The Canadian Bitcoiners Podcast - Bitcoin News With a Canadian Spin - Bitcoin Treasury Companies, Paxful Claims Foul, Parasite Pool | The CBP 235 Pt 1

Episode Date: October 7, 2025

FRIENDS AND ENEMIESDid the Bank of Canada Abandon inflation as a metric they use to make policy decisions? Are Bitcoin treasury companies running out of ramp? Lets find out.Join us for some QUALITY Bitcoin and economics talk, with a Canadian focus, every Monday at 7 PM EST. From a couple of Canucks who like to talk about how Bitcoin will impact Canada. As always, none of the info is financial advice. Website: ⁠www.CanadianBitcoiners.com⁠Discord:   / discord   A part of the CBP Media Network: ⁠www.twitter.com/CBPMediaNetworkThis show is sponsored by: easyDNS - https://easydns.com EasyDNS is the best spot for Anycast DNS, domain name registrations, web and email services. They are fast, reliable and privacy focused. With DomainSure and EasyMail, you'll sleep soundly knowing your domain, email and information are private and protected. You can even pay for your services with Bitcoin! Apply coupon code 'CBPMEDIA' for 50% off initial purchase Bull Bitcoin - ⁠⁠https://mission.bullbitcoin.com/cbp⁠⁠ The CBP recommends Bull Bitcoin for all your BTC needs. There's never been a quicker, simpler, way to acquire Bitcoin. Use the link above for 25% off fees FOR LIFE, and start stacking today.256Heat -⁠ https://256heat.com/ ⁠ GET PAID TO HEAT YOUR HOUSE with 256 Heat. Whether you're heating your home, garage, office or rental, use a 256Heat unit and get paid MORE BITCOIN than it costs to run the unit. Book a call with a hashrate heating consultant today.The Canadian Bitcoin Conference - https://canadianbitcoinconf.com/The PREMIER Bitcoin Conference, held annually in the great white North, where Bitcoiners come together to share stories, build momentum and have a great time while doing so. Whether your a pleb, business, newcomer or OG, the Canadian Bitcoin Conference wants to see you in Montreal, October 16-18 2025. Don't miss this one!

Like a threat. And one of the things that can't be attacked is your self-custody Bitcoin. And one of the things that can be attacked is the ETF. Can't be exposed to that. That's my view. It's not a good idea. And by the way, that'll hit MSTR too. It'll probably hit other stuff as well.

Friends and enemies. Welcome back, Canadian Bitcoiners podcast. Friends and enemies, welcome to the CBP. Want to be better informed. Listen to Levin Joe E. Spots is taking care off right off the top. Oh, Bitcoin and Easy DNS. The media is feeding a sloppy.

Doesn't matter what topics discussed. Quality entertainment and information you can trust. That's being planned or at least discussed. You know, we're not going to allow. Quality entertainment and information you can trust. Send the guys some value boost them with some stats. Bitcoin is the scarcity. I mean, it's just a fact.

Geopolitical national down to the local cloud. Friends and enemies, welcome back to the Canadian Bitcoiners podcast. Len did the Bank of Canada, are they planning? abandoning inflation as a metric that they look at for their man struck i don't know who cares doesn't matter does it change anything it's just and even do anything about it even if they still look at it i don't know yeah that's a really good point the answer is no right a lot of this has to do with how much money is being pumped to the system what could a bank really do not much not much um we'll talk about that we'll talk about a bunch about the stuff it's good to see you guys

Thanks for stopping by. Thanks for listening, watching. Yeah, big day here. Bitcoin all-time high a little earlier, $126,000 something U.S., which is huge. I don't know what the prices now because I have a young daughter

and things to do before the podcast. 155. That's pretty good, 125K. We like that. We're on the way to a million. We'll talk about that. We'll talk about a bunch of other stuff. But first, lend the sponsors.

EasyDNS is the best place for you to host your content. Buy a domain, port a domain. anything to do with domains, Mark's got your back. We like Mark. He's been a friend of the show for a long time, a friend of ours as well. And him and I be doing a couple of different, I think chats at the conference will be on stage for it together. One is just the two of us about Bill C2, the wolf and sheep's clothing.

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wrong if you lose your client list or client database. So Mark can take care you there too. All you got to do is go to easy dns.com put in the promo code cbp media and you get 50% off your first round advice can't beat it what else is sold on the dark web bitcoin not good place to buy it not on the dark web would be from bull bitcoin good place to sell it not on the dark web would be bull bitcoin because they will happily sell it buy it all that thing using lightning using on chain the whole nine yards not just that i mean since they're non-custodial you have to provide an address in order to facilitate a buy. This is what you want.

You don't want to have an opportunity to get rugged. They don't give you that opportunity. You have to provide that address. This is really the way you should look at an exchange. Furthermore, you could also pay bills with your Bitcoin. You could buy gift cards with your Bitcoin. If you have to send money to somebody, you can send, well, through Bitcoin, it ends up as e-transfer in their bank account.

Lots of different options you could do over there. They're the best in the game. If you sign up using our referral code below, you'll get taken a little bit off your buys and sell. forever. Yeah. 25% off your fees. Yeah, I can't beat that. Can't beat that.

We have two more sponsors. The famous Brampton Man or Hamilton Man segment at the end of the show is where we talk about 256 heat, but you should be looking into them as well. And then, of course, Len, we're a week away from the Bitcoin Conference 2025. I'm very excited. Talk to Daniel Carlin today on the phone. Talk to one other person whose name I won't reveal, but there's going to be a fun contest during the conference as well.

Things are shaping up. Books my flights today, we are ready to rock and roll. If you haven't bought a ticket yet, you ought to, and you can get a bunch of money off. Not with our promo code. I don't know if Danny wants me to share this, what I'm going to anyway.

I think the promo code Meetup 2025 saves $45.45 bucks off the ticket off of any ticket. I'm pretty sure any tier. So enjoy that. A couple housekeeping things. I won't be here next week on Monday. I'll be at the Washington Redskins Chicago Bears Monday night game. So we need a co-host.

If you know who should co-host with Len, let me know and we'll bring them in. Otherwise, Len will be hosting with the chat. Yeah, yeah, I'll do it solo. I was thinking maybe just doing that as a solo rip. You could. You could be a quicker one. You're not going to hear me talk for an hour and a half. Yeah, it stinks could be Monday anyways over here, right?

