The Chaser Report - What Are Julian Assange's Next Steps?

Episode Date: June 26, 2024

Dom and Charles tackle the biggest story in the country: Julian Assange's freedom. Also, Dom has a special announcement about an incredible Chaser Report milestone. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

The Chaser Report is recorded on Gatigal Land. Striving for mediocrity in a world of excellence, this is The Chaser Report. Hello and welcome to The Chaser Report with Dom and Charles. Stop right there, Charles. What? What? Don't violate the US Espionage Act. Why not?

You just get off scot-free. Even though you're not a US citizen, even though you're not in the United States. Yeah. And even though the US has a First Amendment, which guarantees the right to free speech. So the thing is, you can publish something. not in America and not be an American citizen and still be extradited, well, it turns out to Saipan Island of all places. Julian Assange is free and it's a cautionary tale for people who publish naughty, edgy stuff

like us. Yes. And I just don't want us to break any laws and do the wrong thing because, you know. Well, I do think back to that time when George W. Bush was visiting and in our newspaper, we published an article, How to Assassinate a President. Yes. But it was all done theoretically, yeah, hypothetically. It was, if anything, it was a cautionary tale.

Yeah, it was sort of saying, here's what you shouldn't do. Yes, that's right. Yeah. Because, actually, that's one of those other things where it is illegal, despite their free speech thing, it's illegal to publish details of how to assassinate. Probably he's here, actually, too, just seeing about it. I'm so glad you reminded everybody that we did that.

Hey, let's talk more about this. And I've got a milestone to reveal to you, Charles, in the moment. Yeah, great. It's a good and a bad milestone in a way because it just occurs to me that over the past, you know, a few years we've been doing the podcast. Yeah. There's a lot of things we've said, Charles, a lot of publications we've made. I am. And they're now all transcribed by Apple Podcasts as text.

Yes, that is worrying. So they're all out there able to be searched by, I don't know, the US Department of Justice. And Charles, today marks the 900th episode. of the Chaser Report. You're fucking kidding. I'm not. 900 episodes of this thing. Very in mind the crazy period

when we used to do a couple of them a day. Oh, yeah, that's true. It was very keen. But yeah, 900 episodes. Isn't that both admirable and yet somehow really depressing? It's really depressing. Should we get out the party poppers? We don't have any party poppers.

Fittingly, I think. Should we get out the... Maybe for number 1,000 later in the year. Hookers and cocaine or something? What do you think we are, Tunnel 7? So, no, this is. This is the thing. Charles, we might well have violated the Espionage Act, and we wouldn't know,

but the AI would scrape it and get through. Because Charles, America and things are falling apart around us in the studio. America, of course, was well within its rights to prosecute a non-citizen for active journalism despite their First Amendment. But you've got to realize, no, see, I'm with the US State Department on this. Sure. Because the thing that you've got to remember is everyone goes, oh, well, hang on, he didn't even live in America. why is he subject to U.S. laws?

But you've got to think back to the impact that those leaks had. You might recall, these were the ones where they literally were showing drone footage. Part of the leak was they were showing drone footage of people who were actually operating out of, like, Florida, and treating these Afghan civilians like it was in a war game, and literally just shooting them and then making jokes about shooting them. At a cultural level, it has affected our understanding of, what and how horrific drone warfare is, how asymmetrical and, you know, dehumanising that whole thing is.

It sort of actually spoilt the whole party on the US's foray into asymmetric warfare. Absolutely. And without those leaks, they would be happily bombing Afghan weddings to this day, right? So the sheer, for she impact, it was a global impact, and it was struck at the absolute heart of the military industrial complex. So I sort of go, fair call. That's what the... You know, like if you publish something that impactful,

then of course you have to expect repercussions from the greatest military cunts in the world. Like, you know what I mean? They published half a million, uh, wikileaks. Published about half a million, uh, classified U.S. military and diplomatic cables. Yes. The ABC says it included the alleged killing of civilians by U.S. soldiers in Afghanistan and in Syria.

And Charles, this makes very hard to commit war crimes. If you'd written an op-ed piece for the New York Times, if you'd been living in American written some sort of op-ed piece for the New York Times about how terrible drones are, you wouldn't have had as much impact, right? Like, the whole point about American hypocrisy and the American sort of military empire is,

as long as you're allowed to free speech, as long as your free speech doesn't really, you know, impact and go to the, you know, actually upset the people who run the whole joint, which is not the politicians or the judges or the tradition, or anything like that, it's the people in the Pentagon who have all the bases and have all the arms and money and ability to kill people. And that is what Wikipedia, what Wikileaks actually managed to do. They, they, it was like a drone attack into the heart of the Pentagon.

