The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Begin With WE: 10 Principles for Building and Sustaining a Culture of Excellence by Kyle McDowell

Episode Date: December 25, 2023

Begin With WE: 10 Principles for Building and Sustaining a Culture of Excellence by Kyle McDowell https://amzn.to/4aBu4KP Kylemcdowellinc.com Toxic work culture? Do words like apathetic, disengaged, insecure, and afraid describe how you feel about your role or even your organization? Former Fortune 10 senior executive turned author and inspirational speaker Kyle McDowell has found the cure to rid the corporate world of its dysfunctional ways. In Begin With WE, McDowell examines the root causes of dysfunction in business, highlighting the plague of a “me-oriented” paradigm, and provides the remedy with his framework, The 10 WEs. These guiding principles are the cornerstone of Kyle’s leadership philosophy and establish the foundation required for a Culture of Excellence. Kyle’s inside-out approach cultivates courageous “WE-oriented” leaders who recognize the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. McDowell's approach has been adopted by thousands. The 10 WEs have reignited lost passion for leaders and also provided a framework for a life with greater impact and fulfillment. "McDowell has created a framework that allows everyone on the team to deliver their best work. His candid approach is refreshing and speaks to the hearts and minds of all leaders." - Harry Kraemer, Professor of Leadership at the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern "Begin With WE cracks the code for leaders to deliver excellence. McDowell's guiding principles apply from the ballpark to the office park." - Kevin Kiermaier, MLB Outfielder, Three-time Gold Glove Award winner, One-time Platinum Glove Award Winner "Begin With WE made me a better leader and McDowell's principles have not only changed how I lead, they've also had a tremendous impact on how I'm raising my children." - Sr. Executive in the Automotive industry Transform apathy into optimism and fear into fulfillment with this real-world guide for creating authentic leaders and higher-performing teams. About the author A former senior executive at multiple Fortune 10 firms, Kyle McDowell is an author, inspirational speaker, and leadership coach with nearly three decades of experience leading tens of thousands of employees at some of the biggest companies in the world. With an MBA from the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University, Kyle is widely known for his inspiring approaches to transforming bosses into leaders and reshaping corporate cultures.

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big 130,000 LinkedIn group. Chris Voss won on Tickety-Tockety and chr voss the linkedin newsletter the big 130 000 linkedin group chris was one on tickety-tockety and chris voss facebook.com our amazing author today is kyle mcdowell he is the author of the latest book to come out september 7 2022 begin with we 10 principles for building and sustaining a culture of excellence as you guys know we talk a lot about culture on the show and the importance of it especially if you're an entrepreneur or leader in your company and laying the foundation for developing a new culture because if you don't if you don't if you're if you're not the builder of it the curator of it the one who makes it happen it will make itself and you'll have a very disruptive culture i'm sure you if you don't mind if you're not mindful of it for nearly three decades former senior executive turned best-selling author speaker

and leadership coach kyle mcdowell amassed an impressive track record of delivering superior results while also cultivating authentic leaders and driving cultural change prior to exiting corporate america he has led tens of thousands of employees at some of the biggest companies in the country in his wall street journal and usa today bestseller begin with we he examines the root causes of dysfunction in business highlighting the plague of a me oriented paradigm and provides the remedy with his framework the 10 wheezeze. 10 wheeze, I think that's what I call my 10 personalities. Today, McDowell is regularly invited to speak at business, education, and non-profit institutions events and has been featured in major national publications such as the Wall Street Journal,

Forbes, and Inc. Magazine. Welcome to the show. How are you, Kyle? Hey, Chris. Man, I'm well. What an intro. Thanks for'm well. What an intro. Thanks for having me. What an intro. I'm offering a new service website where people pay me to go around and announce them. Here you, here you. There you go. Give us your.com so people can find you on

the interwebs. Yeah, my man, kylemcdowellinc.com. And by the way, it's the same for all my social handles, kylemcdowell Inc. There you go. Find him anywhere. So give us a 30,000 overview of the book. Begin with we. Yeah, so I guess for some context, I spent nearly 30 years in corporate America. And you touched on that in my intro. And man, probably around year 20-ish, I felt an overwhelming sense of apathy. And I realized I wasn't alone.

