The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Razor 03: A Night Stalker’s Wars by Alan C. Mack

Episode Date: May 12, 2023

Razor 03: A Night Stalker’s Wars by Alan C. Mack https://amzn.to/41uJ5sb “A truly extraordinary book by a phenomenal pilot and warrior. Alan Mack was in the thick of every sensitive, harrowing, high-stakes operation in the decade following 9/11. His account of combat from the cockpit of the world’s most exceptional special ops aviation unit and of the toll it took on him and his family is forthright, riveting, raw, compelling, and inspirational. Readers will not be able to put Razor 3 down.” -General David H. Petraeus, US Army (Ret.), former Commander of the Surge in Iraq, US Central Command, and Coalition Forces in Afghanistan, and former Director of the CIAFinalist, 2022 Army Historical Foundation Distinguished Writing Awards The attacks of September 11, 2001, prompted the creation of a robust and deadly special operations force -- Task Force Dagger. Alan C. Mack, Callsign Razor 03, led a team of MH-47E helicopters and armed MH-60s. Their two-fold mission – Personnel Recovery (PR) and Unconventional Warfare (UW) involved flying in terrain and weather previously not thought possible. If that wasn’t enough, they pushed the flight envelope of their specially modified Chinooks to the limit and beyond. Mack shares his behind-the-scenes perspective of the Horse Soldier’s infill into Afghanistan. He discusses the hunt for Osama Bin Laden at Tora Bora and describes his shootdown during Operation Anaconda. Years later, he chased Bowe Bergdahl, rescued hostages in Iraq, and the U.S. Navy Seal ‘Lone Survivor’ from the Kunar Valley. Mack’s near-death experiences and frequent deployments not only affected him, but pushed his wife toward prescription opioids. Her developing addiction led to friction as he kept her secret and continued to deploy. He lived by his unit’s motto, Night Stalkers Don’t Quit! He wouldn’t quit on his unit – he couldn’t quit on his family. His story of success, tragedy, and ultimate happiness is as old as warfare itself. About the Author CW5 ALAN C. MACK retired from the Army as a Master Aviator. He served over 35 years in the Army, first as an aircraft mechanic then as a pilot. He flew CH-47s in support of Operations Desert Shield and Storm. Additionally, he spent 17 years flying MH-47 Chinooks with the 160th SOAR. As a Night Stalker Flight Lead, he participated in Operations Desert Thunder, Desert Fox, Enduring, and Iraqi Freedom. His awards include the Legion of Merit, 2 Distinguished Flying Crosses, 10 Air medals – 1 with ‘V,’ and a Combat Action Badge. Alan finished his career as Commander of the West Point Flight Detachment. Now he and his wife Patti live happily in New York’s Hudson Valley.

You wanted the best. You've got the best podcast, the hottest podcast in the world. The Chris Voss Show, the preeminent podcast with guests so smart you may experience serious brain bleed. The CEOs, authors, thought leaders, visionaries, and motivators. Get ready, get ready, strap yourself in. Keep your hands, arms, and legs inside the vehicle at all times, because you're about to go on a monster education rollercoaster with your brain. Now, here's your host, Chris Voss. Hi, folks. This is Voss here from the chrisvossshow.com, the chrisvossshow.com. Welcome to the big show, everyone. We certainly appreciate you guys coming by. Oh, my gosh. It's the big show, everyone. We certainly appreciate you guys coming by.

Oh, my gosh. It's the big Circus Tent podcast in the sky with all the brilliant people, all the smart people, and everyone is there, and I am none of the smart people. I'm just one of the dumb guys who's the host of the show, but we certainly appreciate you being here. Go to Goodreads.com, 4Chess, Chris Voss, YouTube.com, 4Chess, Chris Voss, LinkedIn.com, 4Chess, Chris Voss. Check out the new AI podcast at AICrisVoss.com, 4chesschrisfoss. YouTube.com, 4chesschrisfoss. LinkedIn.com, 4chesschrisfoss.