The WikiLeaks was also conducting asymmetric warfare. It was sort of. Information warfare. Yes, exactly. And it was, it was as bad as killing a whole of the civility. Admittedly, it was killing the ability for, people to kill civilians but you know what I mean like well the judge did say in the court today in Saipan quite surprisingly that there'd been no negative actions as a result of the publication like

they couldn't point to anyone and say oh those spies were outed those people were killed these US troops well that's obviously because it's classified information or because they had to stop but there was huge damage there was damage to the US's reputation as a fine upstanding global citizen well it reminds me and and George W Bush's war strategy I mean reminds me you have that photo of the napalm girl. Do you remember the napalm girl in the Vietnam War? Yes. One of the most famous images ever taken.

A young naked girl running away from the napalm on the battlefield. Her skin burning. That's why she had her clothes off because the clothes were doused in the stuff. And the American public saw that image and were horrified at what was being done in their name. I hope that photographer was done for espionage. Well, presumably. Yes. But Charles, they're an American citizen.

And so they get the First Amendment. Oh, okay. If Julian Assange had been in America, he could have argued. Just because he was from an allied nation that's gone along with all their wars, he didn't get freedom of speech. That's the thing. We don't have a first amendment. He gets an e-visa.

He gets kind of, yeah. He can go and work for the US. I'm not sure he can't. But he falls between the cracks of, you know, a trusted ally, but without getting. So just imagine, Charles of thought experiment, if that photo hadn't been published, America would probably still be in Vietnam. They would have killed a lot more people. Yes, it would have been so much more, yeah, and they would have won.

They would have won the Vietnam War. The communists would never have seized Vietnam because they would all be dead. They would have all been killed. The thing that, you know, really made the US be defeated in Vietnam was the doubt, the seeds of doubt. And the truth. Yes, cast by the truth. Exactly. You don't want the truth in a war.

No, as Jack Nicholson so rightly said. But look, I think we've buried the lead a bit on this story. And I think the Australian media has buried the... Really? I really think that they've missed the whole... Sorry, has someone buried Julian Assange in the... Has the private plane been hit by some sort of US drone? I wouldn't be...

Yeah, I wouldn't be stepping outside with a... You know, the face print of that... I mean, he's going to Canberra. Well, I think it's going to be some robot magpie swooping him pretty soon. Yeah. No, the true lead for this story is that there exists a country called Saipan just to the north of Australia. I didn't...

I've never heard of Saipan. No, have you? I don't think it's a country. I think it's just a US protector. Who knew? He's got a US federal court there. Who knew that Saipan exists, that it's got a federal court there

and that it's like on our doorstep in our time zone? They can't be busy, can they, the US federal court? Well, who knows? So this is, it's in the northern Mariana Islands, which has only, Saipan only has 43, uh, people in it. And it's, um, they've been US citizens since the 1980s.

And Assange's whole thing is part of the plea deal, as I understand, was that he had to go to a US court. You can't have a plea deal in absentia on VideoLink. You can't zoom in to a courtroom and do a play deal, but he absolutely refused to set foot on the US mainland. So they had to find a court that was far enough away and be willing to go there. So as a result, he's had to pay a fortune in private plane fees.

I think $78,000, something like that, to charter a plane. $780,000. Yeah, $780. There you go. But what I don't understand. understand is why didn't there was a perfectly usable facility much more conveniently located.

Guantanamo Bay. That's what I was thinking as well. Or couldn't he have just walked into any US bar? I mean the US, the notion that the US power stops at the border is hilarious. He could have walked into... Well, as his conviction has proved. He should have just stayed where he was and the US

would have come to him. Any military base in any country base. There's US, the US, we forget to tell extensive there. He could have come back to Australia. It's 900 US military bases across the world. He could have gone to Pine Gap, Charles. He could have gone to the, to Darwin. He could have gone anywhere.

But look, I don't know about you, but I kind of feel like stepping onto a military base, which is essentially, you know, controlled by the US military. It might not have been the best ideal in, you know, circumstances in terms of, you know, like his whole. But do you remember? Not wanting to get killed thing. Yeah. The whole sort of, do you remember what was the one with all the photos out of Iraq where

that, you know, they tortured all those. What was the name of that? Oh, Abu Ghraib. Abba Grabe, yeah. But Charles, they would have abegrabed him. But, Charles, the US has habeas corpus. They would never torture foreign detainees,

except at Black Sites or at Guantanamo Bay. Like, if he went to... But how did he know that Saipan or whatever it's called doesn't have black sites? It probably does. Like, nobody... I'm got to go for a holiday just Saipan. I'd love to see you rendition, actually.

But this is the, this is the extraordinary thing. So the saga is open for now, right? Yeah. In a moment, what does Julian Assange do now? The Chaser Report, more news, less often. We were throwing this around internally earlier today, and there were a few suggestions. Yeah. Because what does he do?

I mean, was WikiLeaks really a job? Was he making money running? Like, how does he live? Yeah, well, don't they? I mean, do they get donations? Yeah, I think they get donations. And there's a lot of powerful, rich people who supported him. I mean, I don't know why you would have been.

published those leaks that he got when he could have sold them to the Russians for lots of money. He funded the site for a very long time. Donner Snowden. It was like a mistake. He could be in Russia right now in a peaceful democracy with stable elections. I feel like there's jobs. I mean, if Skomo can get a job, then anyone can get a job.