And it was about 2017, I was asked to take on a role leading 15,000 people. And I think at the time it was the world's largest healthcare enrollment operation, as well as call center in that same kind of vein, right? So we did enrollments for the Affordable Care Act of 1-800-Medicare. Oh, wow. Chris, when I took that role, man man i knew i needed to lead in a way that i had never been led before i knew i needed to reach the team and and kind of galvanize them in a way that would be memorable but also transform the organization deliver better results and the night before i was to meet with the top leaders of that organization i penned these 10 principles. I had

no idea at the time what they would become, how strongly they would resonate with so many people. And the principles are essentially the rules that govern how we treat each other. First, I'm really a big believer that if we are high functioning behind the scenes, behind the curtain, we are so much better positioned to deliver really fantastic results externally. So I rolled these principles out and several years later, they are still a cultural manifesto for that organization. And I've been lucky enough to evangelize and implement these principles at numerous organizations around the country. And that's how the book came about. And I've spent the last year and a half continuing

to promote and evangelize the books, myself on stage regularly, espousing and speaking the benefits of principle-based leadership and namely the 10 weeks. There you go. So let's do a tease. Well, before that, let's get into your background in history, your hero's journey. Let's get to know you a little bit better and then we'll get into the book. Tell us how you were raised, what got you down this road and into the fields you have and developing what you've done.

Yeah, man, I would describe my childhood as middle class. And that's probably generous. We didn't come from a whole lot, very rural area. I grew up in the strawberry capital of the world. And that's right in Plant City, Florida. I'm a big fan of the Strawberry Festival, by the way. There you go. Strawberries are good for you.

Right on, man. But my parents were both very, very hard workers. My dad is a good one. I just knew anytime I needed or wanted anything in life, they taught me very early. It was probably going to require some effort. So I worked. I started my first job was 15 years old, bagging groceries. My first entry into corporate America was right around the age of 18. As a matter of fact, I applied for a role at a local bank in Tampa when I was 17. And I rolled the dice that my interview and an offer would come after my 18th birthday.

And it worked out. And I started off in a very small cubicle and just managed to work my way through bigger and bigger roles, bigger and greater spheres of influence. And then ultimately, as you mentioned in the intro, my last couple of stops in corporate America, I led collectively over 30,000 people at two Fortune 5 companies. Nice. I got a lot of experience in big organizations,

and it's kind of what fueled the book. There you go. I love that you started out early bagging groceries. That's how I actually started stocking, then I moved to bagging groceries because they wouldn't let us do the bagging front work. There was like an age limit, and I think it was like 12 or 13 or 14 when I started.

You couldn't do the bagging front end. People couldn't see you until you were like 16. So if I think for two years I did the stock, it's a stocking thing. And then eventually I talked about this in my book. I worked my way up to being a manager of, of the, the,

the, the baggers and, and all that stuff. And that's when I got real power and I became a malignant narcissist and evil and something like that. Yeah, too. There you go.

So let's talk about these 10 wheeze. Who are these 10 wheeze? And are they in my head? Is that the ones that they're always talking to me or is this different? They might be. I hope they are actually. Oh, there's one that says kill,

kill, kill. The judge says I can't use anymore. And I get one of the ankle bracelets off next week for that. So it should be good. Just one though. Only one. Well, there's one that says kill, kill, kill. The judge says I can't use anymore. And I get one of the ankle bracelets off next week for that. So it should be good. Just one though. Only one? Well, there's a stack. is a fundamental truth. It's something we hold to be true. It's our series of beliefs. And not to be confused, by the way, with values or mission statements inside of an organization,

because those are wonderful for communicating externally who we are. They tell the public who we are, what we stand for, and who you're doing business with, essentially. But the principles are our fundamental truths. They are how we deliver and how they enable the principles,

the values, the values rather, and the mission statements of an organization. And have you heard them? Yeah, I'm sure you've heard them. But what I'm guessing is you've never heard them in a kind of contiguous manner because they grow from one to the next

and they kind of form almost a moat, if you will. So we're in the castle and these principles circle us in this moat and they prepare us and arm us for both adversity and good times. But what I think is unique about these principles is when lived conspicuously, when they become part of the daily vernacular of the organization, the organization becomes, the team becomes impenetrable. Why? Because we have subscribed to all of these same fundamental beliefs. Have you heard of them? Absolutely. The number one is we do the right

thing. We number one is we do the right thing always. Seems so simple, right? But it's not so simple because the right thing can mean different things to different people. And there's the book goes deep into how you land on what the right thing is. And then they kind of go through, almost matriculate all the way through to the very last one is we obsess over details. But the beauty of these principles, my man, is when the team subscribes to them, it removes all ambiguity of how we behave, how we treat one another. For example, one of my favorites is we say what we're going to do and then we do it. It's number three, right? If you're going to make a commitment to someone else on this team, you must deliver on that.

