The Chris Voss Show - The Chris Voss Show Podcast – Unlocking Leadership Potential with Dr. Rhonda Parmer’s Expertise

Episode Date: February 21, 2025

Unlocking Leadership Potential with Dr. Rhonda Parmer's Expertise Rhondaparmer.com About the Guest(s): Dr. Rhonda Parmer is a certified executive coach and behavior analysis consultant who specializes in helping high-potential leaders cultivate unshakeable confidence to effectively lead world-class teams, achieve financial goals, and avoid burnout. With an impressive 31-year career in public education, Parmer concluded her tenure as an Associate Superintendent before founding the Leadership Executive Group. She is also an author working on a leadership book, utilizing her EASE framework, and she actively engages with clients through one-on-one coaching and workshops. Episode Summary: Join Chris Voss as he explores the intricacies of leadership development and executive coaching with Dr. Rhonda Parmer on this episode of The Chris Voss Show. With a lighthearted introduction, Chris brings humor and warmth before diving into insightful discussions with Dr. Parmer, who shares her extensive experience in helping leaders grow. She brings forth a wealth of knowledge from her educational background and her work as an executive coach. Throughout the episode, Dr. Rhonda Parmer discusses essential strategies for building effective leadership, including the importance of delegation, time management, and self-improvement. She introduces her EASE framework and explains practical applications for developing leadership skills in various sectors, including education, banking, and even clergy. The conversation reveals the significance of understanding individual team dynamics and utilizing tools like the DISC assessment to foster better communication within teams. Listeners will gain valuable insights from Dr. Parmer on crafting successful leaders who not only focus on business results but also ensure the well-being of their workforce. Key Takeaways: The importance of delegation and time management in effective leadership roles. How the foundations of behaviors are shaped by heredity, early life experiences, and personal growth. Understanding different communication styles with tools like the DISC assessment to improve team dynamics. Three effective techniques for maintaining work-life balance: blocks, clocks, and socks. Executive coaching can transform aspiring and current leaders across multiple sectors, enhancing their skills for future success. Notable Quotes: "What got you here won't get you there." "You're doing something that only you can do. That's when you're really in your leader sweet spot." "If you're doing everything, then you're really not doing anything." "The only person you can ever change is yourself." "Success breeds success… there’s something psychological and physiological when thinking about yourself as a successful, confident decision-maker."

You wanted the best. You've got the best podcast, the hottest podcast in the world. The Chris Voss Show, the preeminent podcast with guests so smart you may experience serious brain bleed. The CEOs, authors, thought leaders, visionaries, and motivators. Get ready, get ready, strap yourself in. Keep your hands, arms, and legs inside the vehicle at all times because you're about to go on a monster education roller coaster with your brain. Now, here's your host, Chris Voss. Folks, it's Voss here from thechrisvossshow.com. There you go. Welcome to the big show. We certainly appreciate you guys. As always, Chris Voss Show.

His family loves you but doesn't judge you, at least not as harshly. You know, your siblings because they never liked you anyway. Anyway, guys, welcome to the big show. Go to goodreads.com, 4chesschrissvoss, linkedin.com, 4chesschrissvoss, chrissvoss1, the tiktokity, and all those crazy places on the internet. Opinions expressed by guests on the podcast are solely their own and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of the host or the Chris Voss Show. Some guests of the show may be advertising on the podcast, but it is not an endorsement or review of any kind.

As always, we have some of the most amazing, brilliant guests on the show. We have a wonderful young lady on today. We're going to be talking about her experience or insight and how you can make your life better with her knowledge. Dr. Rhonda Palmer is a certified executive coach and behavior analysis consultant working to help high potential leaders build unshakable confidence so they can lead world-class teams, reach their financial goals, and avoid burnout. She's a children's book author and is writing a leadership book.

