The Bugle - Sea Sore

Episode Date: March 19, 2023

Andy, Alice and Neil celebrate a major sea treaty, sure it will go well. Also, Octopus armies, small boats and politicians with a foot in the deep sea and a foot in the gutter. Plus, SVB. It's a bank, apparently, and everything is fine.Why not check out 15 years of top stories: https://www.thebuglepodcast.com/topstories.Featuring:Andy ZaltzmanAlice FraserNeil DelamereProduced by Chris Skinner and Laura Turner. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Dancelaguard fans, you will be thrilled to know a book is coming out if you fund it via Unbound. We are publishing the Dancelaguard Reader by Alice Fraser and Dancelaguard, a glorious insight into the world of Dancelaguard, self-published romance maven, and online bestseller. If you would like to find out how to support it, go to thebugelpodcast.com. If we get enough support, we will publish the book. That's a real thing that's going to happen. Thebugelpodcast.com to support the Danciler Guard Reader. A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-A- Audio newspaper for a visual world Hello, but you glurs and welcome. Am I still allowed to say welcome? Where's that off brand for UK? PLC these days Quite a bit of BBC work so I've got to make sure I for balance foreign against the government

So let's go with welcome and f*** off I mentioned that with things to the beauty I'm and his ultimate. This is issue 4256 of the bugle to be precise. Yes! 256 episodes since we relaunched, meaning fanfare please Chris. Bigger fanfare please Chris. Meeting that you can now have a straight eight round knockout to decide your favourite post relaunch bugle episode. A competition that assuming you did one match every two hours to allow for each episode, averaging about 40 minutes to play in full with a half-time

orange, some post-match analysis and a look ahead to the next contest. Going by about four matches a day, tapering down to two a day from the quarter final stage onwards with a break, a days break in between the round of 16 and the quarter finals and the quarter finals and the semi finals and two days between the semi finals and the finals and of course no third place playoff. That's precisely ten weeks of your life that you can do that competition in. Ironically, this beginning to this week's episode probably means it's already looking a good bet to be knocked out in the first round. Unless, or to guess this week, can pull this episode out of the fire. Let's find out, joining me to try to rescue this episode from a car in a basement in Australia, which may need some explanation it's Alice Fraser

hello Alice. Hello Andy there is no competition everybody's favorite episode is my debut on the vehicle of course where I launched the pun I think it was the one where I said our bite mucked fries all right about short spices short spices. Fast food endeavour. I am in a basement in a car in Newcastle in Australia because I did my fringe festival show here and it was terrible but also my baby and my dad are up in the hotel room looking after each other and this is the only place that I can podcast. Also cars have great acoustics and it's just a fun place to hang out. And I don't think I'm the only person who's hanging out in a car to avoid their children. I go for a walk sometimes in my suburb in Sydney and it's just like every fifth car is

a guy sitting behind his steering wheel on an iPad just illuminated in the dark, sadly avoiding his life. Yeah, I think most professional motor racing drivers are just avoiding their children to be honest. When you say they're avoiding their children, you don't mean like physically under track. That is a use for it, I would 100% tune into. Well, the voice you just heard there,

joining us for the first time this year, it's Neil Delamay. Hello Neil You're not in a basement or in a car No, no, I am celebrating saying Patrick's Day. I didn't realize was there Patrick's Day until I woke up and felt extra Irish I just I just felt both oppressed historically and glirical It's it's it's an unusual feeling, but I'm prepared to go for today, I have to say. Well, as a British person, for those two emotions, I'll say, sorry, and you're welcome. I'm stuck on the race car drivers who are trying to escape from their children.

Is that what they mean by I'm following in the footsteps of my father? They're just being tracked. It's quite possible. There are a lot of children of racing drivers themselves become racing drivers. Miqshu Makar. Yeah. I don't know if that's more than in other professions, whether the children of assassins themselves become assassins, I don't know.

We'll have to look at the stats. Chris, you are also For this St Patrick's Day special wearing a glorious Irish green football shirt Yeah, telling us the vintage beforehand It's the 8890 because back then you didn't like change a football shirt every six months. So Ireland kept this shirt for about three years. And it actually had a sponsor on it. Right.

