The Breakfast Club - INTERVIEW: Nick Cannon Opens Up On Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Maturity, Legacy + More

Episode Date: September 15, 2025

Today on The Breakfast Club, Nick Cannon Opens Up On Narcissistic Personality Disorder, Maturity, Legacy. Listen For More!YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BreakfastClubPower1051FMSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. I just normally do straight stand-up, but this is a bit different. What do you get when a true crime producer walks into a comedy club? Answer, a new podcast called Wisecrack, where a comedian finds himself at the center of a chilling true crime story. Does anyone know what show they've come to see? It's a story. It's about the scariest night of my life. This is Wisecrack, available now.

Listen to Wisecrack on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Short on time, but big on true crime. On a recent episode of the podcast, Hunting for Answers, I highlighted the story of 19-year-old Lechay Dungey. But she never knocked on that door. She never made it inside. And that text message would be the last time anyone would ever hear from her. Listen to Hunting for Answers from the Black Effect. Podcast Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hi, my name is Enya Yumanzoor. And I'm Drew Phillips. And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom. If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes, we're not the podcast for you. But if you have unmedicated ADHD... Oh my God, perfect. And want to hear people with mental illness, psychobabble. Yes, yes.

Then Emergency Intercom is the podcast for you. Open your free IHeartRadio app. Search Emergency Intercom and listen now. Do you want to hear the secrets of psychopaths, murderers, sex offenders? In this episode, I offer tips from them. I'm Dr. Leslie, forensic psychologist. This is a podcast where I cut through the noise with real talk. When you were described to me as a forensic psychologist, I was like snooze.

We ended up talking for hours and I was like, this girl is my best friend. Let's talk about safety and strategies to protect yourself. your loved ones listen to intentionally disturbing on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Hold on every day I wake up, wake your ass up. The Breakfast Club. If you're all finished or y'all's done. Yep, it's the world's most dangerous morning show The Breakfast Club.

Shalameen to God, DJ, Envy, and Jess aren't here, but Lauren LaRosa is and we got a special guest in the building. A man, I have no problem calling an icon. Oh, I appreciate that, job. No, for real. Nick canned in his head. How you doing, my brother? Man, I'm good.

I mean, I would say the same about you, man. No, not yet. Not yet. Come on, man, quick play it. You know, the reason made me think of that, I was listening to you on Miff Bleak podcast. Oh, okay. Yeah. And I was just like, I don't know if it's because you and Bleak got such history.

Yeah. But I don't know. I feel like I heard a different side of you in that interview. Really? I don't know why. It made me look at things in a different perspective. Not like I didn't always look at you in that way. But I'm like, yo, Nick has really done a lot.

And I remember it was one part you was talking about how you just want to, to do things that were always authentic to you. Yeah, yeah. And it made me start thinking about all the different hats you've worn, a comedian, actor, TV host, rapper, director, executive. And I was just like, damn. Nah, I pre that, especially coming from you, man, because even that conversation,

that was when Miff was up here and he was in. Did she used to be running around with them? But I've been in this game for so long. Like, I've been running through New York since the 90s, you know what I mean? And I used to run with them because we was all kind of young and stuff. and everybody used to look out for me because I was like this kid

that was doing stand-up and rapping and all of that stuff so everybody would look out for me from from Jay to you know Will Smith all of those different people kind of took a liking to me so I've seen the game

since the 90s and to your point man like I've been blessed to be able to do so many different things but it's like time you don't think like damn 30 years have passed you know what I mean

like and I've done I've done so much stuff that I forgot about a lot of times but it's like you know from the movies the TV shows and all that stuff and now I'm just in a space man where I'm just trying to operate and be the best father I can be and you know peace that's it piece is most important which which role feels more most authentically you then and which one do you think people underestimate I think I mean if we're talking like artistry I love acting I mean at at the core but stand-up is what got me on you know what i mean stand-up is what you can do for the rest of your life and it's evolved in

such a way now uh so i'll probably never stop doing that um i there used to be this idea of like oh i want to be the the entrepreneur and the hustler and i and i kind of i did that for like 10 15 years and did it heavy it made a lot of money and it's like it ain't even really about that no more so i if if if i'm talking about my craft i think i really enjoy acting uh but i'm still going to be the businessman than I am. I still, now I'm in that space where I just want to give people opportunities. And so that has kind of almost stepped in front of like how much money I can make. I'm like, yo, how many people can I help? And that's why I say with you, man, I mean, from the black effect to everything you're building in the space as a mental health, like,

it's so necessary and so needed that I don't think you get the flowers as much as you should because you are quietly building culture for this next generation where no, else is doing it like and you're doing it in a way where it's unapologetic and I mean it's it's from somebody who always wanted to do it and literally watched you build it I'm like man that's so dope but you did build it that's what I'm saying like to me the underestimated part about you is your role as an executive because you think about wild and out's going on what 22 seasons yeah yeah yeah like you know people don't may not know the mass singer you're an executive producer of that yeah yeah that was you was like yo let's I brought

it out yeah we got it we took it from uh it was a korean uh property it was a uh and it was a hit over over season we brought it here and now what was season 14 so it's just like but that's a that's to me those are things like i just enjoy it and i guess that's the the business mindset as an executive but to me like that's like i'm so in that space now like i'm probably creating maybe three or four different game shows and stuff like that coming up because because I understand, like, oh, I can have fun doing this, but then at the same time, this is an empty space that you don't really see us in that much.

You were the chairman of teen Nick for 10 years. 10 years. Yeah, yeah. Well, he's over there 1515. I mean, you was over there. That story bugged me up because I didn't realize, well, the Masked Singer story bug me up because I didn't realize you left America's Got Talent.

