. Hey. He's on some Shalomaine.

He was like, man. He was terrible. No, it is. It is. Because I ain't going to. Did you tell him that during that? Yeah. If he was here, he'd be like, yeah, I did.

You wouldn't have wanted what you were doing then to be. Like, I think where you are right now and how it's happening is like, this is you. Like, it's so crazy putting you with that song, those other songs. You really are like a whole different person there. Because now I remember. Let me take that as a comment, man, yeah. I remember. I was like out, like, in L.A.,

I'm like, it's so different. I never put two and two together, though. But it's so, I think, so when you were doing, before you were here, right, where you're focused on, like, you know, bars not dead and, like, lyricism and finding that bridge in that gap, did you all, if you always knew that this was it,

why didn't you just start here? You got to go through the motions. That's what it was for me. It was just like, I'm young. And like I said, the person that, the other version of me is so just

gone like it was a lot this interview would have been hard for me if I had got it in 2019 yo I was just

such a timid like soul like I just I'm just to myself I'm introverted I just don't want to I want to be out the way

but I want people to know who I am and I started just like just isolating and recognizing what I was doing wrong for myself you still speaking of Christian

and all yeah yeah I spoke to Christian yesterday. What is something that canon or leg or drama corrected in you that initially irritated you? But you realize like, Danny, right?

Why the hell is Lake laughing? That must be more than one. More than anything? Because he met the timid soul, the one that's, I don't want to do nothing. I don't, you feel me? So a lot of that, I feel like the grand scheme is artist development. I really wasn't a firm. I didn't think it existed.

But being with them, It's just like, okay, I could still be developed. Like, I even thought I was at that. When I dropped all of them records, I'm like, I don't need no coaching, no nothing. Like, I've been here before. It's like, man, no, you have not. It's a lost art. You have not been here.

But that's what I think Generation Now does so well, what other labels don't do. Like, you can see the work they put in Oozooze. You can see the work they put in all. You can see the work that they put in all. It's that most people won't do. Get Bell Pure Fiber Internet with Crave Netflix and Disney Plus. From $94 a month, price guaranteed for two years on internet with a two-year term and auto pay credit.

Visit bell.ca for details and to check availability. Bell, connection is everything. Hey, everyone. It's the Jonas Brothers with the Hey Jonas podcast. We've been catching up with some great friends, Paul Rudd, Michael Boubley, Seth Myers, Nile Horan, Jake Shane. And making some new friends while getting into what's really like to have sisters, like Alex and Asgen-N-Rle. She likes to control everyone and tell everyone. Okay, well, control is a harsh word.

I would say that's a harsh word. I am more outspoken growing up a lot of the times because she was so quiet. I would speak for like the both of us. Now I'm working on like thinking a moment, really not controlling her name. Not controlling her. And Joey King. You know if you're like mom is yelling at your sibling and even if you're annoyed with your sibling, you just like won't let that slide.

It's like only you can yell at your sibling. I'm like, you can't do that here. That is. You want to talk about her like that. Only I talk about her like that. Plus, we've been taking your calls, listening to your voicemails and giving you advice. Or at least trying to. So if you've got catching up to do, now's the perfect time.

Listen to Hey Jonas on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the new podcast Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero, and I travel by myself because it's a rare space. where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word solita, trading the pity for possibility. Every time I tried to be alone, I kept meeting people, and they were like, you smiled at us.

Not a lot of people smile around here. It's when you're alone that you're most receptive to the world as it is and not the lies you're sold about it. It can be a time where you push your limits, change your mind, or wake up to a new version of yourself. So whether you're a solo travel veteran or you're too nervous to book your first trip, I hope you listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When I was 14 years old, I was kidnapped and held captive for nine months.

I survived, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. I just remember this. low taunting voice next to my ear saying, shut up, don't say anything. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable. I knew if he woke up, without a doubt, he was going to hurt me. I started feeling that there was someone at the end of my bed, and I just started screaming.