Because they didn't have any money, I don't know. Sorry, yes. Happy some Patrick's Day, Andy. And I love the fact that the only two professions you could think of were race car driver and assassin. Well, those are the two that got away. From, you know, I've ended up with two professions, comedian and cricket satircition and yeah they were very much the losing semi-finalists

behind racing driver and assassin. What a UCAS form that actually was when you were filling in that. Listen I don't know I just don't if I get the point to be an ninja. If it's not, if it's not an ninja, it's definitely who opened the batting for Australia in 1911. Both race car drivers and assassin spend a surprising amount of time just spinning their wheels. Andy, do you find that being on the BBC as you are so often and the BBC's obsession with balance? I'm conscious of this as somebody who writes for some of the things that you do for the BBC. Does that leak into statistics as well when you say a statistic do you then have to say but also maybe numbers aren't real?

Yeah, basically you've got to be balanced and all things so the way I do is I do one true statistic and then one false one and you know just find that no one seems to notice. He does negative numbers in the statistics just to keep everybody happy. As long as all my statistics in any given day add up to naught, then that's fine. That's all I'm seeking for, but I'm not a big deal. Yeah, but you don't like not because not originally was invented by Arab mathematician Sighting from outside, you can't use down the BBC. Oh, right. There's can yet.

Oh. Yeah. What are you going to do now? You need some sort of Anglo-Saxon concept. That's what you do. Yeah. Well, I'll just build a hinge and be done with it. We are recording on St Patrick's Day to commemorate some Patrick's Day. I'm recording in front of a green screen, all bit with a picture of London on it. It's the 17th of March 2023. On this day, in the year 180, Commodus became

sole emperor of the Roman Empire at the age of just 18, following the death of his father Marcus Aurelius. Now contemporary accounts suggest that Marcus Aurelius was not even slightly murdered by his own son, but thanks to modern technology, we now know from watching films that Commodus did in fact himself murder his father before of course himself being laid to slain in the Colosseum by a vengeful gladiator. And it's amazing how wrong the historians of ancient Rome could be, half the time I think they just made shit up for a good historical author because they couldn't be able to do the research. On the 19th of March in 1932, so two days from now as we were called, possibly tomorrow, as you listen at Bueglot, I'm just seeing you individually there. I don't think our listenership is collapsed to just one listener. I hope not anyway. On this day in 19, well on the 19th of March in 1932, the Sydney Harbour Bridge was opened,

which if Alice was not in a basement in a car in Newcastle, Australia, rather than in Sydney, where she normally is of late, you'd be able to just confirm that it is still there, but I guess we'll just have to rely on that assumption. Prior to the Sydney Harbour Bridge opening, Alice, the only way to get across Sydney Harbour was by a combination of one or more of Dolphin, Miracle, Teleportation, Fruit-Pow, Jetsuit and Catapult. It's amazing that the influence that bridges had on Sydney as a city. Oh, yeah, absolutely. Or if you bite a one bad in the right place, it'll kick you across the harbor.

Right. Yeah. But I mean, the bridges just so much, so much better than those options. On the 20th of March, I'm still on the commenter's thing to be perfectly honest with you. The 20th of... He invented darts that year, of course. You know that, don't you? Yes, well, of course.

Yeah. And the Commode, which is a chair that you shit in. Look, any chair you shit in as a Commode, if you look at it in the right way. Technically, all the shit. If you bite it around a one-band in the wrong place, all the chairs are commos. On the 20th of March, so that will be Monday, as we record. It will be the 107th anniversary

of Albert Einstein, Little Freddy physics himself, publishing his general theory of relativity, which of course stated that an elephant looks tiny if it's a mile away, but a mouse looks fucking huge if I waggle it in your face. That was seven years ago. On Monday. As always, a section of the bugle is going straight in the bin. This week we have a special questions in modern philosophy section provided to us by our in-house bugle philosopher, Professor V. X. Buckestoff, in which we pose the following key questions in modern philosophy.

If furniture could talk, would so for starter war, would the widespread use of the social media term hashtag free will, itself disprove the existence of free will? If an animal demands to be eaten but only by a vegan, do meat eaters have a moral obligation to roost on a potato until it hatches? And if scientists discovered that the only way to save the human species was by cloning 100 million Cristiano Ronaldo's and million judi dentures and letting them loose until an otherwise unpopulated island for a hundred years which island should we use?

If you have answers to any of those questions do email them yes Al? I have an answer to the first one which is if so for us could talk would they start a war? It would depend on how the terms were couched. Oh, well this episode is really recovering very, very promisingly. I can see this being a quarter finalist at this rate. In what fucking competition? Top story this week, the sea. Love it or hate it. Believe it or think it's yet another conspiracy or scam by the elite.

