The Code To Winning - BUILDING WEALTH THROUGH REINVENTION: INSPIRING JOURNEY OF RESILIENCE || MATT CHICK || EPISODE 062

Episode Date: October 16, 2025

Meet Matt Chick, a powerhouse entrepreneur whose story is the definition of resilience and reinvention. From humble beginnings and personal challenges, Matt transformed his life through relentless drive and a willingness to evolve.   Before entering real estate, Matt successfully ran four car dealerships, each generating millions in annual revenue. But in 2017, he decided to start fresh leaving behind a comfortable career to pursue real estate full-time. By 2018, he launched his own team, which quickly became one of Arizona’s fastest-growing real estate groups.   In just a few  years, Matt has sold over 1,000 homes and flipped more than 100 properties, cementing his place as a force in the real estate and investment world. His success doesn’t stop there — he’s also the owner of a VA staffing company, a nail salon, and a national real estate investment firm, all built from the ground up.   Matt’s journey is proof that no matter where you start, discipline, adaptability, and a vision for something greater can completely redefine your future. This episode dives deep into his mindset, business strategies, and the lessons learned from turning adversity into advantage.

Everybody loves the rags to riches story, right? Because people can relate to it, right? But I was born into a poverty family. Like my parents, you know, my mom didn't work. She went to school pretty much full time. My stepdad was making 12, 13 bucks an hour. My real dad was gone. Left when I was three.

He came back when I was like 13. There's two ways that you can look at that, right? So one, you could take the things that you see on a daily basis, right? So, you know, I learned work ethic by watching my stepdad call out a work or my mom not work, right? I learned how to be a good human by watching other people be bad. Either become the thing that you hate the most or don't become the thing that you hate the most. When was that exact moment when you realized that real estate was your way out and was a chance for you to rewrite your own family legacy as well? You know, I like that question a lot. I didn't know. Like I was in a car business. I was running four dealerships.

I had over 60 employees running 25 salespeople. I enjoy real estate. Real estate as a traditional sales agent. I enjoy it to a degree. Real estate investing is really what I'm passionate about, you know, because you kind of, create your own income you create your own opportunities you know sure you got to go out and hustle and find it hunt and kill it drag at home but at the end of the day you get to decide what you make on that deal the code to winning insights you need today to seize the world tomorrow if you are interested in learning about real estate estate development investing i have a person right now who is very experienced in the field he's also a coach as a founder um above all a father and husband as well. So there's going to be a very, very enlightening interview. So if you are specifically

interested in learning a lot about in the real estate space, pay attention. This is going to be a very, like I say, educational, very informative interview. Without further ado, the man himself, we have Matt a chick. Thanks up, man. Thanks for having me. I'm Jack. I'm excited, dude. Thank you so much. Thank you very much, boss. I mean, one of the things I do love about people, I think you and I discussed earlier on before we started. Everyone, someone's got a story. Everybody. And I know you just shared something briefly.

You started to speak about Christianity, paths, being an atheist and finding God. But obviously, you mentioned that your past was filled with hardship and poverty. How did that shape your hunger for success in real estate? Man, so I actually get that question a ton, right? Because everybody loves the rags to riches story, right? Because people can relate to it, right? But I was born into a poverty family, like my parents.

You know, my mom didn't work. She went to school pretty much full time. My dad, my stepdad was making 12, 13 bucks an hour. My real dad was gone. Left when I was three. Came back when I was like 13. But I think there's two ways that you can look at that, right? So one, you could take the the things that you see on a daily basis, right? So, you know, I learned work ethic by watching my stepdad call out of work or my mom not work, right? I learned, I learned, you know, I learned how to, be a good human by watching other people be bad, right? Does that make sense? So it's like you go, so poverty when it comes to creating money and finances, it was like, there's only two paths here for me. It was either stay in poverty, stay broke, stay exactly how I was raised, or go create

something out of life, right? And it's either you either stay exactly where you're at or you get to go build something. And for me, it was, I didn't like where I was at. I hated being broke. It's probably why I did stuff that I did to make money at an early age. And, you know, I just hated, I hated being poor. I hated it. I hated it with a passion. So I knew that wasn't for me. And, you know, for me, it was like, okay, I'll go do whatever I need to do to make sure that I'm not poor, to make sure that I have money.

So for me, it was like, take the lessons I've learned from my parents that weren't good lessons and turn them into positives, right? So either become the thing that you hate the most or don't become the thing that you hate the So for me, it was, it was, I turned away from it. Not everybody's that lucky, though. Like some people fall into the same trap, the same things, the same lessons, and they become the same identity that they've had their entire life, right? So it's through personal development, self-growth and all those things, right? And that's an easy way as well, you know?

Yeah. I'm just used to it, you're accustomed to it. You're surrounded by it as well. Man, we've been broke multiple times. Like, like, I've taken a ton of risk in life and I've lost money and made money. And there's times, but you're right. being poor, I'm scared of it, but I know that I can get through it. It does create a resilience in you.

If you know what it's like to boil water on a stove to take a bath or, you know what I'm saying? Like, I don't know. Some people can relate to that some moment. Or, you know, we've had potatoes or eggs. I can't eat eggs to this day because we had so many eggs growing up because they were cheap. So, like, they're not cheap anymore. They're not cheap anymore. Yeah.

I was about to say, yeah. That's billionista. Yeah, I know, I know. So it's just like you just get conditioned of those things that you just don't want to be that way anymore. So for me it was good. It pushed me to want to go create something that's worth having. One of the things I noticed as well

from people I've interacted with, those that are still trying to find their path, usually those that had that poverty background. There's a level of anxiety and anxiousness. It's like a fear of, I don't want to go back there to the point where they willing to do anything, you know, kind of thing.

