The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – The 5-Day Job Search: Proven Strategies to Answering Tough Interview Questions & Getting Multiple Job Offers by Annie Margarita Yang

Episode Date: October 9, 2023

The 5-Day Job Search: Proven Strategies to Answering Tough Interview Questions & Getting Multiple Job Offers by Annie Margarita Yang https://amzn.to/3LTD7fg Anniemargaritayang.com Discover the ultimate guide to landing your dream job and receiving multiple job offers in just five days! Renowned finance expert for Millennials, Annie Margarita Yang, presents The 5-Day Job Search, a groundbreaking system designed to transform your job-seeking experience. Tailored for job hunters across all industries, this comprehensive book offers a fresh, pragmatic approach to job hunting, ensuring you can secure multiple job offers even during severe economic downturns. In just five days, reap the incredible benefits of The 5-Day Job Search: Follow a prescriptive formula broken down into easy, simple steps Find a fulfilling, rewarding career that aligns with your gifts and talents Join a top company with an amazing work culture where you fit right in Stand out with a strong personal brand that attracts employers Receive responses from companies within 24 hours, joining the elite 2% of applicants that obtain interview requests Gain the confidence and tools to sell yourself effectively Exude confidence in interviews, resulting in a written job offer in 90% of instances Secure a job offer with a $25k to $35k raise compared to your current salary Develop resilience to handle challenges and setbacks throughout your job search You'll be guided through a foolproof system covering essential topics, including: Finding work that aligns with your core values for greater happiness and success Developing a killer LinkedIn profile, headshot, and professional website and email signature to strengthen your personal brand Identifying and filling gaps in your skillset to advance your career and increase earning potential Crafting a standout resume that highlights accomplishments and reaches hiring managers Researching companies before interviews to gain insights and tailor your approach Enhancing interviewing skills and asking the right questions, positioning yourself as a leading candidate Conquering rejection and criticism and harnessing your personal power Addressing the challenging salary question and negotiating favorable offers As a bonus, gain access to downloadable tools for refining your resume, developing your personal brand, resetting your thoughts, determining your core values, and more. Join satisfied readers who have transformed their careers and achieved financial success with The 5-Day Job Search. Buy your copy today and embark on a journey to a fulfilling, rewarding, and well-paid career. Don't miss out on unlocking your full potential and landing the job you've always wanted. Invest in your future and let Annie Margarita Yang's proven strategies guide you to success.

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to do i'm just kidding uh go to goodreads.com fortress chris voss linkedin.com fortress chris voss youtube.com fortress chris voss and chris.com, Fortress Chris Voss. YouTube.com, Fortress Chris Voss. And Chris Voss won on the tickety-tockety. As always, we have the most brilliant minds on the show who bring you things that will make you smarter, better. They'll give you the Chris Voss show glow, as we like to say it. That's a trademark, actually. And in essence, you will become sexier all around. As you walk around life, people just being amazed.

They'll be like, holy crap, he's got the Chris Voss glow. He's just, wow, he must listen to the podcast. I must listen to it too. And as always, they are joining us on the show. We have another wonderful young lady joining us today. Annie Margarita Yang joins us on the show today. She is the author of the latest book to come out August 6, 2023. It's called The Five-Day Job Search, Proven Strategies to Answering Tough

Interview Questions and Getting Multiple Job Offers. This sounds like something a lot of people should want, especially those folks over there on the LinkedIn-ity, as they say, TikTok-ity, LinkedIn-ity. It just doesn't work on LinkedIn, does it? I can get away with TikTok. She is a game changer for millennials tired of running a never-ending financial treadmill. She is a money-saving guru with over a million YouTube views. And she's also written Amazon bestsellers like the 5-Day Job Search we'll be talking about today and 1,001 ways to save money.

That's a lot of ways to save money, and definitely we should hear about that as well. She is not a Gen Xer or from an earlier generation. Okay, Boomer. She's a millennial who understands how crazy the job market and helping positive bank account status is right now. It's always good to keep that bank account positive, I hear. She gets it. She delayed dream struggles and hunger for escape. But here's the thing. She doesn't just talk the talk, she walks it. And that's why we're excited to have her on the show. Some of the systems she's been created to make financial freedom feel more like an achievable goal

than an unrealistic dream. So if you're a millennial or probably a Gen Z or maybe overwhelmed by your student loan debt, finding a perfect job or how you'll pay all your bills, her latest book is all the tips you're going to need. And if you're Gen Z, you'll want to avoid crushing debt in the first place. I think some of them are already kind of in the college thing, so they might have signed up for it. But the more you can avoid, the better. Welcome to the show, Annie. How are you? Hey, Chris. Thank you so much for having me on your show today. I'm so excited to be here today to share insights from the five-day job search. Just wanted to put this in here. If people watch until the very end,

they'll learn how to get 10 off a signed paperback copy ah there you go i love autographed copies of books they're they're they're more personal to me and more valuable i think uh if anybody ever sold one of my books that i'd personally autographed for them to them personally i'd be like kind of offended because i'm like that was for you man but whatever dude uh I see it's on eBay. So Annie, give us your dot coms. Where can people find you on the interwebs? The main place where they can find me is on Annie Yang financial dot com. My largest social media right now is YouTube. They can just search for Annie Margarita Yang.

