The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Junkworld: The Ballad of Leroy Brown by Mk Stangeland

Episode Date: August 29, 2023

Junkworld: The Ballad of Leroy Brown by Mk Stangeland https://amzn.to/47UMPHZ Junkworld - a planet for discarded machines. Fresh off his latest victory, it is here that champion fighting robot Leroy Brown inexplicably finds himself. Certain his presence on Junkworld is a mistake, Leroy makes it his mission to go home. Enter the Top Dog. A tyrant determined to conquer all of Junkworld, the Top Dog demands Leroy's capture for reasons known only to himself. This mysterious focus on Leroy ensures it is only a matter of time before Leroy's mission to return home intertwines with the fight against the Top Dog. But just when Leroy Brown shows he may be the best hope Junkworld has, his entire world threatens to collapse - with devastating consequences.

You wanted the best. You've got the best podcast, the hottest podcast in the world. The Chris Voss Show, the preeminent podcast with guests so smart you may experience serious brain bleed. The CEOs, authors, thought leaders, visionaries, and motivators. Get ready, get ready, strap yourself in. Keep your hands, arms, and legs inside the vehicle at all times because you're about to go on a monster education roller coaster with your brain. Now, here's your host, Chris Voss. Hi, folks. It's Voss here from thechrisvossshow.com, thechrisvossshow.com. Welcome to the big big show my family and friends we certainly appreciate you guys being here what would we ever do with or without you well i don't know with or without

you this is like a song without you clearly i can't sing and that's why i do podcasting ladies and gentlemen the chris voss show you're part of the family that loves you but doesn't judge you harshly at least not as much as your father does when he looks at you with those disappointed eyes going, where did I go wrong? No, I'm sure your father's a wonderful gentleman. He's just still disappointed. He's like, man, what was I thinking? Anyway, guys, you're part of a family that loves you and doesn't judge you. And in the meantime, help support that family by going to itunes.com for just christmas um

youtube.com for just christmas linkedin.com for just christmas uh christmas one on tiktok and uh subscribe to the linkedin newsletter what an amazing gentleman on the show and he's got a cool new book out that i think most people are gonna like and if you don't well maybe you should read it and then you might find out if you like it he's the author newest book that came out or else damn it he's the author of the newest book that came out march 31st 2023 called junk world the ballad of leroy brown mk stangland is on the show with us today we're going to be talking to him it's about his latest book and all the stuff that went into it and all that good stuff. In the meantime, let's get into a little bit about him and what he has done. He is a writer from Southeast South Dakota.

He keeps himself busy with multiple occupations, among them his budding writing career and serving as assisted living for his grandma. Michael is a fan of enjoyable stories in their multiple forms, including but not limited to books, movies, television, comics, theaters, and RPGs. Junk World, The Ballad of Leroy Brown is his first published novel, and it will certainly not be his last. That sounds like a great promise or a threat. I'm not sure which. We'll find out. Welcome to the show, Michael. show michael how are you yes hello thank you for that introduction thank you for having me on and thank you for coming on it's wonderful to have you give us

your dark columns wherever you want people to find you on the room sir um well i recognize this is one of those uh i mean flaws for someone who is a writer and trying to get out there, but I actually have kind of minimal social media presence right now. So I think the best option for people who want to look into what I'm here for is if you can go to Goodreads and look up Junk World, The Ballad of Leroy Brown there. Hopefully, you know, being here today, I'll convince people that, hey, this is something I should go look out. And even better is that if you go look at it on Goodreads, it'll have a bunch of links where there's online sites for purchasing a copy. There you go. Goodreads is a great place to be.

In fact, our podcast supports everything to Goodreads. It automatically sends every episode to Goodreads and shows up on our blog over there. So, very good place. We love the Goodreads it automatically sends uh every episode to goodreads and shows up on our blog over there so uh very good place we love the goodreads in fact i think we've given away a lot of books on goodreads come to think of it uh so people follow them over there and then uh so give us a an idea of what's in the book it was like a 30 000 overview of this book what type of what genre is it etc etc well at it is primarily a science fiction book but it's also got a bunch of it's got a bunch of other elements in there i kind of think of it may be weird to think about on the surface but in a sense at its core there's a bit of a sports story element

but then around it it's got action it's got adventure it's got military. It's got adventure. It's got military. And of course, it's all wrapped up in a science fiction story. So Junk World, The Ballad of Leroy Brown. It's about a robot, a combat robot, arena fighter. You know, if you've ever seen something like BattleBots or the movie Real Steel, you might have some idea about what's going on. You know, you have two robots, they go into an arena and they try and break each other.

