The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Eat or Be Eaten by Dr Rick Bein

Episode Date: October 17, 2025

Eat or Be Eaten by Dr Rick Bein Rickbein.com https://www.amazon.com/Eat-Be-Eaten-Rick-Bein/dp/1963718011 The issue of food can be interpreted in two ways. As a geographical agriculturist, I have focused on food production around the world, but also on being faced with predatory action. These stories relate such events in my life. Some are humorous and some are educational. my Peace Corps experience provided the spark that led to this series of adventures and observations. Farming strategies vary tremendously around the world, from my home farm in Colorado to those in Brazil, Sudan, Papua New Guinea, Mozambique. The picture depicts a Sudanese feast, where various food items are laid on an outstretched tablecloth on the ground to serve men dressed in formal attire. Only the men are eating and when they are sated the women come to eat what is left over. Notice the only the right hands are touching the food. The left hand is considered foul and would contaminate the food.

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Because you're about to go on a moment. monster education roller coaster with your brain. Now, here's your host, Chris Voss. Hey, gentlemen, the iron lady sings and that makes official welcome the big show. As always, the Chris Vos show is a family that loves you, but doesn't judge you as harshly as the rest of your family and all that good stuff. Opinions expressed by guests on the podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of the host or the Chris Voss show.

Some guests of the show may be advertising on the podcast, but it's not an endorsement or a review of any kind. Today, we have an amazing young man on the show. We're talking about our insights and everything else, and his book called Eat or Be Eaton out August 20th, 20th, 24. Rick, give us your dot-coms. Where can people find you on the interwebs? Just Rick Bine.

It's just one way to get there. And then people do that. I don't actually know the exactal. Okay. So people that are look for a link on the Chris Foss show. And you can look that. Also, I have a, you can Google, Traveling Farmer.

It's another website that I have. so traveling farmer is that traveling farmer dot com or no just traveling farmer and when you come up if you google it it comes up it's okay but there's also within that is a eater be eaten uh eat or be eaten what dot com no i don't know okay all right maybe don't maybe forget about that traveling farmer just yeah so what we'll do is we'll have a link on the chris voss show post that people can find there to be able to look for that, or you can search for Eat or be eaten out August 20th, 20, 24. Rick, give us a 30,000 overview. What's the side of your new book?

What's the side of what it's about? Yes. Okay. Eater Eaton is about different kinds of foods that I've eaten around the world. I've traveled to many countries. I've lived 12 years in the tropical world, and I have recorded a lot of the, with photographs, all of the, Many people where they eat, this sort of thing, and stories about that. And then I've also got times when I was almost eaten. So it was eat, whatever we're going to eat, and then eaten. I was almost eaten a few times. Yeah.

Have I eaten by tigers or lions or bears? One was a lion. That sounds like a great story. And then the other was piranhas. Oh, piranus. And then another another was a wolf. And there's some other things where it's eaten by a botfly. Actually, it lays an egg in you.

You have to get rid of it. Oh, wow. That doesn't sound fun. That sounds like my first 10 marriages. Anyway, so let's get into some of the details here of the book. What prompted you want to write this? What was your motivation behind it? I had these stories.

And I've been telling them for years. And people said, you ought to write those down. And so I did. And pretty soon I had a lot of stories together. And so let's, and I said, let's just make it in a book. So that's what I did. And, you know, it says you're a doctor here. Tell us about what sort of degrees do you work in,

schooling have you had? And what got you into this adventure that you had that you talked about in the book? I'm a, I'm a geographer. I work through the Indiana University at the Indianapolis campus, and I've been there 45 years. Actually, I'm a professor of mayor at us at the moment, so I am a professor, full professor. I did my degrees at the University of Colorado with a bachelor's degree, and then I did my master's and PhD at the University of Florida. So then I went and worked in other countries. What was the draw for you to go to other countries?

been in the Peace Corps early on and before I had finished college. I was in Brazil and I had a wonderful experience and it sort of taught me something that I can go anywhere in the world as long as they're not shooting. There are some places in Africa where you can get shot at. That's right. Yeah. That's right. Or like Sudan. I wouldn't want to go back there right now. Yeah. Where were you in Africa, mostly, I guess, during this time? I spent five years in Africa. The first time was in the Sudan. That was my first job after graduate school. And I was teaching at the University of Khartoum. And Khartoum is where the Blue Niles come together and form the main Nile. Denial. That's a river in Egypt, right?

