The Church of Eleven22 - [BONUS] Relate: a conversation about your love life - Episode 04: Dating

Episode Date: February 1, 2021

22 family welcome to relate where we're having a conversation about our love lives we're so glad that you're here to dig deeper into what we are studying in song of solomon each week as a church last week we talked about how to be a godly woman if you want to catch that conversation or any others we've had so far you can go to co-e-22.com slash song of solomon today we're here with pastor joey and gretchen and our special guests and friends pastor michael and ashley olson not to be confused with the 90 sitcom star full Mary Kate and Ashley Olson. I'm sure you've never heard that joke before ever. But thanks for being here, you guys.

Before we get into all the spicy dating questions, and there are some spicy ones, we're going to play a little round of the newlywed game. So first question, and the guys are going to answer the questions based on how they think their wives would answer. First question, what song would your wife, Ashley or Gretchen, sing at karaoke? Everybody knows what you would sing for karaoke.

Amazing Gretchen. For sure. All right, let's hold out the cards. Let's see them. What did you say? I'm going with ironic, don't you think? You know that song? Alonis Morissette.

Yeah. Oh, she could crush. You could crush that. Is that what it would be? No. But the other one is probably... Born on blondes. What's that called?

What's up? What's up or what's going on? Yeah. What's going on? Yeah. That's it. That's way too high for my range here. Okay, and what did you say over there?

Girls just want to have fun. 100%. Of course. Either that or Billy Idol Rebel Yo. Which is the quintessential karaoke song. All right. Okay.

Wives, your turn. Second question. What was the last new thing Michael or Joby learned or tried? What was the last new thing Michael or Joby learned or tried? Why is ours so much hard? It's a little hard.

Because we're like super boring. Yeah. We're very confident. But I would say both of these questions are coming from the conversation starters that are in your Song of Solomon journals at home. So great questions that anyone watching can do with their spouse or significant other.

Okay, I've given you extra time now. I've filled the time so you can think a little. Eye cream. Hey, man. Is it true? Listen, my wife has an affinity for skin care. And I'm getting to a point where this is coming into play. I was going to say something, though.

Thank you. They look amazing. Plump and refreshed, hydrated. If you have these things at your disposal, why wouldn't you use it? I mean, listen. Okay, Gretchen, what did you say? The coffee mug that he is using today keeps his coffee.

At 145 degrees. It is a gift. In all times. It's amazing. Which you can check from an app on your phone. He has an app for that. Coffee again. Brought you by whoever made this.

All right, well, that's good. Well, before we dive into the more serious questions, we, this past week, Pastor Joby, preached on dating. And I loved what you said and the point that, you know, the world does dating a certain way, and what if we change that narrative? Check this out. Here's the point. Our world's way of dating is hook up, shack up, break up, repeat. Listen, it's a recipe for divorce. It is a death spiral of selfishness with a back door open for you to devalue one another in case it does not go your way. That is not what

God has designed for us. God's way of dating is pursue, progress, propose, period, till death do us part. And imagine if every married 1122 couple that knows the Lord, imagine if we truly submitted ourselves to one another out of reference for Christ, and imagine if wives wholeheartedly submitted and encouraged their husbands, and imagine if every Christian husband that goes to 1122, if he loved his wife and valued her and was willing to lay down his life for her and prioritize her. Can you imagine the impact it would have in our city?

Because let me tell you what would happen. People that don't even believe what we believe would want what we have. Atheist dads would be, I don't know what you do if you're an atheist. You don't pray. Wishing that their daughters would marry one of you. Because they would say,

I don't believe all that crazy stuff they believe about heaven and hell, and I went to the church one time. It was kind of cultish. It was like this crazy guy up there, raises his hands, crying, but I'm going to tell you what, I want my daughter to be pursued by one of those guys. And all the single people, let the, wherever they are, I don't know these places, lemon bar, I don't know, wherever you go, okay? They would be saying, I really would like for one of those. I mean, they sure do treat you kindly, but they won't sleep with you, but before they break up with you, they sure are awesome people. can you imagine the impact if singles honored one another, understood that dating is a process and not a status, and that married people love one another. So my question for you, if we started dating the right way,

we can not only change our relationships, maybe, but could change more than that? Could you talk to us a little bit about that? Well, in John 17, Jesus says they will know that we are Christians by our love for one another. So what if a primary evangelism strategy to reach our lost world was just that non-believers would see

the way Christian husbands and wives love each other and no matter what you believe about God and heaven and hell, that is what you want in a marriage. Like if you're married or want to be married, you want to be loved. And so what if the model on the planet was believers at home loving one another? So good.

