The Breakfast Club - More Than an Actor: Marcus Callender on Writing, Producing & Being a True Creative | Part 1

Episode Date: November 25, 2025

In this episode of The Latest with Loren LaRosa, Loren sits down with actor, director, and writer Marcus Callender for a deeply insightful conversation about his journey in the entertainment industry. Marcus opens up about his breakout role in Power, the life-changing visibility that came with the Wu-Tang: An American Saga series, and the emotional highs and lows of navigating recognition, creative pressure, and unexpected setbacks. He shares the challenges of working through the writers’ strike, the impact of industry instability, and how these experiences ultimately inspired him to self-produce his passion project, the stage play Spades. Marcus reflects on the moment he took a leap of faith—moving to Los Angeles—and how that decision unlocked new opportunities, purpose, self-belief and more.  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BreakfastClubPower1051FMSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Hi, Kyle. Could you draw up a quick document with the basic business plan? Just one page as a Google Doc. And send me the link. Thanks. Hey, just finished drawing up that quick one-page business plan for you.

Here's the link. But there was no link. There was no business plan. I hadn't programmed Kyle to be able to do that yet. I'm Evan Ratliff here with a story of entrepreneurship in the AI age. Listen as I attempt to build a real startup run by fake people. Check out the second season of my podcast, Shell Game, on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

What up, y'all? It's your boy, Kevin on stage. I want to tell you about my new podcast called Not My Best Moment, where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures. What did they mess up on? What is their heartbreak? And what did they learn from it?

I got judged horribly. The judges were like, you're trash. I don't know how you got on the show. Check out Not My Best Moment with me kept on stage on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. On this week's episode of Next Chapter, I, TDJ, sit down with Denzel Washington,

a two-time Academy Award-winning actor and cultural icon. I don't take any credit for it. I just didn't put me first. I just put God first and he's carried me. Listen to the next chance. chapter podcast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. New episodes drop weekly. On the podcast Health Stuff, we are tackling all the health questions

that keep you up at night. I'm Dr. Priyanka Wally, a double board certified physician. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu, a comedian and someone who once Googled, Do I Have Scurvy at 3am? And on our show, we're talking about health in a different way, like our episode where we look at diabetes. In the United States, I mean, 50% of Americans are pre-diabetic. How preventable is type 2? Extremely. Listen to health stuff on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Big Take podcast from Bloomberg News keeps you on top of the biggest stories of the day.

My fellow Americans, this is Liberation Day. Stories that move markets. Chair Powell opened the door to this first interest rate cut. impact politics, change businesses. This is a really stunning development for the AI world and how you think about your bottom line. Listen to the big take from Bloomberg News every weekday afternoon on the IHeart radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a homeguard that knows a little bit about everything and everybody. You know if you're going to lie about that, right? Lauren came in hot. Back on the ground. Hey y'all, what's up? It's Lauren LaRosa, and this is the latest with Lauren LaRosa. This is your daily dig on all things, pop culture, entertainment news, and all of the conversations

that shake the room. Now, today I'm bringing you guys another conversation that was guaranteed to shake your room, but also shake your faith a little bit, your motivation a little bit. I'm sitting down with Marcus Callender, who is not only an actor. He would actually be, he would be so annoyed if I only called him an act. actor. But he is a creative. He's a multi-hyphenate, an actor, director, writer, all-around storyteller who has been able to make impact both on screen, behind the camera, and now behind the script with his play, Spades. Spades the play is everything black, bold, conversation, nuance, comedy, put into one Spades game and put on a live stage. You guys. You guys,

guys will know Marcus Callender who played Power, who played Oliver Power Grant on Wu-Tang in American Saga. He also played Ray Ray on Ghosts from Power Book 2. Y'all remember, we lost Raina because of Ray Ray, but if you don't know him or if you're just finding him, I'm so happy to introduce him here in conversation on The latest with Lauren the Rosa. This is part one. First of all, let's let the people know who you are and who these voices are that they're hearing and, you know, for the visual people seeing. So introduce yourself. Marcus Callender, born and raised in Brooklyn, New York. I'm a Pisces, yeah, and I am the writer and director of Spades to Play.

Some of y'all might know me from Power. I played Ray Ray. I was the guy that killed a little girl. I know you're going to ask, well, how did you have to do it? It was in the script. Some of y'all might know me from Wu-Tang and American Saga. I played Power. Oliver Grant, who's one of the co-founders of Wu-Tang.

and I've done a bunch of other stuff But those are the like The main two things people recognize They stop you on the street about Yeah So when people ask you why did Ray Ray kill Tarik's sister And you say it was in the script

How does the conversation go after that? They be like y'all man like But you did your thing though Like for real for real Can I get a picture of you? You know like yo like I hated you for a long time You know but I take that as like look You know if people see me

And still think that I'm that character I guess I did a good job in portraying that. You know what I'm saying? So, but I think also, too, the beauty in that is that people get to meet me and, you know, sense my energy because I'm a pretty down-the-earth person. I don't, you know, I know some celebrities give off that, whatever, but I'm a pretty down-the-earth person because, you know, I understand what the journey is in this kind of career. Yeah.

You know what I mean? This wasn't handed to me. This is something I had to work for. Work very hard for. So I'm cool. I'm approachable. I'm from Brooklyn. You know what I mean?

I'm a New Yorker still at the end of the day. So like don't come at me too crazy. You know what I'm saying? That era of power is like cemented in so many people's like, like I remember waiting for power to drop like the new episodes. And I mean, there's all these different iterations of it and chapters of it now. And I think there are some people that do that. But I feel like those early days of power when we had Tarek and Raina and Tasha. and ghosts like y'all was really in people's houses

people's homes for real for real for real had us waiting all talking on Twitter together you know what I'm saying watch parties and everything 100% what was it like for you because you're on both sides you're a creator of you know these conversations in film and theater and all these things but also you're an actor yeah what was it like being that like intertwined with culture where people lived and breathed for your next episode oh man well one

it was power where I started being recognized on the train or like everywhere I went and like especially when that episode dropped like I literally had to like hide my face all the time you know what I mean because people are like yo you the dude from

yo way yo that's crazy you know what I'm saying and I remember when it happened because the episode leaked at first it you know so people saw it before it officially came out and I remember I was in L.A. at the time and like some friends hit me like Yo, son, I saw you on this episode.