She has compiled all the research from the gurus and turned their advice into actual steps using her EASE framework. She leads workshops and works with clients one-on-one and in groups to help them discover their strengths, align their actions, and their values. She retired from public education after 31 great years. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you for your service. I finished my career as an associate or finished her career, not my career, as an associate superintendent. I got caught making jokes and getting off base there. She's founded the Leadership Executive Group, my favorite topic, leadership, where she and

her team coach leaders across all sectors to ensure they maintain success without sacrificing their well-being. Welcome to the show, Dr. Rhonda. How are you? Great, Chris. Thank you so much for that outstanding introduction. I do love all the jokes, so thank you. Do you want me to refer you as Rhonda or doctor during the show? Rhonda, please.

Some doctors, they're like, I hear enough Doctor, Doctor, Doctor. It's kind of like mom, mom, mom, I think, sometimes. So, give us your dot coms. Where can people find you on the NOMs? Yes. So, RhondaParmor.com. Pretty easy. But remember, Parmer rhymes with farmer.

RhondaParmor.com. And LinkedIn, Rhonda Freeman Parmer. Working to restore some other social media sites. I had a sad situation over the summer where my Instagram got hacked and now I am in Instagram timeout, I guess, while they investigate and figure it out. But I'll start it up again later. But I found that LinkedIn is just as good. You know, you get connected with a lot of people that way. Oh, yeah.

LinkedIn is where all the money is at that's for sure but i was inspired by you chris with all the socials so maybe i'll start just recreating we try to be everywhere you know you never know where your audience that resides you know there's the people that are all over so it's kind of important to kind of do that give us a 30 000,000 over you, what you do there to help people. Okay. I like to have trainings. We have, we work with all different types of sectors, banking industry, people in the museum industry, oil and gas down here in Houston, education, of course, that's where I started and just either work one-on-one with the CEOs, executives, or the aspiring executives, or sometimes they'll call me in to work with their entire team. And so we're really trying

to make sure our CEOs are functioning the way they should be. And what I mean by that is that they're doing the work that only they can do. So sometimes when people work their way up, they're so good at what they did that they bring that skill set with them to the next level. And that's not really what they got hired to do. So we have to help them tease through that and say, what got you here won't get you there. So I'll give you an example in the banking industry. A great teller may go on to become a great loan officer and then move on up to executive or vice president, and they haven't been trained on how to deal with all the people aspects or growing a team or understanding different dynamics between teammates and that kind of thing. So that's where we come in.

Oh, yeah. We found in the sales business that a lot of times great salespeople don't make great sales managers. We found that out the hard way a few times. Yeah, people don't. People don't. You know, if you're the frontline cook at McDonald's and you move up into a CEO role or leadership role of management of some type, you don't want to be still flipping all the burgers all the time.

You need to be focused on some other activities. And one of the things you talk about on your website is delegation. And that's a failure that a lot of people don't do especially in the entrepreneurial field they fail to delegate we you know we come up learning all the trades because when we were new we had to do everything you know when the business is starting it's just you you're you're kind of the captain of all hats i used to always and even when i had hundreds of employees, I would still tell people I'm the CEO and the janitor because no one picks up anything around here. That is so true, Chris. You know, and I try to tell people, if you're doing everything, then you're really not

doing anything. You're not really getting done. You're not prioritizing. When you drill down, that comes to, it boils down to a lack of confidence. And it's either a lack of confidence in themselves. So they're doing something that they know how to do. So they can feel busy and like they're productive and getting things done, even though it's not what they should be doing. Or it's a lack of confidence in their team. And so it should be a chance to train team members up. We don't want to rob them of their learning for their one day promotion when we're gone. I have a pretty easy formula for delegation and it really is just do it. If it's

something you can do and only you can do and you need to get it done, answer this email, whatever it is, do it. Delegate, of course. Defer it. Maybe you never touch it at all. It's just something you're just going to put over here and look at because you're still deciding. Or just delete it. You don't even need it. We have so many things coming in our inboxes or even mail. Don't even waste your time looking at it. Just throw it away.

