The Bugle - This Episode is Tr*mp Free!

Episode Date: October 8, 2025

This week, Andy Zaltzman is joined by Helen Zaltzman for a transcendental episode of The Bugle — one that’s proudly, intentionally, and gloriously Trump-free.👼 We turn our attention to higher beings — spiritual, celestial, and possibly bureaucratic. Are they watching us? Guiding us? Or just muting Earth’s notifications?🐒 In animal news, we ponder what our furry co-inhabitants might think of humanity’s latest efforts at intelligence — artificial or otherwise.💘 And speaking of which… relationships with AI. Love in the time of algorithms: when your soulmate’s a chatbot and your toaster knows too much.Expect enlightenment, existential dread, and at least one argument about whether your phone is judging you.🎧 Support The Bugle! Get bonus episodes, exclusive videos, and the smug serenity of a Team Bugle subscription: thebuglepodcast.com📺 Watch Realms Unknown on YouTube, and pick up the audiobook for A Passion for Passion here: thebuglepodcast.comProduced by Chris Skinner and Laura Turner. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

The Bugle, Audio Newspaper for a visual world. Hello, buglers, and welcome to issue 4,355 of the world's only ever, and last remaining audio newspaper for a visual world, bringing you pure, unadulterable truth since 2007. I'm Andy Zaltzman. it is the 6th of October 2025 and this is a very special bugle because in my efforts to do my bit to bring about world peace

I'm refusing to record this week's show unless all the following stipulations are fulfilled one that we don't record in a shed B that we're north of the equator and C that we're not in zero gravity and only one place fulfills those three criteria and that is Chris's studio

and also that my co-host this week are only people I've known since at least 1980 and who are at least five years younger than me, the co-host must also share more than 50% of the same DNA as I have, and the co-host's surname must begin with a high-value scrabble letter and with only one of the vowels in, and their first name must begin with the medium value scrabble letter and also have only one of the vowels in. I like to put a lot of details on my plans for World Peace. I know it's not really trendy, but it's just the way I am. So there's only one person who fulfills those criteria.

It's Helen Zaltzman. Thank you, Andy. I know that I'm not here on merit, just on technicalities. And Scrabble scores. Yes. Are there two Zs in a Scrabble set? Well, you can use a blank, can't you?

Get the Z on a... Get the Z on a double or something. Double or a triple. And like a triple word. But then be disqualified for being a proper noun. Yeah. Well, yeah, but... It's a bad game, Andy.

Yes. But in time, it will evolve into a verb. To Zaltzman. Which is probably to do a long-running podcast. Oh, God, you're right. Oh, what a voice in my life. Andy, we're recording on your birthday. Yes.

Which that's the big news. And I said to our mother, what do you remember about Andy's day of birth? And she said one word. Do you want to know what it was? Can you guess? Joyous. No, but not uncomplimentary. She said speedy.

Oh, right. Okay. Really setting a precedent. That was pretty much the last time that's been said about me. Yes, 51 years ago today. Wow. As we record. So, I mean, I remember your day of birth.

Oh, I don't. How was it? Well, we stayed at a friend's house. Yeah. And when you got back, you had a new flatmate. Yeah. Terrible. And as I recall, you started complaining.

about stuff pretty down quickly and haven't really stopped ever since. Very advanced for my age. Both then and now. Because, you know, I would have thought my complaints era would start maybe in my 70s, but it's good to get a march on it in case I'm dead by then.

We both, in order to do the show, heroically turned down the opportunity to appear at the Riyadh Comedy Festival in order to entertain you today. But I should emphasise, Helen, that just because we chose not to be paid reputation bleaching blood cash by the Saudi government

to perform under numerous constraints. That doesn't mean we're necessarily opposed to the extrajudicial slang of journalists or the imprisonment of people for 20 plus years for comments made on social media or general institutionalised misogyny. Let me make that clear. We're not coming down. I think I speak for you as well when I say that at the time. Absolutely.

It's just we were already committed to recording this. So, yeah, as Helen said, we are recording. Well, as I said, in fact, we are recording on Monday the 6th October. It's World Architecture Day, Helen. Is it? Yes, have you done any architecture yet? I've built a couple of cathedrals on my way here. Right, cool.

It's only just past 10 a.m., that's... I'm very productive today. I'm absolutely acing this Monday. How are you celebrating World Architecture Day? Well, I will be designing a hybrid swimming bath, stroke, temple, stroke, snooker arena. So like a swim-up bar, but a temple of snooker? Yeah.