Check out the new AI podcast at aichrisfoss.com. Yeah, that's it. AI podcast with chrisfoss.com. And also, what the hell is the other one? chrisfossleadershippodcast.com as well. Anyway, we have an amazing gentleman on the show to tell us his story about his journey as a military officer and he's quite extraordinary in his what he's done he's i guess with the class of cdw so uh he was in the military for quite some time he's got an amazing story in his book that has just come out um september 15th

2022 it's called razor 3 a a Night Stalker's Wars. Alan C. Mack joins us on the show today. He's going to be talking to us about his wonderful book. He's an elite aviator, war hero, and author of the latest book that we just aforementioned. The call to adventure was persuasive and he moved up the ranks from aircraft mechanic to night stalker flight lead in the military. Let's see. He was flying MH-47 Shinnoks with a 160th soar over his 35 years in the Army. His experienced leadership put him at the forefront of his clandestine special operations,

some still too classified to discuss in an open forum. The man has secrets. Secrets, I say. His awards include the Legion of Merit, two distinguished flying crosses, Still too classified to discuss in an open forum. The man has secrets. Secrets, I say. His awards include the Legion of Merit, two Distinguished Flying Crosses, 10 Air Medals, one with the V. We'll find out what that's about. I think that's about the TV series in the 90s, wasn't it?

The V? No, I'm sure it wasn't. And he has a combat action badge. You know how many badges I have? None, because I suck. But he's awesome. So we have him on the show. He finished his military career as a commander of the West Point Military Academy's flight detachment before taking on public service in Orange County, New York, serving as a deputy commissioner of emergency management. Welcome to the show, Alan. How are

you? Hey, I'm great. Thanks for having me. There you go. Well, you're a highly decorated officer. Uh, thanks for joining us on the show. Give us your.com. So people can find you on the interwebs, please. Yeah. So it's pretty simple.

Alan C Mac.com. And that's a L a N for Alan. So Alan C Mac.com. There you go. And then just calm down there, Alan. You're, you're,

you're energy's a little too high for the show. I got him laughing there. He's, he's going boys. Um, so Alan, uh, what motivates you want to write this book? Uh, your energy's a little too high for the show. I got him laughing there. He's going, boys. So, Alan, what motivated you to want to write this book? Actually, the movie 12 Strong came out.

So, you know, I flew the horse soldiers in, you know, the guys that were portrayed in that movie. Like Chris Hemsworth was in there. He was supposed to play me in the movie, but he played the Green Beret major instead. I guess he was a little too short for me anyway. That's true.

He's too good looking too. Yeah, yeah, for sure. He's ridiculously good looking. I don't know what that means. It's not like a joke. Well, I was invited to the premiere down in Manhattan. And while I was there, I was talking to an author that was working with that team, uh, named Jim DeFelice. He wrote the book,

American sniper, which they made a movie of that. Yeah. He's like, you know, you, you tell a good story. Why don't you write a book?

And I was thinking, I don't know about that. Right. And he offered to help, which turned out to be smoking cigars and drinking bourbon, which was enough. Yeah. That's always a great way.

That's kind of what got me rolling. There you go. If you do that, will you write? It works out pretty well here. I don't know. Maybe it doesn't. I don't know.

It depends on if you set your paperwork on fire. People don't do that anymore. They don't use typewriters. So tell us a little about your history. What was your upbringing? What got you into being in the military? You know, it's kind of funny. It's the, the be all you can be commercials back in the seventies.

So I was in junior high and those things were running around, you know, on the TV, all four channels. And I just, they had like three of them that involved helicopters, and I always wanted to fly helicopters. And the Army offered a program at the time called High School to Flight School. Like you graduate high school and put in for Army flight school and go, right? So I go to the recruiter, you know, and I say, hey, I'd like to fly helicopters. He's like, oh, you know, pump the brakes there, turbo. It doesn't work that way. So he said, why don't you join as an aircraft

mechanic you know kind of learn the culture the climate learn something you know some of the lingo and uh then put in for flight school and it's a lot easier well that's a little recruiter spiel but uh it turned out to be good advice there you go uh i worked on helicopters for nine years and kind of hit a point in the army where it was time to either get out or move up. And moving up for me was flight school. So I put in for it with the idea that if I didn't get picked up, I'd just get out. And I got picked up. And, I mean, you did, what was it, 35 years?