You know you didn't ask for it, so get rid of it. And if you can stay focused a little bit like that, you free up your time to do the things that you need to do. Yeah, time management is a big part of it, huh? Absolutely. It really is. Something to help with that, too. You mentioned how I work with leaders, and I'm trying to help them make sure they focus their time on their priorities, doing the things that they need to do, because I don't want that as a taxpayer, for instance, and just looking at a school business as a taxpayer, I don't want my taxes going to say, let's say a principal mowing the yard. Mowing the grass out in front of the elementary school.

They love doing that, but they're paid to make the hard decisions that nobody else can make yeah it's the same in every sector you know if if i'm paying to go on a vacation then i want each person to do their role so my vacation is flawless and that kind of thing but when we're when we're talking about time management i i i want people to be able to prioritize time and also make time for themselves. So I talk about three things in order. It's blocks, clocks, and socks. Blocks, clocks, and socks.

This sounds like a title for a book. It should be, right? I'm going to do that. So blocks. So we have our calendars, either your paper calendar or your electronic calendar. Block out time all through the month right off the bat for yourself to be uninterrupted in your office working on the projects that only you can do or the meetings that only you can host. Block that time off because nowadays when we're sharing

calendars, when people see that time blocked off, they're not going to interrupt you. They're not going to put a meeting on that time because you've already blocked it off. They don't need to know what it's for. They just know you're not available. And then clocks, set your clocks and know what time your day ends. And I know different things come up with executives and CEOs and that kind of thing, but at least try to, you know, three days out of five, leave on time and have an accountability partner, you know, your secretary or your counterpart there. Hey, we're done for the day. Let's go.

We'll finish this tomorrow. And then the socks are pretty easy. When you get home, kick up your feet and do something for yourself or with your family. I like that. Be tuned, you know. I like how you keep it simple. So the three things are blocks, socks, and what was the middle one? Leave on time. So blocks of time to do your own work while you're at work.

Clocks, so you leave on time, so you're taking care of yourself, your family, or whatever. And modeling. Modeling balanced life is good for everybody. Just leave you on time. I do the modeling on my OnlyFans. No, I don't. That's a callback joke on the show. We always joke anybody who

googles whether or not I have an only fans you're disgusting so I just want to know that I like to we'd like to shame our audience around here in the Chris Fossum anyway please please God no one ever do that don't ever don't ever google only fans of Chris Foss so tell us about how you were raised the reason I said thank you for your services my mother was a teacher for about 20, 25 years. My sister was a teacher as well for a short time. Tell us about your upbringing, what shaped you, what taught you about leadership, et cetera, et cetera. Okay, thank you. So I was born and raised here in Houston. I am the only girl in a family with four brothers. We, solid. My dad had to go off out

of town to work, but sent money home and we made it. And it was, you know, mom made our clothes and made our food. But we were solid. You know, we had great parents who prayed for us, showed us how to live. And, you know, but just like everybody in our generation, you had these things programmed in your mind, you know, work hard, get a job, do these things and money doesn't grow on trees and all these mindsets that for no bad, no mal intent, they are designed to help us build, try to build resilience and try to have dedication and, and move on and serve others. So all of those things are programmed in your mind. You mentioned earlier, I'm one of the, I am a certified behavior analysis.

And when we think about behaviors, three things shape our behavior. A third of it is just heredity, you know, plain old genes. Another third of it is what was modeled to you from the time you were born till about age 12 or 13. And the last third is your own experiences from the time you can really start to make sense of them around age eight to present day and so obviously the older you get the more experiences you have and the more opportunity you have to change or alter adapt your behavior and so I was I was I knew I did not want to be a stay-at-home mother I wanted to have children I never did I'll tell you about that in a little bit I never never did have children, but I thought I would have four or five or six kids

from the way I was raised. I knew I didn't want to have to go out of town like my dad and work all the time. And then my other models, I had a grandmother who was a teacher. She was a high school English teacher. And when we would go see her, all she did was talk about her students, how wonderful they were. Everyone was brilliant. Everybody was an amazing writer. Everyone had a funny story. So she never complained about the students. I'm sure there were some turkeys back then, but she never did get on to that.

