The Breakfast Club - Viola Davis, Thuso Mbedu & Gina Prince-Bythewood Talk 'The Woman King', Redefining Femininity + More

Episode Date: September 19, 2022

Viola Davis, Thuso Mbedu & Gina Prince-Bythewood Talk 'The Woman King', Redefining Femininity + MoreSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hello, my undeadly darlings. It's Teresa, your resident ghost host. And do I have a treat for you. Haunting is crawling out from the shadows, and it's going to be devilishly good. We've got chills, thrills, and stories that'll make you wish the lights stayed on. So join me, won't you?

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We are The Breakfast Club. We got some special guests joining us today. Yes, indeed. We have the great, the legend, Viola Davis. She's back. Good morning. Hey, peace, queen. We have Dusso Beidou.

Did I say it right? Dusso Beidou. Dusso Beidou. I had him practice it like 10 times. I did it before you came. I was like, come on. And I bet $100. Stay with me.

Stay with me. He's going to get it wrong. I say, yeah, I don't care how many times he practices it before you came. I was like, come on. Say it with me. Say it with me. He's going to get it wrong. I say ye, I don't care how many times he practices it, I guarantee he's going to get it wrong. And Gina Prince-Bythewood. Good morning. Peace, Gina. Good morning. From the movie, The Woman King.

Excited. Excited about that. This feel bigger than a movie. This feel like an event. It is. A moment, a movement. Yes. Now, how difficult was it for you to get in that type of shape because

from the pre-meal i mean it was it was a lot it looked like you did your own stunts and everything yes we did and it was a lot hour and a half of weight training every day and heavy weights because they wanted me to be really bulky so you could believe i could take down 250 pound men three and a half hours of martial arts after the weight training, you know, weaponry training, you know, punching, elbows, running 10.0 on the treadmill. Wow. You know, when you start running, your heart rate goes up and you lose oxygen. And I'm over 50. So the fact that I'm alive and sitting here is a testament.

Are you ready for somebody to try you? Just to show. You look at people differently now. Hold up, hold up. But that's a powerful feeling to be able to just really transform your body like that. You think you'll incorporate this training like just forever into your life now some of it yeah we still work out together all three of us to they come to my house and we complain yeah you know but you know for me and too so can attest to that it's getting into the

mindset of the warrior that mindset of either you fight or you die yeah you know cuz as actors you can't just transform the body you have to transform even um inward yeah we are after all at the end of the day playing people and um i mean i don't know i don't walk uh through my life except with my child it's if you come you know for my child I'll I'll try to kill you but really um every day I don't have fight-or-die sort of spirit so people that don't know let's break down what the woman king is about good at this. Go for it. No, Gina, you're not doing this to me. The homie Amazons, right? Yeah, no, it's a

story of this incredible group of elite female warriors who defended their kingdom, defended their people at a time when they were at a great crossroads of which way they were going to go. It just tells a story of this incredible kingdom that

was different than any other kingdom in all of Africa. And it's based on a true story, right? Because this is the real-life Dora Milaje. Yeah. Right? Absolutely. Yeah, that's the incredible thing. These women were real.

So many of us have never heard of them, never were taught about them. So to be able to go to the movies, see yourself reflected up on screen, how you've never seen it heroically, we think it's going to be a game changer. It's exciting for me because I've never seen black women in a role like this. And I love movies like 300 and Apocalypto where you see all the fighting and running and excitement. But to see these powerful black women, I just feel like this is something that is life changing for us. I saw that you said, Gina, that when you read the script, you knew even before you finished that you wanted to do this movie.

Yeah, for real. Five pages in. Wow. It's written that these women rise up from the grasses about to go ham on some men who took their women prisoners. And for me, my mindset, athlete, wanting to put us up on screen i wanted to see that image i wanted to be the one to shoot that image yeah i'm glad y'all did this too because you know i'm a big comic book guy so i always knew that dora milaje was based off a real you know crew of women but i never did the research on it i never went to go look about the dahomey amazon

so this is a great educational piece i i think. Yeah. And Viola, you produced this also, right? My production company with my husband, Julius Tennant, we produced the movie. We fought for it for seven years. Seven years.