Yeah, 35 years, 11 months. Wow, man. I mean, that is a long time to be in the military. Do most people stay that long or do they usually roll out? No, a lot of guys will do their four years or three years and get out. And then if they stay, they'll typically get out at 20, which is what I would have done, except 9-11 happened, the war was raging, and I was in a kind of an important position in the special operations community. So I didn't want to get out. There you go.

And speaking of 9-11, that's kind of where your book begins. Let's talk about what launches into that. Yeah. Okay. So I'm down in Louisiana. There's what they call the Joint Readiness Training Center. And that's where special operations forces go to practice. It's a big free play area where you get to use all your tools, you know, all your equipment that you might not be able to use out, uh, out and about, but you can use it there because it's restricted area.

And, uh, I flew the night of the 10th, came back, was kind of trying to sleep in because we were operating at night. And somebody yelled down the hallway, turn on your TV, turn on your TV. And we were staying in one of these old military barracks that have cinder block walls and tile floors. So the noise just carries. So I was like, shut up. They're like, no, turn on your TV. So I turn it on. And obviously there's a tower burning.

And I thought, wow wow somebody's in trouble you know because the Empire State Building had hit I think in the 30s with an airplane and I thought you know how could that happen you know that's busy airspace but and you know about that time in comes another one it's like okay this is no accident you know and it kind of went from there. Yeah, it was a horrific moment. I had lost $75,000 off our portfolio of rate drops for a mortgage company, and it became apparent that I had to lock them all. And so I spent the night drinking and locking and losing $75,000. One of the things is when you have a portfolio like that, it floats. Until you lock everything in, it's floating. So, you know, it can go up and down, you know, I've,

I've lost up to $400,000 on it. Um, and, and then you can gain too, but, uh, I spent the night drinking. And so this, the next morning I'd been up to like three, just doing all these loans, putting them in the computer. And i'd stayed up till three and uh i at 7 a.m i called the the mortgage desk to go hey man you need to make sure i put a lot shit in the computer somebody needs to get on it this morning and uh they go wall street's been blown up like that's what they told me i was like what and they go you need to turn on your television and so smashed into the wall of you know i can't i can't have my context and i go down to the tv and i see i turn on cnn and i see the building on a flame and i'm sitting there

going what the fuck you know and i'm hung over and just just not in the best of uh moods or anything and then i see that second plane come in live yeah so i'm with you on that that was it was extraordinary to watch it live and hit that realization that you're like we're under fucking attack it was extraordinary moment um and and so that that made you want to stay in the military yeah uh because you know you just got to remember what it felt like right after 9-11. You know, America had come together really in a way that it hadn't in a long time and certainly isn't anymore. And we were part of, you heard it called the pointy tip of the spear, if you will, right? And so in the special operations community, we knew we would be part of the response.

And as a flight lead in the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment or 160th SOAR, I knew I would be definitely part of it because there's very few of us amongst the few in the organization. Damn. Damn. So where do you go from there once that happens? Do you start gearing up for Afghanistan? Pretty close. So we drove back to Fort Campbell, Kentucky, which is up near Nashville. And once we got back, we were able to get on the classified networks and computers and find out what had happened. And the next day, I was on my way to Tampa, Florida, which is where the Special Operations Command resides. And we drove down in a 15 passenger van with a bunch of special

planners. And initially our plan was just to go over to Afghanistan and be what they call personnel recovery or PR. So if a bomber crew got shot down or had to eject or something, we would go rescue them. And they ended up putting us in a country called Uzbekistan, which is just to the north of Afghanistan because Afghanistan is landlocked. And we just sat there waiting for someone to screw up. And we were there by October 3rd. So that's how fast we moved.

