The Bryce Crawford Podcast - The Johnny Chang Interview (EP 87)

Episode Date: March 17, 2025

In this episode, Bryce sits down with Johnny Chang to talk about Religious Theology, Gods Grace, Sin Nature and more!

What's going on, guys. Welcome back to another episode of the Bryce Crawford podcast. I'm Bryson. Today, I have an awesome guest on recently became friends. Johnny Chang. Johnny, how are you doing? What's up, bro. Appreciate you. My pleasure. Do you think, do you go about like, I know some people call you pastor because you like do like an online church. Do you like, do you call yourself pastor or? I go by a minister. Cool. Yeah, minister more than anything. Or just Johnny. Okay. Yeah, I'm not too big on the labels. Yeah, okay, cool. Yeah, that was actually something I wanted to talk to you about later. Um, yeah, I'm super excited about this. My favorite thing that I admire about you is your knowledge on the word. It's just so crazy. I feel like that's such a beautiful compliment and such a beautiful thing

to have. The way that you quote scripture and the way that you remember it on your heart, it's like every time you get asked a question, it's the first thing to come off your tongue. So I highly respect that. Thank you. And I also highly respect the work that God has done in your life. I mean, it's so crazy how you can hear something about someone. And like whenever I hear your story, right, when I see videos and things like that, the Johnny that I know is not that old Johnny. So it's hard for me to imagine what your life was like before, you know. And so I just really admire your heart, your character, and your dedication to scripture.

So I appreciate you. Thank you, bro. Yeah, man. I bet a lot of times when you do interviews, do you get asked to, like, share your story a lot? Yeah, yeah, it's usually what it is. Yeah, yeah. You can't have a testimony without the test, right? So, yeah, definitely.

Yeah, I'll let you kind of summarize that quickly. Sure. Because I want this to be different. I want us to just like ask questions about the Bible and stuff like that because I think there's a lot of value to that. But I don't want to undermine what God's done in your life. So if you had to briefly summarize how God encountered you, what your life looked like before and afterwards, what would you?

Yeah, so I grew up in Section 8 project housing on the east side of L.A. and my father was like an atheist. My mother was a Buddhist, like a hardcore Taoist Buddhist. And my dad was an alcoholic and didn't believe in any, you know, he didn't really have like good morals. He was beat as a kid. So he kind of passed that generational trauma onto me and my brother. Yeah. So he beat me.

He beat my mother. He beat my brother. And so I kind of took to the streets because I, like, I'd rather stay out and chill than come home and get beat. Yeah. So at the age of 12, I just, joined a hood, a gang. Yeah, out here in the San Diego Valley. And, like, three months into that, I ended up going to prison.

It's called California Youth Authority. So I was 12 years old. I went from 12 to 25, essentially. I was locked up and it was incarcerated. And, you know, it was during that time that I became actually a Muslim in prison. No way. Yeah. So I was a Sunni.

I was studying under, like, an imam. He was one of my, his whole family essentially was, Sunni Muslim And so, you know, I read the Quran front to back three times. I read the Bible at that time, front to back two times. And he was telling me that we have to pull from the book that that came before us, which is the Bible. So there's Abraham, there's Kane, Cabrille, and, you know, all these different people also in the Quran. So, yeah, I was, you know, got my GED, you know, I was trying to work on myself mentally, emotionally, physically.

but the one thing that I kept feeling was like emptiness inside of my heart. No matter what I did, I was just happy, sad all the time, this crazy roller coaster. So I got super blasted. You know, most people who are tatted down, it's because, at least in my experience, is because we feel nothing except for pain. So like I would rather feel something than nothing even if it was pain. So I went from that to then coming out, being released, tried to fly straight and recognize that I couldn't. I was a two strike felon in California for a violent crime. I was in there for a shooting

essentially. Dang. Two counts of assault with deadly weapons. So I was like, all right, I genuinely like, I'm trying. I'm applying to all these places. There's no love being shown. I was like, man, F it, you know, I'm going to go back to my neighborhood. I got plugged in. I started making $30,000 a month selling drugs, basically. And even then, you know, I had the cars. I had the women. I had the penthouse. I had all the materials that I had. But still, empty. inside of my heart. And that's when I really felt miserable. I think that was worse than me being in prison. Because when you're in prison, you still have some kind of hope. If I get out, I'm going to be happy. You know, I came about the PJs, the projects, I'm going to make money. You know, and I reached

all of that and I was still empty. Dang. So I was like, dang, this is horrible. And it was during that time that I attempted suicide, three different occasions. And thank God, God, God held on to me. Yeah. And a series of events happened, like, long story short, my mom, she, um, she, um, kind of her car broke down and she had me take her to the church. I went to the church, we broke bread. You know, God really uses food like he did with, you know, Peter and

all that. So he placed it in the pastor's heart that day to make black bean noodles, which is my favorite. To this day, it's my favorite food. Dang. And he opened up with, not in a judgmental way, but a very loving way. And as the first time I truly felt loved. I thought my homies loved me. And they do,

but it was a huge. humanistic love. And he truly loved me with the heart of God through the gospel. And he was explaining to me how sin was an identity, not an action. You can't change yourself being Chinese is the same as you can't stop sinning. Right. You're born as a sinner through Adam. And that's why you keep messing up. But you're trying to, he's like, imagine looking in the mirror and saying, today I'm not going to be Chinese or I'm going to be less Chinese. It's impossible. So you're normal. And that's the first time I heard, you know, having a YA number, a California CDC number to then going from criminal to your normal.

And then, you know, I just felt the love. And he taught about Hebrews 1014, all these different scriptures essentially, telling me that it was an identity and that my new identity is in Christ. And if God who holds the kingdom, who holds the keys to the kingdom, tells you that you're righteous and perfect,

then you should believe that above your thoughts, right? And I trusted that. And here we are today. Dang. Insane. I mean, praise God. I didn't even know that about, about you being,

Muslim for like a time period. From what I know like for for like people that are raised Muslim at least, I think there's an average like it takes a Muslim seven years to leave Islam. Yeah. What was what was your deciding factor of like leaving that essentially? There was just a lot of like controversial stuff, you know, that I won't get too into, you know, out of respect for them. But I was like, okay, so we're in prison for a set amount of rules. And then there's there's the prophet who's doing certain things that I didn't find. justified number one and then when i questioned out of a good heart i wanted to understand they were basically telling me you shouldn't question right so that's number one number two um the emptiness

no matter what i did i was praying five times a day you know i was i was physically fit you know i was reading i was um everything i had my god my g ed anger management counseling all because i was a muslim and i was bettering my mind but there was still that emptiness inside of my heart yeah so i was like yo it doesn't matter what i do you know i I'm always going to fill this happy, sad sin, repent, up and down lifestyle. Yeah. And so that's the thing that I recognize was there's something inside of me that is like God-sized hole and I just can't fill it.