Talk about that. Yeah, I mean, well, that was, dang, it was so long ago. But, you know, me running my mouth doing some. saying stuff I ain't had no business saying, well, actually I was telling jokes in my stand-up and NBC didn't like it. And they kind of like threatened to fire me. And I was on my Chappelle shit at the time. Like I had been kicking it with him. And I was like, oh, well, I go, well, I quit. And I literally just stepped away from America's Got Talent. Everybody was like, yo, this is the biggest mistake of your entire career. You were making about $20 million a year? Yeah. And it was,

people are like jobs like that don't come around again Howard Stern was trying to convince me to stay and he I'm looking up to him because he told NBC when you know back of the day that he was leaving and all that stuff so and he was like nah man keep that job Simon Cowell everybody was trying to convince me and then I was like nah I know my worth and then I went and created a show over at Fox that was bigger than America's Got Talent when you posted about you leaving agency back all those years ago yeah you had said that at one point you were in a dark place about trying to figure out the decision yeah because everybody was like against me like my entire team and I'm like what am I making a bad decision because I'm literally trying to stand up for freedom of speech

and stand up from my culture and all of that stuff and it was like wait I feel like I'm making the right decision but nobody they're like nah man you got to this is how the game works and you you're the highest paid hosts on television and all that stuff you step away from that you know the industry's not going to rock with you no more and i just stood 10 toes down but it was definitely a dark place because i mean and and that's happened a few times in my career so like at at certain points it's like oh i know what this is it's a cycle you know what i mean so long as i can always stay true to myself uh then it ain't never going to be an issue with me but it was scary you know when them first times happened you don't know like dang is this over dang how am i go

feed my family from this point on if everybody around me agents manager everybody's like nah you got to figure this out but you know luckily you believe in in yourself definitely plays off what did you learn about like how to navigate the race conversations working with corporations from that because I know the joke was it was you jokingly saying yeah I said NBC's for a nigga be careful it's true they proved you right right and they didn't like that but Again, and we had several conversations, you know, closed door, and it was just, it was, when you feel something isn't authentic, you just kind of know like, yo, I'm going to just trust my gut. And sometimes, because I don't think there was any malice, even from their side and stuff, they're trying to protect their brand. And then it was part of me that just, at that time in my life, I was soapboxing so heavy.

You know what I mean? I wanted to pontificate. I wanted to, and that's the energy. I think even a lot of us was on when it was really just like, yo, we're standing up for us and we ownership and all of that. And I think rightly so, it was a good decision at the time. But now that I'm a little more mature and all that stuff, it's like, yo, you definitely got to know how to pick your battles,

even though I won that one. And, you know, I would encourage people to always, stand firm in who you are and what you represent but that can it can drain you so much you know what I mean and and like I said it's only by the grace of God that you know I am able to continue on and continue to keep going and not stopping so but yeah man at this point man I'm just I'm chilling I'm just like I'm just like I said peace is the most important thing to me oh that was my question I got another one I got I mean we can go anywhere I don't want to take a goal off of that. I guess talk about peace, right? You talk about things that drain you. When you

picking and choosing these shows and people you work with, now, you today, because I know you've had a lot of situations that worked and didn't work, artists, you've tried to help and things of that nature. Yeah. The people business is really tricky when it comes to peace. So has there been people that have come to the canon? And the canon is like, yeah, I'm not letting you dream my energy. Uh, yeah, all the time. I mean, but more than anything, especially when you're dealing with talent, they got to want it more than you do. I'm made the mistake a lot of times where I see something in somebody or see the vision and I'm like man they got it but they don't actually work hard enough the talent is clearly there

but they don't know what it takes and then they feel like oh well I'm with Nick so I'm good and it gets to a space where you know I'm spending millions of millions of dollars on different artists and different projects and stuff and they don't go because the energy on it from the standpoint of who you're trying to help, they not believing in themselves 100% yet. So now, even more than talent, I look for someone's drive. And if they really got it and they do it. And I

think even when you look at what the labels and stuff are doing, that's what they pay attention. They don't do shit no more. But they pay attention to who has the motion. They pay attention to who has the drive because then all they got to do is throw bread behind that and then it's going to go. But they

don't develop nothing no more. And to be honest, I mean, JD said is a lot of time they didn't back in a day they didn't develop they just had cats like JD or puff or you know all of those different you know black own labels that they were the ones that did the developing and then they had the relationship with the majors so you know that's the idea now to where it's so much entertainment so much content out there now that our curation system is the thing that's the most important I mean that's why y'all are who y'all are because this is the only space to really pull up and actually curate and understand, like,

yo, if they said it on a breakfast club or if we heard about it there, then that's we don't have too many other spots that actually can do that anymore. I feel like Wail and Out has been a curation space too. Like, you know, and it's become like this cultural institution for hip hop and comedy. And I always wonder, what's the one decision you made early on that you think, like, ensured the longevity of Wile and Out. Damn. Um, listening to the young folk more than anything.

I mean, while and that was a journey in itself, too, because nobody believed in that. That was something I had to invest in on myself. Luckily, that was early MTV days. Like, I was, you know, hosting TRL and all the spring breaks and all of that type of stuff. And they gave me a deal. And they wanted me to do, like, some punk type of show, because that's when Ashton was popping at the time. And I was like, now I want to bring my friends together and mix hip hop and comedy. improv together and they didn't understand it and so I went shot it with my own money uh and then

they got it but then I owned it so then from that standpoint that obviously probably was the best decision of just making sure that I own my IP from the gate and then I think we did like a strong four seasons and then you know I got married and things start shifting up between you know MTV and there was MTV 2 was created and all of that and so when I brought it back but MTV 2 and MTV 2 was really like the hip-hop MTV. We kind of just, you know, ran that channel. I mean, that's what me and Charlotte really got down back then because that we was just making whatever we wanted to do on MTV 2.

It was like we'd literally be over there and they kind of gave us free reign to kind of be creative. And that was a time, you know what I mean? That was like mid-2000s. And from there, I think the longevity just finding cats, like, you know, the 85 South crew and, you know, hitman holla and conceded and Justina and all. Like, they kind of keep the brand going where even from the gate, from even the Cat Williams days and the Kevin Hart days, I've always been a dude that just fell back and let everybody else shine.

You remember we was going to do, they were going to bring your MTV rapts back. Yeah. And we were executive producing that. Yeah. We did it a couple of times. We got, the crazy thing, it was the hosts were going to be Jesus and M. Mero and we had it on That's crazy

And we had it on a bus We were it was they were sending We got this big ass tour bus and we sent them All over and me and Charlotte was Executive Producers Academics in there too Yeah yeah yeah It was gonna be like a correspondence

Yeah, yeah But that's a thing where we've had the opportunity over the years It's just generate stuff And some of it works, some of it stick And then some of it don't But yeah man like to have something like Wile and Out kind of just have the longevity that it has is, it's crazy.