So I don't expect a lot of people to be sitting by their computers, probably be fat and happy sitting by the TV. That's one thing. This week, I'm doing a home and away with Mike Campbell. So Mike will be stopping by 6 o'clock on Wednesday. And then I will be recording with him on Thursday. And we have an announcement to make on that Thursday show. It'll be on the Wednesday show, too, actually.

I'm not sure when he wants to make it. But I'm looking forward to talking to him. Tons, man, you know, I don't listen to a lot of shows with as much regularity as listen to Money Talks. I love Money Talks. I don't always listen to it right away anymore because I'm a little busier than I was a year ago, obviously, but you can go back through Mike's roster of guest, Len, honestly, and even including me, which is hilarious, if you listen to Mike's guess, you're making money. You're

making money on equities. You're making money on real estate. You're making money on Bitcoin. You're making money on metals. You're making money on commodities. Like, Mike, for all the things that we rant and rave about, about slop online, Mike is zero slop. He's all signal. And he's a great guy, too. So I'm looking forward to talking to him. It's been a while. since we had them on. We have them on about once a year. And I'm excited to chat with him. He doesn't get to talk on his own show.

He's asking all the questions. I want to ask him some questions. I'm like, put him on the spot. Yeah. What does he think about Bitcoin? He loves it. He loves it. Does he?

Yeah. I don't hear him speak too much about it. He's had, I'll tell you what, like the announcement we're making on Thursday tells you everything you need to know about what do you think is about Bitcoin. I'll say that. Boots? Let's do it. War time, 133.

A couple of beer mugs. Cheers. Cheers to you, too. You know, I should mention to Mark, thanks again to Mark for coming on the show two weeks ago. We released that last week. I forgot we didn't do a live show, but it did come out. So enjoy that if you haven't already. Okay, get back to the boost.

Sorry. God's Death, 230. God's Death, 237 stats. He says, thank you, gentlemen. You're welcome. I think this was respect to the, yours and Mark's interview. Yeah, I had a lot of fun with Mark Because he made a secondary comment to that

But there was no stats associated with it So I'm pretty sure that's what he's discussing Appreciate it, man, yep Mo BTC Dick 500 sats He says we need to start a betting pool For Joey's answers on Brampton versus Hamilton, man I'm not sure how we could do a betting pool Because it's alive

Yeah And yeah, so you'd have to bet right away is you going to say Brampton or Hamilton this could be possible but if you guys could figure us out and want to take lead on this go right ahead and I'd like to hear it totally to put it in action Dan Wedge

513 sats just give kudos to the $1, Singapore he says hey Noster this is a sponsorship call can we put some stats together and fund lend weekly shot at Bitcoin magazine

I think 1 to 5K sats weekly should do it. What am I going to say? You do it for 5,000 sets. I'll do it for free. Whenever there's a reason to it. tweet out the kindly MD stock chart every week and just play bagpipes. Oh my guys.

They did not have a good day today. It's below where it was on the conversion from medical zombie to Bitcoin Treasury, I think. I have to look at that again, but I saw some stuff on Twitter about that, not even an hour ago. So the people that bought in, the pipe guys. Yeah. Are they underwater or are you? I don't know what they bought at, honestly. So I'm not sure.

But it would be awesome if they were. I can't believe what I'm saying this. But at least he has access to a private jet. So it's all, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Listen, I hope they turn it around.

I hope they turn it around. I don't give a fuck about them. Doom Satoshi 521. Hold on. Hold on. I forgot to tell you my wife is going to pottery. I got to get the monitor from her. Just keep doing your thing.

In the final. Last but not least, doom Satoshi, 521 sets. Very short, very sweet. He says, thank you for your time, and you are very welcome. So for people wondering what the heck I'm doing, I'm reading off the top five boostograms that people can send in through stuff like, what is it, Noster and Fountain, shit like that. And if you want to send a message and some stats along with it, if it's top five, I'll read it next week. Yeah, so there you go.

I was going to say something there. I'll just, I keep on saying that I make this announcement on Thursday with Mike. Mike already made it. I'm going to be speaking at the World Outlook Financial Conference in Vancouver. in 2026. February, right? I think February, yeah. So I will be on the West Coast

talking to a room full of traditional financial investors and I will be doing a talk about obviously Bitcoin. So I don't know what I'm going to talk about because it just feels to me like I can go two directions, right? I could just spend the whole 20 minutes

just dunking on them or I could try and convince them that this is something they should be rooting for. I'm not sure. exactly. Rooting for it is something they should purchase. What makes Bitcoin, well, what makes Bitcoin Bitcoin? Yeah, we are desirable for us while limited supply. You can't take it from you to verify it with almost little horsepower.

There's a lot to it. If you start selling those items and explain each one in depth, then it's, it's hard to say, shit, this thing is garbage. Man, I really feel like you're right about that, but you're talking to people that understand rare assets or sorry hard assets that can't be duplicated so like that's the kind of shit you got to talk to these are the kinds that's my opinion but run with it man i'm really looking forward to it i'm really looking forward to it you know i we talk about on the show sometimes how because we did this podcast and because it's found you know niche internet microcelebrity status

um we've been afforded some kind of cool opportunities over the years to meet certain people and it's attend certain events like i could not be more happy to do this. And, uh, you know, they're paying for travel and that's it. I'm doing the rest for free. Um, it's, uh, it's my pleasure to talk to people who want to learn about Bitcoin in a, in a, in a scenario or at a, you know, a place in time where maybe it's not the favorite asset, right? Everywhere else we go land Bitcoin, obviously super popular. But this place, I expected to be, um, not a hostile crowd, but a skeptical crowd for sure. You got to take a step back. from where we are in this echo chamber and you have to figure out what is bitcoin adoption

right now and i'm not talking about just simply companies but just even individually and somebody that actually holds bitcoin not leaving on exchange or having an etf what is what is that what do we achieve in terms of adoption rate is it like one percent of one percent of one percent oh god maybe it's something extremely small and through all that we still we have now the price of Bitcoin went up today to 1.26K per Bitcoin. It shows you like how much runway is left here. Yeah. And we haven't heard anything from these monster companies, aside from Tesla. We haven't heard from Microsoft. We haven't heard from Google. We haven't heard from Apple. You name it. Say a thing positively about Bitcoin. Eventually, they're going to have to say something

positive about Bitcoin. And when they do, then people are going to look, oh, they flip a switch. Oh, there must be, there must be something to it. You missed a boat at that time. That's, you know, 17, 18 years past the inception date of Bitcoin. Nobody uses it right now. Yeah. And think of how valuable it is. And I can't buy enough of it. It's just, I crave it.