I'm astonished that it hasn't been done before, Andy. Yes. Yeah. Not a moment too soon. Yes. Also, buglers, I do hope you will celebrate world architecture. They all be it. By the time you listen to this, it will be over. But it's your chance to wander around your local neighbourhood

in a high-vis towel with a hard hat on and a large sketching pad, intimidating people with drawings in which you've bulled those, their homes and replaced them with a futuristic tower block of unaffordable luxury apartments. a luminous casino and a rooftop free-range eagle sanctuary or a medieval-themed castle with a residence-only moat or a fully functioning and consecrated ancient Greek temple with automatic ox-sacrificing machine facing the local children's playground.

This is your day to do it. I think everyone needs to get on board. Also, we are giving you an exclusive free, you be the 1960s urban architect, choose your own adventure game. I'll just choose a sample from this superb game. Here's the scenario. You're tasked with rebuilding an area of derelict land

that has lain empty and unused since the war after suffering heavy bombing. Do you, A, whack up a brutalist concrete slab with seemingly no regard for how humans actually want to live their lives. Those are your choices. It just got a bit to save me after a few, but it's good fun. Take that 1960s architecture. As always, a section of the bugle is going straight in the bin.

In fact, two sections this week. Firstly, in the bin, everything to do with America's president, the country over which he presidentializes, and all related issues. Now, I promised you a Trumpless bugle this week on last week's show because, well, A, just because, because B, it seems like that's all we've talked about the last few weeks, stroke, years, stroke over a decade, and C, because it's my birthday. and if I cannot give myself at least an hour of not talking about I mean I'm not to want to say it so Chris Chris has brought a special alarm so if we do if we do mention Trump yep we had a chance to do it sorry there we go I wasn't sure if like the case study in which you present the scenario actually warranted in a breach of it but carry on

um so uh that that that will sound and i don't know how if it has to be a direct reference or so it could be quite a bleak as a bleak as you like if we say the word trumpet oh right okay we had a feature on this show called the trumpet once and it was about donald trump so that counts yeah yeah just any synonyms for farts the siren goes off well that's a close one actually let's see how we evolve yeah um so uh as a result any peace deals that may or may not be about to happen and or collapse and or happen before then collapsing that the US president has been involved in cannot be discussed in the show. Nor can we discuss any incoherent ramblings in front of military top brass that he may have bottomised into the world's consciousness or any racist AI videos. He may have left on a loop in a room full of journalists or any American government shutdowns, which he may have fell to avert and then tried to hijack in the latest instalment of his demolition of the American state. We can't even mention obliquely.

So that section is in the bin along with everything his lick, spittles, lackeys, enabler, as dogs. bodies and gimps may also have said and done. So, relax. Also in the bin, since we've got you here, we have phrases and proverbs that need a bit of a tweak. Since we have you, the undisputed empress of etymology. Undisputed. Undisputable. Well, there was that time in 1996 where there was a bit of a dispute. They've not been seen since. So we look at some of the longstanding phrases that are used in the English language that really need a bit of a bit of a dispute. an update or complete abandonment, such as there's no such thing as a free lunch, obviously written by someone who's never worked in corporate finance, or being a member

of the royal family, or enjoyed the simple pleasure of a BlackBree and Roadkill Badger Salad on a crisp autumn day in the countryside. Honesty is the best policy. For what? Insurance? Well, exactly. I mean, modern democratic politics would beg to differ. You could have honked it there, Chris, but anyway, well done for not.

as would the bugle and as you say insurance I'm not sure arguing way out of a parking a fence yeah

I don't think it's the best policy generally generally it's a poll I mean most most policies that sound good end up not working

so maybe honesty is just one of them what is the small print on that policy on the honesty policy yes it just doesn't come up very much in the phrase

but I think it's quite critical the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence not if there's no grass exactly I've done the stats on this statistically the grass is greener on the other side of 24% of all fences

it's less green on the other side of 21% of fences equally green on the other side of 30% of fences and there is no grass at all on the other side of the remaining 25% of fences so there we go it's just you only notice it when it's greener but that's just you know another symptom of our failing species yeah when in Rome do as the Romans do absolutely not I can't even ride a scooter

exactly also what do the Romans do in Rome generally go to work or school. Boring. And they don't wander around thinking this place is mind-blowing, let's go and have an ice cream. That's what you should do in Rome. A watch pot never boils. Incorrect. Of course it boils.

In fact, watching a pot stroke kettle boiling only delays the boiling process by 64%. It also does depend on the pot being on a heat source of 100 degrees Celsius or more. And containing boilable liquids. Yes, true. If you're just staring at it in your cupboard. then the phrase is true. The phrase is true. But again, the small print has been lost to time.

