The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Uncovering Insurance Pitfalls: Expert Insights on Coverage Challenges with Frederick J. Fisher

Episode Date: July 26, 2025

Uncovering Insurance Pitfalls: Expert Insights on Coverage Challenges with Frederick J. Fisher FisherCG.com About the Guest(s): Frederick Fisher is a seasoned expert in the insurance industry, specializing in professional liability over an illustrious career spanning more than 50 years. With two decades of experience as a claims adjuster and owner of a Third Party Administrator (TPA), Frederick is well-regarded for his dedication to client financial security. He is an advocate for providing strong financial safeguards and has authored the insightful book titled "Claims Made Insurance, The Policy That Changed the Industry: A Deep Dive Review and History," set for release in June 2024. Frederick currently operates as a consultant and expert witness, focusing on insurance consulting and risk management. Episode Summary: Join Chris Voss as he hosts insurance expert Frederick Fisher on The Chris Voss Show, where they delve into the intricate world of insurance policies and claims. In this episode, the discussion zeros in on understanding claims made insurance policies, with Frederick sharing insights and case studies that emphasize the significance of being informed and cautious while purchasing insurance. They highlight headline-grabbing stories about insurance litigation involving big names and underscore the challenges faced by companies and individuals when they're inadequately protected. As the conversation progresses, Frederick uses practical examples to underline the perils of a lack of transparency and knowledge when it comes to insurance. From discussing the implications of not disclosing warranty questions to exploring the nuances of management liability insurance, the episode is a goldmine of knowledge for entrepreneurs and individuals alike. Chris and Frederick tackle the often-overlooked elements of homeowners insurance and unravel the critical components that can lead to financial security in the face of disasters. Through engaging dialogue, they underline the importance of seeking expertise in the insurance industry and avoiding the pitfall of being attracted solely by the price of policies. Key Takeaways: Understanding the intricacies of claims made insurance is crucial to avoid costly mistakes and ensure comprehensive coverage. Transparency and honest disclosure on insurance applications are critical to prevent fraud accusations and resulting claim denials. The order taker standard limits the responsibility of insurance agents, making it essential for consumers to engage with knowledgeable brokers. Entrepreneurs should consider management liability insurance to protect against personal liability incidents stemming from business decisions. Homeowners and condo owners must review their coverage limits diligently, including potential code upgrades that can lead to increased costs during rebuilding. Notable Quotes: "Everybody hates [insurance], everybody hates buying it, everybody hates dealing with it." "Insurance is the last thing. It's either milk or insurance. Come on. We know where that's going." "Take buying insurance seriously and don't use your brother-in-law as your broker unless he's a specialist in it." "You can't say, ‘I want the best coverage’… what does that mean? Quality of the coverage? The price of the coverage?" "It's intentional. I'm telling you right now… insurance companies are out to screw you." Resources: Frederick's Website: FisherCG.com (as inferred from transcript format) Book: "Claims Made Insurance, The Policy That Changed the Industry: A Deep Dive Review and History" by Frederick Fisher Social Media Handles: Chris Voss on LinkedIn and TikTok as Chris Voss1 (as inferred from transcript format) Tune in to the full episode for an enlightening journey into the world of insurance with Frederick Fisher, and stay tuned for more captivating content from The Chris Voss Show.

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with your brain. Now here's your host, Chris Voss. He's the author of the book that came out August 28th, 2024. Gary Elliott, Gary Elliott joins us on the show. His book is entitled, You Can get through this with God's help. Uh, and hopefully he's got a 1-800 line or maybe an email I can use for that. Uh, but we're going to get into it. We're going to find out the deets as the kids like to say of all the stuff there so that we can find out more, uh, he has an amazing story.