So yeah, at the start of the story, you have the title character, Leroy Brown, and he has basically just become undefeated champion. And, you know, he's doing great. However, naturally, you know, robots's doing, he's, he's doing great. However, naturally, you know, robots go in, they need maintenance. And when he, he's reactivated from getting shut down for mains, he discovers he's on and then he's somewhere else entirely. And he has no idea what's going on. He discovers he's on this planet called junk world, which is basically a giant garbage dump, a giant scrap

heap where people send machines that they don't want anymore. Sounds like the story of my life. So naturally, given where he was at beforehand, he is certain that this is a mistake. And so he makes it his mission to go back. Now, while this is happening, he draws the attention of a robot called the Top Dog. And this is a robot that he's a mechanized tyrant that is trying to conquer the planet. He's a pretty bad dude. Now, he learns about Leroy, and for reasons that only the top dog knows about, he wants Leroy brought to him alive. So naturally, you wind up having Leroy's mission to go back home intersecting with this. You know this fight against the top dog.

That is trying to conquer the planet. And you know those. Those intertwine. And it brings the story together. And it eventually leads to certain twists. And reveals of things. Maybe not be in the way. That they might first appear.

Ah. Plot twist as they say. Or something like that. So junk world why why uh oh let's uh let's dig into the title a little bit the ballad of leroy brown uh correct me if i'm wrong but was this a song from the 70s yes um i think the um the musician jim craw think. I could be wrong. Something like that, yeah. I don't know either. Among the songs he

composed, he recorded, was Bad Bad Leroy Brown, you know, baddest man in the whole you know. So that is actually, I mean, where, I mean, that is where I took the name from.

It is a direct reference to it. It's, I mean, the character, I mean, the character doesn't necessarily share a whole lot of personality traits. But, you know, Leroy Brown, the robot, he is a pretty, he is pretty, he is pretty good at, you know, he is pretty good at fighting people. So there is definitely, he's the, you know, the name it's come, you know, it's, it's applied pretty well. There you go. So, uh, why did you choose it? What drew you to it? You mean to the title? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I wouldn't say there's any specific draw, but going back to what I mentioned, the things of combat robots and that, one of the cultural things is that people who build these robots, they often have names that either, they're either kind of minor jokes know, minor jokes that you can still say normally or they may be referenced to other thing and I kind of

played into that a little bit when I was creating this character where I was thinking what's what's a good name for a really, for a really tough robot and I'd say that's a song it's it's I mean because it is a pretty good song and I thought hey this works out pretty well I can take it and apply it to Leroy Brown. There you go. So it has a kind of stickiness to it, you know, Leroy Brown, especially if you've heard the song. I mean, I'm singing in my head right now because I used to have a tape of it back from much my younger years, about five years ago when I was very young. And so it sticks with me.

So it's set in this science fiction sort of format and kind of battle bots. Are there any humans in it or is it pretty much uh the they're the only i mean the only the only chapter in which there are non-robot characters are in the prologue which is showing the life that leroy is living before he gets sent there which is which is an essential chapter because it because it's hard to get a full understanding of what it's harder to get an understanding of hey why does leroy want to get go back if you don't know what he's going back to so you have that you know the intro but then once you get to um junk world the whole rest of the story every single character in it is a robot it's all and part i mean part of um part of what i've i do make reference into

there to help late because sometimes because one of the important things of when you're setting up twists is making sure you have ground rules or making so you can't so you can't you're not lying to the audience and maybe giving them pieces so that i mean maybe they'll just go along but then there are also the readers who are going to be trying to figure out what's going on and one of the pieces i put in here to help establish that the twist is and say hey this is the same planet but distant in the future is make reference to the fact that you know this is a planet where no biological life has ever lived so there's a certain element of yes they took this they found this

uninhabitable planet and decided i mean we can't do much else with it let's jump dump our junk there so wow it's kind of so happy it was like hey yeah dump C-3PO and R2-D2 over there, right? Yeah. It's a planet where the only characters in it are robots. They built a bit of a civilization for themselves out of...

They're not wanted anymore, but they want to have a purpose so the ones that are reactivated, they've just tried to find that purpose for themselves. I know some bots that are humans that need a purpose. So there you go. That's a different story for another time. So what are some of your sources of inspiration that helped guide you through the book or me want to write this story? Well, there's, unfortunately it feels sometimes like I'm just, you know, beating the same drum when I'm trying to talk about that stuff. Cause oftentimes it does go back to what is the main inspiration?