The sea is here to stay. And since we last recorded, the nations of the world have reached a truly historic agreement to try to protect the oceans of this planet. It's followed ten years of negotiations, the UN high seas treaty has been agreed and it will come into force at some unspecified point in the relatively near future if it actually happens. This is a huge moment for the sea, a much underrated part of the world. We focus so much on land, but actually the sea, well it's what, good 70% of this planet, you're both fans of the sea as a, as a component, do you think it's had

its time and maybe we're just molly coddling and how about throwing treaties in its direction and trying to butt it up? Well, we need to see, because I'd like to keep my surname. Right, off course. Otherwise, I'm just called Neil. If there is no sea, that's how that works. I'm a big fan of this UN treaty that has come into force or are welcome into force. But the real question here I think Andy and Alice is can the fish be trusted to keep their side of the deal? I think that's the real key here. Like they are notoriously tricky to deal with. Some podcasts which have you believe that there's no such thing as one.

So I just don't think it's the right time to appease them. But apparently, apparently all the main parties came to the table. The UN, Captain Bird's Eye Poseidon, all the big hitters, and they hammered out a deal. Some of the carol like animals apparently were the last to hold out. They wanted a full-scale war with the UN, but the UN reached out to the traditional foe, the true crabs, following the old law of the sea, my enemies enemy, he's my friend. And sorry, can we just let that line have a little bit of space in the early? You can't just say that, and move straight on. I mean, I thought you'd like that.

You were right. If you're like that one, I'm a cracking octopus bun, come and open it up for the viewers. A cracking one, eh? Um, took ten years of negotiations to get this treaty sign, which involved disagreements on fishing rights, shipping lanes, deep sea mining, the rights of underwater volcanoes

to a rut whenever they wanted. And the amount of salt that is allowed in the sea, they finally settled on a slightly vague sounding place that it should be the same saltiness as a pan of water or cooking pasta in. So we'll see if that works out. I mean, that is hugely tricky negotiation when there are so many different parties involved as Neil was pointing out, obviously, us humans with our evolutionary nostalgia when we were aquatic microorganisms, living simple lives in the utopian adil of the ocean without social media and everyone shouting at each other. The plankton, with their unlikely of practical lobbying alliance with whale hunters, the whales themselves always complain about submarines trying to seduce their partners.

I mean, all these warring factions, and yet somehow they have hacked out a deal. Yeah and the massive delay of course at the launch party where the king of the ocean wanted his daughters to do a performance and opened the sea shell and his favorite daughter was and there which really put a hold on on proceedings. I always think that scene in the little mermaid where they open the sea shell and there's no aerial there. They don't, whoever wrote that scene doesn't understand show business at all. There is an understudy, there is a manatee in a red wig waiting backstage for her chance to shine and she would have been there. I just, I feel like my reaction to this story is very shaped by my childhood. It took them 10 years to negotiate an agreement

to protect the world's ocean, something that Captain Planet could have solved in one episode. The fishing industry was a very interesting party in any treaties to do with the sea. I mean, they must spend a lot of time as an industry just wishing people to hurry up with food printing technology because frankly it's f cold and wet out there. And the fish is themselves as well. The problem with they have in any negotiation is they often forget what they were trying to negotiate. So it's it is a really hard thing. You can understand why it took quite quite so long. It's designated as much as 30% of the seas as protected areas. I guess the concern with that is that all the fish and other sea creatures will now move to that 30% of the ocean that is protected and property prices

and the remaining 70% could collapse causing an economic crash that ironically could bankrupt the entire ocean-based world. So, you know, there are clearly stumbling blocks ahead any particular highlights. Real estate problems in the deep ocean will be solved by rising sea levels as real estate problems on earth will be created. Not enough people talk about the gentrification of carol reef store. I think and that's a good point that you raised there Andy. Increasingly white carol reefs. White car race. Okay. Yeah. Well, one man bleached is another man's property prices. And obviously, as Jane Austen herself once wrote, it is a truth universally acknowledged that a species in possession of a good planet must be in one of an economic system that

strives to exploit that planet for all its worth until there's nothing left but a post-apocalyptic wasteland of barren destruction. And the fainter co-s of some scientists saying we did warn you. And I guess... Julie was ahead of her time, wasn't she? She was very much ahead of her time. So, you know, there are these... So far.