They are abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. But these aren't stories about what's taken from them. There's stories about what it takes to make it out alive. Listen to the Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I think a lot of it, too, is they are producers and DJs, so they hear a different sound. Exactly.

And for me, it's just like, why not listen? Because in the beginning, it's just like, no, I'm not. I don't even care what they're saying. I might not have vocalized it, but it's just like, well, I'm not doing that. Fuck them country I'm not That's crazy But now it's just like

Nah They're right Now they are They're right They got to end for Absolutely They know what they're doing They're right

Now all the development Is a lost art You know what that But so So for your generation It is a lot of people Who didn't get that Yeah

You know And I mean And you can see the difference I mean Look at Jack Harlow Look at the Monica I can tell That generation

I had nothing To do with that Okay All right None of them will admit it But I can just tell Something about that project. I'm like, I don't think the generation now had nothing to do with this one.

So that Army rollout wasn't this? No, no, no. I don't think so. I don't think so. But I want to talk to you. I've heard you talk about dealing with anxiety. Yeah. Because you wrote a book called a...

Trankle. Trankle. Yeah, overcoming the experience. While I was in Hampton, I was going through it. What was so bad? What was difficult? I had went through something before getting there. At Dell State, it was crazy.

It was like an experience I'd never went through, especially being from Brooklyn to go through something like that in Delaware. It was just like, this makes no sense. Something that traumatized you? It wasn't really traumatic. It was just something that I really never go through. And it almost got a little bit too real. Realer than it, I ever would have seen it coming.

But in the moment, it's just like I'm dealing with it head on. Like, I'm not tucking my tail for nothing. What was the moment if you don't mind of that? I just got into it with a bunch of people that I didn't even know I was getting into it. It's like it's just coming from angles. And it wasn't just me. It was just a group of my pig. And it's just like people we thought we was cool with they did something shady one day and now we're just at odds with

Niggas from Philly and niggas from Delaware. It was just like, all right, I don't even know what's going on. But I do know I'm protecting myself by any means or whatever it is, it is. I left and that's when the anxiety started to crack for me. And I'm just like, yo, what's going on? Like, I'm having heart palpitations. Panic attack. I go straight to the hospital.

I'm about to die. It's over. It's over for me. I guess in a hospital, like, you're having, it's an anxiety attack. It's a panic attack. I'm just like, oh, okay.

But it happened after the fact. So it's just like, okay, I didn't know what was going on. So I only left Del State because I initially wanted to go to Hampton. Straight out of high school, my grades, I just didn't meet it. I didn't meet the requirement. So I went to Dell State first.

I had like a 3-3. Went to Hampton. I got to Hampton. I'm thinking it's going to be just as like, in a beginning, I'm like, oh, it's going to be just as five. as Dale State because Del State is the ghetto. I loved it there.

I got to Hampton. It's like, Booney. Yeah, y'all got to be a side at 11 o'clock. I said, whoa. Curfew until homecoming. I said, whoa. Yo, my first roommate used to have seizures.

My R.D. didn't tell me. Like, it was just like, I just... You thought you liked your music. That shit. But the craziest thing is... You know what you're not. He's right. I'm not even like that.

He's crazy. I don't know. He's good. He's good. Okay. But nobody told me. Right. So one day he's trying.

One day I'm just chilling in the room. Like, it might have been the first day. I don't even know what it's drinking. You don't know what to do. And I'm not even laughing at it. I'm laughing at it. I'm laughing at Charlemagne.

I don't know what happened. He started. I'm just like, oh, no. Like, hold on. The R.D was like, oh, yeah. By the way, I'm like, by the way, this is not something you buy the way.

Right. Are you supposed to tell me this? You're worried up. I was like, cool. I might be able to deal with it. He might got to like the third, fourth joint. I'm like, all right, bro. Respectfully.

Like, we cool. But I don't know what I'm going through right now. And I'll be damned if we're both in here. We just bugging out. What whole year was in you was James Hall? Harkness. Harkness. Okay.