I need it. I need as much as possible. I think everybody's in that same boat once they understand it. And there's so much left to grow here. It's going to be great. I totally agree. Totally agree. Let's get into it.

Where do you want to start? Let's talk about this Bitcoin cookie guy. Sure. It's a story that we should all learn from. I am a big fan of learning from other people's mistakes. And the reason why these lessons are free. Somebody else pays the price and you just reap their words and go from there. So this guy, Bitcoin underscore cookie on X,

if you want to check him, I'll go ahead. He posted something unfortunate. What happened is Bitcoin. And I'm going to read it almost verbatim. He says, we are devastated to share that our Bitcoin holdings, our entire savings and a potential inheritance for our daughter has been drained from our ledger wallet. This was everything we worked for so hard to build and protect.

What he did, he clicked on a link and a hacker stole the information from a cloud. His keys were stored on a cloud somewhere. So this has nothing to do with leisure being shitty. It is shitty, but this wasn't the weakest link in the chain here. What it was is he did not properly store his keys. From what I gather, I'm just trying to piece things. When he set up his ledger wallet, he must have copied and pasted, those words into maybe a Google Cloud or some other cloud service.

I'm guessing, pick a cloud service, right? And then somehow, through clicking a link on the internet, he was able to give access to a hacker to his cloud. They must have found this, and it was for them, it was, you know, they must have been so happy to see that. The amount he lost was in the vicinity, don't call me in this, around 0.58 BTC, so more than half of Bitcoin. And it goes to show you, this was his entire savings,

and he's saying this is inheritance for his daughter. So in his eyes, how valuable Bitcoin is, not even one Bitcoin is generational wealth for this guy. And I'm in the same boat as him. But still, even with that in his head, with this thinking, he still did not do the right thing when it comes to setting up and securing your, keys. Everybody out there that has put their keys online somewhere. If it's on a computer

that's attached to the internet or you've in this case put it somewhere on a cloud server, you would, I strongly suggest to re-roll things, start from scratch and set it up so your keys are never exposed anywhere online and then move your Bitcoin from the compromised wallet or potentially compromised wallet to a new one, which is not compromised. Doing that, You are much safer. Learn from Bitcoin cookie. The guy suffered a, what, $65, $70,000 USD mistake. Nobody could afford this.

Maybe some people can, but nobody wants to afford this. Don't be like him. Be a better Bitcoin. I really love, excuse me, bad timing on the yacht. I really don't have much to say about this because, you know, we talked about these types of stories from time and time when they come up. How is it you're putting stuff into the cloud still? your seed words how is that you know you know what it is joy it is ease of use it is laziness

it's laziness is what it is yeah path of least resistance and this applies to anything this applies to anything in life people will always choose the path of least resistance when it comes to doing something and the reason why something is hard is because well a lot of people aren't doing it right that's what makes it hard but it doesn't mean it's the wrong thing to do it's just the more challenging thing and it potentially is more rewarding. How I suggest you back up your keys is you use the metal plates, do that, secure that somewhere. You can even be, you can even be very good with like some very creative solutions where

you maybe change things around or move it in the different, I don't want to give up too many secrets, but there's ways you could be very, very secure even if somebody does find your plates and that's the best way i i never want to have it exposed to internet and i i want to have it in safe places and multiple i think is probably the better and different jurisdictions because you never know if you get locked out on one and i think that's the best thing all and also another thing if you really want to go a little bit further you could use the 25th word so you could have a phrase yeah and if you really want to go even further you can memorize your keys. You could do it to 12 words, a little bit easier to remember.

24. You could memorize, like, you know, you could memorize the last five and a passphrase and not worry about basically anything. You could put the other, whatever, 19 in the cloud if you're really that desperate. But if you know the last five plus your passphrase, you're good. But like you said, it's just this path of least resistance all the time. Even as the asset appreciates to new heights, like NB. K had this right a long time ago, you know, secure your Bitcoin and like it's worth a hundred times more than it is because it's going to be worth that. And now here we are at, you know, whatever, 125,000. And people are still, I mean, the other question is, I wonder

how many people put stuff in the cloud five years ago and forgot about it. And now, you know, that data is maybe not, you know, necessarily quote unquote hackable. But certainly it's more at risk and if you just done this air gap with a cold card, you know, like you got to think about these things. You can fix this, by the way. Like, sweeping a wallet like you mentioned is easy to do it takes five minutes and there's no excuse for not doing it and fees are low yeah so moving it from one address to another even multiple times if you choose to do so it's not going to cost you very much in terms of fees in terms of bitcoin so now is a really good time to do it and i think one other thing i want to just point out because i don't really

i didn't touch on it too much is if somebody wants to leave their bitcoin on in exchange like i can't put enough thumbs down on that yeah wherever you buy your bitcoin hopefully it's bull bitcoin but if not if it's an exchange as custodial um move your bitcoin off as soon as it's possible to do so i know someone have like a minimum what you have to do or like whatever it is then if you do that you're not leaving it in for them to hold on to you because that's another rugable place i know it's not entirely the same yeah you know you get shotgun k y seed and i remember uh i had a bunch on shake pay maybe last year or two years ago i forget when But when I went to move it off, there was a, it was like a two-day delay because of the shotgun K-YC.

And the app didn't work like that. I couldn't get the app to take a picture or something like that. I can't remember what the problem was. But it ended up taking me a couple of days to get the corn off. And it's just like, why? I should have just not had this there at all in the first place. It's just not worth it. If you think directionally, it's going to get easier to take money off exchanges.

You're wrong about that. It's going to get much, much harder. All right. Do you want to move on and talk about this. Taxful story? Sure. Do Paxville? Do Bitcoin well?