And I thought I could do it with Christian, you know, with the Quran and with being a Muslim. Yeah. But it didn't fill my heart. Yeah. Respectfully. No, no, no. I understand that. I could, right before.

So I tried to take my life when I was 17 and like a couple months before that, I always heard, well, if you got some religious structure in your life, then, you know, you'll be good. You'll be good. And it just like, I kind of like feel you for a sense. And like, it just doesn't work. Yeah. It just does not work. Thanks for sharing that. I know you get to share that a lot. And it's always encouraging to hear. I want to shift gears to a lot of questions that I have. And I want to hear your perspectives and things like that. I think, I think my first question would be, yeah, I hear it a lot. I hear the sin being an identity thing.

But then I think of like, like I literally just got a phone call last night from a friend. He's like, I literally am struggling with this certain sin habit or this addiction, this stronghold. How does someone break a sin stronghold in their life? So if you look at the Bible, John 16, verse 9, tells us of sin because they believe not unto me. So a lot of people know about Jesus.

The demons know about Jesus. But truly believing in someone is trusting what they say above what you think. Right? So let's say, for example, you know, you go out and, you know, I'll use you as an example. You go out and you're one of these Christian events,

but then it shifts to you going to a club. And then a lady hugs you and you got makeup on your shirt and you come home smelling like cigarettes and alcohol and you got, you know what I mean, this makeup. If your girl loves you, she's always going to have her thoughts like, yo, why does Bryce have makeup on his shirt? Why does he smell like he's been to a club?

if she trusts you, she would take what your word says above her thoughts. Do you understand? Above the situation. Likewise, Jesus is telling us in 2 Corinthians 517 that we're new creatures. All the old ways have passed. The issue is we trust our thoughts above that word. So the stronghold comes from not trusting the word of God above your thoughts. So the way that I explain it is your thoughts influence the way you feel and the way you feel influences behavior.

people don't just wake up in sin so if i have a thought like let's say a lustful thought then it's going to bleed into me and give me lustful feelings and then the action is just a byproduct of that thought does that make sense yeah no that makes sense so a lot of people think like oh you know um i have to cut it at you know bounce with the eyes at the action they're not recognizing that not only is sin and identity it's trusting your thoughts above the word of god so if you want to break free from every stronghold it's very very stronghold it's very very simple actually you have to get in your word because if you're not in your word you're in your feelings and the bible tells us in jeremiah 17 verse 9 all of our heart is deceitful above all

things desperately wicked who can know it that means our hearts will deceive us one day will be happy next day will be sad right so if we trust that that's how we're going to live happy sad happy sad all the way up and down and this world teaches you that right trust your heart follow your heart trust you know your thoughts believe in yourself that is literally demonic doctrine it is the byproduct of being sad and empty, right? The byproduct of that is being sad and empty. So, yeah, I don't tell people that, you know, that to stop this or, you know, cut all these things out. Of course, you should be doing those things, but that's very surface level. We have to get to the root issue of I'm trusting myself, even as a Christian, as a Catholic, as a Jew, whatever.

If I trust my thoughts, thoughts that are different from God, Isaiah 55, 7 and 8 tells us my thoughts are not your thoughts, right? Then I'm going to live different from God. And I'm not going to live a godly lifestyle. It's proof. Yeah. Dang. So what,

I guess like, I guess like something that I have a hard time thinking sometimes is like, and even I have a hard time sometimes for myself is, is that trusting in that word. And I have a hard time reading my Bible sometimes. I think it'd be a universal thing that people struggle with reading their Bible. Yeah. How can people take,

the step to read their Bible more. Like what if someone, if someone were to say, Johnny, I don't have motivation to read my Bible. What would you say to that? Because I get asked that all the time. What would you say that? So what I teach people is when you starve the flesh, right? Then you will feed the spirit. Likewise, when you feed the flesh, you will starve the spirit.

So what Satan does is when you open your Bible, he attacks the flesh. You get sleepy. That's a normal thing, right? And then the second thing he does is he places expectations inside of you. He will tell you, read your Bible and finish your Bible. you know, in a year, like a Bible in a year. It sounds good on the surface level. The issue is you'll go strong for like two to three weeks, right?

Maybe even a month. But things happen in life. You get distracted, career, choice, whatever, all this other stuff. Work happens. Life happens. And then you fall from the consistency. And that's when condemnation enters. Look at you.

You call yourself a Christian. You were reading so well for like two, two to three weeks a month. What's going on here? Again, he works through these thoughts. Right. So what I tell people, if you want to read the Bible, I've read the Bible, I've read the Bible front of back 25 times now. How I do it is I read until I get sleepy. So whether it's 10 verses, 10 chapters or 100 chapters, I wait upon the grace of God to give me that strength to fight my

flesh, number one. So once I start doing the nodding off, I'm like, I'm going to close the Bible. Sometimes it happens in 10 verses. Sometimes it happens in 100 chapters. Right. So we live by grace. And then second thing is don't have expectations. Right. Don't do Bible in a year. Five chapters. there's a day, read the Bible every day, just open it until you get sleepy. Don't have this expectation. And you'll notice, you'll go from Genesis to Revelation once, twice, two, three, four. It'll continuously go. And so this is what helps people move forward and read the Bible. The last piece of advice is read the Bible to accept it, not to understand. Because we're finite individuals. We cannot understand infinite amount of wisdom. If you just sit there and read, faith comes by hearing,

hearing the word of God, also reading the word of God. Study to show yourself approved means to just keep reading. And you'll notice that this word will just pour into you. If you hang around a barbershop long enough, you're going to get a haircut. If you hang around with gang members, you're probably going to do, you know, nefarious activities. But if you read your Bible enough, you will start to, the Bible will start to bleed into you. And that's the secret that most people don't know. Whoa.

That's encouraging. So, so this is a thought I've been having recently. which is and it was a conversation I was having with Josh like literally last night can you be a Christian and be depressed

absolutely absolutely I think it depends right it's relative right I think depression comes from again thoughts right because you don't and in feelings as well

the way that the Bible explains the mind is a connection from your brain to your heart that's what we call the mind So yes, if you're not renewing your mind every day, you will be depressed. If you're not taking every thought captive, Second Corinthians 10, 5 tells us, right, and bringing it to the obedience of Christ, which Jesus Christ and John 114 is the word, right? He's the word that was made flesh and dwelt among us.