Yeah, cooked. I was cooked. And he was like, now I respected it. I ended up moving downstairs. is everything was I wanted to and in the beginning I kid you know I wanted to transfer the week I got there I was like I got to get out of here I feel like I'm in prison I can't there's no visitation I'm like what is this I hit pops I'm like yo can I go to Clark he was like no you're not you're gonna thug it out and then as time progressed it got better like I just I think it gets

better once you realize I did things discipline just yeah but that's what is it's about discipline You got to think, when people go to college, a lot of times, they lose themselves because they never had that much freedom. Yeah. So what Hampton does is it guides you to get to that point. But imagine having the freedom. Yeah, because at Del State, you just. I got my car. You better be smart about life.

I'm in a co-ed dorm. My RA is them in my age. So it's like, I'm not ever listening to you about nothing. And it's just turned. I get to Hampton. It's like, I'm in an all-boys dorm. 11 o'clock. Can't have your car.

Can't have your car. You will get out by five And I'm just like, wait a minute, hold on. It's a lot. I didn't even have this back home. It was never this strict. So for me, it's just like with the anxiety I already had And then just dealing with that,

I went to therapy. That's the first time I'm going to therapy at Hampton And it was just like, That's good. I'm to, nah, it wasn't good for me. Because I went and I'm just like, miss, I'm bugging out every day. But that's what I did with anxiety.

Coming to you once a week is not efficient. You got to go. go more. Because once you realize it's something happening to your mind and not your body is able to put it in

proper perspective. And then I just started like the idle mind is really the playground of the devil. I started just getting out more. Like, all right, let me go tapping with people.

Let me go work out. Let me go to the calf. Let me just do the students in it whatever I can do to just ease my mind. And then it helped. And then I ended up writing a book.

I'm just like, I know it's not only helped me of the people that's in school, everybody deals with it at someone. That's right. So this is something that I can just share it with the world. But you know what? That's what I went to Hampton,

that's what put me tight with the locals. Because what I would do is, first of all, I would be out on the weekend, so I would get out, or I would sneak out, sneak out. And I would walk down the back by the park lot behind the cemetery. Using Harkness?

That wasn't James. Okay. And I would sneak out. But that's what got me cool with the locals, because you couldn't be, couldn't come after 10. So I'm hanging out with Pusha Tee at Tim Montgomery

I'm with all the locals there You was in the 7-5 So I knew more people locally than the actual school Because you wanted to be outside I was DJed I had to pay the bills That's a fact

And me I also I was I was jaded in the sense I was like I got a little bit of Instagram I got more followers than everybody here I don't care about nothing Y'all gone know me That's really what my mindset was So what got you

What got you to the point where the anxiety slowed down and you would be able to control it a little more I should say just the process of just doing things like I realize like what Charlemagne just said once you realize it's like oh this is a mind thing I start doing things and I started going outside and laughing and having fun and just chopping it up with joints and all that it's just like it's not even there no more right then I go back home and it's just like oh back is against the wall and I'm just like oh okay this is a mind thing I can get over this As long as I just continue to do what I,

and by time, the next school year, it's just like, I'm cool. I ain't tribut about nothing. You know, anxiety is largely about uncertainty, right? Yeah. But then when you're a rapper, you got to have like this irrational confidence. So how do anxiety and ambition coexists?

Now, I kid you all not, I don't be anxious about nothing. I think that experience allowed me this, to be this person. So for me, it's just like, I'm overly ambitious now. I'm super confident because back then, even a part of me, like when I did drop the West and all that,

like I was not confident. And I think a lot of people seen that and I didn't realize it. But I think that's why a lot of things went over a lot of people's heads. Because it's just like, I never really had nobody tell me that I didn't have it. Everybody always told me like, oh, you got it. You got it. You do nice. This, that and the third.