Gary was born and raised in San Diego, California, graduated from Michigan Bay high school, uh, and, California, graduated from Mission Bay High School and went to Mesa Junior College. Spent 20 years in the US Air Force, stationed in Massachusetts, Southern California, Germany, Texas, England, Northern California, and after plus five months in Okinawa. He received his BS from Chapman University

in computer information services, and after the Air Force worked for 19 years, Lockheed Martin as a satellite systems engineer. We like satellites because that's probably what runs this show, actually. He spent two years at the Western Seminary. He's been a Christian since 1970. In the same year, he started teaching the Bible. He has been involved in Christian ministry for almost 55 years. He married to, he's married to Judy, his second wife, for 32 years and has three children teaching the Bible. He has been involved in Christian ministry for almost 55 years. He's

married to Judy, his second wife, for 32 years, and has three children from a previous marriage, and Judy has two boys from a previous marriage. Loved to play tennis and go to the gym. Boy, we know everything about him right now. I think we can just wrap the show. Gary, welcome to the show. How are you? Gary Fierro-Linz Thank you very much. It's great to be here. Pete Slauson I think I just did in your bio, uh, uh, you are here a life story. You know how they used to do those shows on the TV. This is your life. Was that, was that, was that what it was called?

This is your life. Yeah. So Gary, uh, give us any dot coms, any places you want people to check you out on the internet to get to know you better. I'm on author Gary Elliott, two L's two two T's, AuthorGaryElliott.com. Pete So, give us a 30,000 overview. What's inside your new book? Gary Elliott Oh, gosh.

You know, it really covers over 30 years. It started, I went through a separation and divorce. It started in 1990. And I went through about over a year of counseling, which I really needed. I didn't know how dysfunctional I was. So in 91, I was working at Lockheed at that time, and I went to the bathroom. I was just sitting there minding my own business. And all of a sudden, God just gave me

my first poem. I wasn't sitting there saying, God, I could use something spiritual from you. It just came. I thought, holy smoke. So when I finished, I went back to my cubicle and I wrote down this poem. And then after that, you know, the poems just started to come. It's like it was amazing. And then I would share them at work. And some people would say, you know, you should write a book. So it was kind of in the back of my head for a long time. And I'd write some more poems along when things came along, good and bad, difficult times,

you know, death and my family and my mom passed away and stuff like that. And then later on when first I had prostate cancer, which a lot of men, older men have, I was kind of expecting it really. So it was not a big huge deal. But then later on when I, you know, my wife ended up having to have open heart surgery, we both had cancer at the same time. And that was, you know, now we're up kind of up to date in the 2020 time frame. And so then when I finished my last set of chemo and stuff, I had kind of nothing to do and I thought, well, what should I do? And then the Lord just said, write the book.

Pete Slauson Right, the book. So, did you find it was, you know, I mean, one of the things about divorce is divorce can be a time, you know, it's a change over identity. It's a death of identity. It's a death of vision. It's a death of, you know, because a lot of people, when they get married, they kind of have this concept of, well, I've got that, you know, it's like that line in Fight Club. Well, I've got that one thing taking care of for the rest of my life, so, you know, I can focus on other things. And so, there's kind of identity around marriage. So, we're a married couple, you're kind of two people in that identity. And then in divorce, you know, you lose that identity and you have to kind of rebuild your

own identity again as a single person or, you know, whatever's next. And so, did you find it was, you know, maybe in that cathartic moment of going through that experience and, you know, rediscovering yourself, did you find that the poems kind of helped you kind of work through that process? There's kind of a healing sort of thing here, maybe. Yes. You know, I really feel like I got married too young. I was young and dumb. I was, I was young and dumb. Uh, I was 19 and as far as my maturity level, I didn't, don't think at the time I was really mature. Well, you know what they, you know what they say?

Life is youth is wasted on the young. I say that a lot. The older I get, but I was, I was subject to the same sort of, uh, dumbness. I think I still am. I'm, I'm, I look at stuff I did 10 years ago, I'm like, what an idiot I was. Oh, yeah, I know. But you know, in a real marriage, you know, like my second marriage, we were best friends first. And then we grew together. Whereas at first marriage, we were never really friends. And instead of growing closer together, we end up over the

years because we were married for I think 21 years growing further and further apart. And we look good on the surface. But under the surface, we had a lot of issues. And so during that divorce timeframe, like I said, I was really glad I was going through counseling, because I was really glad I was going through counseling because I was so dysfunctional, you know, a lot of issues with anger, a lot of issues with abandonment and other things. So just really needed to get worked out and make myself healthy because I think I emotionally was unhealthy. Do you, would you recommend that a lot of people go on through divorce, maybe, uh, go get counseling at the same time. Maybe that a lot of people going through divorce, maybe, uh,

