The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Jon Bruner, Head of Marketing for Lumafield, Ex-Ray Vision For Engineers

Episode Date: November 15, 2023

Jon Bruner, Head of Marketing for Lumafield, Ex-Ray Vision For Engineers Lumafield.com Show Notes About the Guest(s): John Bruner is the Head of Marketing at Luma Field, a startup that specializes in making industrial CT scanners. With a background in 3D printing, John joined Luma Field two years ago and has been instrumental in the company's growth and success. He brings a wealth of knowledge and expertise to the field of CT scanning and is passionate about helping engineers gain valuable insights into their products. Episode Summary: Welcome to The Chris Voss Show, where host Chris Voss brings you the hottest podcast in the world. In this episode, Chris interviews John Bruner, the Head of Marketing at Luma Field. Luma Field is a startup that manufactures industrial CT scanners, allowing engineers to gain a detailed understanding of their products without the need for destructive testing. John explains how CT scanning works, showcases some fascinating scans, and discusses the various applications of this technology. From counterfeit detection to quality control, CT scanning is revolutionizing the way engineers analyze and improve their designs. Key topics discussed in this episode include the capabilities of Luma Field's CT scanners, the benefits of using CT scanning in engineering, and the potential for AI to enhance the analysis process. John also shares some captivating scans, including a detailed look inside an AirPods case and a glimpse into the intricate components of a Thunderbolt connector. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in cutting-edge technology and its impact on various industries. Key Takeaways: Luma Field's industrial CT scanners provide engineers with x-ray vision, allowing them to analyze the internal structure of their products without destructive testing. CT scanning is a valuable tool for quality control, counterfeit detection, and product development in industries ranging from aerospace to consumer goods. Luma Field's software and AI co-pilot enhance the analysis process, providing engineers with valuable insights and recommendations for materials, design improvements, and more. CT scanning is an accessible and cost-effective alternative to traditional methods of analysis, offering detailed 3D models and cross-sectional views of products. The applications of CT scanning are vast, from inspecting electronics and packaging to studying natural specimens and works of art. Notable Quotes: "Our scanners are used by engineers for diagnostics. They look inside physical products, everything from electronics to consumer packaging to footwear." - John Bruner "CT scanning lets engineers look at their products in cross-section in incredible detail." - John Bruner "Our vision is that more and more things will be inspected at 100% so that engineers really know what they're delivering to their customers." - John Bruner "CT scanning satisfies that wish for X-ray vision, allowing us to look inside things and understand how the world works." - John Bruner "Understanding our world in ways we've never seen before is the power of CT scanning." - John Bruner

You wanted the best. You've got the best podcast, the hottest podcast in the world. The Chris Voss Show, the preeminent podcast with guests so smart you may experience serious brain bleed. The CEOs, authors, thought leaders, visionaries, and motivators. Get ready, get ready, strap yourself in. Keep your hands, arms, and legs inside the vehicle at all times because you're about to go on a monster education roller coaster with your brain. Now, here's your host, Chris Voss. Hi, folks. This is Voss here from thechrisvossshow.com.

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but doesn't judge you, at least not as harshly as your mother-in-law. For 15 years, 3-4 shows a weekday, 15 to 20 a week. We've been producing stuff like a radio show. The CEOs, the billionaires, the White House advisors, the governors, Congress members, U.S. ambassadors, astronauts, TV, and Pulitzer Prize winner journalists on the show. You just join, whenever you listen to the Chris Voss Show, this elite crowd of people that bask in what we call,

I mean, we don't have've trademarked we don't really but uh the chris voss show glow glow i think we need to hire a gal to say that just like the uh opera singer we need the chris voss show glow you know something like that i don't know whatever man we got too much time on our hands evidently with this show uh so guys we uh always talk about amazing technology uh the future of stuff uh and all that sort of great stuff on the show and we are going to be talking about some amazing technology today that's gonna it's gonna blow your mind i need to pay somebody to do like a blow your mind thing there's lots of money going around right now today i guess uh i need to spend

or something or i just need to go on fiverr and just go on a crack binge on Fiverr and just buy everything. There you go. Anyway, guys, we're going to be talking to a wonderful gentleman about their technology, what they're launching in, and how it's going to probably change the world. John Bruner joins us on the show. He's the head of marketing at a company called LumaField. We're going to be talking today. Welcome to the show, John. How are you? Thanks so much, Chris. It's great to be talking today. Welcome to the show, John. How are you? Thanks so much, Chris. It's great to be here. I am basking in the glow.

You're basking in the glow just already. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Your listeners should know that it is as high energy here when you're on the show as it sounds out there. It is, but we all did the coffee shots before the show, the five-hour energy shots before the show. I was going to do another joke, but I'm going to leave it off the table. We didn't do that. Don't do drugs, people. They're bad.

