The Bridge with Peter Mansbridge - Your Turn -- From Inflation to Shrinkflation

Episode Date: May 23, 2024

The question of the week was "Name one thing you do to try to beat inflation."  There may not have been as many answers as usual but there are some good ones that will make you think. And some thoughts about shrinkflation too which is definitely a part of this story as well.

And hello there, Peter Mansbridge here. You are just moments away from the latest episode of The Bridge. It's Thursday. It's your turn. It's inflation on your mind. Coming right up. And hello there, Peter Mansbridge here. Welcome to Thursday. On this shortened week, I hope you've been enjoying it, clearly. One of the things you've chosen to do is, and it's interesting because I'm not quite sure what the reasoning may be. You know, we threw out a question on tuesday so shortened weeks i didn't give you a lot of time question was name one thing you're doing to beat inflation that you discovered over those last few years that where you can save money you can not be in the situation

well maybe not save money but not have to spend more, right? So we threw that question out, and you know what? For the first time since we started these questions of the week, it's been a fairly limited response. So either you figure inflation's beat, the numbers have been going down, and that's encouraging. Or you say, I give up. You know, there's nothing I can do. I've tried, and I can't beat it.

Well, that's not to say we didn't get any responses. We did get responses, and I'm going to read them. It's just not anywhere near as much as we've been getting in other questions of the week over the last, well, five months. I know people are getting ready for summer. I'm getting ready for summer. I'm getting ready for the big bridge breakout for the summer months. Got about another month to go before that starts. Looking forward to a summer off. There will be a number of shows during the summer and special encore editions,

but there will be some live shows, including with Chantel and Bruce. We'll do a couple of special good talks and we'll do a couple of special shows on the U.S. election goings-on, especially around the big conventions. The Democrats and the Republicans

hold their conventions in July and August, and we'll do shows around those too. But that's not why we're here today. We're here to talk about inflation and one of its cousins. And I've been thinking about that ever since I got a letter from one of you. One of our regulars, Don Dufour, writes quite often. Dawn wrote, I guess it was a couple of weeks ago. And she said, I want to suggest the general theme of shrinkflation as a possible idea.

You know, people could provide examples. Is there anything we can do about it? Your creative twist on the topic? Apparently I have creative twists. That's good. Anyway, she included a picture, which has been a common theme in the articles I've read on shrinkflation. They've been kind of targeting craft, craft foods.

Not that they're the only ones, believe me, they are far from the only ones who are involved in shrinkflation. But as Dawn says, today I bought a replacement salad dressing. And she's got pictures of it. It's French dressing in two craft containers. One the old one, one the new one. She paid exactly the same amount for both. Yet one, the newer one, has 50 milliliters less salad dressing in it

than the old one. So that's a way of saying our prices haven't changed. You're right, they haven't. But, honey, I shrank the salad dressing because there's a lot less in there. Well, 50 milliliters less. But Kraft is hardly alone. Hardly alone. There are all kinds of people doing this. Companies. I'll name a few. Well, you know, chocolate bars, candy. You know, you know that.

You just say, yeah, I mean, if you're more than 20, 25 years old, you can remember how big chocolate bars used to be. They're not that big now. They're pretty small compared to what they used to be. They're not that big now. They're pretty small compared to what they used to be. But hey, the price, the price is basically the same for a lot less. That's shrinkflation.

And you get paper products, drinks, snacks, candy, dairy, household, food. It's all the same. The packaging has got smaller. Here's one you probably never thought of. I certainly didn't until I read about it. Toilet roll.

Did you know that toilet roll has changed in size, or at least in some brands? It's smaller. Same price. Smaller. The width of the paper. Not the thickness, the width. Major piece of investigative journalism on that one.