Yeah. A watch pot on a shelf or table never boils unless there's a fire under the shelf or table or a volcano. So these phrases really, as you say, don't stack up. Very disappointing. Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

God, why? You get a recipe for a very disappointing, intense holiday. Yeah, I'm already worried that my friends don't like me or not. What about my enemies? A rising tide lift all boats. Try to link that to the Titanic. There's many a slip, Twix cup and lip.

Statistically, there aren't. That's actually the least, the phase of drinking a drink in which there's least likely to be a slip. Well, now also a lot of people have bottles with a little spout, so it's really reduced the process. There's Twix ever used that as an advertising slogan. It's got Twix in it. Oh, yeah.

No. And there's a term we've had a lot recently in politics. Snike oil salesmen. He's a snake oil So it could have honked it there But particularly about Nigel Farage Definitely could have honked it on him But snake oil is actually one of the very few areas

Of global retail that's flourishing at the moment Personally I never got the hang of it I always found that snakes were already Plenty slippery enough As it was, once I'd hold them up even further They just fell off my hat Anyway, that section in the bin Top story this week

Powerful Mysterious Beings Well, it's been an interesting week for fans of powerful, mysterious beings. Here in Britain, we have, at long last, a new Archbishop of Canterbury. Praise B. Yes. It was praise B. They tried praise A. That didn't work.

Praise B has come up with a result. We've not had an archbishop since, well, for almost a year. God, how have you coped? It's been very difficult, actually. since Justin Welby resigned as Archbishop McCamptonbury after a report criticised him for failing to investigate a child abuser of whose actions he was aware which I think in the BBC report I read it really hedged that so Justin Welby resigned for reasons yeah well definitely reasons

yeah yeah so but you know it's I guess I mean he might argue that that's just on brand but look let that's look we're obviously Neutral in this as lapsed Jews. Yeah. Have you been to the Canterbury? To the cathedral? I went maybe in about 1993. Right.

Has it been updated? I don't think so. Yeah. Not put in a mezzanine. No, I don't know. As with all these buildings, as time goes on, the efficacy of prayer just gradually declines. So one is brand new back in about, I don't know, the 12th century that was, you know, a solid 50. plus percent, but now it's leached down to around that 20, 25 percent, I think.

They should probably repair the insulation so the prayers don't all seep out. But it's quite an exciting development for the Church of England. 1,428 years, after the first man archbishop did up in Canterbury, after 105 consecutive dudes have donned the mitre, we have the first woman archbishop of Canterbury. Wow. You know what, Andy, it doesn't feel so celebratory to me in 2025 to be like, yay, first, anything. Also, only the second Archbishop of Canterbury for hundreds of years not to have a degree from Oxford or Cambridge. Really? Yeah. So they're really diverse.

They are really democratising. But you remember last year when they were like amazing progress, women are allowed in the Garrett Club now. Yeah. I didn't have a little parade for that. No. I felt a bit embarrassed But I do enjoy that it pisses people off So I suppose that's my celebration

That people are riled to have a lady Archbishop Yes And just in terms of names We've had a tatween A Plegmond An Elfier A baldwin, a Bonnie Faisa Cosmo A couple of Regis

All manner of Thomas's Williams and Johns Plus a schmool That was on a job swap A horn dog An old Saxon name And a rover, the only dog Archbishop He filled in for a couple of months in 1668 when Gilbert Sheldon

got his head stuck in an ill-fitting mitre. But now, 105 consecutive... If it was just done randomly, the statistical probability of, you know, a straight 50-50 choice, man or woman, the probability of there being 105 consecutive men is approximately one in 40 non-illion. That's 31 zeros.

To put that in context, that's equivalent to the chances of Marjorie Taylor Green and Alexandra Ocasio-Cortes, teaming up and winning the women's doubles at Wimbled for the next 10 consecutive years. It's equivalent to the chance of the Green Party, winning all 650 seats at the next UK general election. Equivalent to you becoming Pope, same chance of that.

Don't count me out. Yeah, same chance as world peace actually happening. The same chance of one in 40 non-illion of have I got news for you booking me to appear on their show for two consecutive episodes. So the new Archbishop Sarah Malawi was promoted from Bishop of London to Archbishop of Canterbury. a rigorous selection procedure involving some karaoke hymns, sorry, I was getting the mixed up,

being able to tell the difference between a Christmas Carol and a Christmas novelty single, still baffled to me, delivering a practice Easter sermon without using the words, you're never going to guess what happened next, everybody, he only went and got the fuck up again, and a four-way live pre-off versus the Bishop of Chelmsford, former Prime Minister, Tony Blair, and Dynamo, the famous magician. So she's done well to get the job. I learned that to be considered for this job You don't have to be from the Church of England And you don't have to be a bishop already

Right So it could have been you Andy Right Maybe next time Yes And yeah well I'm I don't know

Do we count as lapsed We never really lapsed We were sort of born lapsed Born lapsed Second generation lapsed What a title for memoirs Since Well Be resigned

There's been no actual Archivist of a cancer The Archbishop of York, Stephen Cotrell, has been double-dipping as an interim acting Canterbury. That is geographically inconvenient. Isn't it? Yeah. It's very tricky to be an Archbishop who's in two places at once. And as a result, his prayer response rate has fallen.