And I'm also growing my TikTok. Just started yesterday, literally. So they can find me on TikTok with the username Annie Yang Financial. There you go. Well, you should do well on there. The TikTok is great for the young kids and YouTube is as well. The young kids just really love both those formats. So give us a 30,000 overview of what's inside the five-day job search. The five-day job search is basically a misnomer. I know people like instant gratification. They want something quick, easy, and they think there's some sort of secret to landing a job in only five

days. So that's why I got this catchy title here. But actually, if they read the introduction, they're going to find out that to land a job in five days, you have to become the kind of person that's worthy of landing one in five days. So it's really, if you love personal development, self-improvement, that's all in here. This tells me, this sounds like one of my dates told me on Tinder that I need to be more worthy of love. But my mom also tells me that too that i need to be more worthy of love of any love but my mom also tells me that too i need to be worthy of love uh and that somebody should get around to it i'm just kidding she's wonderful uh so uh thanks matthew fulton for calling in thank you for sharing your book with us annie appreciate the comments there bud uh so what uh what motivated you want to write this book i know it seems obvious and i may have alluded to it in the biography but people like to hear it from your words uh uh you know what motivated you

to write this book actually it's not obvious i didn't want to write the book at all i wasn't interested writing a book is a huge endeavor i'm not interested in writing a second book i already wrote one oh you're one damn it What more do you want from me people? Yeah. But, um, I honestly, I think I have some psychic ability. I can hear voices in my head. I'm not schizophrenic. I, I mentally same completely. All right. I'm very smart young lady. Um, I'm just very intuitive. And one day when I was trying to go to sleep at night at 1 AM, I just heard 10 voices in my head going off. you got to write this next book. I don't want to write it. And on and on for like an hour. I'm just like, leave me alone. I want to sleep. But then just kept saying, you got to put this in the book and that in the book. And I said, come back in the morning. All right, I got to sleep. I have work

tomorrow. And they wouldn't stop. They just said, no, you won't listen to us in the morning. You got to write this down now. So I got up. I started writing everything down. Slept at 4 a.m. Next day, the same thing. And I thought, this is insane. Or you're going insane.

It went on for 10 days. What I did was I dictated everything that I heard into my iPhone for the next 10 days. And then I just transcribed it into a manuscript. That became the book. Wow. That's one way to do it. Yeah. I wrote it in 10 days. I tried doing that with the voices in my head, but the manuscript just said, kill, kill, kill, kill, kill. But evidently I have a few, as most of my listeners know. So there's that. Yeah.

And it says it in that voice. Go, go, go, go. You know, that sort of thing. I don't know. I can't do the voice. So there's great tips that are there. Tell us a little bit about your origin story, how you grew up. You know, I believe you're a millennial, as you've cited in your bio.

Yeah. How did that shape you and kind of shape the book as well, I suppose, as you went through this journey of your life? Well, I'm 28 now. I graduated high school 10 years ago back in 2013. I'm from a working class Chinese immigrant family. So I'm the first generation here. My parents don't have a lot of money. And during my senior year in high school, everyone in my school was applying to go to college. 99% of people from my school got into college. I'm the 1%. Well, not even 1%, 0.1% that didn't get in. Not because I'm not capable or qualified, but because I didn't even apply. I was the only student in the whole school that didn't even apply to go to college because it just,

it didn't make sense to go without already knowing what I want to do with my life because I'm a straight A student my whole life. All I've known is school. And I'm like, why go in circles? I see people after they graduate college, they realize, Oh,

I actually don't like accounting. All right. I actually don't like accounting. I actually don't like psychology, but I've spent $100,000 on this degree. I have to do something with it. I didn't want to do that. I wanted to avoid that, especially because my parents didn't have money. That's where I come from, basically. I saw that a lot in life. I went through the same thing when I was 18. I had a Pell Grant. My parents were poor.

I had a Pell Grant to go to the University of Utah, and I started my first company. And I thought, well, this company thing seems to be working out. I'm going to go do the run for that. But I knew a lot of people, you know, that were going to college, and they're changing their major every week, you know. Yeah, you're like, how's that psychology thing working out for you? And they're like, I'm doing a construction major and you know the next week they're like doing you're like what do you want what do you want to know and i do know over the course of my lifetime i've seen so many people you know i've met ceos that you know what was your major in college ballerina

ballerina um you're like what uh you literal, uh, some of my friends with, uh, literal arts and liberal arts, uh, you know, and, and they studied drama and acting and, you know, their CEOs of companies. But, um, it's interesting to the people, uh, struggle with that. And I, I know as the millennial generation had a lot of struggles because they were kind of born into that age of the 2008 crash and the financial nightmare and light recession that that was the great recession i think it was what we call it and so that kind of scarred them and and and kind of impeded their their ability to hit the ground running a little bit i think yeah i i totally agree and that is why when i was in school in 2012 i was like looking at everything that was happening to millennials that were in college or just recently finished i was

like this doesn't make sense i was reading the news at the time and every day i just couldn't stop reading about student loans because this was my future, right? And I would read about how half of the people who recently graduated college didn't even have a job or they were underemployed, meaning they were working a job that either didn't require their degree or it just wasn't related to their degree at all. Not only that, the average student loan debt coming out at that time was $26,000, which to me was unfathomable. And then now today it's worse. It's $36,000. Yeah.