Did you ever have that anxiety? I have a, I still have anxiety this day. Yeah, for sure. Like, anxiety is a real thing for me. I've just learned how to use anxiety as a, as a superpower, right? So like, before anxiety would stop me, you know, it would, it would worry me. I'd stay up at night. It would be challenging. I couldn't sleep. My wife's the only thing that could calm me down. Thank God for her. But now I look, anytime I'm anxious, it's because I'm not taking action. So now anxiety puts me in action. So the thing that's creating the anxiety, if I can take action towards it, then it doesn't, you know, as long as I'm going to go do something.

Like if I'm worried about raising a couple hundred thousand bucks or, you know, raising money for a project that we have or a house that we just closed and we got to start construction or whatever the thing that gives me anxiety, I'll just go work on it. And if I can't work on it, I've learned not to worry about it. I couldn't agree more. When was that exact moment when you realized that real estate was your way out and was the chance for you to rewrite your own family legacy as well? You know, this, I like that question.

That's a lot. I like that question a lot. I didn't know. Like I was in a car business. I was running four dealerships. I had over 60 employees running 25 salespeople and I freaking loved it. I freaking loved it. Fast pace, closing people, sales high energy, sales environment. It's just, it was built for me. But my wife hated it. I was working six, seven days a week, 12, 14, 15 hours a day. I just had two kids. When I getting right head, my daughter and my wife just hated it. Right. So she kind of gave me an ultimatum of like, hey, I already raised two kids without you. you've never around. If I have to do it, I'm going to do it legit without you.

She swear she didn't say that to me, but that's how I heard it. Sometimes we hear stuff. She's like, I didn't say that. I'm like, that's how I took her. So, like, it forced me to get into real estate. I had a buddy that was doing pretty well in real estate. I've been invested in real estate for about 20 years now. So I was flipping back when I was like 22, 23 years old, lost a bunch of money.

And then it was kind of just dabbling in it. So I was just like, man, screw it. Let's go. I'm going to go full time and see what it can do. But became passionate. about real estate once I found what the vehicle could actually do. When you get in the beginning and you're just trying to just trying to survive, right? I went from making, I don't know, $125 to $130,000 a year in the car business to no income,

$30 grand in the bank. That $30,000 doesn't last very long, you know what I'm saying? So like it was at a necessity, three kids at home and a wife, wife and three kids at home, I had to go perform. So I just worked at like a job. And next thing you know, you close a deal, you make $10,000, you close a deal, make $15,000. And then you're like, hmm, what can I really do? do, right? And then you have no ceiling anymore. Car business, I was capped. I was never going to make

any more money. Yeah. You know, so much as you can work so much, like you can just go so high, you know, because it's still the same sales commissions, sales bracket. And you don't own it. Yeah. You don't own it. You know, you know, eventually you got to own, own a piece of it. Maybe not all of it, but eventually you got to own a little bit out of if you want to generate real wealth, long-term wealth. You know, in real estate does that. It allows you to own a piece of real estate or own business or, you know, even if you're a high-level salesperson, closing 50 to 60 units a year. It could be close to making a million bucks in GCI. So like it's just, it's kind of just shown to me. And then real estate in general, I enjoy real estate.

Real estate as a traditional sales agent, I enjoy it to a degree. Real estate investing is really what I'm passionate about, you know, because you kind of create your own income. You create your own opportunities, you know. Sure, you got to go out and hustle and find it, hunt and kill it, drag it home. But at the end of the day, you get to decide what you make on that deal. Oh, I love it so much. And so obviously flip. Right now, it's become an ever so popular thing. And the problem is just trying to see through these fake gurus that just started after COVID. You know, the problem with, you know, life before and after COVID is that there's just more gurus that just started something for like a year or two that want to try and teach courses.

You need zero proof that you've done anything in it and you can go make money and if you could teach it. That's ridiculous. It's true, though. You know, that's what it is, man. That's ridiculous. You know, social media has changed the game. You know, you don't need, if you have popularity, you have everything. Which is even back then popularity had to be earned.

And right now, it's just like you say one thing, go with it. And people just like follow the crowd as well. So people even doing their due diligence are like, well, I found out of the guy was the forum, like, but you just looked at these amount of followers as well. You know what I'm saying? And that's the thing that's, I feel like that's so hard to try and see through the right people. And I don't know what it is.

But like, the best way I've been connecting with high quality people is the fact that like my like surrounding is like quality as well and I've noticed that people like yeah Jake and Joe if because of how they are I feel like sometimes you also born with that natural discernment where you just know like these people are just 100% and it's just it ends up rubbing off that because I just I so hard going through so many people are like this is this people are genuine like it's I'm sure you see it more than I did I'm sure you see it a lot you get to interview people and it's like like this is our first time meeting you're either going to know I'm genuine or not by the

end of it, right? I'm sure you see that a lot, you know. No, they spoke really highly of you. They spoke really high and I was excited about that. I appreciate those guys. Yeah, they're good people. No, and I think so when you started in flipping, what was, what was the process of which you did that was it like, did you have to get the right credit of score? Did you have to get the right place? What was the first step that you kind of like? Deal flow is everything. So if you can find the deal, you can find everything else. Okay. So we just got really, really good at finding the deal. Right. So cold call.

you know, bulk texting back when it was a thing, agent referrals. Like we were just laser being focused on finding deals. And then once I started finding deals, there was really only a couple of ways I knew how to diso the deal. It was either wholesale it or, you know, fix it up and flip it. So once I figured out I didn't have enough capital to fix and flip, I started raising capital, made a top 25 hit list. I have a buddy of mine that was doing CrossFit at 11 a.m. during the day.

And I'm like, either his wife supports him or he has money, because if you're working out in the middle of the day, you know, either working at night or something, but he seemed pretty well to do. So we just started hitting that hit list and started pitching. I was pitching people. I was pitching people on what we were going to do, not what we've done, right? So it was all like, hey, here's my vision. Here's what it looks like. Here's a model. Here's what I'm thinking. And dude, we had two meetings. One meeting, we raised a million bucks and started flipping. Wow. Yeah. He believed in it. The original ass was only for $60,000 because I wanted to spend money on ads. So we were going to wholesale everything. We were just going to wholesale everything.