You know, the preserving the oceans, you know, it's one of those classic woke things. The idea that, you know, we should have a planet that continues to function in the future more than six months away. That, you know, this treat is trying to address. Yeah, did you know her real name was actually Jane Austin Shortford, Jane Austin, Texas, revitalized by Joe Rogan's comedy club? I didn't know that.

Well, I mean, the BBC, which you mentioned earlier on, it's founding ethos was informed, educate, and entertain. And I think with three for three so far. Emily Brantes, real name was Emily Brantesaurus. I love people thought about this. There were very big family. So don't forget it, nickname. I had to shorten. In other seniors, scientists have warned of a, quote, alarming rise in microplastic pollution in the seas. They've claimed that there are now 2.3 million tons of microplastics, a 10-fold increase

in just 15 years. Now the question arises, is this because we're putting way more microplastics into the ocean? Or is it? Because the creatures that live in the ocean have been trained to be more discerning eaters and are no longer eating as much plastic as they were. This is a good news story people. This is evolution in action. This is scientific overreach. Like science is telling us that this is an alarming rise in ocean pollution. It's only alarming if you personally don't want to piss microbees, like a machine gun of horrifying texture. Well, it's only alarming if you don't want a baby whose brain is full

of tiny bubbles or you don't want to be so full of plastic, the function as a human bull pit. I just feel like you can always spin this as a positive. Plastic doesn't age. Maybe this is the anti-aging solution we're all looking for. Yeah, I don't know. I think it's a bad thing guys. Right. Yeah. So you're working real? So, yeah, scientists have found microplastics in human bloodstreams, in human waste, and recently in our lungs. We are evolving into a kinder surprise. We have plastic inside our bodies and it's really put me off using my deldo. What is the point? If it's already there in assembling your own fake phallus, there are 2.3 million tons of microplastics in the

ocean. If you buy the action figure of a teenage mutant in your turtle, it will have less plastic than an actual turtle. And that is what our generation has done. When Sid Peter asked us at the parley gate, what if you don't and the boomers go, oh, will we defeat it communism? And the Gen Z people go, we start with a school strike to affect change.

He's gonna look at us and say, what did you and we'll say we laminated flipper from the inside out But I mean we do need to keep this in perspective. I mean 2.3 million tons of microplastic potentially in danger ing pretty much everything that lives in the sea might sound a lot But there are a third of a billion cubic miles of water in the sea and that weighs way more than 2.3 million tons. So there's a little way more water than plastic. In fact, I would say more than 90% of the sea is still water rather than plastic. So, just a classic example of the me, do you get your hold of something? Yeah, I mean, if Cleopatra looked at it that way,, like there's way more milk in this bath than Asp. Yes.

You're right. It's a bit of a perspective, isn't it? Yeah, this should be safe. How, what was that? Or maybe I feel bad because I'm lactose intolerant. I was so pleased when I found out that microplastics were caused by synthetic fiber breakdown because it justifies my decision to never wear anything but the corpse of a dead torn torn. I've got two questions there. Okay. What is that? And... To Star Wars reference. I'm your nerd fantasy girl. Yeah.

Um. It's my brand, but I'm just starting to brand myself as- When an Australian person just says the name of a creature, you just assume it's a weird shit that you've never seen before. I won 100% off. It was an animal from Victoria or from Western Australia or a manor who owns a use and he's called Tom, Tom. Oh, yes. Yes, Chris is showing us a picture.

Right, there we go. I just assumed it was something that had a pouch under its arm for keeping other people's children that were shot out of its eyeball. Like most other Australian animals do. like most other Australian animals do. A final piece of C news now, a world controversy in the C world because of a plan to build the world's first octopus farm and scientists and octopus fans have up in multiple limbs over welfare issues and the ethics of farming optopods famously intelligent creatures. I mean amongst the various words you don't often hear on public transport these days, I tell you what this world needs an optopas farm, there's going to be pretty high up there. I mean it's not something that we generally think about as a, I mean, how does a combine harvest of work underwater? I don't

know how, I don't know how this would work. But the great mistake the octopus community has made over the years, the many millions of years of evolution that it's had the opportunity to change it, to take control of itself, is remaining extremely delicious when boiled and sprinkled with paprika. And that is why this issue has arisen. As an octopus fan myself or a several a pot of file, as I think we're called, I'm really against this idea of farming octopuses. I think if you can't find the octopus on your own and challenge it to a duel like a gentleman you shouldn't, you don't deserve to eat octopus. They seem like the smartest thing that people still eat.