And you know what's really awful is a lot of it, a lot of it just services the interest. There are people my age in their 50s that I see on Facebook and they're like, I finally paid off my student loans. And I'm like, you've been paying that for 30. Yeah. Yeah. That's actually really common.

Yeah, it is. Half of borrowers are over 35 years old. Really? Yeah. Wow. And the average person get this takes 21 years to pay off their student loans in full.

Do they really 21 years? Yeah. It's not 10 years. It's 20. See, I own a mortgage company for 20 years. and I started seeing that at the tail end of it before the 2008 crisis wiped all the mortgage companies out. And I would see doctors that, you know, they were making like 200 grand a year.

They come out of med school and stuff, but their, their debt service on their college loans was so huge. They may as well have been living on a minimum wage income. They couldn't afford nice houses. They couldn't afford hardly anything. And I'm like, wait, you're a doctor and you get paid all this money, but all of it's going towards, you know, loan service. And so people don't realize a lot of these things. So you wrote the book, 1001 Ways, I Believe to Save Money. Correct.

There you go. And so that probably was some tips at living frugal and living within your means. And now this one, the five-day job search. And I imagine this is fairly popular on LinkedIn as well, isn't it? I haven't, I actually haven't promoted it yet. I'm actually starting my marketing. I have this huge marketing plan.

I plan on getting on 500 podcasts. Oh. Yeah, and share all of those podcasts with people on LinkedIn, on Instagram, on YouTube, on TikTok. We're not there yet, but I plan to sell over a million copies. There you go. I love your plan, man.

You've got a plan, and that's the way to do it. I know you can with this, especially LinkedIn, because LinkedIn, the large majority of LinkedIn is job searcher seekers or potential job seekers. And then recruiters are just all over that thing. And so that's the that's the business place to go when people go there. So in today's digital age, how does personal branding play into job search? Okay. What people don't realize is that everyone already has a personal brand. Even if you don't even have an online profile on social media, you have a personal brand online. The personal brand is the i don't have social media personal brand and if you have social media but what you post on social media is this is what they wrote on my

starbucks cup or this is what i ate for dinner last night your personal brand is this is what i ate for dinner last night if you have aol.com is your email address uh is that a personal brand too then yeah like people instantly judge you for what you post online so you know the saying you are what you eat personal branding online and how it relates to your job search you are what you post oh well there you go and it's really true we've talked about this on the show before in fact i think we had a little bit of a debate on a show recently. And I was talking about what you're talking about, how now everyone's pretty much a personal brand,

especially online. When you put your little shilling out there and you're like, I'm XYZ, you're building a personal brand. And I've had people unlike yourself that have talked about on LinkedIn, you need to manage your personal brand brand if you're putting up a lot of stupid stuff on linkedin while you're searching for a job like i don't know idiot memes or maybe some political stuff job job searchers job recruiters are going to see that and go yeah not this guy we can see right through him we know exactly what he's about he's he's the one that's going to be in HR every five minutes. There you go. And you'll never know it.

That's the thing. You'll never know it. You'll never know why they didn't reach out to you for the interview, why you didn't get the job. They just simply will ignore you. Yeah. It's like on Tinder. Like no one ever tells you they left swiped you.

You just never know. So you just sit there paranoid all the time going, am I getting left swiped you you just never know so you just sit there paranoid all the time going am i getting left swiped i don't know i should maybe there should be a counter that says how many times you've been left swiped and right swiped that would be brutal man uh so um you know do you think that millennials and gen z years get this more than people in the gen x department like i said we had a little bit of a debate it the other day with somebody who didn't think that social media online accounts are branding. Do you think you guys get this more because you guys grew up in this digital age? That's not true. Okay. Yeah.

I look at my friends on Facebook. I look at my connections on LinkedIn. They're not branding themselves. That's why I'm the one getting all the five day job searches. And they're here saying that they've been looking for a job for six months, they still don't have a job yet. Because the things I see them posting online, I'm like, this has nothing to do with your work. Yeah, they're posting pictures of the family. It's nice. It's a personal Facebook, but you can't avoid the fact that when an employer is looking to hire, they want the best one for the job.

And unless you're showcasing the fact that you are the best person for the job, because you posted something related to your expertise, not just once, but over and over and over again to build that perception. That's not what they're going to think of you for. And I don't know if you, I imagine you know this,

but I don't know if a lot of people know this, but there are some really, heavy uh internet crawling software that companies are starting to use now that can hunt down they can put in your email your phone number your name and they can hunt down just about every account you own across social media um and they can see your accounts then they can see what you're posting uh i mean they can do like a really deep dive background check i suppose if you've got i don't know some um some account on i don't know some site that you shouldn't be on or something that will hide something you know whatever um they're gonna see it and they're gonna know they're gonna find they're gonna be like it and they're going to know. They're going to find you. They're going to find you.

And they're going to be like, yeah, I don't know this person for us. If you're posting stuff that's toxic or maybe isn't going to do well around the water cooler at the office, or maybe you're posting something that isn't in line with, you know, diversity and stuff like that. You know, there's a lot of these diversity departments now. Initiatives, yeah. Initiatives, the DAEI. And they're probably going to be like, this guy isn't going to work out.