And then this guy was like, hey, you know, I'll come in and bring some money. And then in the very beginning, we were giving 30% of our profit away to him. He would carry the house, carry the rehab, 30%. And then as you start scaling, you realize buying houses with 100% cash is an absolute mistake because your scalability is low. Like, you know, if your average asset is 400,000 bucks, you know, $4 million doesn't go that far. It's hard to scale, right? So then we started using hard money with a combination of private money, went and raised about seven and a half million, have nowhere near that in the street anymore. But right now, we stay pretty lean right now.

But we've done, I don't know, 155, 155 deals over the last four and a half years, something like that. What advice you to give? Because I've only experienced this thing like recently where obviously I'm going to be heading towards like event space because I've been connecting some of the top podcasts as well. So it's something that is in work in progress. And it was shocking to me when I actually had invents. investors approach me and I'm like gosh dang I've only been doing this thing and see the potential it's mind blowing but for people out there I mean you are so successful the first like go

what advice you give those that are trying to like do funding and like try and like get investors on board yeah when you sell anything you sell the future when you sell a business you sell a future like you've got to show where you're currently at and that you're a viable business but you always sell the future right this is what you could do with it if you take it if you come along right with us so raising capital is no different This is what we could do if you come along on the ride with us. You're a key instrument in it. I'm going to go raise 15, 10, 15, 20 million bucks or whatever it is.

You know, then you got to create your hit list of people that you're going to go after that potentially have the money. And then you're going to go, either is it private equity or is it going to go, you know, big bank equity stuff, you know. And that's a whole other realm. I have no clue. A hundred percent of my money is private. It's all people that I know. None of it's like bank. You know, we have hard money lenders that will lend on the deals for us.

It's all people that I've made genuine relationships, handshake deals. Wow. I raised $7.5 million on a handshake. Didn't have any, no contracts. Unbelievable. Let's tell a lot about someone's character. Right now I'm front. You know, it's just so sad with how much less trust people just have within people.

And it's because there's many gurus that have ruined the industry. You know, like in everything people have done. And I think just having that and just handshakes and still being afloat right now, It tells a lot about someone's character as well. We lost, in 2022, when the market blipped, we lost close to half a million dollars of investor money. And then, so I started calling all my investors, let him know where we're at.

We only had a couple investors at the time. One guy, my main guy, he took 100% of the loss. And then it took me, I took two years and I paid him back. I think we have a balance of, I don't know, 80 grand with him still currently. Wow. I didn't take, we kept doing deals and I didn't take a dollar from it. I lived on my savings why I paid him back. because that was the right thing to do.

And you know what? Many investors would say like, sorry, man, you know, you know the risk that's involved kind of thing. 100%. I had people legitimately tell me, hey, dude, you knew what the risk was. Like, you don't need to do that. I go, no, I do.

Because it was on a handshake. There's no, there's no flipping way I would walk away from that. Not one. Wow. No. And we still own three houses together. That's got another million dollars locked up in it.

That once we sell them, we'll get them back. Wow. I love stories like it And then what would you say Somebody right now watching this thing Because I've had a lot in real estate as well In your opinion What would you say is the best way

For somebody to start in the space Would you say like the Airbnb arbitrage They investing in No did I suck with the short-term rental Rental game residential retail Like residential rentals I absolutely hate them And that field is also kind of sailing

I hate them I feel like off the COVID It's kind of going downhill I mean if anybody follows like the big sub two guys and all that stuff like that's that's how you buy that's how you do it now like the day of putting 20% down on a you know a 500,000 house putting a hundred grand down to get 400 or 500 dollars a month and positive cash flow is absolutely ridiculous like nobody should ever do that in my eyes no other people are going to tell me I'm crazy I know a lot of people that do

that but it just doesn't excite me you know I'm still in a very big place of like I like creating active income I'm not necessarily chasing the passive income currently so I like active income wholesale, fix and flips, novations, that kind of stuff. Our residential retail team, you know, we got 27 pending deals currently right now. So, like, active income is where I'm at because I'm still trying to build. I only recently learned about novations like last year. And the concept of it is just so fascinating to me, you know, because can you explain to the viewers what novation is as well?

Yeah, novation, I mean, it's really just a fancy term to say that you're replacing one contract with another. That's it. It's like a beautiful concept. Yeah, it's it. So you're literally taking your purchase. You know, you have a purchase contract on the house, and then you have the ability to, like, we use an attorney and fact document. We're allowed to then list the property, you know, on the MLS, find a retail buyer, find that, and then create a spread and then invoice for the difference, right?

So we have to invoice for the difference once a lender gets involved. It's just unique, dude. It's just a unique beast. We don't do them in Arizona. We only do them in states that we're not licensed in. Our broker really didn't like us doing them here. And because we're licensed real estate agents. like our broker didn't really love it.

So I would either hire another broker to list the house. We wouldn't list the house here ourselves. Or we just focused when we were like doing more stuff out of state in Georgia, Florida, and Texas. That's powerful. Yeah. No, I really like that. And yeah, and I think the whole like a recurring generation, I'm getting the sub two guys. One of them I'm getting tomorrow.

Cool. And then I'm coming back for Pace, like I think next month as well. Yeah. He's a stud, dude. I like Pace along. Again, it's like. Sometimes it's, I don't know what it is. Maybe I'm just being biased because it's a member of the same faith that I am.

But like sometimes like it's people like like you, like him where you could just, just sense like this, they don't want to rip people. They just generally want to help people. Because I was reading a thing when you, because he was doing a thing where you help the homeless woman like get like a thing. And the comments are like, well, why don't you like just, why'd you have to show it? I'm like, he's just showing out the possibility of what can be done. You know, teach a man to fish, he eats forever.