Seven years. Wow. Seven year fight. It's always hard to get a movie done in Hollywood. A miracle. Anyone has a hard time,

but us especially have a hard time. Do you think this is going to start a shift in Hollywood where instead of the narratives of the enslaved, we get those stories all the time, we'll get more of these stories showing our warrior spirit? I hope so. We have to.

As you said, it's time. It's what we love so much about this film. Again, so many of us are taught, certainly in America, that our history begins with enslavement, and there was so much more going film. Again, so many of us are taught, certainly in America, that our history begins with enslavement, and there was so much more going on before that, where we truly do come from kingdoms and warriors and kings.

So with the success of this, it has to open that door. Actually, keep that door open that Black Panther kicked open for us. We want to keep that door open for others to tell these stories. We had John up here the other day. John Boyega. Boyega, yeah. He said this was his easiest role open for us and we want to keep that door open for others to tell these stories now we had john up here the other day he said john boyega boyega yeah he said this was his uh easiest role because

he said he didn't have to train he was like which robe am i gonna wear that was a tough thing to decide which robe he was wearing because he said you guys did the work and he said it was amazing watching you guys really get to play he said he loved it though and he felt very comfortable on set because there were so many black women around yes oh, yes, he did. He said y'all would tell him if he had a crust in his lip or a crust in his eye. You know, he was very excited about that. Now, the thing about John that was amazing

about his involvement is he normally obviously he's a leading man. But he came aboard this. He used his power to help us get this made, help us get that green light. He obviously wanted to work with V. get that green light. He obviously wanted to work with V, but that was big. He just wanted to be there to support black women. And he was incredible on set. He came when he wasn't shooting just to watch, to take it in, to take in the

environment. So he, yeah, he was a king. How many no's did you get before you got the yes? And what reason would they give you to say this isn't going to work or we're passing? Well, it's any number of things. It could be fighting for the actors, okay? A black actress, especially dark-skinned black actress, is not going to have the same resume as a white actor, okay?

So then you have to fight for them because everything is about what you've done before. How much money that movie made. That you did before. You have to fight for the director. You know. The studios approved directors. Who are the Steven Spielbergs.

The Christopher Nolans. The David Finchers. They have their own movies. They don't have to do Woman King. You know. You have to fight for the budget. You have to fight. You know what, you have to fight for the budget. You have to fight. You know what?

You have to fight for everything, even hair and makeup, okay? Because there's no precedent. I just have to add this because Gina said it, so I have to keep it going. It's the whole idea of support. And supporting is

different than just helping. Supporting is caring. You're always, that net that's always there. And the thing about our movies, this is a predominantly black female led movie. There is no white savior in it. If you do not plop your money down to see

the movie, then it is going to be really hard for the next black artist to come into that room and get a movie greenlit that's going to be 10, 15, 20 years because we will set a precedent that we did a movie that y'all didn't want to see.

It's as simple as that. It's not like okay, we just didn't want to see this movie. No, you don't want to see dark-skinned women driving the narrative in a global box office. That's why when people have that conversation about diversity, I'm like, yes, that's great, but you've got to spend them dollars, too. If you want more diversity, when these movies drop, you've got to go see them. And it's exclusively in theater. Which, by the way, I'm going to see it on Saturday.

So I have a whole day planned to go see it on Saturday when I arrive to where I have to fly out to. And so we're making a date to go with my girls. But I want to encourage everybody to go see it because we're so used to things now, you know, streaming and being able to rent it at home. But go to the theater. It's such a great experience. And I said, this is something you have to see in the theater. No doubt. And also, on top of everything else, it's a hella fun movie.

Yeah, I was about to say that. And from the very beginning, you don't have to wait. You're going to be dropping off that roller coaster from the very beginning. So sneak your snacks in, bring that big bag, whatever you got to do. You know what I'm doing? Because I have four daughters. I know Charlamagne has four daughters, so I want to

take them and see them. I was going to ask, does it make you nervous with everybody kind of scared of movie theaters? They're not back yet like and we want to take them and see them. I was going to ask, does it make you nervous with everybody, you know, kind of scared of movie theaters? They're not back yet like we should be. Does that make you nervous at all? I mean, it's, you know, it is a, I just, I don't know what's going to happen. You know, certainly Top Gun brought people back.