Who'd have thought it, as they say. Now, is there a way around it? Don raised the question. Is there a way around shrinkflation? Well, it's pretty tricky. Companies put out their products, and we determine whether or not we want to buy them or not. But in South Korea,

according to the Financial Times, they have cracked down on shrinkflation. How have they done that? Producers of food and daily necessities must inform shoppers of any reduction to their product sizes or face fines, so says the Financial Times in writing about this. on, I guess it was last week, was designating the practice of slimming down products while keeping their prices unchanged and not informing consumers as an unfair transaction. This measure is to prevent a situation where reasonable consumers are forced to bear

indirect price increases. Because sure, that's what it is. It's a price increase, right? You're getting less product, price remains the same, so the price has gone up. It's difficult to notice, says the Financial Times, quoting one of the leaders of the Fair Trade Commission, it's difficult to notice changes in product sizes or quantify if the prices and packages remain the same. South Korean move comes amidst international anger at the practice of shrinking products to pass on the cost of inflation to consumers. Joe Biden, in March, criticized companies for downsizing products, while French

finance minister Bruno Le Maire has called shrinkflation a scam and announced that supermarkets would have to label products where volumes had been reduced. Okay, so shrinkflation, that's inflation. So what's the penalty in South Korea? The new rule will take effect in August. Violators will be subject to a $3,700 fine for a first offense and double that for a second. I'm not sure how much of a penalty that is, but it's something.

If you want more on that, go to the Financial Times and punch in South Korea. That'll give you some indication. Okay. Now, I thought about this. And I thought about the changing nature of packaging and pricing and how they relate to each other. And I thought back to my childhood. And when I think back, my first memories are mid-50s,

leaving Malaya, where we lived in Kuala Lumpur. Heading to, by sea, to London and then to Canada. Immigrants to Canada. 1954. Just over 70 years ago. And we lived in a number of homes, rental homes, in the first few years we were in Ottawa. My dad was working for the federal government in the public service. And I remember at one point we lived in this area called the Glebe,

which is interesting because now in the Glebe, on Bank Street in the Glebe, if you live in Ottawa, I'm one of the part owners of a restaurant on Bank Street in Ottawa. So I'm in that neighborhood quite a bit. However, that's not what we're here to talk about. Shamelessly plugging Gia Cantina, great restaurant on Bank Street in Ottawa. But what I remember about those early days was there was a little corner store almost directly across the street from us in the Glebe, and I used to love going in there and looking at things.

I couldn't afford to buy anything, but we used to look at the stuff. My sister and I, chocolate bars and things like that that we weren't accustomed to. But one of the things was Coke, Coca-Cola. And in those days, mid-50s, you could buy a Coke for a nickel, five cents. It was a small Coke. The large Coke was a dime. But the small Coke, which was the main seller, was five cents. Now, they had an even smaller bottle, kind of like a tiny miniature bottle,

almost like a perfume thing. There was two cents. It was more of a kind of a gimmick thing. But the main one was the five-cent Coke. Now, what I didn't realize at the time is Coke in that bottle had been five cents almost since day one of Coke in the late 1800s. In fact, they used to have as one of their signs, ice cold Coca-Cola, As always, five cents. Right?

So that's like the late 1800s, the early 1900s, through the First World War, through the 20s, the 30s, into the Second World War. It was still five cents. It didn't change. Now obviously, cost of production must have gone up. And yes, I guess the fact was, five cents, they still were making a profit. Until the late 1950s. And keep in mind, Coke kind of owned the soft drink market. I don't know, it's like 75%, 85% of the soft drink market was Coke.

Coke owned it. Anyway, by the mid-1950s, Coke executives were getting a little worried because the cost of production was now almost equal to the sales price. And they could forecast when they were going to be in a losing position. So they had to make consideration. What are we going to do about this? And one of the ways was, okay, well, let's charge six cents for that small bottle of Coke. And they thought about it and they said,

well, you know, the problem with that is you've got to have a nickel and a penny. Couldn't put in a dime or a quarter because in those days, those machines couldn't kick out change. So you had to have exact change. So you go, okay, what are we going to do here? So this is quite something.

Listen to this. Coke, and this gives you some indication of the kind of power it had in the American economy in those days, actually went to the U.S. Mint and said, we would like you to mint a new coin, a coin for 7.5 cents. So there'll be a 7.5 cent coin. And that's what'll be used for a Coke.