Just stick to coffee. I think that's our thing. So anyway, John, give us a 30,000 overview on LumaField and what you do there. Yeah, so LumaField is a startup that makes industrial CT scanners. So you might be familiar with a CT scanner that you've used at a hospital, looks inside your brain, uses x-rays, takes x-ray images from different angles, and then uses software to get a 3D model out of those. Doctors use it to look for all sorts of stuff going on inside your brain. Our scanners are used by engineers for diagnostics. They look inside

physical products, everything from electronics to consumer packaging to footwear. And anything that engineers used to cut open with a saw, they can now CT scan and do the same electronically. That's what they're going to do with my brain soon. They're going to give me that frontal lobotomy. So we're going to go full saw uses. But now they don't have to use a saw with your technology. Is that correct? Yeah, that's right.

So it's just like a medical CT scanner. If you look at what a radiologist looks at after you get a CT scan, they're slicing through your brain top to bottom. They're kind of like looking at it in cross-section. We're letting those engineers look at their products in cross-section in incredible detail. They did that with my CT scan. They just found monkeys and squirrels fighting most of the time, which is exciting in there, which is why they're giving me a lobotomy. It is, unless you're me, you know, you're on the outside of it all, then it's a real problem. But, you know, there's a lot of monkey slinging and stuff going on in there. So tell us about, you're the head of marketing.

When did you join this company and what got you involved in it? Yeah, I've been with the company for just about two years now. And before that, I had been in the 3D printing industry at a couple of different companies. And a lot of us at LumaField came from 3D printing because for a couple of reasons. One is the original idea was that CT scanning would be a companion to 3D printing. I don't know how much you've talked about 3D printing in general, but it's very, very promising technology, but it produces sort of uneven results,

and it's hard to know exactly what's going on inside these very complex things that you're 3D printing. So our founders figured maybe people would use industrial CT to look at 3D printing on objects. And since then then it's turned out uh you know it's it's actually really valuable in a bunch of different industries outside of 3d printing but the other reason that there's crossover is because it's kind of the opposite of 3d printing with 3d printing you have a digital model and you're turning it into a physical object

and we take your physical object and turn it into a digital model wow that's how that's the short answer for how i came in was through the 3D printing world. There you go. And so it's built as design, build, and ship products at the speed of light and basically giving engineering teams X-ray vision that help them make decisions at the right time. And then it's being used in a few other different formats too as well we talked about before the show. Yeah then it's being used in a few other different formats too as well, we talked about before the show.

Yeah, that's right. We offer three products essentially. There's a scanner that we put in your office. It's about the size of a commercial refrigerator. It's six feet wide, six feet high, three feet deep. Plugs into the actual...

Yeah, you can... It gets a little warmer than a probably not refrigerator, but you can, you can irradiate Mountain Dew and then, and then drink it later. There's no harm. It's not like a, it's not like,

what about my tuna fish sandwiches? I like to bring in and heat up in the microwave. Yeah, it'll actually, what you should, it's interesting. Food actually is sometimes irradiated by x-rays as a way to, yeah,

there's certain, it's got a dual purpose then for sure, man. This is worth the money, y'all. I'm all in. Yeah, we'll make your tuna slightly safer if we scan it for you. The rest of the employees will hate me though because you don't cook fish in the microwave. But you get a cool graphic, cool visualization out of it.

You do, yeah. That makes it, that offsets it clearly, the smell. That's right, that's right. So we make the scanners, which we put in your office or manufacturing facility we make uh software that runs in the cloud you use it through a web browser that's where you see the beautiful images and do all of your analysis and we have an ai co-pilot that that lives inside the software as well and it helps you analyze uh you know your

your uh your products and and look at your scans more effectively but it also answers general purpose engineering questions. You can ask it to help you pick a material to make a, you know, a new bracket out of, or what kind of adhesive should you use? How big should this thing be? That kind of thing. And it looks like it kind of has a heat map to it, maybe. Is that the right term? Yeah.

Can it have like a heat map? Yeah, if you'd like, I could show you a couple of scans here on screen. We're going to start using this for the show. We're going to demand that the whole show operates on 3D modeling, so people have to show up with their x-ray. Yeah, that's right.

We'll do the whole show with the guests in x-ray. We'll gladly sell you one of these x-ray things before your guests come on if you want. I'm going to x-ray the guests in x-ray we'll gladly sell you one of these x-ray x-ray things before your guests come on if you want i'm gonna x-ray the guests yeah yeah um we find a lot of our customers use this uh technology to kind of hold their vendors to account um you know they scan the things they come in and say hey you didn't do this or that um i think you could do the same thing with your podcast guests uh so this is a, these are a CT scans from our system of three AirPods. The one on the left is authentic.

It's a real one from Apple and the middle one and the one on the right are fakes. They're, they're counterfeit that are from, from eBay. And so this shows you, you know, in incredible detail,

what's inside it. You, you referred to heat map. And, and what you're seeing here in this color scheme's inside it. You referred to heat map and what you're seeing here in this color scheme is that it explains density, the relative density of these materials.

