The Checkup with Doctor Mike - Widespread Painkiller Abuse In The NFL with Brandon Marshall

Episode Date: January 25, 2023

Watch me and Brandon react to the worst NFL injuries of all time here: https://go.doctormikemedia.com/youtube/BrandonMarshallInjuries Check out Brandon's new fitness app, House Of Athlete+: https://houseofathlete.com/hoa-plus Listen to Brandon's podcast "I Am Athlete": https://iamathletetv.com/ Brandon Marshall is a record-holding wide receiver who played 13 seasons in the NFL. Now retired, he's building a sports media and fitness empire with his brand's "I Am Athlete" and "House of Athlete" which seeks to provide the elite sports, fitness, and recovery resources professional athletes have to the average person. Brandon is known for being outspoken and honest, so I was eager to get the inside scoop on how injuries are treated in the NFL, how wide-spread painkillers are before games, and whether or not Terrell Owens should be playing football at 49 years old. I had so much fun with Brandon and really appreciate his insight into the most popular sport in America! Executive Producer and Host: Dr. Mike Varshavski Produced by Dan Owens and Sam Bowers Art by Caroline Weigum CONTACT: [e-mail]

Do you think 49-year-old Terlowean should be on the field? Hold on. Who's in your research department? Let's welcome to the podcast, Brandon Marshall, six-time pro-ball NFL player, wide receiver, extraordinary, entrepreneur, and now mental health advocate. He recently launched his new app, House of Athlete Plus. That's doing extremely well. Encourage you to check that out.

In this conversation, we talk all things, mind, body. his transition from being a pro athlete to civilian life and even the crazy things that go down in NFL locker rooms and he does have a special message for 49-year-old Terrell Owens i hope you enjoy this conversation as much as i did let's get started be who we're about to launch a five day a week show live streaming live every day wow that's hard streaming is hard well instead of me going on ESPN i can do it on my channel okay right so yeah what you know like i was doing a five day a week show on fs1 i'm like i'd rather do it on my own exactly so that's the same reason why i went to social media because i would try and go on tv and they'd be like oh you're a young doctor you don't know

what you're talking about we're going to have our people say it i'm like well fine i'll just do it on my own right and it became really successful what made you not want to do the fs1 or espan and then do it on your own well one i'm an entrepreneur and two i feel like we're overdue for a space where athletes can sit down and feel comfortable true It's really simple. You know, look at Skip Bayliss, Damar, Hamlin, dies on the field. Yeah. Okay.

Brought back to life. And while he's still on the field, he's tweeting about the NFL and what they need to do because of the playoff implications. Yeah. You know, and, you know, all the athletes were in the uproar. So those athletes that now no longer want to sit on Skip's show, where did it go? And that's the opportunity for. creators like myself, and there's others in the space. I think a lot of people are building out podcast. We're building out of a platform, right? Like, I imagine a world one day where I'm not

in front of the camera. Yeah. Right. Hopefully in two to three years, right, we have several athletes as contributors and partners on our platform. How did you feel with the whole DeMarz situation when it first happened? One, I thought he was gone. And I thought he was gone, because I've never seen on the field in my 13 years at the highest level in the NFL played for 25, 26 years. I've never seen athletes cry that way, hug that way, embrace that way, right? And when they mentioned CPR, I've never experienced any of that. Whether on a practice field, game field, in a locker room, no sport setting.

I've never seen that. And that's when I thought, you know, it was the worst. what was the sentiment around players as to what they thought happened or was there clear sort of knowledge about what was going on well a lot of us at home didn't know so it was a lot of speculation shady mccoy's one of our contributors to our platform he actually played in buffalo not too long ago so really close to people in the organization still so there's details that he still haven't come out as far as like what was happening on the field what's going on with him. In that moment, they took off his face mask. Sure. And all of that.

And so, like, there's a couple of people that kind of knew what was going on, but wanted to respect his privacy in the situation. You know, he's a human being at the end of the day. So I think players on the field absolutely knew. Bingles, Bill's absolutely knew. They wouldn't handle the situation that way. Even the coaches, the coaches wouldn't have stood up and said we're not playing we can't play right um so it's pretty cool to see how the guys have galvanized this has galvanized the guys people have come together and still pushing the conversation forward of like how do you make the game safer uh is there any other ways uh that we could you know lean into prevention and then what can we do for players moving forward who was the first

person that texted you when you saw that well it wasn't a text it was russell wilson wow russell wilson tweeted right i was en route to go in studio uh to jump on our show and then watch the game live and actually start driving probably like 15 miles per hour faster because russell wilson the way he tweeted it was like it wasn't just like prayers up for damar yeah you know it was a little bit more i don't know his exact tweet but there's a little bit more behind it and i was like man like this doesn't sound good right you know i'm thinking and i was thinking you know was there a bone or something something sticking out, right? Like...

So you think it's more like a physical... Right, like something really gruesome and nasty. Traumatic, yeah. You know, not just like an ACL or a concussion, right? Although concussions are a big deal, but... But something that make you, you know... Oh, my goodness. Yeah.

Right. So this was significantly worse. I'll tell you how I felt as a medical professional when it happened. Watching it obviously gruesome. I had much of the same emotions you just described. For me, I gave... I gave pause into saying, we don't know what's going on here.

We don't know his medical history. That's his privacy. We don't know what happened immediately before the game. There's so many unanswered questions. And yet you had so many people ready, not even to speculate, but almost with like this confidence, this is what happened.

That's right. And I'm like, well, pause. Like, we don't know that this happened. Did that bother you that people were jumping to these conclusions? Or were you like they're trying their best? Yeah, I think that's what we usually do. You know, it didn't bother me. I literally was just focused and locked in on, on him.