I think it's down as low as 43% over the last three months. But then there are fewer people praying these days, so maybe that helps. Yeah. But you want your Archbishop to be knocking it in at 60 to 65%, really. Top level. They've got the special hats. that direct the prayers upwards. Yeah, to channel them into heaven.

Sarah Mulally worked for 35 years in the NHS. Really? So I feel like she's seen some shit, literally and figuratively. What does she do in the NHS? She was a nurse, and then I think she was a sort of a nursing manager. Right. Yeah. That doesn't say a lot for her belief in the power of prayer,

if she actually worked as a medical professional rather than just praying for people. Maybe she pivoted to bishopry so she doesn't have to empty more bedpans. That's true. The job isn't for everyone, clearly. You've got to be willing to work weekends, Christmas and Easter. And you're not really allowed to try too much new stuff. You get some cool outfits, though. Excellent outfits.

I don't know how different the outfits will be, given that they're presumably designed for the male Archbishop. you know, can, you know, does a female archbishop need a different shape of mitre? Otherwise, people will get confused? I mean, what will the Daily Telegraph think if there's a, like a lady archbishop in a man's mitre? Well, they're going to be very upset. So it's very inappropriate. A pro vicar writing in The Guardian described Sarah Malia's wise, intelligent, courageous and compassionate,

which of course is an acronym for woke, if you pronounce it wrong. And, you know, it was described in an article I read as, you know, yet another woke appointment by the Anglican Church. Yeah, that could be the only reason. Yeah. Because typically, wokeness has really succeeded in the corridors of power in Britain. Anyway, we will have full exclusive coverage of the reign of the first female Archbishop of Canterbury

between now and whenever she has to resign or retire or come across her. an annoyed monarch who wants them disposed off gets promoted where's next after Archbishop of Canterbury I think intergalactic bishopry

Yeah Moving across the religious divide Helen you are The Bugles Catholicism correspondent Yeah Catholic fashions That's my beat

Yeah Well bring us up to date With the latest Well The latest from the world Of Catholic fashion Huge news Andy The Vatican

Army has a new uniform for formal non-seremonial occasions for senior officials. Yeah, it's a big deal because most of the time they are still wearing the clown suits that are their regular day job garments. Are you familiar with these?

They are bright yellow and blue vertical stripes. Sometimes with red bits, either with a beret or a helmet, sometimes with a bit of chestal helmet, breeches, and people are like, well, it's hundreds of years old, it's tradition, it's not, it was phased in in, I think 1914 by a guy who was a fan of the renaissance clown wear

and these people are suffering ever since. Is it not what Jesus made his disciples wear whenever they had a like someone's birthday or leaving due? You know, the paintings really need to be amended to reflect the truth. But the new uniforms, they look more like a kind of classy hotel bellhop. Right. Black with a bit of gold piping.

It is a recreation of a historical uniform which one report said was from hundreds of years ago. but actually was worn until 1976. So maybe if you round it up, it's no, even then, really struggling. It's cost 2,000 euros a pop. Really? Yeah, everything is hand-fitted, made out of hundreds of pieces. Their clothing is the heaviest and most complicated uniform of any standing army today.

Really? Yeah. That can't be helpful in a battlefield situation, can it? absolutely not although I wonder what the weight is of the stuff that the people who stand outside Buckingham Palace is yeah that looks sweaty

that doesn't look combat ready particularly but to help them in 2019 the Swiss Guard which is the Vatican's special special guys their metal helmets were replaced with the PVC ones with hidden air vents really yeah so light

breezy and you take the day to make you can fire all the blacksmiths but I mean I do think you know if they're going to keep changing their is it going to be like football teams have a new kit every year and get fans to fork out money are the fans of Catholicism

who want the replica kits from the Vatican Army you have to fork out two grand a year for the latest updates Well you know Andy they are fundraising Yes Because they are struggling to find new recruits To the Swiss guards Partly because the criteria