Well, yeah. Well, there's no D-U on it. But anyway, it starts way down in Lake Victoria, down on the equator, and it runs all the way north. That's the white Nile, and the blue Nile comes in from Ethiopia. It joins in Khartoum, and that's where the university was. But it goes all the way up through the Sahara Desert. And so give us some stories out of the book that we can tease out to people on some of your adventures. I can talk about some of the ones that sound more gripping are those when I was almost eaten. Oh, sure, yeah.

I mean, people love good eating stories. Yeah, well, when I was almost, anyway, this was a story when I was in the Peace Corps. We were, I was in a village, interior Brazil, way back up against the Bolivian border, and a bunch of a frontier kind of zone. And they were moving this family out onto this big swamp. They wanted to be there before the rainy season started. We had a big truck loaded up with furniture and everything. People were riding on top of all of that. And somebody found a big bottle of Rodgut alcohol, Brazilian rum,

called it Kashasa. And so they got passed around, and the driver got too much of it, ran off the road, and we had to push it back on. And each time we did, we got a little dirtier and dirtier. We finally got to a destination. and there was a nice little oxbow off the main river over there and we thought that looked pretty clean, looked nice to get in and clean out.

The Brazilians did. They jumped in and got wet, got out and soaped up, jumped in and got the soap off. And this other American and I, we were in the water. We got in and just enjoyed it. And they're scrubbing in there and hanging out in there. And we came walking out of the, as we came walking, finally came walking out.

This little old man came walking by and said, you were lucky this time but men don't swim with piranha without a swimming suit oh boy so that was a very sobering moment that's over you up right that's for sure and then as we went that evening they had us uh at the at the at the ranch house we talked talked a lot of them they started telling stories about piranhas and that was really and nerving as well and that night i couldn't sleep i was hanging it was in the hammock with my knees up to my chest and just sort of hardly sleeping at all. And then the next day we went fishing right where we had been swimming. All right.

We took our bath and we pulled in dozens of piranha just like that. Really? Yeah. There's a real knack to catching piranha though. That's another whole story. Okay. It's probably, hopefully you had some swim trunks on when you were, when you're bathing with the piranha because, you know,

you don't want you have any bait out there for them to grab a hole up. That's right. Well, as it turns out, that I didn't have any swimming trucks on this. Oh! They said, men don't swim with piranha without swimming suits on. Yeah, that's what I also say on Tinder. You know, they normally go after bloody things, and we were using calves liver for catching on hooks. But if you don't have any blood, and if they're not hungry, they'll probably leave you alone. But if you are, they might grab hold of some of the tender parts of the body. so that's why you don't want to have it.

That's why you want to have a swimming suit on. You want to save those tender parts from anything with teeth. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But anyway, it's the story goes on, and I remember, I've told that story so many times, but then I remember my son when he was six years old, heard this story. He says, Dad, you were really lucky when you were in that water with those fish. And I said, Alex, you were the lucky one. Yeah, because you wouldn't be here.

if you've gotten a hold of anything. I'm not sure what we're talking about. That's right. I think people can put the two together. So you had these adventures. In writing the book, what do you hope people come away with? What do you hope they gain? Well, they just gain some life experiences.

Somebody goes and lives in the tropics and different cultures and different places and how they live. And it's sort of an area, it's kind of a memoir, but it's also it's an adventure, adventure stories. And so going out and being out in the wild or whatever, talked about crazy things that I had to eat. Oh, really? I didn't know if I had to or not, but I often thought I did because I would insult my hosts. Oh, yeah. So things like termites and.

Termites. yeah yeah that's well i mean that's probably they eat a lot of woods so maybe that's good for fiber yeah well these are yeah that's right these are flying termites not like the ones we have that eat wood that makes it safer i'm sure yeah yeah i know it doesn't make that much dearest but they fly they they they what they do is they well they just have fly right in your mouth yeah they might no they don't do that but they do there's a big big it's a termite mound. As they dig a big hole in the ground, make a mound over the top of it, and they collect, anyway, they're babies in there, and periodically they swarm, and they come out

and what the locals do. Now, this is in what's called South Sudan right now, but it's all through East Africa that they do this, and they put a little depression in the ground, maybe three inches deep, kind of square hole, and when they put a candle in it, and when they swarm, them, they fly to the flame. And they burns their wings and they fall in the little pit. And then you go and collect them. And then they roast them. And then they roast them.