Actually, Spider-Man right before that brought people back. I think it's about the incentive of is this interesting enough? Get out your bed, climb into the car, and go. As you mentioned, this really is an experience to go see and we want you to see it on the big screen and we want you to have that communal experience

of everybody yelling and screaming. It's fun. What do roles like this make you feel about American patriarchy and the roles they tell us men and women are supposed to play? Tusa. Come on, Tusa.

Gina. You got some swords in the back if y'all want to fight. I'll take it right now. Sorry, can I have the question again? What do roles like this make you think You got some swords in the back if y'all want to fight. Yeah, I'll take it right now because they're home. Sorry, can I have the question again? What do roles like this make you think about just American patriarchy and the roles they tell us men and women are supposed to play? Well, it's not necessarily just American patriarchy.

I think it's globally. Global. You see it back in South Africa as well. Just from my history, I know that the shows that I've been on in South Africa were extremely hard to be commissioned because, again, dark-skinned black women aren't sellable as far as people are concerned. And this, I think this movie will show the opposite. It shows, you know, the humanity of the dark-skinned black woman.

It shows that we are people who are talented. We've got something of value to add. And that whatever the system has deemed as the standard isn't necessarily true. What about executives at studios who didn't know the story? Did they say this could never be true? There would never be a group of women who were fighting like this. Did anybody say that? I, well, I think the world would say that.

I think that, you know, we have a narrative that's out there that says that there's a lot of things that we can't be. You know, we can't be muscular. We can't take down a 250-pound man. You know, we can't be humanized. We can't be a lot of things and and i think that the best movies that we have are movies that disband all of that and um i think you're gonna see it because i let me tell you something i felt good in my body for the first time like this i mean as I mean, as,

I mean, come on, Tussauds. I mean, because it served me. Yeah. It really did. At first,

I was like, Gina wants me to bulk up. I can't be walking around here all bulked up. And then all of a sudden, it's a sense of pride to redefine femininity, to redefine womanhood. And that's what we have to do

as black women because, you know, when going to acting school, I was always taught, if you're not 90 pounds, you don't look, you know, like a 90 pound, you know, blonde haired, blue eyed woman, then you're just ugly. You're just not feminine. You're not a woman. This just blasted a hole through that. Watching those previews definitely made me feel like I got to go work out. And I saw that you guys posted the woman who actually trained you all.

Gabriella McClain. Yeah, so is there gonna be some type of video that everybody can? Yes. Okay, I think that's a great idea. Because I'm gonna say the first thing I saw, I was like, I need to. The Woman King workout video is coming?

Yeah. You think that's a good idea, huh? Absolutely. You better be ready for her. And you know what? I'm not yet. What I want to say is that, because people might think, oh, only women need to do this workout. We had Hero and Jordan working out with Gabby.

Oh, they were. Quarter to vomiting. I wanted to cry as well. It was hard. Gina, you decided to work out with them. Yeah. Did you want to punish yourself, or was it one of those things you wanted to see how hard the workout was? No.

Because you didn't have to. Yeah, the thing is, I joined because I knew how hard it was. Having, you know, trained as an athlete. And I needed to be, like, if I'm going to tell you to do something as a director, I should be willing to do it myself. But also, before every film, I trained just to get stamina built up my mind and my body and here I had

free trainers so I'm going to take advantage and you're an athlete already right Love and Basketball that was based on your life

yeah that's so dope to me I was just watching that last week again because you know it's always on you really played a man for his heart

in real life there was some liberty and that was a movie people didn't think would work either when you did it You really played a man for his heart in real life? There was some liberty. And that was a movie people didn't think would work either when you did it. Yeah, no, everybody turned that one down too. And that's a classic. Classic.

Classic. You'd be like, that's my favorite movie. Gina, why was it important for a woman, especially a woman of color, to direct A Woman King? Man, it had to be from our point of view. Our lens, what I brought to it. As a director, it's a vision. It's my vision. What do I want the audience to see? How do I want these women portrayed?