So if you don't replace and renew your mind every day with scripture, you will fall into this thing called depression, which is all deception, right? So Satan will tell you, even though you have the best things in your life. everything's going well, he'll give you those feelings. Just like John 13, verse two, where he plants the heart inside of Judas to betray Jesus. He can do that with us too. So it's not necessarily is depression real? It's if you're not in your word, the byproduct is depression, loneliness, emptiness, fatigue, burnout, all this other stuff that all these Christians are facing. Right.

So I don't actually believe a true, if you're a true Christian and you're truly in your word, you're not going to be depressed. you're always going to be peaceful because your feelings go up and down your heart changes your thoughts change your perspective changes but the word of god never changes so if you want to live happy and based as we say you read the word yeah and so that's why i'm not better than people i have a ged education high school equivalent i read king james version these those arts all that other stuff it's hard to understand but i read it not because i'm trying to flex on people because i know if i'm not in my word, I'm in my feelings. And if I'm in my feelings, I don't have the discernment. Yeah. Hebrews 412 literally tells us the word is the discerner, right? Because, you know,

a lot of people say it's the Holy Spirit. Sure, that's one of the gifts, but actually, what's more solid, right? Because Satan can also give feelings and can also come as an unholy spirit and trick you and deceive you. So the word is what discerns. And if you're not in your word, you can't properly 100% discern. Is that how you discern like the thoughts? Because I believe that if Jesus lives inside of me, that he consumes my thoughts. So I kind of describe it like, if I'm walking down the sidewalk and I see a homeless guy, and I feel the unction to give this guy five bucks. I'm like, okay, I selfishly would not do that. But there's some days where I'll have a thought that I don't know if it's a bad thought or a good thought. Like, I just don't know where

it's coming from. So you're using the word of God to discern that? Yeah. How would you compare that? Like, I guess I'm trying to find an example. Like, what if it's, what if it's, what if it's, what if It's like should I buy the red truck or the blue truck? You know, like something like that. It's not necessarily sinful. Sure. But it's like, what if like I'm going to go buy a red car today? Sure.

And it's like, what if deep down I'm doing that out of a selfish place? Sure. But I don't know yet. What if there is grace for if that makes sense? Yeah, it does. So like basically it's not whether you did do this or that. You have to replace your thoughts with the Word of God. That is what discerns.

So you can't, you have to accept, oh, maybe I can't properly discern things. if I don't have the Word of God. But to answer your question, there are practical thoughts, right? You have to trust, like, if I'm going to use, you know, if I'm going to go eat, do I want Chipotle or Chick-fil-A? We don't have to be like, okay, God, Holy Spirit discern me, right? Do I do Chick-fil-A? They close on Sundays.

Like, it's overthinking at that point. I think there's practical thoughts, but when I say discernment comes from conviction or condemnation. So there's a difference between the two. A lot of people feel like they're convicted, but they're actually being condemned. Romans 8 verse 1 says there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. That means whenever you have a negative thought or a thought of confusion or fear, that is not from God. That's what the Bible tells us. So if you know the Bible, then you can discern.

But some people will think, well, fear is from God. They think it's a warning. But literally, what I've learned is all conviction is always positive, actually. It's always for the greater good. Condemnation is always negative. It makes you spiral. One thought leads to three thoughts, 10 thoughts, 300 thoughts. And you're just like, I don't want to, what am I doing?

I'm feeling horrible. I'm not a good Christian. I'm backsliding him. All that is condemnation. God doesn't condemn him. He even tells the woman caught in the act of adultery, neither do I condemn thee. So there is no condemnation in God. We are actually truly liberated and free when we're true biblical Christians who believe

in the salvific message. The issue is our thoughts don't tell us that. we can't discern unless we're in the word because our feelings, you know, they deceive us. Yeah, for sure. I think it's something that I struggle to wrap my mind around. There's a verse. I think it's in Proverbs where it says a righteous man falls seven times and then gets back up. And I have a hard time understanding that because every time I hear that verse particularly quoted, it's from people that abuse the grace of God. Sure.

That literally do the total opposite of what Paul says in Romans 6. Yeah, of course. So what does that verse mean when he says like a right, when it says a righteous man falls seven times when it gets back up? And then a follow up question, how can we live in grace without abusing it? Good question. So falling seven times,

it means that we still have our flesh, right? Paul speaks about it in a Romans chapter 7, verse 15, for I do the things that I don't want to do, the things that I keep on doing. I don't do the things that I hate that I do. And he explains it in verse 20 that is to sin that dwelleth inside of me that makes me do these things. things. And that's clear and it's synonymous with Proverbs because what it's telling us is when you

trust your flesh, you will fall. But we still have an advocate, which in 1st John chapter 2 is Jesus Christ, right? We have a person that when we do sin in our flesh, God lifts us up. So a real Christian, if you look at the end result, if they're falling seven times, but they get back up, that means they get up every single time. Does that make sense? So that's what we need to remember. Satan will always make you fall. and then be like, stay there. But what this means is, no, I'm righteous in the eyes of God. God has lifted me up.

I don't have to beg for forgiveness. I have to thank him that even though I fell God, you still lift me up. You don't condemn me. You don't kill me when I sin. You don't take my arm. You don't even really discipline me. You show me this is why you shouldn't trust yourself. Trust the word of God, right?

And then you move forward with that. Now, that also ties into the abusing grace. first and foremost, what people don't understand is they think that if you sin willfully. So they'll use Hebrews 10, verse 26. For if we sin willfully, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. They remove a big chunk of that verse. And that's why we need to know the Bible accurately. It says, for if they sin willfully, after receiving the knowledge of the truth,

then there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins. This knowledge of truth is found in Ephesians chapter 1, verse 13. It literally tells you, this is the word of truth. the knowledge of truth, the gospel of your salvation. So true abuse of grace is Jesus, through grace, died on the cross and gave it to you for free before we even asked him to. But you're still claiming and you don't take the identity of his identity, which is he's righteous, holy, and sanctified. You then continuously say, no, I'm a sinner though, because what you see is sin, what you feel is sin. You think sinfully, right? So you accept that. That is actually abusing grace. And secondly,

people don't sin however they want if they truly come to the position of a sinner. Every person who's met Jesus proclaims the gospel afterwards. It's actually the people who are legalistic that think that they can control their sins. They're the ones who sin willfully because they're rejecting the grace of Jesus Christ. That is abusing the grace. It's not, oh, do I sin however I want? Why would you sin however you want? For example, Bryce, you've got a lot of followers, right?

And you're with your girl. How long have you been with there? About a year. Okay, so prior to you dating her, let's say there's an Instagram baddie or someone who's really beautiful comes up to you and wants to date you. Because you're not, you don't have a relationship with your girl at that time. You can date her, right? But now that, let's say you're famous, right? Your Instagram famous.

