The Chaser Report - Thirst Trapping | Ange Lavoipierre

Episode Date: July 12, 2022

Ange Lavoipierre joins Chris Taylor and Dom Knight in the studio to discuss the real stuff that kids are talking about - which Ange researches in her new podcast 'Schmeitgeist'. Join Chris and Dom as they discover the whole new world of "thirst trapping" with Ange as their tour guide. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Thank you for your patience. Your call is important. Can't take being on hold anymore. FIS is 100% online, so you can make the switch in minutes. Mobile plans start at $15 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at FIS.ca. Striving for mediocrity in a world of excellence, this is The Chaser Report.

Hello and welcome to The Chaser Report. It is Wednesday, the 13th of July, 2022. Dom Knight and Chris Taylor with And Lovapier, who's the host of the new ABC podcast, Schmitegeist, which is all about pop culture. We'll get into that. But before we do, we've got to talk about the pink hair in the room, and Lvapier. This is, since I saw you, last time you were a serious ABC journalist doing a daily news podcast. What's going on?

Yeah, so they told me that I got this podcast and I went, yeah, great, thank you. And I walked straight out the door and beat down the door of the nearest hairdresser and said, it's time. I've got to look like a cultural podcast host. There was a direct correlation between the commissioning of the podcast and a desire to change hair color. Honestly, I reckon I was working too long and it's sort of like I was doing hours that were too long in this podcast and it sort of cooked my brain a bit and I sat down for like my annual haircut or whatever. And I was just like, you know what, let's change it up.

Let's make it pink. Is it going to fall out if you do this thing? And they're like, no, it won't fall out. Just give us the money and we'll do it. And they did it. And now I've got pink hair. It looks great. Thank you.

I've known you for a long time. And I don't think I've ever seen you a different colour. No, I don't like change. Oh. Have you not seen the people who work in the executive wing at the ABC? Actually, that's true. It's an absolute kaleidoscope of colours. You're in the right part of the world now.

I know what you mean. I don't judge them. I just worry about how other people see. I think this is because I'm from a hard news background. It's because I'm used to trying to be like credible, you know, and now I've thrown that out the window. I've always found the problem with ABC News is that Juanita Phillips is very ordinarily colored. here.

I mean, you tune in, Lee Sails very traditional. Oh, where's the pink with Lee? Annabel Crabb might throw a vintage frock on every now and then, but that's about it. It's, you know, it's crying. If the ABC wants to reach youth viewers, which we keep hearing they do, maybe Joe O'Brien should try going yellow one week. I don't know. Let's get on your podcast, Ange, because I was talking to you earlier in the year and you

had lots of concepts for what you were going to do. You want to do something in the culture world, perhaps not quite, So news, and then suddenly I hear Schmitegeist, which invites the question, which you've answered in your trailer, what is a Schmitegeist? Exactly. Well, if you know, you know, so many people have been like, wait, what? And I'm like, you know what, maybe, maybe, you know, if I have to explain it too much. And some people are like, what's a zeitgeist? I'm like, oh, no, I don't even know where to begin.

I don't even know where to begin. But, you know, Arias, Shmarias, Zitegeist, Schmitegist. And really, you know, I feel like there's a whole range of pop culture podcasts out there in the world that will tell you what has happened in that, you know, who Will Smith has slapped in the last 24 hours, you know, but not so many people that will tell you why these things are happening, not necessarily Will Smith. There are quite a few takers up to that task, I think. But, you know, if it's a big picture trend, like, I don't know, like why are Crox $1,350?350. a pair, you know, why, like how did Crocs, but not literally that, but like, why did how did Crocs end up being a high fashion item? Why are selfies getting uglier? Why are men posting thirst traps on TikTok all of a sudden when that's something that really

just used to be for women. That's something women used to do for better or for worse. Okay, I'm hooked. First traps, male first traps. This is something that I thank God bypassed the chaser by, I'm hoping. It's just beginning. There's time to get on board. Don't worry, Dom. So, I mean, we all know what I'm talking about, but I think there's something quite, as in the women's version of that or the girl's version of that, because that's kind of what we're all used to seeing. But when I first started putting together this podcast,

I put a bit of a shout out to all my like very online, capital B, capital O, very online friends. My least favorite people. No, I love them. There is a world out there, you know. You don't have to live online. Some people are best experienced online. in my way. That is true. I guess online you can always

to make them offline, can you? So you don't have that option in the real world. Yeah, there is no off button for me, unfortunately. But, you know, these people, a lot of them were sending me suggestions about what to cover on the podcast, like what's happening in the internet that we haven't seen yet. It's usually a bit of like a, you know, a bit of a sign of what's to come in the rest of the world. One of the first things that I was sent was a bunch of male thirst traps from TikTok and then I started seeing it and I couldn't unsee it. It was very disorientating seeing it because you're just not used to seeing men preen themselves for the female gays.