I just think somebody else who didn't have the love of our people, love of these women, they may have made a movie that was just about kick-ass women killing, and that's it. But I wanted to show our humanity. I knew we needed to see our humanity. And that's the thing why more of us have to tell our own stories is because our lens, we're putting a camera on what we want to see, and it makes a huge difference. So how important is it for black Americans

to have a connection to the motherland? I think, so from what I've observed, and I talk about it with most of my friends is there is an identity that was stripped from African-Americans when you know they were taken from this land. I have a confidence in me that I cannot possibly fathom you know what life would be like without knowing who I am. You know, again, I was talking to my friend about this the other day that, yes, we had apartheid and, you know, we have our own system that oppressed us, but we still knew where

we came from. I can say I am of the Zulu tribe, you know, King Shaga, and I can trace my history. I can take my confidence in that my king fought A, B, and C to see X, Y, Z happen. And so for African Americans, that was taken from them. And so there's, I'm noticing this constant search for something that cannot be filled by anything that this space might hold. And tracing whatever, Africa might be the answer to that. Ms. Davis and Gina, I'd love for you all to answer that question too. Well, what we did intentionally on this film,

because oftentimes you hear a little bit of conflict, is that we wanted this cast to come from all over our diaspora. So we had African-American actors, South African, West African, London, Jamaican, Ugandan. We wanted all of them to come together so that it was black women telling the story of our ancestors together. And, of course, you celebrate each other's cultures, but it was black women as a collective. And that's a vibe we wanted on set.

And that's what we wanted to put up on screen and hopefully inspire to stop the division because we all came from the same place. Well, I've felt like I've spent my whole life running and chasing and trying to find me. You know, because I've been defined by a culture that really has had a very definitive idea of who I was. And it's been negative in order to control, in order to just suppress. And so when I went to Africa for the first time when I was 25, it changed my life.

It just blew once again a hole in it. I was coming from Juilliard where the big thing was disappearing, trying to become a perfectly white actor with speech training and trying to lose weight, never happened and I don't know why I was trying to make it happen um but once again that's when I went to Africa I saw the why that's what I saw I saw the why and I can't say that I'm I'm not still in search of because I'm not African so I don't know what tribe I'm from. I still don't know that.

I don't know that I'm Zulu. I don't know, you know, what my great-great-great-great-great-grandfather could have done. But I just know that there's something else out there that I was, that America has not given me. You from South Carolina like me,

so it's probably West African. I didn't mind. I'm West African. It's Senegal, Guinea-Bissau, and Sierra Leone. That's my... No, see, I'm Kenyan, Cameroon. Yeah. Oh, wow.

Okay. I was going to ask, you know, for people that don't understand, you guys had to fight so much to put your product out of what you wanted, whether it was this film or Love and Basketball. Why do you continue to fight and much for to put your product out of what you wanted whether it was this film or love and basketball why do you continue to fight and not let go because it would have been easy to say you know what let's go to another movie but in all those cases the movies that you did became

classics and and the fact that our people love them so why is it so important to continue to fight even if they say no and shut you out? I mean, honestly. Because it was easy just to let go. It is. Because if I don't fight, they won't get made, and then we won't see ourselves. And that is absolutely my goal, is to put us up on screen to be inspired by.

I learned early on in my career it just takes one yes, and that's the thing. Fight, fight, career, it just takes one yes. And that's the thing. Fight, fight, fight till you get that one yes. And you do that when you're doing things that you're passionate about. The passion fuels the fight. If I was doing stuff where I just thought, well, maybe Hollywood would buy this, then it's easy to give up. But I tell stories that mean something to me that's going to mean something to us and that I'm passionate about. How do you know when it is time to let go?

We all have a passion that we like or something that we love. Maybe the world might not love it and be like, maybe it's time to let that go. When do you have that mind frame, if you ever do? I've never let go. I do very few movies

because when I do it, it's a story I have to tell. It feels like the woman king from what I've been seeing, because when I do it, it's something, a story I have to tell. It just doesn't feel, oh go ahead. It feels like the woman king from what I've been seeing, 100% on Rotten Tomatoes, everybody that I know, one of my friends was like, I gotta go see it again because the movie theater was so loud from people responding.

She was like, this experience, you know, it was messed up. That's Taylor right there. She's the one that went and she said it was so loud. Oh yeah, my friend said it. Now by the way, that's the only problem with going to see a movie full of black people. That's the only thing. Okay?

But I saw the 100% on Rotten Tomatoes. I've seen the amazing reviews and people saying this is like a life-changing movie. Did you brace yourself to think that maybe people wouldn't accept it

before it came out because, you know, you don't know what people's responses are going to be initially and it was something that was hard to get done and something we haven't seen before.