The red and orange areas are denser and the blue areas are less dense. The red and orange areas are copper, mostly copper. There's a little bit of lead solder in some of these. The blue areas are, they're copper, mostly copper. There's a little bit of like lead solder in some of these. The blue areas are the plastic and silicone that are on the outside. So as part of the visualization, we can strip away the less dense areas and show you just the denser areas.

That's what's going on in this. This could be huge for, you know, counterfeit. You know, brands have so many problems, especially with China, you know, counterfeit brands you know brands have so many problems especially with china you know counterfeit brands and and copies and you know they've fought it every which way you know i've seen so much fighting over over you know is this copyrighted um or not copyright but counterfeit uh you know they've they've tried you know putting all sorts of tags on stuff trying to make ways to do it but this is brilliant because you can see those of you are listening to podcasts most people consume it in audio you really want to

watch this on youtube uh because you can see that you know it's it's it's night and day the differences of the quality of parts that you can see in the apple authentic as opposed to two counterfeits yeah that's right um right. Yeah, and you're right. You know, brand protection is a big deal. It's a headache for the companies whose brands get ripped off, but it's a consumer problem too. You think you're buying one thing and you're actually getting another. You're getting defrauded as the customer.

Yeah, yeah. That's really cool. And they can see you know every which way but loose you can move it around from all different angles and look at it yeah what you said too about making sure that you know you're getting it built the way you they promise when it gets shipped to you yeah going out to consumers being able to identify maybe you know different issues like wearability or um i don't know you can see that you can see the wires aren't connected maybe if if they are right yeah exactly exactly

yeah and i mean this is this is these are beautiful i'll show you um uh something else really quickly here if uh we have this website called the scan of the month oh there you go we look at all sorts of interesting things that's my mocha cup right there yeah we got we got this uh mocha pot i'll show you that and then the other thing that's that i love is this this food package i love espresso but let me let me show you this this mocha pot i'll show you the inside of the mocha pot and we'll get into something that's really cool so yeah here's the ct scan of a of the mocha pot you can look inside.

You can cross-section it like this. Again, this color map is showing you relative density. You've got the less dense plastic handles and the more dense. I believe this one's aluminum. You can just slice through it back and forth all you want. Wow, that is crazy, man.

You can watch my espresso come up the spout. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll give you a really cool animation if you want. This is what my espresso come up the spout. Yeah. Yeah. We'll give you a really cool animation. This is the kind of thing that, you know, we love that. I love the beautiful images in marketing, but our customers are using this to find these little, little details here.

So there's, this is what we call porosity. These, these little hits in the, in the metal, when you cast metal or injection mold plastic, it's really easy to wind up with these little air bubbles inside it. They're the source of all sorts of huge engineering and manufacturing problems. But it's invisible on the outside. Yeah, and they can see that

something maybe in the pour isn't working. There's an AeroPress. Those make the best coffee ever. Yeah, everyone is. I'm told that a few people on our team went out and bought AeroPresses after we scanned them. They are the best. It's the best coffee you'll have in your life. Yeah, yeah.

Well, I know you're a coffee head, so figure this one. It's become the coffee show. Yeah, yeah. I'll move us along to some different scans in just a minute. But here's a fellow kettle scan. Pretty sophisticated. Oh, wow. Bunch of wiring. Got the wiring, the schematics, and all that stuff. scans in just a minute but this here's a fellow kettle uh you know scan a pretty pretty sophisticated bunch of wiring got the wiring the schematics and all this stuff just zoom around this is like such a fun way to see the world you know it really is i mean this is almost kind of like

something you could turn into a tiktok channel and people just watch it for fun like just what's inside this yeah we actually have experimented with putting these things on on tiktok there was uh you know the tikt TikTok algorithm goes in and out, but we had a few out-of-the-park successes in the last couple of years where I'll scan a drill or something and put it up on TikTok, 20-second video of it twirling around. It's like 200,000 views and thousands of comments. So the fun thing is that industrial CT has been around for decades, but only it's been so expensive

and so inaccessible that it's only really used in aerospace and a couple of really large companies. So we figure that on TikTok alone, more people have seen our industrial CT scans than I've seen like every – I'm serious. This is fun.