Yeah, they put them in a frying pan and turn them, turn them up, I guess, I don't you call it, but just fry them over and get them all crispy. And they're like, at that point, they're real crunchy. And I sort of like pretzels at this point. Okay. Okay. And they're like a half inch long. And so those are some of the things that they do with it. And then they have all kinds of other dishes they make out of it. So when I ate it, it was like, I didn't mean to eat it. I came into this village with one of my students. And he didn't warn me about this. It just sat down at a table. And they walked in there with this bowl, a big heaping bowl, you know, about 12 inches across the bowl with a big cone of roast. to termites sitting in it there.

They put it right in front of me. And I said, oh my, what do I do? And my student says, hey, just take a few off the top and put him in your mouth. Well, as soon as I did that, the whole tribe dove in to the termites. And it was such delight and such ecstasy in their faces. And they were enjoying these termites, unbelievably. And I just started watching them. I kind of forgot when I had something in my mouth.

I was going to spit it out. But I accidentally started chewing. And I discovered why they liked it then because it's salty. They were salty. And in the tropics, you don't have, most of the heavy rain in the tropical rainforest, the rain all washes all the salts out of everything. And the termites go down on the ground and pull out minerals and put them in there there. They like to eat them because they get some salt.

Otherwise, people are salt starved in these areas. So that was why they did it. That's pretty wild. That's pretty amazing. You know, I kind of like pretzels. You know, that's one of the reasons like pretzels. They're crunchy, they're salty. They don't really seem to do much for you.

Nutrition-wise. I mean, imagine there's some sort of nutrition in there somewhere. Some carbs. Get some carbs there. But, yeah, what an adventure story. And so, I mean, this is your life's journey. So it took you probably a lot of decades to write this book, I guess. Yeah, different times.

Yeah. Some of it's written way back several, you know, decades ago. But some very recent, as I remember these things and I put them together, I find my old notes. And since that's there. So the, it's pretty interesting in the life journeys that people go on and stuff. You know, people don't do the Peace Corps. used to anymore. And I think that a lot of, for a lot of Americans, I think

that has stunted their worldview or their understanding of the world outside of America or their societies and stuff. And I think that's kind of one of the problems where we're having issues with populism now is because people, you know, the racism and

xenophobia and the antisemitism that seems to be rising, that seems to be hitting the news every day in 2025 right now. And I think one of the problems is people just, they've never been out in the outside world. I remember I had been in the outside world and had been busy running my businesses for, let's see, probably 11, 12, 13 years. And then 9-11 hit. And it was kind of an awakening for me, as was for a lot of people. And it made me really question my politics and

my positions in life because I was like, wait, I thought everyone loved America. Why doesn't everyone loved America. And then I started trying to understand what was going on in the world and how the world worked. And then I started finding that there's some probably things, bad things America's done sometimes. We haven't always been what's right, but it doesn't mean you need to blow up our buildings and kill people. But, you know, it made me start realizing the world and spending more time thinking about the world. And I think people need that experience. They need to go live in other cultures and other environments. And also just to realize how good they have it here is a democracy or what once was there was democracy.

And so people need to do that more. What do you think about more people doing what you did with the Peace Corps? I think it was the best thing that ever happened to me. Totally opened my eyes to the world. And once I left there, I knew I could go anywhere in the world because people are people wherever you go. You just accept them as they are and love them and participate in what they do. And I say, I'll go anywhere as long as they're not. shooting. Did you have any of that experience when you were there? Well, not really. I came close one time. When I was in the Peace Corps, this one drunk that was in the one village, he thought we were communist. And we didn't know that. We didn't know Portuguese well enough

at that time to understand what he was saying. And so he pulled his pistol out of his pants and walked us down the street until I guess he was taking us to jail but we didn't get that far that we weren't always going to do he thought he was so drunk he might trip and accidentally shoot us or something anything going to happen

yeah finally some of the locals saw him and they stopped him probably knew he was the town drunk yeah yeah so it was interesting so he was trying to make a man's over after a while And I guess he never got over.