That's you killing the little girl. I said, wait, how the fuck you know that? That's not supposed to be information yet. So I came back to New York. I got invited to some watch parties and shit. And, you know, going there and, like, experiencing the people and whatnot was kind of like a surreal moment for me. Like, it was, as I said, it was the first time, like, okay, now I'm being recognized outside of, you know, I'm being recognized on the street. Right.

You know what I mean? So, like, getting used to that and acclimated to that. Because, you know, as I said, when you're from New York and you see somebody staring at you, the first thing you're thinking is like, yo, what's up? You're looking at it. You know what I mean? So, like, for a while, it's like, yo, why people keep staring at me? You know what I'm saying?

It's like, oh, yeah, the show. Mm-hmm. You know what I'm saying? So that was an adjustment period. But at this point, I'm used to it and, you know, I show love all the time. And, you know, so now people are recognizing you. Can't go on the train. Right.

Because people want beef. They want step on your Tim's. And for you as an actor, at that point, does it put pressure on you? Because, you know, we had you for some time, but then we didn't have you anymore in a certain point in the season. Yeah. Does it put pressure? What kind of pressure? Pressure, like, I mean, because you know more about the script and where the story's going than we do, right?

So you know people are getting to know you. They're starting to recognize you, but you know that you're not going to be on the show forever eventually. Or did you know that at that point when people are going to be on the show forever eventually? Or did you know that at that point when people were recognizing you? No, I knew. I mean, even before we shot the episode, Courtney Kemp, she called me personally. It was like, look, you know, this is what we're going to do with your character. We're going to kill you all.

I said, damn. Right. You know what I mean? Because I'm like, I could have, you know what I could have been raining havoc for another season. Uh-huh. She was like, yeah, we're going to. I mean, I didn't know. I didn't, okay, so I didn't know I was going to kill Raina until the table week of that episode.

Right. Because they, you know, they're pretty top. about the script, like, you don't see it until the table read. And the table read is how far out from actual shoot date? We shoot, we do the table read probably like a week before we shoot it. Okay, got you. So I came to the table read, you know, I'm highlighting my lines before, and I'm reading the thing.

And I'm like, oh, shit. And I remember, like, looking up and, like, everyone was looking at me, like, yeah, everybody going to hate you now. Then I said, yo, what? Like, me? Okay, okay, cool. This is interesting. Right.

All right, I'm going to be a villain. Okay, I'll take it. But I didn't realize, like, how much of an impact it was going to be. So, you know, we did the table read. And then right before we started shooting, that's when Courtney was like, yeah, so we're going to, because I think I did like two more episodes. It was the episode where I killed Raina and then the next episode where. Courtney, like, don't get comfortable.

Yeah, exactly. She's like, look, we're going to kill you off. But look, we love the work you're doing. I said, okay. cool you know like it was an honor that child chose me to even do this part because that's another thing too i don't know if a lot of people notice but originally i was supposed to just do one episode in season three i did the i was in the last episode of season three i was just supposed to do that episode but Courtney liked my work so much that after we filmed she said look i want to bring you

back for next season and you know in this business you hear that all the time you know people say hey, we're going to bring you back. And it's like, all right, cool. So I didn't necessarily believe her until, you know, my reps hit me. Hey, they want to bring you back? I said, all, cool. So, you know, coming back to it, it was like, all right, you know, now I got some time to, like, really develop this character to see where I want to take,

where I want to take it. You know what I mean? And that's when, you know, I was shooting that with Anika Noni Rose was in that because she played jukebox. And, you know, so that was cool to work with her and 50s in it. So that was cool to work with them. But, you know, I approached this. it in the best way I know how I tell people all the time every character is in you but what makes

it was going to make it different is simply you there's only one you on the planet you know what I mean so for me it was just kind of like okay like what's my version of this right you know what I'm saying hi Kyle could you draw up a quick document with the basic business plan just one page as a Google doc and send me the link thanks hey just finished drawing up that quick one page business plan for you. Here's the link. But there was no link. There was no business plan. It's not his fault. I hadn't programmed Kyle to be able to do that yet. My name is Evan Ratliff. I decided to create Kyle, my AI co-founder, after hearing a lot of stuff like this from OpenAI CEO Sam Aldman. There's this betting pool for the first year that there's a one-person billion dollar company, which would have been

like unimaginable without AI and now will happen. I got to thinking, could I be that one person? I'd made AI agents before for my award-winning podcast, Shell Game. This season on Shell Game, I'm trying to build a real company with a real product run by fake people. Oh, hey, Evan. Good to have you join us. I found some really interesting data on adoption rates for AI agents and small to medium businesses. Listen to Shell Game on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts. A decade ago, I was on the trail of one of the country's most elusive serial killers. but it wasn't until 2023 when he was finally caught.

The answers were there, hidden in plain sight. So why did it take so long to catch him? I'm Josh Zeman, and this is Monster, hunting the Long Island serial killer, the investigation into the most notorious killer in New York since the son of Sam, available now. Listen for free on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts.

On the podcast Health Stuff, we are tackling all the health questions that keep you up at night. Yes, I'm Dr. Priyanka Wally, a double board certified physician. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu, a comedian and someone who once Googled, Do I have scurvy at 3 a.m? On health stuff, we're talking about health in a different way. It's not only about what we can do to improve our health,

but also what our health says about us and the way we're living. Like our episode where we look at diabetes. In the United States, I mean, 50% of Americans are pre-diabetic. How preventable is type 2? Extremely. Or our in-depth analysis of how incredible mangoes are. Oh, it's hard to explain to the rest of the world. Your mangoes are fine because mangoes are incredible, but like you don't even know.

You don't know. You don't know. It's going to be a fun ride. So tune in. Listen to Health Stuff on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey there, Dr. Jesse Mills here. I'm the director of the men's clinic at UCLA Health, and I want to tell you about my new podcast called The Mailroom.