He's posting some racist stuff and things along those lines. Yeah, this reminds me of something. It's a book that I read called Lycanomics. There's four types of people. There's a highly competent, highly agreeable person, highly competent, but a jerk. That's probably me. Then there's like the polite person, but incompetent. And then there's like you're incompetent and you're a jerk. No, that's me right there. If you're in the last category, no one wants to hire you.

This is why I work for myself, Annie. What you should try is the second and the third category. People would rather work with someone who's polite but incompetent than an incompetent jerk. That's true. If people see the kinds of things that you're posting online are not necessary. Well, I hate the word politically correct. I don't think I like to be politically correct. But just if you're the kind of person, you're so divisiveness and you definitely show your anger online.

Just kind of like bad energy. Nobody likes bad energy. Nobody likes that energy. Nobody likes working for bad bosses. That's why people leave companies or bad environments or bad, you know, communities and stuff like that. People don't like that. They want to do their work and they want to go home and all that good stuff. So how does a personal branding differentiate a job seeker in a competitive market and how can it elevate an individual in their niche?

How can it bring us up before a brand? Well, first of all, if someone's looking for a job and you want to be competitive, you at least need the LinkedIn profile. It's like the new resume. The resume can only fit one page. On that one page, you can put, I don I don't know three four job experiences your degree and then some volunteer work maybe that's all whatever you whatever you want to make up yeah unless you make the font so tiny that nobody can read it I do that too you can't fit very much but the LinkedIn you can put all of your past job history that's related and that will help you it will give you that extra oomph because maybe

you've had actually six experiences related to what you want to apply for, but you can't fit it all on the resume. So I feel like the LinkedIn is more of a way to showcase the rest of your background to round you out. Not only that, you can also make your LinkedIn look very beautiful, very visually pleasing and attractive, right? Along with the bio, I think a lot of people mess the bio up because you can't put that on a resume, but on their bio, they just put some one-liner like, I'm an accountant working in the real estate industry. I'm a guy. Yeah. What they really need is something that says, this is who I am. This is what I do. This is what I'm looking for. Yeah. I find when I've hired, I've hired candidates myself and I'm

looking at their, their resume. They don't stand out. You know what? At first I wanted to spend at least a minute on each resume because I read that the average recruiter spends only six to 10 seconds looking at a resume and I thought I want to be a bit more you know considerate of people I want to actually read the resume and then after doing that for a few minutes I thought this is pointless I can't tell the difference between all of these applicants if I just cross off the name from the top there I would have thought they were all the same. Wow. I couldn't tell who to give the interview to. So I feel like the LinkedIn, if you actually have a LinkedIn URL at the top of your resume that people can go to and check out, they can see more and see how you're different.

It allows more flexibility basically so for someone starting out for a job or launching their own venture uh you think that linkedin is probably one of the most important places they should be initially especially for a job or venture for a venture in terms of the venture i think it's not necessarily about getting clients through linkedin but the networking and meeting the right people exactly you do want to work with, who can help you. Yeah. And, and I don't think a lot of people know how much background checking goes into there. When we pick people that come on the show, when we, when I look at people to network with, or, you know, I get outreach on email and some sort of offer or PR

thing, or, you know, someone wants to talk to me about something I check with LinkedIn and I'll, I'll check with social media too. I don't have the sophisticated things that hunts down everyone's emails and, and, uh, websites and accounts, but, uh, you know, people have to realize it's out there. Like people are still pretty oblivious to you find at not realizing that there's so much of their online footprint that people can find stuff, you know? I mean, people always find my OnlyFans account. There's not many people.

Yeah. I actually was so embarrassed by this because I did an audit of my own online footprint. I started using the internet when I was in fifth grade using this username called AnnieLovePie, which I don't like to admit to people because it's like very cute. Pie is good though. It doesn't sound professional though. That's true. So I,

four years ago, I Googled Annie love pie. I also Googled my full name, Annie Yang and Annie Margarita Yang. And I found things on there. I was like, Ooh, this is really embarrassing because when I was a teenager,

I like to answer questions on Yahoooo answers and someone had asked why does it feel so good to stay under like warm cozy blankets and i answered that question and i don't remember what my answer was but it was really embarrassing and i thought wow if somebody searched me i i'd be really embarrassed yeah and see you you guys the millennials are the first generation to grow up wow, if somebody searched me, I'd be really embarrassed. Yeah. See, you guys, the millennials, are the first generation to grow up like that with a footprint. Us as Gen Xers, we did a lot of stupid stuff. Sometimes we weren't the best people, but none of it's recorded anywhere because there was no internet. Like, you know, we never, you know, the time when the cop had to talk to us about throwing the football on the street and it hit a car, you know,

that sort of stuff or something, you know, and there's no record of that anywhere. It's just like lost in the times and memories of people. But you guys are the first generations to do that. And then Gen Z as well, where, you know, you guys literally have a footprint from the beginning of life. Like, if your parents were

really loose on social media there's probably half naked pictures of you as a baby on facebook or something hey there's our cute new baby and it's like do you really want to have that all hanging out when he finds that photo when he's 20 or his boss that's why the lawsuits have started people have turned 18 and have had their parents share their entire life on social media. Oh, my gosh. They're now suing their parents. Are they really suing their parents? Yeah, they're suing their parents because it's an invasion of their privacy.

