The Chaser Report - SAS Tuvalu

Episode Date: November 15, 2023

Dom and Charles talk about the recent developments in Australian refugee policy. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

The Chaser Report is recorded on Gadigal Land. Striving for mediocrity in a world of excellence, this is The Chaser Report. Hello and welcome to The Chaser Report with Dom and Charles. Now, Charles, we don't talk enough about refugees on this podcast. It's been a topic that's stuck in the more of many for decades now, Australia's approach to asylum seekers in general. But what wonderful news we've had lately, eh? Oh, we've had some great news on the refugee front.

We're going to devote an entire episode to talking about. about refugees, which I'm sure will bring delight and happiness to so many people. No complaints at all to podcast at chaser.com. And no one's their reviews on Apple Podcasts. That's what we like to see. Well, there's two stories, aren't there, Charles? Because I've got an inspiring story of a big, powerful neighbour Australia, reaching out a helping hand to a country that's doing it tough to Valu.

Well, should we start with the good news or the bad news? What's your news? Well, I've got the fact that Australian government has been forced to release 83, refugees from detention, from indefinite detention. Oh, that's the High Court meddling, isn't it? Yeah, the High Court has just meddled, but it's a complete disaster, Dom. Like Australia had a plan, we had a good plan, which was to just lock them up forever and not work out what to do with them.

And the High Court said you can't do that. Yes, indefinite detention apparently is unconstitutional. Let's find out more about the monsters that are terrifying our streets and the good And news tale of Australia being kind to its neighbours after this. So, Chelsea, can I just clarify... We're not in the same place for this one. Have I somehow connected to the Ben Fordham show? What's going on?

Oh, no, no. You've got to understand, Dom. Like, this is one of those things where you go, oh, right, okay, the high court has come down in favour of human rights. And then you look at the detail. The details are hilarious. You just go, oh, right, okay. Maybe I'm in favour of human rights.

I've always, you know, identified as somebody who is in favour of human rights, but, you know, it just makes it that extra little bit tricky. Because I remember Charles back in my legal studies a long time ago, and I can't even remember the Latin terms for it anymore. I'm perhaps habeas corpus, I'm not sure. There was a notion that when the state locked you up, there was supposed to you for a particular period of time that was defined and following due process in a court of law.

That was, like, if the state's going to lock you up, they're supposed to be a pretty robust basis for doing that, not just, you know, chuck them in prison indefinitely. Absolutely. That was the theory. Yeah, and that dates back all the way to the Magna Carta, I think. Like, that's a fairly, like, you know, millennia-long principle of... Making this the first time that Magna Carta's ever been relevant.

So there you go, Cookers, we'll give you this one. The Magna Carta does relate to this. But the thing is, over the last 10 years or so, there was a government in power who just went, you know what, I reckon those people should just stay locked up. And so there was no judicial process at all. It was nothing to do with the courts. It was the government themselves, the executive arm of the government,

like the people who run the government just went, you know, just, I don't know what to do with them. These are refugees, they've come in. We can't possibly return them to their country because, you know, in many cases it was things like they will definitely be killed by their governments, right? So a humanitarian detention, in other words. Much nice that'll lock them up forever. But we don't want to release them onto the streets, partly because they don't have a visa.

There's no appropriate visa to give them. So we'll just, I don't know, just like, oh, well, sucks to be them, right? So that was the policy. And the High Court, just a few days ago, ruled, no, you're not allowed to do that. These people have to go free, right? So here's where the whole, oh, maybe actually Ben Fordham does have a point comes in, which is, there was an actual reason why some of these people were being. Locked up, like, so, well, let's just read ABC News in America.

The way they reported this story was three murderers freed in Australia after court ruled out holding migrants indefinitely ministers. Oh, but Charles, you know what these right-wing news sources are like. They call everyone murderers, don't they, who aren't really? Like, this person's probably just some sort of innocent activist, are they? Yeah, one of them is Surul Azar Umar, a former police officer. Do you think that they... Oh, that's we want people like that.

We want police officers. Who was sent... don't we? Yeah, well, this guy was sentenced by a Malaysian court in 2015. So there was a judicial process about him. He was sentenced to be hanged over the death of a Mongolian woman whose body was dismembered with military-grade explosives. And I think the allegation there, certainly the opposition has said, this guy is an assassin.