There you go. If you have to deliver externally, we damn well have to do it internally. So it's kind of the rules of the road that govern how we treat one another first and foremost. There you go. And a lot of people, do you find in your research and your, you know, polling and the coaching you do and stuff, what percentage of leaders would you say in your evaluation and research actually have sat down when they create a company. Maybe they don't need to improve the culture that they have, but there is kind of a signature that I think you have to do as your personality,

that fits your personality and what you want to deliver. And there's always ways to tweak stuff. I can see sometimes where maybe, I don't know, if you follow Jack Welch or something, maybe you want to keep what's going on or Lee Iacocca. But what percentage of leaders do you find are intentional about setting that standard up front rather than trying to chase and fix maybe what they broke? Almost none. What the fuck? I was going to guess 20%. Wow.

Wow. Almost none. I feel like Chris is so powerful because when we align around the principles first, like out of the gate, it's the first thing every leader should do, whether they're taking on the new role or whether they've had someone new move to their team is to establish expectations. I think what most bosses do is they establish the expectations around the kpis the fundamental success criteria of a role they don't set the standards and expectations for how we treat one another they don't they don't establish guard rails for how

we're supposed to behave to and with one another so i i think the number is very very low at least i know the first 20 plus years of my career, I focused only on the results. I didn't focus on how we got there, which is the biggest thing in my career. There you go. Yeah. That's really interesting. Almost zero. Wow.

I would say almost zero. And if they do, they're not formal enough to where the team member can repeat them over and over again. It's a one and done type thing. Yeah. And I imagine some, a lot of us that are entrepreneurs, the team member can repeat them over and over again. Like it's a one, one and done type thing. Yeah. Yeah. And I imagine some, you know, a lot of us that are entrepreneurs or urban CEOs,

we, we kind of have a toolbox and it's kind of subconscious, or at least I think we do that. I do. And I seem to find people that do sometimes it's harder for me to dig it out of them. Like you have a toolbox you're using. You just,

do you know what it is? No, I don't know. I do. I'm like, what type of leader? Yeah. I don't know. Just what it is? And they're like, I have no idea. I'm like, what type of leader? Yeah, I don't know. It seems to work for me.

I built million-dollar companies. Well, you know, it's not that hard, really, after a while. I mean, it is, but it isn't. There's like a machine to it once you learn. It's a muscle memory. Yeah, it's a muscle memory. And I think that's what most people, leaders, are running on is a muscle memory, you know, kind of what got them there.

But not every situation of your muscle memory and your toolbox, you know, can be applicable. I've certainly gone into businesses or, you know, sometimes you have catastrophes or challenges or cathartic times or business models, you know, change on you in a heartbeat. And yeah, you still fall back on them, but you always have to be constantly improving and growing so um there there you go but yeah being intentional in culture i i was lucky enough and i've talked i'm sure the audience is like he's gonna say it again but one of my early influences i studied to be a ceo and so i studied harvard business review i studied tom peters read a lot of tom peters druck's books, just everything I could on business to try and prepare myself for being a CEO someday of a major company. And so I spent a lot of time preparing. And Peter Singe's book, The Fifth Discipline, influenced me a lot in his workbook because I wanted to create a learning organization.

And I saw the value of that and I learned about culture and why it was important but I didn't have the guidebook that you've espoused in your book where you've really put it together in detail I would have loved to have it why didn't you write this book like 35 years ago dude where were you man I needed you um and so and so you know I know, I had a couple tidbits. I don't even know if they made your list, but I have a couple tidbits that, you know, I used in my toolbox. But, you know, building that learning organization and it's different things. But I was intentional with culture.