Well, the Mint thought about this and they said, no, we're not going to do that. Coke's important. Coke's a big part of our economy, but you don't have that kind of power, buddy. So it didn't happen. So eventually, you know what happened. Prices went up, went up to a dime. Then you got machines that kicked out change. So I don't know how much a Coke costs now, but it's a lot more than five cents a bottle. Every once in a while when you go to one of those kind of neighborhood flea markets, you'll see the old bottles of Coke, the small, not the miniature, well, you might see some of those miniature ones, but you'll see the five cent a bottle Coke. And sometimes they'll do a little special gimmicky thing at stores and they'll bring them back out and sell them for whatever,

you know, two bucks a bottle or something. But that's an interesting story because that's not shrinkflation. It's not inflation. Well, it is inflation. But it's inflation for a reason right and let's look how long coke held off before they changed things five cents a bottle for almost a hundred years didn't change now it's changed a lot since the mid-50s as as we all know. But so was everything else, right? So there's your little history lesson about Coke,

but how it fits into the bigger picture about shrinkflation, inflation, and what, if anything, we're going to do about it. I mean, the good news this week was that the inflation rate went down again. It's 2-point-something percent. Most people talk about inflation as if it's still way up there. And one of the reasons it's kind of up more than we tend to think it is is because of shrinkflation. All right, I'm not an economist, and, you know, all my research was done online for this opening little monologue.

But I hope you enjoyed it. And I'm sure I'll get letters saying, you know, Peter, you were right, but you didn't consider this, that, or the other thing. And I love reading those letters too. So don't be shy. Shall we, shall we begin?

Well, maybe we should begin after we take a break. There's a couple of other things about today. Thursday's not only your turn, it's the random ranter's turn. But the ranter, the ranter has been, remember the story about the ranter? The ranter is just a guy, right? He lives in Western Canada, the prairies. He has a real job. But in his real job, he does a lot of driving.

He kind of, when he's out there driving, he's thinking. And he's thinking about any number of different things that affect us in the issues of the day. And he does his rant. Well, this week, for the first time in almost two years, the rancher says, you know what? I can't do it this week. I've been like so busy.

I've had a few ideas, but they haven't formulated yet. I have to take the week off. Well, who's to say you can't do that? So the ranter gets the week off. There'll be no rant from the ranter this week. I'm sure he'll make up for it next week. But we wish him well with his heavy schedule and look forward to whatever he has to say to us next week. All right.

It is your turn. So it's time to get to your letters. And we'll do that right after this. And welcome back. Peter Mansbridge here with a Thursday episode of The Bridge. It's your turn. And finally, we're going to get to your letters here. On the topic of inflation, the question was, name one thing that you do

to try and beat inflation. You're listening on SiriusXM, Channel 167, Canada Talks, or on your favorite podcast platform. However you're listening to us, we're happy to have you with us. First letter comes from Montreal. It's from Dane Stewart on the question of how do you beat inflation. Dane writes, one word, potatoes. That's right, those sweet, sweet underground treats.

Fabulous, many-eyed roots, stoic and tasty tubers. A few months ago, I was at the grocery store, and I realized I could buy a sack of potatoes for a fraction of the price of fancier options like sweet potatoes or rice or pasta. There's been no turning back since. Mashed, roasted, baked, cut into home fries, the potato has wowed me with its versatility in the kitchen and its low impact on my wallet. I know, I know, big structural problems like inflation need big structural solutions.

But until those come around, I encourage you to join me in worship at the affordable altar of the humble potato. Wow. Now, listen, you know, my doctor tells me that I've got to cut back on potatoes as part of my so far unsuccessful attempt to lose some weight. But I love potatoes too.

I love all of them. I love the mashed. I love the roasted. Baked potatoes with a little butter and sour cream. I might as well just lather them onto my belly, right? Potatoes cut into home fries. All right, Dane, we hear you. We'll all go on a potato.

That'll be what we eat now. Bill Ebert in Edmonton. I don't know about this one, Bill, but this is not going to make everybody happy. But hey, I just read them, right? Bill writes, I feel my way of dealing with inflation goes against the grain, but I consider myself a down-to-earth type of guy.

I see things in black and white. To deal with the rising cost of living, I increased the rent on my five rental homes by 25%. He's got five rental homes. This covers the cost of my mortgage and bills every month. I'm also holding off buying a new truck. I will keep the old one for five years instead of three. This way all my living expenses are covered by others and I can bank my money I make from my job. Okay, Bill, if you've got the luxury of owning five rental homes,

I guess that's one way of dealing with it. Is there no rent control in Alberta? 25% increase in your rent? Interesting. Interesting. Kevin Ellis. Now, I think Kevin is writing from Toronto. He didn't put down his location. But he does have an area code, and it's 416, and that's Toronto.