That's a good concept. teach a woman how to fish she eats forever she never has to be she never has to be hungry again you'll get canceled a fire i promise yeah i'm not worried about that i'm just saying that's the philosophy he did more for her teaching her how to do that than he could ever with that right in any kind of amount of check i couldn't agree more and it's like it's the concept i think which uh stands by with capitalism at the end of day because if you know that there's potential and you're not kept and you're not like subjected to be a able to reach a certain level, you can actually reach that much potential. I remember coming here

in the US, I don't know if you hear the accent, but I'm really from South Africa. Okay. But coming year 2017, with my old mission companion from like the church and I served the service mission. And then I just started seeing like the employment rate was like 3%. But then it's not the 3% is the fact that if you know in Utah's got a very door-to-door sales industry, everyone knocks those comes back does an investment on like a duplex or something like that and like starts building wealth at a super young age and i think seeing that from like you know a foreigners perspective or an immigrant it's like what the heck like what what's possible here you know what i'm saying and then you hear the story that 99% of millionaires like wealth comes from real estate and you start realizing

there's so much potential but it's about doing the right deals doing right to people and making sure you in the right trajectory because you can only easily get rich by scamming people as well you know so integrity comes along with you want to add on that as well yeah take take the right risk i was you know like we have we have the i call it the ten commandments a wholesaling right and one of them is it's it's not a deal till it's a deal and a lot of people when they first get into into real estate investing they're trying to force deals so it's like really know your numbers know what you know what you're know what you're capable of buy it right you know fix it up right don't over don't overrun your rehab, don't overrun your holding costs, right? Those are the little things that matter. It's

like really just pencil a good deal, right? And then make sure that you execute properly. I think a lot of people get excited about investing in real estate, especially in the flip space. And it's actually a recipe for disaster in my eyes, right? Because like if you're too excited about it, you're trying to force it. You think you can push ARV. You think you can push what you're going to sell it for. You think you're going to be the next best sale in the neighborhood. And right now in the market conditions that we're currently in it's just not true you know like right now i'm budgeting two to three to five percent under what the last sold sale was before i buy a house wow so i'm going to come out on the market 10 to 15 grand lower than the last sale because i want to sell my house quick because it's about

turns and then if i can buy it off based off that number then maybe i get lucky and you hit the market and i make an extra 10 grand but you know you want to buy off of a not a lucky number you want to buy you want to buy off. I call it a cake number. So there's two numbers. A cake number and a push number. I buy off my cake number. My push number is what I, blue sky. If we get it, great. I'm excited. We made an extra 10, 15, 20 grand. If we don't, I bought it off my cake number and we still made 50,000. That's powerful. And then would you say right now, if somebody would just try and start like a duplex, out of these two options that I want to talk about, would you say maybe getting a duplex and then renting one out living on the other one? Or would you say just, I know Utah, what's very, very common.

there's like basements where people end up like getting a home and then renting out the basement. Would you say those two would be a good way? I think it's all just lifestyle. Like, is that how you want to do it? Like, sure. Like, whatever you can, if you have the capability of buying a duplex, rent in one and renting out the other, great. You know, if that's an area you want to live and you enjoy that.

And yeah, for sure. You know, or a fourplex or whatever you can do. I think you just got to look at where you at and what can you currently do, right? And then you got to analyze what that looks like. What are you bankable? You know, do you have W2 income that you're actually. bankable. What can you approve for? And then you've got to run the math. Right now the cost of money is so freaking high. Even if you're a retail, even if you're a retail buyer and you're buying at six and a half,

seven percent interest rate, your cost of money is pretty high. So are you actually going to cash flow that asset? What do you have to sit on that asset for the next year and a half, two years to you can refi out and do a cheaper money to where you actually start cash flowing? So you've got to really look at all the variables, right? And then is that the life you want to live for the next two, three, four, five years? No, that's powerful. Now, I think it's great. You know, My favorite strategy is for people that like, if you're just the normal person that's not getting into real estate investing, but you want to make sure you're acquiring real estate as investments over time, over a lifetime. Let's say you're a W-2 employee. You got good income and you want to just

be in real estate. Buy a house, living it for a couple years, make it a rental. Buy a house, living for two years, make a rental. You do that for the next five, ten years. You got, you know, 10 houses. Or you find a way to buy two. Two every year for five years. You got 10 homes, 10 homes at 5,600 bucks a month, cash flow, you're at 5, 6 grand a month. You know, if that excites you. And then over time, that becomes a hell of a lot better, right? You know what I'm saying? Over time, it becomes better.

You know, 20 years, 25 years, your notes are starting to get paid off or you got appreciation. Now you can pull money out into your properties, you know, that aren't going to be taxed. Like, so then it adds, you know, then it adds something. That's so amazing. And then what's the turnaround in flipping? Let's say you buy a home or you want to flip and how many days the turn around before and ends up like flipping. Every project's different.

Like if you were to talk about projects that I'm currently looking on, I want rehab to be somewhere between 45 and 60 days. That's good. Yeah. I want to be done in eight weeks. So if we can be done in 60 days and back on the market and I have 30 to 60 days of selling it, 30 to 45 days selling it, it gives me a four month turn to actually have it. on the market and rehabbed and then 30 days to sell so i'm a four to five month hold process wow and that's when you get the cash just comes as soon as it's sold right okay and then what would you say is like um your first one you said you made like 15k or 10k uh on which one the first

flip you did the first flip i did uh no it was a home round i did like 55 grand on that one 60 60 000 something like that yeah wow yeah most of them were really good until about 22 and 22 I decided to scale, raised a bunch more money, had 21 projects going at once, and it just didn't work out. And then are you also in the commercial space? Not a ton. I'd love to be in it.

