The Bridge with Peter Mansbridge - Your Turn -- On the Middle East Crisis

Episode Date: October 12, 2023

Your thoughts and your questions about the horrible events in Israel over the past few days. The shock is still settling in for many of us but you do have thoughts and want to share them. The Random Ranter has thoughts too on something very different -- the issue of working from home. All this and more this week on Your Turn.

And hello there, Peter Mansbridge here. You are just moments away from the latest episode of The Bridge. You have lots to say about the situation in Israel and Gaza. And we'll get right to the Thursday episode of The Bridge. I'm Peter Mansbridge in Stratford, Ontario for today. I don't know about you, but I've watched a considerable amount of television over the last few days, ever since Saturday morning when we woke up to the horror that was taking place in Israel. And I say I don't know about you because I wonder

whether you're still watching as much as you were on the weekend. The television networks say there has been a drop in the numbers of those watching. And I don't think it's because they're not interested. I think it's because at a certain point, some of this is just too hard to watch, too hard to listen to. Some of the stories are just so heart-wrenching. So I imagine there's been a degree of that. Having said that, I would like to say that watching

my old colleagues from different networks from around the world doing what they do, trying to bring the story home to people, has been remarkable. It's dangerous work. It's hard work.

Now, these people are trained and properly prepared for the situations they're going into, or at least most of them are. But nevertheless, it has been extremely dangerous, and there have already been more than a few journalists killed in trying to do their work in this last week. So I admire what I've been watching. Every once in a while, it does seem a little bit stretched. I mean, I've watched some television networks, almost like they were covering a...

I'll be careful how I say this, but when they start covering the rockets coming up from Hamas and Gaza and the Iron Dome, the Israeli defense system, knocking out some of these rockets or most of the rockets, it's almost like a play-by-play is taking place. And, you know, because we have the benefit of actually seeing it happening. But still, there's something about it. I don't know that it makes me feel uncomfortable, but it just seems a little bit too much on

the tech wizardry front. I mean, this is an unbelievable human drama that we're watching in front of our eyes, that is taking place, especially in the area immediately in and around Gaza. That's where most of it started on last Saturday, in those areas immediately around Gaza, where the Hamas went in and murdered people, decapitated babies, we're now told. I mean, it's been unbelievable and horrific. But you've been watching and listening and reading about it, and you have some thoughts, and I'm going to read some of them now. A reminder that we get a lot of mail here at the Bridge. It comes in by email to themansbridgepodcast at gmail.com.

I know there's also a lot of stuff on our YouTube channel, but if you want to have your comments considered, please send them in here. I don't have time to go through the YouTube stuff because so much of it is garbage. There's good stuff on there as well, as I've said before. But the letters that come in that people take the time to write to the podcast

are really thoughtful. We don't agree with each other in many occasions, but they're thoughtful and polite. And I know I try to be the same in responding. Sometimes I get carried away. Anyway, let's get some of your thoughts on the story. In no particular order, and once again, I don't read all the letter. I read usually just a few sentences from most of them.

Travis Moore. Travis didn't tell us where he's writing from. Excuse me, but I'd appreciate it if you did. But Travis writes, I'm not convinced that this conflict is really about the plight of the Palestinians or the Israelis. Has the world ever witnessed a terrorist attack of this complexity? Consider that multiple armed

terrorist units concurrently attacked Israel by land, sea and air as simultaneous rocket barrages overwhelmed the Iron Dome system with volume. The amount of resources, planning, recruiting, logistics, training, and smuggling coordination for this operation could not have been achieved without the clandestine support of outside state actors. But who is behind this? Is Russia attempting to divert American financial intelligence

and military resources from Ukraine? Is Iran attempting to sour Saudi-Israeli peace proposals and prospects by luring Israel to kill Sunni Muslim Palestinians in heated revenge? Is an emerging China trying to sow chaos in the world order that challenges its rise? All good questions. Joan Ruff in London, Ontario.