And then we had another task force move to the south on a carrier, the Kitty Hawk. And were you mostly always flying the Chinooks? No, I started out flying UH-1 Hueys, like the ESA and Vietnam. And I was lucky enough to be at the top of my class, and I had two Chinook slots, and I was lucky enough to be the top of my class and I had two Chinook slots and I was lucky enough to get one because junior pilots generally didn't fly them back in those days. And, uh, that's how I got it. I actually was mad that I got it because I wanted to do assault work and I thought Chinooks were all, um, you know, moving cargo, which I turned out that wasn't the case. Well, great plug out to your book.

You've got a, you've got a quote, a reference from General Petraeus. So that's, that's pretty freaking awesome now in front of a book. Yeah. Yeah. I get him and Bill McRaven is on there. Oh, wow. There you go, man. Great endorsement.

And you've got wonderful ratings of the book too. So order it up people. That's a plug for the book. So what was your most interesting mission as a pilot? Can you tease a little bit out? Yeah, probably. Well, there were a lot of interesting ones, but probably the very first one, which was on October 19th, I brought the horse soldiers in.

They weren't the horse soldiers at the time. They were ODA 595, which is a designation for a special forces team of 12 Green Berets. And that's where the movie 12 Strong comes from. But I flew them in the very first night that we flew and encountered some weather conditions that really turned everybody else around. And I was able to continue with just the one Chinook and 12 guys in the back. And we use what was called a terrain following radar or TF, right? And what that does is you, you essentially play a little video game in the cockpit and this video game

allows you to climb and descend over mountains at 300 feet when you can't see out the window. Holy crap. Yeah. So it was, uh, that was probably the most interesting. And 300 feet, you know, you're, I guess you're trying to evade sonar radar and radar and so on. Yeah, well, I mean, it's designed to fly at 100, 300, or 500. And at the time, 500 wasn't certified for use in the clouds because it was brand new.

And we'd never been allowed to use it for real because it was considered too dangerous. Oh, wow. Because, like, is your laptop or your phone ever bricked up on you yeah well imagine the black boxes on a 62 million dollar aircraft doing the same thing yeah and one of them is the radar so and you're 100 feet off the ground right and so they hadn't yet certified 500 and 100 is really kind of too low that's really for avoiding radar so 300 was really the just the altitude that it had and, uh, it allowed it to, to see the terrain a little better.

And, uh, yeah, it was, it was pretty cool. That's quite a, I mean, you're, you're, you're, you're a, basically a carrier carriers, uh, carrying, you know, special operators, you're carrying different people in your thing. So you're, you're just not a pilot who's responsible for himself flying, you know, an F-16 fighter jet. You have a whole mess of people on the back that, you know, are on some sort of mission and, and, and your, your ability to keep them alive or get them to where they're going or out of where they're going is, is everything.

What, how do you remain calm and keep focused in issues like that? And, uh, what does it feel like to have that sort of power no i'm just kidding i mean responsibility yeah um you know what it comes down to is the one thing that the special operations community is famous for is its realistic training and essentially what you end up doing is we would call stress inoculation. So you put yourself in stressful situations in peacetime, in training events, so that when you experience it for real, it's kind of muscle memory. And that's really what it was. There's determination, obviously, because 9-11 had just happened. The missions we're doing, we know that if we fail this, I mean, Donald Rumsfeld, the secretary of defense had called down personally to make sure we took off that night because he knew the weather was bad. And he's like, you have equipment to do it. You do it. Okay. You know, so we did,

you know, and we encountered some problems along the way, but, uh, we were able to just stay calm because we just, you know, fell back on our training. Now you get home, home as in back to the Fort operating base and you kind of get away from the aircraft and you sit down and you try to have a, you know, a cup of water or something and your hand starts to shake a little bit. It was like, okay, that, that sucked. You're kind of like, uh, I can't believe I made it through this. Uh, that was the first couple of weeks. We flew every night. So there were two flight leads, me and another one.

We each had two helicopters. And one night after about our third mission, we snuck off in a corner, and the CIA had given him a bottle of bourbon. And he's like, Al, come here. I got a little snort, right? So we go off alone, and we're trying to just decide, you know, are we doing the right thing? You know, what am I doing versus what you're doing? You know, and he goes, what do you think, Al?