So just now, you were saying the IP for WALL and Out you own. Yeah, yeah. So can you explain the bad, what was it, the bad versus wild? Oh. How does that happen? And like, how is MTV or whoever able to come to you and say you stole? Well, we're partners. We're still partners in it.

So it's like, because you got to understand, too, especially when you're dealing with like Paramount, Paramount is a publicly traded company. so even within nomad like there's still an ownership percentage got you okay you know what i mean so and if and i think i talked about this when i was here here before like if you own a hundred percent of something and your partner ain't supporting you then you never going to win so i've always valued them as my partners but it's always going to be stuff to where you know i try to move with autonomy a lot of times because like it's mine but still got to make sure that the the attorneys are talking to everybody and stuff because they're just trying to protect their brain and because it is

on their networks it is associated with them so I can't just go run wild and do something and they didn't approve it and stuff like that so you know but that's just the business have you have you been able to talk about and figure out what all it is because there were reports of them being upset the lawsuit them that was but none of that stuff I don't even think that was really real I mean I mean it was real but I think it didn't really have anything to do with me okay they didn't they never sued Nah, not me. I mean, well, you know what? I don't, not me. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know what, I think there's some, there was something between Zeus in Paramount that if you notice, like, I was never named in it. So I kind of always just fell back. And the whole time that happened, I'm talking, you know, everybody at Paramount is my people. So they're like, but they're like, look, we got to make sure we're protecting. And they're like, look, we're trying to protect you as well. So you know how it is. Like, that's just business. business and you that that never that type of stuff I've I've had like real issues legally that was never like a real thing that people come out strong when people

think that people are playing with you because then people are like he's done so much and he's been doing it for so long yeah so people thought that it involves you so people were really pissed off like how would they do that to him when we only know whiling out because of Nick Cannon yeah and I think because at the end of the day you know and that was me and Lim trying to I was just listening to limb like because I really respect what he what he built and he was like man I want to do something you know where I have all of our talent kind of act like they doing while and out and I was like all right why not you know what I mean that seems like that could be dope he's always doing

offshoots and stuff but I guess there was some history between you know Zeus and paramount that I was like man I ain't getting involved in none of that stuff so but but it all worked out I think there was a lot and that at this industry you know how that goes too there's people start putting out press releases and things like that and that stuff makes more noise than what actually happens and i think even they figured it out super quickly uh but it you know once the headlines hit everybody was like oh it's good it's going down and you know because you know right now like whaling out we got brand new episodes airing right now but it had it it was kind of on hiatus for a second so they were like what's going on is it going to get and it was like nah it was just that was

the interim of getting to the new episodes. So it all worked itself out. I love it. I want to go back to something. So you're all doing new episodes. Yeah, yeah. Okay, okay, okay. Yeah, we got new ones running right now.

And that's, I think it come on every Monday night, VH1, and then obviously all of this, you know, YouTube and all of that type of stuff. But they, we rocking right now. It's going to, it's going heavy. I'm not going to lie. I felt a little way about the new Paramount ownership. Not because I know anything about them. It's just that that was all home for us.

a long time. For a long time. A guy's like Chris McCarthy and Paul Richie's. Yeah. Yeah. It was our people. Those are people in a real way. So I see like that just regime gone.

Like yeah, got hurt a little bit. I'm not going to front. Hey, man, I was right. Like you said, I was over 15, 15 for 10 years. You're like so it's like it's an end of an era. But it's like I think the new regime is they're trying to hold time. I thought they was going to sell everything. Like, I thought they was going to sell BET, Nickelodeon.

Yeah. And they said, nah, we're going to keep it and we're going to redevelop. They're trying to redevelop MTV and actually turn it back into a music brand and stuff. So I'm like, and they got the bag. So, hey, I salute them. And like I said, we're about to diversify while and out in such a way that obviously, you know, my main focus is being international. And even there's an education platform. that I've been working on from the gate for like a lot of the public school systems and even the HBCUs to where

trying to build a curriculum based off of you know improv and and the our ability and so like the same way that you have the groundlings or the same way that you have a second city we can have that in our communities to where you can go to the wild and out theater down the street and learn how you know all the principles and concepts of how to how to be a performer and how to do live improv and things like that and then that becomes an incubation system for new talent so where i used to just go online and be like y'all who's the funniest kid who got who nice as a as a battle rapper now i can literally say i have schools in various cities that are training and developing young people with all of the concepts of, you know, funny comedians, hip-hop,

but at the same time, teaching them principles about, you know, just pure education. I think somebody like you could do that so well because you're in that middle point of like you know and feel and are real talent and understand what developing that. It's like, but also you're like of the now. Like, you know what's happening right now. And a lot of times it's like a disconnect. Yeah.

Just listening to you talk about that made me think about a conversation me and Charlemy were having about Marlon Wayans on Kaisanite Stream. And just the reaction to, I said that Marlon was way better than Kai on the stream. And I'm like, and I didn't, I didn't say it in a way like I didn't expect him to be. Yes, you did. No, you didn't. No, you didn't. He didn't hear the full conversation. I said, I know it's Marlon Wayans, but he was way better than Kyle on the stream.

But it would be, it would be so dope to see stuff like that bridge more because younger people get to see like he really does this like, but younger people don't know Marlon Wayans. And I understand that. actor, stand-up comedian, 30-plus years in the game. Of course he's going to be better than guy. They know who he is, but I think sometimes people don't understand how putting your reps in doing everything that Marlon Wands has been brought up doing his whole life, prepares you to do whatever you want very well because a lot of us get on stream or get online and numbers go and we're just here, we're figuring it out.

So to see somebody who's really talented like him be with Kaj and I, who's also talented, but, you know, like it's like a variety show. Just levels. Yeah, but it was just fire to see them together. I hear what you're saying and you're 100% right to where that's what we should be doing as a community. Taking our OGs and putting them with our young guys and saying like, look, we're going to polish you. And that's really what while and out always was. And that's even why I switched it from like old school and new school because it's like we want all of that energy because Kai and them, they got their finger on the pulse of what's going on.