How he's doing. That's it. Yeah. Right. Like, and I think that's what made this moment special as a former athlete and as athletes, right, where it was like standing up to linear television, all of these reporters are people saying this or that. It was like, no, the only thing that matters this kid's life.

Yeah. That's it. I mean, even in a sports world from a media standpoint, talk radio. we couldn't talk about anything until we knew what was he was okay literally for a week so we're a serious sex em and you know we're sitting with you know the steve coens of the world and they're like guys we think that the only thing we can talk about is demar like it doesn't even feel right talking about anything else and you saw that across you know all networks um and that was pretty powerful but it it shows uh how powerful our voice is as athletes when we come together

right separately doesn't matter you're going against 32 billionaires yeah okay in a whole institution a whole machine but we are the product yeah right if we come together how much stuff can we get done right and so i think this was a powerful moment for athletes because it united us and that's sort of what you're doing with i am athlete with your facility with talking about mental health and its combination and effects on physical health, do you feel like you're getting buy-in from your fellow players? 100%. Because this is the one thing that's so organic and real to us, right? You know, our cultural currency is probably the best in the business. What I mean by that

is we have billions of followers collectively. Yep. All right? We touch the entire world as athletes. You know, and we're using that cultural currency to build companies like Gatorade or the of the world, the ESPNs of the world. But the one thing that is so organic and something that we can be thought leaders in, we don't really participate in. And that's wellness. From a business standpoint, it's a $4.3 trillion industry. And I truly believe we're the healthiest people on the planet. Yeah. Why do you think that is? Where's the disconnect there? Well, one, you know, the sexy opportunities as athletes is like, what are we wearing? You know, there's some tech opportunities is what we're drinking.

But as far as like our actual routine, our lifestyle, how do we eat? How do we sleep? How do we stay mentally fit? Like all of those things is what keeps us in peak shape and help us get to peak performance, right? And there are people

every single day trying to, that are following trends and feds because they want to live better. They want to feel better. Well, we do this every single day. And athlete can tear or tear up his MCL or hurt as MCL, right, and have a scope, be back on the field in 10 to 14 days in front of 70,000 people live, millions of fans watching.

And then you see some people, right, that may be on crutches for three, four weeks, right? The general population. Now, do we push it to the limit because we have to at times as athletes? Absolutely. But I'm so sick and tired of seeing people live in pain, training. in pain, right? Like, we can, I can, athletes walk in and be like, oh, my VMO's out or my left, you know, glue this out, so I got to do this to fire this because if that doesn't work,

this is going to go out. I wish everybody had that type of access and that type of, you know, understanding of the human body. Yeah. It's all about performance. Yep. You know, even, I mean, you're performing when you're outside with your kids, you just want to pick up your kids. Yeah. I have that same mentality as a doctor that whether you're five years old or 1005 years old, to treat you like an athlete because if someone comes in and they're 105 years old and they're off balance, I'm going to get them on a rehab program just like I would as an athlete who had an MCL tear or I have a patient who has a diagnosis of Parkinson's and they're having trouble with their balance. Same approach. We're treating them like an athlete because the human body responds that

level of training. And I think athletes get it the best but at the same time maybe put an over emphasis on the physical aspect of the training but then forget about all the recovery aspects. because if you look at what's hot in the fitness world, like let's say in the last 10 years, it's those Nike shirts that say go faster, go harder, go longer, I'm a beast, there's no finish line, and it's like, yes, that's sexy. But is that real life?

That's right. And I feel like you could attest it that way better than I can even, because you're an athlete. Absolutely not. It's so funny, when you walk into, and I played for, drafted by the Denver Broncos, was there for four years,

played for the Miami, Dauphins for two. I was traded there. Then three years in Chicago, love Chicago, amazing experience. Because I wanted to get into media, wanted to go to the number one media market in the world, capital of the world, and that was New York. So I played for the Jets and the Giants. I was here for three years. And, you know, any of those locker, when you walk in those facilities, you'll see more guys in the recovery part. parts of the facility than the actual weight room or on the field, right? Like, you may walk in now, what time is it?

It's around 6 o'clock right now. You know, pretty much most of the guys are gone, right? Or you can be gone as far as like on our schedule. But you'll walk into the hot tub, cold tub, the steam room, may go in the training room, you know, and see guys in there doing things. There's guys in there from 5 a.m. to sometimes 9 p.m. at night. Wow. Right? Just recovering.

You know, and then when they go home, they're doing more, right? Because our goal as an athlete is, you know, pretty much, or the name in the game, I should say, is recovering for the next day. Yep. Right? Because it's easy to be a one hit wonder and it's like, can I, you know, I can, anybody can run a great route or catch a ball or run somebody over once. Can you do it play after play day after day, year after year? And that's why recovery is so critical. It's like, okay, you work your ass off every off season to get to peak shape, to pit, peak performance, and then now you're trying to maintain and stay there.

And there's abs and flows to that. And the recovery is the most critical part. You know, hydration, sleep is important. We've been leaning a lot into sleep lately. Mental health is the most important part, okay? And then the other things as far as the modalities that we use and working with different gurus when it comes to, you know, the skeletal system, to, you know, muscles and, you know, all of that stuff.

There's so many layers of the body and there's literally experts that focus on every single layer. So as an athlete, you've got to find who they are and work with them. That's a task ring. And fit it into your schedule. But yeah, we get paid for, we get paid to do that. That's our job. We do that nine to five.