You have other people coming up to you. They think you're handsome. And they come up to you and they go, hey, you know, let's like, they want to like cheat. They want you to commit adultery. they want you to fall into your flesh. Even if they're beautiful, right, in your eyes, who are you going to think about? The person that you have a relationship with,

which is your girl, and you're going to think about her heart, and you're going to be like, dude, I can't do this. No matter how pretty you are, no matter how beautiful you are, you're my type, whatever. Whatever you're offering, I love her because we have a relationship.

Likewise, why did Jesus die for our sins? To deepen our relationship, right? So if he deepens our relationship, yeah, before, when I didn't know Jesus, of course I could just sin, I was sending however I wanted. I was a gang member. I shot at people, bin stabbed, bin shot, all this stuff.

But now that I have Jesus, when Satan the baddie comes and tries to play, hey, let's do this. Let's go back to doing Coke. Let's, you know, let's sleep around. I will think about, because of my relationship and my savior, I would not sin however I want. Yeah. Right. So this is what people misconstrue is they think, oh, I can just send out.

Johnny, you're teaching that we're perfect and righteous. We could just do whatever we want? Absolutely not. If you truly believe and you recognize that you're supposed to burn in hell, which is what I knew. I knew there's a lot of heinous things that I've done. I didn't go to prison at 12 years old for selling strawberry shortcakes. I was obviously a gang member. So I know that I was supposed to go to hell.

And then when I heard this salvific message that you're righteous and you didn't do anything for it, Jesus did it all, why wouldn't I love him so much? Why wouldn't I give all of my life to get to know him, read the Bible, follow him and all of that? Right. So abusing grace essentially, I'm sorry for the long-winded, you know, explanation, but it's essentially trusting that, it's still trusting in yourself. That's how you abuse the grace. Because Jesus says through grace and through my blood alone, which I shed for you, can you come to me? I am the way, the life, the truth. You can't come to me, right? You can't come to my father unless it's through me. But people think legalistically, keeping the commandments, doing better, trying harder. That's what's going to get them. into heaven. But Jesus came for the sinners. A lot of good people, sadly, are not getting into heaven.

The Pharisees were very good people. They kept the laws. They added to the laws. Sardosies and scribes. They did all of that. But they abused the grace because when Jesus came and he was like, I am the prince of peace. I am the messiah, the Messiah. They were like, God of Isaac, Abraham and Jacob is my God. You're nothing. And these good people who didn't break the laws, they were condemning people who broke the laws, took him to the cross and crucified him. So this goodness is the abuse of, is abusing the grace. If you think you're good, you will trust yourself because you don't trust evil people. And when you trust yourself, you will sin continuously.

That's how it is. Dang, I feel like the one thing I'm struggling with, though, to like understand like the identity thing. Like I understand what you're saying. And it feels powerful to me. But I feel like if I told myself consistently, I'm just trying to think, because I'm not going to lot. I did this a lot in 2023. I was telling myself, like, oh, I'm righteous. I'm perfect. I'm righteous. I'm perfect. Which I believe that. I really do believe that. Sure. But then I feel like there was a part of me that got prideful. Like my head got big. I was like, oh, yo, I'm, I'm chilling.

And then I just was like, yo, I'm straight up sinless. And then I'm not going to lie in 2023 at the end of 2020. I made a knucklehead decision. And I felt the most condemnation I've ever felt my life. Because I kept telling myself, oh, you know, I'm righteous. I'm perfect. I'm righteous. I'm perfect. I'm righteous. And I got this big head. And I'm make a note made a no good decision and i felt awful and so like i guess i'm trying to figure out how to wear that label without getting a big head yeah yeah but because like part of me kind of understands like like like i guess when i say like the identity of a sinner like when i think of salvation like coming to christ i'm like okay i acknowledge that i am a sinner like when i when i when i'm like

surrendering my life to go okay okay i'm acknowledging right now i'm a dirty sinner and i need you right now but is there not a part of it that like makes you that keeps you humble knowing that like you're a sinner yeah absolutely so we can take paul's stance on this so paul it's arguable but he essentially wrote 14 epistles right he had tertias he had other people write under him luke and things like that for hebrews but he says i am the chief of sinners right number one but then and he also says in first corinthians 15 that he is the least of the least apostrophe Let's think about that for a second. He's saying he's a chief sinner.

He's in an era where there's Nero and this guy is killing a mass murderer. He's saying he's worse than him. Is he actually physically saying that he's worse like he's murdered more people? No, it's a heart posture thing, right? So Paul, we can take from him that he teaches us true humility by remembering who we are without Jesus. So he'll say it in Romans chapter 7 and verse 21 will say, who will save a wretched man like me? I thank God, Jesus.

who saved me. Right. So as the reason why people like you experienced this and appreciate you for sharing that, why they get big, big headed is because they forget where they came from. It's the same as King Solomon. When King Solomon came to God before he was a king, I am but a child, he says.

I don't know anything. But then he started getting the wisdom. And he started to misunderstand that this wisdom from God is now his own wisdom. Yeah. So like my perfection is not from me. if you strip Jesus away from Johnny Chang, bro, I could just murder people. Straight up. I'm a very, very hateful person.

Yeah. Very calculative. Very manipulative. But I understand that. That's the person I can never trust. That was a person that got crucified in Galatians 220. And that's why I moved boldly by saying we're perfected and righteous. But if you forget who you are, Bryce, a person who at 17 can only kill himself.

You understand what I'm saying? We can only have anxiety and crippling anxiety and depression and loneliness, right? then you will forever remain humble. Dang. That's what it comes down to with me. I'm going to a church in Austin. We're doing 10,000 people out there. And, you know, we just went to Phoenix and, you know,

1,300 people showed up. And right then and there, Satan creeps in. Johnny, you're doing good. You could preach the gospel. You know, you can do it. And as soon as I hear that, I'm like, wow, that's crazy. One of the sisters comes up to me and goes, Johnny, that was such an amazing sermon.

And I tell her straight up, sister, you're too late. So what do you mean? I've been sitting here and I've been watching it the whole time. I said Satan already told me that. She's like, oh my gosh. So we have to distrust our thoughts. Satan will always, he won't drag you down.

He'll boost you so high so that you can fall to your death. That's what it comes down to because pride before the fall. So you have to recognize. I know the Bible, not because Johnny knows the Bible, because God has given me the provision and the grace to do so. But you can only do that by remembering who you are without Jesus Christ. And that's what I always remember, right? I know who I am without Jesus.