go get counseling at the same time. Maybe that's something they should, you know, come to think of it. Cause you know, I run a big singles group and talk about dating a lot. Uh, you know, I can tell you, there's a lot of people I see that, uh, and I've had friends in divorce and I've actually gone and had to testify at their family, uh, hearings and I've seen the craziness of the friends in divorce and I've actually gone and had to testify at their family hearings and I've seen the craziness of the cost of divorce and attorney fees and the stupid shit they fight over sometimes in divorce court that just makes the fees worse when really

they would achieve the same thing. You think that maybe more people should do that or consider doing that if they ever end up in that divorce situation, end up, you know, invested in some counseling? Dr. Craig F. Bolling, M.D. I do. So, when I was in seminary for the two years I was there, my goal at the time was to get the Master of Divinity degree. And you had a choice, you could either have an emphasis in biblical studies or emphasis in counseling. And I've been doing so much counseling over the years that I picked the counseling. And one of the first things I learned is, my professor in charge of the counseling side, he actually wanted me to switch over to get the

degree instead of biblical studies into counseling. But he was saying 99 to 100% of everybody is dysfunctional in some degree or another. And so when you've been married for one year, 10, 15, 20 or more, you're dysfunctional. You need to get healthy, mentally healthy. Or if you jump right into another marriage right after that, you're bringing the same baggage with you. And you need to get yourself healthy before you go into another marriage. Yeah, you know, I see a lot of people that do that. They go hop right into another marriage. They can't handle being alone.

And being able to be alone and with yourself and know your identity is really important because you have to be whole as a person. You have to be what I call clean. Die clean, white men from town. That's Stephen King movie. But you have to be clean. So you're right. You've got to clean up your act. You've got to clean up your act. You've

got to clean up your psychology. You've got to really identify and reestablish who you are as a person. Otherwise you're just dragging that married identity into the other thing. And you know, you're marrying somebody probably fairly different. And, you know, so you've got to reestablish that. And, you know, most people in dating, you know, when you date people, you know, the, so you've got to reestablish that and, and, you know, most people in dating, you know, when you date people, you're like, are you, are you clean of your past relationship? Are you through, you know, have you put that away, packed that away, close that up and, you know, wrap the bow on that and said, okay, put that storage. Uh, and a lot of people don't, they're still dragging all that stuff around.

And I see a lot of people don't, they're still dragging all that stuff around. And I see a lot of people do that. They hop right into another marriage and then it fails fairly quickly because they haven't, they haven't done that. They haven't cleaned the addict, if you will. The and you know, I mean, I have a rule and I think a lot of people do that are in the dating market. I, I mean, this rule is, I think I came up with a 90s and I think I took it from somebody else But basically, you know date people who have been divorced if you're serious about a relationship with them

You know, you can go have some fun, I guess but if you're serious about a relationship with them You've got to you know, you got to wait two or three years It takes time to go through the grieving process, the stages of grief. You've got to unpack everything, you know, and there's a lot of time people spend thinking about that relationship and that's part of the extricating from it mentally. But, you know, that takes time. You just can't go over it overnight. It is the death of something. It's the, it's like processing a death of a loved one, you know, it's the death of an identity. So you, you started writing poems and that was probably really helpful to, you know, some people

do journaling, some people do different things, really helpful to kind of maybe, you know, and, and I think this is good advice for other people that are in some of these cathartic moments to sit down and start writing and processing how you're thinking and feeling so that you're just not bagging it all up inside, right, where you want to explode. You, I mean, going through the counseling, I felt like, you know, you go through dark times. Yeah. And you feel like you have a number of feelings going on.

Yeah. You're angry. You go through angry. I was, I was, I was angry with God. I thought, really? I've been a Christian for 20 years. And my first thoughts were, look what you've done for me, God. And there's one time I'm driving down the road and I got so angry, I got I'm yelling and screaming and pounding on the steering wheel and saying, God, look what you've done, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then didn't take long before I thought, oh, I'm sorry, Lord. But you know what? God can take anything you give him. You want to yell and scream at him because you need to. That's okay. He can handle it. He can handle anything. If you want to. I spent a lot of time crying to cry like a baby for the first year just because of

all the emotions I was going through and you will go through those kinds of emotions, you know, and you feel like, man, I'm in this dark spot. Am I ever going to get out? But as time goes on, as you get healthier and healthier, you start to see, I think I see a little bit of light at the end of that tunnel. Yeah. Like one of my poems, you know, you're seeing the light coming out of the forest. Oh, man, you know, I was wondering when it was ever going to stop raining and pouring and hailing, when am I going to see a little bit of sunshine? But after a while, you see