You can believe in something wholeheartedly. And I believed in its cast. I believed in the story. I believed in what we were doing. But no one sets out to make a bad movie. That's the scariest thing as a director. And probably for actors, it's a leap of faith. But to be on the other side of that is kind of amazing.

And, I mean, I have two boys that I have three scary screenings. The first one is showing my husband. He's the first person, and he'll be honest, as he should be. Did I make a good movie or did I fuck up? And then the second scariest one is showing my two boys because they're going to be honest. But also to do this kind of thing, you've got to be away. It has to mean something. And so do they watch it and are they proud of the work?

And both boys, Cassius and Toussaint, they love the movie. And they've watched it twice, so they loved it more the second time because I think the same thing you see there's so much coming at you in that first time

that they just really got to see more things it just doesn't feel fair to have to convince a bunch of culturally clueless white people about why our stories are so important

she's like well you said it so what drew you to want to be in this movie when you saw the script? So I only saw the script during my audition process. I first, I had like a general meeting with a GV Productions, G.S. Tennant, about his husband in 2019, who told me about the story. And I was shocked because I am South African.

This is a story that happened in Africa, and I'd never, ever, ever, ever, ever heard of it. And Julius, you know, the heart that he had for the story and telling me about it made me absolutely fall in love with it. And then on top of that, it was action, and there would be an opportunity to work with Viola. And I was just like, oh, my gosh, I need to do this, even if it means I'm just, like, wiping you know just like wipe the screen in and out type situation

and um eventually got a chance to audition and then I saw the script and I was just like oh my gosh I can't because you know I'm still like fairly new to this industry and mentally I've prepared myself you know like I'm gonna have to put in the time it should take you know at least like five years ten years to get to a place where I would qualify to audition for something like this you know and it was an amazing script and again it was just like I need to do my best that's all I can do and then after my audition Gina wished me luck with my career which was heartbreaking. It's not an aww.

What? You said you're looking for a career. Damn, Gina. Gina like, let me defend myself. That's cruel. That's like who I am beating so now I'm lifting another basketball. You know y'all playing with a heart. Why would you beat her?

Why would you play so hard? In her audition, I literally knew immediately that she was Na'vi. But, so I knew it in my gut, my heart, my soul. But I still needed V to see her. I needed Julie to see her. I needed the studio to see her. So I couldn't say you're the one. Yeah, true.

So I said, good luck. Good luck with your career, it sounds like. It sounds like it's all right. Good luck with your career. Thank you, Nancy. I'll be sincere. Because I see such amazing things for her. She's a generational talent, for real. How was that process?

Was there pressure? Not at all. Okay. Not at all. So after reading the script and having, I had a creative meeting conversation with Viola about the script. Very chill, very, just like give and take. And I was grateful for that opportunity

because, you know, prior to working, well, hearing of this production and watching her interviews, I identified her process of working as the same as mine, which for me was like, oh my gosh, I'm not crazy if I do the same as mine, which meant, which for me was like, Oh my gosh, I'm not crazy if I do stuff like this. And so to have her be that, to have that creative conversation, to have her then, you know, after having gotten the role, have her call me to discuss the script, exchange ideas was

absolutely amazing. Train with her, suffer with her, switching and you and, you know, and, yeah, just, Viola is an absolute clown. Like, people don't know that she is an absolute,

absolute clown on set. There was never a time where you feel like, oh my gosh, I have to prove myself to her. Oh, I have to keep up with her. It was just,

it's a beautiful give and take. What were some behind the scenes things that were happening while you guys were on set that are memorable for you the food Yeah, no Black women with bad food. No, it's not bad food, but you know, it's it's it was a very strict diet

But every once in a while you got the fish sandwich With the multigrain bread. And me and LaShonna, I'd always run after LaShonna who plays a Zogi. And she would be tearing that sandwich up. And I'd say, LaShonna, give me some of that fish sandwich. I'm going to dig that. And she's like, get away from me. So both of y'all sick of grilled chicken at this point?

Oh, my God. The white fish. And quinoa. I mean. I like quinoa. sick of grilled chicken at this point? Oh, my God. The white fish. And quinoa. I mean. I like quinoa. I can. It does make me go to the bathroom. The chia seed pudding.

Yeah. Yeah. No. I feel like a movie like this creates a different level of sisterhood. Yes. A different bond. Than a other film. Absolutely.