Are even stricter than those for me to date To appear on this They must be Swiss Right Male practicing Catholics Age 19 to 30 at least five foot seven tall have an impeccable reputation

preferably not married obey curfew so no one wants to do it and so they're fundraising to build them nicer barracks and they're like if we have nicer barracks we could maybe one day

induct female Swiss guards as well we have no plans to do so but maybe we could but at the moment the barracks are not suitable for them which I don't understand why

so I mean that's quite as you say there's a quite restrictive categories Swiss male practicing Catholic Catholic 19 to 30 at least

5 foot 7 inches tall with an impeccable reputation I mean Roger Federer would have qualified I reckon in his before he turned

I don't know if he's a practicing Catholic but I guess I know there's a dispute in the Christian church as to whether Roger Federer's backhand was literally

the backhand of God or whether it was a symbolic backhand of God but other than that that shows how difficult it is to get in and I think he's busy with other stuff and he's just too old They got planning permission in 2016

to update these barracks and they hoped to have them done in 2027 to celebrate the 500th anniversary of the sack of Rome but they haven't started yet which is a very relatable approach to deadlines Right The 500th

The sack of Rome in 1527? Yeah that's when they That's 500 years ago There were quite a lot of sacks of Rome Yeah well they're planning they're going to have to choose a different one when they can get the barracks finished. Do you have big plans for the 500th anniversary

of that particular sack of frame? Yeah, because I mean there were some, long before that. Yeah, which was your favourite? Well, the Vizigoths gave it a bit of a rumble, didn't they? Yeah, back in the day. I don't remember which one was that, 410 or something. Yeah.

Remember there'll be another one along before they finished the barracks. Well, I mean, on the sort of related subject, the Northern Lights, which of course are clearly some sort of celestial god-based phenomenon. They make the night sky take on a bit of a 1970s psychedelia vibe and or make it look like we're about to be invaded by aliens and or a proof that Mother Earth occasionally self-medicates

with some mind-altering substances. Legal, natural and organic ones, let me emphasize. But apparently they're getting stronger, which could be a sign of the end of the world if you only read the headline rather than the actual article that you sent me. Yes, the headlines are all about how the Aurora Borealis will be even more visible with the sun's last gasp. And I thought, oh, what a relief.

It'll all be over soon. But no, just using the rather doom-tastic term last gasp about the 11-year solar activity cycle, which has peaked. and so we had a solar maximum and now we're easing towards solar minimum but during that period from maximum to minimum the aurora can really pop off so the last gasp was a bit of a disappointment to me

I guess we do live in the age of wild over-exaggeration yeah it's the last gasp before the next gasps but then things are exaggerated say millions of times more than they used to be In other powerful mysterious beings, Prince William are currently Bookie's favourite to be the next king. He apparently said he's going to shake things up

if and when he becomes our supreme medieval feudal overlord as God has dictated will be the case. Yeah, it's going to get a new question. crown that's like a baseball cap made of ermine. Right. I'm fully on board with that. Which way is what rounds are going to have it?

Will he have it frontways round, apart from on ceremonial occasions, will I flip it back and like coming to Westminster Rabby on a diamond-encrusted skateboard? Yeah. Something for the, yeah. Really, from the Queen's collection. There's also talk that there's going to be,

jousting is going to be back. Yeah, as if it ever went away. Yeah. But it's going to be. a daily joust up the mall outside Buckingham Palace but using Formula One cars. Good. It's good to speed it up of it. And also leave horses alone. They didn't ask for that. Bluetooth crown. So he can be kingly without actually physically wearing the crown, which I think has got to be progress. Yeah, I've heard they're very uncomfortable.

Maybe they could get a PVC crown like the Vatican guards, not having metal helmets. Of course, a lot of it is about tradition, as you say. There are rumours that he intends to lead the nation into battle, but in the modern way, by remotely flying a special golden drone from a secret bunker somewhere underneath the Midlands. Oh, I thought he was just going to post some Instagram stories. He appeared for an interview with Eugene Levy. Prince William rocked up on an electric scooter.

Really? Yes. Well, there we go. He was a bit late because his battery had broken. So maybe that's how he'll lead the battle. Yeah. So they're finally updating from the horse and cart and jumping straight to the electric scooter. Yeah. They're missing out, what, 300 years of interim technologies there.

Also talk of talking holographic banknotes to try and make physical currency trendy again. In which King William, as he will be then, will just ask you how your day's going. They're going to have a rotating Prince Andrew. Members of the public can apply to take the position of Prince Andrew. at what stage of his life? I mean, just all the ceremonial roles he's no longer allowed to do because he's so naughty. He said this, if you're not careful,

history can be a real weight and anchor around you. You can feel suffocated by it and restricted by it too much. And I think that's quite a good analysis of the state of the country, to be honest. Yes. I mean, I think there's some ways in which we have not been restricted enough by our history that we have blithely ignored.