it start to come and you just feel differently. It's amazing what God did in my life. Pete You know, we were talking about the Sun a couple shows, I think last week, and you know, you've got to just trust the process. I think, you know, one of those instruction manuals that they should give us when we're, you know, we start life is, hey, you're going to go through some dark times, you're going to know some troughs, troughs, your troughs, you're going to go through some, some tough times, you're going to go through some deep ravines of life, and you're going to survive if you just keep going. So just hang in there. You know, I think I used to hate when people would tell me, you know, it's not

about the destination, it's about the journey. Cause I'm like, damn it. I want, I want the perfect destination. I want the perfect flight and I want to make the fewest mistakes and I want everything to be perfect. And you know, a lot of people fall in that mentality and that, and then when they get challenges thrown at them, they're like, what is this?

And you're like, Hey man, you should have expected this. And I think after you live long enough, I, you know, like I just, nowadays if something, you know, we go through something bad, I just go, well, okay, we, so this is something we, we need to realize that we can grow from and that we can do things with and it's fine. We're going to be fine. We just have to get through this. We have to keep going.

Just keep going through the tunnel. Keep taking one step forward. Doing things like therapy like you did, journaling, poem writing. Some people write books to help them, you know, and a lot of times that writing stuff down gives us that self-reflection, that self-awareness that we need to help get through these moments. And you know, I think one of the most important things I realized is, you know, everyone goes through these dark times in life, these valleys of life, and you know, everyone goes through these, these, these dark times of life, these valleys

of life. And, uh, you know, you just gotta get through it. You can't give up. You just gotta keep moving. But one friend's friend, the other eat the elephant one bite at a time. And that's what's helped me. I don't know what your thoughts are on that process. Uh, feel free to throw in here. No, you're absolutely right I Mean you hear it all the time one one step at a time one day at a time you think okay? Yeah sure It's really true, you know Like I said you go through so many emotions and some days

It'll be terrible and your mind just kind of thinks it's amazing how quickly our minds go to the negative. And, um, you just can't, you can't, I can't say you can't do that because we will, but you can't stay there. Exactly. And for me, that's the importance of prayer, of staying close to God, because, you know, a lot of people in the Bible that went through some really tough times and horrible times, but they kept their focus on God and you get through that emotional mess that you're going through, whether it be a death or a move,

remove cancer, medical issues. It's, you know, you just take it like we say, one day at a time, one step at a time, and you will get through it. You're not alone. You're not alone. And that's, you bring up another good point, the not alone point. And that's one of the things people sometimes do is when they don't reach out for therapy, when they don't talk to other people and they don't maybe self-reflect by writing, you know, the most important thing we can learn in life is that this is why we do the show. You know, we have people on like yourself who have gone through the cathartic moments. They have a blueprint of how they survive those moments. And so they can help

other people. And that's the most important thing to do is people sometimes will isolate themselves. And you know, that's how suicide happens and other things where they go, I'm the, you know, this is me life or maybe sometimes a God or some something else is, is after them or trying to destroy them. And, and they just feel isolated and they just paint themselves into a corner of madness. And when really, you know, we need to reach out, talk to other people, listen to Chris Voss show so you can find cathartic blueprints. Maybe I should rename the show Cathartic Blueprints. The cathartic time blueprints. But you know, realizing we're not alone

and there's other people in the world who can help us through things. I know I've told stories over the show of the years. People are probably sick of hearing them where, where things happen to me. And I was like, ah, I don't want to share this. It's kind of personal and selfish and booze me cry whatever. Chris has got cry babies. Um, but you know, I mean, there were losses, but, uh, uh, turns out me talking about some of the things that I talked about have helped so many other

people and, and help, you know, that helped that realization, Hey, I'm not alone. There's other people have had this problem. There's other people who survived it. There are tools out there that we can utilize. Uh, tell us about your upbringing. upbringing. How did you grow up? You know, how did it, and maybe how much of that shaped you, did you find in counseling? Give us a lowdown of history on you. Dr. R. R. R. You know, it's funny, because I've been a Christian for so long now,

a lot of people assume that I was raised in a Christian family and went to church all the time, blah, blah, blah, blah. And it's not the case. I was basically raised by my mother. My real dad, like a lot of guys back in those days that went through World War II, they were also alcoholics. My dad was an alcoholic.