And they didn't give their parents permission to do that. Wow. Wow. This is one of the millionth reasons why I didn't have kids. But this is interesting and it's something, as you point out, people need to think about and be aware of. And I imagine you've got to do a little bit of background cleaning once you do this sort of digital analysis, archiving of what's in your history, right? Yeah. The first thing that I did was once I found something that I didn't like, I deleted that account. So I deleted my Yahoo account. I deleted, I had a whole bunch of websites that I made usernames for, like a login for that I didn't even remember I made a login

for. I was like, when did I sign up for this? But apparently I did did so i had to reset password and thank god it you know came to my email and i reset the password then i closed the account immediately some of them i couldn't access i had to just email customer support and say this is mine here's my my id you know please delete it i don't want it showing on google anymore there you go i had to do that with all of my only fan accounts um and the thing is there's that wayback machine uh company that scours the internet is supposed to scrape everything so it's supposed to but it doesn't actually scrape everything it's not like it's every day yeah at a certain frequency so it's still okay oh does it uh there you go oh that's important so people need to know this stuff um how important

is it can in when people are building their brand to build some sort of consistency you know i i look at people like yourself on like on your linkedin you're talking about the same subject and you're showing that you're a professional in it you're showing that you're knowledgeable in it you're you're kind of building your brand around that um what are some common missteps people do and and how important is it to be consistent and not be like all over the place like you you look like you're crazy well it's really important to be consistent because let's take this concept in advertising they keep shoving the same commercial in front of your face over and over and over again until it gets seeded into your subconscious mind you know i keep getting fed the liberty mutual advertisement they keep going like liberty liberty liberty liberty i've heard that one i think a

hundred times i get it right so you have to apply like the same concept to your personal brand think of yourself as a company so i see people they are not even using the same name across all of their profiles so for example i was on a podcast show the other day she introduced to me her name as nick in her message then i click on her podcast show i click on her linkedin Her name's Nicolette. Oh, then I get on the show and I ask her, Hey, should I call you Nick or should I call you Nicolette? And she goes, uh, you could call me Nick or Nicolette or Nicole, whatever you want, whichever one makes you comfortable. And I thought, oh my gosh, you can't even get her own name, right? You can't even decide on that yeah this is surprisingly more common than you think the fact that people can't even get their name consistent on social

media like i had someone come to me her name was like marina and uh she had a middle name here no middle name on another profile and then just first name last initial on another one then someone else came to me and he told me like, he thought his name on LinkedIn had to be his full legal name. So it's like Constantine. But then he explains to me, cause he's trying to get coaching from me. Nobody in my life has ever called me Constantine.

That's the name on my ID. Therefore that's the name on his LinkedIn profile. And I was like, hey, there's no LinkedIn cop checking to make sure that everything you post online is accurate. It's not about being accurate. It's about who you want to present yourself to be. That's true. So I told him, you got to use the nickname that everyone knows you by because if you're getting called your nickname at work, and then you're trying to add your colleague that you've been working with for the last two years and your name on linkedin is

constantine they're gonna be like who on earth is that totally totally yeah it's it's uh it's interesting how uh how that plays out in and you talk a lot about a lot of good stuff in the book you give them a prescriptive formula on how to get their job search done and what to do. Can you tell us a little bit, tease out on that? So one of the things that I say is really important is to get the professional headshot. So what I see people putting on LinkedIn is a photo from the wedding. They think that just because a professional photographer took that picture, therefore it must be a professional headshot those are not the same things yeah especially if you're wearing the dress you know the wedding dress not the dress but from for guys

it's the suit you think that just because they dressed up with the suit and a photographer is the one who took the picture is he gonna wear a tuxedo to work every day is that what's going on um it's not the same thing the lighting is different the background is different one conveys professionalism another conveys party they also think that an iphone photo will work or a selfie i see a lot of those no i i want people to get like an actual headshot and to look amazing in the headshot, which means that you got to book a hair appointment for the same day just before the shoot. So you get a fresh haircut so that you look your best. What I told my hairstylist was make me look like I'm a famous celebrity.

Give me that kind of look. And then you also need to get a makeup artist as well. Just because you do your own makeup every day doesn't mean you mind oh you do you look great thank you you're welcome it doesn't necessarily mean that your makeup will look good for the camera camera makeup is completely different it requires different application and techniques so you should use the makeup artists that the photographer recommends that you use. And then after that,

you're prepared for the shoot. So actually 80% of looking amazing in your headshot is actually all the homework before. There you go. There you go. There's a lot of work that goes into looking good. And I know there's, there's photographers you can go to the locally.

They're really good at it. And, and they can do your LinkedIn headshots. I think you can probably Google one anywhere. But you're right. Those professional photos make all the difference. And they know how to do the lighting just right and hide all your blemishes. I mean, that's why I wear makeup. I've got so many blemishes, it's not even funny.