At one point, when I was getting ready to leave, the people told him I was leaving. I was going to take my revenge before I go. So I was having lunch in this restaurant. And as we had a colleague with me, it was actually a Brazilian colleague who I'd been working with for two years. We noticed this big crowd out in front of the restaurant there, an open-air restaurant. And we didn't, what was going on, but we looked at the far side, and there was this guy, he actually was a butcher. He was a town butcher, and he was sitting, he was standing over there, two pistols, one on each hip, sitting there watching me, and the crowd was jeering him, jarring him on. I guess they had sort of primed him that this might, and that I was coming and going to get in.

So they were, they were looking for some action. There's a little boring little town, and they're looking for the shootout between the butcher and the gringo. And, well, I didn't have a gun, and we never did. It's just that we just sat there and didn't pay any attention. We knew he's there, but we didn't give him attention. So finally, he walked around behind us, and the back start of the store, the restaurant, came in the back door, and then stood behind me for a while. I didn't want to move a hair. And so then he finally went on past this.

My colleague, oh, come on, have something to eat. No, no. He didn't want to do that. So he went on back across the street and took his post out there. So when we finally left, we went and drove away. Well, those are the adventures that you have over lifetime that you survive and you'll back on you go out of that mess. Yeah. So, I mean, in different kinds, you know, in Sudan, we survived a number of coup attempts.

really? Yeah, and they weren't, they weren't, didn't bother too much. It was usually the military going after politicians. And I was a professor there at the University of Khartoum. And really didn't, they didn't bother me there. They did, they closed the university when they had these two attempts because the students were the only place in the, in this country, they were allowed to protest to have a voice. That's interesting. Why did they have it, so where the students were the only ones allowed to protest? It's like Mao or something? Yeah, I don't know, maybe, but it was sort of like anybody could have that. Students were supposed to have their own, it must be an area of liberalism and being able to think and do different things and express your opinions. And so they did that, but they said, you've got to keep it on the campus. Oh, okay.

So they would always, sometimes would just go close the campus, so they lock the students in. So in writing the book, I mean, eat or be eaten, when I first heard the title, I thought it was like, I thought it was maybe a diet or menu book. Yeah, some people might think that, yeah. And frankly, it was put in a, and originally someone put it in a group of recipes, recipe books. But, no, it's definitely, there's recipes in there, but there are things like eating not only turn mice but drinking camel's milk and there's a number of animals milk yeah yeah that's what does that taste like well i did taste it but i shouldn't have we were we were traveling and

i was in with the faculty another faculty member from the university of cartoon and we were we went off into the sahel that's the area of the edge of the sahara desert and and there's people the nomads run their animals through there and camels and uh cattle and sheep. And these ran into a camel nomad there. He had his camels. They were grazing on the bushes. And we drove by there at Land Rover and he came running out and stopped us. And you got any water? Yeah. And he said, we got some water out of the big can and we had in the back. And he drank and another glass, another glass. You just about four glasses straight, just going on like he just hadn't had any for a while.

How long has it been since you had to water to drink? Six weeks. How did you survive for six weeks? How did you survive for six weeks? Well, he drank camel's milk. And the camels were getting their water out of these little, tiny little berries on these bushes. And they'd eat these fruit, the succulent leaves and the berries, and they would get that. That's how they made their, they got their water, essentially.

So in the process, the camel, the mother camel, made milk. So he would milk the camel and that's what he had to drink. And he had it in a little bag on his hip there and he showed it to me and I said, well, so I had to try it. And I didn't really drink it. I stuck my lip, just got it on my lips and it was so rancid. I didn't go any further than that. But as it turned out, I didn't, I got about, as it turned out, I had about two a few days there was I was not too comfortable. I mean,

I don't know, how does that work? Do you have to milk? I mean, do you have to keep that refrigerated when it comes out? No, no. He just kept it in his little bag. And he'd only take enough that he would need it. Well, it was, you know. Did you make sure that was from a female camel? Yeah, well,

yeah. Well, I can I doubt very much you'd get it from a male. Well, that would be something else if it came from a male. I think that's the joke. trying to pull here yeah yeah maybe some maybe another kind of liquid yeah that would explain the rancid taste that's all i know that's right well it got little ranc when he first would first milk or it'd be it'd be pretty good but he little he gets he put it in the bag and you stay there long enough maybe after a day yeah yeah yeah it seems like some you should put in the fridge

I mean, you have to put noral milk in the fridge. I think of both goat and cow. Yeah. Well, they wouldn't have any refrigerator around there. This is totally out in the barelands, you know. Yeah. Well, I suppose this would make it so that you can survive, you know, because, I mean, camels can store water for a long time,

and I guess that hump or whatever they have, they store water. Yeah. Yeah. So they can. Yeah. Yeah, so you could live in the desert. Maybe that's why camels are so cool for the desert, I guess. Yeah, yeah.