So was my mom, really, and my stepdad. But I never went to church. In fact, my mom was actually a card carrying member of the AAAA, which is the American Association for the Advancement of Atheism. Oh, really? So, um, but, but she was a loving mother, you know, she didn't bad mouth God and, and, and the Bible too much every once in a while, she might say something, but you know, it wasn't, but my, and my stepdad, he was in the Navy. And I remember my mom telling him, um, cause he said, Oh, I want to

stay 20 years in the Navy. She said, fine. But Gary and I are going to leave San Diego, so you do whatever you want. So because of that, he had to volunteer for sea duty a lot. So I didn't see him. And when he was around, he was so introverted that he didn't really spend much time with me. But the main thing I really wanted to bring out though was even though my mom and real dad got divorced when I was only like five,

he always lived close by to us in San Diego and I saw him quite a bit. Your dad? That once he remarried, he really settled down as far as his drinking and everything. down as far as his drinking and everything. What I learned from him and that stood out a lot was that he loved everybody. It didn't matter whether you're a white, black, red, green, purple, male, female, he would go out of his way. I saw him take his shirt off and give it to somebody because he said, you need it more than I do. Somebody would come and say, I could really use a truck, take my truck, take it for as long as you need it. I'll just, you know,

stay by the house and when you're done, bring it back. He, he went out of his way to just love people. And that's the way I grew up and that's the way I was, you know, even in high school, you know, I didn't, I loved everybody. Everybody was a friend. I tried to be nice to everybody. I go out of my way to help people, whatever I can do, I'm there. So I learned that from my dad and my mom was also very loving. I never got spanked. that doesn't mean I was perfect

by any means. She just didn't believe in spanking, but yeah, she was very loving and my dad was very loving and that's how I grew up, which helped me to be the way I am. So when did you kind of get involved in religion? Dr. C. You know, again, it's funny because not well as in San Diego, it really wasn't until my first duty station in Massachusetts that we started going to a church, I think it was a Baptist church, and people were really nice to us. I thought, well, that's really nice. Because I was an airman nobody, making no money at the time way back then in the late 60s, they would bring us food because we really needed it. My first son was born in 1970.

So they would bring us food and stuff. I thought, that's really nice. And then we would hear, I would hear a little bit about the Bible and things. And I always felt like even though my mom, like I said, wasn't a believer, for some reason, when I was a kid, I always had this prayer, I would go to sleep at night and I would say the same prayer. Now lay me down to sleep or pray the Lord my soul to keep. If I should die before I wake, I pray the Lord my soul to keep if I should die before

I wake up pray the Lord my soul to take I have no idea where who taught me that wasn't my mom. That's for sure Card-carrying God was always in the back of my head. And so when I went to okinawa Some guys came knocked on my door and shared the gospel with me about all everybody being a sinner And how we need to come to christ how He is the only way to get to God. And so it all made sense to me. And so I accepted the Lord back then in 1970. And then when I went back to Massachusetts, the pastor came to me and he said, I want you to teach a high school class. And I said, no. My first response was no. But God had another plan because He wanted me, because I said, I've only been a Christian for six months. Well, I feel like you could relate to them better than I

could. So that's how I got started. Pete Slauson Wow. Sometimes the teacher is the best student, the person who learns the most. Pete Slauson Yeah. Pete Slauson I kind of do that on the show. I might learn most more than any other in my audience because I get to sit first in and ask questions. And I have to be focused on the answers. Sometimes if you're out there listening to the audience, you can get distracted.

Don't do that, folks. I want you to just stare at the, uh, podcast screen or whatever you can zoom on your phone and, and, uh, I want you to just to focus to, to you get that vein that forms in your forehead, the sticks out. No, I don't do that folks. I'm not even bad. That sounds bad. That's a, that doesn't sound, it sounds like the lawyer should give

me some advice on that one. Don't, don't tell that to people, Chris. Anyway. Um, no, it sounds like, uh, you know, one of the things that happens is, um, you know, one of the things that happens with children who grow up in, in, uh, I don't know if you call your parents alcoholics, but sometimes with a lot of drinking going on is there's sometimes a bit of instability that they have in the home. And so one of of the things people seek in those times from that sort of trauma is they seek stability. They look for something that can give them a log, a rock that can hold