I'm not a person who cares about anybody. very narcissistic very selfish very cunning very lustful but at the same time god saved the person like me yeah and he instead of killing me because i'm supposed to die he killed his son for me why would i then trust that same person yeah and this is where you assume that identity of moving with humility but also boldness yeah makes sense no that makes so much sense so that so like that whole 2023 23 23 i was like doing that and then that happened and i was like oh that sucks. So then all of 2024 to, I don't know if you remember, but when we did the group podcast with George, that's why I was opening up to. I was feeling so much pressure.

And like, because I'm like, I kind of like, for me, I'm hardwired super logical. So I'm just like, it's got to be one extreme or the other. So then I'm like, if that didn't work, let me just try to like strong man, all my faith, just being how much I can know and learn. And so now I feel like from start of January, like December, November, January. I'm on this slow process of trying to like figure out there's got to be a balance of both, you know, and that's, that was all super helpful. Thank you, Ron. So something I struggle with a lot personally is overthinking.

I'm a very big overthinker. And it like will ruin moments. It'll ruin things. I'll like something so innocent can be shared with me. And then I'll take it to the extreme in my brain. and then it'll make me sad or it will make me feel confused or make me feel like, oh, this person doesn't care about me. How can I take action steps to overcome the overthinking?

Sure. So overthinking is the same as the difference between overthinking and deep thinking is the same as conviction and condemnation. Overthinking will always leave you as you say confused, fearful, angry, frustrated, sad, lonely, miserable. Deep thinking is always empathetic. aesthetic at its core. It's always positive, right? So for example, one time I was driving, you know, this was prior to me finding God. You know, I had a BMW and I would always drive

without my seatbelt. And, you know, I was just horrible like that, right? And I would drive 90, 95, 100. And I looked down on my phone one time. I'm going on the free when I'm doing like blazing, 95, almost 100. And I look up and I guess it was just like that sudden stop of traffic in LA and I couldn't stop myself in time. But that day, I remember putting on my seatbelt, right? For some reason. It was all God, obviously. But, you know, and I crashed, I totaled the car, but I walked out unscathed, right? And the window, like, I felt the sheer force where the window like busted open. And I felt like if I didn't have my seatbelt on, I would have flowed out. I would have been dead, right? So every time I think about that, overthinking, for example, in this

situation would be, God, you're so stupid. Why do you speed? You're an idiot. You don't deserve to drive. It's all negative, right? You're like, why do you do this? Like, you're, you're dumb, right? And then it would cause confusion, frustration. But every time I think about that, deep thinking would be, man, God, thank you for allowing me to, although I crashed and I was a knucklehead, you saved my life with the seatbelt. Hope and peace comes out of that. Yeah. So if you want to see the difference between overthinking and deep thinking, most people think they're deep thinkers, but they're actually actually overthinkers. You gauge it with negativity or positivity. It's very simple. It's like actionable steps. Once you sit there, Bryce, and you think, you know, just to help you out, if you start to feel

that fear, condemnation, frustration, you know right then, oh, I've entered overthinking. I need to stop. Like, I don't need to go anymore because this is just going to lead me to be spiraling and rabbit hole after rabbit hole and filling some type of way. Yeah. And that's what helps me. Because Satan will give you these thoughts. Yeah. And to combat that thought, you would think about that, okay, is this negative at its core? It is. Then if it's negativity, I don't need that. And right there, you draw the line in your heart and it stops everything. And it's just like riding a bike, you know, when you first started distrusting your thoughts, all the things that I'm teaching, it's going to be hard. You're going to fall, scrape your knee, you may mess up again.

But the more you repeat and you do this, right, the more just like riding a bike, it becomes part of you and you learn that skill for life, right? Yeah. It's the same with distrusting your thoughts, differentiated between what's overthinking and deep thinking, condemnation, conviction. And that actually helps you. And you get to a point where you're at this level where I'm at, where it's like, oh, I know exactly what when Satan comes in with this thought, I can, I can forsake it right away. Is there like an action step that you're doing to draw the line? Are you like praying? Are you like speaking life over you? Are you quoting scripture? I think me, I think in verses, which is crazy, right? Like, that's why I read the Bible. Because like every time you ask a question,

there will be like a million verses that pop up. And that's what happens. when you keep reading the Bible. So for me, the line and the discernment, as you say, is the scripture. And then there's times where it will go blink, right? There's times where you're like, dude, I don't know what's going. Then, of course, prayer and also speaking life. Yeah. Right.

And I talked about this on George Janko's podcast, Avengers podcast, why God took Adam and, you know, told him to name all the animals. Because in Proverbs 18 talks about there's power and life and death and the power of your tongue. Yeah. So like you have to speak that out. you know like oh i'm overthinking right now right in the name of jesus i don't want to overthink father god please help me do your grace to not think so you know negatively yeah please replace my thoughts because i can't do it you have to do it for me right so yeah so

when we were in phoenix at like george's house and we were all hanging out it blew me away i've never seen anyone do this the way you did it and that's why i'm asking this question this is before the podcast. Everyone's talking. We're in group settings talking. And you're just sitting there listening. You're observing. And I even asked you about it.

You said you were a big observer and listener. And even when we're on the podcast, you're just kind of listening and listening. And it was very specific on what you said. It was like very almost like calculated. Like just like very precise this and there it is. And then you were done. Or like we would be on the podcast.

And it was kind of awkward because George was like, You just speak whatever you want, and it would be kind of awkward. And you and I think Angela spoke at the same time, and you go, no sister, you go. And I know like me, like I know any group setting. It's like the natural human nature is to, I got to say what I got to say. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I've never seen anyone be so slow to speak.

How did you, I'm phrasing the question like it's like a math equation, but how did you master that? I've never seen anyone do it like that. I think what I've learned is that you can never misinterpret silence. So there's a lot of leakage that people, like when someone speaks, for me at least, I can see where their subconscious is. I can see where their heart is. It's called a heart posture. So I've learned through the Bible, James Chapter 3, you quoted, be slow to speak, slow to

anger, quick to listen, right? that's really important because in ecclesiasis it talks about that too but it's when you sit there and you let somebody speak they're just going to pour everything out and then it's almost like the way I see it is like I'm like a spiritual heart doctor like I'm just waiting for them to like diagnose it you know and it's not from a level of authority or I'm better but I've just noticed like okay God I'm going to listen to what they have to say and then you give me the scripture and literally verses will come out. Right?

Like there was a point where George and Ruslan was getting into the hell. Yeah. And I knew like we're checkboxing God right now. Yeah. We're basically saying, okay, God, if this is true, make it make sense to me. And if you noticed, I was like, you know, George, like we're trying to checkbox God. Straight up.