Where do you want to go? Well, we can do Bitcoin well if you want to. I don't have much to say aside from the fact that they raised or they're going to the process to raise $100 million. And with that, they're going to be buying Bitcoin and also paying for general expenses as well. And so that's, they're working towards becoming a Bitcoin treasury company, so to speak. I think right now they're sitting on around 75 Bitcoin, give or take.

I can't remember that. I don't know, something like that. It's more just from what I understand. And yeah, I mean, all the more power to them. Like, what can I say? I'm not a fan of Bitcoin treasury companies, right? Yeah. I've been pretty adamant about this.

They could do what they want. I have no issues. No issues with any company to do whatever the fuck they want to do it. It's their company. They want to dilute, borrow. That's their fucking right to do it. But for me to invest in any Bitcoin treasury company, man, that's not. There's a couple of notable things here.

I just want to preface this by saying this is not a personal shot at Adam at all. Adam is a friend of the show. And while I don't necessarily agree, this is a good idea, there are some things here that should be concerning. First we'll talk about the dilution, right? There's a continued dilution going on at Bitcoin well that's like scheduled and recurring basically. He's paying... simply and BTC sessions in shares every quarter or something, every month. I don't know exactly why.

But the interesting thing is that in this raise, it looks like their latest raise was done at 10 cents a share while the influencers are getting 13 to 15 cents as a price. So the price is coming down on those shares. That's one problem. The problem is they don't have any cash, right? So, you know, while I do think that probably it's fine for simply in sessions to get paid in shares if they want them, I would just say that it's probably not an option to get paid in cash. It's probably it's shares or nothing, shares or options or whatever or nothing. 100 million is a lot

100 million is significantly more than they have in revenue and assets and whatever I don't understand how you make this decision and your shareholders are okay with it except that the shareholder base is really just like friends and family that's the only rationality

or rational I should say that I can think of because it's just a it's very risky to do this um i don't know uh i i i don't get this i said on the show before like you know going away from bitcoin well a little bit there's no good reason to buy any treasury company that's not micro strategy if you view treasury companies as a good play and by the way the market is telling you this bitcoin's at an all-time high and every treasury company safe for micro strategies down 90 percent so like at what point at what point is Bitcoin well no longer investable? I think probably the answer is right now, personally.

But maybe I'm wrong. I don't know. The other thing that you have to consider, I think, I'm not 100% sure exactly what the sort of machinations of this are. But if Bitcoin does get to a point where you can count on it as a long-term play, how are these companies going to continue to issue debt to buy it or issue shares to buy it when the people who are buying the shares could just buy themselves? Same thing goes from micro strategy, I think.

There's a lot of incentives here that are changing directions and a lot of wins that are changing directions. And like I said, as much as I'm rooting for Canadian companies and I have no issue with Adam is a good guy. I consider him a friend to be honest with you, although we don't speak as much as we used to. I don't think this is a good idea. You can't keep issuing shares. At some point, the investors will get angry about that. The only reason, like I said, the only reason I think they haven't is because it's probably mostly family and friends, if I had the guess, which is necessarily a knock on the company.

I mean, someone's got to buy the shares, right? But, yeah, I would say, I did some GPT research too, but I'm not going to read through all that it just to me it doesn't make a lot of sense and this is a problem with all these small treasury companies that you are always going to be second best at the you know in your in the most favorable situation the most favorable outcome for you you're going to be second best to msterr and there's no reason for anyone to buy anything it's not msterr or strike or strive or whatever right he's got all these prefs and you know so i don't know doesn't seem like a good idea to me their goal is to get 5,000 Bitcoin with this $100 million raise.

This is $100 million U.S. Yeah. By the way. Now, they say, as you said, yeah, 10.2 Canadian cents per unit. That's how they're going to be how they're going to do this private placement to raise. But think about this, right? Like, there's some operational dysfunction here. Like, the, the, I'm just looking at this list of data.

10% net losses and having to pay the influencers for marketing and. cash or in stock instead of cash. 39 million total debt versus 26 million in total assets. That's before the $100 million raise. And the $100 million raise, yeah, even GPT says that's at a massive discount. So, I mean, at some point, like what do people outside of Bitcoin think about this is the question? Because people outside of Bitcoin, if I look at MSTR, may think it's a little reckless, but you can't really argue with the fortress that guy's built.

where's the fortress here? I don't see it. And, you know, the one reason, I know, I've seen, like, certain people on Twitter talking about this is going to be Canada's treasury company. Like, Canada doesn't have an arbitrage, like a geographic arbitrage problem. You can go buy MSCR if you want. So, like, I don't see the point for this. And I see Boomer. Boomer's talking about, you know, it's, it's, they're diluting because they can.

I would argue that he actually can't. eventually someone is going to have to say something about this, whether it's the board or whatever, because they have a legal obligation as well. So whether it's his family and friends or not, as long as there's somebody investing that's not in that little circle, you know, one person being upset is enough to cause a stir. If the price of Bitcoin, if they buy it in and the price rips after that,

say it goes 50% or higher, then it's a good move. Because simply timing is they were fortunate in that. If the reverse happens, it goes down 20%, 10%. It's a bad move because they didn't time it right. Now, timing it is just rolling the dice. For the most part, maybe you have some inside knowledge where the market may be going. I don't think that's really true. But what question I have is, 100 million US.

Let's call that what, 140, 130, maybe. I don't know. Let's call 140 Canadian just for a heck of it, right? Sure. Take a guess what their market cap is in Canadian dollars. 20 million?

Very close. 30 million. See, you're going from 30 million market cap to raise 140 Canadian. I don't know. Like, I always wondered about that. It's a,

it feels like a hail Mary to me. It's not like, if I'm worth, like I have a business and the business is worth one dollar, how can I sell more of it than one dollar like it's only worth the market has deemed it to be one dollar worth of value how could i get two dollars worth of how could i squeeze more juice of a lemon that only could yield only one

wait till you hear about forward p.e like i don't know again like i'm just looking at some of the stuff i wrote down here um but this applies to everything like it does it does like not because doing the same thing i don't know how like a 10 million dollar they could raise so much capital when it's like, look at the market cap. Isn't that like what the market deems to be the value of the company? And you're going to somehow through some fiat magic raise more. I love that stuff because it just goes to show you why I like Bitcoin. Did you not ask Adam, did you not ask Adam a question about?