Now, it could have a Toronto phone and live in Victoria. But we'll assume that Kevin's in Toronto. Here's his idea about how to beat inflation. Eat nothing that is supported by advertising. It is not food, but expensive, unhealthy, processed chemical product sold to fund multinational companies operating single crop agricultural supply chains, killing regional crop diversity

and financial and seed product monopolies. Really. That's what Kevin says. So eat nothing that's supported by advertising. Well, advertising is actually one of the ways you find out about the product, right? Anyway, I hear you. Matthew Sklarczyk.

He's in Vernon, British Columbia. Matthew is. And he knows that most of the time I'm in Stratford, Ontario. So he writes that Vernon's about 3,700 kilometers from Stratford. That's correct, but I'm not in Stratford.

I'm not in Toronto. I'm in, today, I'm in Scotland. So it's even further. Depending on which way you choose to get here, Matthew, you can go over the pole from Vancouver. And flight-wise, that's not that much longer. I got to check the times, but it's longer than it is, say, from Toronto. But it's not that much longer.

Anyway, Matthew writes this. During this inflationary period, I realized everything is negotiable, and it's time to go to bat on my behalf. I went to my bank, and I negotiated a higher interest rate on savings by threatening to move to another bank. I asked for a raise at work and when I didn't get the entire amount, I asked for more paid vacation time to bridge the gap

and I got it. While I can't control grocery store prices, this environment allows for some small tweaks in our favor. You just have to ask. Who knows? Maybe by the summer, I'll be able to afford a steak during that extra vacation time. You know, Matthew's got a point here. The worst that can happen by asking is they say no, right?

That's the worst that can happen. As long as you're, you know, you're cordial and polite in the way you ask. But especially the question about the bank, it's a really good one. You know, I fear that too many people assume, you know what, that's their rate. That's what I got to pay when borrowing. That's their rate. That's what I got to accept when they've got your money and investing it and offering you such and such an interest rate.

But if you say, you know, listen, I've seen across the street at the bank across the street, different branch, different company, I can get a better interest rate, maybe only a quarter of a point, but that works out over time to a chunk of money. So you're going to have to match that or I'm moving everything over across the street because, you know, you may well have a checking account, a savings account, an investment account, you know, an RRSP. You may have any number of different accounts at your bank. Or you may just have one.

It doesn't matter. They're making money off it. And there's no harm in asking. You say, it's competition, baby. Let's have a little competition. You've got to be really careful on your own situation with your own employer. How you do that.

But it's one interesting way of saying, okay, I don't want more money, but I want, you know, I want an extra week or I want an extra two or three days of vacation time. Can we work something out like that? Well, you may be surprised. And as I said earlier, the worst that can happen is they say no, right? Moving on.

Benjamin Haver in Winnipeg. I'm fortunate to live near several grocery stores, all within walking distance. As a result, chief among my various cost-saving measures, I've adopted the European approach of making frequent trips to the store a few times a week to buy only the ingredients I need for dinner. By shopping more frequently and purchasing smaller amounts, I've found that I waste less food, such as forgotten veggies in the crisper,

and therefore save more money in the long run. This approach also is the added benefit of helping me get my steps in. Can't forget our steps. Yeah, have you ever thought about how much food you throw out? Do you throw out food? Do you find yourself having bought too much, and after a week you're looking that crisper and yeeks, things are looking a little

brown and you toss them. In effect, you're tossing dollars out. So Benjamin's right. Make frequent trips to the store instead of going in and buying, okay, I'm going to load up for two weeks and then find out that you didn't get anywhere near those two weeks of groceries.

Done. Ken Pellishock in Newstead, Ontario. Newstead's a rural community with a population of fewer than 600, if my research is right here. So Ken's suggestion, we're about to read, may not work everywhere. But here it is. Ken writes, I've got five chickens, which don't cost much to set up and feed if you have the space for them. The kids love them. They're fairly low maintenance. And I've got more eggs than I need. Yeah, I can, I can see that. I can't see it in a condo. I don't know where you're

going to put the chickens, put them out on the balcony. That could be dangerous. But it's a nice thought. Andrew Fobart in Edmonton. I've taken to hunting and fishing when in season to help supplement our protein supply. We've also started growing vegetable gardens for some great organic produce. We don't need a farm for this. We live in downtown Edmonton.

Anyone can do it. Also started riding a motorcycle to work to cut down on fuel costs. Well, you're right. You can be a hunter or a fisher, no matter where you live, right? As long as you can access areas where you can hunt a hunter or a fisher no matter where you live, right? As long as you can access areas where you can hunt and fish. The riding the motorcycle part, it definitely would cut down on fuel costs, but I don't know. You know, I used to own a motorcycle.