So there you go. So what about unique stories to tell? How can storytelling play a role in personal branding? I think what people do these days is we have a lot of people in my generation, they have a victim mentality. You're much older. Maybe you think that same. No, I do know that. that yeah yeah yeah very well aware of

that we have a victim mentality we like to point out what our identities are like oh i'm a i'm an asian american so therefore i have a glass ceiling no not glass ceiling that's for women bamboo ceiling right oh i'm also a woman i have a glass ceiling as well i'm a millennial i grew up in a time where we had the recession and now we have all the student loan debt. Houses are expensive. We can't buy houses. It's all these like complaints, right? So I think it's great. What you can do is I used to be that complainer. I used to complain all the time. What I did was I took those complaints and I flipped it into a story. So I said, Hey, I'm just your average Asian American

female millennial. I know what it's like. I've been through it myself. I understand your problems. Right. So, um, then I can turn that into a story. So one of the things that I did was like, even for job interviews, I used to work at Domino's Pizza. I would like proudly talk about my time at Domino's Pizza and my job interview and all the wonderful things that I learned there. So, for example, when I first worked there, I would complain about coming home smelling like pizza. I wasn't allowed to have my hair down. They always made me tie it up in the ponytail, which I hated. I had to wear a uniform all the time and i had to be on my feet all day i wasn't allowed to sit down at work and we didn't have

set lunch times either so if it was always busy you didn't you didn't get to eat you just have to work you know um but something that i learned there was to be grateful for the fact that i get to earn a living from doing something honest because I had a coworker who was blind. Oh, wow. Yeah. And he used to work as a sheriff one day while driving up to a stop sign. He couldn't see anymore. He had glaucoma. And then after several surgeries, he was just permanently blind. But he said, you know, I get disability income, but I'm a man. I want to provide for my family. So I still want to be contributing. And I want to find some sort of work that allows me to do stuff without my eyes and still be able to help my family pay the mortgage.

He ended up working at Domino's Pizza folding boxes. He folded a thousand boxes a day. Wow. He's done that for 10 years. Wow. And he was that for 10 years. Wow. And he was so grateful and content. And I, I looked at him and I thought, how is it that I'm someone who's like perfectly able-bodied and have so much potential. And I'm here complaining about working at Donovan's Pizza, but he's so happy.

So from this guy, I learned how to be content regardless of what I was doing. And I would share this story with my future employers. There you go. And as a side, why do you think your generation has that victim mentality? Is there any sort of reasons why? I honestly don't know. Maybe it's the in thing to do. Maybe it's the way for having camaraderie with with other people feeling like you're a part of

something everyone else is saying it i want to be part of it too i wonder if launching you guys is most of the time going into you know school and college in 2008 was a crisis point maybe shaped some of that i don't know there's a participation trophy i don't want to use that as the reason though because previous generations had a lot to deal with as well you know they had their own problems previous generations had to be drafted into the war yeah i think that's that's something to be that's something to complain about especially regardless of the time you live in if you have the right mindset and you follow the right advice, you can still end up doing well. There you go. One thing in your book that, you know, I've interviewed lots

of people, hundreds of people throughout my own companies and working for other companies. And one thing you talk in your book is how to enhance your interviewing skills, how to ask the right questions and positioning yourself as a leading candidate. That's a real skill. A lot of people really need to work on because they, a lot of people suck at being interviewed. They're really bad at it. Yeah. People, let me tell you what I, what I as a pet peeve of mine, when I had candidates applying for a position that I had open, they just kept saying, I'm the best person for the job because I'm smart.

I have X number of years experience doing this. And I am also a great communicator. Therefore, I have soft skills. Literally, everyone said something along those lines. I'm smart. I have experience. And I'm a communicator. Wow.

Yeah, it's a pet peeve of mine. They don't understand that job interviewing, trying to even land the interview to begin with, is all about thinking what the employer wants. Really, it's a sales skill. And people never actually sit down to study sales, like go to the library and pick up sales books. What can you learn from that? Because if you're actually able to think from the perspective of the employer, then the employer is like, oh, this person actually understands what my problem is and is able to help me with a problem. They don't care how smart you are. They just want someone to solve their problem.

There you go. So do people need to sit down and think, you know, what do I, what, what actual skills do I bring to the table? You know, just showing up and being like, I'm smart and cool. No, it's not about the skill. It's not even about the skill because I was doing well in interviews, even when I was looking for entry-level positions, I didn't have much skill. The thing is you need to look for the problem that they were experiencing you need to actually ask questions why is this position open what are you trying to achieve what where is the company going what is the major um thing that's

on the company's mind right now that you guys just can't seem to figure out what the answer is i i would like to ask like why if this position actually had um a previous person working there like it's not something that's just newly created why did the other person leave that's a really good question you know know, I love to ask that question. I asked, why did the previous person leave? And they started saying she was so flaky. She said she was sick. And the reason she couldn't get her work done on time was because of this illness that she had. And they had sympathy for her and they were willing to work with that.

But to leave for a lunch break for three hours. I mean, that's not good. Wait, that's bad. She thought it was okay. Stop leaving for work for three hours. This person genuinely thought it was okay. Yeah. Her desk was always a mess.

It was disorganized. So the moment I heard that, all I had to say was, don't worry, I got you. I'll show up to work on time and my desk will always be organized i'll make sure that never happens again and they were they were like cool cool we like that we like her yeah no i i really like this because people don't ask a lot of questions you'll ask people uh so okay so now we've done the interview do you have any questions like uh yeah and then the worst is when they go uh so how soon can I get paid after I start? Because I kind of need some money.