They're like right on that borderline of like ethical, ethically questionable and they're not just a handsy fish is what I'm saying. They have long memories and they do art and they have communities and they have opinions and like little personalities And I don't want to get on the wrong side of an octopus because I don't even know what side that would be their round Hansy fish my people my favorite turn I've ever heard of this podcast I I think I speak for all the long-time listeners of this show when I say I'm disappointed you squander the opportunity and you to call this a cephalopodcast. I'm absolutely disgusted by that. This company is planning to farm a million octopus or octopus I don't know for food.

But they're solitary and they're used to the dark and they're going to be put in tanks with other animals under lights and 10 to 15% of them will die. That is not a farm, that is squid game part two. It's not rice. The plan state of the company has achieved a level, this is, I love this phrase, this quote, has achieved a level of domestication in the species and that they do not show important signs of cannibalism or competition for food. Not they don't show any signs of cannibalism or competition for food. Not that they don't show any signs of cannibalism, just not the important signs of cannibalism. Like they do eat each other, you know, they do eat each other,

but just not so much that you the moon will die. Maybe three or four tentacles, but then they're absolutely stuffed after that. Tentacles are the breadsticks of the sea. And one of the things that they're suggesting they're gonna do, which is horrendous, is they're gonna kill them using icy water. Right?

So the icy water will dispatch the octopuses in a way. It doesn't seem to work on Wim-Half, but it does work on octopuses. And there's a cognitive neuroscientist and lots of the papers. And he was saying this is a very cruel thing to do. A more humane way would be to kill them the way fishermen do, which is clubbing them over the head. Now, if the less cruel way is bludgeoning them to death, that is not great. If the CEO of your company's gone, I don't really want to do the hype thermothing, it's cruel.

Has anybody got any ideas? Plunt for stronger to the head? Oh, you big softy-coloured. You big softy-dougay you big softy-goog. That's bad. We just need to need to nut the app. I'm also, you think about it, you know, this farm, a million octopuses, a million hyper-intelligent creatures

with a deep-seated, long-standing blood feud against humanity. That, again, is seen one in a science fiction film that ends with a destruction of humanity. It is way too big a risk. It is way too big a risk. Way way too big a risk. And you mentioned Neil that this is more like Squid Game, the way I look at it, as you've got, you know, these uncommunicative creatures who tend to live fairly solitary lifestyles in the dark, but are now being forced into communal tanks with light shining on them and then given extremely cold baths. Basically,

we are talking about the same method used to develop teenagers in British private schools through the 19th and 20th centuries. Only the end goal is slightly different. You wanted to create a tasty dinner rather than the ruling class. So, you know, it's just but you know, I guess learned behavior in handsy fish cap, cap and D. I guess learned behavior. I think handsy fish captain D. Swap, swap, swap, swap. Swap. That would be amazing.

Just trying to, Paris Johnson changing his color to blend him with a rock. I guarantee you the hand shakes would get less damp. He's trying to avoid childhood support again. The intelligence of oxpuses, I mean you might think are octopuses actually all that, you know, how clever can an octopus be? The last one they put an octopus on the TV quiz show Mastermind, it just answered eights to every question and then it waddled off. But there have been reports of oxpuses managing to escape from aquariums, if there was one pair of oxp an American aquarium that tripped their way

out by octopus plating a security guard, stealing a uniform, causing a distraction in the penguin enclosure by reporting a polar bear sighting and bursting out using one of the aquarium minibuses. And going on a four week alcohol fueled crime spray across six states that ended in a police ambush and a lethal gun flight outside of Spanish tapass bar in Louisiana. So these are creatures that we need to fear, respect and occasionally eat. Otherwise, we are doomed. I saw a, I was in Greece and I saw a bit of splashing out at the sea and a guy slowly coming out of the sea and he's having a bit of a wrestle.