I really loathe to sort of put up my hand in ignorance at this point. I've never heard the phrase, first trap. Really? That's why there's a podcast. Is it someone who's attempting to be attractive to the opposite? Yeah, exactly, although it has always been women. So that's a good, you know, this is a good side. Okay, I'm going to go back.

Guys, for dummies. Just read what? What's a podcast? And is this the ultimate inception right now that we're on a podcast talking about another podcast? Or if I listen to more podcasts, is that what all podcasts are? Just other podcasts are that.

That's actually the genre, yeah. That's exactly what a podcast is. But like anyone pouting, posing, post, usually a picture or a video, but, you know, historically a picture that would, its sole purpose is to kind of like, Garner compliments and like, you know,

someone sliding into your DMs and being like, oh, like cute pick. So like all those George Christensen picks where he's in the blue singlet with the whip. That's sort of a thirst trap? That's like a very niche thirst trap. It's the world's... Vladimir Putin right in a drag.

Chris, many of us were not thirsty at all when we saw that image, but it was... That was when he was briefly the whip. And within one day of that job, they had him posing with a blue single letter, an actual whip. Jamie Packer on board his boat last week with Robert De Niro. Thirst trap? You would have to have had a long, long, long period without a drink for that to constitute a thirst trap, one might say.

But so it's men actively, I guess, but surely that's not new, men trying to be attractive online. Okay, so it's about the, like, fourth rightness with which you're trying to be attractive. Like a thirst trap is not like some surreptitious, you know, like I'm posting, like, a photo of me with my nice new hair card, or I've got a new job or I don't know what a men do. It's not me putting a filter on my holiday snap, so I've got fewer chins. No, it's you, it's you posing, like, in an, like, ostensibly sexy pose by the Adriatic, like hand on hip. Has to be the adriatic.

Shirt off. Yeah, it's the only constitution. The Indian one works. Is that the clear marker is the shirt off? Shirt off is a big one. But, like, there are, like, classically sexy things that are very, very tropey, and it'll make you uncomfortable when I talk about them, but like we're talking like lip, lip biting, like that kind of thing, like real sort of like bedroom eyes, like real kind of sultry stuff.

And you wouldn't necessarily think it was that unusual if you saw women doing this on, on platforms like Instagram, because that is, you know, kind of how women are socialized to behave online. It's like, you know, it's acceptable behavior. It's within the canon of acceptable behavior for women. Not everyone, but, you know, it's in there. And rather than go the other way of rewinding women back from that being acceptable, we've found it's easy just for men to do it too. Yeah, but particularly Gen Z men.

So you find, and it's... We're probably very comfortable with their sexuality anyway. Maybe it's, whereas Dom and I might cringe at this and think it's narcissistic or embarrassing, maybe for Gen Z it's sort of just really normal? Yeah, well, I think that's kind of what we wanted to work out with this episode. It's like, wait, is this indicative of some large-scale shit? shift in masculinity for Gen Z, which has sort of like happened under our noses, which were kind of like, oh, well, now the script is different for men.

Like, it's possible for men to do this thing and not be, like, widely shunned by their peers for doing so, whereas, like, 10, 15, 20 years ago, totally would have got you shunned. I'm just looking down Chris Taylor's Instagram as we speak, just scrolling through. How much thirst is there, Don? Look, there's an image of you and your partner with some large animal by the day. name of Bianca. Is that a bull or something? It's a Highland cow.

A Highland cow. That was a degree of thirst. The three of us were going for first. Yeah. Yeah. I felt Bianca as the cow was like doing the heavy lifting in the first department there. But I'm going down to New Year's Eve, 2021, and there's a picture of Taylor sprawled across an armchair with a sleeping with your dad as well, I think, as sleep.

And Taylor, there's pose. I mean, if you imagine a man cuddling a cushion. and one leg up on the side of a squishy armchair. Hello ladies. I never thought I'd say this, Chris, but where are the drinks? I'm thirsty. Serve them up. Thank you for your patience.

Your call is important. Can't take being on hold anymore. Fizz is 100% online so you can make the switch in minutes. Mobile plans start at $15 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at fizz.com. The Chaser Report, more news, less often. This is fascinating, Danes, because I would always do the opposite of ever being, ever posting something that could be accused of having an element of vanity.

Oh, yeah. And so it is kind of interesting. And it seems they're not doing it. It's not like Tinder where you're just sort of maximising your hot picks for hookups. It's more for likes from mostly the opposite sex or anyone. Like are other men liking these things? I think there is an element of like, you know, gay men going or buy men going for, you know, these ostensibly straight dudes, but they are ostensibly straight because there's, okay,

so there's all these different types of them. It is a really bizarre world, like very uncanny valley because I've like been through and broken down all these thirst traps into subgenres. And I think the best one that I've heard talked about is in the actors' studio. And there might be like one guy who is just playing. all the different parts. Like, he'll be acting out a scenario and he's playing all the different parts.