So hopefully our conversation today will give people some practical handles to really dive into that and hopefully create that change and that change that narrative. Michael and Ashley, I know your story about dating. It's quite interesting. Ashley, can you give us like the couple minute synopsis of your dating story, how it all began? We'll try to keep it brief. I was living in Ontario, Canada, right after I graduated college. Michael was living in Minneapolis.

He also had just graduated. and he was going on a music tour with a professor, friend that summer, and the last stop on the tour just happened to be his friend's old home church, which was in, coincidentally, a little town called London, Ontario. So I remember walking into this church service, it was a Sunday night, and my parents lovingly dragged me there, and I heard a guy drumming, and singing, couldn't see his face,

and I thought, I'm totally gonna marry that voice. Wow. Yeah, it was shocking and unexpected. Also very complicated, considering I was in a long-term relationship at the time. Complicated sense. Five years and about... It is a theme.

It is a theme. Not for me. Yeah, about to be engaged. So, interesting. Also, hadn't seen his face, so it was like, hope he's cute. Because now at this point you're locked in. Locked in.

Hoopies cute because you're committed. I am officially committed. CI cream. Yeah. So my parents had invited the whole crew back to our farmhouse for bonfire. He spent the majority of the night chatting with my brother. I spent the majority of the night eating 27 marshmallows trying to figure out a way to connect with this person who I was pretty sure that I was supposed to marry, but didn't actually know.

So by the end of the night, worked up enough courage. to ask for the entire band's email just to, you know, be cool. And he gave me his email, didn't get mine. Like a chump. And I spent the next week in some pretty tumultuous conversations with the Lord, trying to figure out what to do with my life. Because I was either going to say yes to an engagement and marry a guy who was a solid dude, but was not walking with the Lord,

or pursue a relationship with a guy who I knew I was passionate about Jesus, but I didn't actually know him. So a week went by, and I shot him a quick one-line email, and he emailed me back in about seven seconds, and that started our relationship. That was, I mean, that night we met was, we consider, like, date one, and then on our 10th date, we were getting married. That's true.

10th date. I don't know if everyone heard that. 10th date. So you only went on 10 dates. How much time was- We saw each other. We were long distance. 10 visits.

Saw each other 10 times before you got married. For sure. The number of completion. Yeah. There you go. Wow. Michael, anything to add or she pretty much covered it? Yeah, man.

I mean, there's a really cool. I've been accused several times of going long on this story, so it's a good thing you asked her. But there's another cool side to it. So I had a guy. I went to Bible College. The professor that she was talking about, Dave, would be like one of the most influential dudes in my life

from a spiritual angle, just invested in me like crazy. Ten years previous to me going to that school, he was her music pastor as a kid. So what you saw was two eras of this really influential guy's ministry coming together. And he did our wedding.

Oh, how cool. And so, I mean, the community and the investment of somebody to us, without knowing how this was going to pan out, this guy was just faithful. And then it all kind of came together. And he stood up at our wedding and he said, I think I'm the only one here who knows everybody. Every single person.

Wow. And you've been married how many years now? 17. 17 years. Very cool. So let's get into some questions. You know how this works. You all have sent in some questions.

We go through them and put together kind of like our most popular questions that were sent in, some common themes. So Gretchen, this one's going to go to you first. When dating someone, if they're not on the same page as you with God, is that a reason to end the relationship? Short answer, yes, but it's never that simple. I think whoever's asking that question is already in pretty deep or they wouldn't be asking that question. And really, you just have to ask yourself, are you dating?