My question is, is it too far-fetched to think that Russia has backed Iran in their support of Hamas, that perhaps Putin wanted a distraction from Ukraine, forcing a funding rethink in the U.S.? Look forward to your informed response. I think it, listen, I think it's a really good question, and there are certainly some who believe exactly that. But the fact is, we don't know, right? We don't know the answer to that question.

At least we don't know it yet. We may end up knowing it. Let's see. Jacob Peterson writes, My name's Jacob, and I'm writing from Winnipeg. I support the right of the Palestinian and wider Muslim communities to criticize Israel and its government for the occupation of the Palestinian state. I agree that Israel, Israel too has committed heinous

acts against the Palestinians, but it is un-Canadian to celebrate cold-blooded mass murder at the hands of terrorists. There's no cause that justifies it. It worries me that this violent, vengeful mentality is festering in Canada. I'm not Jewish, Israeli, Arab, Palestinian, or Muslim, but I have the common sense to see the atrocities that are being committed at the hands of Hamas and to criticize them for what they are. That's about some of the protests that have taken place in a number of Canadian cities.

Celebrations, some describe them as. Ramsey Asfor. I live in Kingston, Ontario. Our family immigrated to Canada in 1990, and I became a Canadian citizen in 1993. My father is Palestinian, and we lived in Jordan until I was 14 or so. The current escalation of the conflict between the Palestinians and the Israelis is deeply troubling, and I'm very saddened by it.

From my perspective, the news media coverage looks decidedly one-sided in favor of the Israeli perspective. Israel has always maintained that most of the coverage they get on this question, Israel versus the Palestinians, is decidedly in favor of the Palestinians. They complain about that all the time.

Not necessarily in this moment, on this occasion. Now Ramsey goes on to say, in your good talks with Chantelle Hebert and Bruce Anderson, you've discussed the media coverage of Donald Trump, the convoy in Ottawa, and the crisis in Ukraine. The these people look like us, Engel? I'm not sure what you mean by that.

Would you consider discussing the current media coverage of this latest escalation of violence between the Palestinians and Israelis and whether or not it's fair and balanced? You know, I think we will. I think we're going to wait a little longer to see more of it, because there is, we're in a moment here now, and you can see the pressure starting to form on, in some cases, on the Israelis, that they need to keep humanitarian issues in mind

when they're trying to do whatever it is they're trying to do in Gaza. We'll see how that plays out. We'll also see how the world reacts to it and the kind of media coverage that it gets. But Ramsey, these are, you know, these are good questions you're raising. William Flowers from Amherst, Nova Scotia. Just a comment on a Tuesday broadcast you did with Brian Stewart where you discuss, in your words, the dark side of war, in this case involving an assassination. To say there is a dark side seems to suggest that there is a light side

to war. I think most would agree that there is never a light or bright side to war. In other words, all war is dark. We should all be so fortunate enough to live in a world, as Andrea Bocelli says, where war has been banned. Yes, we would like to live in that world. You know, I don't disagree with what you're saying, but, you know, there are times when war is not just dark,

it's like incredibly ugly, barbarous. We've seen some of that in the last week. We've seen some of it in the last year and a half at different places in Ukraine. And that's why there are war crimes tribunals. Glenn Lankin from London, Ontario. It'll be interesting to watch the current Israeli political reaction to these events. Can Netanyahu, the so-called Teflon Prime Minister, maintain power? If not, who can replace him?

Will the next Prime Minister of Israel be more conciliatory or more hardline when it comes to dealing with the Palestinians? It is likely too early in this crisis to have answers to these questions. It is too early, but those are all good questions, and we'll see how they're answered in the time to come. Wendy Holmes, also from London, Ontario. I remember listening to one of your Janice Stein episodes before the Russian-Ukraine war,

and hearing her discuss her concerns about the Russians massing troops at their border and getting suddenly concerned about a potential war. She was right on the money. Well, after her last appearance on your podcast a couple of weeks ago, she discussed Israel and their domestic issues, but more so the deal the U.S. was trying to broker between Israel and Saudi Arabia and how it could disrupt the region with its implications.