Right. So what I love about what a lot of groups are doing today is like how do we take that, modify that and scale it for the general population. And we need that. For me, I'll tell you what the heart, you probably don't know this, but I became a professional boxer this last year and a professional barista exactly that's only for you but um i became a professional boxer and i ended up fighting on showtime pay-per-view actually i don't know if you saw levy on bell's fight yes i was the fight right before right at beast he's actually a really

nice guy i got along with him really well you got him on the show he's definitely coming on the show he just hasn't been in new york but he's awesome dude um what i realized in doing the training for the full year is where is that what I don't understand where is the line between pushing yourself oh yeah I'm just sore versus my whole mind body is fatigue that I would be better off with my performance if I took a break versus pushed on and did that extra workout how do you balance that um that's tough right now but a lot of teams and a lot of leagues are leaning into that right now we're starting to use data we're starting to use GPS so we're starting to track this stuff single day. The problem is, you know, the players, we want that, of course. And there's people

in the, within the teams and these organizations that understand that science technology is critical and is the way. But what about Bill Belichick? And I'm not saying he doesn't embrace this. I don't actually even know what it's a philosophy and his approach to this is. But he's been around the game. You can call him a dinosaur. He's still to go. But he's a, yeah, like goat, dinosaur, but he's still, he's a hybrid. He's a dinosaur, like, whether or damn, dinosaur or goat, goats and dinosaurs don't care about data and analytics. Yeah.

Well, does he? I don't know. Maybe he does. But the Sean McVeves of the world, they do. Yeah. You understand these younger coaches that get it the next generation, right? So that is the battle is that you have some people still in our sports today. That's still about what you said, finish strong, fast.

So they do push that extra thing for no reason. Yeah, but like, but every team, I would say we, you know, This, and this was different, right? When I first got in league, we didn't have this. But every practice, every game, we all have GPS is on. And we're tracking all of our output. We're tracking everything. And so, you know, there's some organization that does it well.

Aaron Wellman, Dr. Aaron Wellman, now he was the head, training the conditioning coached with the Giants. When I was there, he was one of those guys that would come walk on the field and be like, hey, you know, your output is way too high right now. we want to cut your reps by half today or we're going to sit you right because they're looking at those numbers they know if you're in this area you know that's danger zone you're ramped up too high so they're probably looking at your heart rate your weight lost how much water weight you've lost everything everything everything everything see like we don't have this in the gen public we don't

have cool cool uh statistics maybe a heart rate monitor or a sleep tracker but the problem with the general population is getting those statistics sometimes just creates a flood of information without knowledge of how to use it that's right even for me as a doctor sometimes patients come in with some of the information off their smart watches and i'm like i have no idea what to do with this because i don't know how this applies to you in your performance like i need to follow you for a longer period of time that's right that's why i think the biggest thing for us uh right now until we get there because it's needed is the fundamentals yeah you know tracking hydration right Like performance decreases by 25% if we're dehydrated.

Fucking drink water. Yeah. Okay. It's hard. Yeah. You know, your brain literally detaches from your skull when you're dehydrated. What the hell does that do to your emotions and everything else going on, right? Like this is things, these are things that are really happening.

Sleep. Four hours of sleep, opposed to eight hours of sleep. And if you average eight hours of sleep, seven to eight hours of sleep for six to eight months, it's like freaking being on steroids, some people say. Yeah. Right. It's so powerful. Yeah, well, because sleeping four hours a night just reduces your peak performance time,

your reaction time, your creativity, all things that you need as a route runner, as a quarterback. So now let's go to forget that. Now let's go back to the Weekend Warrior there, the nurse, the doctor, the entrepreneur, the creator, right, the YouTubers of the world, the Snap, well, not Snapchat, I don't know if they're still, they're, they're out there. They're out there. Yes, I love you, you guys, Snapchat. TikTok, right? The TikTokers of the world, right? Like creativity.

Like I'm trying to entertainers aren't like entertainers. Like how do they stay right there? Sleep. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I've heard Kevin Hart say some five hours of sleep. I'm like Kevin, what are you doing?

Right. Because you're asking like what should we be tracking right now? And those are, that's what we could be measuring. Yeah. The basis. So you have the or rings of the world. You know, so sleep is important. And then you have nutrition as well.

Like right there, those three things. you can turn into a superhero, right? Just to be the best version of yourself. And so that's just like, all right, how are you performing in this space as a nurse, as a TikTok or as an entrepreneur, you know? Isn't it crazy? Like, you would think we're sitting here

having this high level conversation. You've been on the highest level of the game, six-time pro bowler, and yet we're still saying, sleep, drink water, take care of your mental. Fundamental. That's still what we're talking about. And yet we can't do it. Fundamentals.

And even, yeah, I mean, we can't do it because. It's the simplest things. And yet we mess it up all the time. That's right. Why? One, I think there's awareness, right? Like, if I wasn't a professional athlete, I wouldn't be sitting here talking like this. Yeah.

You know, hell, I might be overweight because probably 80% of the people, you know, where I'm from are obese, you know, and they don't, I've never, I've never seen anyone in my neighborhood growing up running and jogging. Hey, Mr. Sam, running a mile or two. And somebody did that. Like, what is wrong with that person? Where did you go up by the way? Where'd you grow up, by the way?

Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, East Liberty. So, you know, yeah. But it's like deviant, right? It's counterculture. So I think I do believe we're more aware and more health conscious than ever. And so now we're in this interesting space where people are searching, people are reading. they want the information. So platforms like this are critical to get the right information out now because, you know,

we are seeing people start reading more labels, watching documentaries, but even these documentaries you put out could be a hit or miss. Exactly. You know, so times are changing, but I think it starts with education and awareness. And then I think it's about like, you know, our culture, you know, American culture is, which we're talking, what you say earlier from those shirts is hustle, hustle, hustle. right like we celebrate not sleep and team no sleep we grind season that's what it's about look i'm up yeah we don't celebrate sleeping we don't celebrate shutting off we don't understand the

importance of it right so i think it's a cultural thing as well you know we need to continue to just to rethink some things even like you know how we do business everybody just want to make money exactly money money money money money like the platform that i was telling you about that we just launched, I had this interesting exchange with someone on my team where they were like, oh my goodness, we just launched the app, it's phenomenal, it's great, we're getting a lot of engagement. And I was talking about, you know,

what we were saying earlier, like athletes coming in, like I can go and put a program together because I have soreness or weakness in my knee. Yep. Lower back, shoulder. We can literally prescribe this on our app and help people out, right? And these are things that are so natural.

And we can also use our pro athletes that train with us to teach it. Right? How cool would that be? Yep. And so I'm describing this. We're having this conversation. And he's like, yeah, you know, we can upcharge them.

It's another opportunity to make money. And so let's stop right there. Yeah. Right? Like when is enough enough? Yeah. Right. Isn't it cooler just to have a lot of people rocking with you?

Because, you know, we all have missions and a Y and that North Star, but then once you put that in place and you say, oh, this is what the company stand for. Then it's about, all right, how the hell do we monetize it, right? It's about capitalism, right, which I love making money. I want every, I'm an entrepreneur, but there has to be a thin line between, you know, I just want your back to feel better, your knee to feel better. I want you to live better, live well, and then how much money can I make off of you?

Yeah. Like, give it away. That's my thing with our company is give away as much as possible. Well, you want to create a community that then you can all bond around the same things and then that's mutually beneficial all around. That's right. As opposed to trying to nickel and dime and it's like basically being instead of dollar wise, penny stupid, you're becoming penny stupid dollar unwise.

That's right. That's right. 100%. You know, there's some people that's giving me things, you know, taking care of me. and I've become like lifetime customers it's like they do something different new it's like I'm there because I never forgot how you took care of me that's lost on our generation I feel like everyone wants some kind of even exchange like you know you hook somebody up you're like oh I brought you a client like oh you want a fee what fee no I want us all to succeed man that's right it's crazy but

that happens a lot right probably in NFL even more yeah this is a tough time for us right now um You know, it's, everyone has a brand. Everyone is trying to monetize and make money. You know, I just look at, or you know, even like this platform, I believe this is great because when you do good, you get good. Yeah. So I love that you're successful, but because you're able to continue to feed people great information and take care of your community because that information is critical.

Because you can go on YouTube, Google, whatever, and some terrible pop up, right? Exactly. So I believe in, you know, you do good, you get good. You know, my vision is for our company to be sitting over a billion dollar on a billion dollar valuation within five years, right? Because I look at that as more opportunity to hire more people, to bless more families, and also my crazy vision, and that's when we go five to 10 year vision where we're sitting on and pay me a $8 billion valuation is to give away $400 million to the mental health

community. Wow. That's my life. That's my financial goal, right? Specifically that number, 400 million. Nothing else. Nothing else. That's my only goal.

You know, as an athlete made $100 million and career earnings, right? We're doing some cool things in business right now. And my only financial goal is how much money can I give away. And that number that was specific to me, I had this clear vision in 2014 of $400 million. So that's what I'm working towards. It was a 15-year plan. I got nine years to go. Okay. Mental health community or mental health foundation because of your past experiences?

On 100%. Okay. I mean, I think that there's a, I think purpose is the most important thing. Sure. Right. And it's hard to find, right? A lot of people are working, but they're not fulfilled. And if you find your purpose and you work towards that or work in that, then you're not, like, you're just like living a life that is just filled with so much. joy and so much just like you know it's just a it's amazing feeling yeah if you want to find your purpose and you don't know where it's at okay looking your pain hmm was that a strategy used that's how we get to the mental health discussion okay well tell me about it tell me about your journey right so in 2011 i found myself at mcclain hospital you know i was there diagnosed with the borderline personality disorder and i sat there for three months in an outpatient program

dialectical behavior therapy, self-assessment, cognitive behavior therapy, mentalization therapy, one-on-ones with the great Dr. Gunderson, and I was there Monday through Friday from nine to five, right? And then from there, I would go train and work on my body. See, this is how the whole house of athlete structure came together, right? Because I truly believe my three months were so amazing and transformational because I leaned in holistically, not just mentally. Okay? So I'm there for the mental part of it in mental health. But you didn't neglect your physical side.

I'm training. I'm eating what I'm supposed to eat. So I'm approaching my plate the right way. Just simple stuff. Healthy veggie, healthy fat, healthy protein, healthy carb, right? you know three four meals a day uh protein in between so i'm on a routine not just like oh i'm hungry no i knew when i was eating sure right i had a community around me so support team staff i was resting i was cutting off around 10 11 and so i was social media at that time uh Twitter

okay you got the angriest social media going i know i know Twitter was a thing but but even that like i really wasn't into uh social media until we started getting into business got it okay so you took up you took a little bit of time away from that yeah the only reason i ask is because i feel like there's so much toxicity on social media oh 100% because it's like hard to disconnect from that you have to have boundaries there but yeah i was there for three months and uh it totally changed my life and that's where my why i found my why uh and i realized that football was the platform and but it was not my purpose and um i spent three months with Harvard, built out a case study and learning from athletes, entrepreneurs and entertainers

that did something well beyond their field or their screen, you know, and so I was studying Livestrongland, Armstrong, Magic Johnson, Keanu Reeves, Boomer Seizing, so on and so forth. And a couple people stood out to me, and what came out of it was content and commerce and pushing to this space. So that's how we got to this whole, you know, House of Athlete thing, but it was in my pain, right? This thing that some people would say what should break me or would break people. I mean, we lose people every day from suicide.

