The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – The Success Factor: Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance by Ruth Gotian

Episode Date: January 11, 2022

The Success Factor: Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance by Ruth Gotian What do astronauts, Olympic champions, and Nobel laureates do differently that allows them to achieve at such a high level? High achievers share the same four attributes: intrinsic motivation, perseverance, strong foundation, constantly learning through informal means. The key to their success is that they do all four of these things at the same time. Based on research and in-person interviews with astronauts, Nobel Prize winners, and Olympic champions, The Success Factor outlines the approach that individuals aspiring to improve their performance can adopt. Using these four shared attributes as a guide, The Success Factor helps you reach your peak by applying the lessons of high achievers in your own life: identify your passion using a Passion Audit; learn how and where to find a mentor and how to build a mentoring team; develop your own community of practice; pursue your interests through informal learning; manage your time and energy. The Success Factor comes with online resources that feature a downloadable Passion Audit worksheet, Mentoring Team worksheet, and Goal Audit worksheet. The book offers scripts for approaching potential mentors and a list of uncommon places to find a mentor, such as webinars, airports, and social media. The Success Factor features exclusive interviews with high achievers, including such people as Dr. Tony Fauci NIH/NIAID Institute Director; Dr Mike Brown, Nobel prize winner; Dr Peggy Whitson, Former NASA Chief Astronaut; Maxine Clark, founder and former CEO of Build-A-Bear Workshop; and Steve Kerr, eight time NBA Champion and head coach of the Golden State Warriors.

You wanted the best. You've got the best podcast, the hottest podcast in the world. The Chris Voss Show, the preeminent podcast with guests so smart you may experience serious brain bleed. Get ready, get ready, strap yourself in. Keep your hands, arms and legs inside the vehicle at all times. Because you're about to go on a monster education roller coaster with your brain now here's your host chris voss hi folks it's voss here from the chris voss show.com the chris voss show.com hey we're coming here with another podcast we certainly appreciate you guys tuning in. Thanks for being here. We just did the massive CES 2022 show coverage, and I did not get the corona. So that's pretty awesome.

Win on both, on two fronts there. Yeah. Thank you. Watch those videos. There's a billion of them. They're on the show. They're everywhere. Go watch them.

And you're going to see a lot of the cool products at CES and everything else. And, of course, the fun of the interviews as well. Also, go to goodreads.com, Fortuness Chris Voss, see everything we're reading and reviewing, and to see the video version of all of this, including the brilliant authors that we always interview, go to youtube.com, Fortuness Chris Voss. Also, go to all the groups, Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, all those places where the show streams all the cuts of its different interviews and things like that. Today, we have another amazing author on the show. Who saw that one coming since we do amazing authors all the time? This is a new hot book coming out January 25th, the day before my birthday, 2022.

So you're going to definitely grab that. And, of course, this is a book that's going to make you smarter and expand your mind. The book is called The Success Factor, Developing the Mindset and Skillset for Peak Business Performance by Dr. Ruth Godian. She is on the show with us today and she's going to be talking to us about her book and everything she does. She is the leading chief, I'm sorry, she is the chief learning officer and assistant professor of education in anesthesiology and former assistant dean of mentoring and executive director of the Mentoring Academy at, I believe, Weill Cornell Medicine. She has been hailed by the journal Nature and Columbia University as an expert in mentorship and leadership development. In 2021, she was selected as one of 30 people worldwide to be named Thinker's 50 Radar List, dubbed the Oscars of Management Thinking,

and recently won the Thinker's 50 Distinguished Achievement Radar Award, ranking her the number one merging management thinker in the world in bridge theory and practice. She's also the semifinalist for the Forbes 50 over 50 list. Welcome to the show, Dr. Ruth. How are you? Thank you so much. I'm so pumped to be here with you. And we're so excited to have you as well. Did I get the pronunciation of your last name correct on that intro? Gautam. It means good person. Isn't that wonderful?