They got all of the young people. but there's also a process of being seasoned and longevity in this and somebody like Marlon like that's my OG that's big bro like I I've looked up to him my entire career because it's like yo that dude has done it all you know what I mean from start

it's like so much stuff that we forgot a lot of times but let's start in several black blockbuster movies and TV shows and so it's effortless for him because he this is what he do that's what I'm saying not that people don't know him but I think a lot of younger people don't even understand

the preparation. With actual talent? Yes. That is what you're saying. That is exactly what I'm saying. The only thing about the Kais and that's of the world, we don't even know what they're going to do yet. This is just their platform that's introducing them.

We don't know what them skillsets are yet. Like the little dude Reggie that be doing the comedy, I think he's hilarious. I'm looking at him like he should be in movies and TV. Like that's what I see for him. But then I can see that for Kai as well. Nah, because Kai came on wilding out early on. It's funny.

my kids put me up on Kai back in the day and he was like dad you gotta put Kai on while now we put him on and he rocked it and I was this was before all of the stuff and I was like yo man you want to be on the show and he was like man you know how much money y'all make it right now I was like I get it you know because I was like right at the beginning but I was trying to you know from the Kai's to the Drewski's you know

like when they first started bubbling I'm always seeing who's now I remember even I show speed my son put me up on him when he was like 16 he was like and like we was talking to his parents and everything trying to figure out it was a way to put a 16 year old on while and out and all that stuff so you they they communicate with the youth in such a way that we don't even know how to do it at all like it's like I don't know what the algorithm is or the from the clipping all that stuff but they're communicating differently so I'm just trying to figure that out because that is truly a talent in itself and then if they're gifted on top of that whether it's musically whether it's you know

even like i said somebody like speed i mean that dude is a a natural athlete and has turned probably made more money just doing what he does than any professional athlete could because he just been able to figure it out internationally yeah and it's like i'm i'm so in all those young dudes and what they're doing like you said they they just now building their platform and they're teenagers they're you know what I mean imagine what they'll be you know five 10 years that's fire what you're trying to do that's what I mean to say it's like not that they're not talented but they need what you're trying to do exactly and that's why I don't think we're supposed to figure them out like they have their audience right yeah every now and then they invite

unc over and yeah have fun also uncle put you in a movie yeah can put you on TV like you know if that's what you want to do yeah that's why I love the relationship Kevin got with them because that's the way I see it nah that's real and that's That's how we all came up. You know what I mean? Even when I was creating wild and out and stuff, like I said, I was talking to cast like, you know, Jamie Fox and Marlin and all of them. And they were like, yo, they was giving me advice. And I was, you know, paying attention to the game when I was a teenager around them.

So then when I got my opportunities to be an executive or get deals and produce stuff, I had already knew how to do it. So it's like it's the same thing. We just got to pass the information over to the young boys. Do you see yourself as a bridge building for the next generation? Yeah, I never really thought of it like that. I mean, like I said, when I see what you're building, I was like, yo, that's needed. I think at some point I was on that for a minute, but then it's like I just got to focus on what's working. And then so I know how important while and out is to the culture.

So I can build those bridges through that. I can continue to be the conduit for those spaces. But I don't know if it's still, like, trying to build for the culture as much as it's just really just trying to do the best work I could possibly do. I don't know why you're acting like you don't do that. Like, wild an out does that, bro. Yeah, yeah. You also do that by the talent that you choose the work with, too, and some of the projects that you develop. You help a lot of people be able to do things.

But Matt Reifke came from Wile and Out. Yeah, 85 South Day was already doing their thing. Pete, all that. Pete, Dave, all of that stuff. Hope you amplify their profiles, yes. Yeah, I mean, but it's definitely, and that's why I say, like, probably I can focus on that and, like I said, everything I'm trying to build. But before, you know, like when we, I was, you know, the executive over there at Viacom and all that stuff,

it was just like we were just trying to build stuff for us, you know what I mean, and see how much we can, and they was allowing us to do it, you know what I mean? So we were just trying to put on for the culture where now I think, you know, As I've gotten a little older, it's like I got to pick and choose where to put my energy. Because if I'm just, there was a point where I was like, I want to give everybody a deal. And I want to sign it. And I want to figure, like, I'll be trying to figure out how can I build a streaming platform and how can I do? And it's like, oh, a lot of that stuff is so draining when you can just focus on what's working and rock like that.

Well, you got the Nick at Night Show now. Yeah. Late night space. Why late night space this time? I think, I mean, I'll be honest. They kind of, you know, Amazon came at. me and was like yo you should do this and i was like it was a fun you know uh take on how to flip late night and almost like late night radio that used to be like the call in advice

for relationship and sex and stuff like that so it was a cool uh we do it at you know a spot that uh i have ownership in in hollywood and it's just like a cool little date night vibe to where you know we bring in a professional uh whether it's a therapist or a psychologist and you know They give the real advice, and I'm just there for the commentary. But it's super dope because then I do man on the street bits with it and all that stuff. So it's just another thing to do, again, something to have fun with. But, you know, when they presented it to me, I was like, all right, let's get it. I saw you on this end you don't believe in, you don't like the term co-parenting?

I think that was, again, they clickbait. I think what I said, but in that sense, what I was saying, I was like, it's parenting. You know what I mean? I think we start, you know, trying to come up with all of these. phrases that kind of like, no, we just, let's just be the best parents we can possibly be, because then once you start trying to define what co-parenting is, and then it's like, then that diminishes what our experience is just as parents. You know what I mean? I think everybody wants to be the best parents to their child. So I was just saying, I don't like all of these terms that society just

starts putting on there, especially, you know, based off of the... My name is Ed. Everyone say, hello, Ed? from a very rural background myself my dad is a farmer and my mom is a cousin so like it's not what do you get when a true crime producer walks into a comedy club

I know it sounds like the start of a bad joke but that really was my reality nine years ago I just normally do straight stand-up but this is a bit different on stage stood a comedian with a story that no one expected to hear 22nd of July 2015 a 23 year old man

had killed his family and then he came to my house. So what do you get when a true crime producer walks into a comedy club? A new podcast called Wisecrack where stand-up comedy and murder

takes center stage. Available now. Listen to Wisecrack on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Hunter, host of Hunting for Answers on the Black Effect Podcast Network. Join me every weekday as I share bite-sized stories of missing and murdered black women and girls in America.