Yeah. Right? And I looked at that and said, this is an opportunity to really tell my story and inspire people. So the goal initially was to raise awareness. Because all, you know, the athletes and artists and people that we see. standing up today, talking about anxiety, depression. It wasn't like that in 2011. Like in my press conference, I stood up, I was like, we need to put faces to this.

Yeah. Right? We need to walk the halls of Congress and look at how we're allocating this budget because it's definitely not going to the people and going over here. It costs me $35,000 a month just to get the help I need it, just paying the hospital. And then another $15,000 and living the expenses just to be able to continue to operate. Sure. Right?

So those are the things we wanted to do, and I would say I thought it was going to take 20, 30 years to get to this place from a mental health community standpoint. But, man, it went from a taboo topic to an everyday conversation, and I'm excited about that. How do you think you got so much success from a program like this, and others do end up on the wrong side of things and do succumb to their illnesses? What do you think the game changer is there? Well, it presents itself in so many different ways. Every case is different. So, like, I don't even think I'm capable of answering that question. Well, what worked for you?

Yeah. Well, it's that. Like, so House of Valley, here's our five pillars. Train, fuel, mental fitness, recover, and try. The fundamentals of that, right? So I think me leaning into the fundamentals and putting a routine around that is why I succeeded. Because now if you study Tom Brady, Serena Williams, LeBron James, and, all of our top performing athletes that the goats that we admire it's the same thing yeah

Monday this is what I'm doing Tuesday this what I'm doing they know when they're waking up when they're going to sleep and everything in between from having breakfast at this time this is what I'm having for breakfast right they know it we fucking go through life as human beings sometimes just like willy-nilly with no plan yeah you're missed the mark a thousand percent if you don't have a plan. I want to get in shape. Okay, well, tell me when you're eating breakfast. Yeah, exactly.

And when you're eating lunch, when you're eating dinner, and what snacks you're having in between, and why you chose these foods. Well, take me to 16-year-old Brandon. I'm talking to you when you're 16 years old. And I bet if I ask you, what do you think the life of an athlete is? You say ultimate freedom.

But yet, you're describing to me the exact opposite, right? Because when we're younger, we think, oh, when you're rich and you're at top of the game, you do whatever you want, you go wherever. But yet, it's a very important. very formulated, structured lifestyle. Otherwise, it's unhealthy. That's right. Yeah. And because we think about just the performance side of it at that age. We don't think about recovery. Yeah. Because we recover like this when we're 16. That's right. And we don't think about, well, how do I stay

at a 4-4 speed from quarter 1 through 4? We don't think about those things, right? And that doesn't really happen until you get now at the college level, we're having these conversations and we're doing some amazing things, definitely at the pro level, but really an athlete, it doesn't hit an athlete until their metabolism change for the most part. Really? But we are seeing more sophisticated athletes come in and it's like, damn, I wasn't doing this my rookie year. Yeah.

Like the way they're taking care of their bodies now is totally different than what we were doing back then, right? It took like the veterans that sit me down and like, I wasn't getting a massage. I wasn't getting a cold tub, you know, these gurus that they had coming in, talking about M-A-T, A-R-T, and all these other modalities, they would do stuff work with my body. It's like, man, this shit don't work, man. Like, no pain, no game. That was the mindset.

You know what I mean? Well, you were cutting pieces off your pads and, and manufacturing. Yeah, you still do that? I would still do that. I would still do that. Really? Oh, yeah, for sure. But what about the protection?

You're selling me the whole recover. Protection goes down, recovery needs to go up. Oh, no. I got to look good. You look good. You feel good. You feel good. You play good.

You play good. You get paid good. that's Dionne Sanders quote and I believe in that and Tom Brady even like I was listening to Tom Brady TB 12 methanol and Greg and you know people like well that's not for me you know I can't do that's Tom Brady that's his DNA is different no he and he was saying like he bleed the same way that everybody else does he just works his ass off to recover meaning like he'll get hit he'll have those bruises and what he knows what to do when that happens right like it's it's it's all about getting your body back down the back to baseline and

out of compensation. If I get hit here, right, I know what I need to do to make sure I'm recovered and then I'm not putting more wearing tear on this left knee or this lower side of my back, right? So all the people out there who may be living in pain right now dealing with lower back issues, knee issues, ankle issues, you know, neck issues, it's a trickle down effect and a triple trickle up effect, right? So if you don't take care of that, you're just going to three years from me. now five years from now, 10 years from now,

you're going to be the crippled person that's walking around town and we're always going to like, oh, that looks so sad. So it's important for us to take care of ourselves. We have to prioritize our health. Yeah. It's interesting that you're pointing out like the joint above and the joint below because that's a philosophy that we learn in medical school now, at least in my like the medical school that I went to

because it's so easy for a patient to come in say they have knee pain and then we forget all about that their hip is thrown off or is their ankle instability that's leading to their knee pain. And so you should have a doctorate degree at this point, man. Like you're talking at a really high level, just so you know that. That's really an accomplishment. I give you props for that. No, I appreciate that.