Is there an end to your dating? And is it marriage? Because it should be. If you're a Christian, that should be your goal for dating, not just to date. And the Bible says, we are not to be unequally yoked as Christians. And if you have one believer, one non-believer, non-believer you can never become as one in Christ.

It just won't work. But I think that there are other, there are scenarios where you have to really sit down and talk to your partner and say, this is, this is who I am and this is what I need in a relationship. And the marathon scenario is always my favorite. You're running in a marathon. You're running at the same pace and you cross the finish. line at the same time, great. That's your goal. You're running in a marathon. You're way ahead. Your partner's way behind, but he or she is trying to catch up with you because they know the Lord now.

There may be a baby Christian. They might not be as far along as you, but they're still eager and they love Jesus. That's okay too. You don't have to be running at the same pace. As long as you're running in the same race and you're going to cross the same finish line. That's really good. And then there's the third scenario where you're not even in the same marriage. in the same city. You're running in completely different directions and you're going to cross completely different finish lines. And so you really just have to say to your boyfriend or girlfriend,

hey, this is who I am. And probably by now they kind of get it. And usually a question like that and a conversation that you sit down to talk about is going to open up a huge conversation. Things will come out. that you didn't know would come out. Maybe he is going to say, see ya, or she's going to say see ya,

or maybe it will open up more conversations for them about the Lord. That's okay too, but missionary dating is not okay. I thought that was great. And here's how it played out with us, is that, you know, I came from a home. Listen, man, I was in church so much as a kid. unhealthy and if that can be a thing. But I was just there a lot and I was I was firmly committed to the ministry. I was on a journey towards serving the Lord in the local church or in the music industry or wherever that, you know, would end up. And my wife came from a Christian home,

didn't have the ministry background. But one of the greatest joys in my life, honestly, has been to see how God has positioned. to Ashley through the course of our marriage, and I can only hope, you know, Ephesians talks about washing, you know, with the water of the word. Part of that for me is just putting my wife in environments, honestly like this church, where she's consistently bombarded with gospel truth that shapes her worldview. And what I'm seeing in this phase of our marriage is my wife, like, and you know, because you're nodding, she is quickly becoming one of the most effective disciple makers amongst

women that I find out. So I love the marathon analogy in that term. That marathon analogy is great. Pastor Jobie, you talk about continuing to date and pursue your spouse. So it's going a little different direction. Now, to our married folks, what are some things you are continually doing to date and pursue your amazing wife, Gretchen? Yeah, part of what I was trying to do this week in the sermon is not only deconstruct, like what the world says to single people about dating, because dating is not a status. Dating is a process that, like Gretchen said, that leads to marriage. Because you're not looking for a boyfriend or a girlfriend. You're looking for a husband or a wife to love and pursue.

But when you say, I do, then you need to keep on pursuing and doing, right? And so a lot of times, especially in Christian relationships, man, they just grow stale and old because they quit pursuing one another. So I've told you, I think I'd say this every week. I'm obsessed with my wife. I love to take her out on dates. I really do. And so we just do. I mean, I ask her out today.

And one of the... What'd she say? She's praying about it. The classic line. I pray about that. And it should be super fun, man. Dating as single people and as married people should be fun. The Shudemite woman says about Solomon,

Behold, my beloved, he bounds over the hills like a young stag. Like, he is pumped about coming to pick her up on a date, and she is pumped that he's coming. So, look, I've got a lot of friends and a lot of hobbies. I like her better than all of them. Awesome. And the more... She was waiting for you.

But you cultivate that, man. That thing doesn't just happen by accident. God doesn't just, like, sprinkle love dust on you. You put yourself in those kind of environments where you just remember. remember and reconnect and you know so so yeah we just keep dating and and sometimes they're like fancy ones where we get all dolled up and go eat expensive steaks and then more often than now we it's kind of like midday old people dates you know because my kids are we could say what I love I love me some student ministry

at 1122 well you put your kids into student ministry and they are gone for hours doing Jesus stuff and then you got this gap that you can... Right around dinner time. It works out so good. And it's happy hour, so it's cheaper. You get the old people special. I love it so much. That's what we do.