And I said, I think we're going to die in the next flight. And he says, yeah, me too. And we did not expect to live through, because every mission was a little bit different. We encountered a different problem in each one and we were pushing the aircraft beyond any limit that we'd ever been allowed to do in peacetime. So it's like, okay, theoretically this should work,

but we've never been allowed to get to these limits. And so we had a lot of ordnance fired at us, meaning heat-seeking missiles, we had 16 of them fired at us i had two fired at me uh in one day and uh we have like flares you see it in the movies you know the missile comes at you the flares come out and it decoys them but that still doesn't you know

make it feel good there's no guarantees on that you know no no not at all as a matter of fact if they shoot multiple missiles at you at with the equipment we had at the time, sometimes the sensors, which were like these little eyeballs, would get blinded for 30, 40 seconds. So if you fired two in rapid succession, the second one might get you because they don't spit the flares out. But that's all changed. That's better stuff now. And then the big thing over there was the grenade launchers, the over-the-shoulder grenade launchers that all those little iraqis had and afghanistanis have so you know they're shooting that crap at you oh they're everywhere you know we we had um

yeah i can't even count the number of rpgs or 23 millimeter cannons fired at us so 23 millimeters like a 50 like it's bigger than a 50 cal it's like you know that big around the projectile as well wow that big around it's about that long it looks like little flaming softballs coming at you yeah you see it you see it in the news like when they invaded iraq the first time you know the it's snakes through the sky oh yeah that's what those were yeah wow yeah note to self stay away from those bullets yeah i don't i don't like flaming snowballs being thrown at me. No. Maybe on Friday nights.

I don't know. It depends on what we're drinking. So this is quite an extraordinary story. I guess at one point you were almost shot down or were you shot down? I was shot down. March 3rd of 2002. I was part of what was called Operation Anaconda. And that's a long story,

but the gist of it is I put these Navy SEALs on the top of a mountain called Tarkar Gar, which was later renamed Roberts Ridge because we got hit with an RPG and a bunch of machine gun fire that took all the systems out of the aircraft. So no electricity,

no guns, so we couldn't even defend ourselves. And I was able to get off the mountain, but in the process we lost one of the aircraft. So no electricity, no guns. So we couldn't even defend ourselves. And I was able to get off the mountain, but in the process, we lost one of the Navy SEALs. He fell out of the back of the aircraft onto the snow, which was about hip deep. And it was 12,000, almost 13,000 feet in altitude. And I ended up on the ground in a valley below. He's up on the top, my wingman. So I was Raz zero three and that's the call. So that's the part of the title and razor zero four came and picked us up, moved us to a safe location and then took the seals back in, which is where,

uh, two medals of honor were, uh, were, uh, well earned. Yeah. Wow.

That's crazy. I, it was funny. You, you mentioned the, the, the date, uh, I guess you never you mentioned the, the, the date, uh,

I guess you never forget your first, uh, helicopter shoot down. you never forget your first shoot down. If you live. Oh, that. And so you've got all these crazy stories packed in the book where people can read about your adventures and,

and everything else. Uh, were you ever afraid you were going to die? Uh, maybe when you were shot down, was there ever. Yeah. I mean, uh, you know, like I die? Uh, maybe when you were shot down, was there ever? Yeah. I mean, uh, you know, like I talked in the, in the beginning of the war, I definitely

didn't think I'd survive past an admission or two. Uh, when I got shot down, you know, um, once again, training, I was, you know, occupied mentally trying to save the aircraft, you know, and the crew. And, um, other than that, I was never, you know, I crew and um other than that i was never you know i'd like to say i was never successfully engaged again without intending to be so you know i got shot at again but it was like i knew the bad guy it was usually what we call a kazevac you know you come in to get somebody that's been shot and you know there's you know machine guns rpgs and uh yeah you don't know that you're going to make it but you're going to try because you're going to try to save that guy's life.