I think, like, I feel like I can administer my own IV. You've gotten so many down my IVs, right? Right, because we're surrounded by doctors like you all the time, right? So when we sit down, like that's what you will say to me, I come in. I'm like, doc. Like the younger me, I'm like, doc, this is actually really good because it gets back to like when, you know, we really start getting as an athlete. So if I was a rookie sitting with you, and I'm like, hey, doc, my knee hurt. Right?

And you're like, okay, Brandon, let me, and you start checking stuff up here. What the fuck is this guy? God, I hope my patients don't think this way. Because I'm like, my knee hurt. What are you doing up here? Sure, sure. What are you doing? I know what you mean.

I'm never coming back to your office, right? So what happens over time is like, that knee's not getting better. The knee's not getting better. Shit, doc. What were you saying again? You know, that might be year two, might be year three, year four, whatever. And so you start educating. Well, Brandon, you got to understand that, you know, and this is where, you know, the doctors really separate themselves.

There's a lot of people that have the science and have the skill. But can you communicate that to a patient where they understand it? So if you can talk to me and say, well, Brandon, trust me on this. I know you think that this is the problem, but this is just a symptom. We need to see where it's coming from. It could potentially be coming from this, right? It could be just trauma right here. But it could be that your whole quad isn't even turned on

because you took a hit from two years ago and it shut everything down. Now all of the force is going into your knee, right? So we got to get the force back into your muscle. So now you're not filling this knee pain. So now I've got to do TKEs. I got to do all those other stuff just to get this activated. But when you turn on a game, a Lakers game,

and they get that shot of LeBron in the tunnel, He's on a bosey ball doing rubber band stuff. It's like, what the hell is he doing? Tom Brady doing all kinds of stuff. That's injury prevention right there. Yeah, and it is also like, you know, we can talk for days about this. I mean, I guess your audience are 11 million subscribers and growing. Yeah.

Because if it was my audience, they'd be like, man, next. They want to talk about like, tell me what happened when you played golf or played cards with Michael Jordan. I mean, if you want to talk about that too, I'm down to hear about that too. Well, he didn't let me play cards, actually. Oh, why? He was nervous about you beating him? No, he was nervous that I didn't have enough money. Oh, well, Michael Jordan has a lot of money.

A lot of money. A lot of money. So my first year in Chicago, after my first game, you know, playing against the Colts, home game, we win. I had two touchdowns and I'm in Chicago, right? Like, this is, to me, the biggest sports town, you know, in our country. The bears. And it's the bears, the bulls, the socks, the Cubs, the hogs.

like everybody's like we got everything represented and the fans are loyal right yeah big time and so anyways i get a call for one of my buddies it's not philly fans turn real quick ooh you might have some philly fans no because i used to be a philly fan mcnab days teo days pinkston days i was a huge fan you're not a fan anymore i fell off watching football as much as i'd like because of this youtube world doctor world so i don't get to watch as much as i'd like but back that i was a huge fan i went to the falcons eagles game i don't like that why Because you like, you got to find some time for you to watch some balls. So here's the problem.

When you in life start getting more things to do, you start having to create priorities, what's important? And I was like, I wanted to become a boxer, so that took priority. I wanted to be a good doctor for my patient. That took priority. So you don't miss football. I miss football. Like, crazy. Are you kidding me?

Like even talking about the Demar situation on like social media on television, I was like, man, I miss my fantasy days. Sam's a big football fan. I'm always talking to him about it. It's hard for me to watch football and I talk about football. because of what you just said oh because you miss it yeah like i got to really be intentional on like my schedule and i'm going to ask you a hard question okay do you think 49 year old tarolowen should be on the field hold on who's in your research department what do you mean right here this is me right here do you see any notes um here's what i would say to that um this is going to be

a very politically correct statement no one t o need to sit his ass I love it. Okay. So, no, he doesn't need to be playing. But I do think, and there's so many, there's so much more to that. Sure. But I do believe, you know, when you look at modern medicine and technology, there's no reason why athletes can't push it. Tom Brady's 45. Now, positions are different. Yeah. But I do believe athletes, the longevity and a lifespan of an athlete. Has prolonged. Yeah. I don't be surprised. you start seeing more athletes play into their mid-40s and he hell even pushed her. Have we seen a 50-year-old?

I'm sure we've seen a punter. I think Vinetary, very good one. And then also, Testa Verdi, maybe. Vinny Testa Verdi was pushing it. But you got LeBron. Look what LeBron's doing as well. Yeah. You know, he's been playing at a- He's like 25 right now, basically.

There you go. High-level nose. No, no, I'm saying he's playing like he's 25. Oh, yeah, correct. So what I'll say is, T.O. need to sit his ass down um but if there was an athlete that could do it you know what i'm saying it would be yeah yeah but there's so many other things but i don't want to see him get hurt either well my biggest thing with it's like they're they're you know um and and i don't know

because you know and i don't know if anybody knows his why behind it but it just sometimes it's sad um seeing you know our athletes like just hold on just too long sure you know you know know what I mean? And that transition can be hard for a lot of us because the sport is our identity for a lot of us, right? And so if you take that away, then what do I have? Sure. You know, I totally see the identity aspect of it. I see it in fighters a lot. There's also a level of it being a distraction in your Monday through Friday training, Saturday maybe you have off, Sunday's game day, and you repeat that process over and over again. And then when there's quietness, there's stillness there's nothing to do that you have to accomplish all of a sudden anxiety creeps in

depression kicks in at least depressive thoughts the anxious thoughts and it could take you to a bad place if you're not ready for it if you don't have prep if you don't create your own schedule that's right because before the sport would give you that discipline that was the hardest thing in my transition really was creating a schedule tell me about that you know every day i had an it Itinerary since I was 18, right? You had high school football, so I had routine and a schedule there. But when you get to college, you know, every minute is accounted for up until you go to sleep. So I had this itinerary in my entire college career, obviously four years at University of Central Florida.