Well, I've already said it like it's battle bots. It's, I mean, cause that's really where, you know, when I, cause the way this story worked out, the character of Leroy Brown was actually created first and there was a certain element of this world he came from that came first. And that came from my love of BattleBots and especially the revival that started up a few years ago and then, you know, Junk World, you know, tossing him into that. I, you know, I kind of had to build that up. I mean, there are certain, as far as, you know, the whole picture, I'd say there's a lot of different pieces here and there that, you know, that, that various inspiration comes from.

So there's not necessarily one big inspiration for the rest of it, but there's pieces that other things that are, I've gotten like one, one of the more out there examples is that in the book there is for a short time there's this giant mechanized spider walker that is an example of here's one of the things that these robots are building out of spare parts to continue their lives okay now where i got that from and why i decided to put in the book is i'm looking for something to fill a certain role. And where do I go to? Well, for people who might remember that back in, like, I think maybe 98 or the late 90s, there was the Wild Wild West movie with, you know, starring Will Smith.

And one of the big things in there was that giant metal spider. And I know a lot of people don't like that movie, but as someone who's growing up as a kid, you got that giant metal spider and I'm thinking, hey, that's pretty cool. So one of those things is, you know, when I'm looking for certain elements, I can take the, you know, this thing that I find is cool and I can find a role for it provided i can make it fit it naturally into the story and and it's kind of funny because i'm because um i don't remember exactly names but my understanding is that like there's a producer of that movie and he also was responsible for like the nicholas cage superman movie that didn't happen that was

supposed to have like a giant spider. And there's a part of me that's thinking, you know, he's, he has this obsession with giant spiders that don't go well. And there's a part of me mentally imagining him going like, yes, vindication.

Yeah. I think, uh, who's didn't one of the directors and producers of, of some of the silent Bob movies. he was fairly critical of that show. I think he did a stage bit one time where he told the story about how they brought on that director. And the director was like, we're going to do this. I think they were trying to do it with Batman or something, too.

He's like, what? So there you go. But at least it's in your book. So there you go. Well, I mean, I fully understand why people would criticize him for that and like yeah i mean making a giant spider the main villain of a superman movie yeah i can get it that's pretty stupid yeah but at the same time as an individual element you know i look at the movie and i see this giant robot spider and i think hey yeah that's i mean the giant robot spider that's pretty cool so you know i look at the movie and i see this giant robot spider and i think hey yeah that's i mean the

giant robot spider that's pretty cool so you know if i have a if i can fit it in naturally into this story why why not take this thing i feel is cool because as they say you know good artists you know great artists steal that's true that's true i mean it's all creative swiping i think when it really comes down to it anyway, right? Yeah. I mean, the real thing is, how do you do the implementation? Is the implementation knock this what what motivated you want to become a writer uh i imagine you've been writing for some time and usually people leave that up and then finally do a book yeah well i've got sort of two halves to that because there was an initial spark of writing when i was real young a real young kid where I didn't, where I really didn't know what I was doing.

But some of my earliest memories of writing is stuff that I didn't even write myself. I told the story to my mom and then my mom would put the actual words and then may I do some scribbles. A couple examples are like this story called The Flying Trees. I did like a couple of those, which was basically my family, but as trees that could uproot and fly around. I mean, it's really, I mean,

for, for young kid, real simple stuff, but, and then another major example is that growing up, me and my brothers were big fans of the teenage mutant Ninja turtles. So we did what was basically the equivalent of fan fiction, just short stories. Amusingly, I'm pretty sure one of them involves the turtles

going back in time to the dinosaurs and fighting dinosaurs, which is kind of funny when I consider that what's one of the big elements, recurring elements of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, turtles in time. So there was an extended period there where writing wasn't a main focus, but what really picked it up again was when I was in college. And are you familiar with the

web series Red vs. Blue? No. Okay. It's, long story short, these guys took the Halo video game and basically used it as an animation engine. You know, they made the characters move, they put voiceover on it. Within Halo, at least, there's, I mean, it's a big thing. I mean, they attracted the attention of the guys behind halo and everything so at that at that