Gina, did you eat those things, too? Or did you just train? Nah. Sometimes. She bought us pies, though. I was bad every once in a while. Cause in South Africa they have these incredible pies. It's like fresher than anything.

So every once in a while, cause I knew how hard they were working. I would slip them a pie. I'm not gonna lie, I would eat some candy late at night. I'd put it under the bed and plop it in my mouth and then wake up and go, why did I do that? Oh, no.

I had my stuff in the tray now. Oh, yes. And we like... Tusa, can I talk to you? You got powder all over your fingers. Viola, did you read these reviews or look at any of those responses? Oh, my God, no.

Because I know you normally don't do that but with this one I can't do it I can't do it I can't do it well it's really good just saying

I'm one of those people I have a little bit you know what I was going to say can I cuss a little bit of course you can cuss as much as you want I'm a little bit full of shit

because at first I'll say I can't take compliments you know it's about the work and then if you don't want? I'm a little bit full of shit because at first I'll say, I can't take compliments. It's about the work. And then if you don't compliment me, I'm like, they didn't say anything. We human. Don't bullshit.

We human. We all want that validation from somebody. It's hard work, though. You want people to recognize. It's human nature. Literally, we can have 50 great reviews, and then there's one hater, and then you focus on that. And we don't want to do that.

We know what we did. We're proud of what we did. We don't want anyone to dent. But I have to say, and too, so you can attest to it, Gina, too, it's so great being with sisters. Yeah. I mean, and all of us were different. Yeah.

But absolutely, you're in the room and you know, you know that you know that you know that we have each other's back. You know, you know, just like the Algorji, we are going to fight for each other. We're going to pull for each other. We're going to hope for each other, you know. And my God, you just don't get that all the time. You go out in the world, you're like, come on, sister, you know it's hard.

Why are you doing this to me? I mean, you know, we can get into that. But this, the joy of my life. Come on. Joy of your life. I saw you, Ms. Davis, say that you know this movie's performance will be judged in a way that films with white directors and cast won't. Can you elaborate on that?

Because it's never been done before. And what I find in general is that we're scrutinized. Image and message sometimes is more important than execution. You know, it's got to mean something. And what does it mean? What is it saying? Are you insulting us? You know, it could be any number of things

because it's the first. Whenever you're the first one out of the gate, you just have to go through that plate of glass. But I know that I know that I know that I know that no matter what, even with the scrutiny, you're going to have a damn good time for two hours and six minutes in that theater. You just are.

You're going to laugh. You're going to cry. You're going to stand up and cheer. I don't care if you gonna stand up and cheer i don't care if you're a white man i don't care if you're a white woman i don't care black woman black man you are gonna be on your feet and you're gonna sit with these women and you're gonna root for them what did you what did you learn about uh our story as black people by doing this film like something you didn't know? There's nothing. I mean, other than the story of the Agoge, for me it felt right. I know that we're human. I know that we're all of those things.

I want to show other people what we are. You know, I always say if I can sit with Robert De Niro in any Martin Scorsese movies, if I could sit for two hours 40 minutes with a Meryl Streep or a Julianne Moore or a Cate Blese movies, if I could sit for two hours, 40 minutes with a Meryl Streep or a Julianne Moore or a Cate Blanchett, then you could sit with me.

You could sit with Tussauds. You could sit with Lashana. You could sit with Sheila. You could sit with us and understand that we're complicated. We are as women, as black women. We're not just all just strong, nurturing. I mean, I played a lot of strong, black women. We're not just all strong, nurturing. I mean, I played a lot of strong, nurturing women. I was going to ask, when do you guys get a chance

to wind down? You know, we just seen you a couple of months ago with your book, and you have TV shows and more movies on the way. I know that was a lot. Do you guys get a chance to just relax? And do you? I mean, I for real need a nap because after Old Guard

I went straight into this but I was going to take a break after the Old Guard and then the script came it was like damn I'm not getting a break but I'm looking forward to that but also my mind is always going I already know what I want to write next so I will

take a little time but then I love what we do and I I already know what I want to write next. So I will take a little time. But then, yeah, like I love what we do. And I still do. And I never want to lose that. What about you, Miss Davis? You look like you want a vacation for so much. Oh, I do. And I'm going straight into Hunger Games.