And I played 13 years in National Football League. And literally that entire time, my time was accounted for. And on paper, walk in, okay, you know. Here's the schedule. Team meeting is at 8 a.m. You know, then we're going to transition into, you know, the head coach, the, you know, special teams. Then we're going to come back and do offensive defense. Then we're going to go do wide receiver meetings.

Then we have a little break. And then you come in. You got a little bit of time to regroup when it comes to, you know, recovery. Then you got workouts. Then you have a walkthrough. Then you go to practice. And then after practice, you have 20 minutes to go do what you need to do. And then you have offensive meeting.

Then after your offensive meeting, everybody go to their segment meetings. From your segment meetings, you're sitting with your wide receivers, what's specific to us. And then after that, you're going to do some more recovery stuff. Then you go home and then you have your own little schedule. Right. So everything was there. When you stop playing ball, you have to create that for yourself, right? And I think that's why a lot of us struggle is because you wake up with all this idle times. Like, what do I do?

Right. And we stop that routine. And we stop taking care of ourselves. That's why we see a lot of us. struggling. I've been taking care of my body all this time and start eating what I want. I'm not going to work. I've been doing this my whole life. No, whether you're an athlete or not, you still need to fucking live well and feel good, right? So we stop all of that and we don't know how to put that schedule in place. So like now, you know, running a team,

you know, building teams, you know, launching new products. Like, I didn't even know when I check my emails. I look up. I got freaking a thousand emails. I'm like, damn, is this corporate America? Just sit on your phone all day. checking emails and it's like it's like when to do that i don't know like i look up at the end of the day i'm tired now i got 50 email mails in my inbox i'm like i'll do it to the next day now i paled up so i had to find a way like okay this is when you're going to check your email so it doesn't get you know all backed up right um when they run team meetings when am i going to meet with this person that person when am i going to take care of myself in this process yeah that structure is

important because it creates discipline without even thinking about it creates habits and habits don't take a lot of mental energy to execute a habit is it just what you do like you don't have to force yourself to drink a glass of water it's a habit I drink glass of water when I wake up you know where I see a parallelness I just said I treat all my patients like athletes there's a parallel with men who retire have the same issues that athletes when they retire just 30 years 40 years down the line. They retire. They have this huge celebration. They used to have the structure of work waking up at this time. And then it goes away. And then they fall into a dark place. And that's why we see our depressive rates and suicide rates higher in those over the age of 65 after they retire, specifically

for men. So it's interesting that the same process that goes through with a professional athlete happens with men in that age group. This is something I talked to Reggie Bush about last weekend. And I'm curious about your take. And if you don't even want to talk about it, that's fine. But I'm curious as a doctor. NFL has gotten a lot of pushback for being a dangerous sport. A lot of NFL players are saying they don't even want their kids to play. Concussions are a big issue. These are all things important to talk about. But then you'll hear whisperings of players saying, I got medications to be pain free to play. I got tortle injections. I got percocet in order to be able to practice. Do you think that that's a widespread practice or do you think these are like individual outlier moments?

Every case is different, but definitely it was a widespread practice, but it could show up differently in every team, depending on physicians administering these things and also leading these teams. They've cracked down on a lot of these prescription drugs and toward all stuff. When I first got in the NFL 2006, we left team meeting. So this is the night before the game. So night before the game in the NFL, you know, you could be

home or way you're stand in a hotel okay so let's say we're home Denver Broncos we're in Denver get in my car got to be at the team hotel checked in by 6 p.m. team meeting starts at 8 and then we go into that same cycle that I talked about so the whole team is together then you separate into special teams come back together offense over here defense over here after that then the receivers meet together running back to meet together, et cetera, et cetera, okay? After those meetings, they have food and then also treatment set up in the conference rooms, okay? And then you can make your way to your hotel room by 11 p.m. is curfew, all right? So my very first time going through this, walked out of that receiver room, that last meeting that I had,

and I walked by one of the rooms in this whole conference, that we were in and I seen a line of guys lined up with their pants like almost you know underneath their butt or like their their belts open and I stopped that peek I'm like what the hell you're doing it's like oh we're about to get a tort all shot oh no right so the night before the game you would see a line of guys just boom boom boom boom and you know a tortoise shot is almost like it just mass the pain to make you feel better you know it helps with inflammation and all of that And I do think it's needed at times, but I do think that there's been some teams and some players that's overdone it. I'm one of those players. You know, when the NFL stopped doing

this stuff and start really cracking down on some of these practices, you had a lot of players that were so used to that. I don't even know if it's addicted. That was like, well, how am I going to finish? How am I going to finish? So what I end up doing is going to the black market finding tort all pills because the teams wouldn't give it to us okay right so literally up until you know i like damn they're retired you know i would have my own little prescription bottle of tort all and i didn't overuse it but when i needed it i was like okay cool boom and another story right and these are just real and i think it's important to talk about these things because for the next generation of players right because if you take care of yourself and you recover um you do more

preventative work and there's new things that you can do out there you won't get caught up in that cycle and then what you some players you know now we're talking about a lifetime battle with addiction you know depression suicide it can get really bad yeah but all right playing for the Chicago Bears really wanted to um play in this Sunday night football game I think the 49ers going into their new stadium was going to be a wild night um the week before um I hurt my ankle high ankle spring. They said I was supposed to be out maybe four to six weeks, right? It was a bad ankle spring. Well, high ankle sprain's tougher than lower. Yeah, tough, tough. So now I have seven days to try to find a way. So it seems like, hey, we're just going to just rule you out. Don't practice. Don't

do that. I was like, listen, I probably won't be able to practice, but don't make a decision until after warmups on Sunday, on game day. So it's like, okay. So like, I got art therapy coming in. with Dr. Dennis, you know, doing some cool things there. And, you know, I'm soft tissue work, ice, heat, all, like, everything. I'm doing everything, right? And so I get out there. And right before everybody was going to come out to warm up, I went out there and a general manager, the coaches, everybody was there. What I did before I went out to that warm up, I took like four pain pills, two tortals.