It's literally an assassin who is now free to roam the streets of Melbourne. So... Yeah, look, the Guardian's reporting this guy as hitman. Yeah. As a hitman. That's tough, Charles. That's really worrying not just obviously to the people he may murder, but also because this really threatens the jobs of Australian hit men and women.

Yes. Because there's nothing saying it's men only these days. Anyone can be a hit person. They're taking our jobs. So we could just call them hit people. This guy is going to undercut, you know, honest Aussie hit people who pay their taxes in this country. Yes, that's right. And there'll be a race to the bottom, won't there?

So suddenly instead of 10 grand to hit, it'll be five grand. And then there'll be sort of, it'll be like Uber. eats type, gig economy hits and... Yeah, door death. People will use up the door death out. Yeah. And Charles, there have been days, some of them are spent working with you, frankly. Or I would have offered people for 50 bucks.

I would have been happy. Well, this is why it's not a good idea to reduce the price of assassinations too low. You want to, you want to maintain a bit of a flaw so that there's a barrier to entry. That's just classic economic theory, isn't it? Okay, so this is one guy. But Charles, surely, you're talking about just one. There's one rotten apple in every barrel. And admittedly, amongst 80 people, one of them being a convicted hitman, it's not good.

But I mean, sure, the other 79 are innocent, aren't they? I mean, there is the sort of, I mean, it's a bit icky, but quite a lot of rapists, it would seem, as well. Oh, yeah. So the other two murderers that we don't have the details on yet. Okay, so there's three murderers amongst the 80. Yeah, the odds are looking worse. Yeah, lots of people convicted of a source. assault and sexual assault and...

Yeah, look, some of the details I don't even want to go into because they're just... Yeah, I mean, some of them are absolutely, just absolutely awful. One of the murderers, actually... I know, one of the sort of people identified, did some heinous crimes, but came from Myanmar, so couldn't go back there because obviously he was part of the sort of Rohingya minority. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. And this is part of the issue, Charles, is that Australia is well known. And this is one of the few things I think we can be truly proud of Australia in the international stage.

we're very anti-death penalty. But that means that if there's someone who was convicted overseas of an offence that involves the death penalty, for instance, I don't know, murder, we're placed in a bind, aren't we? Because we can't send the murderer off to be murdered themselves by the state. But then it doesn't necessarily mean.

Again, this is a bit of weird territory feeling like Ben Fordham here. We don't necessarily want this bloke in the Australian market. Yes. But we probably do want him to have a sort of fair judicial process because what if you ever, found yourself accused of being a hitman unfairly, but you were never given the chance in court to prove otherwise? Or is it the case that he did get the trial? And he was, and I don't know, but he was convicted of the sentence in Malaysia, which is death penalty. This is the problem.

Deporting people to death penalty countries is something we don't like to do. No, exactly. No, but when he was, he was tried in absentia, though. Like he fled. Oh, I see. So it's not, not necessarily the same judicial standards. that we... Okay, so let's not go down too far into the weeds of this guy. But he might shoot us. Well, he is free in Australia. This is the thing.

So I think we need a solution to this problem. And luckily Australia is very good at coming up with absolutely brutal, horrible ways of dealing with immigration problems, right? So what I'm... And also world leader, we don't have to sort of, you know, adhere to international norms as such, right? We've got to adhere to the high court. But what I'm thinking, hear me out, Don, is bring back the barges. The barges? Now, you remember in, like, the whole reason Australia, white Australia was founded

was because they had all those barges on the Thames that kept on filling up with convicts because America got independent. They used to ship all their convicts, this is the British, used to shit up. Yeah, to America. To America. America declared independence. And so they just got stuck on barges. Now, the barges are back in Bristol and, um,

places like that, like they've actually started putting refugees and people onto barges back in the UK again. Why not do the same thing here? And what I'm here is we fill up a barge full of unpleasant refugees who we don't necessarily want here, and we send them to England. Oh, that's a very good idea. You know the Uno Reverse card trend on TikTok? Yeah, where everyone carries around. Flip it, just flip it around. Flip it around and go, and England won't be able to deal with it because it's like, that's the rules of Uno. That's the rules of Uno. And also, they started it.

They did it first to us. Exactly. They can't say, oh, we disagree with transportation. Well, you did it. You're the ones who invented it. We also play the irony card, don't we. And Charles, I don't know, though. I mean, I don't want these people to be, no matter what they've done.