But it's just like for myself, everybody's seen the potential. But I didn't. It's just like, I'm just like, I don't know. like I it's a lot it's a lot of competition out there I don't think I'm as whether I knew I could rap everything else might have been off for me

so now it's just like I got everything I'm all at the bag of chips can nobody can't hold a candle to me that's really how I feel about myself and that's I think I just had to grow to that point because like I said if if y'all was interviewing me in 2019 this

this shit would have been over a long time ago you wouldn't have nothing to say I ain't had nothing to say. Yeah. I'll tell you one thing, though, you're about to have a baby. That parental paranoia, anxiety of being a parent, I'm telling you right now, it's going to come back. You already kind of setting your boundaries, though, it sounds like, because I know on a project you talk about, you know, your kids is about to come. You're not playing with people.

Yeah, congratulations. Congratulations. He hit you with the, you're about to crazy. You're about having a girl. All my anxiety right now literally is all rude. I got four girls. All of my anxiety is rude. trust my family and my kids

MVP chilling yeah now I'll be chilling because I keep my family with me in sight like I'm the one that's like we won't move together like you know I mean

like my daughter before she go we all on life three life 360 I go on vacations with her she's 24 now so we go to the club with each other we go to the hookah spot I keep them close because I am concerned

but I'm just telling you right now it's balance yeah it really is my daughter went to NYU so I can make sure I can sit there I'm back I'm back I'm that he was dealing with the anxiety

yeah but the crazy thing my son went the University of Miami. I'm like, ah, my neck, can see you later, man. It's so much different. Because I wanted a boy initially, and when I found out there was a girl, I was just like, ah, bad.

At first I was like, oh, all right. But now I'm just like, I can't wait to meet her because now I, you'd have been right here. What's the baby you do? October. Wow. Were you a whole in the past life? Who?

Huh? Who? If you could hear me, you can hear. I didn't even hear what you. Were you a hole in a past life? I did my, you know? That's right. I did my dirt up by my lonely.

I don't. And that's what the girl is for. Who's not? That's right. Yeah. That's right. Look at me. You did say journaling helps with your anxiety, though.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm a rapper, bro. It's like, why not use my words? But yeah. Now, when Joey Badass was going against everybody, you jumped in, tagged in. Yo, y'all want to know what's so funny. I told this story before, but I never told it on the breakfast club. So, boom, I got into it with my now wife, right?

She had got me so mad. I forgot what I was pissed off about. I heard some of my stomach too. It wasn't mine. I ate half my sandwich. You got to eat. You got to eat. By the way, he's African, too.

That would make it even funny. He was crazy. He's crazy. Why would you say that? Why would you say that? Yo, nah, but, all right, real quick. So my lady, right, she got me so mad one day. And it's just like, it was mad to a point where I wanted the hit.

something but i'm just like come on we're not ever doing it so we go to sleep and my whole thing has always been like never go to sleep we never go to sleep mad to that day i didn't care i was tight but it's just like i got to take this hang out somewhere i kid y'all not i was drunk in my bed she's sleep i'm up lights out the whole house just pitch black i picked up my phone and i'm just like somebody's gonna get this egg i started writing My Nixon 6th verse, right? This was before I knew I was about to do this. I was just prepping myself up because I'm,

Canon was already in my ear like, if you don't do nothing, you not nothing. Like you're not him. And I'm just like, ah, whatever, bet. Reason drops the dead apple song. I'm just like, I hear it. I hear a little bit of it. I'm just like, ooh, that's crazy.