And I'm Jordan, the show's producer. And like a lot of guys, I haven't been to the doctor in many years. I'll be asking the questions we probably should be asking, but aren't. Because guys usually don't go to the doctor unless a piece of their face is hanging off or they've broken a bone. Depends which bone. Well, that's true. Every week, we're breaking down the unique world of men's health,

from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility, and things that happen in the bedroom. You mean sleep? Yeah, something like that, Jordan. We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about. It's going to be fun, whether you're 27, 97, or somewhere in between. Men's health is about more than six packs and supplements. It's about energy, confidence, and connection. We don't just want you to live longer.

We want you to live better. So check out the mailroom on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows. What do you get when you mix 1950s Hollywood, a Cuban musician with a dream, and one of the most iconic sitcoms of all time? You get Desi Arness, a trailblazer, a businessman, a husband, and maybe most importantly, the first Latino to break prime time wide open. I'm Wilmer Valderrama, and yes, I grew up watching him, probably just like you and millions of others. But for me, I saw myself in his story. From plening canary cages to this night here in New York, it's a long ways. On the podcast starring Desi Arnaz and Wilmer Valderama,

I'll take you in a journey to Desi's life, the moments it has overlapped with mine, how he redefined American television, and what that meant for all of us watching from the sidelines, waiting for a face like hours on screen. This is the story of how one man's spotlight lit the path for so many others and how we carry his legacy today.

Listen to starring Desi Arnaz and Wilmer Valdera That's part of the MyCultura podcast network available on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. What happens in an actor's mind when you get that moment and it's big and everybody's talking about it and your phone's ringing crazy and then you're not on the show anymore. So now it's like, I mean, you're not new kid at school because you got the work under your belt, but you got to. to figure out what's next now. Yeah. Like how does, what's that mental journey like?

That's a great question. You know, this is my job. This is the latest with Lauren La Rosa, the podcast. No, that's real shit right there

because there is pressure if you, especially if you allow it. Yeah. Because that, you know, in our community, especially it's all about what's next, what's next,

what's next, what's next, what's next? It's like, damn, I just shot this shit. Can I, you know, let I breathe for a second. So yeah, there was that pressure of like,

okay, what's next? fun fact I didn't work for about a year after I shot power and I was confused by that you know what I mean because here I am like okay like I did this role and it's 50 cents everybody's paying attention to that exactly you know everyone's recognizing me but I was not book I couldn't book a gig for shit why not I don't it was out of my control you know what I mean like because I moved to LA shortly after thanks to Courtney Kim when I finished I finished I finished filming power on my birthday of that year.

I forget what year there was. I think it was like 2000 and like 17 or something like that. Yeah. And it was my birthday on the last day of filming. And I remember she came to me. She was like, you should move to L.A. I said, y'all people tell me that all the time. She said, no, you should.

Like, you will work a lot out there. You know, there'll be a good city for you. This is when L.A. was L.A. was the same no more. No, I was living there during that time. Mm-hmm. And so I was like, okay, I'll think about it. And then it wasn't working. I, you know, in not working, I was depressed.

You know what I'm saying? Because it's like, yo, like, because I had just finished shooting power and I was doing a show called The Breaks. I was literally shooting both these shows at the same time. Like, one day I'm on power, one day I'm on the break. Living your dreams. So I was booked.

Yeah. So for all of it to just come to a halt was just extremely confusing to me and I couldn't fathom it. And I was at home one day. I took a nap. I took a nap Right before I took a nap I said Lord like I need a sign

Something like what is going on So I took a nap and I woke up To this offer to go do a workshop In Connecticut for a play And I was like Okay All right It's something

You know what I read the script I liked the script I realized that the playwright Who wrote it I worked with him On another workshop Like a year or two ago, and he just remembered my work from there. That's why you always got to bring 100% to whatever you do.

Don't ever think that something is too little or too small to give you all because you never know. Right. So when I realized it was him, I was like, oh shit, this is the guy from, he remembered me? Wow, okay. So I said, all right, cool. I'm going to go and do this workshop. At this point, I hadn't done a play in a very long time. I was just doing TV.

So getting in that environment again was an adjustment But I remember the day I got there I was like staring into the abyss And something just hit me like a ton of bricks You need to move to L.A. Like it just hit me I felt like it was just God speaking to me It was like you need to move to L.A.

And I immediately called my manager I said, yo I think we got to do the L.A. thing. She said, all right, cool. I'll set up some meetings and boom boom, boom. I said, all right, cool. So I did the workshop. The workshop was cool. That was a dope experience.

And then shortly after I came back from the workshop, I went to L.A. To take some generals, like some general meetings with like cast and directors, producers. I was supposed to be there for two weeks, two weeks turned into a month. Because, you know, one meeting followed up with another meeting. Right. Followed up to another meeting. I signed with a new agent. Like, I got all these things on this L.A. trip.

And that's when, right before I came back, that's when the, the, the episode of Power League. So it was just a lot going on. And you know what I'm saying? So I came back and, you know, basking and all of that. But in that trip to LA was when I decided, okay, yeah, I'm definitely going to move out here.

Because like every person I was meeting with, they're like, you're moving out here, right? I was like, yeah. I didn't know how I was going to do it. I didn't have the money to do it. That's the L.A. story, man. I didn't know how. That's how it be.

That's how it be. But at the same time, too, but it's about trusting, trust in that intuition. You know what I'm saying? Trust in what God placed in me. You know what I'm saying? Because in my head, I'm like,

there's no way I had that epiphany to move to LA and he ain't going to make a way. And lo and behold, you know, I got the money to go out there. I had just enough to, you know, to survive for a couple of months. Thank God, you know, I got some friends out there. You know, I was able to stay with family,

you know, people who I love. So, you know, I want to, went out there, I was there for the pilot season of that year, and I tested for two pilots. I'm thinking, okay, cool. I'd have moved down here. I'm about the book of a show. Time, baby, we are you what I'm saying? Oster's up next.

Exactly. You know that show, New Amsterdam on NBC? Yes. I was almost on that show. I tested for that show. I thought I was going to get it. I was convinced I was going to get that role because when I did the screen test, the producers were like, you, you, how did you make that look?

They literally say, yo, you made that look. easy. So I'm walking out like, yeah, I got this. And then I didn't get it. You know what I'm saying? So it was, you know, and that's the thing, too. It's true what they say. There's way more nose than yeses. Right. You know what I'm saying? So I didn't get that. I was up for this other show on the CW. I didn't get that. I mean, but that show didn't end up going forward anyway. But, you know, I had, I had these two shows that I was up for didn't get it. I was almost up for this other show. But they went with Loren's take. But understandable, I love Lorenz, you know what I'm saying?