Vasa means bad person. So that's in Latin, I think. We're like yin and yang. Yeah. So it's good we finally met. I don't know what that means. We'll balance each other out. Yeah, yeah.

It's the yin and yang. So welcome to the show. Give us your plugs so people can find out more about you and order up your wonderful book. Thanks. So my name is Dr. Ruth Gotian. I study extreme high achievers, Nobel Prize winners, astronauts, Olympic champions. And I figured out how they became so successful. Reversed engineered their path because I realized that Nobel Prize winning scientist is just like an Olympic medal figure skater. And to me, that meant that if those were the same, that to me meant that those were learned skills. And if they're learned skills, I'm an adult educator,

I can teach it. I reverse engineered that pathway, created a blueprint for it and put out the book, The Success Factor. And I'm here to talk about success because I'm kind of obsessed about it. We can tell, and you're really motivated about it. So what motivated you on to put this book out? So this was actually years in the making. I was 43 when I decided I was going back to school to get my doctorate. And I did that while working full-time and raising my family. Because nationally, long before we were talking about this great resignation, we were always wondering why certain people were leaving the industry, what we called a leaky pipeline. Why would people who worked so hard and trained so hard, excuse me, for so long,

then leave? And everyone was really focused on those who were leaving. I was more interested in the other end of the spectrum, the people who were doing such incredible work that it more than made up for those who are leaving. So I was interested in figuring out how can we make more of those people. As I said, when I went back to school at that ripe young age of 43, I decided I was going to find out. It was literally my doctoral dissertation. At that time, I focused on physician scientists, those who have the MD and do research as well. So I got to study and talk to Nobel Prize winners and a former US former surgeon general and a bunch of NIH Institute directors and people who won the biggest scientific prizes. That's when I realized the

four elements they all had in common. And then I got curious, oh, I wonder if other extreme high achievers have that. And that's when I started talking to those Olympic champions and those astronauts and CEOs and those regular people. And that's when it, it just, it was like lightning. I realized that they all do the same things. So I had to,

that was my big pandemic project. After interviewing all those people, I had to write the book because who aims to be average? People want to be successful. They just don't know how. They try all these random things that don't work. Well, here are lessons from everyone from eight-time NBA champion Steve Kerr to Dr. Tony Fauci to former NASA chief astronaut Dr. Peggy Whitson, the CEO of Build-A-Bear Workshop, Tony Award winner, you name it, it's in there. I have almost every industry represented.

That's really cool how you gave a span of industries on there so that you take people from all walks of life instead of just like, here's the Fortune 500 people. Right. Because I think that's been done. Oh, yeah. And I think too often people try to copy their habits and that doesn't really work, Chris. I'm a morning person. I wake up super early.

I've probably had three cups of coffee before the world wakes up. If that's me, you can't copy my habits. If you're a night owl and you go to bed at three o'clock in the morning, it's just not going to work. So what you do need to figure out is the mindsets of these people. And once I realized that the astronaut was just like the Olympian, who was just like the Nobel Prize winner, who was just like the CEO, that's when I realized these are learned skills. And my God, I had to put that doctor to work and teach people how to get those skills for themselves. So some people call, some people assume that what these people have is a talent.

Is it more learned skill or there's just some people that are innately talented? Look, you could be talented at many things. It doesn't mean you're extreme high achiever at it. In fact, Apollo Anton Ono, the most decorated winter Olympian in short track speed skating. He was actually a state champion before he ever laced up his skates. So you could be good at a lot of things, but he didn't love swimming, but he loved short track speed skating. And you could see it even though he's retired from the sport now, when he gets on the ice, he just posted something on Twitter about a week or so. you see, you could just see the outpouring of love and infatuation

that he has with that sport. That's a difference. Now, what if you had a great talent, but you were sitting on the couch all day, binging Netflix? You didn't use your talent. Are you talking about me? I'm talking about all of us at some point. She's talking about me. Yeah. I've been guilty of that. I know I have some skills and I'm good at stuff, but then I'm like, maybe some video games today. But that's okay. As long as the video games don't outweigh the time you spend on nurturing your skills and your talent. Well, let's not tell anybody how much time goes in there.