We're at the door at Marker 32 going, let us in. It's like $4.58. And they're not like, oh, let them in. They come to everything. It's so great. Ashley, tell us, where do you see this show up in your marriage

and I know you disciple many women? And where do you see this maybe either going really well or maybe not so well in the lives and marriages of the women you disciple. For sure. I feel like when we were single, or not when we were single,

when we were married, but before we had kids. Before we had kids, it was really easy. I felt like our whole life was a date. Like it was like a giant sleepover. It was so fun. Tickle fights.

We were. But you do whatever you want. You eat whatever you want, whatever you want. And then you have kids, and it's like, and I remember when my kids were really like,

little and I was like, I need Jesus and I need a babysitter. And honestly, father, husbands, you get extra brownie points if you actually book the babysitter and give your wife also maybe 30 minutes to get ready without like the toddler licking the shower door and, you know, it, that becomes so much more important when you have kids at home because you just don't have as much time to be intentional with conversations, with fun, like just enjoying each other's time like you used to before you had kids. You know, and kids are fun and family is fun, but it's so important once you have children to make sure that you are being intentional about getting away, just the two of you. Allie, it took us 12 years of raising kids. Now we drop them all off at school on Fridays,

and I have the day off, and that's the best day of the week. It is really fun. Best of the week. And when you book a babysitter, book your babysitter 45 minutes ahead of time. So, that you can get ready in peace. With the babysitter. Wow, man. There you go. That's how you get your 30 free minutes to you're ready.

Perfect. Okay, so back to giving some practical handles for our singles who are in the dating world right now. Michael, how, what is your advice for someone to discern if the person that they're dating is the one they're supposed to marry? Yeah, man, this question, when you say it, I hear a couple things.

I hear a couple scenarios. First, I hear the one. And we've addressed that, right? And it's, on this, we've done that, and it's been handled really well. I remember Pastor Britt was sitting here and Pastor Cuam was sitting here, and you actually did that one echo thing. Yeah, yeah. I have to do it every time you.

Right. Now, thanks to you, I do that every time I hear it. Let's do it again. No. No, I think we handled that. I think we handled the myth of that. And then the second scenario is that you're in, you're coming, you're in a relationship with the right mindset.

And you've disbanded the myth of the one. and you're just making some serious decisions. And actually, I think Pastor Jobi in an earlier sermon handled this really well. He gave us some practical tips for how to discover this thing. And he talked about the opinion of friends. He talked about community, family, and not going on your own on this thing.

You know? Certainly don't follow your heart. I've done that a couple times. And this, yeah. I'm a big walking heart, is what people say. But I think objectivity and wisdom, insight from people that know you and love you the most is really, really important in that. That's really good. And Gretchen, you shared with us a bit on our first episode of Relate that you were engaged and called it off.

And so can you tell us how you came to that decision and what discernment played into that? Well, I grew up. We started dating in high school. So we started dating at a very young age. I really think I grew out of the relationship way before I broke off the engagement, or it should have been years before. We dated for almost seven years. And I met Jobby at the gym, talked about that, and we didn't date or anything because I was engaged.

But just seeing him at the gym and seeing who he was as a Christ follower just really made me think because my fiancé was not a Christ follower. It was not a God-honoring relationship. and I finally ate six weeks before the wedding. I'm sitting down doing invitations with my mom, and my mom said, I'm not paying for another thing in this wedding, and so you decide what you want. And I said, that's when she said,

it's better to be single and want to be married than be married and want to be single. And I knew I don't, I don't, I'm not going to get a divorce just because my husband's not running the race, the same race than I am. like if I'm in a situation where I'm in danger or my kids in danger one thing but I'm not so I'll just be miserable the rest of my life and I didn't want that and I knew I didn't want that so I said you're not running in the same race as me and it took a long time it took it took a closer relationship with the Lord for me to really realize that so prayer wise counsel in your life and then choose to do the hard thing to save it in the long run. At that time, the absolute hardest thing I'd ever done. It was, because I was, I mean, seven years I was bringing up with his whole family. You know, like it was a thing.