But that's a good, like, oh, they didn't book me, they booked Lorenz, he's a legend, you know what I'm saying? So, like, the fact that the casting directors and producers or whoever are debating between you and Lorenz Tate, a lot of times, too, for us as talent, just being in a conversation in the room is a win, even though you can't pay your rent with that. You know what I'm saying? Can't. But, I mean, that's a great either or to be in. Exactly. So it was like, okay, cool. I mean, yeah, I didn't get the roles, but like, I'm like this close.

And that's, but, okay, I didn't book these jobs, but I'm still in L.A. You know what I mean? And one thing people don't tell you about L.A., yeah, it's all sunny and all that. But when you ain't doing shit, that shit really gets to you. You know what I mean? Yeah, it feels like, especially because you're so far away from, like, the people you know, and, like, the ways that you were just like, you know, real quick, I could go do this real quick if I'm back home or, like, whatever.

it feels so lonely it's like you're in a room and it's like echoing and you're trying to figure out like what do I do to turn the noise down I was in that space when I first moved to L.A. for about like six, seven months

and I was just like what is going on and then people, the move to L.A. itself people are just like oh look at God you're going to move to L.A. You got it. You made it.

Yeah, so it's like you know opening up about it not going the way that you wanted to go is tough to family-wise not going the way you wanted to go. It's tough. Having to act for things in the meantime, it's like such a process. But I think for anybody that has done it,

it definitely is like survival of the fittest, but it makes you a different type of hungry about your career. Exactly. That's a good word. Hungry. I feel like a lot of folks ain't hungry. You know what I mean? People just want the result.

They want the end goal as opposed to knowing, understanding what the journey is. The journey is way more interesting than the goal. You know what I mean? Because every time I reach the goal. go, I'm mostly thinking about what it took to get here. Right. You know what I mean?

It's like, okay, yeah, this is great. But like, man, I did this, I'd do this, I'd do that, I'd do this to get to this point. And it allows you to appreciate it more. I feel like when people get things too quick, they don't understand, you know, they don't have an appreciation for it. So they fumble it. Yeah. You know what I mean?

They think they're entitled or they think it's just always going to be that way. You know what I mean? So at the same time, it is a blessing that I had to go through the journey. that I did. But in that time, after, you know, not booking these gigs, I'm still in L.A. And I'm like, okay, well, what the hell am I going to do? Because after pilot season, it's a little slow in terms of auditions. It's mostly like independent films and all of that.

Right. So I'm just like, okay, well, what the hell am I going to do with all this time? I started dating this girl. That's a distraction. You know what I'm saying? And it's expensive. And it's expensive. it's expensive yeah so especially in l.A it's like $25 yo I know she wanted to go to town come on now

I like room on a Wednesday you know she she's on TV now funny enough anyway oh really what show that's that's that's an off-camera conversation were you all auditioning together no no no no I mean I would help her with auditions and stuff like that she knows who it but anyway you watch the show she's currently on I don't oh so it ended bad I didn't I don't watch it because she's on it, I just, that's just not my kind of show to watch. Okay. So it's like a Zeus network thing?

No, no, no. Okay. I'm sure you watch it, though. Eddie who. That would be hip-up? No. So she don't thought this is a TV show, a scripted show. That they, they're in they're like, this six seasons right now?

It's not D.R. from Detroit then. No, no. Because that's like second season. I'm going to figure this out. Okay. Beautiful girl. Amazing. woman, you know, nothing bad to say about it.

It just didn't work out. And she's a Scorpio. You know what I'm saying? Anyway, so I'm in L.A. I'm like, okay, what am I doing? I go to this party when it was on Easter. As soon as I walked in, I saw people playing space. I'm like, oh, shit. Hmm. I need to start. I need to get back into the script because I had put the script down for like almost two years.

So you wrote this script when you wrote this script. were in L.A. or before you moved to L.A.? I started writing the script in 2015. Got you. So 10 years ago. Okay. I started writing the script. When I first started writing it, it was just a one act.

Explain to the regular people what the one act means. So typically in a play, you know, you'll have like two acts. And a play in a full length play, you'll typically have two acts. So one acts is just, you know, kind of like just the first half of it. I didn't think it was going to be a full-length thing when I first wrote it. It was just something that I was inspired to write. because I was learning how to play spades at the time. Yes.

When I started writing it. So I was inspired to write it. I knew I wanted to get into writing at some point, but I didn't think I could do it because I didn't go to school for it. And, you know, like, you know what do you think? You know what I mean? I had a bit of imposter syndrome. But I just started writing it and it just kind of poured out of me.

So I did a stage reading of it. This is in Brooklyn at this spot. At the time, it was called. the Kimberley Project in Bedstead. And we had a pretty big turnout. This is before, like, Instagram was Instagram for real. Got you. You know what I mean?

So the fact that we got so many people there off a word or mouth was a really big deal. So we did the reading and like the biggest feedback. People were like, we want more. We want more. Like, it's got to be longer. So I was like, all right, cool. I'm going to do that. But then I started filming something else.

So I kind of put it to the side. What were you filming? That's where I started filming the brakes. Got to the brakes. Okay. So I started filming that. So I got caught up in that and then power came along. So I was just all in that.

So with this downtime, I go into this space and I see the script. I mean, I see people playing space. I'm like, okay, this is going to give me something to do. Because I was tired of like running into people like, what are you working on? That's the number one question. People are going to ask you in Los Angeles. So what are you working on? What are you working on?

What do you do? You know what I'm saying? So I was tired of not having anything to say. So I said, you know what? Literally the next day, I went back to the script. At the time, the script was like 180-something pages. It was a lot of, a lot of pages. And I had some friends over to read it.

I said, look, you know, I just need to hear this out loud because I need to see where I want to go with it. They read all 180-something pages of it. Shout out to y'all. And from there, I just kind of like started diving into that. Like, that became my focus. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, okay, I'm going to,

employing myself. You know what I'm saying? Yes. So I said, look, so I'm going to dive into that. So I started working on that. I did a reading of it in L.A. And so I was going to produce it in L.A. That was going to be like where I first produced it.