There are several ways we can all do better at protecting black women. My contribution is shining a light on our missing sisters and amplifying their disregarded stories. Stories like Tamika Anderson. As she drove toward Galvez, she was in contact with several people, talking on the phone as she made. her way to what should have been a routine transaction. But Tamika never bought the car, and she never returned home that day. One podcast, one mission, save our girls. Join the searches we explore the chilling cases of missing and murdered black women and girls.

Listen to hunting for answers every weekday on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, my name is Enya Umanzor. And I'm Drew Phillips. And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom. If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes, we're not the podcast for you. But if you have unmedicated ADHD... Oh my God, perfect.

And want to hear people with mental illness, psychobabble. Yes, yes. Then Emergency Intercom is the podcast for you. Open your free IHeartRadio app. Search Emergency Intercom. and listen now do you want to hear the secrets of serial killers psychopaths pedophiles robbers they are sitting there waiting for the vulnerable thing they're waiting for the unprotected i'm dr leslie forensic psychologist i advocate for safety and awareness of predators while wearing pink

when you were described to me as a forensic psychologist i was like snooze we ended up talking for hours and i was like this girl is my best friend this is a podcast where i cut through the noise with sarcasm, satire, and hard truths. I'm not going to fake it and force it for me. But would you force an orgasm? Because that's like a different layer. The car accident you didn't want to see but couldn't turn away from. In this episode, I discussed personal safety and self-defense, tools, instincts and strategies

to protect yourself and your loved ones in everyday life and high-risk situations. Listen to intentionally disturbing on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts they throw terms at me constantly so I was like why why can't it just be parenting like why does it but that it there's a negative connotation sometimes that it goes and like I've never had a bad experience so I'd rather just like no we parent together like that just sounds you know a little better than what co-parenting co-parenting sounds like you got lawyers involved and stuff like that which the people who do that that's that's cool but it's like I feel like if we're really getting to the core of it, parenting is what we're doing. I saw or read the interview that

Mariah Care did with Harper's Bazaar where she talked about wanted to really be fair in you guys' parenting situation because like, you know, grown up with parents who are not together anymore is really difficult. Yeah. Your kids are getting older now. Have they ever come to you and been like dad? Like, why are y'all not together? Uh, when they were a little younger. Really? Yeah, but now, you know, they're 14. They kind of get it. And we've always had a great relationship. I mean, even with Mariah saying like I've always we've been present you know so even in that sense where I remember when they were probably like 10 11 that's kind of when they would say you know can you guys get married again and all that stuff and because when they see us as a family it looks you know like

this is this is what it should be but you know as like I said they're 14 now so they kind of they understand that it's just it's a little it's it's not picture perfect but it's their family and they love it. And then there was another clip. People love coming for you in the parenting stuff. They do. Does it ever get to a point where you're just like, what the hell?

Like I'm over it. Everything you say. Not really because it's like, it's been that way for years. Like, I've never, like, I... It's been that way since you've had 12 kids. No, but even before... I feel like it's heightened because you make the kids.

I mean, but it's always been able to like, from the stuff that we was talking about early, that they always like, I'll say something. my mouth would get me in trouble or something and then it's like I got to clear it up and so a few years back I'm like I ain't even worried about clearing that stuff up especially when I have so many platforms of my own that it's just like well as long as they're promoting it

I'm not even tripping so because I'm going to I'm going to speak my truth and if you know I'm only responsible for what I say and not for what you understand yeah because there was a clip of you talking about your daughters and who you want your daughters to date and even with that I was like when you listen to what he was trying to say and understanding you're just taking accountability yeah you changed a lot or the man you are now is who you want your kids to date not who you were oh yeah we get a topic about that yeah yeah yeah and most men if you asked them honestly would you be like yo would you want your daughters to date a young boy like you yeah they're gonna be like no you know but in that sense like as we mature you're gonna be like look dad did a bunch of stuff made a lot of mistakes please don't find somebody like that but find somebody that is gonna treat you right and do the and that's that's that's

that's all I was saying in that sense it was like I was taking accountability and just saying like yeah I do have five daughters and I want them to make way better choices than I made and I think that's what every parent wants I would want my daughters to have the he the version of me that went on a healing journey right that version if you could find that early yeah because I know a lot of my home girls not time they won't even date a guy who's not trying to do some work on themselves yeah even the therapy or something big fact and that's I think you know we obviously share that same energy of like therapy has changed our lives in such a way. Absolutely. Because I used to feed off of toxicity. You know, I used to, you know, from being diagnosed as a narcissist and all that. Like, I would like, that's the type of stuff. It was like my ego. Yeah.

Yeah. The TikTok girl is going to love that. I don't know why I didn't know you got. Like, how does that work? It's a process. You got it. One, you got to have the. write a psychiatrist or even psychologist they both can do it but it's like a three week process to

where you got to they do a in-person verbal uh interview that you got to answer all of these questions at a certain pace then you got to fill out these forms then you got to write uh and not like they're they're not trick questions but they're questions that you know from one to 10 how do you do this how would you handle this in this situation and then they take it takes about a month to come back and then it's a spectrum and it tells you you where you land on the spectrum of MPD. And, you know, luckily, like, the far end of the spectrum where people, a lot of people, you know, associate narcissism with, where there's the lack of empathy and rage, I didn't have those.

Like, those are the things where, like, people just, you know, they're so into themselves that it's dangerous. but all of the you know the self-worth and you know believing that who you are and that you're you know a unique individual and your word matters more than most like I had all of that and you know what I mean so that you have to do the work now once you've been diagnosed you're like oh wow so even in dealing with my children or dealing with the mothers of my children is like now I'm equipped with saying oh yeah I'm probably gaslighting when I'm doing that or oh you know what I could probably present this a little softer or at least with a little bit more compassion because my nature is to be like, what, I created this, I'm this, I'm that.

And then it's like, but that's not helping, you know what I mean? We're not looking for resolution. I'm just looking to be right and really feeding my ego. So I've learned all of that type of stuff and it's helped me become a better parent and a better partner in many scenarios. When? Yeah. That was maybe like two years ago.

