The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – The Perennials: The Megatrends Creating a Postgenerational Society by Mauro F. Guillén

Episode Date: August 20, 2023

The Perennials: The Megatrends Creating a Postgenerational Society by Mauro F. Guillén https://amzn.to/3E4WIVO Get the best from accelerating social change with the new book from the bestselling author of 2030 and “acclaimed thought leader” (Kirkus), Mauro Guillén. Adam Grant praises how the book "invites us to rethink our careers, our families, and our future plans.” Find out why business leaders and bestselling authors around the world are calling the book "sharply relevant and necessary" (William P. Lauder), "insightful and deeply researched" (Richard Florida), and "A must read" (Mohammed A. El-Erian). In today’s world, the acceleration of megatrends – increasing longevity and the explosion of technology among many others – are transforming life as we now know it. In The Perennials, bestselling author of 2030 Mauro Guillén unpacks a sweeping societal shift triggered by demographic and technological transformation. Guillén argues that outmoded terms like Boomers, Gen X, Millennials, and Gen Z have long been used to pigeonhole us into rigid categories and life stages, artificially preventing people from reaching their full potential. A new postgenerational workforce known as “perennials” – individuals who are not pitted against each other either by their age or experience – makes it possible to liberate scores of people from the constraints of the sequential model of life and level the playing field so that everyone has a chance at living a rewarding life. Guillén unveils how this generational revolution will impact young people just entering the workforce as well as those who are living and working longer. This multigenerational revolution is already happening and Mauro Guillén identifies the specific cultural, organizational and policy changes that need to be made in order to switch to a new template and usher in a new era of innovation powered by the perennials.

You wanted the best. You've got the best podcast, the hottest podcast in the world. The Chris Voss Show, the preeminent podcast with guests so smart you may experience serious brain bleed. The CEOs, authors, thought leaders, visionaries, and motivators. Get ready, get ready, strap yourself in. Keep your hands, arms, and legs inside the vehicle at all times, because you're about to go on a monster education rollercoaster with your brain. Now, here's your host, Chris Voss. Hi, folks. It's Voss here from thechrisvossshow.com, thechrisvossshow.com. Welcome to the big show, my family and friends. 14 years going on 1,500 episodes.

I've got to change the byline there on the track. Welcome to another great show. As always, we put on the most amazing shows to make our audience the most smartest people on the planet. If you're listening to their podcast, it's making you dumber. No, it's not. I'm just kidding. It's probably just not making you quite as smart. So that's why you should always refer the show

to your family, friends, or relatives, and thereby is the lead-in for the plugs. Go to goodreads.com, 4chesschrisvoss, youtube.com, 4chesschrisvoss, linkedin.com, 4chesschrisvoss, the big LinkedIn newsletter. I think Rose is like a weed. Every time I go up there, I'm like, Jesus, how many people subscribe to this thing every day?

I guess it's free, so there in lies that. We have an amazing author and mind on the show and of course none of them are mine i lost that years ago you you see me for 14 years you know what's going on uh anyway he is on the show with his latest book that comes out august 22 2023 my god are we in August already? It's almost Christmas for hell's sakes. It is entitled The Perennials, The Megatrends Creating a Postgenerational Society. And he's written a bunch of books we'll be talking about. Mauro Gian joins us on the show today, and he'll be talking to us about his latest book. He is one of the most original thinkers at the Horton School. And if you don't believe him, he'll fight you. No, I made that part up. Don't believe that. That's not in his bio.

He's one of the most original thinkers of the Horton School where he is the professor of management. I just thought that'd be funny. And vice dean for the MBA for Executives Program. He's an expert in global market trends. He's a sought-after speaker and consultant. He combines his training as a sociologist at Yale and as a business economist in his native Spain to methodically identify and quantify the most promising opportunities at the intersection of demographic, economic, and technological developments.

His online classes on Coursera and other platforms attracted more than 100,000 participants from around the world. And he's won teaching awards at Wharton, where his presentation on global market trends has become a permanent feature of over 50 executive education programs annually. And he's the Wall Street Journal bestselling author of 2030, How Today's Biggest Trends Will Collide and Reshape the Future of Everything. And he's here, people.