There's adaptation that works for them. Now, on your websites, I know there's one being built for you. We'll have a link to it on the Chris Voss show. And then there was the other aforementioned website you mentioned for traveling. Do you do any speaking or consulting or go around and telling your stories, offer any services that way that we need to plug. Yeah, I do that. I've done a number of talks at different places, whatever. I was a, as a teacher, I gave a lot of these stories to my students. Yeah. So, and then I did, on the website, I went ahead and told these stories into a YouTube

channel. So I have a YouTube channel that I have about, oh, 20-some stories there. And some of them are the same as just these but there's 25 stories in what's eat or be eaten in my website there's about 40 30 stories but they in that let's call the youtube's site there's about 30 stories and there's some of the same some are different and there's since i've spoken and i'm speaking into it i was talking to a camera and they're there's there's there available on uh youtube to get it on YouTube, just Google my name, and YouTube, YouTube, my name, it'll come up. And then, so I got that, the regular YouTube that I have with the book company, something they made, they've put together, and I have those recorded in there as well. So there's, I'm trying to think what else I've got there. But I do give a lot of talks. All right. Sounds good. And do you want to give us an e? I think, do you want to give us an email, may you or people that reach out to you?

to have you come speak? Yeah, it's R-B-E-I-N. Okay. It's Rick B-N, but it's just goes R-B-E-I-N-R-B-E-I-N at I-U. Well, anything more we want to promote before we go out on the show, Rick? Well, I guess I can tell some more of the stories. If you want to give us, tell you what, give us one more quick story. Yeah, well...

We want people to buy the book and read it, but a few tease-outs are always good. Yeah, I've had that. I told you about the camels and termites, and I had another... One of the things I had was an interesting story was an anaconda. We came in contact with anacondas. It was about 20-foot-long snake, and these farmers had moved in there to this wooded area, and actually they came up the river. And they saw this clearing along the side of the river.

So we're looking for a place to start our farm. So they landed there and came in and started building their house out on the edge of this. There was a path going off into the forest. And they built our homestead along that path. As it turned out, the path was created by these peckeries, these little tiny wild pigs. They run in hordes of maybe 100 or so. And they're pretty dangerous because if they catch you in a forest, you'll become a skeleton in a great short time,

but sort of like the piranha, prana of the forest. But anyway, they began killing these piranhas, excuse me, the peckeries, because they were a nuisance. They kept breaking into the house and knocking things down, and so they started killing them little by little.

Then to come find out that path where they went down to the water was where they drank. Oh, wow. And there was this anaconda hiding under the water there would once a month as it, the peckers had come down every day to drink. Then once a month, anaconda would reach up, pluck one of those peckeries out of the water, out of the herd, bring it in the water, drown it, and swallow it. Wow. And then they'd be happy. And then as they killed the peckers off, the anaconda didn't have any more of its normal food.

But then he noticed down the stream there that the farmers had built a pig pan with the corner of it reaching into the river. And so he thought, I'm sure, maybe who was he or she? I don't know. But anyway, let's say it was a she. She saw that it was, that it looked sort of like it was just an oversized peccary. So she crawled into the pan and between the rails and then swallowed one of their pigs. and then when they came out in the morning this anaconda was trapped into pig pant

he couldn't get out probably full of pig exactly it couldn't get back through the crack in the fence so he was trapped in there so they killed it and they took all kinds of parts of it they used it for different things some of it was good they said was good for medicine

and whatever and they had the skin that was left over And I ended, and they gave it to him. Actually, I paid him 10 bucks for it. And they said, you want to take this? And they said, yeah, well, you want something for it? And I said, well, 10 bucks? Okay, we'll take it.

And so I had this thing. I rolled it all up and used to put it on the back of my horse. And I was the only way to get out there on horseback. And Peace Corps got me a horse. So anyway, we rode it back. And I kept it. around. I used in my teaching all these years. And then recently as I retired, I'm not teaching at schools anymore. And I wanted this skin to be useful to somebody. And I noticed by rolling it up

and unrolling it every time you did that, the scales would start falling off. And so I said, well, I don't want that to happen anymore. So I found a little school in Indianapolis that had an after school thing where they had a little museum and they could attack it on, put it up on the wall. So it's permanently stretched out. Wow. So they could see it there. So that's where I left it. But I used to use, I was only about three years ago that I did that.