We help people get in a commercial, but we don't flip commercial. Oh, yeah. But isn't the process a bit more unique and different? Yeah, for sure. It's different. What I like about commercial, it's definitely more business, right?

It's more business to business, right? But I just, I haven't flipped commercial, so I don't know. And have you, do you have any commercial investments, though? No, zero. I'd be open to it though for sure That'd be a good lane Yeah What we're really looking at right now is specs

We're gonna do some development specs We're gonna we're we're looking for land like out east Queen Creek you know Apache Junction We're looking to do some specs So I enjoy the flip game I everything everything serves its purpose But eventually you got to figure out like what is it good for Like annually right

Like I know guys that are flipping 15 to 20 houses a month And that's their business And they're okay with some $15,000 dollar profits some $50,000 profits. You know, my goal is to make $55 grand a house or I won't do the deal. Wow. So like if I can't make 40 to 55, then we just pass on the deal. And that's on an asset class of, you know, five to $600,000.

That's crazy. Yeah. And then with that in the flipping range, obviously every state has got like its own state laws and permits and stuff. I'm sure. primarily like just to the Arizona, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We don't flip it. We flipped in Texas and it was a nightmare. But, you know, we don't flip in other state. We wholesale in other states.

You probably don't flip in California. That's worse as well. Yeah, not interested. You know, I found, dude, you back, you know, I used to. I was provoking. Yeah, you felt for. No, I'm out. Sorry, continue. I found probably about three years ago, I am that guy that has shiny object syndrome. I like different businesses. I like different ideas. I'm an idea guy. I'm more of a visionary than an executor. So, like, I enjoy day. I'm a day. I'm more of a visionary than an executor. So, like, I enjoy day. I enjoy day. daydreaming about big stuff. And I just found that it just didn't serve me, man. So like about four years, three and a half years ago, I made a decision to just stay laser being focused on what I'm good at and what I know. And now I just say no to everything else. Wow. It takes a lot, especially knowing what your personality is. It takes a lot of discipline, you know. I had a nail salon. We had a nail salon that we owned. We had like six or seven different businesses. None of them were freaking crushing. They were all just a distraction from the thing that would actually make me money. So I just said screw it them out, not doing it.

I love that. And I think, I mean, with this level of success, the trajectory that you've been on, I notice one of the things that most entrepreneur is that are successful as yourself have, there's a mentorship of people that like guided them throughout the way. Did you have that for yourself? Yeah, I've paid so much for coaching. I'm literally paying, I pay $6,000 a month for coaching right now with three different coaches. Do you mind sharing them or are you in?

Yeah, so Dustin Runyon, Alex Sheppleck, and then I have a guy named Coach J.D. So Coach Jadis in California. Dustin Runyon runs a big real estate team here in Lake Havasu. Just a freaking beast of a man. Big in a development. He's raised, I don't know, hundreds of millions of dollars in money for development. As a real estate team that does a ton of transactions. He really helped me in just focusing clarity and what was important.

He believes on taking work on the person and the person will develop the business, right? So we've worked more on the person rather than the business. And it just kind of goes. And then Alex Sheppleck, he's my marketing coach. And then his wife, Shannon Sheppleck, is my health coach. So I pay a ton for coaching. If you don't know the answer, you can either go figure it out or you can pay someone that's already been there. Right.

So like, you know, a high level of accountability around what I want to do. So I just, I tend to pay for coaches and my coaches become my friends. And then I have amazing relationships with them all. I've never ever interviewed a single person or came across single person that has not invested in themselves. I have to. Have to. It's the most important money that you'll ever spend in your life. Exactly.

They just, it's a cheat code. I can pay someone. You know, one of them I pay $1,000 a week. Another one I pay $1,250 a month. Another one I pay like five or $600 a month to. But like, literally there are people that have done it. Like, so why, like, now. I just got to go execute it.

And that's in a struggle in itself, right? Because if it's not a habit yet, you got to especially on the health stuff, like if it's not a habit yet, you got to go figure it how to make it a habit. Business is no different, right? If you're not used to, you know, banging the phones and make 500 calls a day for you to go do it one day and then go do it for the rest of your life, you got to create that habit, right? So that's the important piece. And I think another thing I always see as two components to it.

One, yes, you're paying them to try and, like you said, cheat code, give you the path that you can lead to your success but also helping you avoid the mistakes that they did 100% And then number two It's also you're holding yourself accountable Now that I've paid you You're gonna have to act on it

Because how many things have I gotten for free That I'm like I just put aside It's for free you don't value it as much But if you pay you're like Well I pay you a thousand bucks I'm gonna get my thousand bucks worth of what it is You know So that's how I always see it

And I do the same thing right now Like I go to many networking events I find ways to try and find myself in the right room and ask questions. It's so important. It's everything. I've paid thousand bucks for dinners because I knew people that were going to be there that I wanted to be involved with.

I've paid thousands of dollars to go to events, but I was purposeful, figure out who's going to be in the room, and then why do I want to be connected to that person? Then I was purposeful on making sure I connected with them when I was there. Like being strategic is not a bad idea. I love it. Love it so much. I mean, from obviously going to selling about 40 homes in your first year

to leading one of Arizona's fastest growing teams. What would you say are those habits that change from when you started to where you act right now? The habits, they're all the same, right? So like it's working like it's a job every day. Like I work this like it's a job for me, right? Even though I'm my own boss. I show up and I do the work that's supposed to be done to make sure I have what we have. But the number one thing to focus on ever when you're building a real.

real estate team is recruiting. So the number one thing you should always do is always be recruiting. And I've had ebbs and flows in that. Like right now, my real estate team's smaller than it's been in a while because I took my foot off of recruiting. Right. So today, you know, I don't know, last week, a recommitted to recruiting. I got a pipeline of four or five agents that are thinking about coming on board. So the work works, right? It's just do the same thing over and over. Something that's tough for me that might be tough for a lot of people is the consistency in the thing that breeds you the result, right? It's always being, willing to do the same thing over and over.