I don't want to get into that. Okay. I can't remember if you did or not. I know we talked about it a bit because we were both curious. Yeah, I don't know. I do not want to get into that. A 10 cents to share. It's way below recent.

trading levels. So, like, what is Bitcoin well trading for right now? 9.5 cents USD. Okay. So, yeah. So maybe it's about, it's about average. Yeah. Like, I don't know. You can't keep, you can't keep diluting. Like, it doesn't, again, it's, there's, there comes a time where this is going to stop working for everyone that's not Michael Saylor. And I I think that time is getting really, really close. And I've said before it, you know, as soon as they get on the S&P, if they get on the S&P, it's over for all these other guys. Every single one of them is going tits up. Every single one of them is going tits up. Do you think that micro strategy will be there in 10 years?

Yeah, for sure. 100%. I don't know. For some reason, I have a feeling of me. Do you think Bitcoin will be there in 10 years? Yes. Yeah, so he's going to be there in 10 years. He's got, he's got a portrait.

Those are not mutually exclusive. No, they're, no, they're completely aligned now. mostly because his capital structure and his share structure like he's the reason he's able to do this is because he's got the big Bitcoin balance sheet if you start adding passive blows to the MSTR equation like it's just going to become too strong

The evaluation is already there probably is 100% tied to them the perceived to the Bitcoin value that no that perceived that they have access to the Bitcoin okay sure sure now if something were to happen to either Fortress Fidelity

or Coinbase Either of them or maybe both That it's exposed That there has been a hack Even to the smallest degree That one of their wallets Was drained for like Half of Bitcoin

Something so small That it wouldn't impact The bottom line of MSTR And it could have come from a neighboring company One of somebody else that has I think the market Would look at this I say my God

I can't trust this to be held by a third party that could be hacked by hypothetically in North Korean or something like that. It didn't require much work. They just had to somehow work their way in, get it, boom, and then, oh man. And that would be enough to just really drive down the price of Bitcoin. And also drive down the price of said company. I'm not necessarily saying you're wrong. I just think that's a like a fat tail risk is what I would say. Yeah. now we just talked about coin keys left on yeah cloud yeah on a cloud I doubt it if who knows who knows now we went from hey it's never it's never zero percent

chance right never zero percent chance yeah we went from hold your own keys make sure it's never exposed you only have access to it blah blah blah to like that you know what this third party can hang on to it for me that's okay i i know i don't trust in exchange holding my bitcoin leaving a but I do trust those two places you can't those two things

don't align Joey it's either A is true or B is true not both at the same fucking time I think yeah you know

you're not wrong about that I just want to to wrap up that point about the treasury companies like Bitcoin

well is not alone in this what I think is going to be a failed failed plan failed idea and I hope

the ATM company can keep them afloat though it doesn't look like it can so I don't know as long as that is you could

keep getting debt, companies will last forever, regardless if they're able to present a, like it doesn't matter. Someone's got to give you the money. Someone's got to give you the money. Yeah, exactly. And if somebody's willing to do it,

and their rates are coming down in Canada, at least, more aggressively they are in the States. I'm not sure how that impacts borrowing rates at the commercial level, but if it does, maybe it's more favorable to start, you know, getting more and more debt. We're going to go drive to zero,

0% interest rates. That's the goal, it seems. What does that mean for borrowing? And they fucking do this forever. TBD, yeah, TBD. Then there's no stopping it. But what you can stop is Paxful. Yeah, right?

Because they are going to be winding down operations as of November 1st, 2025. And they say, this is straight from them. I'm not fucking bullshitting this. I'm not fucking pulling this out of my fucking ass. This is what it said on their X account. Due to the lasting impact of historic misconduct, by former co-founder's Ray Youssef.

We talked about him in the past. He almost came on the show. He almost had the show. Yeah. Okay. We opted not to. This was probably two years ago. Or shot back.

Sorry, I pronounced his name incorrectly. This was prior to 2023. Apparently those two gentlemen did some, as they say, historic misconduct. It's not me saying it. It's what Paxel said. And they say combined with unsustainable compliance remediation costs. So it's going to be closing down.

And they say, They condemn the actions of the past, does not reflect Paxville's values today. And since 2023, Paxville has transformed with a new leadership, strength and ethical operations, blah, blah, blah. And to be honest, I thought they were down for some time. I recall the story back in 2021. Right. Right. Like, that's when Ray Yusuf became a name that we talked about.

And, okay, what is Paxville? It's a peer-to-peer exchange is one of the largest out there. and to have this closed sucks added to the list though of peer to peer exchanges that seem to be you know shuddering yeah

yes it seems to be this is the way things are trending where is Paxville their headquarters located Joey if you could take a guess Canada United States Delaware to be specific

Of course Delaware Friendliest friendliest friendliest business jurisdiction in the world besides where was SBF again where was he came in or something like that I forget yeah someone in some island somewhere isn't the delaware biden state am i incorrect it is yeah yeah yeah great place to do business there's some rule there around incorporation that makes it

very easy to establish a company there at lcc if you recall correctly paxville was rugged by celsius they were doing the paxville earn and they were able to earn some weekly interest as a result but that very fiat like system well it went tits up and so they tried to do their best Ray Yusuf I think dipped in his own pockets to try to make investors or that's the story yeah

yeah so now it's closing but I think Ray Yusuf and Archer being historic misconduct I can't speak on that I haven't looked too much into that I'm more you touched in it I think that's the biggest story here is the peer-to-peer exchanges I think they're going to be

continually under attack. If they're not in a right jurisdiction, they say they had unsustainable compliance remediation cost. What the fuck does that mean? I don't know. It's just a word salad.

But it sounds like doing business in Delaware, one of the best places to do business wasn't good enough to stay open. I'm looking at other ones. These other peer-to-peer exchanges they've got to be careful with where they go. Big time keyman risk, right?

It seems all these peer to peer exchanges that have shut down had keyman risk. So these guys are blaming Ray. There's been other times, like, you know, not necessarily exchanges, but we've talked about tornado cash and samurai and stuff like that. If you got a guy at your helm, then you risk having problems. So interesting, right? Vexel, we talked about on the show we had. Mike the Groot on.