i think there was an extended period and even now certain where in a sense my main focus is in movies and film but the thing is at its at its core all of it involves storytelling. I mean, I mean, some movies can get away with spectacle over story, but at the end of the day, the best movies, even when they are mainly spectacle, have good stories. And so as an individual, what put me focused on writing is that, you know, I mean, writing, you know, in book form and that, I mean, that's the one that's kind of, I mean, that's the one that requires, you know, the least large investment. It's easiest to get into, like, it takes a lot of money. It takes a lot of equipment to make a movie or, you know, a TV show or any of that stuff. A novel, you know, anyone with a keyboard, something to write on,

you can go ahead and write a book. So anyways, I've, you know, I digress. So anyways, this Red versus Blue series, they were, and watching this, I'm thinking, I want to do this. So what wound up happening is I wound up writing basically a full season's worth of scripts, but episodes like two, three, four minutes long, which could have served as the basis of the same type of show. that show never actually got made even though i had these scripts but the important thing from that is that writing that and there's i also wrote a stage play in college and those things right there those got me back into the groove of writing started me on the trend to where i am right now there you go there you go uh so what's your process as a writer? Some people have different processes on how they write. Sometimes they write in the morning, at least an hour a day. Some people just drink a lot of coffee. Ernest Hemingway, I think, drank a lot

of vodka or something. I don't know what he was drinking, but evidently there was something. What's your process? Well, the process I found for me is a lot of times I will, before I put anything to page, I'll oftentimes have what effectively amounts to kind of a first draft or outline that basically forms all in my head. I have an idea of what I'm doing before I actually write anything. Then from there, it's, I might write an outline, I'll probably write an outline, like get details down, then I'll go into first draft, well, first draft, second draft, depending on how you count it. But as, and a lot of times I may be doing writing when I'm not even actually writing where I do a lot of it I do a lot of writing and figuring out details in my head like I'm at work if I'm doing just

main things that you know do require attention but it's not hard brain work and from there as far as I mean as far as when I'm at the keyboard, I mean, it can really vary. I might wind up finding opportunities to sit outside and write. I might just be at the computer. So there's a lot of variety. I mean, the book I'm currently working on that's currently in draft form, that one I actually tried a different format where i think it's been described as some people will have everything planned out and then some people will just go at it and see what they

can they see what comes out on the page for the one i'm currently working on it actually i actually did try the approach of um you know just see what comes out on the page. But then I, I, I get like what, maybe one chapter, one and a half chapters. And I'm thinking, you know, I'm thinking, I'm seeing a lot of parallels or connective pieces that might pull inspiration from, you know, a book that exists, you know, famous books that exist. So then I paused that and went back and I, I read a bunch of various other books, you know, kind of went down some rabbit holes. And then in a sense, even though I tried to start going in with an approach of just see what happens, I wound up coming up with an outline in my head anyway. So there you go.

There you go. Uh, that's one way to do it, man. What are some of the challenges that you run into in maybe some people run into they can't write? What are some of the big challenges that you find and deal with when you're writing? I'd say one of the biggest challenges is knowing what's good as is and what does need change because it's i mean it's very very difficult for anyone to actually get like i mean realistically speaking any any first draft is gonna need a rewrite someone you're good it's gonna need edding and all that thing is it's hard to tell, like, what actually, what of this do I have that needs to, it needs to change? And what do I have that's good as is? And there is a certain element where the process I use, sometimes I wonder if, you know, that plays into it. Because, because a lot, because again, a lot of stuff I'm working on, I mean, I'm forming my head.

So the stuff that in my head, it changes when it gets to the page. So there's very much a question of what do I have? That's good. What do I have that I, I mean, the stuff that I like, what if it actually needs to go to spite of me liking it and what are the stuff. So there's very much a question of making sure I have a good product that I'm not, I'm not editing it into a state of something bad. And what am I, you know, what can I, what should I hold on to? What needs to go? Because it may need editing, but, you know, it's not just editing. It's also making sure you're editing it, editing it right. And, you know, sometimes, I mean, even though I'm not, you know, you hear stories about projects that get ruined by editors, get ruined by publishers, get ruined by producers. Now, sometimes those changes from those people up top are actually good things. And sometimes people making the actual product, you know, they can have bad ideas they can have i mean so there's a lot going on there of not knowing what is the right decision definitely and uh you know you got to find the

right editor right people all that sort of good stuff um what advice would you give to other writers who want to be writing you know you've written your first book it sounds like you're working on something else we'll get to here in a second what are some other things that you've you've uh you've uh seen uh your advice you give to others i'd say one of the i mean one of the big ones that i've come across that i think really it that i mean is really true is that experience is the best teacher. Where does the best inspiration come from? Stuff in real, I mean, you know, just lived experiences. And I mean, look for, and look for, I mean, always be, have your eyes open for inspiration.