But then I booked a play in New York. See, that's another thing too. I went so long not working. The minute I dive into my own shit, now all of a sudden these opportunities come. Which play did you book? I did a play. called Fabulation written by Lynn Notting at the Signature. Got you.

Really big off-Broadway theater company. It was actually like my dream theater company to work at. The signature is where I got some of my first bearings into theater. You know what I mean? So, you know, I was like, oh, shit, I'm about to go do this play in New York. All right, cool. So the plan was to go do the play and then come back and produce spades. While I was doing the play in New York, that's when I booked Wooltang.

So it kept me in New York So I said, all right, well shit Okay, I'm gonna stay in New York So I kind of once again Put space to the side Because now Wu-Tang is like that After when that series dropped too Exactly

People were also very tied to it Just because people wanted the story Exactly And it was timely And it was all the things So now your star is You know, rising again Because of Wu-Tang

And what was that experience like Because you were going through this Like very mental depressing Period of like Why is this not? Like God am I supposed to be here And then boom, you're back up again. So you're high up on the hill now.

So what is that like for you as town? Yeah, let me tell you something. It was December 21st or 22nd when I got the cold that I got that role. It was how I approached that entire process was like, unlike how I approached any other show that I audition for. Because, you know, sometimes, you know, we'll get a part or we'll get an audition. And we're like, well, I want this. Like, I'm going to make sure I know all my lines for the audition.

I'm going to be perfect. those be the ones you never get. It's always the ones where you're like, man, I'm going to just, you know, I'm just do it. So with this one, when I read the script, I was like, oh, yeah, I can do this in my sleeve. It's New York, niggas. Right.

I'm from New York. Yeah, I could do that. I didn't know Power was a real person. I thought it was a fictional character. But I was like, okay, cool, I could do that. It's funny, his name is Power because I was on Power. But, okay, that's cool. So I did the audition.

I sent the tape. I sent the tape. I was also, but I was also up for another, you see, you see, you see, you see the theme here? It was a lot going on on. Uh-huh. I was up for another role. They were going to bring back NYPD Blue on ABC. Remember that show?

Yes. So I was up to be on that show. I wanted to be on that because it's ABC. You know what I'm saying? Like, Hulu's cool. Yeah, but. This is network television we're talking about. Which is normally a bit more stable.

It's more stable. It's just more money. Yes. You know what I'm just more money. So I wanted that. that and it would have kept me in New York still. So I was like, okay, cool, I want that shit. So the same day I found out that I didn't get that,

I found out I had a callback for the Wu-Tang shit. Gotcha. Okay, all right, well, something. I went to the callback for Wu-Tang, and I remember going in there, we had to do it, and this is before 2020, I had to do it to a computer, to Riza, in L.A. So I go to the office, the casting director was like,

okay, so, you know, we have Rizzo on the laptop. He's coming in through Zoom, so you got to do the audition to the computer. I'm like, what? You know what I'm saying? Like, at the time, it was like, I ain't never done that. You know what I'm saying?

And it's Rizzo, but like, at the same time, like, I thought it was, I thought I was at a disadvantage because I'm not in the room. Gotcha. It's always different when you're in the room, they can feel your energy and all of that. I'm like, there's no way this is going to translate

over a computer screen. Mm-hmm. But I did it. I only had to do each scene once I didn't even have to do it again I remember after the casting director I was like really good job that was amazing

I was like thanks cool I left I went to my friend's house as soon as I got off the train my agent calls me this is like 45 minutes later my agent calls me and she's like hey they didn't want to test you

I was like I just left the motherfucking audition but I knew in that moment that I had to roll because I was like I've never gotten that's not true that's not true new amsterdam i found out they wanted to test me probably like 15 minutes after my

got you now he's in the room test you for those who don't know the talent side of tv means what okay so when you do a screen test it basically means hey we love you we want you for this role but we also want this person for this role also considering this person we just want to see how what what makes the most sense on camera visually you know what i mean visually Hi, Kyle. Could you draw up a quick document with the basic business plan? Just one page as a Google Doc and send me the link. Thanks. Hey, just finished drawing up that quick one-page business plan for you. Here's the link. But there was no link. There was no business plan. It's not his fault. I hadn't programmed Kyle to be able to do that yet. My name is Evan Ratliff. I decided to

create Kyle, my AI co-founder, after hearing a lot of stuff like this from OpenAI CEO Sam Aldman. There's this betting pool for the first year that there's a one-person billion-dollar company, which would have been like unimaginable without AI and now will happen. I got to thinking, could I be that one person? I'd made AI agents before for my award-winning podcast, Shell Game. This season on Shell Game, I'm trying to build a real company with a real product run by fake people. Oh, hey, Evan. Good to have you join us.

I found some really interesting data on adoption rates for AI agents and small to medium businesses. Listen to Shell Game on the IHeart Radio app Or wherever you get your podcasts. A decade ago, I was on the trail of one of the country's most elusive serial killers. But it wasn't until 2023 when he was finally caught. The answers were there, hidden in plain sight. So why did it take so long to catch him? I'm Josh Zeman, and this is Monster,

hunting the Long Island serial killer, the investigation into the most notorious killer in New York, since the son of Sam, available now. Listen for free on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts. On the podcast Health Stuff, we are tackling all the health questions that keep you up at night. Yes, I'm Dr. Priyanka Wally, a double board certified physician. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu, a comedian and someone who once Googled, do I have scurvy at 3 a.m. On Health Stuff, we're talking about health in a different way.

It's not only about what we can do to improve our health, but also what our health says about us and the way we're living. Like our episode where we look at diabetes. In the United States, I mean, 50% of Americans are pre-diabetic. How preventable is type 2? Extremely. Or our in-depth analysis of how incredible mangoes are. Oh, it's hard to explain to the rest of the world that you, like,

your mangoes are fine because mangoes are incredible, but like, you don't even know. You don't know. You don't know. It's going to be a fun ride, so tune in. Listen to Health Stuff on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey there, Dr. Jesse Mills here. I'm the director of the men's clinic at UCLA Health, and I want to tell you about my new podcast called The Mailroom. And I'm Jordan, the show's producer. And like a lot of guys, I haven't been to the doctor in many years.