I mean, directly into Hunger Games, which is awesome director Francis Lawrence, awesome role, the villain role. But you know what? Everyone's always saying, you know you know you got to be ambitious sometimes you've got to be ambitious about rest about nurturing your soul and your heart you know they say that the only way to treat being overwhelmed is to do absolutely nothing. It's in those spaces that you just, that you find who you are, even, that you connect with your life.

And don't feel guilty about it. Sometimes we feel like if you're not being active and working, it's a bad thing, but you need that to, like, refresh yourself. It's trauma-based. You don't feel like you deserve to rest. That's why they say being busy is a trauma response a lot of times. It is.

I was going to ask you about the book, too. You gave so much of yourself in your book. Was that exhausting or exhilarating? Both. Okay. There were some things in that book that it really cost me to write. Yeah, it did. And to share it with the world, people that you don't know. But then an

incredible thing happened, which is, I don't care what you have to say about me. This is who I am. The good and the bad, the mess, the beauty, the joy. And that's what I have always been ashamed of. And now it's like, you know, it's like that saying, the privilege of a lifetime is being who you are. And so that was the genesis of the book, but it did cost me. When you say cost you, you mean like personally or like with people in your family? It cost me to just put it on paper. Wow.

It did. Writing about my mom, you know, writing about a very personal event, my abortion when I was 28 years old. That was a really, really, the fact that I even just said it now makes me want to just, writing about that, but writing about it honestly. And not from a political perspective, but a personal perspective, which is more of a paradox. Yeah. You do help so many people. We got so many calls, emails, comments with people.

You open up so much where they felt, it felt relatable. Like they were going through it and they felt like somebody else was on their side. Somebodyails, comments with people. You open up so much where they felt, it felt relatable. Like they were going through it and they felt like somebody else was on their side. Somebody else has been through it. It allowed them to have a little freedom. Like we got, it was so many. And the book, it feels like you're opening the door to a therapy session. Like these are things you would tell your therapist and not share publicly.

But it seems like we're eavesdropping in on a therapy session, which in itself will make you feel vulnerable. Well, I think that everybody has to find a home. They have to find home, home meaning that place, that sacred space within you where you find your peace, where you find your joy that is totally just separate from the world. And that's what I've always been in search of, and I realize it's because I have to own my story. You know? I know you guys are doing a runner. You got to go, but I just wanted to know,

were there any parts of the movie that y'all had to take out? Because, you know, you might shoot 20 hours of movies, but you got to limit it down. That's a Gina question. What was the best part that you didn't want to take out, but you just had to? Well, the beauty of this, I can say

my director's cut is only eight minutes longer. That's how it should be. The movie up on the screen, I've always said as a director, I have to believe everything up there. So if I'm fighting with the studio, if they want me to cut something that I don't believe in, I'm going'm gonna fight I can't not do that so yeah the movie up on

screen is what I wanted to put I mean the original like if I put everything in it was three and a half hours and so only I have that copy but it wasn't you know sometimes less is more. And when you start to shape it and shape it, themes, characters, they just pop more. And so, but it takes me a minute to get there. I have 10 weeks for a director's cut. And for the first five weeks, I'm not cutting anything. And then you get less precious and less precious.

And again, less is more. What is best for the film? How crazy is that fight though right because you're the director you see a vision it's your vision is what you want and then the man calls and says the white man don't you say the man okay calls and say we want you to do this so we want you to do that but it's not your vision this is my vision this is my shit how difficult is that exactly how I sound in the room. Exactly. And it's, that's the thing. Like, I came in with a vision.

Y'all knew what the vision was going in. And it happens every single time. And then slowly but surely people try and dent your vision. And that's where the fight comes in. And I feel like so many young filmmakers come in and think they have to bend. But for me, and that whole thing the fight comes in. And I feel like so many young filmmakers come in and think they have to bend. But for me, and that whole thing of pick your battles, but with vision, there's no picking your battles.

Every battle you have to win, or you're going to look up on screen and see something you don't recognize. That's right. And after all that we went through, the beauty of this was when I'm fighting to protect and to save scenes, I knew that they were behind me.

I knew that they'd be in the fight with me, and that's an incredible gift. But at the end of the day, on this movie, I will say, I was told by the head of the studio, you know, they have final cut. But listen to our notes. Just, like, take them in. Don't just blow them off, but have final cut. But listen to our notes. Just, like, take them in. Don't just blow them off, but take them in. But other than that, we are going to give you your cut. This is going to be your film.