She just made it sound so exciting. And so I thought, well, I'll become a teacher. I can have fun days like this too. And then as I got older, I saw my brothers doing different things, technical things and engineering. And I thought, maybe I'll do that. That's also thrilling. As I talked about those experiences, children, when they're not exposed to different types of experiences, the only thing they think they can do is that something that they know somebody else does. And so it's using that a little divergent.

This is my commercial for the day. It's very important that we teach young children all about different careers. So, Chris, if you're ever invited to do a career day, go do it because kids don't realize there's a lot more things to do besides teacher and doctor. I've done a couple. Good. They're kind of fun. Yes, they are.

So what shaped me? I knew I had to work hard to do something different. I worked myself through college as an engineering technician so I could be like my brother. And that made good money because I graduated debt-free. But about halfway through, I realized, man, I don't like being by myself all day. Writing these reports is kind of cool but i'm lonely so i went back to the education field yeah and you i mean you learn a lot about leadership when you're leading yours in an army of of students and then of course you've got to deal with the boards of education and the parents and everything oh yeah the parents i forgot

about the parents yeah my mom was sorry i'll go ahead tell me about your mom my mom was lived through the age where it used to be the teacher was redeemed as as the i don't know hero the arbitrary of the hero the arbiter of of truth and knowledge and then she lived through the period where suddenly it became like they wanted her to parent all the kids. And, you know, suddenly she was to blame for everything that was wrong with the stupid kid who, I don't know, they were jacking up with sugar cereals and sending to school. ADD and ADHD and OCD and, you know, all the things. But yeah, it became that thing where if you gave him a bad grade it was like suddenly the teachers fault that your kid stupid right so she must have been a teacher in the 90s huh she finished up yeah yeah she's been retired

for she's been retired for I think about 20 years or so she's 82 she's been retired for probably about 20 years but yeah fortunately she she wasn't alive during the the shooting things when those things started i think i think the high school things have started like the the colorado thing but yeah it was kind of it was kind of interesting she would call and talk to me and i would just hear about how things are going in education i was just like wow crazy you know they started doubling at the end they were starting to double her class size and doubling it again. And it's crazy times. Yeah.

Now, where are y'all from? Where was she a teacher? Oh, okay. Utah. Yes, I knew that about you. I'm sorry. Okay. No, that's okay.

Oh, you share in Vegas and Utah. So you use a lot of that techniques that you learn being a leader, being a principal, and all that good stuff. This is the funny thing. So I'll back up so what i i didn't realize this while it was happening but my first year my first year as a teacher my principal mr gilbert de leon shout out to him he was wonderful he used he would put me in charge of different committees or tell me to set up science fair or tell me to you know hey set up this dance or whatever and i just okay my boss told me to do something a science fair or tell me to, you know, hey, set up this dance or whatever.

And I just, okay, my boss told me to do something, I do it. And I didn't realize what was happening, but he was expecting more out of me. And it made, I guess that's just the way I did things. If somebody tells you to do something, you do it. But after it happened, I started to reflect and I realized, he kept telling me, you're a leader, you need to do something, you do it. But after it happened, I started to reflect and, and I realized he kept telling me, you're a leader. You need to do more. You need to go get your master's. And I kind of struggled with a little confidence back then. And I was like, no, no, no, no, no, I'm not, I'm not. And then he finally would just keep on and on and pointing things out and

saying, you know, there's, there's not too many people that I can just hand a, a piece of paper and say, here, start a, create a whole event or start it. And I didn't do it by myself. I'm not trying to say that, but he just noticed there was something in me. And what I'm trying to say is when I finally realized that I had leadership abilities or whatever, it made me go back to my childhood, because if you're the only girl with four brothers, you have to sort of referee sometimes. And I think that really did shape it really from the time I was in second grade, you know, the mediator and the, Hey, you know,