So what do the high achievers have in common? What did you find? I actually found out that they have four things in common and I talk about them in the success factor and I'll tell you what those four things are, but I want to tell you that knowing what they are and knowing how to apply them are two separate things. So I definitely talk about in the book, the success factor, how to actually apply these things. So you ready for those four things? Let's do it. All right. The first one is they have found their intrinsic motivation. They have found their passion, their purpose, what they were put on this earth to do,

what they would do for free if they could. It's not about the diploma. It's not about the promotion. It's not about the recognition because it was never about the promotion. It's not about the recognition because it was never about that. That's extrinsic motivation. That's when other people judge you. And Chris, when other people judge you all the time, you know what happens? You either fail out or you burn out. That's just not sustainable. You need to do something from within that you enjoy doing. So these are the people who have found it. So for example, the physician scientists, for example, who are working on treatments for cancer, usually they have a direct connection.

They lost somebody. They know somebody who suffered from it. They know they might never find a cure. But every day that they work towards it, they're going to get a little bit closer to a treatment so that nobody else has to suffer the way someone in their family suffered. So that's why they don't stop. That is their fire. That's their fuel. And they are constantly pouring gas on it to make sure that fire doesn't burn out. And in fact, fun fact, I always ask the Olympians, I said, can you show me the end of our conversation? Only two of them had their medals up on display.

Really? Everyone else, it's in a box under the bed. It's in the safe. One of them had it in a brown paper bag in his store. I said, you don't have a trophy room? Brown paper bag like it was store. I said, you don't have a trophy room? Brown paper bag like it was lunch. I said, don't you have a trophy room? They said, no, it was never about the medal.

The medal is a chapter in my life, not the entire story. Oh, wow. I know. That's an interesting perspective. Right. And they all said this. Every single one of them. I'd still show off that medal,

man. I'd be wearing it. I'd be wearing it. I'd go to the grocery store. I'd be wearing it to vacuum. But so that was the first one was the intrinsic motivation. The second one is their perseverance, their work ethic, their tenacity, their grit, all of those terms that you want to use. When you've got a fire burning inside of you, you are not going to stop because there's a big game on, because there's a Netflix special, because you're tired, because you've got that fire burning inside you. You can't stop because if you stop, someone else is going to suffer from cancer if that's what you're going toward. Now, this doesn't mean that they are working 18 hours a day. I want to be very clear on that. They are not burning the candle at both ends. They're

actually working smarter. They figured out their peak hours, their peak focus hours, and that is when they are working on their goal. Don't do passive tasks during peak cognitive hours. So what does that mean? I told you I'm a morning person. I wake up before the sunrise, which means in the morning is when I would do my writing, my editing, my budgets, my grants, all the things that take a tremendous amount of focus, right? Because when you focus, it's exhausting. Now, I don't do Zoom meetings. I don't respond to emails. I'm not on the phone. Those are passive tasks. I am not wasting my cognitive time on passive tasks. I will do those in the afternoon when I'm a bit more tired,

when I am not as focused. How focused do you really need to be on a Zoom meeting? How focused do you need to be to respond to that email? It's not the same as I need to focus on practicing for this race, or I need to be focused on writing this paper, whatever it is. It's a different level of focus. It's not that depleting focus. So that's number two. Number three is a strong foundation, which they are constantly reinforcing. What they did early on in their career is what they're doing later on in their career. So for example, Neil Katyal argued 45 cases before the Supreme Court of the United States. I don't know about you. I haven't even stepped inside.