So my parents didn't talk to me for a while. They were like, what in the world is happening? Yeah. House. House wrecker, homewucker. Okay, so you guys, dating in the digital age is a whole. beast in and of itself between dating apps, which seemed to be taking over the dating scene. We did a quick Google search and found that just for Christians alone, there is Christian

mingle Christian dating for free, your Christian date.com, Christian cafe, real Christian singles, over 60 Christians, Christian seniors, Christian seniors, Christian date, Christian crush. And like, we stopped scrolling because it was like, this is plenty for what we need to say. It is overwhelming. And then you add in social media. you add in our fear of making phone calls. It is, it's a lot. So, Ashley, between dating apps, fear of phone calls, social media,

what advice can you give to the people who are trying to date right now in the digital age? We did not have to go through that. I know, praise. Your email was kind of like the start of online dating, maybe. Well, honestly, I mean, we virtual, we were the OGs. That's weird to think about. We are the OGs of virtual dating. Which is, I think it served us really well, honestly.

Yeah, yeah, because we were forced to communicate. We knew that it was going to be a thing, and we had to make decisions based on that. But we learned about each other through Sam's Club International phone cards, and I'm dating myself, thus the eye cream. It's true. It's, I mean, it's a lot. And honestly, I think we've said this a couple of times,

asking the Lord for discernment and wisdom, in all of dating, but specifically that arena is, it can be super overwhelming. So I think just asking for wisdom, first of all. And then I think maybe not putting so much pressure on yourself and that as a tool. And just, I mean, it's great to use if that's what you feel like you want, that's the route you want to pursue. I would just say, cultivate really healthy, godly friendships and you want to marry your best friend. So instead of looking for that spouse, just look for a great best friend. And I think start there, maybe less pressure. And then like Pastor Joby has said a few times, just, you know, ask the Lord for opportunities and find yourself in places

where there's going to be people running the same race. If the virtual thing isn't your thing, then go, be in person and just do life and ministry around really awesome godly. people and see where the Lord will take that relationship. That's good. Pastor Joby, can you just give us some handles on how do you balance? Because you talk about often, a good thing can become a God thing if not used properly. So is there a balance between dating apps, social media that can be used as a tool, and then how do you prevent that from becoming an idol? So on the one hand, I guess it's better than meeting somebody like in a bar or something, you know, like some old kind of dating scenes. But my biggest check is the little bit I know about them.

I don't really know much about dating sites, but it seems that the initial treatment, particularly when a guy is looking for a girl, it does kind of commodify the girl. Like all I have is a two-dimensional photo that is my initial reaction, and it's a thumbs up or thumbs down. Man, less than 70 years ago,

the majority of Americans that were married, married somebody that grew up within two miles of their home. And when socials were replaced by social media, the young men lost a significant skill, which was to kind of get yourself cleaned up and have the guts to go talk to a girl and understand what rejection feels like, and then dust yourself off and try it again. And there's something to that that has been lost. So again, the tool in and of itself, I think, is relatively benign, but there are some serious trappings there. There will be nothing that will ever replace face-to-face with a girl, and you feel the thing about her, and she feels a thing about you,

and she says, let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth. There's no dating app for that. So you've got to get to that place. Yeah, marriage is not lived in 2D. Not at all. For sure. And to start something off that way, um,

you might not be on the trajectory that you want to, not to say that it wouldn't be a usable tool. I know tons of people that have. Yeah, we know some awesome marriages. It's an interesting time to just navigate through that. For sure. For sure. Well, thank you guys so much for being here today.

I feel like there is not a lot of direction for Christian dating out there. And I know everyone listening is taking away so many practical tools to hopefully do what you talked about at the beginning. That we're going to change relationships that maybe will change our communities and our cities. So thank you guys and the Olsons for being here. And thank you for joining in. We're so excited for you to be a part of the conversation and sending in your questions. For all things Song of Solomon, including Relate, you can go to co-e-22.com slash Song of Solomon. We'll see you right back here next week to talk about fleeing sexual immorality.

It'll be something. See you soon, church.