This goes way back, though. It goes back to my days in the Navy in the 1960s. I had a motorcycle when I was based at Portage Prairie, Manitoba. I loved it. It was fun. It was a different era. Didn't even have to wear a helmet then. And I go, my God, I rode one of those things

and I didn't wear a helmet? Are you crazy? I guess I was. Here's a regular, Marilyn Wallace in Fanny Bay, British Columbia. Fanny writes on how to beat inflation. My husband and I love road trips, but the cost of hotel accommodation and restaurant meals have really gone up.

Our compact sport utility vehicle, a Honda CRV, was our home on wheels for five weeks during a southern U.S. trip last winter. Even though my husband is six feet tall, we can comfortably sleep in the back once the seats are collapsed, and can even keep it warm if we are connected to electricity. All the necessary kitchen supplies fit into a medium-sized tote, and along with our old-fashioned Coleman stove and a cooler, we can make affordable, nutritious meals. We always stay in campgrounds with bathrooms and showers nearby. Even our bikes

go with us. Did I mention that we're both in our mid-60s? No problem at all. Well, good for you, Fanny and six-foot husband. It still sounds a little cramped to me, but okay. So, you saved money because of not having to book a hotel. You're telling me that not once in those five weeks did you end up in a hotel? Be honest now.

Not once. Crammed in the Honda. Using the communal bathrooms and showers. Got it. Okay. Enjoy. Nancy Taylor in Calgary. I used to shop at one store for all my weekly shopping needs

because it was convenient. Now I go where I can save money. I go to Walmart for groceries, the dollar store for household supplies, Shoppers Drug Mart on Thursdays for the 20% seniors discount. I know that. And I browse Goodwill for any good quality items

that I need, not just a good deal. That's the secret, right? Do I really need this thing that I'm looking at that's clearly a good deal, but do I need it or do I just sort of kind of want it? I remember one of my dad's sayings. You get him something for Christmas and he always said, don't get me anything for Christmas. I don't need anything.

I don't want anything. But you know what? It's your dad. You get him something for Christmas. Give it to him. He'd look at it and he'd say, I don't know how I've lived all my life without this. It was his way of saying he loved you.

I guess. Danny Spano writes from that great location. Those question marks. Danny forgot to include where he was writing from. People hate it when I tut-tut. Danny writes, one thing I'm doing to deal with the pain of inflation is avoiding drive-thrus for coffee.

I can't believe how much I was wasting getting a coffee in the morning, which would impulse me to buy a meal. I would easily go over $12 every morning. That would add up to $60 a week. So every morning, I make my own coffee and I make a quick meal. It does take some planning, but it is well worth it. This would give me an additional $3,120 a year. Okay. Clearly a lot of people don't listen to that advice. Because whenever I drive by, you know, a Timmy's,

you know, we've got like, Stratford's a small town, it's only like 30,000 people. And I think we've got like five Timmy's. And every morning, there's a huge lineup of cars. That's not to mention all the people lined up inside. So there you go. Here's the last one. It's from Percy Phillips in hey Percy

Percy's in Portage to Prairie Manitoba the old hometown and Percy is known for his short sentences and here's his one for today live simply eat locally and be grateful because you are a Canadian. Oh, Percy.

I can almost see Percy raising the flag. He's getting ready for July 1st. He's going to be out there on the Portage to Prairie lawn. Live simply, eat locally, be grateful, wave the flag. For all of those of you who took part this week, thanks so much. And for all of those of you who are listening today, thank you so much. It was actually kind of fun today. Not as many letters as usual.

We'll blame the quiz master for that. Could have got a better question. And we could have had a longer week, but then we wouldn't have enjoyed the Victoria Day weekend, those of us who were able to. All right, my friends, that's going to do it for today. Tomorrow, of course, Friday, it's Good Talk. Bruce and Chantel will be here,

and we'll pick apart the issues of the week as we glide towards summer. Hope the weather's good for you wherever you are, and we'll see you all tomorrow. Thanks for listening today. summer. Hope the weather's good for you wherever you are. And we'll see you all tomorrow. Thanks for listening today. It's been a treat, as it always is. The Bridge will be back in less than 24 hours.