Every company I built from the moment it launched and the environment that we tried to do, I tried to be intentional and direct and curate. Curate is probably the best word, that culture, and incubate it so that it would continue. And I tried to set that stone, and I was looking to have partners that were supportive in that, in that they would match my lead and we could march in unison. And so that's really important. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs don't think about that. A lot of CEOs don't think about that when they go in unison. And so that's really important. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs don't think

about that. A lot of CEOs don't think about that when they go in to companies. And number one, if you take over a company or you come over into a CEO position and you're replacing a prior CEO, you've got to be aware of the culture you're moving into. And was it toxic? What are some ways you can evaluate a toxic culture versus a healthy culture? Yeah, I love that question. And it's rarely asked. You have to ask, right? You have to ask. You have to get close to the people that actually do the work, right? I think too many times, especially in big organizations, the more senior you become, the more disconnected you become from those that actually perform the

work. So now I'm not naive either. I know that a lot of times if a leader in an organization or someone with a fancy title asks, hey, what's broken? We're probably not going to get the most open and forthright answers. So we got to do anonymous surveys. We have to do skip level meetings where I meet with not just the people that report to me, but the people that report to them as well. You've got to create an environment where people feel comfortable to raise their hand to say when something's broken, got to be comfortable to raise their hand when they've made a mistake. Sometimes these signs are obvious and you can judge that by the turnover they have, the hard time they have or the difficulty they have attracting new candidates.

So a variety of ways, but it starts with asking the question the way that you frame it. There you go. And, and being mindful of it. And it's so important to hit that ground with the first foot because trying to fix a broken culture or I think even worse. So I'll put this up to see if you agree with me or disagree with me, but even worse than moving into a broken culture,

there are things that you can do to say, this is a new moment. This is a sea change that we're happening. And you can announce that as a leader and go, I realize that things are broken. I realize that you're unhappy. I realize maybe you didn't trust the prior management, but from here on out, you have my word.

I think we talked, somebody recently, I think last week came on and talked about an example of a, of a leader who did that and said, you know, we can spend a year trying to figure out whether you trust me or not, or whether I trust you. And,

you know, this has been a culture of distrust that in the prior management, but here's the, here's my commitment to you. I will trust you if you will trust me we don't have a year to figure this out we've got a very short window of time to save this company so we we can we can go for with this or we can spend a year mucking around about it and i'm willing to put my money on the table and lead and i think that's really

important i think i think the question I'm asking for you for though, is it's harder to fix it. If you were the one who broke it, if you've slacked or, or, or if you've abdicated the lead or abdicated your culture and haven't really thought about it and it's become toxic, it's really harder for you to fix it, which is probably why they replace CEOs as often as they do,

because trying to rebuild trust, trying to rebuild the culture, trying to get people to believe in you again and follow and lead you, it's a lot harder to do than from your entry point. What do you think? Amen. Well, you said one word in there that really sticks out to me, and it is the driving factor in, by the way, I love this scenario. The example you mentioned, I guess you had a guest who said,

we don't have time for this. Here's how I'm going to operate and here's how I expect you to operate. Let's hold each other accountable. Almost identical approach that I took when I created the 10 We's. And I was new to the organization, so it is easier if you're new, bringing new perspective. But the word that you mentioned that is so important in both the person who

created the issue, who is trying to solve it, as well as the new leader and that's trust. So if you're the guy or the gal that put the culture in the proverbial toilet, you've got an uphill climb, man, because

you are, in large part, at least by some people's account, you're the one that created this. So they don't trust you. Where on the other hand, if you do introduce, if you say, listen, today's a new day, we're going to behave differently. The challenge is, and I think a lot of people, I know a lot of bosses love the idea of walking in and snapping the talk line saying here's who we are here's how we're going to behave now in the very same day they behave exactly the way they did before not inspiring trust right they try and lead by they try and lead by pr and hypocrisy so yeah they'll put out the pr statement be like oh yeah we're gonna lead and do all these great things and then and we're gonna be moral and ethical and trustworthy. And then, you know, right away, they're like off to the races with whatever.

And then it's obvious. Yeah. And everyone in their employees are like, you're full of shit. As George Conway used to, or George Carlin used to put it in his famous, you know, you're full of shit bit. And I think that's important, but a culture, God, I'm really surprised. That's going to haunt me. I'm going to be up at night thinking about what you said that most leaders don't do culture.

I want to know who that was. He's a wise person. Very wise person who did that. The culture, the fact that most people aren't intentional in culture is just astounding to me. I mean, I would at least guess 5% to 20%, but that really makes sense. Actually, I look at a lot of companies nowadays. I mean, I think about it this way. When there is a management or leadership position open, we almost always hire the person who is really good at the function that they will assume managing.