But it's all still designed to be sexy. Like, or it might be like a POV video and like he's role playing. Like, you're in the scene. So he's role playing like, you've just woken up in bed together after you've gone home together and he's like, good morning, baby.

Like, I'm going to make you coffee or whatever. Like, you know, it's like you're the most beautiful woman I've ever seen. Like that kind of thing. And so. It's almost only fans. It's like, it's pretty, like a lot of it's a fine line. It's pretty raw, but it's like, you know, it never really strays into that kind of M-A-X, you know, zone

because it's, because it is, you know, it's still TikTok, but it's pretty horny. But role-play scenarios sound, you know, like the straight bit in pornos before they get the kid off. It sounds like the guy offering to clean the pool up to the point where the pool cleaning stops and the gang-banging begins. Yeah, they show you the before and the after and they'll, like, write you into the scene. And the person written into the scene, to go to your original question, Dom, is typically a woman. It's like, you know, you're understanding that this is a straight scenario. But yeah, women seem to really go for this. And often, like, under 18s as well.

So, I mean, I'm not going to get into, like, the weird moralistic thing. Because a lot of the guys are really young as well. So, like, you know, kind of whatever. Oh, right. So problematically young? No, no, no. Like, I mean, I'm not, look, that's for someone. That's for someone else.

If an adult was watching, would it be? There are like, I don't, I mean, look, I don't think so. I mean, yeah, I couldn't say. What we're talking to like 16, 17? Yeah, I don't know what the rules are about like how old you have to be. But some of them are like quite young. And I'm probably getting that thing going on that you get when you get over 30 where you're like look at a like 15 year old and look at a 19 year old.

Like I can't tell. They could be like whatever. Well, you are 33, but as against that, you've got pink hair now. So, right, it ages me down. Yeah. It's hard to say. I mean, I guess my reaction is there were two ways that society was going to go

in terms of getting more equal, right? Either men were going to get classier and stop with the objectifying or women were going to get in on the act to the same degree. And so this might be progress. Everyone being at the same level of just constant horniness online.

I agree. I agree with it's a type of equality, but it's so the lazier option of the two you deposed on. Absolutely. Not doing the heavy lifting or changing anything, just making everyone horny all the time on TikTok.

Well, I mean, that also, is it that they are looking for hookups, or is it that they're trying to become influencers, Ange? Because I assume that almost all content now is just people desperately wanting to get paid by brands. Like, this is why Instagram is selling stuff. What a lofty ambition. Like, Icarus fly not too close to the sun.

Oh, that we might be an influencer so we can promote barbecue shapes one day on a social platform. The dream. Remember when we grew up, people wanted to, I don't know, be actors or something. Like, you could sort of do artistic work. Now, is it enough just to flog makeup on a social media platform? Is that the height of ambition?

It is so hard to monetise, yes, pontificating. No, but it is really hard to monetise. I interviewed this guy called Calvin Reef, who has 1.8 million followers. And it's like a full-time job for him, and he's like just okay. His whole thing, by the way, is kind of like Thirst Trapp adjacent. he does like he cries in every video he's making uh he's making uh he's making what he calls emotional content and it's in the actor's studio so he's like role playing all these scenarios like really heavy topics but like you know relevant to uh you know young people i guess it's like

all the issues and uh but he plays them all out but his fans it's like 85% women or women or girls uh and it's 33% of them or something like that are under the age of 18 so It's just like all these girls who just love him, like they are crushing on him, but he is crying in every single video, like this dignified, silent, like the most beautiful crying I've ever seen. Yeah. So it's a weird world. I would encourage you to go around this.

Crying specific TikTok is not a world I was aware of before we start of this conversation. I just assume every world exists now. Yeah, yeah. And you could say anything to me and go, I'm sure that's a whole channel on TikTok. What if I'm making it up? There's no fact-checking on this podcast. The right two people to tell this to. But the fascinating thing about this, too, is just the economics of it, is you say, like, you've got TikTok, Instagram, these massive channels, and people are producing content for free endlessly in vast quantities.

The money goes to the people, to the actual platform. Like, TikTok is worth countless billions now, as Instagram was. Yeah. At least on YouTube, you actually get money from ads. Like, I can understand being a YouTube creator, you actually can make a good living at that. But how do these people live? What is the ultimate point? Is it just the validation of having a million?

You can't put a price on likes. Honestly, I reckon like heaps of these guys are there, you know, at a pretty early part of their life. Like some of them are still at school. You know, they're probably not. They don't have flourishing careers like the three of us, obviously. And so they're. Fair point.