And if you don't listen to this whole damn show, you're going to be dumber for it. Welcome to the show, Mauro. How are you? Oh, thank you so much, Chris. And by the way, the great mind here is yours. Well, half of mine. I had a frontal lobotomy last week, so there's that. There's a half of mine there.

So welcome to the show. Congratulations on the book. It's a half-mind there. So welcome to the show. Congratulations on the book. It's a new honor to have you. How many books do you have? And then give us a.com of wherever you want people to look you up on the interwebs, please. Well, I've written two books for the general public, but for academics, meaning for 15 other people or so, I've written maybe 10 books, 10 other books, but those are boring books with a lot of footnotes. There you go.

And people can find me on LinkedIn with my name, M-A-U-R-O, and then G-U-I-L-L-E-N. I think that's the best place. And then we can connect and we can, you know, exchange views. There you go. So what motivated you to want to write this latest book? Well, you know, a number of years ago, maybe two years ago or so, in the middle of the pandemic, I was bored. I was giving a seminar over the web,

and the audience was directors of zoos and aquariums in the U of the pandemic, I was bored. I was giving a seminar over the web and the audience was directors of zoos and aquariums in the US and abroad. So let's fancy that. Okay. So what I had was all of these people who run zoos and aquariums, and they were telling me about how difficult they were finding it to appeal to multiple generations, right? Because only, you know, very old or very young people want to go to a zoo these days, it seems. And so it dawned on me that I had to do something about generations. And why is it that we are continually categorizing people into generations when it doesn't make sense, when we should be paying attention to their individual characteristics as opposed

to all of the stereotypes and all of the cliches when we say, oh, you're a millennial or you're a baby boomer and so on and so forth. So that's how I hit up on the idea of writing the book. Well, you know why we do that, right? Because we have to identify the greatest generation ever known to man, Generation X, of course. And we need to separate the riffraff that was separated, both of those. So that's why that's done.

But your book is entitled The Perennials. Who are the perennials? Damn it, where are they? Damn it, yeah, where are they? They're all over the place. Who are the perennials? Damn it. Where are they? Damn it. Yeah, where are they? They're all over the place. It's still a small percentage of the population. But Chris, the perennials are people who don't think and don't act their age.

They learn, they work, they have fun at whatever age, but not necessarily when we were told that we were supposed to do certain things in life. Ah, so they might be like me, a guy who has Peter Pan syndrome and hasn't had a wife and kids and plays video games all day when he's not doing a podcast. Is that who? Am I perennial? What is a perennial? Tell us what the... I think perennial equals Chris Voss.

I mean, there's no question about it. You are, I think, the archetype of the perennial. But it is people who really want to break the mold, people who think that the way we've been running our lives is too constraining. It's like a straitjacket. And, you know, we have so much change in the world, everything is changing, politics, the economy, technology. We need a little bit more freedom, right,

more flexibility to do what we want at different ages. And the current model, the way jobs are structured, the way, you know, companies think is not consistent with that more flexible way that we really need in order to adjust to this brave new world. So is your sell that we need to throw out the whole Gen X and Gen Z? I mean, we need to throw out Gen Z. Let's put it that way. Have you seen it lately?

No, I'm just kidding. I love you people. Seriously, I'm going to have to live with you. But we need to throw out all those archetypes of labels and we need to just focus on perennials, maybe? Well, I think we need to focus on individuals. You see, the problem with generations is that this is a particularly American obsession,

by the way, because in other countries in the world, they're not that obsessed about generations. But here it all started with the greatest generation. So people who were in the Great Depression and fought in World War II. Wait, I thought that was the Gen Zers. Yeah. And how they compared to baby boomers. So all of this has started with that comparison there. And then every successive generation has been criticized for being lazy for being unfocused and so on and so forth by the older generation and that's how we came to be in 2023 it's being you know we've been playing that game for too long and it's kind of silly uh chris because uh the the boundaries between generations are completely arbitrary so they say oh those people who are born between the year x and the year y well that's completely arbitrary. So they say, oh, those people who are born between the year X and the year Y, well, that's completely arbitrary. And then there's so much variation within each generation.

I mean, not all millennials like avocado on toast. Let's just get serious about this, right? So there's a lot of differences within generations. And by categorizing people into those labels, I think we're doing a disservice to everything. Yeah. Well, I mean, I can buy a lot of what you're saying, but I mean, have you heard some of the new generation's music? I mean, that's pretty much what separates them, where you just go, what the fuck are you guys listening to? Ping pong, jing-wong, what is that noise?