This is fun and cool. Yeah, we have a blast with this stuff. I could just sit and play with this all day long. Food packaging. So there you go. You can see. I like how you showed on the pot, you know, there was aberrations in the quality of the metal. And, of course, if uh, on the pot, you know, there was, there was aberrations in the

quality of the metal. And then of course, if you're building something that, you know, it may be something important sits on top of it, or, or you just, you know, you're looking at your warranty service or, or, uh, guarantees that you're offering on products, you know, you can see that, oh my God, we're probably going to have a high amount of replacement returns, things of that nature, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, that's right. And, you know, is the packaging on this shampoo bottle going to withstand, you know, shipping in Amazon boxes to 50,000 customers

in the next month? And actually, a lot of these are becoming more challenging, by the way, because, you know, a lot of companies are prioritizing moving to greener materials. Plastics have come under fire. People want recyclable plastics. They want biodegradable plastics. It turns out the recyclable and biodegradable plastics are a lot harder to work with than the traditional ones. They're harder to fit to exactly the right shape in the molding process. They're a little bit less likely to be resilient

to the kinds of pressures of transportation and shipping and delivery because everyone has everything, you know, delivered these days. So it's a challenging environment for the engineers who design stuff like bottle caps and, you know, plastic enclosures and these high volume things that you tend to go all day without thinking about but that are really underpinning your life and that take a lot of skill and care to design. Yeah, if I can't get my ketchup out of my bottle here as you guys are showing this squeeze bottle cap, you know, it's the end of the day for me. I'm over it.

Yeah, it's a crisis. Yeah, and you mentioned here that the people who designed the squeeze bottle cap created 111 prototypes before finding the right design. Could this be a way for companies to not have to maybe have less prototypes, maybe get right to the exact design they might want? Yeah, that's right. You know, this CT is a great way to close the loop. So, you know, engineers are constantly designing a thing and testing it. And too often, if you're not really able to see what you've developed up close,

it's hard to close the loop. It's hard to know if it's giving you what you need as an engineer, as something that meets your requirements. So CT lets you close the loop. It lets you effectively cut open as many products as you want without actually cutting them open. And the state of the art in a lot of these fields, I joked about cutting things open with a saw, but that's actually what they've done. You take a bottle like this, you fill it with resin, epoxy resin, you cure it, you cut it open with a bandsaw, and then you polish it. You look at it under an inspection microscope. And that takes a takes a long time it takes ages to set up it's destructive you know so

you can't sell that bottle after you've after you've done that and um and the the cut itself destroys some part of the bottle so you you have to know exactly where you need to cut and uh and sometimes the cutting itself creates other signals that might be true or false. If there's deficiency in the place where you made the cut, you're not going to pick it up because you just cut through the deficiency. Yeah, you just wreck the spot. I can see how this could be a great quality control. You know, like every hundredth unit or something you throw at the machine or something like that.

Yeah, no, exactly. You're totally right. You can do sampling. You can do full inspection. Full inspection is pretty rare in higher volume consumer products, but it's commonplace in aerospace. Like, you know, a lot of parts that go into like aircraft engines get CT scanned. And our vision is that because we've made these systems a lot cheaper and a lot faster and a lot easier to use, that you'll see more and more things getting inspected at 100% so that engineers really know what they're delivering to their customers. Yeah, there you go.

Yeah, I can see so many uses. It's so cool. Plus, I just sit and watch it on TikTok in the late night. I can't sleep sitting there and calling this to it. But yeah, this is amazing. I never thought about how some of this stuff was done. There's a sriracha bottle. Yeah, I'll show you a sriracha bottle. Gotta know how to get my sriracha.

Yeah, and this is another one where you don't want that to stop up because then it'll squirt all over the counter when you finally do get it unstuck. And then here's this Tetra Pak. This is my cocoa nut water that I drink every day. Yeah, that's right. Have you thought about this cap ever i would not really you know it's kind of interesting

oil inside so you know like what so uh so chris and i are talking about the vita cocoa uh tetra pack uh container you see this you see this type of cap on um a lot of things like soup and stock now with the at the, also some other drinks. So it's made of wax paper with some coatings on it. And it's got this plastic cap that you kind of, you untwist it and then it opens. And it's easy to overlook the fact that, you know, a lot of caps have a seal on the outside. You break the seal open with your fingernail or you have to pull a strap out and, you know, unwind it. This has a seal. It has a, you know, a seal foil underneath the cap.

When you open it the first time, these blades come down and they cut the foil. And you don't even notice it because it's so smooth. I didn't even notice there was a foil in there. Yeah, here's an unopened cap. It's got this foil here. And then these things on the sides, they're actually blades. And when you,

when you, when you turn the cap, it, it pushes these serrated blades down into the foil. Holy crap. It's got cams. I mean, this,

this thing has like several, several independent pieces that move together and, you know, track each other. Anyway, it just slices that foil open and, um, you know, track each other. Anyway, it just slices that foil open and, and you never even know. It's,

it's an incredible, like a whole Hoover dam engineering experiment. My fricking coconut water cap. Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's, it's amazing.

So this is, this is what I'm talking about. It's like, you know, it's fun to scan, uh, AirPods and, um,

this is a, this is an interesting question coming in from emily on linkedin see this tool is good for initial design but also for evaluation of wear and tear for warranty and parts and replacement uh policies thanks emily um yeah i imagine you could test stuff over time you know how they do those they have those tests i'm sure you do where they have those testers that you know those, those shake something, you know, really hard to try and give 10,000 uses or something. And then you can put it in the machine and see, you know, how it held up. Yeah, totally.