Right. So you take a team of 10 that has an opening for their leader. You're going to look at the results of those 10 people. Who is the biggest or the best performer, right? We don't, or rarely anyway, do we assess leadership acumen? Do we assess someone's ability to motivate, handle conflict, inspire those around them? We don't test for those things. We don't, rarely do we even talk about those things in the interview process.

And when the person reaches, someone gets promoted into the role, they struggle, they don't do well. And then, you know, it ends poorly, but we never,

rarely does the organization take a step back and say, what could we have done differently to arm this person to be the best that they could be right out of the gate. And that involves training and involves, you know, a mentor, perhaps coach, whatever, but making an inconspicuous about it, right. Being purposeful,

as you say, is absolutely essential. You know, you bring a good point. You mentioned there that we don't really look at leadership on hiring and all that other stuff. Hopefully people look at it when it comes to promoting, but maybe not, you know, it's, it not. I've been guilty of promoting people that were maybe the best salesmen and they don't turn out to be good managers because they're great salesmen. The jobs are two different things and mindsets. But yeah, I mean, when you look at today's recruiting process, correct me if I'm wrong, you might have more experience. I don't have my finger on the pulse of recruiters,

but it seems like most of the recruiting is really looking for people correct me if I'm wrong, you might have more experience. I don't have my finger on the pulse of recruiters. But it seems like most of the recruiting is really, you know, looking for people that, you know, can do the job, follow the rules, stay in color within the lines. You know, they don't really hire for people that color outside the lines, think independently and stuff. You're kind of, it's very rudimentary. I'm thinking of, I always have this image that comes to mind of the pink floyd song another brick in the wall where they

have the video of the kids marching through the manufacturing facility and and so it seems like that's kind of a lot what people want and yet we hear from the other end at least from you know authors i have on a brilliant discussions we have like this one is, you know, oh, you need to, you need to have servant leadership. You need to make people underneath you leaders yet. We don't hire for those people. It's kind of an interesting economy when you really think about it. Well, and I think it's even worse, Chris, in that there is this love that I love the image that you just brought up with the video, because the same thing happens in management and leadership positions, right? So let's use the same scenario.

I've got a team of 10. The incumbent boss has gone on to some other place. So we have an opening, right? So let's hire the best performer out of these 10. They're now a leader. Well, they are most likely to behave in a way that is completely consistent with the person who just left or that person's boss. In other words, they're going to replicate and repeat the same, in many cases, shitty behavior, bad leadership, more about me than about us, the team, because that's all they know. That's all they've seen. And by the way, they must endear themselves to the person that is making that hiring decision. So the best way to do that is to pay it forward the same

garbage leadership that they've observed. So then what happens? That person is now in a position to where they're going to have to make a hiring decision. What are they going to do? They're probably going to hire the person that most replicates their tendencies, which were exactly the same as the person before them. So in other words, there's this domino effect. And so it goes. The cycle repeats until someone, you alluded to this, until someone says, enough. That's not how we're going to be.

That's not who we are. It takes courage to do that, especially in an organization that's got the cultural kind of malaise or toxicity so deeply ingrained in the DNA. Somebody has to be the one to take the risk to lead differently. There you go. You know, we've talked so much about servant leadership. Servant leadership seems to be talked about more than anything else lately. I think it's been around for a lot of years. But I think COVID and remote working and the fact that a lot of the, you know,

baby boomers and Gen Xs retired early from the working force. And now we have a very limited working force that everyone's fighting over and it's not going to change anytime soon. And they realize that, and they're, they're demanding to have better leadership or they're going to go someplace where they can have it. People, people quit over leaders. They really do. I mean, they'll work, they'll work jobs that maybe they don't like as much as long as they got good do. I mean, they'll work, they'll work jobs that maybe they don't like as much as long as they got a good leadership and they feel like

they're contributing and they feel like they're getting value from it. But if, if your leadership is crappy and depressing and demoralizing, they're, they're going to leave and they can. No, I mean, I think I just read that, God, it's probably somewhere on my LinkedIn, but I think I just read that 32 or 25 stays, don't quote me on it, people, just Google it. But like there's massive states that are almost doubling the minimum wage loss that they had on the books, which is going to be, you know, a major impact to business. But most businesses are already there now. I mean, I remember before COVID, we were all arguing that if we went to 15 bucks an hour, you know, everyone go bankrupt or something, the economy would crash. And now I see people begging and pleading for 20 and 25 bucks an hour to work