Entrepreneurship is actually really boring. When you work for yourself, it's actually very boring. Because the boring things are what works, right? So like, and for guys, I like excitement. Like, I thought chaos used to serve me, but chaos was ruining my results. Right. The truth is the only thing that matters is doing the activity on a daily basis that breeds the result that you want.

Exactly. Right. So if I know that recruiting feeds my business and I need 40 or 50 agents to get back to 100 million in production, then I got to go recruit every day. That means send 20 face-talking messages to agents congratulating them in closings, sending text messages, calling the school lists. That means I have to go do those activities or I got to hire someone to do those activities

for me, right? So it's just being a real estate agent is no different. Being an investor is no different. If you want to be a real estate agent, it's 20 connects today. Go talk to 20 people a day for the rest of your freaking life. For the rest of your life. As long as you're an agent, it's 20 people today. That's the standard.

You know, if you want to be an investor, then I would talk to 20 real estate agents today and see if you can find deals. That's how I would network for the deals. Or you got to go spend money to find deals. Or you got to call or do or you got to call or doork. Whatever the one thing is or two things are that you're going to go do, you got to do that for life and you got to commit to it. I love that. I love that so much. And but the problem that lies on this whole thing is the fact that, yes, you did admit and say that entrepreneur can get boring.

What happens? I don't, you know, you know Robert Kusukes, cash flow quite a track. the employee small business big business investor is the fact that when people go from e to s they get so like in love with the idea of doing everything because there's a lack of trust and delegating like i want to do i want to do i want to do which could lead to burnout also it could lead to stagnation but also leads to the fact that you just think that no one is good enough to do what you can do and to some degree because also people feel like they're investing so much in their own businesses that they feel like people can't be able to do that level. Have you ever struggled with that before? No.

Okay. No, I'm the guy that delegates everyone. I have my old business partner. My old business partner explain me perfectly. I'm really good at step one. I'm good at getting the relationship. I'm good at creating the opportunity. I'm good at, you know, step one. And then step two through 99, I need someone else to do. That's just who I am. This is who I am. So like, you know, my partner today, he carries a lot of the heavy lifting with the retail side and production. And all that, my job is go create opportunities, invest in real estate, raise capital, and agent recruiting, right? So we just stay in our lanes.

But you have to know yourself well enough. I didn't know myself well enough to do that. You know what I'm saying? Does that make sense? So like you have to know yourself well enough. And it's explained and it describes me perfectly. That's why I don't take offense to it. I don't like if someone goes, are you good at executing?

No, I'm not. I'm really good at building relationships. I'm good at getting stuff done. at DefCon 5. If it's at a point that it has to get done or it's going to blow something up, I'll get it done. But until it's Defkin 5,

I suck at getting it done. Interesting. And what's the hardest part about recruiting the right people? Because recruiting is, I mean, it's not that hard. Get it out, you get a few people there,

but the right people that see your vision. Culture is everything and then holding standards, right? Got to be able to hold standards and culture is everything, right? So we have really have four standards

on our real estate. I mean, 20 connects a day, show up to 90% of everything put on, clear your tasks every day. And the last one, I have to cuss, but it's don't be an asshole. Okay. And what that really means is have a spirit of contribution. And this, I stole this from Dustin Runyon and how he runs his real estate team. Those are literally his standards. The only one that he doesn't have is tasks done daily.

I have one that you, all your tasks have to be done daily. And the spirit of contribution basically means, hey, in the beginning, people are going to pour into you. When you have a question, someone's going to answer. Sooner later, you're going to have the answer to a question that someone else has. You're expected to give that answer. This isn't like we're here as a community and help each other to get where we want to go. And if that's not who you are to your core, then we're just not going to be the right for. Because we give everything away for free.

I'll help anybody anytime. Don't care. Like I have a couple of coaching clients now, you know, that pay me. I invite them to the team stuff. I invite, you know, like not everything has to be paid for. There's a lot of stuff people get for free just from being in our world. And that's so true. I couldn't agree more.

Culture makes it or breaks like a total team. And you've seen cultures that are just a little toxic. You've seen cultures that are super complacent where people don't see a vision. You see people that are like, aren't when I're clocking and clock out as well because you don't want to really be there. And are your sales reps? Is it like a commission thing? All of it.

Yeah. So we have about 12 people on staff that we pay. And then the rest are 1099 contractors. Yeah. Okay. Which is also hard in itself. It's actually easier to pay someone. Most people work better when you're paying them as an employee.

I have a freaking crazy concept of like a 100% payrolled real estate agent team where everybody is on salary. And I think that we could do more business. Because then you hold them accountable to the standard because you're paying them to do it. And most people would probably do it easier than they would do it for themselves. And I could pay them probably 30% less of what they would make as a regular agent, just doing it on their own. Most people operate better as an employee.

It's very rare to find someone that can operate to a standard. At least I haven't found it. You know, it takes, you know, out of 10, you're going to find two or three. And then you try to hope to God, you keep the two or three. That's what it is. How's retention on your side? We have an attrition rate of 30%.

Okay. Yeah. Which we need to fix. It's industry standard for a real estate team. Yeah. But, like, I would like it to be a lot less. And that's going to come down to culture. It's also going to come down on opportunities, and that falls on us, right?

The bigger we can create the team, the more opportunities we can give agents, the bigger they could see a vision within staying. And those are our burdens, right? We have to make it so big that they never see themselves going anywhere. Exactly. And also incentives and stuff like that, right? And seeing like, hey, listen, if I reach a certain target, this is what's going to be able to be there as well. 100%.

Real estate is such a cycle, you know. So coming with teams, coming, coming and going. It's like, oh, yeah, let's try that. Let's try that kind of thing. And most teams are a race to the bottom, like commission splits, you know, brokerages are racing the flat fees or, you know, most of it's a race to the bottom

on how cheap someone could be with you. You know, but we don't prescribe to that. And what do they do? Do they just do cold calls or they find deals? No, we have five Legion levers that we focus on sphere, social media, open houses, leads, and then agent referrals. Okay.