That's, you see that in the product development labs at a lot of our customers that they'll have some machine that's like, you know, evaluating the, the wear of a textile on an automotive seat. And so it's got, you know, a piece of denim that it's just like pressing back and forth against a, against a, a car seat to, to test where I need one for my back. See how make yourself much wear and tears on the old body there.

So this is really cool like i said i could look at this all day long this is fascinating just uh now i'm gonna be toying with all my products i don't know what's going on with this i've always been fascinated like with my mocha pot how the how you know it uses steam and then it has a gas release valve and and it eventually just reaches a point where it pushes it through the coffee and then up the spout and the cream, it comes out. I always,

I always love watching. I'm just like, that's really cool. That works. Yeah, it is. It's amazing. All these very clever kind of passive things.

The world has become really electronic, right? And a lot of things that used to have a clever, a clever mechanical kind of like aspect to them, now the magic has gone a little bit. There's just a tiny computer inside and you can put whatever software you want on that. You can put some sensors and a little motor in it. Now that replaces a lot of things that used to be mechanical. And so it's really fun to look around the world and find all these places where there's still tons of clever really really low cost engineering i mean this this coconut water cap is like so

complicated and it's on millions of these containers yeah millions like four a day i think i have a few million yeah yeah yeah you've done some mileage on that is i you know the the great thing about coconut water is it has a thousand milligrams roughly of potassium in it you need about 5 000 potassium a day okay so this is one of the main ways that i get that current it's great for hydration and stuff too yeah am i getting a check from coco uh coconut company we should check in this um we'll way. We'll sell them and send them an ad. Anything else more you want to show us in the video?

No, I think this is pretty much it for a few of the demo scans. I wanted to show you some of the things that are representative of what we're doing. I'll show you another fun one actually right here. This is a set of automotive parts that we looked at. Check this out.

Airbag in the CT scanner. So here, see it from the side? Check that out. This is actually the bag itself. It's coiled up inside. And what you see here, this little notch, that's where the front cover of the airbag is engineered to break open when this thing inflates. When you look inside too, you can cut in and see the inflator. It's not actually exploding. It's kind of like rapidly creating gas, which I guess is an explosion in a sense, but it's not a fireball kind of explosion. It's like

a chemical off-gassing process. It's these little pellets here. They get ignited and then they inflate the thing and it all happens in a split second. That is crazy, man. Like I said, this is really neat. You can just sit and play with this all day long.

You got the gas cap there. Even a gas cap, super complicated. Check out this windshield wiper wand. Can you even go on the internet and see this? These are right at scanofthemonth. Everything. Can you go on the internet and see this or is this? Yeah. Yeah. These are right at scan of the month.com.

That's where we put this, this storytelling website. Yeah. Um, but it's just, you know, we, we just go around.

We, we have, um, uh, dozens of these, uh, scanners at our offices. We were based in,

uh, Cambridge, Massachusetts and San Francisco. We have a few other offices in Minneapolis, Detroit, Jacksonville, Florida, and Dallas. And we've got a bunch of scanners at all these locations. And we just, we put things in all the time. It's a great way to explore the world. My girlfriend's going to be like, are you looking at girls online? No, I'm looking at 3D scans, man. These are amazing. Yeah, looking at pistons. There you go.

So let's talk about your guys' product lineup. You have this Neptune, Triton, Voyager, and Atlas. Tell us about how some of these work. Great, yeah. Let me pull up Voyager for you here. And I'll just go ahead and start to load some of these scans if you'd like. The Apple Thunderbird. Yeah, I can show you that. I think that's crazy, the detail on that.

Yeah. All the stuff that's in a plug. When you think of a plug, you're just like, I don't know, it's a wire. It plugs into something. Right, right, right. No, not at all so this is you're looking at voyager here and i'm i'm loading uh loading a scan to to show your your viewing audience um so we make the the scanners that uh that i've mentioned they're uh they're you know six feet high six feet wide three feet deep um you see

them you can see them on our website. We actually have one out the window behind me, but I'm not sure I can move my webcam enough. And then we have this software, and it lives in the cloud. It lets you download scans and look at them right in your browser. So we're about to see one come up here in a second. You recognize this? A Remington,

maybe a shaver. Actually a Braun, I think. Yeah. Yeah. So this is, you know, you mentioned like twirling these things around.