He's kind of talking crazy about New York. Somebody nice. Somebody needs to say something And then I'm just like, somebody Somebody needs to say something I already start writing a verse About this whole thing So now it's just all playing

Into my favorite I go to studio the next day Kid you not But I didn't finish the verse The whole idea is just in my brain It's how I knew it was gonna be something I'm like I'm gonna rap over Murder was the case

And Little Ghetto Boy It's L.A. I was real strategic I don't know who I'm gonna get to make this beat I don't know how I'm going to do it But I'm gonna get this done I go to the studio I call my man Luca to the studio

He pulls up we make the beat Off rip Time take the drums out all that My engineer's in there I go straight in there I do the first half Before the Tupac section And before we go into murder

Was the case While he's building murder was the case I'm right in the second half I sent it to Cannon Cannon is like Nah this is crazy We need to drop this I'm like yeah I'm about to drop

Like I'm gonna do this I don't care about No label logistics right now. This is urgent. Jay Juan was about to... Me and Jay Warren was already talking. He was like, yo, let me know

when you're about to drop. I'm dropping two today. I'm about to drop it this time. I was like, ooh, I got to get out before Jaywon. I'm sorry. I told Cannon. Canon was like, yeah, we got to mix it. I said, bro.

Jay Juan is dropping in 30 minutes. He was like, oh, no, no, no. Put it out. My cameraman, he came to the studio. He walks in the studio like, you ain't, you ain't, you ain't into the chat with this? I said, bro, you came in here thinking you,

You had a good idea. It's done already. You need to do the cover art. He does the cover art. First person I text, Wayno. Wayno was on a live stream. He had 1,300 people in his live. I said, I'm going to get this to Waino.

If Wano could play this right now, we're out of here. I text to Wano. Wayno's mid-live. He's like, oh, I just got a journey from Kaj. If y'all don't know who Kaj is, da-da-da-da. He's the whole bio. Press play. I'm watching it real time.

It's going crazy. I had just met Gina Vue's and DJ. head because we have all my folks it worked out so perfectly we had just came off the cash rules press run maybe like a week before this and it was regular like I went up there and then the drama was in there

and they asked me one question because drama was there and I'm just like okay cool like I had one day but they got the record one day I'll get my respect right today's the day today's the day I sent it to I sent it to DJ head and Genevues in the Twitter DMs

they posted after Waino maybe 30 minutes flooded everything just flood because I'm really talking crazy things from L.A. It's from L.A. It's hit me, but I used to be L.A. so much, I know so many people

from my thing. It's like my whole thing was the only worthy thing outside of Joey and Ray. Some dude DM me. No, I was playing Twitter games. I'm like, I see people for Joey follow me. Lloyd Banks followed me. Just mad.

Right. Rapper started following me. I'm like, okay, these are the guys that I want to rap with. So I just tweeted like, I ain't going to lie. I got a, I got a soak for Joey. Somebody DM me. His name is DDOT. He DM me.

He was like, text me. Text me. He said, text me the song. I text him the song. He was like, Joey said he got one better for you. He sends me an open. I get the open. I sent it back in 10 minutes.

Joey FaceTimed me. He was like, bro, I'm not going to lie. I ain't never get a verse back this good that fast. He was like, but I was overdoing it. I did like 24 balls, 16 slot. I'm wrapping over hooks, everything. He's like, I need you to just bring it down a little bit. I bought it down and then he dropped Brooklyn's finest.

Me, Rome Streets, C.J. Fly, Joey. But yeah, I just, it was like I just stepped into this. Like, I'm going back to it. If this was five years ago, I would have not done that. I kid y'all nothing. I was not doing it. Now it's just like everything. I feel like, I feel like my back is against the wall a lot now as a grown man, too.

And I like being in that space because it just, it's like fueling. Okay, now I have a point to prove to myself. More than anybody else. I have a point to prove to myself, and I'm going to get my point across. I saw an interview, man, that you did from Hampton like a decade ago. And I think you said that within five years you wanted to be wealthy, not just financially, but you wanted to be wealthy in health, wealthy in the mind, wealthy in the same. spirit, right?

So it's been almost 10 years. It graze yourself. Yeah, I'm getting in there. I'll tell you that much. I'm probably at like a 97. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just waiting for this one wreck at the crack.