And in that sense, well, the more you're, you're exposing your eyes to the more variety of stuff you're, you know, you're, I mean, the more you're exposing your eyes to, the more variety of stuff you're, you know, I mean, the more you have to go from, the more inspiration you're going to pull from. And, you know, the more it's, it's very much a matter of, you know, if you're just sitting in your room, not doing anything, I mean, where's, like I said before, you know, best artists steal, you know, there's borrowing and stealing, but what are you going to borrow and steal from for your book if you're not exposing yourself to anything? Definitely. You've got to definitely have that exposure. So let me ask you this. You've alluded to, you're working on some other projects can you tease out some of that well the one i'm working on right now um is is it's a bit of it's a bit of an interesting thing because i'm trying and i am effectively taking a bunch of you know more classical stories and kind

of it's basically trying to stick them together in a way that makes sense. I've kind of, if I can remember correctly, kind of humorously referred to it as like Dante presents Alice's journey to see the wizard at the center of the crystal. There, yeah, there is there. I did in that. I did in fact,

wind up reading, reading that as part of that. That is one of the rabbit holes i went down it's and let me tell you rabbit holes well yeah but it's it's let me tell you it is not an easy book to read even i mean i i got this copy that has like notes and it's i still i still scrub i had to go through it like twice to figure it out but no but i but that's currently what i'm working on it's a fantasy story um but i've also got a few other projects that i've previously tried reading try you know previously tried going the through the traditional process

and you know the big thing is i you know these stories were stories that i could get you know, the big thing is I, you know, many stories were stories that I could get, you know, literary agents interested in. So my approach was when no other literary agent, you know, no one was interested. Okay, I still have confidence in this. So I'm just going to set it aside for now. And then maybe someday if I have proper, you know, clout in that, I can go back and, you know, get a second approach. So

I've got, like, two, I got like, you know, two, three, depending on how, like books that are in that are arguably are arguably ready in some state. And then beyond that, I've got like a, like, I got a buttload of, of story ideas. So I have, so yeah, when I say, you know, this is not going to be my last book. Absolutely not. I mean, I think, I mean, realistically, realistically speaking, my approach is that it's a, it's worth thing to say, but you know, you have to hear, you know, you have people think about like, what are you going to do for retirement and all that? And my approach is, well, realistically, if I could pull it off, I don't want to retire. I just want to wind up in a situation where I'm just writing books, you know, maybe someday if I, if I'm successful enough,

maybe try my hand at stuff like movies and that, but it would be a matter of, I just want to be making this stuff so that I'm like, I die and, you know, I've got my last book coming out or maybe I have a book that's half finished that. So, yeah, the last book,

the last book of, of, of Michael Stringland. But the, you know, that's the beautiful thing about writing is, you know, it's mostly in your mind. Michael Stangland. That's the beautiful thing about writing is it's mostly in your mind and a lot of people we have on the show,

we have people that I think are in their 80s that have been on the show and they've written like 60 books and you can kind of keep writing. It's much different than if you're trying to do bricklaying. That's much harder to do at 80. Yeah, and I would say, I age. And age really isn't, I mean, as long as you've got your mind intact, I mean, age isn't a thing. In fact, I'd say there are like two individuals I think to as far as age

that really have, I mean, have been a bit of a minor point of inspiration for me. You've got kind of two distinct points. You've got Alan Rickman and Ulysses S. Grant. And my thought is like both of them in their respective fields, they kind of got, in a sense, a late start for really being who they are. Alan Rickman, he got a late start in acting, but he, I mean, he became a big name and, you know, he could still be going, still be a big thing, you know, if he hadn't passed when he did. And then Ulysses S. Grant, I read a biography of him once, and it made a point of saying that if he had died like at 30, I don't know what, 35 or

somewhere in there, like before he turned 40. I mean, he would be just a footnote in history of that. Like he had a military career before that, but it was only when he was up there and the civil war broke out that he really became something. And I look at those and that really does remind me, inspires me that, you know,

I mean, yes, there are limitations limitations to age the body does degrade as you get older but there is really no i mean as long as you are alive there is still i mean there is still opportunity for you there is still a chance you know to do something with your life there you go i'm i'm 55 so i'm still trying to figure that out. Well, there you go. I'm glad the opportunity is there. What was the old line from The Treasure of the Sierra Madre with Bogie?