Those are our five leads, lead levers. Okay. Yeah, super, super laser beam focused on what we do. Well, if someone comes in, And if you plug it in and do what we tell them, they'll make money, guaranteed. And what would you say is good in that field in making money per year? Oh, I mean, good. Like, I know agents making a half a million, $600,000 a year.

Okay. Yeah. Well, I would say average agent, they all want to make six figures, right? That's the big, anytime you're interview of real estate agent, they want to make six figures, is what it is. But if you get 20 connects a day, you'll make six figures, for sure. And I think that's one thing I like us well about real estate is that it's been consistent over the year. like what the standard expectation is. Because with all these other industries,

I was in the solar industry, where it was like slightly more than six figures, but then it's one of the booms that kind of go up and down. But like insurance and like real estate is one of the most consistent stuff over years and overtime as well. And also the fact that I noticed

that you strive to help a lot of entrepreneurs also like, you know, make six figures is you're giving a realistic expectation rather than saying your first year you can make like $30 million. Yeah. No. I tell everybody, like anytime someone's, says, hey, I want to make $100 grand, I tell them straight up. I go, I don't know a bunch of businesses that you can make $100 grand part-time.

Yeah. So if you're not willing to work 40 or 50 hours a week, then let's just get rid of the $100,000. Like, if you want to, if you only want to work 20 hours a week, then it's going to be, you know, you can probably go make $40,000,000, you know, now I know people that have done it that have made multiple six figures. I know a good buddy in mine worked at the post office and he was doing 40 deals a year. That might be wrong, so don't quote me on that, but he was making well over in the six figures and running a real estate team and working at the post office.

That was just an animal. Just a freaking animal. Love it. High energy, super fit. Do is just an animal. That's an anomaly though. It's not a very common thing. It's not at all.

No, not all. What's the most painful investment that you've ever made and what did it teach you? I think you may have mentioned that the one you lost is that off the curve, but is that the most painful one? No, I had, if we're talking deals, like investment deal. Yeah. I would say I had I had a deal that I bought we call them relationship deals I was trying to get in relationship with the guy it was a deal that I typically don't buy sight unseen so what I did is

he had a house I got I underwrote it I didn't really necessarily love it I asked him a bunch of questions on it and I ended up saying hey dude I'll buy this I'll take this off your hands but I want I want to see everything that you get like I want to be a legit buyer for you so I bought it um sight unseen he told me I could I couldn't walk it and I knew like I shouldn't have done that. Anyways, I bought the house. Rehab was only supposed to be 50,000. That's what I was told that it was going to be.

It ended up getting red tagged by the city. The permit, the addition that was on it wasn't permanent. They made me rip it off, redo it. So I ended up having to tear off like 600 square feet of this house. Permanent put 600 square feet on. Do a full rehab. It cost me $145,000 bucks when it was supposed to be $50,000. So I was 100 grand over budget.

sold the house and then I lost $142,000 on one project. I'm a visual learner, you know what I'm saying? So I paint pictures every time people are talking. And right now that's like, oh my gosh, lighting a bag of money on fire. And you get antidepressants for that. Yeah, it's horrible. It's horrible.

Oh, yeah. And I think it's important because then you learn from these mistakes. I don't do it now. One thing I can't stand as entrepreneurs that just have these success rates and success stories. I won, one, one, one, one, all the time. Because when something does happen, you're not prepared for it as well. but that was a lesson. Do you think it has helped you see things a little differently now?

I will say no if I can't walk it. If I, if this, you got to buy a sign and see it and I just don't trust it anymore. And there's a lot of guys that do and they're willing to take the risk. I'm just not that guy. If I can't walk it,

cool, send it someone else. So you risk averse pretty much. Yeah. So the way I underwrite deals now is I disqualify them. If I can't disqualify it, then it's a deal. I literally look at every deal on why it's not a deal. Every deal. I don't even try to make it a deal.

My only goal is to make it not a deal. And then if I can't do that, it's probably a deal. Wow. So I literally tear the deal apart. And do you also focus on the residential side? Do you focus on the high-end homes, like the high millions and stuff?

We've done a million and a half is our biggest. Okay. Yeah, a million and a half. I would. It just takes so much more capital, right? You just place in way more money. Your rehabs are bigger. Now you're like two, three, four hundred thousand in rehab.

Your holding costs are 10, 15 grand a month per project. This takes a lot more capital. So just the risk reward for me. And I haven't seen it work out where I'm making multiple six figures on the deal. Like if I'm putting up a half a million bucks, a capital, you know, like I'd like to see at least a return of 150 to 200 grand. And I have found that they could be $100,000 rips or they could be $75,000

rips. So like for me, I'd rather go do two at $500,000. Wow. Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. It's just longer projects, right? You start getting $3,500, $4,000 square foot.

house, you're reconfiguring it, you're, you know, you're doing a bunch of stuff, you know, and then you're dealing with a different, you're different, with a different buyer, a different buyer that has a different attention to detail. So now it's got to be meticulous and it's got to be perfect, which is fine. Like I enjoy giving that kind of product, but there's no room for error at that point. And then what's the ROI for an investor that invest in you in like these projects? Like what can, what's a return on investment? 10%. Okay. Yeah, they get 10%. Yeah. I guarantee 10% return for anybody that places money with me. I haven't needed money in a long time, so I don't necessarily raise capital much anymore. But like if someone wants to get on

intervigible projects because we align, like if I like them, you know, if like it's a, like I got one guy right now that just generally wants to just get in the game. He's got about $100,000. And I'll do a deal with him. And I'll give him 20% of whatever we make. I probably won't pay him 10%. I'll give him 20% of the profit on the deal, just because. Wow. And would you say, what's the turnaround for that if he does that? Six months. I tell everybody six months. Wow. So if he's willing to put up a hundred, I'll probably return 20 grand to him in six months, which is phenomenal. Where else can you get that? It's a no brainer. It's a no brainer. Where else? I mean, nowhere. I'm trying to even think of like,

volatile stock market. I'm trying to think of bonds. Yeah. Bonds. It's hard. It's guaranteed thing right now, but that's still like what, four percent, five percent, depending on what it is. And that's also like in a 12th band span. Like it's, it's ridiculous. That's amazing. 20 percent on It's huge, yeah. So it just depends, you know. I only do that for people that are, like, coming into my world, though. Like, I don't, like, it's rare that I need a bunch of money anymore. So it's, you know, I just don't, I've had, I have enough capital raised.