I, like the rest of the world, was shocked by the horrendous news of the Hamas attack, yet I had had an uneasiness since that podcast, a worry of what might transpire. Janice Stein's analysis of the world's geopolitics is amazing. easiness since that podcast, a worry of what might transpire. Janice Stein's analysis of the world's geopolitics is amazing. I'm sorry that it does not bode well for the world at present, but I thank you for her continued insights. And you know what? You're going to hear more of them.

As regular listeners know, Brian Stewart's been with us for a year and a half on the Ukraine story. As some of our listeners will know as well, because I've mentioned it a couple of times, Brian is writing a book on his memoirs of an incredible life as a war correspondent and foreign correspondent. And he's deep into that writing and he's facing deadlines. And so, you know, he's's asked me can i have some time to finish this book and i said of course you can and janice is going to fill in janice is going to be there for us for uh for a while she's in demand um not only in Canada, but in different parts of the world, from media organizations, from governments. She's an expert in conflict analysis and mediation,

and she knows the Middle East as well as anybody. And so we're lucky to have Janice with us, and I'm lucky because I've had this relationship with Janice for the last 40 years, trying to help us understand issues. So it's great that Janice is going to be with us. And that will start, well, probably next Tuesday. Brian will be back eventually, but he's writing away. You're going to love his book. I've heard so many of these stories over the years,

and I'm so glad he's going to share them with you. Peter Johnson from Upper Oxford Mills, Ontario. That's a half an hour south of Ottawa. It's been just over a year since I first heard you, Bruce and Chantel, on a warm spring day in May of 2022. I was on my deck making a mess, fixing something, and as I turned the volume on the channel up, I yelled out, oh my god, it's Pete DeZoss and three wise men all over again. I've tuned in to almost every single podcast since. It's so refreshing to hear your voices and listen to opinions that are both intelligent and worthy of our consideration

and trust. So this is just a note to say thank you all. I'm a much happier retiree now. I'm a retired teacher. We're not known for brevity. It was difficult to keep this short. Hope you appreciate that. Yes, we do, Peter, and we thank you. And such kind words. And for all of us to be compared in any way, some small way, to the old Zosky and Camp Kierens and Lewis. Those were the days, right? What a great conversation that was every week.

So Chantel and Bruce and I are lucky and happy to have the opportunity to give you some thoughts. Okay, let's change the topic. Let's go to something much different. Last week, one of the big issues was the price of turkey. Can you believe it? We were looking for something that last week that would break from the kind of discussions we'd had for the couple of weeks previous.

They were pretty hard-edged stuff. So Pierre Polyev had talked about turkey prices up to $120 a bird. Well, a lot of you went after that. You didn't like that. You thought that was just, well, it wasn't turkey, but it was bull. Merle Peters, though, writes, just listening to the Winner Winner $120 Turkey Podcast. Not sure where your guest shops,

but there's no one in our area that sells a turkey for $120. The average price around here is $30 for a 15-pound bird, which is large enough to feed our family. I'm not sure where you would find a $120 turkey. Aha. How about in Grand Valley, Ontario, where Matt Babinski lives? I had to laugh a bit. I thought of you, Chantel, and Bruce when I bought my turkey for $118.

Now, keep in mind, it was 20 pounds and fed our family of 16 people. I listen to your show nearly every day. Happy Thanksgiving. Percy Phillips, Portage La Prairie. Fresh-killed turkey selling at the St. Norbert Farmer's Market just before Thanksgiving for $4.90 a pound. The infamous $120 turkey would only be 24.5 pounds. If the feds wanted to address the price of food in Canada, it would tackle supply management that keeps dairy and poultry rather precious.