And I'm sure I remember correctly he had a trident in one hand. And as he got closer, you could tell he was still joling with a live octopus. And he got, it was a rocky beach. And there's as a family, so it's three small children, two adults, only other people on the beach. And he finally gets himself in a position where we get the octopus by one leg and in front of us repeatedly beat the octopus to death on a rock in front of us. And then when it was limp, he reached in, bit the ink sack out of it, spat it out, nodded it as and carried on like we were supposed to continue a day just as normal

What a stag party So compared to the ice I'm not so sure I Really hope the Daniel Craig was gone. I like your vision for when I walk out to see But I've got a better idea for that. How about James Bond beat a squid to death and then points its insect out in front of everybody? Mmm, that could be the rebrand casino royale really needs. It was octopacy surely. I think if I remember from my Hal and Roger adventure book series as a child, book series as a child, scientifically accurate as it was, I think that's it biting out its brain. Right, that's that's worse. I don't need octopus. Right, but I have eaten octopus, but I've never killed an octopus with my bare hands whilst wielding a trident and confusing a family.

Confusing is an understatement. It was a spirit. It didn't have three heads. And he's so Britain news now. And well, this is also related to the sea. Since our last bugle about 10 days ago, we're shifting to Friday recordings for the next few weeks, the UK government has well incurred some criticism from various people who, on the more humanitarian end of the political seesaw, over their launch of a new scheme to clamp down on small boats crossing the channel packed with what I do think inform a terms times would have been referred to as human beings but I think that's

a term that is now the government is trying to remove from legal parlance. They've launched another three word slogan stop the boats. I I don't have been three word slogans increasingly popular in politics. My own personal favorite three word slogan is use three words or hyphenate unnecessarily whenever possible, in fact, one at all the time. It was a huge story, sort of last week and it was made huge by the input of one of England's greatest ever footballers, Gary Linnaker, who is a BBC football presenter now and has a huge social media following. And he tweeted to the fact that the language used by the government was reminiscent of some of the language used in 1930s, Germany. Now, of course, when you make a comment like that, it will be reported

as, Linnika says, the Tories are all Hitler, which was not quite what he said, but it led to, it was, it was, it was, the Linnika thing became a bigger story than the fact that the government was launching or developing a policy that was I think, well off the cliff in terms of a lack of humanity. It's kind of interesting what it showed about where Britain is as a nation politically and just the nature of public debates these days. Gary Linnaker, Neil of course famously scored England's goal against Ireland in the 1990 World Cup, in a one-all draw in the group stage. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to know that. And then Kevin Chidi equalised, yes, for the forces of good, I think the rest of the world

said, under there. Alice? I mean, stop the votes, here's an Australian slogan. It's nice to know that you shipped your convicts to us and we ship our barbarism back to you. I think that's how it. It's farming, the farming economics of it work. But I saw Rishi Sunak tweeted a number of things which he left up. I'm generally not a big fan of commenting on things that people have tweeted until they've had time to think better and take them down, but he's left it up for many days in a row now saying that people who come on small books to UK illegally or claim come to the UK illegally will not benefit.

And this was the real kicker for me was it will not benefit from the UK's modern slavery protections which I think is a great news for anybody who wanted to have slaves in the UK but didn't want to bring them in legally. That sounds about right. There are some people in parliament that just love an old three word slogan and immigration don't they? Stop the boats, get Brexit done, our bite, well you know the rest of that one. Every little helps and always coca-cola, I don't know all the rules. The paranoia from the certain newspapers on this is just unbearable.

They're here, they're afterco coast, they're in small boats, they're coming, they're not the fucking Vikings. If you relax, you're gonna be sick. This is an uh, yeah, I don't know, they're unenforceable, cruel law change to throw red meat to a certain base and there's this huge paranoia about small boats. And like, it's like, it's gonna get worse because this isn't gonna work so they'll be like, uh, uh, uh, we're, we're here at all small boats. We're no small boats. We're gonna mix small boat illegal Lylos their band as well ships in bottles. That's how borrowers illegally get into the country doors doors are banned Can it winds clearly floated for some time when one after the Titanic went down and as a precautionary measure Stephen Redgrave and Matthew Pincent will be executed in your sting

case. To be fair to the government though, they called it the illegal migration bill and it turns out that it is illegal in international law. I mean, this is a rare example of the government being honest about what it's doing. It is saying its own bill unless I've missed, I don't know where the pause is supposed to be if they're supposed to be a pause. But anyway, they've called it the illegal migration bill. And essentially they're trying to deal with this vast global humanitarian tragedy and the evils of people trafficking by being not particularly tough on the crime, but tough on the victims of crime, twisting one of their old slogans.