from in life. Do you think that some of that impact your childhood with the dissolving of your parents union very early on? And that kind of creates its own instability of itself. You're correct. Um, there wasn't the alcohol as much because you know, when you're a kid and you're that, that's the thing to do, you know, drink. Yeah. I mean, in that era that everybody drank in that era, I mean, you know, my parents and all muscles parents way back then

they're smoking one, two, three, uh, cartons, taxi cartons. the bucks to get a carton of cigarettes that was more impactful for me than the alcohol and the reason being because I was 17 years old when my mother got throat cancer and I was with her when she went to the doctor and he said the cancer you have is strictly from smoking. Really? Wow. Oh and so you know but still I tried it and like the first puffer to us like a coughing Why the world people like this stuff this terrible so I didn't smoke Drinking I definitely didn't want to get to the point where because my dad like I said, he was an ugly alcoholic I saw him fighting the police when they would come to arrest him,

he would fight them. I thought, boy, I never want to get to that point. So yeah, I mean, that's a bit of instability right there. Yeah. Yeah. You know, seeing that and everything else, I mean, that's you're wondering what's going on. Why is this going, seeing that and everything else, I mean, that's, you're wondering what's going on. Why are you, why is this going on? As a child, sometimes we have a lot of a hard time processing this data and we just store it as trauma. Sometimes we put it away and our mind goes, okay, we're just going to share this with, try and resolve this at another time when maybe we feel like this person's developed. And it's kind of interesting, a lot of people pack trauma away.

And so it was good that you went to therapy because maybe some of these things that you went through when you grew up impacted you and your relationships, your romantic relationships, maybe it affected your marriage, your marriages. And you know, it was good that you went through some counseling so that you could maybe see, you know, maybe is there anything I need to resolve here, maybe to understand what's going on in my life and make yourself a better person. I think that's maybe the journey we all need to be on. And the counseling I went through was through the senior pastor at the church we're going to, so that was also quite helpful having counseling with Him.

Yeah. I mean, anytime we self-reflect, and I think that's something that's really lost in this era that we're in, you know, we're kind of in this narcissistic era where, and I'm guilty of this too, where we, you know, we spend all our time online bragging about who we are and what we're doing, and you're kind of, everything's a brand build. Everybody's got a brand build now. And you know, there's a certain aspect of sharing that like we talked about helps other people. I like to share my ideas. I kind of use Facebook as a journal a bit, but because it's actually kind of nice. It reminds me a lot of things over the years, like, you know, recently reminded me of my dog's passing and stuff. And I'm like, Oh, yeah, I

should really remember and think about that. You know, it's you live a long life and you lose a lot of things over time because you're focused on things. And you're like, Hey, I forgot about that. But, you know, being so reflective, spending time with ourselves, spending time with ourselves in quietness to ponder things, you know, or kind of think about ourselves like, why do I do what I do in life? But it's interesting, you know, we've talked about this a lot on the show, and it's really an important lesson for people, is that a lot of what happens to us in our childhood, trauma and different experiences

we have, they shape us and they shape our marriages or relationships, how we interact with people. And, you know, there's a lot of stuff maybe that we need to unpack there, fix, and then finally pack, you know, put away in storage because we're like, hey, all right, we got all that done. It sounds like you've been through that journey a few times and would you say that's helped improve your relationships? You're married your second marriage, etc. Oh, for sure.

You know, after the doors, I said, well, I'm never going to get married again. A lot of people say that. It's interesting. One was disastrous. I can't take another one like it. But then after about a year and a half or so, I thought, well, if I should get married, this is what I'm looking for. So I wrote down some things.