It will, of course, do nothing. Regional politics reign supreme in Canada, and they would rather puff and puff and grandstand with retailers than actually do anything of substance. Willa Henry, Kingston, Ontario. During the ad issue episode, you reminded us of the price of a food basket. I think it would be great to bring that back and publish the cost of the basket at each grocery store.

This would drive down prices very quickly. It could be quite regional, but would really make prices transparent for Canadians who are struggling to cover costs. Keith Stapleton. About the growth of the food basket, this information is already tracked by AC Nielsen. All major food manufacturers purchase this data on a regular basis. Nunziato marino please pass along to pierre poliev that we easily fed 16 people with an organic fresh turkey raised with antibiotics

for 75 dollars still a bargain meal to feed that many people while peacefully sitting around the table. Derek Forsyth in Edmonton. It's another turkey story. I listened to you and Bruce commenting on Polyev's remarks on $120 turkeys. For us, that's the average cost for a turkey and has been for a number of years. That's because we buy organic, fresh turkeys. For us, that's the average cost for a turkey and has been for a number of years. That's because we buy organic, fresh turkeys, grass-fed from a local producer. It's a choice we make and we balance that by only buying one turkey a year at Christmas. Thanksgivings are gatherings at a farm with relatives from my wife's side of the family where there are a myriad Ukrainian dishes

and farm fresh vegetables. Turkey may or may not be in the mix. That said, I'm acutely aware that day-to-day food prices are getting to a point where a number of families are having to make difficult choices and it's worrying that the less nutritious pre-ackaged food is often the affordable reality for many. Derek Forsyth in Edmonton. The random ranter has your attention. He's been on a bit of a run lately because most people are agreeing with his rants. So he's feeling pretty good about that.

And it appears that on this one, his rant last week about gender pronouns, it seems like, at least to those who were writing in, it was popular. Calgary, Alberta, Lawrence Brawl writes, Bravo, you nailed it. I have a transgendered grandchild. He is quiet, sensitive, thoughtful,

and he asks a lot of questions and has done so since turning five. I wish people understood the fear they create with their parental rights bullhorn. They scare the ones who are simply trying to figure things out. Moreover, they don't understand the importance of a safe place for all kids. Schools need to be safe places. Well done, random ranter.

Jane DeMuth in New Paltz, New York. She also lives sometimes in Ottawa. But whether she's in Ottawa or New York, she says she's always in Chantel Nation. Here she writes,

First, the ranter, as usual, was spot on. In an ideal world, parents would, of course, be involved in any discussion of their children transitioning or questioning their gender. But the proposition of schools keeping parents out of the loop isn't intended for kids who live in this ideal world. It's specifically to protect children who do not feel safe with their parents knowing.

Parents who object to this would do well to take a close and difficult look at whether they themselves are providing safe environments for their kids. I, for one, absolutely would not have felt, or I can say with the benefit of hindsight, actually been safe revealing to my parents as a child that I did not see myself as a boy, but rather as a girl. I have tremendous sympathy for kids in a similar position today. The appallingly high suicide rates for trans children who lack support compared to those who have it are evidence enough for its need.

Thank you, Jane. Paula Gratton from Miramichi, New Brunswick. I couldn't agree more with the ranter this week. These pronoun issues in schools shouldn't be an issue at all. If my children feel safer talking to a teacher than to me, then I'm glad they have a teacher to speak with. Living in New Brunswick, these issues are front and center, for talking to a teacher than to me, then I'm glad they have a teacher to speak with. Living in New Brunswick, these issues are front and center,

but the bottom line is that queer youth deserve rights. I don't know when that became political. Thanks for your podcast. Thank you for your letter. Well, hey, we're talking about the ranter. So why don't we bring him out for this week's rant and see what he's uh what he's going on about this week you ready i'm ready here he is the random ranter The Random Rant-er. Well, what do you know? I'm having a great time today.