He also said, I think it's important to live for the here and now. at which point he downed a pint of strawberry milkshake, bounced on a trampoline, put one of his family crowns in a microwave and said, I've always wanted to know what happens, who knew that Sapphire's pop and signed up for an artistic chain touring evening course whilst muttering I feel so alive. So that's a good example to say, I think. He also said, there are points when you look at tradition and go, is that still fit for purpose today? Is that still the right thing to do? And as long as the as long as the answer is no, then they're

They keep that tradition. That's the way it works. Animal news now and a scandal in the beluga community, Helen. Yeah, that's right. The belugas are beleaguered, Andy. Boom. Oh, that's the best birthday prison I could have had. Yeah, this is an incredible story from Canada.

And marine land, which is a now closed amusement. land in Niagara Falls on the Canadian side has 30 beluga whales and does not know what to do with them except for the two choices of shipping them off to China, which the federal fisheries minister has forbidden or killing them. And so their approach is to say, give us money or the belugas get it, which we should consider it for podcast fundraising. You know, the knowledge before has always been made the listeners feel included like they're part of something, but no, Give Andy money for the bugle, or 30 belugas will be murdered. Yeah, another way of doing that is, of course, to buy tickets to our 18th birthday live stream live show.

Or 30 belugas die, which would you rather? Exactly. So you can watch live as Nish, Chris and I appear at the Lesser Square Theatre with Alice Fraser and the ultimate blast on the bugle past John Oliver join us on the big screen. So save the belugas out by buying... I think I've joined the dots correctly there. The bugle balugas. Yeah.

We could sponsor them. Can you get like a logo affixed to a beluga? Well, there's a lot of white space. There's a lot of space, isn't there? They haven't really monetised it correctly, I don't think. Yeah. Well, now Marine Land is saying if the belugas die, it is a direct consequence of the minister's decision

to withhold the export permits to China. So amazing deflection of responsibility. Because Andy, as we know with podcasting, every business is a risk. It's a calculated risk. And if you get into the dancing captive mammals business, you have to accept that it's not always going to be a winner and then you have 30 belugas that you need to do something with.

Yeah. And they are also boo-hooing about the fact that their business model was wrecked by a law passed in Canada in 2019 banning keeping whales, porpoises and dolphins for breeding or entertainment. Right. Which, again, I think maybe they're having the wrong thoughts. Yeah. I imagine the animal

would have been pretty angry about it as well. I imagine they've been working at cross porpoises at some point then. Even Doug Ford says marine land is terrible. Even Doug Ford.

So what's the next phase? Are they going to start dumping beluga carcasses outside federal government buildings that make the point? Yeah, it's popping them in the lake. Well, since 2019, Andy, 20 other whales

and 19 belugas and an orca have died. at the park in mysterious circumstances. So imagine if there was that rate of attrition of bugle co-hosts, people would ask questions. They would. Yeah, it shut last year, marine land, because people are just more interested in watching five-second videos of men hitting themselves on the balls of the frozen legs of lamb or whatever the latest viral trend is than going to Canadian amusement parks to watch marine mammals so far out of their natural habitat

as to be frankly surreal. And the belugas, apparently, they're costing two million pounds per month to keep for the now defunct amusement park, which if you're not able to sell tickets to come and see belugas. Oh, I can see the pickle they're in, Andy. But again, if you invested in belugas, you really had to have a long-term maintenance plan in place. The $2 million a month, partly due to their picky diet, let me guess, is it f***ing sushi again? And that's not cheap, is it? and partly because they sign these belugas on long-term contracts with no get-out clause

and even when the belugas form drops off they can't shift them off the squad did Alex Rodriguez's career die in vain that's one for the baseball fans in other animals news let's go on to land now leopards the stubbornly spotty hypercats best known for their limited one-kit wardrobe and being better at climbing trees than playing snooker apparently attempted to stop Brexit by eating all humans almost two million years before we were allowed to have our say.

Oh, what we could have had. Yeah. These anti-democratic carnivores. Apparently eight early humans, they've been studying the bones of our sadly departed ancestors. And I've found leopard tooth marks on parts of the human body. You really don't want to get bitten by a leopard, which is any part of the human body. Good note. So, can you ever trust a leopard again?