let's put things together and do it a different way. Instead of this, this four boy testosterone argument, you know, all of that to say, yes, education definitely taught me, but part of my upbringing did too. And it was a matter of fact, when I finally admitted that, oh, I do have leadership skills. And I do have a way of bringing people together. And it's not a it's not trying to be cocky or condescending to anyone else. It was just a let's, this is the gift. You know, some people have a gift of singing, I have a gift of

making people feel like they're all in this together. So you accept your gift and you use it. Sounds like your principal, you know, delegated well. He understood that he needed to build you as a leader, give you experience, and put you into leadership roles that could, you know, develop you. And you could get that muscle strengthened to be a good leader and be a good uh administrator of everything and so it sounds like you know i mean that's a that's an important leadership skill too is to is to train your replacements you know some people think they're not replaceable but right you know everybody is i was thinking of michael eisner the other night i don't know what was going on with me but i was like whatever

wasn't michael i was trying to figure out his path but i was thinking of michael eisner the other night i don't know what was going on with me but i was like whatever wasn't michael i was trying to figure out his path but i was thinking about his journey through i think it was disney and how i remember reading the book about the guy who's back ceo of disney now i forget his name but there was a whole kerfuffle of the power shift between them as they uh transitioned ce. And there wasn't that sort of handoff that you would normally have or training. It was a competition. But yeah, a lot of people don't do that. I had to learn that too as an entrepreneur to train future managers and to basically train myself to be replaced or train someone to replace me, which is really hard because I'm really darn smart.

Right. We are almost irreplaceable, right? Almost. But yeah, I do credit him to that. And from the time I actually realized that, because I'll be quite honest, and this happens a lot too, when people are asking you to do more and more and more, you think to yourself, Ali, what are you doing? Why are you dumping this on me? I got students to teach and parents to talk to and lessons to write. But through it, I realized, hey, he just offered me an invaluable

opportunity to have mastered all these skills and do different things that not everybody gets a chance to do. I remember I was still a teacher, and he allowed me to run the summer school program. And I remember the superintendent at the time was saying, wait a minute, you're, who are you? Why are you running the summer school? I mean, it didn't take long for him to know me, though. Yeah, but that's brilliant, though. I mean, that's part of leadership is training the future of your company so that the people can come up, so that there's something to inspire you to.

I believe the reason I was thinking about Michael Eisner was he didn't want to be replaced. He thought he would go on forever as the god of whatever. I think it was Disney he was running at the time. And hopefully I have my references right. But I don't know why I was thinking of Michael Eisner. It was kind of interesting the other night. I was like, wait, he did work for Disney, right? But didn't he also do work for NBC, I think it was.

He had all these roles. Yeah, I remember now I was thinking of it because I was thinking of NSNL had their 50-year thing. And there was one CEO who worked for NBC who really kept that alive. And you look at it now, and it's 50 years in. And Bob Iger also was the one I was thinking of, who's the current CEO of the thing. Anyway, it's one of those. This is what I dream about at night. This is what I think about at night.

You're on that natural plane of thinking. What CEOs are up to. What CEOs are up to. Some people dream of, I don't know, people on the beach or something in bathing suits. But I dream of CEOs. So now you have a pretty good-sized company going on there. I see that you have quite a few gals that are working for you as consultants and stuff. Tell us about your setup there.