I'll never scale back to 20 projects. What's the highest you've gotten for one investor? Three and a half a million. Where the heck did you get these investors? I need, I need, I change my circle. Yeah. Yeah, one time I had three and a half million out on one guy. He's actually my business partner now.

So that's why I say I don't need a bunch of money anymore. So when things got bad, he was the guy that took 100% of the hit. We were partnering before that. But when he goes, I'm going to take 100% of the hit, he could easily said, no, I want all my money and I would have gone. I would have had, like, he would have took every ounce of dollar that I had in the bank to make it right. So when he did that, it's solidified. Like, I'll do whatever he ever needs.

Genuine friend to this day, I'd go to war for him. I'd protect his family. he was, they were mine. You know, I'd show up and I'd show up and take on hell. That's this interview in so while I hardly even looked at the questions. Let's start the interview right now. No, like, but that's the relationships we're looking for in life, isn't it? Exactly. That's what it's all about. Like, if we're looking for genuine relationships that we care about

others, like, I mean, that's why we're here. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And I, again, I like that as well because when you build relationships with people, it's just, it has a different feel. and especially in this conniving and evil world, you cherish and value it so much because you realize, wow, you really are a very unique and anomaly and not go and do anything for you and for you as well.

So I'm glad you found those. I'm glad you saw on yourself. And what advice would you give people to try and get those genuine? Oh, you have to be genuine. Like vulnerability is everything. You have to be genuine. You have to be real.

You have to be about it. Like, it's so, it's crazy. Like, I don't even know how much more time. time we have but like for me i come from a background of of like where my family were my brothers it was people that i was doing illegal stuff with people that i was running life differently so like you like had a legit bond you would literally go to war for each other right you if one dude was in a fight you all were in a fight and i hate to relate that to this but it's it's that vulnerability that sacrifice even in today's like so that's how i value my relationship am i willing to go put my life in

in line for someone else. And if it is, that's a relationship that I, that I care about. But it only comes by being authentic and vulnerable and real and having authentic conversations. It's not about me winning on him and him winning on me. It's about how can we help each other win and level up and get where we want to go. It's a true brotherhood, right? So it's about that brotherhood that I look for. So if I can't have that, then I'm not about it. Like I don't, I suck at small talk. Like I just want genuine relationships. So I find myself going deeper in conversation faster and then if it just doesn't match it doesn't match and we can be acquaintances and love each other and you know but but it doesn't you know but we just would never be close right

and as men we're looking for genuine genuine relationships that are close because a lot of a lot of times as men we feel like we have to have this facade but it's not true like we you know it was so much of ego i got to show up to be something i'm not i got to be able to try and say drive the cars that i don't call him in a for like to try and live a life something like you know It's just. I drive a 98 Silverado. Right. And people make fun of me all the time.

I have one buddy. He goes, you're the richest, bro. He goes, you're the broke as rich dude, I know. It's the greatest compliment in the world. It's the greatest compliment. My overhead at my house is ridiculously low. People laugh. Like, I just live, I live a simple life, man.

I enjoy that. I know what it's like to be broke. Warren Buffet. Oh, yeah. So, like, I don't think you can. Like, you know what I'm saying? He's the only person I can say beats you. Yeah.

Has his three bedroom and all my heart down there. That's true. I got a nice house. Yeah, that's true. But it's guys like that that that that that I learned from, man. There's guys like that. Like, I don't want to be the flashy guy. I never have been.

I just want to be myself. Show up, be me, and then whoever that resonates with, I'm happy with. And if it doesn't resonate, I'm okay with that. So, Matt, every time I conclude and ask, oh, my guess, this is one thing. It's the last and final one. Because I say the code to winning insights you need today to seize the world tomorrow. In your definition, what does the term winning mean for you? first thing that comes to my mind is a relationship with God, but I don't, you know, I'm not, like, winning in life is having a relationship with God and knowing that your time here is not forever.

So just get right with him. So when you're done, you're done and going to the right spot. But then I would, then I would, if I was talking like a worldly winning, I think the relentless pursuit of something that, that excites you. Like, I don't, I don't think of, I don't necessarily know if it's about achieving or monetary value. it's something worth living for on a daily basis, something worth creating. Relationships, family, being productive in society, a business that provides the lifestyle that you want. It's about living with purpose

and never losing side of that purpose. Having something to live for that's greater than yourself. Powerful. Wow. If you could let our viewers know where they could get a hold of you, if they want to try and get in a coaching program, You turn on your courses and like Instagram handle, social media, whatever it may be. And I'll leave the description. I'll leave titles on the description section as well regarding.

Instagram, I am Matt Chick, Facebook, Matt Chick. Those are going to be the easiest ways to find me. I suck at all the other platforms. I'm still figuring that out. But Instagram's phenomenal or Facebook, you know, Matt Chick or I am Matt Chick on Instagram. Awesome stuff. The code awaiting insights you need today to seize the world tomorrow, the man, the myth, they're very legend himself.

That chick, baby. Let's go. That was fun, man. That was fun, I loved it. Thanks for having me.