And you're like, seriously, dude? And all the good stuff. And you're just like, are you just going to get your pay and leave then? Is that how it works? But I like, the other thing is too, asking questions to a prospective employer shows that you actually have a deep interest in the job. And maybe you've done some research like, hey, I saw that, you know, there's a couple people in your glass door that has written some reviews that didn't like this. Can you tell me about, you know, maybe the environment or the, you know, the culture that you have, your company. Is it positive?

Stuff like that. Did you guys get rid of Bob, the guy everyone's complaining about on Glassdoor, et cetera, et cetera? I actually did that for my current employer, actually. I still work a full-time job while I'm selling this book. So when I was applying for jobs he offered me an interview i wanted to do my research before doing the interview so i he's a you know it's a really small business so he doesn't post much online can't find very much but what i could find online was one star reviews on google so people were complaining they didn't give me my

security deposit back they like to steal security deposits so i went into the interview and i said hey listen i tried to find as much as possible about your company all i could really find were these complaints from tenants can you explain is it really as bad as what these people make it out to be are you really stealing money you know and then he was like the most vocal people always complain online when you do something well people don't actually you know go out of their way to give you a five-star review yeah they don't it's only it's only people complain but you know the other thing that people tell me is they go well chris you're complaining and we don't get many job we don't get many complaints about things. I'm like, that's because no one takes the time.

And so sometimes it's a, it's a very valid dipstick when you get a complaint. I mean, that's what I learned in business. Yeah. Yeah. But it shows that you've done the research. Like you say, it shows that you've, you have a real interest in the job. You're not looking for a job. You're looking for a possibly a career yeah and you want to go into this interview acting like you have options like i don't need to be here i really don't need to be here i chose to be here today to interview with you and just don't say it out loud right i know but it's this attitude certain attitude and energy that just says, I want to be here. I want to learn more.

So that's the kind of approach I took with that guy when I was like, listen, these one-star reviews you've got on Google, they're a problem. I have options. I don't want to be here. If it's really as toxic or as bad as what people say. I don't want that associated with my reputation. I'm here trying to build up a stellar reputation. I'd rather work for a company that does have a stellar reputation. So please. Yeah.

You don't want to, you don't want to be someplace where, I mean, I remember years ago, this is before the internet, but years ago, I went to work at a car dealership leasing company that, that bought and sold cars from dealerships to, you know, they, they found bought and sold cars, uh, from dealerships to,

you know, they, they found buyers and they say, Hey, what car do you want? We'll have it shipped in and, and get you the exact car you want. And, uh, I went to work for them for a few months. And one day the TV news channels showed up on the front, on the front lawn. And we're asking for the owner and we're like, what's going on going on turns out they've been kiting the contracts and all sorts of stuff in the back room with not paying bills and and for maintenance you know stuff i didn't know about i was some sale and i got a job there but it was kind of embarrassing because you're like i don't want this on my resume it was all of the news and stuff and and so uh yeah i mean it's uh i've read some I've read some Glassdoor reviews, and, you know, you can read some of them.

You can be like, there's a really toxic CEO or manager over there. Like, I just know it. You just tell, like, everybody is complaining, and, you know, it's always this one guy. But, no, you're right. It shows an interest in the job. It shows you're just not looking for a new job. I've been at work for a while. I need some money, you're right. It shows an interest in the job. It shows you're just not looking for a new job. I've been at work for a while.

I need some money. I'll do anything. That's the one thing I used to hate hearing in an interview. I'll do anything. You're like, wow, dude. Okay, so you don't care what job we give you, man. You just want a job. You don't want a career.

And no company wants that i like how you are interviewing their employer because it it shows so much when you start asking the employer about the job and and you and you show a unique interest in it because like wow this person really wants this particular job or this thing or they want to work for our company and you it makes you feel uh very special and personalized as well. What are some things we haven't talked about in the book you'd like to tease off to people to get them to go pick it up? I would like to tell people they got to apply to 50 jobs a day. I don't think that's a lot. When I was doing my five-day job search, so I landed an accounting job with no accounting

degree for three job searches in a row. I did it all in under five days. People think this is not possible, but no accounting degree and got an accounting job five days. My secret is I applied to 50 jobs a day. Wow. A week. I was, my plan was to keep applying to 50 jobs a day until I actually got an offer in hand. So even if I was scheduled to do interviews, even if I already did the interview, I'm still applying to 50 jobs a day. Wow. I don't, it's not about how many people say yes to me in the end. My thought process is I only need one person to offer something.