They're awesome. So I have this group of ladies who is really pulling. All of them are really pulling for me. And we are all are all I mean, just be honest, we are all retired principals or district administrators. And we started our company out really just thinking, let's call up some superintendents and ask them, you know, how are you building your leadership bench? What kind of teacher induction programs do you have? And we got a little traction, but not really enough to really have a business. And all these ladies are like, hey, am I working for you or what? You know, when we opened it up to really to all the other sectors, that's when our client base quadrupled and we needed more help. And, you know, those ladies have stepped in. Now, I'll be, you know, to be honest, I'm ready for any more new clients. And we have all these experienced ladies now, and a couple of

guys that are not on our website yet. But we're looking at just true, pure, honest leadership. And it's, it boils down to how do you think about yourself as a leader and what confidence levels do you have and what do you expect of your team? And that is once we know our roles and responsibilities and we share our goals and passions to get to take care of business, then we can operate in a way that I know this is a little cliche, but literally we're all rowing in the same direction and there's no question. And we use a lot of educational research, but we use almost all business research. So I'm a John Maxwell certified executive coach. So we use a lot of his, you know, all of his books and lessons that are just timeless. And as a matter of fact, when I was a teacher, that year I did the summer school, one of the assistant superintendents handed me the very first John Maxwell book that I ever owned was Develop the Leader Within You. And at the time I thought, wow, this person

way up in the top ranks is handing me this book. And then I looked at the title. I was like, oh, okay, I need to develop. But anyway, I mean, all of that to say, we are, one niche that we've just broken into recently is with pastors and clergy. And so if you think about, just say a new minister somewhere, almost, not everybody has a big mega church with a lot of staff. Almost all of them are in small churches with maybe a secretary, maybe one other person who helps out with everything else, you know, music and programs and ministry and that kind of thing. But they're literally almost by themselves. So they have they've been studying the Bible and they have this vision of being a great minister. But have they had the training to build a collaborative team and mostly of volunteers? So how do they rally the troops to

get people on board to do the things they need to for their church without the staff, without paid extra hands or an assistant or anything like that? And that's been pretty exciting to watch that unfold for different pastors. I mean, leadership is everywhere. I mean, even parents are a leader. I mean, one of the things we always talk about is even a parent is a leader. Anybody can be a leader. I'll have some people talk about how, well, I don't have management in my title, Chris, so I'm not a leader. I just have to put up with whatever's going on. I'm like, no, you can be a leader.

And in fact, that's one of the best ways to move up in a company is to identify as a leader. It's one of the ways when I was young, I got promoted at companies I worked with. They're like, this kid, this idiot's got leadership quality. I don't know how. He seems like a moron, but people seem to like him. So, yeah. We started a podcast in 2009. What about that?

That's awesome. I guess. I'm tired right now. They just told us on YouTube. Yesterday, I think we hit 8,500 videos on YouTube. Wow. That's awesome, Chris. Good job.

I need a nap are you using the socks I need the socks I need a relaxation socks and a martini every nice you you have some different things you've got a 90-day transformation to inspirational leader program, it looks like. Are you more direct or influential or steady or more compliant? Those are your four major behavior communication types. But not only do you learn about yourself, you learn how if you're like, for example, I'm a high D. OK, I have very direct and I have to pepper that, you know, temper that down, water it down a little bit when I'm working with other people, because not everybody likes to work with a direct person. And so the best thing about the disc is you learn how other people like to be communicated with or worked with. And so if we're talking about leadership, there's two things that you can always remember about leadership is,

how are you bringing influence? Okay, that's kind of like what I was referring back to with my brothers, you know, they're fighting over what to watch on TV or what to play or whatever. And you influence them by helping settle a debate or whatever. So that's a simple example. But in business, how do you act, speak, interact with other people so that you can influence because everybody has great ideas. The problem is when you have a great idea, but you're not very not very good at communicating it or You're too much of a bully or too direct and your people can't even stop and hear what your process what you're saying And so the best thing about it is you learn how other people like to be communicated with and