Like we're finite individuals trying to understand an infinite being. You've already said that even if he does send to people and torture them forever, you would believe him regardless, right? it's because we're trusting our thoughts, right? Because when he sat there, I kept thinking of Isaiah 64 where all our righteousness, including our thoughts, everything from us is like filthy rags. But George was trying to understand, right? Make it make sense to me. Make it make sense to me. Well, then what makes us different than an atheist or an agnostic? God doesn't call us to walk by sight and things to confirm him. Even though it doesn't make sense, we're called to walk by faith

and believe him. So I could see that. And what that, helped me recognize and how I hone in on that skill is just recognizing that people will share their hearts and you don't you don't like I don't have to step on the toes you know I don't have to and why I let Angela do that is is because I've learned yeah just let people talk and they will express their hearts they will show you everything that's in their heart yeah and then you can then you know and I'm the same like I used to cut people off I used to have like main character energy you know and I used to just be like yo I got to say this I got to say that but if you listen to people you actually gain a lot more than actually speaking dang yeah that was that was something

i really admired about you um it was it was just so yeah it was so interesting like i i feel like it's very rare um now i think um my last question i had for you i'm i'm kind of selfish because i'm asking questions for myself no reason uh you move in peace man you're so calm What does it look like to move in peace? Like how can we move in peace? Because something I'm still trying to wrap my brain around is, I feel like this correlates. Like I was telling Cliff, even on the podcast, I was like, yo, I struggle with my frustration and my anger. And then Cliff was like, you don't make me anger.

I give you the power to make me angry. And I was like, shoot, like that kind of makes sense. True. But how can I continue to move in peace or how can I move in peace and be calm and things like that? Yeah, I don't know if that makes sense. It ties back into like taking, not taking ownership for what Satan has planted inside of you. So you don't want to obviously, you want to be peaceful, but there's times where you're just not. And that's what it goes all the way back to distrusting your thoughts and your feelings.

Because if you trust yourself, then you will take ownership of that intrusive thought or that anger or that frustration when it's not even yours. right the way i explain it is like if you're shopping in in a grocery store and you have a shopping cart full of your items and someone just comes and throws in like a can of beans you're going to be like yo this is not mine like you take it out and be like yo don't do that again right we do that with our shopping cards but we don't do that with our minds satan drops things inside of us and we're like oh yeah i want to eat beans yeah he'll drop in you're frustrated oh yeah i'm frustrated amen that's something that's very dangerous. Yeah.

So if you learn, oh, this is not from me, I don't want to feel angry right now. Oh, then I know right then and there it's not from me. It's from Satan. If I follow this, I'm going to be angry. So it's thinking deeply about your thoughts. And then that's essentially what Cliff was saying. Right.

He was saying, I don't give it power. And I'll go deeper by saying it's not even about giving it power. We're taking ownership and making it ours when it's not even ours. So we have to recognize that. So yeah, do I get angry? Of course. Do I get lustful? Absolutely.

But I think about it deeply. Wait a minute. If I trust this, what is this going to lead to? Right? It'll lead me. Sure, it may be happy, but let's weigh this out for a second. If I do, let's say, a line of Coke, will I just do a line of Coke? Absolutely not.

I'll do an A ball and then I'll start drinking. And when I get drunk, I get lustful, then that will lead me to this. Now, what about Coral the Heart, which is my digital congregation? What about good news? My church? They're going to, I'm going to, I have hundreds of thousands of people following me. and that's through that one line of coke and following that thought, it's going to ruin everybody's heart of like, man,

Johnny walks with peace, he understands. And even if he could fall, there's no hope for me. So I kind of learned to really think deeply. Whereas Satan through technology, chat, GBT, iPad, right? Which is babysitters for kids nowadays.

He makes you not think. And that's his strongest weapon. So if you don't think deeply, you're only going to accept everything that comes to your mind. And that's exactly how he deceives everybody in this world. I feel like you just spoke my language because I'm deadly afraid of airplanes. Especially like with everything that's going on. Like dude, I'm telling you we, I was getting on a plane and I looked at your Instagram story.

And it was like the most beautiful sunset outside the window. And bro, I'm freaking out. I'm like, dude, this is not. That's not me. Like if you ask Maddie, my girlfriend, like how I'm on planes, like, I'm not brave. I am not brave. Like, like it is not good. I'm like shutting the window. Everybody else got their window up and mine is shut. Like, yeah, it's

crazy. And so, and, and, and, you know, I'm going to be honest. Like, I don't like living like that because, like, you know, it's an airplane. And it's, I feel like right now, if I'm being honest, Satan is using all the stuff that's happening with airplanes right now. Of course. To instill the fear of, like, that's going to be you. Absolutely. And it's so, it's so hard not to think that way because I feel like he's disguising it, not as like his voice, but as like, bad news and so because it's bad news and because it's happening all the time it doesn't it's it's hard for me to discern him planning that you see what I'm saying you're like well it's not from him and in my mind I'm like I'm recognizing I'm seeing that now but it's hard to be like it it's not like a you know a

handsome guy trying to whisper in my ear it's like oh I open up my phone because I'm waiting five minutes to board and oh crap you know someone repost a video of this airplane and I'm like are you hitting me and it always happens right there and I'm just I'm like that's the thing that I'm I'm struggling with the most like I resonate with everything you're saying and that's the hard thing that I'm I'm I'm wrestling with right now is how can I discern that yeah when I feel like it's all packaged in such a way it doesn't seem it doesn't seem subtle yeah yeah yeah uh it's it still has to do with not being in our word right because the word of God tells us that he protects us right were under his wings. He cannot let those types of things happen to you. But Satan, and God also

says he doesn't give us a spirit of confusion, neither does he give us a spirit of fear. So again, when you feel confusion, when you feel fear, it is not from God. No matter how much it makes sense, right? If I lace this with cyanide and it's your favorite drink, let's say, no matter how, and you know that it's cyanide, you're not going to drink it, even if it's your favorite drink, right? Same thing. The thought makes so much sense, but it doesn't, it's still, the end result is fear and ultimately death. Yeah. And it's it's it makes you stagnant, right? Inconsistent. So you have to, you know, it takes time.

Yeah. This is what I help people with when I do my one on one mentors. Like I work with pastors in 90 different countries. Passers have the same thing. Johnny, I get what you're saying, but I'm not at that level. Like I still trust like what I'm thinking and it's, it's, it makes so much sense to me. And I'm like, but because you trust that above what the word says, right? Like you know about the word, but it enters here. It doesn't enter here. So we have to humble ourselves and recognize, wait a minute. If it's really hard for you, you have to start with prayer. You have to acknowledge one thing.