And then once you get out of there, you know, the adrenaline is just flowing and you just, once again, training kicks in and you just, you do what you got to do. And then later on, you can sit there and say, ah, shit. Was it hard to transition after all those years and two wars back to being a civilian? Yeah. I'll tell you, there was a little bit of a process there because the title of the book, Razor Zero Three, A Night Stalker's Wars, is like a little bit of a play on words in that I was in Desert Storm. I was in some other operations that I don't talk about. I was in Enduring Freedom, which was Afghanistan, in Iraqi Freedom, which was Iraq.

So that's one set of wars. And the other was my wife at the time had a prescription opioid addiction. Oh, my God. And so as the years went by, it got worse and worse, and we were trying to hide it. We were trying to deal with it. She went to rehab, and she ended up dying in 2012. Oh, no, I'm sorry. Yeah.

But it's one of those things we were kind of on the cutting edge, I'd like to say, of the current prescription opioid addiction epidemic. But anyway, when she died, the organization I was in, the Night Stalkers, offered some very nice opportunities for me, trying to take care of me. And I said, you know, I need to change a venue because everywhere I look is kind of a sad memory because either it was happy and now I don't have it or it was sad because it was bad. And I went up to New York, to Manhattan, and I unveiled a statue that's currently at Ground Zero, which is called America's Response.

And it's a green beret on the back of a horse representing the horse soldiers. And while I was up in New York, a job opened up at West Point as the flight detachment commander for West Point. So I would fly a couple of helicopters up there and I threw my name in the hat and I got it and did three years there. And now the reason I go into that is because as a flight lead in the 160th, you live by the news. So if you live by the news you know so if you watch the news and you see an event it's like how does that affect me should i look that up you

know and you start digging into the encyclopedias what's the climate in country x you know and you get to west point it's like well what's the temperature in dc you know or what's the temperature at notre dame or notre dame you know the College? And because you're flying the superintendent around and the parachute team and things like that. But I'd like to say, in the special operations community, you get the stresses up here. At West Point, it was like down here, but it wasn't like just a straight out transition would be down like this. And a lot of guys don't do well with that. So, the responsibility I had there at West Point, I'd like to say, was just enough guys don't do well with that. So, you know, as the responsibility I had there at West Point, I'd like to say it was just enough stress to kind of keep me going.

Met my current wife, the cadets I worked with were just amazing, kind of gave me back my positive attitude, you know, that I'd lost with all the, uh, opioid addiction stuff. And it just so happened, I ended up meeting our County executive who needed an emergency manager, and I had all the certifications for it, and I worked with him on an air show, you know, creating it, and he's like, hey, you know, I don't have a helicopter, but I've got a job for you if you want it. I was like, well, what is it? Anything to do with emergencies? And he's like, as a matter of fact, it does.

So I ended up as a deputy commissioner of emergency services for Orange County, New York. And that's a lot like the military. So I've had a very, very easy transition. I have friends who have not done so well. Yeah. A couple of suicides and a couple of guys that just, you know, they're still not doing well. But I turned out pretty good. Good.

Well, that's good to hear. The suicide rate of veterans is way too high. Yeah. And we've had different authors on that talked about it, PTSD and things of that nature. Did you know at the, I don't know how well you knew people over there at the West Point, we had Dr. Nate Zinser on the show? I don't know him. Okay.

Yeah. It's a big place I hear. Yeah. if he owed me money or something i would have you owed you money you probably remember yeah well it's good that you come you know the other thing a lot of my friends that have been in the military talk about that went back for three or four two or tours of duty on um uh in iraq was they missed the brotherhood and the purpose, the sense of purpose. They're just like, I feel so alone here. But when I go back there, I have a band of brothers. I have people that they're loyal to me. I'm loyal to them.

They have my back. It's really hard for them to make the transition to being right here. I'm sorry to cut you off. People ask me all the time do you miss you know flying and the answer is a simple no i don't really miss flying i miss the missions right i mean we we were going after the baddest of bad people i mean we were in the unit that got bin laden and zarkawi and you know things like that and it's the people it's exactly what

you're saying it's the people you it's exactly what you're saying. It's the people you're doing that mission with that make all the difference. I mean, there were times I was overseas and the guy that was going to replace me, his wife had a baby and he called me up and he's like, Al, could you, I hate to ask you this, I know you've been there four months already, but could you stay an extra couple of weeks so I could, and so I could spend some time with a new baby. And I was like, nah, I'll take, you know, two more months, you know, and give them, you know, another couple of months.