You the only person you can ever change in this life, you can inspire and you can influence, but the only person you can ever change is yourself. So when you learn how they like to receive communication, you can modify. And the other thing about a leader is not only how you influence, but how you add value. And so learning about behavior patterns and communication patterns and how to

connect with them, it allows them to receive different communication topics or different things that you're talking about. So they do have value, add value. Definitely. Added to them. I have that problem sometimes where I'm too direct. Some people can't handle a sort of masculine directness. And, you know, you've got to change your tones around to what you're saying to people to maybe appeal to how they respond. But, yeah, everybody's, you know, when I used to call it touching hearts and minds, but then HR said I can't call it touching hearts and minds anymore, or at least not touching. But I used to go around and check

in with people. Check-in is probably a better word, but touching hearts and minds where I go around to my people at least a daily basis and be checking in or weekly basis, checking in, how are you doing? How's everything at home? Everything cool? Salespeople are funny people where if their head's not square, you're going to have problems. You know, if they've got problems at home, they've got problems, you know, if they're not straight in the head, they don't sell well. So you've got to have them on game, especially your top guys. And so if they've got, you know, issues, I mean, I ended up being a psychologist, really, as a… That's right.

As an entrepreneur, because I'm like, I didn't sign up for the psychology part. That's right. I just signed up to make money. Chris, what you just described is exactly the lesson that we teach entrepreneurs, CEOs, aspiring CEOs, aspiring executives, whatever. That you're just building up your people. And I said earlier, we want to have you prioritize your list so you're doing something that only you can do. Only you as the leader can make those people feel validated, noticed, heard. And so that tiny bit of your day where you're doing nothing but checking in and most of the time it's just hey ronda how you doing hope you have a great day but you can sense hey ronda how you doing and oh i

need to stop here what are you working on and how can i help you or what's going on you don't seem your normal self and and you have to have that perception and you don't get that unless you interact with them every day. Yeah. Yeah. Most definitely. So tell people how they can onboard with you guys, how they can reach out, how they can get to know more knowledge, schedule a call, all the good stuff you have available on your website. Yes. Either way, either on through LinkedIn or on the website, RhondaParmor.com. We do have our, you can sign up for our newsletter, check out our blogs, sign up for a discovery call. I promise you when I speak with you and talk to you, it is not to push myself on you.

It is really to hear you. Where are you? Where are you with yourself, your team? And how can I really help? And those are the, it's a conversation where I'm mostly listening and trying to figure out your needs. So I mentioned that 90 day transformation. It truly is. If you go through the system, and I don't give a whole bunch of homework.

I'm not into a bunch. You're busy, but we can talk for just a few minutes every week, every other week, however we set it up, and then you commit to practicing that skill because confidence in and of itself, delegation, all of those, they're not traits, they're skills. So we learn skills, we master skills by practicing, and then we celebrate wins. You know, success breeds success. So if we can, one of the things I train people to do,

I know it sounds a little corny or maybe a little junior high-ish, but we keep a success log. And that's so you don't go through a week and go, oh my gosh, I haven't even done anything this week. Because you may be expected to get these two big things done and you didn't. But every day, just write down the three big things that did happen. And then at the end of the week, okay, I didn't get these two big things done that I said I was going to do this week, but look at these other things. These came up or these other things happened. And there's something psychological and physiological that happens when you're thinking about yourself as a successful, confident decision maker. And, and when you feel those physiological, and there's even neurological changes that happen,

other people see it too. And then that's part of the magic that happens when you build that team and people are on board. And it's sort of that rally cry toward whatever it is we're working on. Is it our building membership at the church? Is it sales in our store, little boutique over here? Is it visitors at the museum, accounts at the bank? Whatever your KPIs are, you step back from those KPIs and develop yourself and your people, and that comes next. Those KPIs will just come.

Well, thank you very much, Rhonda, for coming on the show. We really appreciate it. Thank you so much for having me, and I wish you the best for your next 3,500 shows or 3,500 shows or however many you have. I'm going to go take a nap. Thank you very much. Rhonda, give us that.com

one last time as we go yes sir it's ronda parmer.com and remember parmer rhymes with farmer but starts with a p like paul ronda parmer.com thanks for tuning in go to good reason.com fortress christmas linkedin.com fortress christmas christchristmas, christmas1 on the TikTok and all those crazy places. Be good to each other. Stay safe. We'll see you next time.