That's. Yeah. Wow. You see the blades and everything. Yeah, that's right. That's what's eating my face. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah, that's right. That's what's eating my face. Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Look at that. You can change it to where you can kind of see the boards and chips better. Yeah, so what I did just there was I took the plastic off in the visualization, removed the materials. Here I can put them back on. There you go. Oh, wow. You can see the chips and uh the boards and the springs

the cutting heads um yeah actually let me back up just slightly this is i can explain how a ct scan works so these are the the two-dimensional we call them radiographs these are x-ray images and uh basically the scanner all it does is you you a product in, the scanner has an x-ray source and an x-ray detector. So it has a kind of a flashlight beam of x-rays that it's pointed through the thing that you put in the scanner. And then on the detector, you're getting images like this, depending on how the object is oriented inside the machine. You just take one at a time, two-dimensional black and white images of something like this using x-rays, and you rotate the part. And in the same way that you as a human can look at this rotating and begin to understand how it's laid out, we use software, reconstruction software that we've developed

that's based on some Nobel Prize winning work in the uh, and can turn this into a 3d model that you can then kind of, uh, you know, twirl around like this, look at it. You can, uh, you know,

crop in if you want like, like this and look at, look at cross section. You can do cutaway basically. Is that, is that a cutaway or a cross? Yeah, it's a cutaway there.

Yeah. Here we can, you know, kind of go up and up and down. Wow. So you just slice it and dice it and see each variable level of it. Crazy. Here's the battery.

This is a lithium ion battery. We scan a lot of batteries. You can see individual layers. Oh, wow. You can. What they call jelly rolls. My girlfriend says I have jelly rolls. It's a problem for many of us. But I don't shave enough

evidently, so I don't know what that is. It's my big beard. That is crazy, man. And I can see just seeing the chips and how they mount to the board. Yeah, and then getting in. Look at all these springs. This is probably an engineer's wet dream, huh? You guys love this stuff stuff you get in there and you're like oh my god it's really

entertaining it's an incredible way to to see the world all of us you know had some have had some wish at some point for x-ray vision to be able to look inside things and understand how the world works and oh yeah this satisfies that right yeah it really, it really does. I mean, like, I just want to sit around and look at everything. I'm like, what's going on here with this thing? Maybe we'll just x-ray the whole show after it's done. Yeah, just send us a thing for every guest. Send us something to get it x-rayed for the show. It would be creepy if we have x-ray guests.

Like, their eyes will be all alien looking or something. We'll identify cancer on the show. That's right. Exactly. Hey, the CT scan picked up that you've got a little mole growing there you need to have looked at. Yeah, it's a tough... Medical CT is still so expensive. It's tough to see how easy it actually is to start to use industrial CT on the engineering side.

It's still pretty inaccessible for a lot of people on the medical side. So which of the products is this one? This is Voyager? This is Voyager,ager yeah is the embedded software here and then you've got atlas the power of ai for engineering yeah right uh and so uh i am i am not signed into my account here let me let me just So this is a co-pilot for engineers that helps you kind of, does a couple of things, as I mentioned.

You can ask it to help you analyze a scan that you've run, or you can ask it kind of general engineering questions, like what material should I use for, for this and that, that type of thing. So we, we saw that there was this big opportunity, you know, a lot of, a lot of companies, a lot of engineering teams rely on people with very, very specialized knowledge. And we saw an opportunity to sort of like, collate some of that help help companies and teams consolidate their knowledge into a single place.

So if you opt in, you can have this learn from your team and understand some internal sort of tribal knowledge and try to bring down some barriers. The world has gotten very complicated. Introducing a new product is hard. You have to rely on a lot of expertise. So we want to make that expertise a little bit more available. So Atlas says, Hi, I'm Atlas, your manufacturing co-pilot. I'm here to help you navigate Voyager CT scanning and design and manufacturing troubleshooting.

You can ask me things. What materials should I use to make a skateboard? Yeah, so we'll see. So it's spinning up right now. It takes a second to come up the first time you ask it something. We're watching these in 1080p. I've got a 4K monitor. This is probably really cool to see on a 4K monitor.

Oh, it's gorgeous, yeah. Yeah, I've got a 4090, uh, um, card GPU. Oh, nice. So that would be really, really fun. Yeah. It's a,

it's a beautiful, um, uh, these, these, these are beautiful, uh, uh,

scans when you're seeing them in high resolution. It's like, what did you do today, Chris? I don't know. I just scan and crap and watching it. Yeah, yeah,

exactly. And here i am you know i'll show you this speaking of beautiful other beautiful scans here there's a controller yeah there we go um i keep i'm just making your viewers watch me use my my uh this is cool i i didn't know this how much went into those little plugs. Now this is wild. Yeah. This is a Thunderbolt four connector. Oh wow. And, uh, you know,

you compare it with much simpler, uh, USB-C connector and you can see what a huge difference it makes. So this is the, uh, here's the internals. We, and we could slice up and down just like,

uh, just like, uh, a radiologist would, you can see this is a, a 10 layer PCB in here here these little traces it's just it's you know conditioning the signal it's handling power because these things can deliver like 100 watts of power and charge a laptop and drive your uh your your monitor um this can do

something like a you know an 8k monitor so it's There's a lot going on in there, man. Yeah, it's unbelievable. There's a lot going on in there. Holy crap. Yeah, and the quality of the manufacturing is really, really impressive. Look at this. It's like 20 individual wires here. Yeah.