He argued 45 cases before the Supreme Court. The same thing he did on case one is what he did on case 45. He didn't say, I'm an old pro here. I don't need to keep doing this. Now, what are the three things that he always did? He prepared a binder with every possible question he might get asked. And then he had the answers for those questions all written out. He told me not once in 45 cases has he ever opened that binder. But the practice of preparing that binder prepared him to argue

the case. He did that for case one and case 45. He also did moot courts. Those are simulated courts that you would do before the real thing. He did that for case one. He did that all the way through to case 45. And finally, he talks to his kids the night before the opening arguments. And in the simplest of terms, he tells them what the case is about so much so that a child can understand it. Because he says, if a child can understand it,

then the courts will understand it. You don't have to overcomplicate it. He did that for case one. He did that for case 45. He did that for case 45. That's why they have a strong foundation. That's why all the NBA stars, the same warm-ups that they do, the NBA or in the Olympics,

are the same ones you'd see in any junior high gym. The only difference is they have better equipment and nicer sneakers. That's it. Same warm-ups. Last but not least, you heard of Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Mark Cuban. They read three to eight hours a day. It's not reading that made them billionaires.

It's opening their mind up to new knowledge and then making connections that other people don't see. So the question is, if you don't have three to eight hours a day, or if you don't like to read that much, which to me is a foreign concept, because I'm an academic, I read 70 to 100 books a year and love it. But for those who don't, what is another way that you can open your mind up to new knowledge? You can certainly read books like The Billionaires. You can read articles, blogs, listen to podcasts, webinars, lives, right? Hopefully I'm dropping some good information here. You could take courses, LinkedIn learning courses. You don't have to be in a formal classroom.

Now, the other way they all learn is that they surround themselves, not with one, but a team of mentors. They have their own team who believe in them more than they believe in themselves. And if this is what the Nobel Prize winners are doing, why do the rest of us think that we are better than that and we don't need it? So those are the four things, intrinsic motivation, perseverance, strong foundation, and the continuous learning through informal means. And I lay it all out in the success factor. That's pretty amazing. So basically high achievers are lifelong learners? Yes, they are. Wow. I've actually amped up my book reading. One of the ways I consume a lot of books is through Audible. And I'll sit and play the Audibles as I'm working, as I'm driving in the car. Anytime I drive to someplace, even like the grocery store, which is like five minutes away,

the first thing I do is I put on an Audible and I capture it. And I think I've got it to where I can process it about 2.25 speed. Whoa. So I can ram through a lot of books and take it in. Sometimes two, but usually about two to two and a half I can get. It depends on the book. I still listen at one. Yeah. Sometimes if I feel I'm not getting it, then I'll dial it back. But no, two is usually the basis for why I can process. But I'll cram through a lot of books. Going to CS, I cram through a lot of books.

A lot of people don't realize that a lot of your drive time, like when I go to the gym every day and come back again, that's an hour of book read. That's right. And considering I'm at two times that, I'm consuming a whole lot more. So I've actually amped up my thing. It's kind of interesting what you mentioned, that high achievers have, and they're constantly lifelong learners, and they also have mentors. There's a real delineating line there of people that stop learning in life, and we've certainly met a few of those, see them on the news every day. That Dunning-Kruger sort of effect, the people that quit learning and think they know everything and they don't have mentors, and they're just like, I don't need to learn anything more.

I know everything there is. But then the Dunning-Kruger effect, where you have the people who know that they need to learn stuff. They know they're not as smart as they need to be in any given subject. And so they're constantly trying to expand that sort of field. You know what my mentor said to me? She said, Dr. Marie Volpe, she said, there is nothing new under the sun. What's new is how you look at it. Yes. And when I interviewed the former undersecretary of the U S Navy, he said to me, when you take things that other people did and use it in a new way,

that's innovation. That's innovation. And that's actually, that's in the book. That's in the success factor, the whole story about that. And that's why you always want to surround yourself by people who are different than you, look different, think different, process things differently from different industries, because that's how you're going to learn things. A problem you might be having, they might have solved in their industry.