Yeah, I mean, you got already ambition there. The government already knows this immigration bill will break international law. They've intimated as much. The Northern Ireland protocol bill would break international law. Like, what's the next law that they'll aim for? I think gravity could go next. I think it's a confected Brussels Dictat that the noble UK can finally take on now the Brexit has

been done. This time next year you could be floating on the sailing Andy like a ginger-linel Richie just as Henry the eighth would have wanted. You did not win the war to be pulled down to earth by some Euro magnetic force controlled by an unelected planet and then of gravity goes, what about for every action there's an equal and opposite reaction?

Yeah, but maybe there shouldn't. Maybe physics is the invention of lefty lawyers who don't want hard working people to build perpetual motion machines. Did you ever think of that? No, you didn't. Well, I've been lefty, lefty law is one of the groups that were blamed for preventing the government putting through this illegal legislation. And so when a braverman, the home secretary, and part of the problem is that I'm their previous strategy of or policy of trying to catapult people to row underanda. They managed to get, I think, a total of zero

people on the plains to Rwanda under the ancient clause of the Magna Carta out of sight, out of mind. I think that was legal under British law, if nothing else. But Suella Bravenman said there are 100 million people in the world who could qualify for protection under asylum laws. Fortunately, but just by pure luck, 99.93 million last year couldn't read a map or just plain lazy, so it didn't bother coming. But what if they did all come at once, which they won't? But what if they do? And that's the question that Bradman is trying to address, warming to her numerically idiotic theme. Bradman, who holds one of the four great offices of state

in the UK brackets, what the fuck have we become? Added, there are likely billions more eager to come here if possible. Billions, billions of people, billions of people want to go, if we do not stop handfuls of people coming here on small boats, there will be billions. We have currently in the UK heading towards 70 million people. If billions do turn up, we're going to have to abandon our national addiction to underfunding in infrastructure, it's going to get, you know, the traffic's going to be... But why stop there? Why, I mean, why did she not just say trillions?

Is she really wanted to get the attention of the... But what, there could be trillions of people alive and dead. I mean, trillions of humans, zombies, ghosts, I mean, this, to me, Zombies ghosts, I mean this to me shows the scale of the challenge that the government is at least doing something to try to mitigate. Just quickly on the the Linear thing, he was briefly suspended from the BBC and they had to do a football highlights program with no humans present, no presenters, no commentators, which was a slightly weird moment in British sports casting history. The problem for Lenika was that really what he should have said was rather than comparing

the language to what was used in 1930s Germany. He should have said it was the kind of language that would be used in a fictional drama series, setting a hypothetical early to mid-20th century European country that is veering inextrable towards fascism. That would have made it fine. That would have made it ab, as long as it was only... only pretend. One final story before we fully run out of time. Alice, a banking crisis is enveloping the world once more. The Silicon Valley Bank in America, as

collapse, has been various attempts to shore up other struggling banks on both sides of the Atlantic Credit Suisse, abhorring 54 billion to keep their financial dingy afloat. First Republican America has been given 30 billion dollars. That's for a bank that I've never heard of and as far as most people are aware might might well be fictional. What is happening, Alice? And why is it happening so soon after the last f***ing idiotic financial collapse just 15 years ago? I mean, it's happening so soon after the last idiotic of a fiscal collapse because Americans cannot be convinced to regulate their industry. They have a very peculiar idea about how everything works and it doesn't involve anyone

being held back from ravening capitalism. The particular way this bank collapsed is very telling about the weird sort of feudal system in Silicon Valley. The richest people heard about the possibility of a Collapse First. They got their money out and then they told the people below them who then did exactly the same thing and so on and so forth. So that only the people who could at least afford to lose all their money were left holding the bag without any money in it at the end.

And I think the most sort of bizarre thing about this is watching libertarian tech laws spending years trying to convince people that the banking industry needs less government in order to be able to pivot lively into disruption or whatever. And then they turn around immediately and ask for bailouts. It's just watching the gods of dramatic irony shoot themselves in the foot with check-offs gun. Don't get me wrong. I think people who put their money in a bank should be protected by the government and some of them have been to a certain extent. I genuinely think that there should be regulation probably because I'm, you know, too much of a worst to believe in the inherent moral