A DJ? Do they play an instrument? Anyway, I don't know. I'm teasing the generation. So let's get into this some more um so you want you're you're talking about societal shifts here demographics and and it sounds a bit like it's kind of what you're talking about people don't want to have fun and maybe uh have a richer life it sounds like you're describing what a lot of people maybe are going through with the hangover

from covid where you know they're they're kind, they want jobs that kind of mean something more. I know Gen Z wants jobs that mean something more. They want something that has a bigger picture to it. Is that kind of maybe more of what these people are about? Well, let me ask you this question, Chris. Who doesn't like a job that is fulfilling, a job that, well, pays reasonably well, but a job where you can meet new people and where it's fun to go to work? I think that's boomers. I think you described boomers right there. Yeah, but, you know, I don't think that defines any particular generation. I think that's a general human aspiration.

Sure. So what you're selling this is we need to start thinking differently about not boxing everything and just being a better generational society as a whole? Well, yes. I think the way I would put it is that we need to be learners and workers and people who have fun throughout our lives. We shouldn't be confined in learning to just when we are in our 10s and 20s. We should be lifelong learners. For example, that's one implication of this. Another implication, quite frankly, is that we have to do whatever it takes to help those people who don't make the transitions. You were referring to Peter Pan and the Peter Pan syndrome before. Some people don't make the transitions because they make the wrong choices, but other people don't make the transitions in life from one stage

to the other because they have bad luck. For example, think about teenage mothers or think about people who abuse substances, but then they recover, but then they realize I've lost 20 years, right, in doing this. Or think about people who didn't have parents and they are part of the foster care system. Or think about people who just simply, you know, made the wrong choice, made the wrong decision. For example, they dropped from high school and now they realize that only a few jobs are available to them. Well, if we change the model whereby people can recover from those setbacks, I think then we will be helping the 60 million or so Americans that happen to be in one of those categories that I just mentioned. There you go. So how do we facilitate that? How do we change

that model? How do we give that support? Is this a government program or community programs? How do we facilitate that? Well, that's the harder part. And what I propose in the book is that... Wait, the hard part? That's the harder part. What I propose in the book is that, first of all, we have to change our mindset. That this idea that in life we proceed from one stage to the next,

that we have this order and we have this sequence, is kind of something from the past. We have to change now because, once again, things are changing, evolving very quickly in technology, in the economy, and so on and so forth. But then we need, as you correctly pointed out, we need the government and we need companies, big employers, to change the way they think about their employees,

the way they think about people. Because, you see, they mostly categorize people into age groups and then they treat them accordingly. For example, it's very rare to find a company that is willing to invest money and resources in training an employee who happens to be 50 or 60 years old yeah to get rid of him or her yeah bit of ageism there they just don't hire them so i mean that's they don't hire them and they don't want to invest in them if they have them around right that's a big problem that's a big problem because especially for one very important reason, that you and I

are in that age group. So they have to change their tune, okay? And so how do we get them to facilitate that? How do we get them to change their tune? Is there a term for that? Because you know how they are with buzzwords and business. I know, I know. Well, I think that we need to persuade them that this is the way to go. But also, I think competition in the market

will probably also force them to do so because, you see, age cohorts are becoming smaller and smaller because we're not having babies. You've noticed, right, that people are not having as many babies. I didn't have kids. They're still having sex, as you said. They're still having sex, as you said before, but they're not having

babies. Yeah, that can work. Exactly. But yeah, we are in a generational decline sorry to interrupt you right exactly exactly i mean the issue is that companies have uh fewer and fewer young people to hire because so we're having fewer babies right we've been having fewer babies for the longest time since nixon was in the white house actually and so uh so thinking of him kind of turns people off from having a baby. I know. But anyway, the problem is then for companies that if they really want to attract the talent that they need, they're going to have to think twice about the way they deal with people in their 40s and their 50s, 60s, 70s. Can I bring up something, too, that you may have thought of?