So don't go reinventing the wheel. Yeah. Learn from them. And sometimes when I'm listening to books, I'll come across maybe a chapter and I'm like, I know this stuff, but I'll listen to it anyway, because I'm like,

maybe there's a tidbit in here. Maybe there's a little gem. Maybe there's a spin, like you mentioned, where they're looking at something differently. And I'll come across those and have an epiphany moment where I'm like, oh, wow. I never thought of from that angle. And searching for those sort of gems or searching for

stuff in things, you learn a lot of stuff. How does one find a mentor? Can you just Google them? I write a lot about that in The Success Factor. And that's also one of my most requested topics in Forbes. you need to surround yourself in places where you can learn from other people. And I want you to pay attention, not just to the speaker, because they're fascinating, but I want you to also start paying attention to the people in the audience, because they are there because they have the same interest in the topic. Look at their comments, look at the questions, look at the same interest in the topic. Look at their comments. Look at the questions.

Look at what they put in the chat. And start connecting with them in that way. Connect on social media. Let them know what they said that really resonated with you, et cetera. Now, you all know people who seem to have an experience that you want to tap into, have a perspective that you want to tap into. Most errors that people make is that they walk up to someone and say, Chris, I love what you do. I think you're a fabulous podcaster. I want to be a podcaster. Would you be my mentor? And you're thinking, I don't have time for this. I don't have time for this. Now, what if I said to you, Chris, I want to be a great podcaster. I am looking at this different

technology and I have it down to two and I really wanted to get your perspective on something. Then what would your response be? Yeah, I'd be curious of what they had. Right? Because that's a 15-minute discussion. That's not a lifelong commitment. Now, what happens is now you don't ask them to be your mentor. You're asking them for their perspective on something. And this way, it doesn't feel like an obligation to the potential mentor. Now, remember, for them to be a mentor, they need to prove themselves that they can help you and that they believe in you more than you believe in yourself. But the problem is you as a mentee have to prove to them that you are worthy of being mentored.

So you want to whatever it is, you are worthy of being mentored. So you want to, whatever it is, you want to really step it up and show them you can take on stretch assignments, show them that you're thinking about the discussions that you had, send them an article, send them a podcast link, something that's connecting that shows that you are top of mind and that you are working at this. You are really passionate, intrinsically motivated, and you have the work ethic because people want to get behind stars. That's why half the Nobel Prize winners were mentored by other Nobel Prize winners. Bob Lefkowitz shared the Nobel Prize in chemistry with one of his former mentees.

That's why. So don't ask people to take on another obligation, another job, but do ask them for their perspective on something and work to build up that relationship. You would never ask someone to marry you on the first date. Why would you ever ask someone to be your mentor when you first meet them? No, you build that relationship. Show them that you are someone they can know and trust. And then they will start giving you so much great career advice and help and share their network with you that you will one day have the privilege of calling them your mentor. There you go.

So what's the difference between a mentor and, say, a paid coach? Like everyone hires these paid coaches now. Can you tell us the difference between those two? Money. Mentors don't usually get paid. And they're really there for the long run. And they usually have fewer people that they are helping, and they're helping more long-term. And they would help you more in the details of a project. A coach is more short-term, more finite to work on specific skills, and you're usually paying the person.

So that's the big difference. So if I was going to give a TED Talk, I'd want to hire a coach who could help me with storytelling. But if I want to get promoted to the next level, I really need someone who could mentor me with that. There you go. Because some people do that. And it's interesting to know that maybe it might be better to seek out mentors as opposed to paid coaches. But I get that all the time.