For me, the first thing I put on there is I need a godly woman, somebody who puts God first. Second, I need somebody who respects me because I didn't get that with the first one. She has been respectful to me and we know our communication needs to be there. And so I said last thing on the list really was I didn't care if she was pretty or not. I was more important about her inside than it was her outside. than it was her outside. But God gave me both. She is just absolutely beautiful inside and out. I was blessed with that. I'm so thankful. We've been through so many things together

with our cancers and other things that we've had, her open heart surgery. God has really blessed us in that area. So tell us about the open heart surgery. This sounds like, and cancer, this sounds like another journey. A lot of people end up going on. A lot of people end up dealing with because they're, because they're, you know, I mean, this is kind of something a lot of people are going through in life nowadays. And you know, this is one of those other hurdles that we get thrown that, you know, we can,

we can help each other through by, uh, giving each other support. That, that's for sure. Um, yeah, just so thankful. Not only, not only for, for Judy, but I had a lot of other friends to say, we're living in, uh, surprise Arizona at the time when she had her open heart surgery and the major cancers, but I still had a lot of friends and relatives back in San Jose and I could actually feel people's prayers. I've also got some other good friends overseas. I could feel those prayers coming in for me and for Judy. It's just amazing

you have that feeling knowing all these, like we said before, you are not alone. You got people praying for you, people calling you, texting you, emailing you, making sure that you're doing okay. What can I do to help you? Yeah, I mean, it's so important for us to reach out and talk about our problems. We were talking, I think last week week with somebody on the topic of suicide, who I

believe had a son who committed suicide. And you know, a lot of times, you know, not talking to someone else, not reaching out. If you're feeling you're in trouble, you can call 988, uh, which is, it puts you in touch with people who can help. And, uh, you know, sometimes just talking to other people about your issues and opening up. And sometimes we feel, you know, shame seems to be something that kind of holds us back where we don't want to talk to a therapist or talk to somebody else because we're like, well, I don't want people to know anything, you know, all that good stuff. And, you know, talking to people

helps open the door to, you know, improving yourself, improving your life and becoming a better person. You almost need to do that. So, yeah. Dr. Craig P. Hicks I can understand because there was one time I remember specifically it was early on in my counseling and stuff I was in a group there was a large, had at least 60 people or 60 80 people in this room and I'm there and actually had to do with talking about counseling and stuff and I thought I'm here with all these people surrounded by all these people and I feel so lonely. I thought why am with all these people, surrounded by all these people, and I feel so lonely. I thought, why am I, all these people, shouldn't somebody care about, you feel like no one

cares. You feel like even in a crowd, you're still alone, but you're not. And like we've been saying, talk to somebody, speak up, talk, you know, people there that want to help you. So yeah. Pete Slauson Yeah. And people want to help stuff. So what do you hope people come away with when they read your book?

Dr. Michael Bickel Thank you for asking me that because, you know, at first when I wrote the book, I thought, oh, it's just a really nice poem. But really, it's my life. It's more of a story of me going through those 30-some years, and everything that I went through is more than just poems. And I thought, when I finished this, my goal was not only to glorify God, but I want people, I want to be able to help people. just like I talked about my dad, how loving he was to everybody. I want to help people because there's a whole bunch of people out there that are going through

or gone through or will go through a divorce and separation. People are going to go through some medical issues, whether it be cancer or heart issues or something, they're going to be able to read this book of mine because everybody I've talked to have read this book, both of them. Yeah. They've said, I love this book. Some people said, you know, the poem's really nice, but I love your story.

The story one person said, you know, I love the cover of your book because of the colors You know the colors of my book are Burgundy and pink burgundy just stands for multiple my lomo, which is a cancer I have and pink is for the breast cancer, which is what my wife had I want people to be able to relate to to me to be able to help them to say I'm so glad I read this. It really helped me to get through what I'm going through. Pete Slauson

What an uplifting message. And so, you've helped this in your own journey through cancer. Pete Slauson Yeah. Pete Slauson Yeah. So, you know, it's one of those things where, you know, like I said, helping each other, listening to the show, you know, we bring so many people on that have gone through so many different things and it's interesting to hear their stories, their journeys, the choices they make and, you know, sometimes they talk about the mistakes they make or, you know, sometimes we're just kind of fumbling

through life because, you know, they didn't give us an owner's manual last time I checked, I didn't get one in the mail. I'm still waiting for mine to come in the mail. Um, and, uh, uh, so as we go out, uh, any final words, maybe a word or two that you can say to people to help them out, encourage them to read the book. Uh, are there any offers on your website, any coaching, any consulting or anything like that, et cetera, et cetera, give us a final pitch out in your.com as we go out. Well, here's, here's, here's what it looks like. And, um, you know, I just want to emphasize the fact again, that you're not alone.