Did you address the fact that one of the things that's happening with the boomers is we're losing with their retirement. And I think it's what, like 10,000 a day or something in America. We're losing a lot of knowledge, like people that have trade skills. And I think at one point I read that in like certain trades, you know, blue collar sort of trades. But you still have to have a really good knowledge base, you know, union based jobs that are, that are hard. Um, there's like seven people retiring for every new one person coming in. And those seven people have senior, you know, 20 years experience and, you know, the new guys replacing them. Like there's not a, there's not a lot of big replacement. Like when the boomers came in came in you know they were just taking over everything uh but now the opposite's happening you know you see

what's going on in places like japan you see china crashing with its yeah with its uh population thing i mean while we're like is let's not let anybody in the country at the border either that's exactly right that's exactly right because one solution to this problem is immigration but of course these days it's a politically fraught issue, right? I mean, if we erase immigration as a solution, a lot of people will be turned off. But, you know, the other thing, Chris, that I think is important to realize is that all of these arguments are not just about people above a certain age. They're arguments that people who are in their teens or the 20s should listen to because they should be thinking about their life in a different way.

And they should be thinking about how powerful it is to have a multigenerational workplace, for example, or to go to school together with other generations, how we can enrich each other. So I think the book and the message in the book is as valid for somebody who has just turned 60 years old as to somebody who is thinking about what to do in life and is just a teenager. It's really important to think about life in a different way that we have over the last 100 years or so. So if I'm understanding you rightly, it kind of takes us back to the old tribal elements that we used to have, where instead of just being in our segments of society, the teenagers run around, the teenagers and old guys like me and you are on our lawns, spraying them with the hose, go get off the lawn. We need to have more of a tribal situation where people can learn from their elders and we all kind of learn from each other. Does that sound like?

I think that's a great way of putting it. And in fact, I'm thinking about changing the title of the book to the tribal society now that I'm speaking. No, I think that's a great way of putting it. And in fact, I'm thinking about changing the title of the book to The Tribal Society now that I'm speaking. No, I think that's a great way of making the point. Absolutely. You know, we've kind of become the society, and I've had some people on that have talked about it. And of course, my observations, too. In tribal times, you know, we see so many people struggle. Divorce rates are high.

People are unhappy. I saw one of the feminist women from the sixties, she was talking about how, why women really enjoy getting together. Like on the women's March is, is because we used to live in these tribes. And so women, if they needed help with their children, uh, you know, whether it was birthing or babysitting or whatever. They would be in these tribes, and women could sit around, and they could get education, and they had their elder women there, so they had the knowledge base there. And it was a community, and we felt like a community. And the same with men.

Men have that problem now. A lot of us men we game because you know we don't go hunt stuff anymore and but when we're together our masculinity uh and our testosterone actually goes up because we're designed that way to go you know fight the woolly mammoths whatever the hell it is um and and in honesty our biggest problem is now is you know we're isolated in homes we're cut off from everybody the only thing we have are these 2D cell phones that technically we're really not designed for. We're designed for face-to-face. I'm designed to watch your face, your reactions, and interact with you. We're designed to touch each other.

And there's all sorts of shit that goes on in our brain when we touch each other, shake hands, kiss babies. It's why politicians do it. I was telling somebody the other day. So, yeah, I'm a big proponent that one of our biggest problems is we're just too separated as a human species. I couldn't agree with you more. We need to recreate society as it once was. Because, you see, what we've been doing for the last, I would say, 30 or 40 years is playing to the identity politics, right? So everybody has an identity, right? So I'm a woman or I'm a man or I'm a, you know, whatever it is. And this is fragmented society, I think, in ways

that I don't think are, you know, conducive to a better situation, quite frankly, for all of the reasons that you mentioned. I think that we need to rethink all of that that we're doing. Yeah. I've started doing something because, you know, we run a bipartisan show here i mean i'm everyone knows i'm a moderate democrat i probably slammed a little bit to the left but i'm i can i can see the parties from both sides but one thing i've been starting to do is when someone asks me they go oh are you democrat or you republican or oh you seem to be this i'll be like hey whoa whoa whoa buddy we're all americans i'm an american and you're american and there's a goddamn constitution that makes that happen and we need to focus on that and and it's interesting that when i make that identity and remind people

that our identities are american and that we're supposed to be working together that changes the tone of the conversation that and my threat of violence, of course, when I have that bitch face look in my eye that's like, I will kill you. No, I'm just kidding. Don't do that to me. But no, you see what I've done there, though? I've set the standard, I've reset the standard of the conversation to be like, we're an American. Now, if you want to talk

politics as an American with the Constitution, we can do that. But I'm not going to argue with you. But I'm going to talk to you as a fellow American. That changes the tone. Exactly right. I mean, we have forgotten about the common ground, that no matter how different we may be or how diverse we may be

or how strongly we feel about our identities, there is common ground to be found. So, for example, I think somebody from Texas can find common ground with somebody from New Hampshire, believe it or not. I think it is possible, although most Texans, I guess, think it's impossible. Yeah. We'll work in Florida, but every place else, I'm sure. No, I'm just kidding.