I get people that are like, hey, you're hugely successful at podcasting or you're successful at this, that, or the other. Let me spend some time. Can I call you and pick your brain or whatever? Do you understand? I have so little time and I don't have the time for everybody. I'm just filled with those messages. And I think most maybe, I don't know, successful mentors are maybe,

I don't know. I just don't have the time. And it's funny because they don't understand it, but they don't understand that to become as successful as you are, in their minds, you're working your butt off. That's right. That's right. But you know what? But if I asked you for your perspective or your thoughts on something, I'm pretty sure that you would give me the time of day because I just need 10, 15 minutes of your time. And I'd follow up with a thank you and I'd follow up. We have a 24, 730 rule that my friend Andy LaPotta taught me. 24 hours after you meet someone, you send them an email, seven days after you follow up again, and 30 days after you follow up again. Chris, I was really thinking about that topic of podcast technology that we were

talking about. I saw this article and it really made me think about our conversation. I do disagree with what they said about blah, blah, blah. I'm wondering what you think. That's brilliant. It's a whole different approach to some people because people just show up with their hand out.

And I'd love to help everybody if I'm a helping guy, but I'd love to help everybody if I had millions of dollars and nothing better to do. We all would. But I don't know. Would we all? There's some of us that are more scared. People I hang out with do. Yeah. Those are high-quality people.

I'm talking about some of the people I see on the news every day. How do you develop a mentoring team? So there's actually three levels that you need. You need people who are senior to you because they have the experience and they understand the politics of the organization. You also want peer mentors who are at your level and can empathize with you and move up through the ranks with you. You also want people who are junior to you because these are the digital natives. These are the people who understand the new way of thinking and processing information. You definitely want all three levels. And if your listeners really want a blueprint of how to develop a mentoring team, they could just download one from my website, ruthgotian.com slash mentoring team.

And it's all right there. And there's even articles they can read about it as well. Okay. And let's see, what else do we have on the slate? You talk about your book. What do high achievers deal or how do they deal with challenges? So people think that just because they won the gold medal or the Nobel Prize or whatever big thing that they don't have challenges. They have people to handle their challenges.

No, that's not true at all. Everybody's got problems. Everybody's got challenges. But the difference is how they approach these challenges. They never question if they will overcome that challenge. Instead, they focus on how to overcome the challenge. What is the strategy I haven't considered yet? Those who wonder, oh, there's a pandemic, poor me. Those are the ones sitting on the couch, binging Netflix all day long and eating sourdough bread all day long. But the ones who

are saying how to overcome the challenge, where is the silver lining in this? What can I do during this time? Those are the people who are thinking of strategies to overcome the challenges because high achievers fear not trying more than they fear failing. I really like that attitude. I remember when COVID struck, I was really depressed because I saw another 2008 meltdown, economy meltdown coming. And then I was watching thousands of dollars get wiped out in events and programs that we do and stuff. And I remember a friend of mine, he posted, there's two things you do right now. One, be a lifter or two, find a lifter. And I really needed lifting at that point, but I sat down and looked at my perspective on everything. And then I looked

at my assets and went, what do I have? I have a great podcast. I have a great audience. I have a great, I have a platform. And so I'm going to go be a lifter and I'm going to fake it till I make it and get through the darkness. And now I have a better show for it. We changed the format of show a little bit more to invite book authors. And now I love it because I get, not only on top of my audible consumption, I get great authors on the show and get front seat to ask them what I think about their books. Having that different perspective. And there's been so many times in my life where I've had to be like, where is the silver lining in all of this? So that's brilliant.

Look, I made myself patient zero. I had to try this out on myself. And early in the pandemic, I lost my friend, lost my dad. We had this pandemic going on. And I knew that if I didn't do something productive, it would be a long, dark tunnel. And this was my pandemic project. My dad, when he was in the hospital every day, he said to me, do you have ideas for your next book? And who could even think about the next book when your dad's in the hospital? But I was approached by the publisher after he died. And I knew, I just knew I had to do it. It's actually, it's coming out. This is my pandemic project, The Success Factor. And I'm thrilled and I know my dad

is smiling down on me. There you go. Congratulations. Smart dad. I did a book during the pandemic. It was a good time to write a book. So how can someone find out about what they're passionate about? So you actually have to do a passion audit to figure out what it is that you love. There's actually research that shows you only need to spend 20% of your time doing what you love. Now, if that's only 20%, imagine if your whole job was doing what you love. So one of the free downloads that come with the book, The Success Factor, is a passion audit where I walk you through how to differentiate between things you are good at and things you are not good at. Things you enjoy versus things you don't enjoy. Things you're good at but don't enjoy.