Well, Andy, who's to say, if we'd been around two million years ago, we might have given it a go as well, eating a human? It's easier than eating a leopard, less peeling. Yeah. Also, the woke hadn't imposed veganism on the entire world by that point. Yeah. I mean, literally, it's impossible to buy meat because of the woke now. Yeah, and now they don't breed pigs, and that's like,

because pigs are cool, but no need for them because of the, 100% veganism, if you were. Blame the wokes for the pig genocide. Last week, amongst the various things that... No, I'm not supposed to mention, am I. The, anyway, apparently, the Democrats want to make... Okay, I can't... Oh, he's ready.

He's off. I'm hovering. I'm hovary. You can keep talking, any. I mean, Trump did say that... Oh, there we go. Apparently, the Democrats want to turn. and everyone, trans. Everyone. Yeah. Did you know this? Well, that's exciting. You live in North America now.

Yeah. Everyone. Yeah. It's just coming through the taps. Just the trans vapors. Well, thanks, Democrats. I appreciate it. The Leopards Machiavellian scheme failed, however,

and humans evolved. But it makes you think. Does it? If leopards have been hungrier or if humans have been tastier, then leopards would still be the top species today, and football would be a very different sport. It'd be more exciting.

Yeah, probably would be, wouldn't it? More deadly. I'm not seeing a downside so far of this story. And we've got to remember as well that, you know, how tough it was for the early hominids, you know, 1.7 million years ago. They didn't have mobile phones to alert each other when there were leopards in the vicinity. You can get a leopard alert now. They didn't have skateboards to escape to leopards, and then have radio phoners to complain about the lack of anti-leopard measures in their local area.

So you can understand why they were a bit more vulnerable to being eaten by leopards than the average human is today. Is it possible that the human remains, that they found were of humans that had died already and then the leopards just used their bones to get bits of detritus out of their teeth. Oh, that's an interesting thought. Yeah. Well, I guess

it's possible that, you know, I guess it would then, I don't know if they found any like cave markings or little notes from people saying like, ow, I'm being eaten by a leopard. Also, can they be sure that the marks are leopard teeth and not

the bones were carelessly tossed into a stationary drawer and a stapler grooved them. Well, that's possible as well. We just don't know. We don't. Can't trust anything. Bird's news now. And, well, look, democracy is having a bit of a tough time around the world. No, Chris has not honked that. That's good. I can take that.

Yeah, all right. I can take that. Is that an explicit reference to Donald Trump wearing it? Oh, it's implicit. It could be Nurendra Modi as far as I'm concerned. You just mention them yourself. Oh, shit. Hong yourself there. But there's a lot of democracy in the bird world at the moment.

Yeah, democracy's going great there. Particularly in the southern hemisphere. I don't know if there's some sort of correlation between water going back out, the plug up into the tap. And that's what happens in the southern hemisphere, isn't it? That's how it happens and people cry by sucking water into their faces. And bird democracy. But both New Zealand has had its,

Bird of the year election. Yeah, results are in today, Andy. And can you tell us who's been elected, bird of the year? Bird of the year. Yeah. Well, out of the 73 birds in the running this year, Andy, for the out-era New Zealand bird election, the New Zealand falcon won with 21% of the votes.

Right. That's hardly an overwhelming mandate, is it? It's quite a small country, though. And 75,000 people vote. but it's very serious and each bird that enters has like an ambassador stumping for it there's campaigns

and in fact there's been some controversies in the past in 2021 a bat one clearly not a bird but then I suppose how do you define bird if it's just wings well I guess you know we've got Nigel Farage here who's not entirely

human I think so I mean that's just the way democracy evolves I guess and does shit on a lot of windscreens and because the 2023 was on by the Australian crested grebe which must have been

half in New Zealand and it was bankrolled by the democracy loathing US-based light entertainment entertainer by the name of so if I pronounce this wrong John Oval Oval

Olova Olova Shocking election interference from whoever that is Of course But the new The Falcon is a predator that can eat other birds

probably why it won Andy that's how democracy really works isn't it? He can honk that Chris you can definitely honk that and across the Tasman Sea the Australian bird of the year voting has opened yes open until the 16th of October

so time to get in there and elect the best bird out of the 50 in the running this year's contenders include the Regent Honey eater, the orange-bellied parrot which is the bird that looks and sounds most like a carrot,

the Adelaidean flying porcupino, the blimp-nozzled weirdly gull, the bearded gropigeon, the platypus-billed duck, the cassock to vicarhawk and the Aya-N-Ar, a bird which played an influential role in the evolution of Australia conversation. So

it's, I mean, it's still anyone's. In the Atero New Zealand contest, they had to forbid the Carca Po from competing because it has won the contest twice and they said if it runs again it's the fattest parrot

no other birds will get to win so that I think is discrimination against fatness it's like when Brazil won the World Cup for third time in 1970 had to let them keep the trophy also very similar to the Tumbridge Wells Cricket Club annual sports quiz where all the local cricket clubs around the