Florida. We're teasing you. Florida man, Florida woman. We've seen those news. But no, I think you're right. There needs to be more of a community. You know, it's funny. The more I learn about our tribal nature and how we grew up

in tribes and how we did things as men together how we did things as women how we did things as a community that oversaw new people going into the world and educating them and giving them skills and life skills we don't do any of that anymore and the more i see that the more i realize how you know what a lot of our societal ills probably prog proglamate is that the more i see that the more i realize how you know what a lot of our societal ills probably prog proglamate is that the right word from that you're the you're the smart one so yeah let me yeah on that point let me give you a uh a phrase for you know maybe for a tomb right um so uh it would be we have become prisoners of our own identities ah there you go and you know everyone here lies maro guillen he fell prisoner of his own identity right yeah here lies chris foss

some idiot human being that probably was an alien in real life the uh now you you're right we have kind of created this branding society too i don't know if you've talked about this in your book or what your thoughts on it but we've created this branding society where uh you know especially with the instagram sort of age where you know i'm this and this is my brand and god damn it i'm going to stomp around and tell everybody this is my brand this is my identity as you put it. And it really separates all of us. Yeah, absolutely. Some people more than us, because you can just go, you're an idiot.

You stay over there. Yeah. Well, let me tell you this whole thing about social media. As you know, I teach in the university, and I noticed a few years ago that people would start putting on their CV how many friends they had on Facebook. Oh, really? As an achievement. Yeah. Underneath their degrees, they would put, I have 25,000 friends on Facebook, which I

guess means you have no friends, right? Yeah. My degree came with, it shows how many likes I got during the four years I was at behavioral school. I was trying to think of something funny. I think it was at the uh one flew over the cuckoo nets cuckoo's net school uh the one with the rubber rooms but no i think this is important and and and i know that a lot of uh employees right now are kind of coming from what

you've talked about they want jobs that are more fun they i i know a lot of even boomers that left early during COVID, the job market, and even Gen Xers. And I had one Gen Xer on my show that was really interesting, and he took and cashed out all of his assets. He cashed his 401K. And he'd done the math, and he goes, look, Chris, I'm like 50 years old.

I'm not going to see. The odds of me seeing my retirement money and my retirement are pretty freaking low. And I think there might have been some you know some cancer or something in his family his genetics and stuff and he goes you know what i realized he goes fuck it i'm cashing all this stuff out and i'm gonna go have fun and i'm gonna go blow it and maybe i'm wrong maybe right maybe i'll have to go to jail i agree i think we have to go back to each of us becoming more like Bonnie and Clyde. Rob Banks?

Cool. Let's go, man. I'm going to come pick you up in the car. Grab my gun, damn it. I don't know, whatever. But you mean just live like maybe a little bit more free? Exactly. Again, as I said, we have become prisoners of a way of life

and a way of thinking about the different stages of life that is just way too constraining. We have to liberate ourselves from that. Now, how is this going to work when the guy that listens to this show is married and comes home and tells his wife this? Well, it depends on the wife. Which wife are we talking about? That's true. If you're in Utah. and tells his wife this? Well, it depends on the wife. Which wife are we talking about?

That's true. Well, if you're in Utah. No, I meant is he the first wife or the second wife? It depends on if you're living in Utah or I don't know. No, I meant temporarily. Oh, you mean the first wife or the second wife? I think the third wife might react in a different way than the first wife. Yeah, there you go. Well, you got to work this out ahead of time on a prenup, evidently.