And these were things in the early days that you just did because we always thought we were going to get bin Laden. You know, we always kind of knew he was across the border in a certain area, you know, just not the house. And you never wanted, you didn't really want to go home because you were afraid the guy that replaced you would get him, you know, just not the house. And, uh, you never wanted, you didn't really want to go home because you were afraid the guy that replaced you would get him, you know, but it turns out the guy that got him, the guy that got him was the guy that used to replace me.

Wow. That is, that is awesome. Well, it's a joint effort, man. Yeah. We're, we're all in it. That guy, that guy hid really well for a long time. I was so relieved that the night that broadcast and obama got on the on the telly and said we got him it was uh i don't know what it was you know the the thing was

is it 9-11 really fucking changed me you know seeing that same vision on tv that you did with that second plane coming in live that that that fucking scarred me and i did not feel fully healed or uh what was it fully reconciled until he was dead and i don't know why call it some psychologists can figure out what the fuck that's all about but yeah well it's good it's good for people like you who stand between us and the bad guys because uh this country wouldn't be what it is, uh, without you folks. So we certainly appreciate your tour of duty and everything you did for this country.

And, and, uh, without you, I mean, who knows where we'd be as a democracy, as a country, I'd probably still be,

we'd probably be sitting around and watching the, uh, the King's coronation there. We could be, we could be, what do they call the 4th of July? Happy traders day. Traders day. Well could be, we could be, what do they call the 4th of July? Happy traders day. Traders day.

Well, I'm going to be a trader. I watched this, some of that King's coronation. I'm like, nah, now I see what our father founding fathers were like. So this is stupid and boring.

I don't know. It's not stupid. It is stupid. Anyway, uh, anything more you want to tease out of the book before we go out? Um, well,

there's just, there's a lot of stories in there. Most of these are stories that were somewhere on the news at the time. And we attributed these to other people so that we didn't take credit for it. So you're getting it from my perspective. And I just signed a contract for a second book. There you go. So I'm just now outlining it and getting ready to go.

And it was a lot of fun writing it, the whole process. And I'm getting to go out and speak and stuff, but you know, get the book. It's on hardcover Kindle and audio book, which I narrated. There you go. Maybe you can get the Pentagon to pry up in some of those classified missions. You can tell us the story. I'm hoping, I'm hoping, you know, especially as time goes by. That'll do a novel.

And like basically a basic characters on, I think somebody did that., especially as time goes by. They ought to do a novel and like basically base the characters on, I think somebody did that. Anyway, I don't know. I don't want to get you in trouble with the Pentagon. Yeah, they did. They scrutinized the book pretty good. Did they? They gave it a good look.

Took them nine months. Yeah. There you go. Wow. Wow. Nine months. Look at it. They read really slow over there.

Yes. Supposed to take 60 days. Yeah. Well, you know, they got, they got some other stuff going on with that whole Russian war thing. That's a whole nother thing there, but hopefully that stays down so you can just stay home and, and are you retired now?

Fully retired? Well, other than I work for the county. So retired from the military. There you go. Now you're just writing military books, which is a good gig. Well, thanks for coming on, Alan. We really appreciate it. Hey, thanks for coming on, Alan. We really appreciate it.

Hey, thanks for having me. This was fun. Thank you. Give us your.com so we can find you on the interwebs, please. Yeah, alancmac.com. That's A-L-A-N-C-M-A-C-K. There you go. Also, you can get me on Instagram, alancmac2015.

And I would like some followers. Please, get some followers. He's got amazing reviews on the book. He's got some great brand names. Go to Amazon or wherever fine books are sold. Order it up. Razor 03, I should mention. It's not just Razor 3.

It's Razor 03. A Night Stalker's Wars by Alan C. Mack. Order it where fine books are sold. Thanks, my friends, for tuning in. Be good to each other. Stay safe, and we'll see you guys next time. And that should...