virtue of letting people rip each other's throats out with their teeth in a state of nature until we have a king again. But I feel like the core problem here is that so many loud thought leaders continuously present Silicon Valley success, tech success as a function of a ruthless Darwinian survival of the fittest meritocratic thunder dome style situation when it mostly actually seems to be like a meritocratic thunder dome style situation when it mostly actually seems to be like a half hype game gold rush for angel VC money dumps like some cargo cart whether or just begging the big man to drop money on them or that scene in toy story 2 with a little cute green alien sort of pre-manyon prototypes are waiting for the claw machine to choose one of them to raise up into musk land businesses in Silicon Valley do not succeed because their business serves customers or meets a

need. They succeed when some ridiculous gambler slash money duke in barefoot shoes who thinks he's better than wearing a suit to a business meeting. It has venture capital and he decides to give them a spin on the money wheel because they did, I don't know, a funky futuristic PowerPoint presentation and they both listen to the same podcast. It's junk money being played with by impulse driven narcissists to have a God complex and they all know it's not real, which means that the moment someone tells them everyone else might find out it's not real, they start climbing each other to safety like ants in a flood.

Well, thanks for that insightful summary. I mean the question I would ask, does this show that the bugle has been going on too long? Because as the old saying goes, when a podcast spans two inanally avoidable global banking crises, either the podcast has been going on too long, or the global economy has got even more forgetful and stupid than it already was. That brings us to the end of this week's bugle. Neil, it's been lovely having you, having you back on, do you have any forthcoming shows or other works you'd like to.

Yes, I do a podcast. I do a podcast called, why would you tell me that? And producer Chris says it's one of its favorite podcasts. And we talk about things that you should know, but maybe you don't like the woman who invented monopoly. And for the exact opposite reason that you might know, but maybe you don't like the woman who invented monopoly and for the exact Ups reason that you might think and she got no credit for it. Are we interviewed this this season we interviewed the guy who's actually a rock star who did the voice for the IRA Want it wasn't be allowed wasn't allowed to be on UK TV. So check that out wherever you get your podcast It's called why would you tell me that? Alex. I'm doing my show twist at the Melbourne International

Comedy Festival and then I'll be doing it in London and Tokyo on the 18th of May and, um, wait, London will be after Tokyo and then Edinburgh and find me online at patreon.com slash Alice Fraser. I run writers meetings every week if you want to write with me there and I desperately undercharge for them because I don't know how to value my own way. And I forget also to listen to the gargle the Bugles glossy magazine sister publication hosted by Alice. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. It sounds fun. It's not your favourite podcast though, isn't Chris one of his favorites one thank you Neil

you Chris I also love catharsis and top stories Thank you for listening Bugglers we will now play you out with some more contributors to the bugle wall of fame to join the bugle voluntary Subscriptions game together one off or a current contribution to keep the show free, flourishing and independent, go to BuglePockers.com and click the Donate button. Jonathan Monroe invented the instruction manual, prior to which people just prayed to their local deity to make something work, or just shouted at the device until it snapped into action. Alex Hoffman discovered that the site of the renowned Battle of Waterloo in 1815 was not as many had thought, a large London station just south of the River Thames, but some land in modern day Belgium.

The station didn't actually exist until after the battle noted Alex, so I think it's just coincident. On which topic JC Van Ocker discovered that Napoleon wore a tricorn hat as a means of triangulating exactly where he was in relation to things like trees, lunch, and the enemy. Alan Hill inadvertently invented the game of Darts, whilst casually throwing carrots at a pizza during a particularly dull work dinner. And Andrew Callis changed the rules of chess to remove the once-popular option of sweeping all the pizzas off the board and claiming a drawn game. Simon Withham discovered the etymology of the Quafurial term Mullet, which emerged in 18th century philosophy when philosophers would mull over things for weeks if not months on end, leading to them growing long hair at the back, counter-pointed by shorter, dead

hair atop the brain, where the heat of thought had killed the roots of the hair. Chris White was a revolutionary figure in the evolution of the sport of table tennis, after suggesting that the participants should be allowed to play while standing on the floor, rather than on the table, should they so wish the tactic was and remains widely adopted. Margaret Warton conducted a reassessment of the works of the celebrated 17th-century Dutch painter Rembrandt and calculated that he actually painted lots of self-portraits over turning the previous assumptions that everyone who lived in 17th century Holland looked exactly the same just a bit older or younger. And finally, Marna Sharma discovered the missing note in the musical scale. It was D lying there hidden between C-shop and E-flat. Thank you to all our contributors to the Bugle Wall of Fame.

to the bugle wall of fame.