Got everything mixed up. So let me try this again. But this time, this time I'll get it right. You ready? I'm ready. Let's go. I want to talk about working from home today, but before I really get into this, let me just qualify my argument by saying this does not affect me personally. And yes, I understand that there are some jobs that absolutely need workers to go into work. I get that. But I also get that some workers can't

work from home because the call of their coach is just too much to handle. But those ones, they're probably not much better when they're at work anyways. So with all that said, I think it's time more employers embrace the work from home model. I've never understood what the big deal is. I mean, if the work is getting done, why does the employer even care? I don't buy the whole work, morale, camaraderie, team building argument. I mean, seriously, in a time of Facebook friends, Instagram followers, and DMs, I think most people have become pretty adroit at forming relationships virtually. And after the pandemic, we've got all the tools to do it upright. So what's the big deal? Do bosses need to see the work done? Is the finished product not enough for them?

Or do bosses just need to boss? Call me crazy, but I don't see much of a downside. Pretty much every business has a group of workers tucked in the back somewhere. If they're not public facing, then why do they need to be there? Why do they need to be taking up workspace when they could be at home taking up their own? You can argue whether it's good for business or not, but working from home, that can be very good for society. We've been so focused on creating densely populated cities that we've driven the price of living in them through the roof. It's just not affordable.

But if more workers had the option to work remotely, they could live further away. Now, if that sounds like I'm proposing urban sprawl, that's because I am. I mean, environmentally, the bad thing about sprawl is the commute. But if your office is Zoom, that's not really an issue. And with a smaller in-person staff level, companies could downsize their footprint as well. But it goes beyond that. I think working from home can really benefit the whole work-life balance. It adds flexibility. It eliminates the headaches of commuting. No more packing lunches. It'll make your your dog happier and think about all the money you can save on your wardrobe at least the bottom half of it anyways but look at the end of the day it doesn't matter what i think or what employers think working from home is out there and it's

happening the pandemic accelerated a lot of change and working from home is not going to go back in the bottle. A lot of employees love it. And if you're an employer that doesn't embrace it, well, good luck maintaining your staffing levels. Good luck attracting the best talent or any talent because employees, they have choices. and if they want to work from home they're going to find a way to do it the random ranter this one i'm convinced this is not going to get a unanimous vote of support though there are going to be those like me, I won't give my arguments right now, but I'll listen to yours.

I don't agree with that. I think being at work does promote, you know, a work mentality, which can be very beneficial. But I'm not going to, that's all I'll say. Look forward to hearing what you have to say about the random renter. Write to the Mansbridge podcast at gmail.com. But he had a great line about dressing from the waist up. I mean, I do remember when I started anchoring the National,

it was in an older building in Toronto, and it didn't have air conditioning, and it used to get unbelievably hot in the summer months. And there were more than a few nights where I came in, did the show, suit from the waist up, shorts from the waist down. It was the only way to stay cool. Fortunately, they were never on a wide shot. There you go. Your story for today.

We're going to take a break, come back with the final couple of letters. But right now, we're going to take that break. And welcome back. Peter Mansbridge here with the Thursday episode of The Bridge. It's your turn, your opportunity to weigh in with your thoughts,

plus the random ranter. You're listening on SiriusXM, Channel 167, Canada Talks, or on your favorite podcast platform. Glad to have you with us. Okay, final letters. And these are kind of a potpourri of different thoughts on different issues. Nancy Abba writes from Toronto. Over the course of my long voting career, you and I are the same age, I have voted conservative, liberal, and very occasionally NDP, depending on which party I thought had the best policies for the time, and which leader I had the most confidence in. That's the way anybody should vote. With that in mind, I could never be comfortable

voting for a party whose leader has changed or attempted to change their image to the extent that Pierre Polyev continues to do, and I find it difficult to understand why people would. A leopard cannot change its spots, but it can camouflage itself, and in my opinion, that is what Mr. Polyev is doing. Should he become PM, I'm convinced he'll revert to his true self, and I for one fear for Canada should that happen. Vaughan Stewart in St. Catharines. In your episode of Good Talk on Friday, I noticed Chantel seemed to apologize for raising the issue of the rate of immigration into Canada, qualifying that she was not against immigration. This highlighted to me a