We've got to be a decent citizen in the world. Yeah, that's true. We can't ship them back on barges. I know the perfect way to ship them back. P&O cruises. The Ruby Princess. The Ruby Princess. It's just the way to get the back.

There's a new COVID wave. There's a new COVID wave, yes. They may not all make it. The problem may just take care of itself. But gosh, they die in luxury, wouldn't they? Yes, exactly. Such luxury. Yes.

It's a princess. I love it. And also that means that presumably we won't have here in Sydney a whole lot of people arriving on the Ruby Princess with the new COVID wave to infect us. Because we've got... Very good idea. Of doing another job.

I think that's a great idea. I mean, the other thing is a great idea. that we could do is treat them with some sort of compassion and actually work out a judicial system that actually provides the level of oversight that the High Court is asking for. Like, we could actually engage properly with the issue. Do you think that that... And it is worth noting, yeah, I'm reading more about these crimes as we're speaking. Some of them are quite heinous.

Yeah. So... I think the whole thing is these people have stacked up after the last 10 years. And it's so funny hearing the opposition go, well, the government's got... to do something about it. And it's like, this is a problem directly created by the previous government. No, that's not the way it works because the, you know, reverse card was played there again. You see? And when the government became the opposition, they didn't have to, there's no takesies back sees. It's all the government's fault. Yeah. So, but the point is that what

the High Court is doing is it's not saying, oh, these are great guys. Let's, uh, let's be neighbors with them. They're going, no, no, you have to afford them due process, right? So what they're asking the government to do is, well, come up with a process that actually assesses these people and gives them a fair trial and all that sort of stuff. And the government is just going, nah, don't want to. I've seen that they've been saying that the people who have been released in the community have to check in with the police. So they're kind of, it's not as that the police sort of vaguely know where they are. So that, that should reassure everyone. But, I mean, there is a person here. If we do want just a basic level of security surveillance

are going on, if we want people to just make sure that these people have been released in the community aren't going to hurt anyone else as they have, apparently in many cases in the past, all we need to do is just a point, and this is a man who's looking for a job, Charles, appoint Ben Robert Smith is their parole officer. He checks up on them regularly with the sensitivity for which he's known, highly armed or near a cliff. I think he's just got himself a rag-tag army of 81 followers who, who he can sort of do a bit of paramilitary exercises.

This is what the French would do, Charles. They'd put them on to the Foreign Legion. The Australian Foreign Legion. We needed Australian Foreign Legion based on some offshore territory where Australian law doesn't, based in Antarctica perhaps. Or Adelaide. Or Adelaide, somewhere where regular law doesn't apply. And just sort of someone we don't really care about.

No, the mean streets of Adelaide. And just BRS's boys. Yes. And when the dirty's got to be done, they'll do the dirty. That's good. Well, that's one problem to solve, Charles. It'd be nice to have been occupied, and if any of them fell out of line, they wouldn't be able to do it again, what with being dead.

All right, Charles, let's move on to the other story. This is the inspiring story. I promise we'd have an upbeat end to this. We'll get into that after this. The Chaser Report, less news, more often. Now, Charles, it's not often I'm proud of Australia's dance and refugees that I read a headline that just makes me delighted at the humanity shown by the Australian government. Have you taken a knock to the head recently?

Well, we'll get to that. But the other day, I was just so excited to see Anthony Albanese, meeting with the leader of Tavalu, talk about a new deal, because what's happened, and we know this very well, is that Tavalu is rapidly disappearing underwater. Quite a lot of it's already gone. So what are they going to do?

Well, the great news is that the 11,200 citizens can come to Australia. We're going to throw open our doors and let Tavalu in. It's, what's 11,000 citizens here? That's such a blip compared to our annual migration intake of hundreds of thousands of people. Yes. It's fine. Why not do that? I think that's a lovely idea.

That is the best to actually. Hang on, this does not compute. The government's actually just being nice to our Pacific neighbours. Yeah, that's right. Albo went over. He appeared, he went to the Pacific Islands Forum at the Cook Island on the island of Itutaki. And he gave a speech. And it was just a really nice moment.

Charles? And there's no strings attached? There's no little... I mean, what is a string? What is a string? I guess the thing to note is that it'll be a little bit impractical if they all came at once. You'd have to send a whole bunch of planes. So they're going to slow down climate change, are they? Is that the idea? No, Charles, it's fine. Or is it... Or is it the short people get to go first because they'll be the first to drown? That would be a good rule. They're going to come in an orderly fashion that doesn't adversely impact Australia's migration system.