You're still young enough. You have plenty of times to chase other fortunes in life, or something to that effect. Somebody can quote it at the end of the movie, but it's a beautiful line. Michael, this has been really insightful and fun to have you on. Sounds like you've written an an exciting book might make a good screenplay for a movie because everyone likes robots and movies and you know there's probably a lot of ai terminator type movies that are coming out soon with ai that you know talk about machines and and uh you know there

are are soon to be overlords if you will yeah it, it has not been lost on me that as I've finally gotten this book that is all about robots out there for people to read, oh, what's happening? Well, we've got AI being a big issue. Yeah, you know, and there you go. There might be some plots for the further one. So on your next project, do you think you're going to continue a series with this book? Or maybe you're at a standalone of a whole different nature? Well, the best answer I can give for this book is a very solid maybe.

There you go. I mean, I think the main points of inspiration for potential sequels came about where, you know, when I was still in the process of looking for a literary agent, one of the things I kept in mind is that oftentimes, you know, if you do have success, you know, there are going to be people, I mean, the people who print it, if it is successful, they're going to be looking for sequels. So I did have, I did spark some ideas. The thing is, I'm not sure how many of those ideas are ideas I, I, I, I'm really happy with and how many of them are just, well, this, if this book need a sequel, well, at least I've got something working for me. So I think the real, I i mean the real question is one you know if this book does does manage to go on and be a big hit because i am still in a because i am still working towards you know

getting word out there getting people knowing about it so it would be a case of one is that would there actually be demand for it and two do i have a story idea i really like because you know it's one thing to put out a sequel give people more of this and of these characters it's another thing to give people a sequel that won't have won't have them wishing that it had stayed with one had stayed to one edition because how often do we see that of hey i want more of this oh wait i guess we didn't want more of it because the more we got of it um yeah not so happy so but you know strangely enough the um like the strongest idea i've latched on to that i would like is you know i mentioned the top dog, the character, the strongest idea I

have in my head is to, you know, do more with him, like go back and follow, you know, his lead up to getting where he is as the story opens. Cause it's, it's a weird situation where when I think at this, think about this book and think like, what are my favorite parts of it i find strangely enough most of those moments in that involve the top dog in some way so maybe he's the spinoff well yeah that that would be some i mean that is that strange thing where the the most interest i have is for the villain which you know if i'm looking, which if I'm looking to try and convince people, hey, there's another sales point. If you like good villains,

hey, this book, I am really confident that the villain of this book is a great villain. There you go. Bad robots. Always the best kind. This has been really insightful, Michael, to have you on. Give us your dot coms. Where do you want people to find you on the interwebs again?

Well, I'd say right now, I mean, again, I recognize it's not the ideal situation where I kind of have a... But long story short, again, the best place to go looking up this book both you know if you want to see you know want to look into it more maybe find opportunity if you're interested is going to the goodreads page for it um yeah i'm just more than anything i'm directing people more to this book and because you know what social media presence i do have there's not really anything there. So my attitude is more, hey, if I can get people interested in the book, the book is really the product. People aren't buying me. They are buying, I mean, I'm not the entertainer. The book is the entertainer.

So I figure, you know, people are going to the book, look up the, you know, Junk World on Goodreads or, you know, just go look for it at your favorite online retailer, find junk world, the battle of Leroy Brown. And, you know, I figure that if the book is successful, then I will, you know, I'll be, I'll have a larger presence because of it. There you go. There you go. Well, it's been wonderful to have you on Michael. Thank you very much for coming on. Yes. And and again thank you for having me on and thank you for this conversation there you go so uh pick up the book folks wherever fine books are sold stay away those alleyway bookstores because they're dangerous damn it you can uh get mugged well yeah but that i mean hopefully yeah because that going, one of the things is that right now there isn't a lot of presence. I mean, I am very much trying to get people to know about this book.

So hopefully if enough people buy it online, that'll show people, hey, a physical retailer, you want a book that's going to bring people in that'll get you a business? Hey, maybe you should stock this and you'll have people come in and for it there you go order up where fine books are sold march 31st 2023 it came out junk world the ballad of leroy brown by mk stangland and uh check it out enjoy it and order up and of course christmas is coming so you might want to uh take take and get some extra copies you can give away as gifts as well. Thanks for tuning in. Go to Goodreads.com, Fortunes of Christmas, LinkedIn.com, Fortunes of Christmas, YouTube, and Twitter, Instagram, TikTok. You know the drill, folks. You've been here for 15 years.

Thanks for tuning in. Be good to each other. Stay safe. We'll see you guys next time.