And then, because you ever heard of Dr. Amon? No. I think you had to see him because he's all online, but he does all of these brain scans. He's a brain psychiatrist. And he has, it's called the aiming clinics, and they did like this whole brain scan on me. And I'm thinking like, oh, I'm going to be, I'm going to have a genius brain and all of this stuff. And turns out, like, I had, like, severe brain damage in my frontal lobe. What?

And like, he said I'm the poster child for ADHD, which I kind of always knew, but I believe it came from, you know, in the brain scans. He did a whole episode on his platform about it, but it actually, they said there was like some trauma probably when I was a kid that, whether I fell or something like that, that actually shifted. And from that, you know, he was like, you were probably already ADHD, but because your frontal lobe was damaged. and then there was like some other we can have toxicity of the brain too a lot of time so there's like whether it's like and we don't even know it in our communities like everything from like mold and all of that stuff can actually affect how we function and you know obviously you know it's the gut to mind ratio like just the stuff we're putting in our bodies actually affects our mind so I learned all of this stuff within like the last two years about like having a better brain

and having, you know, being able to control your mind and accept the things that you've been diagnosed with, but also know that you can get better. What made you want to go? Wow. Yeah, it's crazy. I'm tripping because, like, you know, when you started having a bunch of the kids, right?

There's a lot of people around me that's in the mental health space, spiritual leaders. They would talk to me, one person in particular, and I'm not going to say her name, and she was like, he has narcissistic personality disorder, blah, blah, blah. I'm like, Nick. Because to your point, when I think of narcissism, I think of lack of empathy.

I think of rage. I'm like, that's not Nick. Yeah, nah. She called it. So to hear you say that is like, wow. Nah, and it's true, you know what I mean? Because it's like, there's certain things, especially on the spectrum where I had to own up and be like, man, I did do that. You know what I mean?

I did try to make it all about me. I did try to create my own. And like, those are the concepts we used to embrace. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, I'm the boss. I created this. It's my world. The chick's got a, you know, falling in line and all of that stuff.

Yeah. Yeah, so, but what? What's the wrong to me? Yeah. He was hitting the things, huh? I don't know what I'm saying. That ain't how you had the kids, but yeah, that was a process. That's part of it.

So what, you baby mama number 12? I'm Nick Cannon. But that's, I mean, you learn, man. But I was on that. You know what I mean? I was on that for a long, long period of time. And a lot of it. That's scary.

Obviously, too, a lot of it, if we're being completely honest, a lot of it is the trauma that I was experiencing of not knowing how to handle divorce. You know what I mean? And like me acting out because I'm like, oh, I'm the man now. And instead of healing and doing what I should have actually did, I just jumped out there. And because I had everything from whaling out and all of it. all the things is like I those were all distractions from the actual work that I probably should.

That's a question. Did you feel like you are two things. Did you feel like you failed because the marriage failed? Or did you, were you worried about what the industry would think? Because the industry was already on some, how did Nick Cannon get Mariah anyway? Yeah, I think it was a little bit of both. Like I said, I hadn't did the work.

You know what I mean? So I was just like, just long as I could keep moving. You know what I mean? Like long. And I didn't get a chance to slow down until I got in therapy but I was just like look I just got to keep making money I got to stay hot I got to stay funny and everything else to figure itself out and I just didn't do the work so then I looked up you know 12 kids later and I'm like wow I could have did things very differently but you know I stand firm on all of my decisions because you know I love all my kids I love my family

infrastructure, but I know it all started from a place of pain and not really healing properly. And, you know, because I had access to everything. So I just allowed that to kind of cloud of my decision making. So you think having all those kids was a response to your trauma? Yeah, 100. Now that, now I'm learning that now. Yeah. And it wasn't like I was acting out.

It was more of being careless, being frivolous with my process because I could do it, because I had the money, because I had the access to whoever and however I wanted to move. And, you know, okay, they're coming at me. They're asking me, opposed to like doing a mature thing and saying, hey, well, we probably make. It's more sense to do this. And then obviously, life happens as well. So it wasn't by, it wasn't like, oh, I'm going to go have 12 kids. It was more about like, yo, I'm going to just live life and have fun. And whatever happens, happens, I can handle it when it probably, you know, being almost 45 now, I can sit back and be like, yeah, if I would have thought the process through a little bit more and took time to actually do the inner work, things might have been a little different in certain scenario.

You wouldn't have 12 kids. I don't know. I don't know. That's the only thing because every, and I've always said this, every child that I had was made out of love and there were strong relationships. It's just, it was, if I would have did the work in the healing after getting divorced, I probably would have took my time and a lot of other scenarios. And for whatever reason, I thought that was the answer. a lot of times it's like oh I'm gonna just I'm gonna figure it out over here I'm gonna figure it out over here opposed to like you know now you're now you're leaving trauma every every step of the way instead of you know fixing it from its origin and then being able to present itself but then I still I mean like concepts like monogamy and stuff like that I still feel the same way about that you has your view on that change then nah not really not for me you know and that again that probably that's the the the the work of, you know, whether you want to go back to, like, Freud's process of, like, my childhood and my upbringing. I grew up in a very unorthodox situation in households, so I've always understood that, you know, love happens differently. So monogamy has never really been my thing, but so I'm pretty sure there's a, that plays a part

of it as well, too. how the women that are that you have kids with how do they handle the healed version of you now because in the trauma you're talking about i'm sure they're coming to you with conversations that you're having differently now than you were before you started to take time yeah i mean shots out to all my therapists uh because you got One for each. Not real tough. Yeah. No, not because there's, you know, I'm definitely, I have family therapy with some of my kids. You know what I mean? Because they have to understand that this is an unorthodox, you know,

non-traditional scenario. And I want them to be in the healthiest space as possible. Then I have my own personal. Then I actually do do relationship, you know, therapy as well. So. With who? Depending on who. There's been, sometimes it works.

You hear I say young boys, he said depending on who. He's stupid. Hey, you're bearing back. Don't beer back. He's trying to take you back. That's ego. Yeah, yeah. That's going to hand that.