Actually, he could help with Orchus, do you think? Yeah, I'm thinking. He could advise on Orchus. I mean, they're the only jobs going at the moment in Australia. Some sort of Orchus consulting. That or he could go into the property market? There's always more need for... You know what I mean?

Well, it's the right age to own property, isn't it? Yeah, exactly. So... Is the Ecuadorian embassy hiring, is it? I think that they might have increased their security detail. Bridges are a bit burnt. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's been suggested he might be interested in the Media Watch job, Charles.

Oh, that's a good idea. Yes, that's what should happen. He should run Media Watch. Do you think that's the reason he did a plea now? Yes. I thought he's going to take it. over late-night live. I'm disappointed that it's David Marr.

He's not old enough. Not old enough, that's true. But no, I mean, Julian Assange, the great thing would be, I mean, imagine if not only, like, you know, Paul Barry's gotten stuck into the stuff that were published publicly. Yes. What if Assange could sort of get into the internal networks of 9 and 7? Imagine if someone hacked into Channel 7's computer.

Oh, my God. I wouldn't want to encourage that kind of thing. Imagine what you'd find. My God. That would be like, media watch would suddenly become a seven-hour program. It would be. Each night. Very, very, very long.

Absolutely. Okay, that's good. I like that. So, media, watch. I mean, the other option for him is, so he's all about telling truth to the man. Yes. Yeah, and thumbing his nose at authority.

Oh, you're going to hire him for the shot, are you? Well, no, I'm just thinking he should get a job on Sky News. Oh. Like, you know, the outsiders. You know, those sort of. Oh, you could do one of the outsiders. Yeah, yeah. I think he'd do really well.

As someone who actually had genuinely. Yeah, social isolation. I think a television talk show. I mean, I'd watch an Assange talk show. Do you reckon? Assange tonight. You obviously never read the Andrew Hagan piece about him. So Andrew Hagan, he's this essayist in London,

and he got given the job. He was hired to become Julian Assange's ghostwriter. Oh, really? This is about 15 years ago. And he was following him around. It was when he was hanging out in London before he was. entered the Ecuadorian embassy. The funny thing is that as a ghostwriter,

you're not allowed to write an essay, an exposure essay, on the person that you've written. I imagine it's part of the rules. But then again, if you were going to break those sorts of conventions, Julian Assange would be the guy to do it on. And yes, because half the, yes, exactly. Because this guy against... Because, oh, you shouldn't have published that.

It's not an argument that Assange can rebut. This guy was embedded with Julian Assange and got so annoyed at Julian Assange's just dick-headed narcissism, right? That he then writes this lengthy, like 18,000 word justification for why he was going to breach all his media ethics and publish a tell-all about what a fucking dick-head Julian Assange is. So I think there's a whole, and I think I can say that without fear of retribution because Julian Assange believes in absolute free speech.

But, like, I think that, yeah, I think we're going to be surprised. Like, here's my hot take, is that Julian Assange is going to become a feature of the Australian media landscape, and he's going to be in an enormous bore. Like, you know, I totally believe in his freedom and all that. I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that after the afterglow of defeating the US Empire sort of fades, we're going to discover that, you know, he's getting on speaking bills with Tucker Carlson. I mean, do you seriously think that as a middle-aged white man,

Julian Assange can find a role in the Australian media? You really think that you might have a chance? And he's the next Koshy. He's the next Kosh. Sunrise. That's perfect for him. A bit more interesting than Shervo, surely. Yeah, exactly.

They need a reboot. I was thinking what a coup would be in all series. I don't want to trivialise what he's been through. I'm sure it's been awful. Yeah. But if I was casting, I'm a celebrity, get me out of here. I mean, that would be. I mean, he'd really want to get out of it.

Yeah, he'd be very good at that as well. Actually, he'd outlast them all. He'd win. He could win alone. Yeah. I mean, the guy's resilience. I'm amazed he's still alive, to be honest. And he'd be good on the Masked Singer, wouldn't he?

He'd be great on the Masked Singer. And also, even Taskmaster, I feel like he'd be very ingenious. He would be ingenious. Well, you know the other thing, and again, I don't want to trivialise what he's been through, but he's got a couple of kids now. He's got his wife, Stella. I reckon he's, you know, young kids are pretty demanding. I don't think he knows what he's in for.

Yeah, right. I mean, as someone with a two-year-old and six-old, I love them dearly, but I've just come back to see them after a week away. Yeah. And you forget, you forget what it's like. Julian, you are in for it, mate. He's going to say, actually, can I, can I get that Gipmo treatment? Our gears from Road, we are part of the Oconoclass Network.

Sorry, Julie, don't hack any of our computers. Welcome home. Oh, fuck, yeah, he's got the power of hack. I take it back. I take it all back. You have him a column in the shot. Maybe he should become a plumber. Because he's got a great brand for that.

Oh, gee. Biggest news story in the world. Charles comes up with a plumbing. How have there been 900 episodes of this shit? Oh, God. Delete them all.