Oh, it's hard for me. I know what you're saying, God, but this is why I'm wretched. It's because although your word is true, I still feel like my thoughts and the way it's packaged makes more sense than your word. Why? Because you've been groomed. You're 21, right? Yeah. At the age, for 21 years by Satan telling you one thing.

It's not going to just happen overnight where you distrust your thoughts. Yeah. Right. But Satan even plants that expectation. Okay, Bryce, you're in your word now. You got to conquer this. You got to do this. He makes us work, right?

So you just have to recognize, oh, I'm a person who I need God. Because let's say you could conquer your fears. He could quote scripture all the time. You, you know, didn't struggle with anything. Why would you need God? You found God at your lowest point. And me too. We all find God at our lowest point.

But Satan, the way, what he plants inside of us is his heart to be the most high. Think about it. Satan was in heaven. He had everything that he wanted. He was a Nakash, a Cherubim, Seraphim, which is one of the, a seraphim, right? He was a very, very high-ranking angel, and he was a guardian to the throne. He had everything. He was only number two to God, essentially, right? God and Trinity is one. So he had everything, but he was the one that rebelled the most. He's like a spoiled kid, right? So we ask God to give us provision to make, like, more peace and, you know, all that. It's the same as like what Satan did.

He had everything, but he rebelled against God. When we have everything we want, without the fear, you don't go to God. You get what I'm saying? We'll just trust in ourselves more. So God loves us. He allows us to have these challenges, which ties back into the righteous falling down. He will let us fall to remember who we are. He could remove the sins like that.

He could have our sinful nature change, but he doesn't do it. Why? Because that's the exact thing that ties into humility, humbles us and makes us realize, oh, this is why I need my savior. Yeah. Right. So, dang. That's really helpful.

Sorry, I got another question because I can't my mind. So I read Psalm 63 and King David's like, yo, I long to be with you, Lord, but I'm in a dry and thirsty land. And I've noticed in my own life, like, I could be, I could feel so close to Jesus than I before, feel his presence, everything. And then I wake up and I'm like, bro, what is going on? Yeah. How do you win the morning as a Christian and not let's say? Because I feel like when you wake up, when you wake up and like at the end of the day, your willpower is decreased.

And then in the morning, like you're kind of like, you know, until you get sharp. It like takes a second to get sharp. How do you win the morning as a Christian? It tells us to set our scales back to zero, right? And what that means is God hates a broken scale. Say, for example, you put a five pound weight on a scale and you pull it off. It should go to zero. But our hearts are not like that.

When we receive blessings, waking up in the morning, things like that, our heart should be zero, but it's not. It's still focused on the blessings from before. And so this is what causes us to not be thankful. When gratitude fades, pride and like expectation rises. You get what I'm saying? So that's why it ties back into what I said earlier, which is not trusting your thoughts and really remembering who you are. Bryce, we're not people that deserve to live if we're being real. None of us in this room do.

Why? Because we were natural enemies of God. But instead of killing us, he killed Jesus. So if you just remember that, now you may not have been in prison or a gang member, right? You got some tattoos. Yeah, yeah. But we were imprisoned in something, right? I was in prison physically, also spiritually, mentally.

You as well, right? Except the physical part. And so those people, people like us, were freed by Jesus. If you just think about that, you'd be so happy. like wow I can not only am I allowed to preach the gospel I'm speaking in front of you know ASU I'm going to Austin I'm doing that Lord I'm a person who's a pitiful person I can't even get myself out of depression anxiety and loneliness and when you start to think about it from that perspective the grace of God the gratitude starts to grow but god you let me walk on these stages you keep me humble you have because of you I am happy you know so this is kind of what it

comes down to. You know, you have to just remember who you are. Yeah. And that will make you wake up every single morning, right? I did short-term missionary in Liberia, Africa. And the kids there taught me how to be thankful, truly, God through them. So at this time, you know, I was complainful because I'm like, bro, I got six months, you know, I've been out of prison for a little bit, but they want me to go there for six months in Africa, a country that I don't speak. And we're pretty crazy. They gave me a one-way ticket and the pastor said if if god doesn't work to get you back to where you need to be then rip up the bible don't believe in him so it was a no money witnessing trip is what we call it right you go and you just literally have to walk by faith right and that was hard for me this is like year two year three

for me in my walk right yeah so i was like bro you're like making me sink or swim essentially yeah so i get there and automatically i'm complainful it's hot out there we're eating one meal a day We have to hike two to three miles, one way to get our water, come back. But yet, what I noticed about the kids was there's like 50 kids in the village and they were playing with the soccer ball. But it wasn't even a soccer ball. It was a beach towel rolled up and duct tape. And they were playing with like, you know, sandals and they were dancing. And I'm like, bro, I have running water in the States, right?

I don't have to hike. I literally can eat three meals a day, five meals a day if I want to. But why is my heart not as happy and as joyous as them? It's because it was a heart issue. They were so thankful for the gospel. They were so thankful to even be alive. They didn't even have time to think about depression or poverty. They were living it.

But they were so much happier than I was. So I recognize, oh, this is not a whether I have more money, right? Like a full bank account does not fill an empty heart, right? So I'm like, it doesn't matter. Like it's their heart posture. They're thankful for everything. And it's because they love God. They truly believe like, wow, God came to our village and told us about the gospel.

And that really changed something inside of me when I came back here. That's how I move with peace. Of course, Satan attacks. He's all you got to get this. You don't have enough this. But again, comes back to remembering who you are. That's what's going to help you stay humble. Satan boosts you up, though.

No, Bryce, you're doing good. You preach the gospel. Well, look at all these people. You're working now and you got all these. like if you do that Satan will puff you up to where you can't even the blessings that come to you wouldn't be thankful for

because you know you'd want more and more and more it's in sensation right dang that's encouraging especially with the thing in Africa like I didn't even know you weren't on a mission trip have you ever talked about that before I have

really yeah yeah but it's not I don't talk about it often yeah yeah that's so powerful it's so I feel the same way I've been on like a couple out of country mission trips and it's like, it's just so crazy the gratitude that they have. It's insane. And it's always like, and I only went for a week. I never did six months, but it was like with my school.