That was my mindset. I don't care how many people say no to me or completely ignore me, ghost me. I only need one. And I think that's the sales mindset i think a lot of people they they if they apply to 50 jobs a day and they don't hear back they start getting upset they think they're rejected yeah and then they they go into this downward spiral like oh i'm not good enough i'm not worthy i don I don't have confidence. People don't like me. So, so many other people are more qualified than me. And it's none of that stuff. They create all

this mind drama. They do. And, you know, I, I still see that sometimes where I'll see young people that will be like, I'll be like, how's the job search going on? Oh, I sent out a couple resumes. I'm like a couple means two, right? Like two, like. And there used to be a time before the internet that that might work because when you put up a job, you may get some calls in the newspaper or something. But now you put up a job on the internet and you can get like 50,000 resumes overload in your email and you're just like, oh my gosh, how do we process this? And people don't realize it is a numbers game like you say it's a sales game uh the same thing applies to dating if you want to find a diamond you've got to shovel a lot of coal and you've got to dig and dig and dig and finding the right career finding the right job uh you know the one that really fits what you want to do it's a numbers game nowadays

and you know i want to share about what you just said right there is that actually in my book i compare dating and job searching together and i share the story of my my friend she's a woman she's been single for five years she's been telling me she wants to get a boyfriend who's turns into a husband and she came to visit me for five days five days she was complaining on end about how she couldn't find a boyfriend nobody wanted her and finally i was just like tell me the truth how many dates did you go on in the last 12 months she told me she went on six wow and i i was like you're telling me you went on a date every two months, like one date every two. I said, you're not following the right approach.

If I were in her shoes and I wanted to get like a husband, you know what I would do? I would line up three dates a week. Friday, Saturday, Sunday. I go on Tinder. I just swipe right for everybody. I don't care what they look like. And women don't have. I go on Tinder. I just swipe right for everybody. I don't care what they look like or anything. And women don't have to do much on Tinder. They just have to sit there and they get 400 messages a day.

Yeah. I'll just swipe. What was she doing? And I do like 150 over the course of a year. I guarantee there's at least one guy in there who could be my husband out of 150. If not, then the problem is me not you know not the guy i've seen some of that in dating where people are are overly picky and they think that shopping on tinder and going through dms or it's like going through uh is like going through this year's catalog and really you

know this is the one thing i learned about dating is you've got to go on a date with people and see if you have that simpatico energy of connectionness. And if you don't, it doesn't matter whether they own a cars or, you know, whatever their asset profile is or whatever the thing is, or, you know, maybe you go on a date with them and they smell bad. That seems to be my biggest complaint women have about me on dates. They're like, seriously, when was the last time you bathed? And I'm like last week, damn it. So there's that. But yeah, you're right.

Dating and jobs is a numbers game. A lot of stuff in life is really a numbers game. A lot of stuff is sales. You're constantly selling yourself. You know, people don't realize, you know, I've had people say to me, I don't like sales. I don't want to go into sales. You know, I'll be like, why don't you go into commission sales? It's good money if you can succeed in it.

I don't like selling myself. And it's like, no, no you sell yourself all the time you sell yourself to someone you date you constantly sell a spouse you know why should you stay with me every day you constantly sell at your parents on you know being nice to you and buying dinner you know we're constantly selling the whole world on who we are. The car you buy sells your image and your branding and stuff. And like you've said, what you put online, put on your LinkedIn profile sells you. That's passive selling. There you go. That's passive selling.

There you go. And so as we go out, because we could talk about your book forever, and you've got a jam pack with so many great details people can see on Amazon and when they're picking the book uh give us your final thoughts and uh pitch as we go out you guys can land a job offer in five days because i have personally done it three times in a row and now i get jobs thrown at me without me even applying for them i got offered a cfo position a few months ago which i turned down i. I wasn't interested, but look, if I can do it, you can do it. I've made this whole prescriptive blueprint that anyone can

follow. I didn't hold back. Like everything I learned over the last 10 years to get to where I was today. I included it in the book. The book is only $17 and 99 cents. If you want to get a signed paperback copy with 10% off discount, you can go on AnnieYangFinancial.com using the coupon code VOSS10. That's spelled V-O-S-S-1-0. There you go. Well, we certainly appreciate that. And invest in yourself, folks. And I know five days seems like, well, get a job in five days. But if you're sending 50 emails or 50 applications every day, that's 250 by the end of five-day search. So there you go.

I mean, you've got to be able to get an interview out of there somewhere. So the proof is in the numbers. It's a numbers game. Everything in life is a numbers game when people really come down to it. Thank you very much, Annie, for coming on the show. We really appreciate really appreciate it's been fun and informative thank you so much chris you're really funny i really there you go i try to be there try to be i'm either stupid or funny or both there you go uh for 15 years my audience has been like yeah he's stupid but he's kind of funny too so there you go uh order the book folks wherever fine books are sold you can go to amazon or other places uh the five-day job search proven strategies for answering tough interview questions and getting multiple job offers available uh on

august 6 2023 from annie margarita yang uh and give this to all those friends, you know, who still have their kids living in their basement. One thing about millennials and Gen Zers is they take longer to leave. This might be a great gift during the holidays that are coming up. Buy them for everyone you know who's got that kid who still hasn't left home to see if you can get them out of their parents' basement, stuff like that. So there you go.

Some fun. Or not, you know. I don't their parents' basement, stuff like that. So there you go. Some fun. Or not. I don't know. Some people like their kids that much. I don't know why. I've seen their kids. Anyway, guys, thanks for tuning in. Go to goodreads.com, Forge has Christmas,

youtube.com, Forge has Christmas, linkedin.com, Forge has Christmas, and you'll probably see this on the LinkedIn newsletter, so you subscribe to that as well because LinkedIn is huge over there. Chris Foss won on the tickety-tockety for that as well, because LinkedIn is huge over there. Chris Foss 1 on the tickety-tockety for the kids. Thanks for tuning in. Be good to each other. Stay safe. We'll see you guys next time.