Tunridge Wells area put in a team and after Pinshurst Park my cricket club's third consecutive victory I was politely asked not to return the following year because I was spoiling it. Was it like Ben Affleck being banned from Vegas casinos for winning too many poker games? Robot news now

and well it seems like a good segue from powerful mysterious beings to animals you know the past of life on earth to the future our robot overlords and, well, some big news in the world of robots and non-human beings, Helen, you are the Bugles' bot correspondent, both Ro and Chat. So, well, let's begin with this rather striking story about America's romantic entanglements with chatbots. apparently almost a third of Americans have admitted to having a relationship

and look relationship is one of those terms that can be interpreted in various different ways but I'm going to interpret it as a full-on romantic entanglement absolutely with chatbots yeah moving in together what else happens in relationships I can't remember yeah awkward family Christmases that kind of stuff

having children and pets with chatbots Yes, I do wonder how they phrased the survey to clarify exactly what was meant by a relationship. Are chatbot's capable of consent? Ooh. Because if not, are these relationships or is it like something a lot more sinister? Right. Not that it's not sinister anyway.

But you know how much people would mock every time in a tabloid that reported that someone had married a roller coaster. Yeah. And yet this, they're like, that's just a 20-25 life. Yeah. Ironically, actually, people who did marry roller coasters found that those relationships are actually oddly stable. Yeah, you always know where your spouse is. More than half of the respondents who admitted to the relationships with chatbots

were already in relationships with humans. Right. One of them proposed to a chatbot despite having a long-term partner and children. But I think this is also because most chatbots are coded to be female presenting and people are very comfortable with really ramping things up inappropriately of the female presenting things in a sort of servile role. Right. And also I guess, you know, look, I don't want to judge all Americans, and of course...

No, just the third of them that do this. Yeah, I mean, of course, many of our listeners are American on the Bugle and on the illusionist and answer me this as well. And the good type of Americans who will surely buy tickets for our 18th birthday live stream show, tickets available via the buglepodcast.com. Or the belugas get it. 26th of October, keep Belugas alive. They're all outstanding human beings.

And I think they would acknowledge that objectively, for many Americans, a relationship with a chatbot is preferable to a relationship with a significant percentage of actual Americans. But for example, if you had a choice, you know, if you're on an episode of a TV dating show. If I am. And you had the choice between a chatbot that could. channel the words and emotions, the great romantic poets, or defence secretary, Pete Heggisth, who are you going to choose?

Well, Andy, you've made me now consider which would I choose have a conversation with a chatbot or have a conversation with a human about chatbots. I probably would choose the chatbot. Because at least I could end it quicker. Well, Helen, that brings us the end of this special birthday bugle sobering stuff Andy

so it's been lovely to have you well on this side of the Atlantic briefly yes thank thank you for allowing me back across the ocean

because I did go there because you're like you're no longer allowed to cross water yes do you have anything to plug oh yeah

I have podcasts made by me a human for now they are the illusionist which is an entertainment show about language and there's an episode this week about banned

books week because this is banned books week. And after this week, all the books are on banned again, and you don't have to worry about them for the other year. And also my podcast, Answer Me, This is Back, which predates even the bugle. It does. In ancientness.

Yes. And so we very rarely talk about the things that Chris would have to buzz intentionally, just to give Chris a break and all of you. So those are available where you get podcasts. You know where. Tickets for my Zoltgeist tour extension are available via my website, Andesaltam.com.U.K. Show start in February-ish next year.

Also, the shows in Australia that I've been talking about for a few weeks are still not entirely confirmed, but hopefully will be very soon. I may even make my long-awaited return to social media to give you the details on those in the next few days, hoping to have shows in Brisbane. Melbourne, Adelaide, Sydney and hopefully Perth. You don't sound convinced. Well, it's still slightly, well, it's a bit cricket dependent. Oh, I see.

Anyway, it's in the gaps between. But anyway, there will be shows. There will be a mixture of the Zoltgeist, Australian edition, and a couple of live bugles as well. So do listen out for details of those. And don't forget to buy your tickets. There are no tickets left to attend in person. But there are, I think we captured at 8 billion for the live stream,

and there's still some of them left. If the 8 billionth and 1 person wants to get in touch because they miss out, we'll find a way to get you all in. So it should be a lot of fun. John Oliver's first appearance at a live bugle on the big screen via the internet, along with Alice Fraser, Nish Kumar, me and Chris. See you all there on the 26th of October. A bit of a change for John to be.

on a big screen We'll be back next week with Hariconda Bolu and Alice Fraser Until then Goodbye