Looks like an alien fish. It does, yeah. Yeah, something you'd find in the very very deep sea this is my favorite visualization here you can go down the the length oh so it's taking you down the length of the whole thing you can see the cable as it goes through and dissipate dude that is like man like i say engineers love this but I love it just because, you know, seeing how things work, like they should show this to kids in school so they can get them interested in engineering. Yeah, absolutely. I would have loved to seen this when I was a kid in school to understand engineering and the way things work. Oh, I know. Right. Um, I, I think, you know, I was interested in, uh, in engineering as a kid and the level of, um, of accessibility now for everything is just so much higher for kids who are interested in.

I mean, they lost me when they had the protractor and the stuff on what the hell's going on. What the hell is this for? Yeah. But here you can see like the end product that makes you kind of get excited. You're like, Hey, I want to figure out how to make something like that. And then when they hand you the slide ruler or whatever, you're like, Oh, okay. I see what this protractor does. Or does anybody use a protractor anymore?

I think a protractor probably. But you know, maybe in like eighth grade geometry, I don't know. Maybe it's all done in software now, but your teacher to say, you won't have that in your pocket. Yeah. I was just looking to stab somebody with this and the protractor. And what the,

the two pointy things on the end. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. See, I learned something in school.

That was bad. This is a, this is quite extraordinary. And so it looks like the AI gave you an answer back. I talked about bamboo, carbon fiber, or use for specialist boards, gave you a few different things. Can you make it as light as possible? Yeah, so we'll have it.

It's like a lot of the co-pilots that you see now. It'll kind of have a continuous conversation with you, so you can ask follow-up you can say like you know and what kind of and what kind of uh bolts what i need to to uh to use on that or i'm going to describe a uh shortcoming that that i'm seeing here's a rattle or something um so it's that's saying you know consider aluminum and aluminum alloys uh or high density polyethylene polypropylene abs but for a traditional skateboard feel maybe look at some lightweight wood woods like like maple and pine there you go emily's going hog wild over here she she wants to scan insects and make scanning game

and then uh and then she just wants to do fun and profit i think she's figured out a way to to uh turn it into the next big thing there. Here, watch this. I'm going to show you something. This is the fun thing about having a big library of scans behind you is that you can pull stuff up. So thank you for that suggestion, Emily. I'm going to show you a CT scan of a beetle here, which is pretty fun. Insect warning if you have anyone who's phobic about insects.

Oh, holy crap. That is cool. Isn't that amazing? That is cool. So I'll show you like a crop in here. Oops. Yeah. So again, you're looking at the crop in here. Oops. That's good. Yeah, so again, you're looking at the whole thing now, and then I'm going to crop in, and you can just see these. Oh, wow. You can see the layers

as you cross-section. It's like those horses when you go to the show museum where they cut the horse into a million pieces. Oh, yeah, exactly. Set it in resin. This is less gross. Yeah, and look at this. You can see where the I don't think they're bones, but where different things meet and intersect. Yeah, the danger is it's so easy to

CT scan things without knowing anything about them that I can't really tell you what's inside a beetle aside from what I Yeah, there's probably some zoologist that, you know, he's like, hey, that's the amacadora. And you're like, yeah. We've worked with

we did a video with Adam Savage from Tested at the California Academy of Sciences, which is the Natural History Museum here in San Francisco. They've got this incredible collection. You go in their archives and their collection spaces. It's just like floor to ceiling bookcases, as far as you can see, with specimens in glass jars and uh they use ct to uh to scan some of those to um both to look inside them and to sort of like create really accurate models that then other scientists can use they post them online they make it possible to and look at them so understanding our world in ways that

we've never seen before yeah exactly so this technology does cross over into the into the natural world as well yeah this. This is extraordinary, man. These are really cool. And I mean, when I was seeing first some of the Beatle, I was thinking, I don't know, maybe gaming companies could use this as a way to build out characters or enemies or, you know, ways to... Because the realism, you know, if you could copy the realism i don't know yeah absolutely it's uh we can drag and drop it we can take something like this and make a uh give you a 3d model of it that you could bring into um you know game design software rendering software

blender or something like that so this is wild man i think think Emily's already trying to figure out how to do fun and profit with it. It's a new video game. Scan stuff and look at it. I mean, it's really intriguing. So what else do we need to plug on LumaField? What you guys are doing over there so we get to wrap up the show. Otherwise, we're going to turn this into a four-hour show where we're just looking at scans because they're so cool. I mean, they really are.