major issue in this country, that we cannot seem to have adult conversations about some of the issues of the day without them being used for political attacks or media frenzies on the topic. I don't know if this is a result of polarization, media trying to get attention, political advantages to be gained, something else, or all of the above. Chantel raised a great point. We need to have that adult conversation about the rate of immigration compared to input of resources needed to accommodate that growth.

Bill Surrett from British Columbia. I enjoy listening to your podcast, even if I don't always agree with the views expressed by your panel. Today's discussion on the politics of the cost of groceries and housing was excellent, but I think there's another malaise weighing on the Canadian body politic that gets too little attention in the media, and it's just as important. It's our country's anemic economic prosperity and declining standard of living. It's not just because of affordability issues and inflation. The Liberal government in Ottawa has been zealously focused

on climate issues since the day it was elected, while investment capital flees the country. Productivity growth is stalled or in decline, and incomes have stagnated. The only economic issues they seem to want to focus on are wealth redistribution and killing the oil and gas industry. Lauren Finlayson, Cumberland, B.C. I quite enjoyed the program this morning, as I usually do.

Chantelle and Bruce's discussion on steps the Liberals could do to reverse their declining fortunes was quite enlightening. However, there was one area they missed this morning, and that pertained to our Prime Minister not paying enough attention to Canadian domestic issues in favor of flitting around the world. It seems to this citizen that he's more interested in jetting off to the G7 and the G20 and then off to another meeting with other poobahs and on and on. I'm sure you get the picture.

I have a feeling that if there was an international conference on the decline in supply of left-hand monkey wrenches, our TV news would show them striding onto that huge government jet to wherever this thing was held. A few days later, he'd return, declare Canada's commitment to monkey wrench supply, pledge a few million dollars to the cause, then disappear on a vacation somewhere that wealthy folks congregate. Wow. Well, it'll be different, Lauren, I guess, when there's another party in power, if there is another party in power, another person in the Prime minister's seat.

I guess they'll stop going to G7 meetings and G20 meetings, like every prime minister I've covered has done, but from all parties. But I hear you. There's no doubt he's done a lot of traveling this year. He's been all over the place. Here's the last letter for today. Ron Fisher from Moncton, New Brunswick.

When you guys brought this up, I was shocked, and to be honest, kind of scared. You're right. We have no leader right now, and we're talking about world leadership. That's what we talked about yesterday. At a time of unprecedented crisis, nobody stands out as a leader for our time. There's no Churchill, no JFK, no Mahatma Gandhi.

The West has spent the last 50 years mired in consumerism and self-interest. The people who vote in elections have forgotten the responsibility that it is to be a citizen, to make a choice that is best for the country, not for themselves. I have to believe that leaders are born for the times they live in. We need to find just such people and encourage them to run for office. Look around. They don't need to be lawyers. They need to be good and selfless people who care for their communities.

I'm not sure I know such a person. I wish I were that person. Perhaps one not sure I know such a person. I wish I were that person. Perhaps one of your listeners know such a person. Yeah, but then you've got to convince them to run for politics, and that's part of the problem, right? All right. Good letters, good conversation topics for today, and we appreciate all of your thoughts

and the way in which you put them to the program and shared them as a result with other listeners across the country and around the world, right? No letters from, well, yes, one letter from the States this week, but we've had them from as far away as europe and the far east and and south america so we tend to get a lot of letters and we appreciate all of them okay we're out of time tomorrow good talk chantelle and bruce will be by uh so please join us when that happens there's always something for us to talk about,

and you love listening to it. So we'll join you tomorrow. Thanks for listening on this day. I'm Peter Mansbridge. Talk to you again, 24 hours. Thank you.