I'll be asking the questions we probably should be asking, but aren't. Because guys usually don't go to the doctor unless a couple. piece of their faces hanging off, or they've broken a bone. Depends which bone. Well, that's true. Every week, we're breaking down the unique world of men's health, from testosterone and fitness to diets and fertility, and things that happen in the bedroom. You mean sleep? Yeah, something like that, Jordan.

We'll talk science without the jargon and get you real answers to the stuff you actually wonder about. It's going to be fun, whether you're 27, 97, or somewhere in between. Men's health is about more than six packs and supplements. It's about energy, confidence, and connection. We don't just want you to live longer. We want you to live better. So check out the mailroom on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your favorite shows.

What do you get when you mix 1950s Hollywood, a Cuban musician with a dream, and one of the most iconic sitcoms of all time? You get Desi Arness, a trailblazer, a businessman, a husband, and maybe, most importantly, the first Latino to break prime time wide open. I'm Wilmer Valderama, and yes, I grew up watching him, probably just like you and millions of others. But for me, I saw myself in his story. From plening canary cages to this night here in New York, it's a long ways. On the podcast starring Desi Arnaz and Wilmer Valderrama, I'll take you in a journey to Desi's life. The moments it has overlapped with mine, how he redefined American television, and what that meant for all of us watching from the sidelines, waiting for a face like hours on screen. This is the story of how one-man's spotlight

lit the path for so many others and how we carry his legacy today. Listen to starring Desi Arnaz and Wilmer Valderrama as part of the My Cultura podcast network available on the IHard Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Who else were they testing for the role of power?

They were testing. It was me. Damn. This cat name is. Antoine Harris who I did the breaks with and I don't remember the other person. So we did the, they said they wanted me to test. I was like, okay, but I'm doing a play. How the hell am I going to make it to L.A.?

Because, you know, when you're doing a play, it's eight shows a week. You only have one day off, which is a Monday. So I say, yo, I mean, do they know I'm in a play? I can't, how am I going to, you know? Because what they do in those scenarios, if you can't be there, they'll use your audition tape. as the screen test. Got you.

But that kind of is like... You know what I mean? I'm like, I want a full experience. Yeah. So they worked around my schedule, which is another test. That was another sign. I was like, oh, yeah, they want me for this. Got you.

They scheduled it. It was so I had two shows that Sunday. I did the two shows. Then after the second show, I literally went from the theater to the airport to L.A. I flew on a red eye and did the test the next morning. and flew back to New York that same night. It was just like, bam, bam, bam, man. I felt like a rock star.

You know what I'm saying? Right. So, but I remember how I felt going into the test. I wasn't nervous. I wasn't trying to put on. I kind of just knew it was mine. You know what I mean? I walked in.

Said it up to Rizzo. Set it up to Kim Coleman. Shout out to Kim Coleman. She was the casting director. I did the scene. I only had to do each scene once and I left. I didn't, you know, like, I hope, you know what I'm saying?

Like, I hope I did the screen test, went back to New York to do the play. Yeah. And, you know, but that also helped too because I was locked in on that. So I wasn't too distracted about, are they going to pick me or not? Because I already had something to do. Right. So I remember the day I found out, I got it. It was like December 21st or 22nd or something like that.

I went to lunch with a friend of mine. Shout out to Megan. I went to lunch. And I was telling her I was like, yeah, I'm supposed to be finding out today. if I got to roll. But I was so jaded at the time because, you know, I had just been through so much. I've been through so much. The year's been crazy.

I'm like, you know, it was raining that day, too. I got a little trauma with rain because the day I found out I didn't get New Amsterdam. It was raining in L.A. In L.A. It don't rain like that in L.A. Those boys lie. It rains in Southern California. You know what I'm saying?

It was just like, damn, it's raining again. Damn, that he's going to get it. So I left lunch. And as I'm walking, it stopped raining. The sun's coming out and shit. I'm like, okay, okay, okay. I remember I went to the T-Mobile store to pay my phone bill. While I was in line, my manager at the time, she calls me, she goes,

she calls me, she's like, hey, I got so-and-so, and so. My agents, you know, they're on the line, too. They only are on the line if you got the road. So I said, wait, hold on a second. Let me step outside real quick. What's up, y'all? I said, just give it to me. don't try because sometimes they'll try to like play with you

and be like oh it's so unfortunately psych I said just give it to me right they say look they want to offer you this wrong I said get the fuck out I was on it was like midtown like 50 something street I said yo get the fuck out I say yeah nigga yeah because it was just it was the it was that moment of like yo I've been through so much this year this year's been so hard so they ended on this note was like you're about to be a series regular oh Oh, this is crazy.

On the Woutain joint, this is crazy. Right. So, more distraction to take me away from Spades. You know what I'm saying? Because remember, the plan was to go back to L.A. and produce it. So I just kind of dived in the Wutang. I did that.

We did that for three seasons. I was still working on Spades. And the guys were really, really involved with you guys, too. Like, you know, developing the characters and on set. What was, I mean, because you say distraction, but I'm sitting here like, all this stuff you're learning in real time from all these great people to then bring back to your players how I'm looking at it.

But in the moment I get it. It don't feel like that, right? Exactly. Like, talk about, you know, showing up on set and you have Riza and whoever else would come and you were, like, these are superheroes to us. I mean, I was in a unique position because I wasn't playing one of the rappers. Right. You know what I mean?

I was playing the behind the scenes guy, the business guy who a lot of people don't know about. Right. You know what I mean? So for me, it was like, yeah, you know, meeting the, you know, meeting the Wu-Tang was cool but I need to meet power where's power never like he would never show up to said I'm asking around like

where's ball you haven't met pee or you got to meet pee your pee is this pee is that I'm like all right well where he at I'm playing him one day we were like seven episodes in so the season's almost done we like seven episodes in we shoot

season one we shot all of that in Staten Island so we had to pause because it was raining theme with rain. Yes. It was raining crazy. So we had to pause filming for a couple of hours. And she, you know, I get a knock on the door.

And the PA's like, yo, you know, you have a guest here. I said, who's, what's the man? And he peeks his head over and said, what up? I said, oh, shit. What's up? Yo, what's good? He came into my trailer. Our first conversation was like three hours.