They'll be doing podcasts in five years time. Don't worry about that. They'll catch up with the career highs we're all currently living right now. Experiencing, yeah. But no, I think they, that's what's amazing about it. Like there are the really big stars as like, you know, Little Huddy and, you know, Calvin Reef and guys like that who have, you know, upwards of a million, you know, or many, many millions of followers in the case of Little Huddy. Kind of makes sense on that because, you know, if you've got an audience like that, you can find ways to monetize it. Like, record labels might do deals with you to put their songs into your TikToks or, you know, there might be some product placement or you can do some club appearances or whatever it is.

Like Little Huddy now has a extremely unsuccessful music career. So, you know, he's trying to make it work. So unsuccessful, he'll be in the hottest 100 next year. Probably. I'm just thinking back to our early days, you know, in our teens and early 20s at uni or whatever. We did a newspaper, right? We put a massive amount of evidence, putting us this stupid newspaper that took us hours and hours and hours and nobody read. It was hidden under various ethnic community publications at news agents, which is not a barely a shop that even exists anymore.

I can completely understand making a video at home. But it was driven by the same. I mean, print, print was the TikTok medium of its day. Well, we were young. We didn't want people to like us. But it was driven by the same vanity to be noticed. Anyone just wants to be noticed. If you've got a slightly artistic strain in your personality

or even as I say, slightly sort of indulgent. You will do things to be noticed. And whether that was a newspaper when we were young. Dying your hair pink or... All of these things. I mean, what's really interesting sort of politically about all. this for me. Dom sort of seriously brought up objectification earlier. And I always wonder if the objectification argument goes out the window when there's not, you can't really accuse anyone of

exploiting here. You know, like, in the old, because everyone's self-publishing. Yeah. It's not like there's a mastermind. You know, like young girls who modeled, you can always say, oh, there was this awful publisher or agents or photographer behind the scenes. People are choosing to objectify themselves. And I don't know if that's sort of like just reclaiming objectification or what's your taking letter? That's what I find so interesting about this because like you could look back, you know, into the annals of pop culture history and see a number of examples of men acting vain and horny in public. But like if you look at, say, I don't know. Craig Brewcastle's career. Craig Brewcastle's career or the back street boys, for instance, right?

You've got the back street boys and they're like, you know, touching themselves and like, you know, biting the lip and they're taking their shirts off and they're doing this thing. But, like, there was an executive and there was like an A&R guy in the background. I'm like, yeah, do that. You bite your lip more. Yeah, do that, do that. These guys are doing it all on their own. And that's what I find so fascinating. Not just the ones who are like a million plus followers,

but the people who have no followers, like, fuck all followers. They want to be. There's just. There's a lot of thirst yet. And they are getting up every day. And they are posting all this horny, weird, vain content that all their friends at school can see. And they don't care. They're doing it anyway.

Like, they're doing it for fun. They're doing it for the, like validation that they get back from like women in wherever like maybe on the other side of the world because that's the other thing that's different about TikTok like it is a little uncomfortable to do this on Instagram because it's set up more like a family barbecue like initially maybe it's changed a bit now but you know these were IRL connections and you know people who you knew in life would be they would be the people who would see whatever you post on on Instagram not the not the case with TikTok with TikTok the four you channel that like is an algorithm that pushes you out it serves you up to

people who already watch male thirst traps of another kind. They're like, oh, you like this male thirst trap? Here's this other male thirst trap from like Albania or whatever. And so, you know, you can get all this validation from all these different parts of the world and, you know, and no one's prodding you to do it. You just wake up and think about it. Isn't that amazing that we as humanity have finally found a place where borders don't exist where the world can come together and exchange ideas?

Where an Albanian can sit down with a Serbian and thirst each other to death. All right, well, there you go. So that's, um, is that episode two of, of Schmite, Guy, Stan? Is that next week's one? That's ep two. So that's out, yeah, in like, in like a week. So Wednesday next week. Did our discussionist then go longer than the episode?

I think it might have. But, but it lacked the insight of the actual episode, I assume. If you want a better version of what you just heard. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, so that'll be out next week. By all means, uh, you can subscribe on pretty much, pretty much all the places that you would usually get a podcast. That rule goes for all editions of the Chaser Report Pocket.

Like if you ever want to hear a better version of it, just go to Schmikegast. It will guarantee to be more coherent and probably more enjoyable. Our gear is from Road and we're part of the ACAST Creator Network. Catch you next time. Thank you for your patience.

Your call is important. Can't take being on hold anymore. Fizz is 100% online so you can make the switch in minutes. Mobile plans sort of $15 a month. Certain conditions apply. Details at fizz.ca.