Oh, my God. Like, I was high as hell on the field. because I really wanted to play, right? So I go out there, and I actually look pretty good. Well, yeah. I end up scoring three touchdowns. You probably didn't, you probably forgot you had a leg because you took. Right.

And I end up scoring three touchdowns. I know we're laughing at it, but that's really bad. Like, we don't want. Yeah. But it's a great story to highlight, like, where some of our athletes can potentially be. Do you think, like, you're overused? Did I tell you, you, I didn't really acknowledge that? I'm going to acknowledge the fact that you're the highest.

how fucking good that was. Can you acknowledge how good having been on one leg? All right. I'll tell you what I thought you were going to say. I thought you were going to say you jumped and you realized you couldn't walk. I thought that's the story you were going to do. No, I scored three touchdowns. One of my greatest catches.

But again, we're laughing, but we're not encouraged this behavior. No, but my curiosity comes from, did you think that using those substances, like basically, were you counseled on the risks every time those lines were there? You think players knew what they were doing? They just were like, oh, this feels good, and the doctors are doing it, so let's do it, or they knew that this was a potential, had drawbacks? Yes and no, right? Like, and like I said, it depends on what team you're in, you're on, and who's the physician, right?

You know, some of the, you know, a lot of the doctors actually, they'll go and say, okay, this is, you know, what is it, Napperson and Celebricks and all these things, like, look, whatever. All these anti-inflammatories. Yeah, right. So, like, some of the doctors will hit it. but it's like fine print like think about like the fine print when we buy things or whatever it's kind of like that type of deal it's like on the radio when they like just know like five

sentences and sometimes it's just like one of those things like hey here goes some napress and here go some celebricks and it's not even a conversation by the way there's not this is probably doesn't matter to say now but your torridol pills are not that much different than ibuprofen yeah it's only different when it's injected because it's a little faster acting and it absorbs a little bit but otherwise you were just taking a bunch of ibuprofen Oh, nice. So you weren't even doing anything that crazy. The doctor expert.

Yeah. But the problem is, is when you're taking, popping two or three of those pills for entire year or a couple years in a row. When you're doing it consistently, the kidney suffer. And you know how I got off of all this cellar bricks? You started sleeping well? Never. Keep going.

You started eating well? There you go. And you focus on your mental health. Nutrition. No, no, just do nutrition. That's it. So like, the name and the game, like, sickness and disease. live in, what, inflammation?

Sure. Right? A lot of it. Absolutely. Right. I mean, whenever there's inflammation, it means your immune system's doing something. So that's usually a problem.

Correct. So we need to fight that. And a lot of times we don't understand, like every time we put something in our mouth, our body's having a chemical reaction good or bad, right? So even a piece of chicken or whatever, like you got to understand your system and how these things react, how your body reacts to anything that you eat or drink.

And so I went through like, this extreme testing is where, you know, I went through some test, blood tests, and understanding what foods work for me and which foods don't. And I went from before this plan taking me an hour to 90 minutes to warming up, right? You know how you get on a plane, have your socks on, you take them off and you can see the pitting of edema and all of that sweating. Probably you guys had a sodium and stuff. Correct. All of that stuff to clean up my plan, my nutritional plan, eating better, right? And all that gone and going from 90-minute warm-up to not even have to warm up at all. Wow. Right. And I picked up on that plan from the locker

room, Ricky Williams or Ronnie Brown, you know, they were eating just like some stuff. I'm like, where aren't you eating the stuff that they cook for? It's like, oh, no, we got our own little chef. And, you know, this is our plan. I was like, okay, cool. They connected me with the guy and it was phenomenal. It's Sarah Melman Diet, but it's Dr. Leon, who runs now his mother passed. So they do some great things down there for a lot of athletes. Well, for the people, like, can't afford their own chefs that are listening and maybe can't get the testing done. Like all these things. But you can now. It's more affordable now. There's companies of plans. Yes. But foundationally, if you go back to what you said those things, you're going to get those

benefits. Right. Right. At the end of the day, like the one to five percent benefit that you needed to be the pro-athic, most people don't need that one to five percent better. That's right. That's right. They need the foundations to be good because what I see in my practice and I see this by the hundreds and thousands is the people that need improvements by 50 percent just by changing the three things you talked about. There you go. And then also like what I said earlier, what it's a healthy veggie. Yeah. A lot of people don't even know what a healthy veggie, a healthy carb is or like portion control. Sure. You know, it's like sometimes we eat the right foods, but we're eating way too much. Right? So it goes back to what you're saying, the fundamentals.

And that's what my whole mission is. My whole business is built off of the fundamentals. That's what athletes master. But then you have other athletes that may come in a locker room, right? Because like that, there was only three or four of us on that plan. Everybody else was eating the stuff was in the cafeteria, which was the healthy. Everything else. Well, I don't know about healthy in the locker rooms.

In the hospitals, we serve the worst foods, burgers, chicken wings. And I'm like, what do we, like, this is a hospital. Like, we're supposed to be training the good habits. And yet it's the worst.