Two at a hundred. And I feel like I'm on my, we're there. We're at the cusp of it. Got Lake. I got Lake, so I know we're at the cusp of it. You feel me? The most important thing I think is like getting, just getting a handle on everything. you were dealing with mentally.

Yeah, and the craziest thing is, and thank y'all, by the way, for always supporting. Like, y'all, y'all big me up a lot of way. I want to say thank y'all. The make them pay joint. That's when it, like, when I got to that point, that's when I really started feeling like how I feel today, like, oh, yeah, now, I'm here.

Like, I don't have no time for no nonsense with nobody. Right. I'm demanding my respect. I'm going to get it either way. I'm staying out the way, but I'm also in your face. And that's it. Like, I'm going to get this other 3% from 97 to 100 by any means. That cleared all the road for the rest of the project.

I'm like, okay, he letting y'all know don't even come over here. Please, don't. See, I love when rappers do that. Like, I love when people start talking about a rapper being a rapper. And then when you point them to a new record, like, oh, listen to that, make them petty. Like, oh, yeah. I understand that. I hear that.

I understand that. I understand that. I don't, I ain't even know all things. I'm like, oh, yeah, but it was some things. And he let y'all know. And I knew because literally it was like a whole Nixon 6 moment again. I wrote it. I did a three-day fast.

In my third day, I'm just drinking water. No social media, no nothing. I'm drinking water. On my third day, Iceman might have just dropped two days before. I'm like, make them pay is so me-coded. I need to wrap to this beat. I found the remake. I drove to the studio at 11 in the morning.

Nobody's in there. So Sunday. I'm in my brain. I picked the whole image with him wearing with Biggs Jesus piece because I'm like that's what I feel like. I feel like Jay Z wearing Biggs chain. And I just dropped it and I deleted Instagram.

Like I posted it, I deleted Instagram. By time I was on the way home and it might have been 20, 30 minutes. My bro V had hit me and was like, yo, what, like, what are you on? I'm like, what are you talking about? He's like, I don't know, like you've been just in it. Like, I feel that he was in L.A.

I'm in Atlanta. He's like, I feel like you're just in such a different space right now. And why did you just do this? Because right now, this freestyle you just dropped is going digital. And by the time I log back on Instagram, it's at like, might have been like 100,000 views. Charlemagne is talking about it. I'm getting repose.

Niggins in my comments talking about something. Oh, he's not better than Drake. This down and that. I'm just like, oh, yeah, this is great. Because I proved the point. Y'all are in the comments talking about that. Or his rollout. We're having a conversation about me.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then from now, I'm just like, it's time for me to get back into the groove and just letting the music fly. The swap of my remake was dope too, though. Like, it was the same. I mean, I don't know who did that be, but it. Oh, my guy, Harrison Gilbert.

Yeah, that's a producer I've been working closely with. Yeah, they wasn't letting us upload that version. I was going to ask. You said you had to, you fast. How often do you fast? And how often you... I'm not going to lie. That was my first time ever fast.

It was the most difficult thing I ever did. But the clarity I got from it was like being on drugs. What was the most difficult? The eating in food or the social media delete? At first, it was social media. At first, I was like, oh, my gosh, I felt like a junkie. Like, where I'm in the crib watching the soprano. I binge-watched the Sopranos.

I finished all six seasons. By the second day, I was starving. Hungry as hell. I wanted to do five initially. I was like, I'm not. not doing five days of this. I got to three. And at midnight, on that third night, I got some soup.

And I was just like, let me ease back into it, you know? But it was definitely eating. That was the biggest thing. What was some of the things you saw in the clarity? Like what was more clear for you? Or were you able to see that you didn't see before? A lot of things just be noise. Like, I don't know if y'all seen F1 with Brad Pitt and Dan some issues.

Well, he was basically telling them something, like, put the phone down. That's noise. Like good, bad, and different. It's just noise. Like, we came to drive these cars. If we don't drive these cars well, we're not doing our job. Right. For me, it's like, I used to be so jaded by just socials and opinions and numbers and analytics.