And that doesn't always happen. I just got two more questions. I only had one, but you made me think of something. When you make these films, what's more important, vision or intention? Vision. Vision drives drives everything every single decision whether it be wardrobe whether it be who i hire who i cast where we shoot um every single decision starts with that vision and i have one question too um i just wanted to ask part of the story is also africans assisting in the slave trade Was it harder to get those roles filled?

Because nobody wanted to play that role. I would think, unless some people like being the villain. It was about we're being truthful with the story. And every single role is necessary. And it is brave to take on a role like that. And props to Hero Finds Tiffin, who played the... Oh, I was about to ruin the movie. Wow.

I'm glad that's you, Jim. There were a couple roles. But it's important because it's important to tell the story and we need those people. But we were going to go in and tell the truth.

I think that's going to be new to a lot of people, especially a younger generation. They're going to be like, really? Everything's assisted in the slave trade? Yeah, I mean, like globally every single civilization participated in some way you know um but for us it was um having our our women our goji women and the niska she represents those

within the kingdom who were pushing for change um and that's what they ultimately did. So my final question is for all three of y'all. What do you want people to take away from The Woman King? Tusa, you want to start? Tusa. So what it did for me was give me a stronger voice. And I've said this before, that before doing this project, I didn't realize that I lived my life apologizing for existing and through this through partnering with viola and gina and telling the story and my character who's so assertive so spirited determined

you know who knows who she is and what she wants um i found my voice but also the whole process of getting this project done made me realize that you know we have desires we have dreams we know what we want but there will be a fight like a fight is guaranteed and ours is to push through it so whatever it is that you feel your purpose to do the resistance doesn't mean that you're not supposed to be doing it. You just need to fight through it. There will be scars, but it's part of the journey. For me, it's really three things. I want you to leave enlightened because you're learning about yourself. You're learning about these women inspired by these incredible women and the story and this environment,

and then empowered to take in, see yourself reflected heroically, know that we all have this innate warrior within us that's squelched oftentimes when you're a woman, and go out there and fight. Ms. Davis? I never want to tell an audience what to take away. Who knows how it's going to land on them? I have no idea.

But I know that I have a 12-year-old daughter who saw the movie. And she cried profusely. And then she said she was so proud of me. And then I get all of her text messages on her phone.

She showed me a text message that she was going back and forth with a friend who had also seen the movie. And they said, oh, wasn't she great? Wasn't Tuzo great? Wasn't LaShawn? Oh my God. It was literally art. And then

she says, and I'm not just saying that because it's my mom. So she showed me the text message and I said, thank you so much. I text her back because I'm on the road. And I said, thank you so much, my mom. So she showed me the text message. And I said, thank you so much. I text her back because I'm on the road. And I said, thank you so much, my baby. And then I wrote in all caps, AGOJI with exclamation point. And then I waited, waited, waited. And I got a buzz on my phone.

And the response was, HUSU. And I thought that that was awesome, to inject in my daughter what I didn't have. That sort of spirit of the warrior. It's like, whatever you dream, whatever you dream is beyond fear. Yeah.

You know? And that was everything. Brought me to tears. Amen. Go support the Woman King this weekend. Everybody go see the Woman King now. Itought me to tears. Hey man, go support the woman king this weekend. Everybody go see the woman king now. It is out in theaters. Thank you guys for joining us so much.

Absolutely. And do you ever have to back your son down every once in a while like he thinks mom lost and just be like, you know what, give me this basketball. I have to back this little boy to bound. You know, the last time I played he was 14 and he legit beat me and I was like, I ain't coming.

I promise you I promise you you could be Envy because I've seen him play basketball thank you well thank you so much guys for joining us check out the woman

the woman king it's the breakfast club good morning thank you ladies Hello, my undeadly darlings. It's Teresa, your resident ghost host. And do I have a treat for you. Haunting is crawling out from the shadows, and it's going to be devilishly good. We've got chills, thrills, and stories that'll make you wish the lights stayed on.

So join me, won't you? Let's dive into the eerie unknown together. Sleep tight, if you can. Listen to Haunting on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, five-year-old Cuban boy Elian Gonzalez was found off the coast of Florida. And the question was,

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