We spoke for like three hours just shooting the shit. Like, we got along immediately. yeah and once we met we've been locked in even to this to this day yeah we're locked in what was it like because on on power the show power you're playing a person that we don't know this isn't a real person you know what i mean even but then on wutan you're playing a person named power who is a real person and you have played him for almost all of the season and then you get to meet him so how does your direction as an actor change when you go from something that it's based on a real person or something that's not based on a real person to

based on a real person and then even after that it probably changes because you then meet the real person that's another great question so season one is all about who these members are before the group was formed so it's just a lot of like just backstory stuff you know what I'm saying so like I was kind of pretty the performance I was given was pretty solid for what was asked to me that season because we hadn't gotten into like Wu-Tang yet. Right.

So when I met him, it was like, okay, the timing is good. So once we finished filming season one, that summer, I spent a lot of time with him. I mean, we went to, you know, I went to D.C. with him, Miami. Like, I was just traveling with, he was just inviting me out.

Yo, come to this, come to that. Because he's doing now, because, well, first of all, I guess, explain a bit for anyone who may not have seen the series. Power's role in the Wu-Tang and then kind of where he is now, like what his life looks like now and roll out. So Power, Power is the executive producer of Wu-Tang as well as the co-founder of Hutang.

He was a part, he was there from the very beginning. You know what I mean? In the show, you see that, you know, Power was the one that basically fronted the money for Riza to make this album, you know what I mean? Because, you know, Power, you know, power was a street nigga. You know what I'm saying? He was a getting money nigger. And, you know, especially in the rap game,

lot of the time we go to the you know when when we meet that bread yeah going to the street you know what i'm saying so that's who power was power already had a name for himself he was already established so it was kind of like he recognized what rizzo was doing and said okay cool i'm gonna invest in that that's gonna be my flip you know what i'm saying so season two is when we got into all of that so before we started shooting shooting season two you know i got to see Because he still, I mean, Wootang is still very much his brand. You know what I mean? He has who wear, which is the clothing line as well that he started.

Yes. So, you know, he would do pop-ups a lot. So he would invite me to these pop-ups. So I'm meeting people. I'm seeing him, like, at work in action. I'm talking, like, down to, like, how he counts money. He counts money like a minute. You know what I'm saying?

Like, so I'm, like, just taking note of all of that. So in spending time with him, now I'm able to refine my performance because now I can add details, you know what I mean, specificity. I'm big on specifics, you know what I mean? I don't like general, you know what I'm saying? So, like, I was able to pick up on little things, how he dresses, how he, you know, like power never ties his shoelace. He always, his kicks is always super clean, fresh out the box, laces, you know what I'm saying,

dope boy shit, you know what I mean? So I was able to pick up on all of that. He sags his pants a lot. So, like, even down to, like, my wardrobe and how. how I wore it, I'm picking up on all of these things. Sometimes I'll be at a fitting and I would FaceTime. I'm like, yo, is this something you'll wear? Like, how you feel about this?

Down to, like, how I wear the chain. He never wears his chain on the outside. He always has his tucked in. You know what I mean? Just like little things. So I was, so in that, I was able to bring more to the role, which I think paid off because now when I meet people, you know, they're like, yo, you got peed down, like, to the, yo, you got peed down.

You know what I'm saying? And I heard that from Wu-Tang members, you know what I mean? So, like, to even get their blessing was a big deal. Right. So then, okay, so Wu-Tang has happened, or at this point, put Spades on the back end, your play, which is honestly what we're here to talk about, but this all is a part of the journey.

We're going to get there, y'all. So at what point, so Wu-Tang happens, that's done, when do you say, okay, I need to get this play happening, and you're going to be New York? Okay. So finished shooting Wooten. We finished filming in 2020, the end of 2022.

And then, was it 2020? 2020 and then the writer's strike happened. Right after we finished filming. Yeah. It was like, what the fuck? It was like, yo, we just finished shooting this show. We've been like, okay, cool. We off this show.

What's the next thing? Did you have things on the table like conversations? and stuff for other shows that were coming. It was finally like, okay, this show led to boom. Yeah. I was doing this film and we had to stop production because I think production, I think they ran out of money and something like that.

But it was supposed to be this like really dope indie film that they offered me this role and I was going to body this role. We had to end production on that. And then I had a meeting with this producer for this other film. So it was just like, okay, okay. And then the writer's strike happened. Yeah. So everything kind of just came to a hole.

So it's just like, all right. Okay, what do I, what do I do with this information? So it put me in another depression again, because it's just kind of like, when you're an artist and you're not doing your art, it fucks with you. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Are you doing anything actively for the depression? Like, are you, because I know, like.

I was doing the things I'm not supposed to be doing. meaning you know what tell us we want to know you can't just leave us hanging like that you know look man I was I was you have vices huh you're leaning into your vices

yeah yeah I was leaning into my vices you know what I mean I was you know messing with you know messing with young ladies I shouldn't be messing with just kind of just I was just all over the place so I was indulging in that But that wasn't good because, you know, here I am not really staying focused

and letting distractions kind of get to me. Yeah. And then I had my birthday party in 2023. I'll never forget that day. I had my birthday party. I invited everybody. I invited all my friends, all my little joints, all, everybody came out. And I remember I didn't even like, it was, it was at this spot.

Remember the grill became? Yeah. I wasn't here during the time of all of that, like poppy. I just started coming around Breakfast Club guest host and started in 2023. So I was a little new, but I knew of it. I would see people there. Yeah, my whole girl Melissa, she owned that spot. So I had my birthday there. It was an open bar. Like I basically threw my birthday

I threw a party for people on my birthday. Because I wasn't even really, like I was literally sitting at the bar the whole party. Everyone's like, yo, this is your party. Like, why are you not chilling? I said, I don't know. I'm just kind of chilling. Because it was another one of those, like, my spirit told me, like, okay, I should throw a party for my, it was my 33rd birthday. I was like, something told me I should throw a party or something. So I did it. And I remember sitting there, I couldn't even enjoy it really.

All I did was, like, watch people. That's all I did. I took some shrooms, you know what I had my little shrooms. That's why you were sitting at the bar. But, you know, I love shrooms, man. Shrooms, that shit will open your mind. Y'all got that. You know what I'm saying?