So how many do you reckon we can take a year? Well, we're taking in a couple of hundred thousand a year at the moment. So I reckon... There's 11,000. There's 11,000. So presumably, I don't know, half this year, half next year, five and a half thousand each. How does the number 280 grab you? What?

280. 280 per year. So wait a minute. How long will that? That'll take like 20 years? No, that'll take... How long? That'll take...

40. 40 years. It's been calculated. It will take... Oh, because people will... In the meantime, yeah, yeah. The final number, the final ones are going to need snorkels, aren't that? 40 years, it will definitely...

I mean, I know Kiribati is already, like, half under the ocean. And the sea salt is now rising and killing off all the trees. So, Tavallu's not far along. How is this, how is this even press release worthy? This is just like a piece of bullshit. The New York Times is saying, by 2050, half the... the land area of the main island will flood daily. So they're not going to, I mean, we could get them stilts.

Saline groundwater is a problem as well. Yeah, no, well, that's the main problem. It's because it's not just like about land. It's about being able to grow anything out of the land. That's why Kiribati is such a disaster because, like it happened. We haven't done anything for Kiribati yet. Yeah, why not? They're even further under.

All right. Well, that's one aspect of it, Charles. There's another thing that we got out of it, though. I bet you a minute. Can I guess what it is? Yep, make a guess. They're really cool domain name suffix, which is TV. Oh, yeah, that would be a good school.

That would be a good trade. Isn't that one of their major sources of income? Yeah, yeah, that's their main source of income. Yeah, they make like $40 million a year out of dot TV. So here's the good news. The number could increase above 280 in the event that climate change worsens. But no, there's another aspect to me. What's the thing?

Well, in fairness, the Labor government is doing all it can to make sure climate change worsens. So, you know, they're really helping out the Tavaluans cause there. That's true. So they may end up coming in the next three years. Charles, what's the thing Australia wants most from the Pacific Islands? Good holidays? Other than cheap fruit pickers. Cheap fruit pickers, good holidays and, I don't know. Oh, yes, rugby union.

It's to save the rugby union team, is it? That would be very good. Actually, that'd be great. If we could keep the Tavalo, Tavalu team as Australia be. Yes. And just combine the two. Australia, A. Probably, yes. No, Charles, it's security.

So in return for the 280 per year. We get their UN boat? Well, we don't get their UN. Well, perhaps we do. But no, security is the... So they'll come over and be bouncers, like Pacific Islander bounces. It'd be good. No, it's about China, of course.

So we'll set up a base. The agreement makes us the main security partner for Tavalu while it still exists. And we promise to help them if they've got a disaster or a pandemic or military aggression. So essentially it's become kind of, I mean, the term vassal state is so overused. It's so overused, isn't it? It's just neighbourly using of each other's tools. You know, like you go and borrow your neighbours hedge clippers and never return them. And then if their place is flooded, I mean, if your neighbours will flood themselves, you'd have them at your place, wouldn't you?

Yes, you'd have one of them. You'd have one of the four. One of the four. With the next one to come in the following here. And then you'd say, oh, and can we have everything of yours as well? Yeah, and we basically get to make the most important decisions on your behalf. Yeah. So that's the deal that's been made.

I mean, you've got to say, congratulations, Santhian Albanese, a diplomatic coup. Yes. It looked like a humanitarian gesture when you look more closely. No. Not really. No. 280 a year. Yeah.

I mean, it's better than nothing. You know what we should do? The thing is, Charles, what should swap the Tavaloans with the murderers that we've got. We should do swapsies. That's what we, that's a brilliant idea. We take all of the Tavallans in, all 11,000. And then the Ben Robert Smith can protect Tavallu. They can be the Tavalu army.

Yeah. We've sold everything. They could just stay there as the sea levels gradually, gradually rise. And Ben Robertson Smith is tall. He'll survive his own life. He's very tall. We could put cameras on there as it gradually descends into Lord of the Flies. I love it.

I love it. S-A-S-Tavalu. That's what we do here, Charles. We solve problems. Another one ticked off. Our gear is remote, we're part of the iconic class network, and on behalf of Australia, thanks to you, Charles, for solving those problems. Yeah, I am. That's right. It all solves. Tick. Done. Add that to the CV.