You didn't need that. You didn't need that. You didn't need that. No, but in the sense, because I've, you know, through, you know, through trial and error, what I've learned with the mothers of my children, they, sometimes they'll say, can we go to therapy together? And I say, of course, you know, so then they get a safe space to present, you know, their issues with me and what. what I'm doing and you know I I retreat a lot of times in my nature that's a lot of that's that's one of my defense mechanisms is that I just be like I don't want to deal with it so I've learned that all right if we can have a safe setting to where and I say I'll whoever you pick you know because

I have my own you know counseling and things like that but if they find somebody that they like and they want to invite me in then we'll sit and we'll do that and we that's so I feel like that's once Because there's so many, once you, and what that does, that gives you the tools to know how to communicate with each other. Right. And there's like, because there's even things that there's like, there's a gap, the goutment theory, they call like the four horsemen that I would teach this to anybody who's in any kind of relationship because those are the four. The goutman theory? Yeah, it's like the four, the four things to avoid when having a disagreement with your partner. And it's like, I think the first one is like, obviously, criticism.

And criticism turns into, it just spirals and it gets into this space where you find yourself arguing more than actually finding the solution of what the actual issue is. So if you can, instead of just instantly saying, well, you made me feel like this, it's like, well, can I share with you how I'm feeling right now? And then in those things where you can actually get to the resolution and the solution so much faster, but you can allow yourself. and moat and then it's almost even like presenting to your partner and be like you know what i really appreciate i see you trying here here here here here and here but can we work on this this this and this and then when you can find somebody that you can communicate with like that it actually you really won't have any problems because you all you have the same goals and agenda so you just go about it in different ways emotionally i know you got to go because they say you got to go 1030

but i was going to ask so how do you deal with the women you have kids with dating other people, especially with, like, Mariah Care, right? It's very public, potentially her, Anderson Pack. Do y'all have conversations about who they're dating, when they meet the kids? Like, is that normal traditional for you? Yeah, I mean, I don't have no problems with it. It never really did. I mean, I think, you know, obviously Mariah has been in a few relationships, you know, since

we've been divorced. It's always been cool, you know what I mean? And, you know, and even making sure that it's healthy for our kids as well. and they've handled all of it, you know, extremely well. And even, you know, there's a few other mothers of my children who have relationships and stuff. And it's like, again, probably if you would, I mean, I think I probably, if you go back a couple interviews, the last time I was in here, there was times where I was like, nah, this is mine. She can't, she can't be with all of them.

Yeah, yeah, like, if she, go do what you want to do. I'm not, but now I'm in a space. was like, I just want everybody to be healthy and happy. And if someone else can make you happy, please, by all means, you know, long, and especially if it's going for the betterment of our child, like, yeah, like a lot of times that I see that as, as, you know, help in that sense to where because you want the mother to be in the, the most healed and healthy space that she can possibly be in and whatever gets you there then that's what it should be now of course the the little bit of ego that that uh I struggle with each and every day is like I want to make sure if you want to

be with me then I want to be with you and we can you know reciprocate that energy but I'm not going to force anybody to to be you know down with me if you don't want to but you know if you do I appreciate that you never wanted to get a divorce did you uh I don't know that's that's complicated now obviously no like the easy question is like nah like that you say I felt like a complete failure on so many different levels because of that but I also knew it was probably that's what was it was best for you know specifically our kids and and kind of being able to be the best parents we could be so it was a tough decision it was definitely a tough decision but but I wouldn't change it you know what I mean looking back I think it was the it was the right decision and I think you know when I look at all of the amazing things Mariah's doing right now I was like yo that's that's dope you know what I mean like she's in such a a wonderful space and you know I'm doing I the kids are thriving so I'm like we we did we made the best decision for us because I don't know if it would have been that way if I would

have been the immature young dude I was trying to figure it all out back then and it's just while because you know you said you your trauma response was to go out there and be with as many women as possible but if in that moment you would have just said maybe even the Mariah or whoever you hurt my feelings right like you know my feelings are hurt that you know what because so hard for men to say it is and to me it was it's like I hurt my feelings and that's what I didn't I couldn't understand because I the decision I was so insecure and really letting the outside noise

get to me in that sense of like where people were calling me like a boy toy and that I was the and then I felt like I watched my own existence kind of

get put in the shadow and so I didn't know how to deal with that so then there was this the ego in me was acting out where opposed to like and I was trying

you know what I mean I was like no I can do it I can hold it down but it was just eating away at me It was like, I don't feel like I'm being myself. I don't feel like I'm getting an opportunity. And I can't be in somebody's shadow my entire, like I want to make money. I want to be a CEO.

I want to be a billionaire, all of that stuff. And it was, I was having all these experiences that I was creating on my own. Like, it wasn't reality. Like, I was the one making all of this stuff up. Like, I had a loving wife who just loved me and we had amazing. But I was like, nah, I got to wear suits every day. And I got to be like, I'm the ball. And it just created this monster in me that, you know, took me in a direction that I really didn't have to go in.

But the ego of wanting to be the man in my household, wanting to be the man in the industry, wanting to prove everybody wrong, that took over. And then therefore, you know, years later, looking back in lots of therapy, like, oh, man, that was purely my narcissistic. ego really tearing me down, which was really all of these insecurities that I had never worked through. Do you ever have times where you like slip back into it? Because we did a segment up here where Mariah Care was saying that she wished she had dated Tupac. Oh, yeah.

And then Charlotte joke like, she didn't need Tupac. She had the legend Nicholas Kennedy. And I saw you reposted it. But you reposted it. Yeah. And when you reposted it, I was like, oh, okay, Nick Cannon, like, stop playing with him. But I mean, the thing also, Charlie knows this about me. Like, I'm, I'm all for the jokes.

I'm all for the good time. Like, you, I'm never going, nothing can make me mad. You know what I mean? So, like, that type, and, you know, it's funny. Like, even in our house, like, Mara used to have, like, literally the picture of Tupac in the bubble bath. She had a big, giant version. She used to tell you, she was like, where? And, uh, I think, you know, one of the, like, one of the bathrooms or something like that.

But it's like, women love Tupac. Like, that ain't, like, that's one of them things. You can't, you ain't never going to be able to compare yourself to Tupac. You never asked her like, why this picture, all the pictures? You know, it was a David LaChapelle picture, and then she got a relationship with him and all that stuff. But I get it. I wasn't intimidated, by it. I mean, I got abs too.