You've got to watch this if you're listening on the podcast. Yeah, absolutely. Well, you know, so this Voyager is free and open to anyone. You can come and see the demo scans including all the scans that I've shown you here. All of these are demo scan sets. You go to app.lumafield.com

You go to lumafield.com and hit the button. There are buttons all over the place to go into the app. And just play around. We'd love to hear from you and know what's interesting to you as far as stuff you think we should scan, stuff you think we should publish. We have customers who are working in areas that are adjacent to all of these scans. But the only hard thing for me as a marketer is that our, our customers

usually put our scanners in their very most sensitive, uh, areas, you know, so they're, they're scanning their prototypes, their new products. So, uh, we're not able to say much about what, what most of them are doing, but, um, as a substitute, you can, you can go in and, and look at our demo scans and twirl them around for yourself, cut in section them, all of that. It's a fun way to learn about the world. There you go. Can you guys scan my girlfriend

so I can find out why she's angry at me half the time? I can scan the one that you leave out in the house. Oh, there you go. That must be what it is. That must be what it is. You probably have to scan the other girlfriend to find out then why the other one's angry i don't know what that means uh so uh final thoughts and pitch out as we go out on what you guys do there at luma field uh how companies can onboard with

you get involved etc etc great yeah um just uh uh so we um our scanners are available for $75,000 a year. They start at 75K a year. It's hardware as a service. So that includes all the software you need to run it, the cloud storage, the maintenance, you know, any replacement parts that you need. That sounds like a lot of money, 75K a year. That's more than most people spend on most things. But it is a tiny fraction of what it costs traditionally to own a ct scanner and it's a tiny fraction of what it

costs to do things the old way you know cutting things open with saws or just making mistakes and not knowing what um what it is that you're really that you're really delivering to your customers so for 75k a year you can uh you can have one of these amazing CT scanners in your office. You can scan things. Uh, our customers mostly scan serious things, but, um, we hear from them that they, they also do things like they put a beetle in or, you know, they put something like that and take a look at it. So that's pretty cool. Whether you guys take a check. No, I'm just,

do you want one for your studio? I think it would look good in your studio. That would look cool. I'll just put it behind me, and I'll just x-ray every show. I'll x-ray the microphone that we have, the Chris Fosch show logo, and I don't know. Oh, yeah. I don't think anything will ever get done if we get one of those machines in there. We'd be glad to scan a microphone for you if you want to send us. Is that a Shure?

No, this is one that we like that works pretty well for us. I can't remember the brand name and I can't see it with my... I can't see the fine print, but it's a pretty good one. But if you want, I'll send it to you. It might be funny. We'll just put it on the show and it'll glow on the show or something.

Have it just rotate. I know a lot of people use that Sure One. That Surewin's popular as well. So, do we get your... What's this? What is she saying? We've had enough Marvel comics. Let's create new characters. Wish

Luma Critters. Okay. Let's do it. Well, if you send us some interesting specimens, we can... There you go. You're going to get some emails from Emily. Or suggest to your favorite local museum that they get one of these scanners.

Yeah. You guys could do this with fine works of art. I don't know if they'd let you, but, you know, like Monet's or something. You can see if they're fake. Yeah. So we have some customers who use our who use our scanners to on counterfeit detection different kinds of things they're looking at um x-ray is used on uh on some art forgeries to look into it i think they uh they use um two-dimensional x-rays to see what what

used to be under the the um the painting uh you know old older artists used to uh used to be under the, the, um, the painting, uh, you know, old, older artists used to, uh, used to reuse their canvases a lot to paint something and then paint over it. And then in white and then paint something new on top of it. Uh, so you can,

you can sort of discern some of that, but, um, we haven't had anyone authenticated Monet yet. I can tell you that. That would be interesting. So if you haven't, I'll do that.

Yeah. Um, uh have them, I'll do that. Yeah. Um, uh, well, John, this has been one of the most funnest shows I've ever had, where we sit here and we look at all this cool stuff. Like I could,

I could, uh, do this all day long. Uh, thank you very much for coming to the show. We really appreciate it. Thank you, Chris.

It's really been a pleasure. I've loved it. I think this, I think this is exciting technology. I mean, between the counterfeit prevention and building things and, you know, just building better products because, God forbid, I should have a malfunction when I'm opening my coconut water. It's a big problem if it happens, right? It's a crisis.

It would be. It would be. I'd be like, oh, my God, it's spilled everywhere, which is probably, you know, what goes on with that. Anyway, thank you very much, Sean, for coming on the show. We really appreciate it. And thanks, Moniz audience for tuning in. Go to goodreads.com, Fortunes, Christmas, LinkedIn.com, Fortunes, Christmas, YouTube.com, Fortunes, Christmas. Subscribe to the big LinkedIn newsletter.

That thing grows like a weed in 130,000 LinkedIn group on LinkedIn. Go to Christmasfacebook.com as well. Thanks for tuning in. Be good to each other. Stay safe, and we'll see you guys next time.