at McDonald's and, and you're just like, well, okay, I guess, you know, demand is here, but yeah, being intentional about your culture is is everything you know having a culture that can learn having a culture that can make mistakes having a culture you know like one of the things we always have in our in our it's like a rule we should have it mounted on a wall really come to think of it but you know i said it so much it was ad nauseum in my office and it was the rule that the only stupid question is the unasked question. So ask questions.

It's okay to say you're wrong. It's okay to say you have an error. It's okay to not understand something. Just please let us know. Ask questions. Let us fill it in. Because the person who doesn't know, they're the ones who's going to cost me a small fortune and some sort of mistake they're going to muck up.

And I'm going to have to clean it up as a CEO and talk to whoever they pissed off. And, well, I'm good at fixing those problems. I really don't want to be that good. Right. It's unfortunate you have to be good at it. But, you know, you said something a moment ago, Chris, that really got my attention and I think it really puts a fine point on why not only the book is needed, but people should be more purposeful in how they approach leadership. And that is now more than ever, organizations are fighting for a smaller number of people. Not that the total universe

of people looking for jobs has shrunk. They have more options than ever. So you made a comment earlier that I think was really, really kind of, it's relevant to where we are now. And that is, you know, we have muscle memory. We can lean back on skills from the past. We can, you know, the same recipe might work. I don't think that's true in leadership any longer because the workforce has changed because the proliferation of work at home is is what it is right you can work in a different hemisphere now which i think requires leaders today well let me back up in the past i think for decades if not centuries the organizations were always in the driver's seat and their employees had to conform to their way of doing things

yeah that's not necessarily wrong but it's very different than today. Today, as you mentioned, if I don't get what I like or what I want that's going to help me be my best in this role, I'm going down the street or I'm going to go home and work from home at a place that's in another state. So those options, they really, really have required leaders to level up and be better than they were yesterday, or else they're going to lose those teams, and the team will lose those individuals,

and those teams will lose. I think it's a very different paradigm now. Yeah, it's really game-changing. In fact, the other aspect of it is, I believe it was in the New York Times or the Washington Post, but basically the baby boomers and Gen Xers who left early over COVID, they're like, fuck it, we're out of here. We're just going to retire early.

They are leaving every day with such a knowledge base and an acumen of business that they've acquired over decades, and they are not being replaced, partially because the new generations are smaller than the baby boomers. And what they documented in the Washington Post and New York Times article was that for every seven journeymen, these super experts in the field that are leaving and retiring early, there's only one person to replace them,

and those people are usually novices and beginners. So we're not only losing employees and valuable, knowledgeable people in the employment market, but also the people that are coming up don't have that knowledge and skill base. And so it's

going to end pretty crazy. I mean, we have doctors on the show that said we're running into a doctor's glut. You see that right now with pilots and air traffic controllers where the demand is so insane and they don't have enough to fill stuff. And it's going to get worse. And if you think paying for a plumber now is expensive, have fun with that. You better learn plumbing. Note to self. So there you go.

What are some aspects about your book that we should tease out as well? And then we want to talk about what you offer on your website for coaching and et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, man, I think at the end of the day, the book and the principles are fuel for change. We've got to choose to be different. We've got to choose that the tired, old, dysfunctional, toxic environments that so many of us have been a part of, hell, I admit, I even helped create some of those, not without ignorance and ego. We've got to recognize there is a better way. I've lived it. I've seen it. By the way, it's probably worth noting the organization in which that these principles were created.

We went on an unprecedented run of success and I'm lucky enough to still be in touch with many people from that organization. And they tell me the impact is still there. The principles are still their manifesto. And I've been able to evangelize them elsewhere since then so i think it's you know it's it's the book is very different in many ways first of all i wrote it in in people speak i wrote it how humans actually talk right i mean think about it we have two different vocabularies we have our work vocabulary and then we come home and speak very differently when's the last time you came home and said hey honey did you get those deliverables taken care of we had some action items from our conversation right we don't even talk that way

so we have two different dialogue two different vernaculars so that would be funny to go home and talk to the wife in buzzwords from this how's wrong with you chris i'd hate to see that sitcom that'd be the reaction right so it's written in a way, and it was intentional, right? It's written in a way that is normal, right? And then also it is written from real experience. I think that's where my book is very different than many others in the space. I'm not an academic. These aren't hypothetical things.