That is not my men. You would love it. It's a fantastic thing. So I'm shrooms. I'm sipping my rum punching shit. And I'm just like standing at people and just like watching people. And I'm just thinking to myself, I'm like, yeah, like, I feel like most of these people are here just because, you know, I'm on TV. And, you know, I don't know if, like, all of these people actually fuck with me.

You know what I'm saying? But that was something I was thinking about. Yeah. And then, you know, after that party, I ended up like. I ended a lot of friendships because it was, it was starting, you know, people were starting to show their ass, you know what I'm saying? Off the rum punch that night? No, no, no, not.

Okay, I'm like, what happened at the party? But just following after that, you know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, people, it's easy, people, it's easy to be around people or to be with you when you're up. You know what I mean? When things are up, that's when it's easy. But when it's not like that, that's when people start to show their true colors. Right.

And for me, I kind of was just like, you know, I need to kind of like clear space because I feel like some of this energy is not helpful for me. It's not conducive. It's distractions. Yeah. You know what I mean? Just energy I shouldn't be around. So, 20203 was a really tough year for me because it was a lot of purging, a lot of it.

And a lot of like, oh, shit, this motherfucker's been like this whole motherfucking time. I couldn't see it because I was, you know, I just spent the last three. years, you know, living on a high that I didn't, I didn't have the moment to like really dissect and like really understand what was around me. You know what I'm saying? So in that, you know, 2023, I was, you know, I was also in a relationship. So I was just kind of like feeding into that more than anything. I wasn't really feeding into myself as an artist because I didn't know what to do.

You know what I mean? I still had space, but I wasn't in. inspired to keep working on it during the like when the writer's strike first hit i recorded the first two scenes on audio because i was going to try to sell it as an audio as an audio book kind of thing because that was like one of the things we could do yeah in in the writer strike so i did that i was supposed to meet with some people they never responded back to the email so it was just like it just kind of felt like yo nothing is like going my way man like nothing you know what I'm saying? So then I had a friend at the time. We were supposed to do a reading of

spades in Detroit. And that ended up not happening because it was a lot of it was more like funny business happening. You know what I mean? It was another moment of like kind of like seeing of someone who's supposed to be a friend. They're true colors. You know what I'm saying? It was starting to feel like she was, she wanted to take my work. can put her name on it, take the credit for my shit. But in hindsight, I'm glad that happened because it lit a fire under me. You know what I mean? Because even before that, you know, like I try to pitch this play to like different theater

companies, you know, these are all white institutions, you know, that are going to take our stories and kind of dilute it and not really give it that authenticity that it needs when it comes to our stories, black stories and how we tell our stories. That's a whole other thing I'll get into later. but so you know I'm pitching it to all these theater companies they're like we love that okay but what's what's up oh you know we're gonna do this other play we're gonna it's like I'm tired of waiting so after that whole Detroit thing fell through I said you know what I'm just gonna I'm gonna do this myself yeah I'm gonna do this myself and I said ah you know what I mean it woke something up

in me yes it woke something up in me so I did a reading of so where the play is now yes I did a stage reading there last year last september um same kind of formula with the whole theater and around at the table but you know except they had scripts and that was kind of like the launching of like okay like i'm gonna commit to producing this play like i'm just going to commit to it you know what i mean because i got all this downtime i'm not filming anything i need to do something you know what i'm saying like and what what better way than to employ yourself you know what i'm saying so from that moment i did the reading. Then after that, we did the reading at Dumbo House. And then from... Oh, so that was still relatively, like, new when I saw that Dumbo House.

Okay, cool. Exactly. So, you know, but because the point of doing these readings was to, like, get the word out. I want people to start knowing about this place so that when we produce it, it's like, oh, that's the play that I, you know what I'm saying? So it's not like out of thin air. But some people thought I think I just wrote this play. You know what I mean? Not knowing, like, no, this was a 10-year journey. Got you. You know what I'm saying? Now y'all stay tuned because this is only part one, but if you're feeling inspired,

if you're digging this story in this conversation, I want to hear from you, my lowriders. Make sure you at me. I'm Lauren LaRosa everywhere, and check out Spades the Play. Now I'm playing in New York. Visit Spades to Play on Instagram or on Posh for your tickets. Hi, Kyle. Could you draw up a quick document with the basic business plan? Just one page as a Google Doc.

the link. Thanks. Hey, just finished drawing up that quick one-page business plan for you. Here's the link. But there was no link. There was no business plan. I hadn't programmed Kyle to be able to do that yet. I'm Evan Ratliff here with a story of entrepreneurship in the AI age. Listen as I attempt to build a real startup run by fake people. Check out the second season of my podcast, Shell Game on the IHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts. What up y'all? It's your boy, Kevin on stage. I want to tell you about my new podcast called Not My Best Moment, where I talk to artists, athletes, entertainers, creators, friends, people I admire who had massive success about their massive failures. What did they mess up on? What is their heartbreak? And what did they learn from it?

I got judged horribly. The judges were like, you're trash. I don't know how you got on the show. Check out Not My Best Moment with me kept on stage on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcast. of Next Chapter, I, T.D.J. Sit down with Denzel Washington, a two-time Academy Award-winning actor and cultural icon. I don't take any credit for it. I just didn't put me first. I just put God first and he's carried me. Listen to the next chapter podcast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. New episodes drop weekly. On the podcast Health Stuff, we are tackling all the health questions that keep you up at night.

I'm Dr. Priyankawali, a double board certified physician. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu, a comedian and someone who once Googled, Do I Have Scurvy at 3 a.m? And on our show, we're talking about health in a different way, like our episode where we look at diabetes. In the United States, I mean, 50% of Americans are pre-diabetic. How preventable is type 2? Extremely.

Listen to health stuff on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Big Take podcast from Bloomberg News keeps you on top of the biggest stories of the day. My fellow Americans, this is Liberation Day. Stories that move markets. Chair Powell opened the door to this first interest rate cut. Impact politics, change businesses.

This is a really stunning development for the AI world and how you think about your bottom line. Listen to the big take from Bloomberg News every weekday afternoon. on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast, guaranteed human.