But, you know, sometimes it's scary too because people, you know, I mean, I know a lot of women take jobs that they feel good about. Women take jobs like men take relationships. And so they tend to pick jobs that maybe don't pay as well, maybe aren't a career, but they enjoy. And maybe that's more what people need to do. But sometimes that doesn't work out because they don't pay well if you've got to provide for a family. So how do you balance the, you know, make some money so you can keep up with the Joneses a little bit,

maybe get that picket fence with a two-car garage, you know, that nuclear whole fantasy dream, but, you know, still keep the wife happy. Well, look, I'm not going to claim that the perennial mindset that I described in the book is the solution to every problem, but I think it will be the solution to this issue of whether we are really helping people develop their full potential. We need to help people develop their full creative potential because, once again, the model that we have right now is too constraining so i think uh moving in that direction would be uh

would be a great and that would result in great outcomes now you mentioned we talked earlier about how who needs to help facilitate this you mentioned the government what does the government need to do i mean funding wars and shit the single most important thing, believe it or not, is that the government is a big employer. A lot of people working for the government at all levels. So if the government actually takes the lead in terms of changing how you recruit people for jobs,

how you treat people while they're on jobs, and so on and forth, that will have a massive effect on the economy, a massive demonstration effect on the economy. Then, of course, there are policies. But you see, the government is the worst because they continually categorize all of us into an age group. So they have programs for young people. They have programs for middle aged people.

They have programs for the elderly. So the government needs to change wholesale. Right. They have to categorize in people according to age. So, for example, they have very few educational programs for the elderly when they should have full access to education for the elderly when they should have full access to education for the elderly, right? Yeah. So the government is a culprit here.

And again, remember that given that they're such a big employer, they should also change their ways in terms of how they employ people. I think I could be wrong, but I think the biggest employer that the government does is the U.S. Postal Service.

It could be wrong. Yeah, probably. But, you know, there's a lot of work that has to go on over there to make all those people happy because we did a YouTube video of it like, I don't know, seven years ago or something about UPS problems, U.S. Postal Service problems, and there's a lot of angry postal workers on it. But it's amazing, right? Now that we're using email and we're using uh you know all sorts of uh communications app and people still write

letters right so i do i still call people and it pisses people off why are you calling me i'm like uh just to bug you because i know people not do anymore um so so employers need to change everyone needs to change uh what are the do we need to create a movement for this do we need to create some sort of social damn it it's uh time to get off your couch and go to your window and scream i'm sick of everything i'm not going to take anymore sort of network thing i i the way i would put it is i think we need to create a band wagon right so we need to create a um a f, right? So we need to create a fad, so to speak. So we need a hashtag, basically. We need a hashtag. We need to rally the troops

behind this idea because, again, way too many people are not seeing their full potential realized because of the old model, the way we do things. We need to move in this other direction. So what we need to do is to have some leaders out there, some companies that are more enlightened than others, maybe some parts of the government who also are seeing the future. And we need to encourage others to follow suit. Hey, I got an idea. You know what you need to do when you find a really young kid who's kind of cute and semi-smart and has kind of an attitude, like a Greta Thunberg type,

only she is promoting this whole perennial thing. And we just find one of those, and this thing will become a movement. What do you think? Is that a good idea? Absolutely. Absolutely. We need this thing to go viral.

We could call her, but she's busy with some other things. She's boating or something around the world or something uh so uh that's really good well this is insightful and and and it seems like you really like like to look at things and try and take them out of the box your build is the most original thinker does anyone ever fight you or threaten to fight you over oh all the time all the time but But I'm ready for a fight. I really like fights because that's when that helps me, you know, sharpen my argument. Yeah, there you go. I really like discussions and debates, even if they're bitter. And I guess is everybody in the world a post-generational perennial then?

Or is it just America? Because we, you know, here in America, we just think everything rolls around. I think it's especially acute here in the United States, but it happens everywhere in the world. Yeah, even Canadians? I think even Canadians. I think even Canadians. Yeah, they're great.

Okay, well, they're always nice. They're always polite and stuff. I always have a couple of Canadians in my classes, and I wouldn't be able to do without them. There you go. Yeah, we love Canadians. I always tease my Canadian authors when they come on the show. I'm like, what's it like living next...

Are we like your drunken alcoholic brother? All the time you guys are up there just sitting up there going, oh God, what are the Americans doing fucking again? You're starting another war? You know the biggest problem with Canadians, right? What?