And I'm that kind of person. Like, I'm checking everything. And then I just started to realize like, okay, when I finally got over it all, how much noise it was, which is like, I don't know what's going on in the world. I feel better about everything not known because everything is everything. everywhere all that wants. And it's just like, now we just so desensitized to,

we see death, we see porn, we see everybody got money, but nobody's rich, we see everybody's healthy. AI is just crazy right now. I don't even know what's real.

So when I got off, it's like it was a whole new world. Like nobody, I'm not answering my phone for nobody. You can't tap in with me. I downloaded substack. I just started writing. And that was really the most clarifying thing

from me like, okay we so like we succumb to a pitfall when it comes to these phones and stuff like that and i'm addicted like i was addicted to notifications i would be in a booth like checking my notifications while i'm rapping like just pulling my screen down nobody's texting me nothing i'm just i just keep checking keep checking me letting go on a phone it was the most that's what really gave me all the clarity it's like bro all right life is big than this and in order for you to be who you want to be, you have to realize, like, you hold that power. You can't let nothing else extra.

Hold the power for you. And that's- With slaves are all small phones, man. Man, what? If you listen to Silicon Valley whistleblowers and then listen to, like, tobacco whistleblowers from back in the day, they're, like, having the same conversation. Preaching the same preach. Just different drug.

I still got my phone, though. I got two of them. Let's get into the record, man. Let's play. Let's play, make them pay. Let's play the swapout edition, though. Let's play the swapout edition. Let's get into it right now.

Kai Cash, we appreciate you. Hey, and you know, Kai Cash is one of the featured artists on Naila Samo's honor roll project. That's right. I have already said it. I said that the big three of rap right now, the new big three to me is Ruben Vincent, Marco Plus, Kai Cash. I'm honored to be there. I'm sorry, Chris Patrick.

Because I'm here. I had you in there, but Kai. He talked about y'all at least like three. times a week. No, I love it. I'm happy. Because about the bars. I've seen it. He was not, I'm telling you, he was not a fan. Well, it's Kyle Cash. It's the breakfast club. Good morning.

Every day I wake up. Wake your ass up. The breakfast club. You're all finished or y'all's done? Hi, this is Kylie Breakman. Angel Geratana. Jeremy Colhane. Patrick McDonald. And we're the hosts of the Artists on Artists on Artists on Artists podcast. The Improvised Character Comedy Podcast where each week a new panel of

Artists discuss their craft. Join us for a panel of Eurovision participants. And we do a little Halloween sometimes. Does the Pope dress up? He winks on Halloween. It's right up next to the microphone. I hear you can almost hear the eyelashes hit each other. You never seen Italy so quiet as when the Pope gets up to wink on Halloween.

Listen to Artists on Artists on Artists every Thursday on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the new podcast Solita, we share the messy reality of traveling alone as a woman. I can wait four hours for the next bus or this random dude is offering me a ride on his motorcycle. I chose option B. I'm Julie Pinero and I travel by myself because it's a rare space where I can say yes without asking anyone else first. I'm on a mission to reclaim the word Solita, trading the pity for possibility. Listen to Solita on the IHeart Radio app.

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I survived nine months in captivity, and I've spent my life exploring how other people survive what should have destroyed them. I'm Elizabeth Smart, and these are the Survivor Files. Every week, I'm with survivors who live through the unthinkable, abducted, stalked, controlled, and nearly silenced. These are stories about what it takes to make it out alive.

Listen to the Survivor Files with Elizabeth Smart, on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So by age 11 or so, at least 70% have a phone. I'm Dr. Joy, and this is Therapy for Black Girls. We spend our surviving middle school run getting into what's happening inside your kids' brain, the group chat, and their friendships, and what you can do about it. Your child is not doing this on purpose. That's the kind of perspective we've been pulling from the psychologists

and psychiatrists who studied this for a living. Listen to Therapy for Black Girls on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.