These are real-life applications that I have used to drive big transformation in teams. But the unintended byproduct that I'm so proud to talk about and realize today is the impact these principles have had on my personal life. And Chris, there's not a week that goes by that I don't have a complete stranger who has bought and read the book that says the principles have had an impact in areas that they didn't anticipate. My favorite example is hearing how it impacts how they raise their children. Because again, if you want to establish expectations, fundamental truth, the system of beliefs principle is the way to do it. So I think there's something in it for everyone, but especially and only for those that are looking for a change.

Ah, there you go. So let's get into what you offer on your website at kylemcdowling.com. Yeah, so since the book came out, and I think you mentioned it at the top, within week two, it hit the Wall Street Journal and USA Today bestseller list. It was number one in nine categories on Amazon. So the bulk of my time is now evangelizing the principles on stage. So whether it be a trade show, a conference, some type of workshop or individual organizations that have asked to make or are interested in making change. I do a lot of, a lot of stage work, evangelizing the principles in the book and my experiences with them.

And then I just fill in the rest of my time with executive coaching. So I stayed very, very busy with both of those. I'm a lucky guy to be able to, to, to kind of evangelize this stuff because I know it works and I know the impact it's had, not just on me and so many others. And it is a, if you want more fulfillment and you want to have a greater impact, that's where I can help. There you go. So final thoughts to pitch out to people to get the book and order up your services on board, reach out to you as we go out.

Like I said, if you want to be, if you want, if you want the same old, same old out of your professional life, if you want to, at least the way I did, experience apathy in a way that just really, really was not a fun experience. I didn't want to get out of bed and go to work. I didn't want to. I just didn't have the get up and go that I had earlier in my career. There is another way. There's a better way. And you can find that way.

And I think begin with we lays that out in a pretty straightforward fashion, whether you want to be the leader you never had, or whether you want to be a part of a team that operates more, more and better in terms of higher functioning. I think that's, that's the approach. And, you know, I gave this my social handles as well. I love hearing from, from followers and I love helping people with problems. So if there's anything I can do on that front, use those Kyle McDowell Inc. social handles. I'm here. There you go. It's been a great show, man, to have you on the show, Kyle.

I really appreciate it. Great discussion. And like I said, you're going to haunt me in my nights about how these guys, I'm just surprised at how small it is. But in thinking about it, I really shouldn't be. You know, I see very few CEOs, especially at the corporate levels of Fortune 100 companies, that, I don't know, there doesn't seem to be any intent there. They're just, sometimes they're just rolling through whatever. Yeah.

We assume whoever you hire brings the leadership chops that you need, and that's not, it's rarely the case. There you go. So thank you for coming on the show, Kyle. We really it it's my pleasure chris great great to be here thank you order up the book folks wherever fine books are sold stay away those dirty alleyway places you might need a tetanus shot or get mugged go to those bookstores and order up begin with we 10 principles for building and sustaining a culture of excellence. And please, people, curate your culture and be intentional. Jesus, holy mother of God, put a tattoo on yourself on it if you're a leader. I mean, it's everything.

I think, would you say it's everything? It's foundational? It is everything. Hey, you can focus on results and you might be successful. Focus on the people, results come, you will focus on results and you might be successful. Focus on the people. Results come, you will be successful. There you go. But you need a good foundation because I think all of it's a package

deal. Thanks to Kyle for coming on the show. Thanks, Ron, for tuning in. As always, refer the show to your family, friends, relatives. Give us those five-star reviews on iTunes that we love so much. Goodreads.com, Fortress Chris Voss, LinkedIn.com, Fortress Chris Voss, the big LinkedIn newsletter, 130,000 LinkedIn group, Chris Voss, Facebook.com, Fortress Chris Voss, the big LinkedIn newsletter, 130,000 LinkedIn group, Chris Voss, Facebook.com

and Chris Voss 1 on the tickety-tockety where the kids play. Thanks for tuning in. Be good to each other. Stay safe and we'll see you next time. That should sound great.