They're always trying to figure out how they fit. Oh, I was going to say Nickelback, but there you go. What did you say? They're always trying to figure out how they fit? How they fit, right? But they come to the U.S. and they start living here in the U.S. They're all constantly asking themselves, what the hell am I doing here? How do I fit here?

I'm Canadian. Well, they seem to fit in pretty good. Celine Dion got her nose in here. Justin Bieber, he fit in just a little bit too well. I'm all for deporting either one of them or both. And then

Nickelback. I love Nickelback. They're a good band. But what they do is they're always imitating Americans. So we have American Idol, they have Canadian Idol, and so on. Well, I'm a big Rush fan, so I accept them. Russian Triad fan, so I accept them. So anything more you want to tease out in the book, Mauro, before we go? I think what I really want to emphasize is this idea that we have to challenge the assumptions as to how we live.

That we shouldn't take for granted that, you know, the way that our parents lived their lives is the way that we should be living our lives. And once again, unless we change now, we're not going to be able to adjust to adapt to what's coming, because what's coming is a big revolution in technology, in the economy, everything, right? And just remember, the only possible response to change is change itself. We have to change. There you go. Somebody said something like that. response to change is change itself. We have to change. There you go.

Somebody said something like that. The only change is change itself. Like Roosevelt, maybe. Was it Roosevelt who said something like that? Oh, it's the only thing we have to fear is... Fear itself. Yeah, there you go. I'm going to say the same thing about change.

You're right. There are a lot of things that are happening with AI. And we've constantly been talking in the technology space about how we're going to have to retrain some people to do some new gigs. Because AI is going to change and it's going to wipe out some jobs. And more people will have to drive Ubers, I guess. The greatest thing about AI, as you know, is that it's likely to wipe out lawyers. That's going to be a good thing. Shot across the bow at my lawyer friends.

You know, it's going to affect everybody. It's going to affect a lot of people. Like myself. Oh. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I've even been told that they're working on AI podcast host bots. So evidently I'm getting replaced as well. But I think my audience after 14 years has probably figured out I'm a bot as well.

And they're just like, yeah, they just wind him up and put him on the show and he does this little monkey clap thing. Yeah, the other day a venture capitalist told me that he had invested $20 million in a venture that is trying to replace podcasters. Do you have his name? Because I'm going to his house.

I'm just kidding. I just made this up. Oh, okay. Well, I've heard there's plenty of platforms doing it. You know, but the beautiful thing is a few AI at this point can be as funny or as interesting as me or smell as bad. So there's that. I mean, as long as I don't shower for a week at a time, I got that going for me. Yeah. They don't like it in the media industry and in Hollywood, you know? Yeah.

I mean, we have people on the show and we make people laugh and we do what we call infotainment. And I, you know, I can read the chat GPT stuff and there's no life in it. Like I can read it and be like a robot bot wrote this. Yeah. This is a bot, but I don't know. Maybe eventually, you know, maybe, maybe they'll teach them comedy. You know, maybe if they read enough George Carlin, they'll get our bit. But improv too, I don't know.

It'd be really weird if they could do improv comedy and just come up with all the funniest that I do on the show. Well, you can feed the machine previous episodes of your podcast and let's see what happens. That would be weird, huh? Send the text in and then have them redo the podcast better like hey hey chris here's how you could have made that joke better dumb ass and you're like where did you get your knowledge from carson all right well damn it uh so there you go maro it's been wonderful to have the show

gives.com so people can find you on the ors please interwebages Mauro, can you give us your.com so we can find you on the interweb? Oh, sure. So it's mauro.guillen.com. But it's better if people find me on LinkedIn because then we can communicate very easily. There you go. Thank you very much for coming on.

We really appreciate it, man. Thank you for inviting me. This was a pleasure, and I've been entertained. Yep. That's hopefully what the rest of the audience was. Otherwise they all subscribed. Thanks for tuning in.

It's got a good reach.com for us. LinkedIn.com for us. You can see me and Mara over there in the big LinkedIn newsletter. Big LinkedIn group. 130,000 people over there too. Check that out. It just went public too. We let it go public. Anyway, also see us on TikTok. It's the craziest place on the internet. Thanks for tuning in. Be good to each other. Stay safe. people over there too check that out it just went public too we let it go public uh anyway uh also

see us on tiktok and all those crazy places on the internet thanks for tuning in be good to each other stay safe and we'll see you guys next time