Things you're good at you do enjoy. What you would do for free if you could. These are all questions to be asking. I want you to look at when you're procrastinating, what are you doing when you're procrastinating? When are you procrastinating? I really push you to think about some of these questions. And I think it's so important that you do that first, which is why I created that download in the book with the book called The Passion Audit. And for those who can't wait until the book comes out to download it, you can go ahead and download a version of The Passion Audit from my website as well, ruthgotian.com slash passionaudit. There you go. There you go. And then final question for you,

why is it that the high achievers don't crumble when they get their big prize? Because it was never about the prize. Remember those medals? Just like you mentioned, huh? You remember those medals in the brown paper bag lunch, right? In the top drawer? It was never about the medal. That was really one, that was just a goal, not the ultimate goal. There's always a goal after that. So if you look at the Olympians right after that, right after the Olympics, they're training for the world championships. There's always another goal. The ones who always had that goal as the be all and end all, those are the ones who crumbled. Oh, wow.

I don't know of a single Nobel Prize winning scientist who quit doing science just because they won the Nobel Prize. Not one. They're just like, I'm out of here. See you. Bye bye. Never play video games. They didn't take their million dollar prize and run. No, they kept doing science. In fact, Twitter blows up every single year when the Nobel Prizes are announced and I watch it live, I'm so excited. They're still, if they have a class that day, they are teaching. If they have a grant to write, they are submitting it. If they have a lab meeting, they are running that lab meeting.

Whatever it is that they need to do, they are doing it. They don't stop for one second. There you go. There you go. They're calling right now too. They're calling right now.. They're calling right now. So this has been wonderful. Anything more you want to touch on in the book before we go out?

I want to tell somebody to pick up the phone is what I want them to do. That's not my job. I'm really excited about the success factor and I'm really thrilled for people to pick it up and learn from it and really understand how they can elevate their own success. Because I don't think anybody wakes up in the morning aiming to be average. I think there are people who really want to succeed and I'm really hoping the success factor helps you do that. It sounds like a really interesting book. I'm glad you compiled all this because I've learned a few things. Give us your plugs where people can find you on the interwebs and order the book up

and know more about you guys. Sure. Wherever you enjoy buying books, Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Walmart, Target, the success factor is there. If you want to know anywhere in the world, just go to my website for everything, ruthgotian.com. You want to know where the book is, ruthgotian.com slash book. For those of you who get it by the 24th of January, there's actually free bonuses for you, including, yes, 13 ways to start conversations with people you've never met before. So it's all there. Just go to ruthgotian.com slash book. All the social media, it's just my name. And if we're connected on social media, you'll actually see my articles in Forbes and Psychology Today and

Harvard Business Review, where I try to leak out these tips all year long. That's awesome. That's awesome. This has been wonderfully insightful. Thank you for coming on the show, Dr. Ruth. I'm taking over, Chris. Taking over. Sure. I'll just turn it over to you next time I go to CS. So thanks for coming on the show. We certainly appreciate it. Thank you so much. There you go. And thanks to my audience for tuning in.

Be sure to order the book. It comes out January 25th, 2022. I'm still stuck in 21. Jesus Christ. The Success Factor, Developing the Mindset and Skill Set for Peak Business Performance. Be sure to watch the video version of this at youtube.com, 4Chess, Chris Voss. Hit the bell notification button. Goodreads.com, 4Chess, Chris Voss.

See everything we're reading and reviewing over there in my book. And also all of our groups on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, Instagram as well. Also see our amazing LinkedIn newsletter that we put out every day on LinkedIn. That thing is killing it over there. It just keeps growing. So check that out as well. Thanks for tuning in. Be good to each other.

Stay safe. And we'll see you guys next time.