And at the beginning of the week, it was like, really? Like, it's hot. And then by the end of the week, I was like, I don't want to leave this place. Which is so crazy to think about, but it's, for a lack of better terms, like the charisma, the energy, the positivity that they carry. The gratitude is contagious. promise last question how do you deal with I think what I notice like whenever I go home and I have an amazing pastor and whenever I look at pastors and churches and things like that I feel like oftentimes

from a Christian leadership perspective a lot of stuff is transactional with relationships in the sense that like to some extent a lot of people that talk to you or talk to pastors. It's, I'm going through this right now or I need my spiritual health and it's like transactional. And then technically for you, I mean, like you're leading the core of the heart and all these things. And for you, you're not like gaining anything out of it. How do you, I don't know, because I'm not, I don't think anything is an eye for an eye, but like how does it not get draining? You know? Yeah. It again ties back into remembering who I am, right? I'm not even supposed to be out. For the crimes that I've done, I should do

a hundred years and I should burn, right? So I recognize that every single day I'm out of prison, it gives me a heart to be like, man, I'm only here because of my pastor, Pastor Kim, who poured love into me. Why wouldn't I reciprocated to people? There's a lot of Johnny Chang's out there, right? There's a lot of Bryce where their anxiety and their depression and loneliness crushes them and it cripples them. So for me, like, I know it's not my heart. God has given me that heart to be like, look, what makes God happy in 1 Timothy chapter 2 in 1st Corinthians chapter 2? What's good to God is for people to be saved. He wants all men to come to the knowledge, right, and of salvation, essentially. And so when I think about it, like, I want to please God. I do. Not because it's a transactional

thing, but because he saved my life. And he pulled me out of literally the pits of hell and transferred me into heaven, right, as a citizen. So when I think about that, there are so many people who pour it into me, Pastor John, Pastor Kim, all these other pastors, why wouldn't I pour it into other people? And a lot of people question me, you know, they make videos, they do all this type of stuff because they don't, it's either jealousy or whatever it is, right? It's an enemy.

But I've learned to tune all of that out. and say amen to all of that. Because without God, that's who I am anyways. A heretic who doesn't believe in God, a lustful person, a gang member, you know, all of that, right? So I've learned to just acknowledge that everything does come from God to remain humble. And then I don't burn out because then I start to feel like this is a, it's almost like a privilege, bro, to be able to preach the gospel. We have churches in China and there's underground churches. We have underground churches in Arab countries too.

For us to even sit here and have a podcast and not worry about, you know, people coming in and taking us away and giving us 100 years for, you know, expressing our faith is a blessing. So when you think about it from, it's a perspective shift, but also a heart posture. Like there are so many of my brothers and sisters part of our mission that are literally, have been to prison for preaching the gospel. and I'm like, yo, I'm not even on that level respectfully. So, you know, to me, that's gangster. Yeah. And I'm like, so I'm like, I just, I'm just thankful to be able to preach this precious gospel to see somebody soul, literally see the chains break right in front of you

to be able to pour and nurture into people. I used to think people were weird when they would have like succulents and plants and stuff. Yeah. I'm like, why would you waste your time watching this stuff like grow, bro? And if I'm planning plants, I'm planning cannabis. Like I'm trying to make money off of that. Yeah, yeah.

But it's like, like now I understand though, because when I see people start from being, you know, in their depression and just four months later, completely free, it does something to me. It's like a currency that it's priceless, right? So that's what keeps me from burning out is remembering who I am without Jesus. Yeah. distrusting my thoughts that I'm tired and whatever and just being grateful that, man. Man, a wretched, dirty, evil person like me, a sinner who is now saved gets to preach this precious gospel, gets to walk on the ground and the foundation of the apostles like Apostle Paul and Peter and all that. A person like me, oh man, that's so, like what a privilege it is. You know, it's the legends of faith as they say. Right.

The Hall of Faith, not the Hall of Fame, right? So that's how I feel genuinely. And I don't know, it's just a hard thing. I'm just thankful. Yeah. Yeah. What does it mean? Another question.

I always hear, so when I read John 8, he says, and you know the truth and the truth will set you free. And then he says, a slave is temporary, but a son is forever. And I think that's so powerful. What does it mean to be free from sin? Does it mean, does it mean sinlessness? Or does it mean like just that the fact that it's got a hold on you? It's both, actually. It literally means, like, if you look at Romans chapter 6 verse 14, it says, for sin, shall have no dominion over you. for you are not under the law but under grace. Being free from sin is recognizing that you're under grace, that you didn't do anything. Jesus 2,000 years ago did everything.

And he made you come up to heaven with him. We're co-heirs to the throne, two crowns, one throne, right? So he's made us a royal priesthood as well. And that's what true freedom is. Being free from sin is recognizing that, you know, no matter what we do, it's not counted again. against us. Now again, doesn't mean you can go and do whatever you want. Yeah. But if you just sit and let that sink in, oh my gosh, it doesn't matter what I do. I can't do anything to, you know,

reverse the shedding of the blood that you gave freely for everybody. God, thank you so much for that. Because you knew that we couldn't keep the commandments. That's when Matthew 5, you said, I didn't come to abolish the law. I came to establish the law. Why did Jesus have to establish the law? because we couldn't. You know, why did he, why does he have to die for us? Because we can't die. We'll die in our sins and go to hell. And why does he rise? Because we can't live without him. So it's all Jesus centered, right? But sadly, a lot of people try to take that because it feels good to follow the commandments. It feels good to work for something and then sit behind and go, look what I did. I read the Bible. I did X, Y, and Z, understand? And that's why the Pharisees couldn't

accept him. Because they wanted works. They were shed. showing the synagogues and they had the drip, you know, and they were like, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm the ish, basically. And they couldn't accept that Jesus was like, no matter what you do respectfully, it doesn't compare to my work. And without me, you're not getting to heaven. Yeah. That made them want to murder him, basically, right? And they did. So I think it's very important for people to recognize that sin is freedom from you trying to do anything and recognizing that God through Jesus did everything already. That's why he hangs on the cross and says, it is finished.

He doesn't say it's a deposit, do better, and then you'll get your money back. He doesn't say it's a loan with interest, pay me back. He literally says it is finished, right? And so he's, and then he sits down, right, because he sat down on the throne. What do we do? When we sit, we rest, right? Because there's no more work to do. But sadly, Satan of this world, God of this world, right?

The prince of the power of the air tells people, work harder, do better, so that when you, who is imperfect, tries to be perfect, you fail. And when you fail, your spirit is broken and then Satan can just drag you and do whatever he wants with you. That's what it comes down to at the end of the day. Shoot. Yeah, I guess that makes a lot of sense. That's encouraging.

I appreciate that. Thanks for explaining that, answering my questions and giving your time because you can't get it back. So thanks for coming on. No worries, bro. pleasure, man. Yeah, I love you, man. It's so funny. Get to hang in chat and Phoenix and get to know you better. Yeah, for so. It's been some time. Yeah, man. Thanks for coming on. Thank you guys so much for watching, listen to the episode. If you guys, listen to these episodes, follow us on everything. Bryce Crawford podcast. Johnny, thanks for coming on. Appreciate you and we'll see you guys. Guys, thank you so much for

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