Do you have a little of Will Smith ever bond over that? Oh, my God. Now I understand Nick at night in the show and the love and the relationship and the advice and all that stuff with you. Because you here right today, I'm like, okay, I get it. I'm like, why is he doing a relationship? It's so funny, too, because when people hear like, oh, Nick Cannon giving advice, I'm not giving no advice. Like, if anything, I can give insight, but there's professionals there that are giving a real advice. But it's just, I'm going through a healing process.

I'm working, and a lot of the therapists that you see on there are therapists that I've actually really worked with in the past and kind of done stuff. So I know their history and that, and they can actually really help. And that's just the same thing that, I mean, Charlotte does this as well. I was like, we just got to encourage doing the work in therapy and especially for black men because we look at it as a bad thing. We look at it as like, yo, you must be crazy or something wrong with you where it's like, nah, man, it's really saved my life in so many aspects. From relationships to personal work to, you know, working through trauma, it's made me a better person.

So if I can offer up platforms from whether it's the council culture platform, where there's Nick Cannon at night where I can introduce psychologists and therapists to the space and people embrace it, I'm with it. You inspired me. I need to dig deeper. I want to talk to that guy that you talked about that did the brain scan

and Dr. Amen. And diagnosed you with the narcissistic I don't want to talk about it. He wasn't the one that did the MPD but he was like he actually helped me because when he found out that I got diagnosed with MPD called me and he was like he was like you he's like you definitely have MPD

but I believe it's because of your brain and not because of the decisions that you make. And so that actually helped me understand it because that's, because once somebody labels you with something, then you're like, oh, and he was like, no, you actually, he's like, we can fix all of that. And then so he actually, you know,

gave me a process of like how to, you know, physically work through all of that trauma and actually have a healthier brain. My last question. if you had a child with every woman you ever had sex with, how many kids would you have? Damn! I don't know.

That's it. Like, I don't, every, I don't know. That wasn't a real question. What do you want your legacy to be 20 years from now, Nick King? Oh, my God. Legacy. I don't know, man. Somebody that really just, it's weird

because I'm in a space right now. I feel like, you know, obviously we live, I feel like we live in a seminary. and it's as fast as this world is moving we're in this like dystopian society right now and I'm almost the present is so important you know what I mean I'm not even thinking about the future other than my children and just wanting to create a best space for them but because of I mean I'm sure you've heard like from how fast AI is moving and even like I don't know like Have y'all ever read that, the book from back in the day, George Orwell, 1984?

Hell yeah. Yeah. It's so, it's happening as we speak. So this dude, he wrote a book right after World War II called in 1949, but it's called 1984 because he was talking about the future and what he thought it was. And it said, I mean, you've heard like Big Brothers watching and all of that type of stuff. But it's literally what today is to where they had like as the. the ministry of truth and they were like literally changing history and it was dude's job to actually go and change history for the powers that be it was a constant war always going on so

they could perpetuate money it was like everything was under surveillance and uh they had this stuff called like truth speak and and it's like wow when you look at how one it was predicted but how really stuff like time and all that stuff is so manmade that I always at least the space I'm in now I'm like I'm not even thinking about the future in that sense I'm just really trying to operate in the present as much as I probably and be the best person I could be in the present because I do I feel like this is this a simulation and we're supposed to get as much as we supposed to get out of it because it can change like that and I just think I mean I obviously we all know what's going on in the world it's like it's so much poison out there

that the future is is not inspiring to me so I just want to be the best I can be in the moment now my lineage obviously is all about my children but I don't even that legacy thing I kind of and also one of my therapists that taught me that that legacy conversation can also be associated with the narcissistic approach as well because it's like now I'm building my legacy when that's all ego as well to putting your name on buildings and buying all of the stuff it's like we think that's what we should be achieving but in a if we're going to get to the utopian aspect of what we're all do we all should be each other's legacy that's right if you love 1984 I want to recommend uh because I know people are going to go buy that book after they heard and talk about it Octavia

Butler's parable of the sour oh okay you should read that too because that that that's talks about like what's going on now she put that out in 1993 and it talks about uh los angeles in twenty 24 and it's ravaged by climate change and social inequality oh wow instability so yeah no i'm gonna definitely cop that one but yeah it's just so weird i mean like obviously it's to to know that it's always been in the books and nothing's new and then it really makes you step back and me like yo people know the people who know they know and they put it in the books and we just come we glaze over it a lot of times but it's like yo this is we we living in a time and i think we probably always been living in this time but it's it's so potent right now because

of the energy that's out there and it's really it's a it's a dystopian society but you know there is hope that we can get to the other side of it and you know that's where i hope we're going in that direction nicholas scott canton ladies and gentlemen yes sir thank you for joining us my brother oh this is fun it's the breakfast club Day I wake up. Wake your ass up. The Breakfast Club. Are you all finished or y'all done?

I just normally do straight stand-up, but this is a bit different. What do you get when a true crime producer walks into a comedy club? Answer, a new podcast called Wisecrack, where a comedian finds himself at the center of a chilling true crime story. Does anyone know what show they've come to see?

It's a story. It's about the scariest night of my life. This is Wisecrack, available now. Listen to Wisecrack on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Short on time, but big on true crime. On a recent episode of the podcast, Hunting for Answers, I highlighted the story of 19-year-old Lechay Dungey. But she never knocked on that door. She never made it inside.

And that text message would be the last time anyone would ever hear from her. Listen to Hunting for Answers from the Black Effect podcast. Network on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Hi, my name is Enya Humanzor. And I'm Drew Phillips. And we run a podcast called Emergency Intercom. If you're a crime junkie and you love crimes, we're not the podcast for you. But if you have unmedicated ADHD...

Oh my God, perfect. And want to hear people with mental illness, psychobabble. Yes, yes. Then Emergency Intercom is the podcast for you. Open your free IHeartRadio app. Search Emergency Intercom and listen now. Do you want to hear the secrets of psychopaths, murderers, sex offenders? In this episode, I offer tips from them.

I'm Dr. Leslie, forensic psychologist. This is a podcast where I cut through the noise with real talk. When you were described to me as a forensic psychologist, I was like snooze. We ended up talking for hours and I was like, this girl is my best friend. Let's talk about safety and strategies to protect yourself and your your loved ones. Listen to Intentionally Disturbing on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.