And I can go back and see it if I want to. But I don't really, it wasn't, it was being destroyed the way I was using it. So I wanted to preserve it in some way. There you go. Well, as we go out, give people your final pitch out to pick up the book and all that good stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I welcome you to try the book, and I do have, I'm actually working on another story because I got about 80 stories in my website at the university that I can make more books out of it at this point.

I'm looking at one that I call cultures of agriculture and some others on people and tribal environments, how they live with the environment and how they make things work for them. A lot of stories are there. And I think you'll like the eat or be eaten is it gives you a wide span of stories between South America, Papua New Guinea, Africa, and then a lot of little period times in there. Like in Saudi Arabia, I spent a month there. But all together, I live 15 years in the tropical areas. and so that's there's a lot of those experiences there so it's useful somebody who wants to go in the peace corps maybe maybe it might might chase them away you might I'm not sure I want to be bathing with the with the with the whatcha McCollets and the in the Delios there yeah so we're honest yeah yeah but I did have a start one of my stories deals with a time in the Rocky Mountains running into an Anaconda into a wolverine. Wow.

A couple of wolverines were there. There was in the summer working in the Rocky Mountain National Park. We were cleaning the trails, getting the rocks off, and shoring up the erosion problems. And as we were doing that, we were on switchbacks. This other guy and I were working there, he was about two switchbacks up above me. And these two Wolverines started loping along above him, a switchbacker. above him, we're just going laterally, weren't paying any attention to him

or me, and this, and he thought it'd be clever to throw rocks at him. So he did that, and they stopped, and they looked at him and they sort of like, you can sort of read their mind, like, who are you to be molesting us with rocks? Yeah. And they started down the hill

after him. Boy, he panicked. He threw the shovel up in the air, his only weapon, came running down by me, and I had to tackle him because he would have run off the cliff behind us. Got him stabilized and then looked around, where are the, where are the Wolverines? They were still coming.

They were looking, you know, and I was standing there. He was sort of cowering back there, and I say, I can't run. They can certainly run faster than me. So I just lifted my shovel up in the air and my other hand and raised it up and was ready to hit him if they got any closer. and they just turned around and suddenly they just stopped and started walking off, running off like they were in the same direction. Well, that's crazy.

Then I noticed this terrible smell, and I thought, my goodness, what's that about? And it turned out my colleague there was, had done a number in his pants. I probably would be there too. And he, as it turned out, you know, I often wonder it was, had nothing, they left, not because of the, they probably left because of the smell. smell yeah that's a note to self if i ever get encountered like a bear wild animal in the woods that decides it wants to eat me go ahead and throw your hands up in the air you make yourself look big yeah poop your pants too that way they're like oh oh what did you have taco bell there

buddy yeah oh i'm out of here yeah so now you know what to do when you run into a wolverine that's uh i'll ship myself uh i'm sure that'll happen just well maybe maybe the shovel thing worked I don't know. Yeah, maybe, maybe. Thank you very much for coming on the show. I do notice we have a website for you called it's your, it's your name, R-I-C-K-B-E-I-N.com. Yeah. So that's a place people can just go to check you out.

I think, yeah. Thank you very much for coming to show, Rick. We really appreciate it. Okay. And thanks for honest for tuning in. Order up his book, wherever fine books are sold. Eat or Be Eaton out August 20th, 2024. You can find the links to the book.

and Rick on the Chris Foss Show.com podcast. And any future books coming up there, Rick? Yeah, I'm going to be working on one called Cultures of Agriculture. All right. And a lot of, maybe have a few of these same stories in it because a lot of them are about farming. And it's sort of how people farm within the environment. And then all over the world. I'm looking at farms in New Guinea and, or,

You know, Brazil, Africa, Iceland, even, and all these different strategies for cultivating the soil. And that's one. So I'm working on where we, that'll be my next book, but got some on the environment, people in their environment. Well, folks, sort of the book where fine books are sold to eat or be now on August 20th, 2024. Thanks for honest for tuning in. Go to goodreads.com for just Chris Foss, LinkedIn.com. Fortress, Chris Foss. Chris Foss won on the TikTokity and all those places on the internet. Be good to each other. Stay safe. We'll see you guys next time.