He was a, he's the leader of Bexel, another P2P exchange, mostly in Europe right now. But, you know, these guys are all, they're, it's a noble goal to have an exchange running that allows two Bitcoiners to trade cash for corn with minimal friction, minimal ID, minimal, blah, blah, blah, blah. But it's not free. None of this stuff is free. There's legal ramifications. You have to pay people to keep your business aflo. not to mention that the government targets you, you're in a whole other world of hurt.

Now, the question I have, honestly, is what are they claiming the, what are they claiming the crimes? I don't want to say crimes. I don't know. What are they claiming the, you know, nefarious activities were perpetrated by Ray and his partner? I don't know.

I didn't die too. I can't find it anywhere. I don't know what it is. I have no idea. It must have been something to do with their association with Celsius, the fact that they were offering up some sort of earned product

that was you think the timing of that just seems you know 2023 and Celsius went tits up 2022 yeah

so maybe because it's right it can be the right time yeah I'm not I'm not saying you wrong I really don't know though I couldn't find that anywhere I mean I didn't do that much searching but you would think that with that kind of claim they would have it in the thread at least but they actually had nothing so obviously

you know in my opinion my armchair armchair barrister here the reason you don't say what the act was is because you can't prove that he did it or it's an allegation that you don't want to pursue or whatever so that's another angle for all this through all this yeah it could be is if you do say something specific then it could be slanderous yep right then you're sending yourself for a legal challenge if you leave it like this it's just it's vague enough something happened yeah the milk is built and we have to close up

but to go back we were talking about decentralized exchanges to appear to your stuff. I think more than anything to show you how good we had it in Canada and two do we still have it in Canada when not too long ago, a year and change ago, two years ago, you could buy it at the Canada Post, our post office here with cash, right? And that was at the time KYC free. And that was done with the resistance. The post office was a agency of the government of Canada. So clearly it was nothing that was done nefariously. Also ATMs are, around. I think we have 3,600 or so ATMs throughout the country. Not all of them are KYC free. Some of them you have to provide some information, but there are a bunch of them that are KYC free, like Bitcoin Wells, for example. And they're still around. And if you want to, like, buy $500 worth of Bitcoin, you could go there. If you want to, if you want to buy $500 worth of Bitcoin for $1,000, boy, do I have a place where you can do it. I don't know if it's that. No, it's fine. I think the spread is 600, 600, let's say.

no not even that much 10% I think it's 10 or 20% so if it's 500 it's 550 oh 20% is 6 I think it's probably 10% yeah I don't think it's 20% let's look let's look but either way I just wanted to point out like how good it was I think it's 13 to 15%

in Canada the spread for their KYC and there's also KYC free light KYC free light I think that's the term to use I just like 5% spread if you want to try that way let's see so you just can do it other places you can't. And this

is making more news these days on some of the major news networks. They're talking about these Bitcoin, they call crypto ATMs as a way for people to extort money from people. You hear these stories all the time. They, somebody, they

get in touch with some random stooge and to say, look, we have this information, send us this, we'll clear, you know, your CRA is going to they're looking for money. This is how you could clear. Just send a Bitcoin where you go. So they're saying that this is a point of people using it for proceeds of crime.

And I'm wondering if there's going to be a point in time in a not too distant future that the government cracks down on Bitcoin ATMs. Any purchase is worth of Bitcoin ATMs. Yeah. And make them all KYC. Yeah. Nothing would surprise me. Cottle, hoddle is another one. Yeah.

There's tons of them out there. But their time is coming. I think you're right. Unfortunately, I wish you weren't right about that. But clearly, like, the clamps are coming down on financial privacy. I don't know how you could pretend anything else besides that. You know what? I want to double back.

I just thought of something from a previous discussion we were having. Sure. There is one original treasury company, Bitcoin treasury company in Canada. I've been doing this for a number of years. Easy DNS. That's publicly traded. Big digital assets, yeah, that's right. Right?

They haven't had Bitcoin in the balance sheet for years, right? Yeah. It hasn't translated into much for their stock price. It did once. I don't know since then. That was, see, that was the whole thing.

It's the pump when you first get in, right? And then all of a sudden it goes to where it should be to, you know, 20 cents or what the fucking that's, that's it's like normal price. That's, I think what happens with a lot of these companies.

They get pumped and then they just go back down to reality. And whatever. Let's see. What was the price of big digital assets right now? think uh 20 cents Canadian it is let's see

this uh 20 cents that's 8 cents down 5% down 5% today on bitcoin all time high oh that was way off so liquid

when we're saying liquid has a connection with big digital assets I yeah I see was on the board a big and didn't big buy a portion of liquid

something like a bunch of shares I'm not sure big provides liquid with the liquidity for their Bitcoin that they could use in the lightning before they ended up

becoming a treasure company themselves which then they don't even put it on lightning which seems we should get Sean back on I'm in Montreal obviously for a couple of days for the conference I'm going to bring a couple of wireless mics my iPhone and a stand

and maybe record a couple of short pods maybe I'll see if Sean wants to talk or you can interview him I'm not doing interviews for a while I'm taking a couple weeks off interviews you could talk to them You know better than me anyways on the liquid slash lightning side, which is what their business model is. Well, that's not what they say.

They say they're routing for fees and that's the business model. Look, if they are routing for fees, all the Bitcoin they bought with either selling debt or issuing debt or selling shares, they would have taken that Bitcoin and thrown it onto the Lightning Network to increase the amount of stats you can make through routing. but they didn't do that maybe you can't put your treasury assets into your operating budget what the fuck these I would love to see these

fucking rules being just I don't know I honestly don't know nothing would surprise me nothing would surprise you owned a fucking thing you bought it legally you could do whatever the fuck you want with it if you want to fucking wipe your ass with it you can not in this country

no man anyways parasite mining pool never heard of these guys great name Parasite.Space. That's their website. You're going to check them out.