You know, I mentioned, it says you can get through this with God's help. And that's definitely true. I could not get through a lot of stuff without God's, without God's help. And that's definitely true. I could not get through a lot of stuff without God's help. Again, the book. Get help, folks. If you need help, get help. One thing, I hope this doesn't take too long, just mention this one last little thing.

I hope I can help, but think of all the devastation going on in Texas with the floods. That really bothered me a lot. My heart went out for those people that have lost, especially young kids, that were swept away and then died through this. The parents, I've been through some stuff, but to lose your kid like that, And it really bothered me a lot. So I hope that, you know, if my book can help you, that'd be great. But just to let you know that I know there's a lot of people

out there that they're praying for you folks. And I want the best thing for you. So God bless you. Yeah, we need all the help we can get. That tragedy in Texas is horrible. Some of the things we've seen about how, I guess, they were offered federal funds to create a prevention system, emergency system that the areas surrounding them have. And I think it's just a travesty.

I think some people need to be all criminally liable on the city council for not taking those federal funds that were offered to them and protecting those people. It's a great example of, it's not a great, it's an example of, a tragic example of how, you know, we need to look out for each other more, care about each other more. This whole rugged individualist sort of mentality of some groups. Yeah, that doesn't work for a lot of people. And a lot of people, you know, in Texas, there are large areas of people that are, you know, they're not rich, they're average people. And when these things happen, they need help. We need to

help each other and lift each other and we need to look out for each other too. And that's really important because the rising tide lifts all boats and when you operate of scarcity, you know, somebody's going to fall out of the boat and die. And it's just unfortunate that some of these things happen when they were seriously preventable. Anyway, but thank you very much for coming on. Thank you for sharing your message. And give me a shirt.com Gary, one last time as we go out. Gary Fierro-Klein Yeah, so it's authorgaryelliot.com. Thank you so much, Chris. I really appreciate everything you do.

Pete Slauson Thank you very much. I certainly appreciate it. And I appreciate people like you come and, you know, it's, it's not, it's sometimes it's challenging to share your story. It's, you know, you're opening yourself up, but you know, it's so interesting how much it impacts things. I just recently, you know, people have heard for, you know, probably close to a decade now, some of the, uh, stories I've told about my dogs and losing them and the cathartic moments I went through and trying to heal and recover from loss.

They were kind of like my kids and I think it was my kids. So it was kind of like losing a child, you know, and I don't have children. So for me, it's pretty complete in that order of, well, this is a child for me. And yesterday was the seventh anniversary of the loss of my second dog, a husky that we helped through cancer for a year and a half. And I talked about that experience online with people and shared our journey of where we helped her through hospice care. And we spent a year and a half trying to keep her alive and surviving cancer.

And sharing that whole experience in those moments helped so many people and it's been seven years. Yet to this day, I still have people that come to me and be like, you know, some of the things you talked about with your dog and the kind of the thought process you went through and the grieving process you went through helped me go through my stuff, made me realize I didn't have closure with my father's death or someone in the family or my, a pet or something. And it's interesting how just telling our stories helps so many other people. And sometimes, sometimes you don't know, sometimes you're getting a pre-plan.

Sometimes you might listen to the Chris Voss show and you hear someone's story and you're like, I don't know, that hasn't happened to me yet, but it's good to know. I've got some, I got a blueprint there for when I was really with you for the dog. Uh, we had a dog at a Dalmatian mix that passed away well back and now we've got a chocolate lab and so yeah, well they sure, they sure crawl into your hearts. So then I can show them to give. Yeah.

Yeah. Uh, well thank you very much, Gary, for being on the show. We really appreciate it. Thank you very much. Thank you. And thanks for tuning in. Go order up Gary's book where refined books are sold. You can get through this with God's help.

It's out August 28th, 2024. And never be afraid to ask for help, please. You know, dial 988 if you're in trouble. You feel any talk to someone right away? There's it's free. It's anonymous. You can do that that or reach out to people, you know Gary reached out to his pastors, you know, whatever the case may be talk to someone, you know You'd be surprised how many of us have been through that same journey That's kind of what's interesting is you're like, there's a lot of people went through this. I'm not alone That's kind of what's interesting is you're like, there's a lot of people went through this. I'm not alone

So thank you very much folks go to good reset calm fortress Chris Foss linkedin.com fortress Chris Foss Chris Foss one on the tick tockity and all those crazy places in it Be good to each other. Stay safe. We'll see you next time and that should have us out