So there is a ton of smaller mining pools out there. So me not hearing of this name before doesn't mean fuck all. Anyways, these gents decided to open source their code. You can check it out on github.com slash parasite pool. And it appears to be a fork of CK pool. One thing I just wanted to point out to this, one really interesting concept. if you're part of it, if a block is found,

one Bitcoin is given to the miner who finds the block, and the rest is divvied up amongst the rest of the people, the rest of the miners. I found it to be an interesting concept out there. I just wanted to just bring it out there and they get open source, and they have a different way of paying out. If you're not lucky miner, you're not really solo mining, but you are going to get a little bit more

if you are the lucky one to win. so interesting am I supposed to have a comment on that do you like this better or tides better from ocean pick your poison I guess I don't really have I personally like tides better but I will say

that on Reddit I am constantly now fed these pictures of guys with bid axes and it says blockbound what do I do now and the first question is always if you're in a pool nothing if you're in a pool you live the rest of your life with regret immense regret you're not getting that that reward it's shared you nice to have a little bit of a you know

a little bit of a bang and slice of a pie that you um that you ended up cracking right but uh not not an option for all these all these miners i like pides personally because the the idea that you can like turn your minor off for a bit and still reap some benefits because you you were on for x amount of hours or whatever x amount of blocks i really like that not to mention that Like, you know, just thinking about the heater that Twan got me here, it hits, I mean, ocean as a pool hits probably three, four blocks a day, two blocks a day, something like that. Like, it's not bad. Some days you actually crush it.

And, you know, if you're in a pool like parasite and it doesn't have a lot of hash, then that reward, that one Bitcoin reward may not matter because the likelihood that you find it is is quite low right on your own so you kind of need that you know parasitic relationship with the winner to make any money and if you're low hash rate then odds are not in your favor anyway somebody said that the guy james howells the guy that lost his yeah who said it someone just said it in the bull bitcoin chat yeah the garbage garbage guy Alex just said that in the bull chat i haven't looked into this at all but i'd be shocked if that was true yeah that's i think the last time we talked about him, I think

one of us said that we won't talk about him again. Wrong again. I don't know. Maybe it was me. I'm fucking wrong. That guy's such a little weasel. I hate the way he looks.

I know that's not nice to say, but he just looks like a scammer. It looks like a guy in a like a office HR video. He's the guy making the sexually inappropriate comment in the HR video at the office. You know, that's how he looks. If you had to describe Luke dash junior. We'll go from there.

Anyways, let's move on. I think, right? I'm telling you, in a parallel universe, he looks at the guy who hangs out outside the pot shop. That's how he looks.

Like, he's like a, you know, constantly stone type. That's probably a generous description, too, honestly. I could do worse than that.

He's not hanging around with the comic book guy from The Simpsons? No, I don't think so. Comic book guy has some, has some Riz, but the, like Luke. I don't know, man. I don't understand. I said this a million times.

Luke Dasher, assuming he didn't lose all his Bitcoin in this hack, whatever, last year, like, how was it possible you've been in Bitcoin for this long? Have so much to say about time preference, and you've never been to a gym. You've never lifted weights. You've never, like your diet, shit.

You're skin and shit. He's coding 100%. He has some water. Have some water while you're at the computer. You know? Have a piece of celery or something. I don't know. He can't, man.

He's just so focused on making sure that ocean. He's got to get his commits. He's got to get his commits. Right. 400 or 500 over to his lifespan, which decent. Apparently Gloria has like 200 more than him. I got this Gloria thing is crazy. I got to listen to Bitcoin University guys talk about nepotism and Bitcoin.

I do want to listen to it. I think these people are all, I said this. I think I tweeted this out. I don't know if I did or not. I wrote it and then just ignored it. But the thing is that all these people, okay, like Gloria, Luke, other, other core dabs, I won't name. I think one with a nice barba. Maybe.

I think all these people spent their whole lives as like shutting losers, honestly. And just we're so unprepared for the publicity, the fame and fortune and, honestly, influence that came with Bitcoin at $10,000, Bitcoin at $50, Bitcoin at $100,000. They're still prepared for it. They don't have the psychological makeup to metabolize that attention in a positive way or productive way. And so they just become crazy. They don't know how to handle it. They're all like Johnny Mansell except less cocaine and just more annoying tweets.

And it's just, to me, it's like an obvious social petri dish that these guys have found themselves in. none of them can handle the pressure. I think that's the most, that's the easiest way to look at all this stuff. I don't know what to add to that. Is it not? Like, look at all these guys. Like, they're just fucking weird. That's all.

And they don't know how to handle all the, all the eyeballs, right? I think that that explains so much about the way these guys act. If you could characterize them. And I don't want to say this applies to everybody there, but it seems like, you know, the nerdy person and the one that just likes to hang out with the computer rather than an individual

like that's that's what a programmer if you have to describe one in a historic one that would be it right maybe that's not the case now but

they're just kind of fitting the bill so to speak so does it really is it really odd and good for them that they were around think of

now if you want to go a little bit further into this imagine somehow mining Bitcoin or buying it for fuck all pennies

And it runs up to $100, $500,000, $1,000,000,000 X to your money or even your energy costs. And you're sitting on a ton of it. And this life-changing wealth, and even at that amount, I am so happy people didn't sell for whatever reason. Some did, some didn't. No, that's the case. All the more power to them, right? People needed to pay their bills. But imagine holding onto it.

And during the block size wars, the inflation bug, it's a whole bunch of things that you just didn't know what was going to happen. You know what? Those conversations were technical. And like the holders, the holders and miners and stuff that were around in the 2012, 13, whatever 14 area, they cared about Bitcoin. And now, you know, Adam back, another good example, like, just cannot handle. Fame. Fame is the thing that is making these guys fucking weird. Nothing else. It's fame. They have the same ideas about culture and tech and Bitcoin and money, but it's the

pressure they're under now that's making them, making them act, you know, act a fool. You think Adam Bach is, famous poet Ludacris says. So coming to pressure because his status has been elevated. Yeah. And really, because it seemed like he's always been able to. to deal with it he's you know i've heard him a number of podcasts he's always very well spoken so what and he's been on stage many times and it didn't seem to be phased by it i think that what happened adam back recently is just he's taking a stance that just is different than say lucas

yeah and that's you know that's fine everybody has your own opinion i don't agree with adam back stance but you know what everybody's has the ability to be wrong and him too yeah slayer heroes, right? Let's see the ethos in Bitcoin. It's, you know what? I don't even say it's just everybody isn't a human being. Nobody should be on a pedestal. Everybody should be judged on

what they're saying. They may have a history behind it, but the idea of what they're presenting at that particular moment should be what you're looking at. Now, there may be some hidden agenda and you've got to digest that and take that into consideration, but still the message that's being portrayed. Yeah, you can't be

a mind reader. Can't be a mind reader, for sure. No, yeah. I agree with you there. Solo mining. Yep. Let's talk about these guys. Sure. Solo mining.co.

That's the website if you want to check it out. They're a UK-based supplier of home-oriented Bitcoin miners. They sell home heaters like bid axes, shit like that. You know, stuff that the central tech is selling or to agree what 256 heat is selling. But anyways, they reported this past week that the website was being deduced. and tacked through that. This is a bullshit move. Whoever is doing it.

Wondering who is doing it, a competitor? I don't know. Remember, they're based in the UK, by the way. So I'm wondering if it's somebody that hates Bitcoin. Either way, this type of activity, you could just fuck right off. I don't like to see this. And since they're in the UK,

I'm wondering what type of punishment that comes along with it. Because if you think about it, if the packets are full of Southport stories, 15 years gone. Don't even think about it, lock away. But if it's talking about it, about grooming packets, maybe it's a six weeks suspended sentence. I don't know how things will operate in the UK, but either way, I hate this.

As Bitcoin becomes more mainstream, there's going to be more and more attacks that come upon it. And I'm looking at this, Paxful closing down. Like there's, you know, it just seems like there's a shift in how things are being done. More regulations. The UK is code. The UK's code. That's long gone. It's even if there's a travel advisory, is that what this is called?

to go there? I think France and UK, I think if you look at the European map, it's all green except for two places. UK and I think France. Out of the UK of all fucking places. Immigration destroyed the United Kingdom. You say whatever you want. Kirstarmer can say

whatever he wants about, you know, will come for you if you're anti-immigrant. No one is anti-immigrant to an individual level. They're anti-immigrant in terms of the broad outcome of immigration over the last 10 years. Same thing here, right? No one hates any one immigrants. They just don't like what's happened to the country.

These guys, again, like, I talked about this a little bit with Mark last week or two weeks ago. Their priorities are mixed up. You have so much going on that requires attention from your government, from your law enforcement, from whatever, and this is where you're spending your time. It's unbelievable. You should be so mad if you're a UK citizen. in like so mad but you're not even allowed to get mad anymore the police come to your house you've just got to think it you have to have a thought pretty soon you won't even be allowed

to do that they'll come get you all right swift ease this past week they have a lot to be happy for because swift has announced they're going to be developing their own blockchain based ledger to be used with 30 plus banks and for what i understand xrp not going to be used not in the paper it's not oh no not again must be a mistake So the new blockchain is supposed to enable instant 24-7 cross-border payments. Imagine having to build your own system from scratch when lightning exists. It does exactly what they're describing right now. But I guess because it's decentralized, they want to make their own centralized server.

The Swift CEO, Javier Perez Tasso, Orole, Amigo. Isn't he playing the Super Bowl halftime show? He should. I don't know. I'll leave it alone. Anyways, I'm very pleased to announce that we will add a blockchain-based ledger to our technology infrastructure. What does that? Listen, I don't care about this quote.

Oh, it gets better. What does that even mean? It gets better. It gets better to allow for trusted movement of tokenized value across digital ecosystems. You may think, wow, aren't those the opposites? Swift and blockchain, tradfi and defy, can they go together? In the regulated system of the future, we believe they can. are ready for it and they're asking us

to play a bigger role. CBDCs for bank coming to you in the very near future. XRP out of a loop. They're developing their own love to see it. What's going on with the XRP army these days? How are they doing? Are they okay? I have no fucking clue.

It just I look at this and they're building their own system. Bitcoin fucking works. Just use fucking lightning. I don't know. anyways Swift Fuck them Swifties

Or Swifties I forget that I love it I love it Sparrow will do One last story about Sparrow Sure yeah New version right

Yeah version 2.3.0 Did you get it yet? No I did not Straight from their X feed I'd like to wait a little while first Before I get it A new version for some reason According to their X post

This release ad supports For sending silent pavement addresses silent payment addresses are a new form of static payment address where an actual Bitcoin address that you send to is determined from both the silent payment address and the transaction inputs very cool also they're doing a BIP 350 sorry 353 known as DNS payments so you now could pay to an address to look similar to like Bitcoin user at domain.com and that's resolved to a DNSX signed Bitcoin URI they say for security reasons only use a silent address payment

and if you want to operate a Sparrow version 2.3 suggest you do it the proper way download Sparrow from their website verify the signatures, you just drag and drop you follow the instructions, drag and drop the file into Sparrow and once you see the verification is good Bob is your uncle and

you do it right. Don't fuck around with Sparrow don't fuck around with your Bitcoin. If you need Sparrow on your phone just go to the app store type in Sparrow and download the guy comes up first. Yeah, it was like two weeks ago. A little more. Apple. It was on an Apple system, right? What a nightmare. If I type in Sparrow and the Astero right now, what comes up?

It's gone. They took it out almost like within a day or two. They're very quick at that. Something will come up. What will come up? Let's see. Sparrow wallet. Blue wallet. I'm thinking Blue Wallow. No, it's slush, a suey wallet. Then Blue Wallet, then Blue Wallet, then Exodus wallet. Ledger Live, Trust, Blockstream, Atomic Wallet? Never heard of that. What's atomic wallet? Yeah. The first one, is interesting because it's a suey wallet so suey's another token yeah yeah yeah so we're looking

for sparrow if you get rugged by a fake sparrow that's bullshit like sparrow is only bitcoin yeah you want to do

anything else it does not work with sparrow yet when you search for sparrow the first thing it comes up is a shit coin wallet does that make sense

shouldn't it be blue wallet or it's an ad too which is the worst part so Apple's taking money to put that at the top there that's sorry that's probably why yeah yeah yeah there you go good for them yeah yeah yeah all right that's it for us let's go over to uh the notable stories

and uh of course brantton hamilton man as well if you're with us on video live stay with us we're not going anywhere if you're on audio come back tomorrow for the other half you guys know the drill until then take care of yourselves don't be a cock