The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Bonus Episode 7: Impossible Choices

Episode Date: May 9, 2023

Noam Dworman, Dan Naturman and Periel Aschenbrand are joined by comic, Jason Salmon. They discuss Spirit Airlines, impossible choices, suicide and more.

I appreciate that. Don't you have to download it, honey? No, only when we switch from remote to this. But we're good whenever you want. Okay, so I can go? Yeah. All right. This is Table Talk, the bonus episode for Live from the Table,

the official podcast of the world-famous comedy. This is Dan Natterman, host of Table Talk, with my co-host of Table Talk, Perrielle Ashenbrand. Hello. And we are blessed to be joined by Noam Dorman, the co-host of Live from the Table, or the main host, or whatever you want to qualify him. Hello, Dan.

And Jason Salmon, who was our guest for Live from the Table, and he has a new special out. We'll plug it once again. Biscuits and Gravity coming out on YouTube. First of all, the bonus episode tends to focus more on comedy than the main episode and more focuses on personal stuff. Now, Periel and I did a show in Scarsdale on Saturday. Periel's producing a show. Periel's branching out, and she's producing a show at a restaurant in Scarsdale.

Is that correct, Perrielle? Yeah. It's like they have a little room off of a restaurant that they use for all sorts of things. And they asked me if I wanted to start. They actually want me to do two shows a month. But I started. I said, let's try one. It's a very small one. It's like 45 people. Yeah.

So it's hard to make any money. But you make a few bucks. And if you do two shows, you can make a few more bucks. Yeah. And I picked Dan up at the train station. How much cover charge

did you charge? 25 bucks. And what's interesting is that people, Scarsdale's very close to the city, but there's a lot of, there's a market for people

who just don't feel like coming to the city. Yeah. But they do want to see stand-up comedy. So as close as Scarsdale is, these people were happy to, I guess, have some place that's right around the corner.

There's people out there, they'll pay more than $25. Some of the clubs charge more than $25 now. That's okay. I'm not trying to be greedy about it. I just, it's nice to, it's convenient, and it's a really fun room, and there really is, like, a great demand for it. How did Dan do?

Oh, my God. He killed. He was so funny, and they just loved him. I'm not going to lie. If somebody said, who are the Scarsdale comics in the city, I'd be like, Dan Adler. Well, they tend to be upscale and Jewish, I think. I think it was Jewish, but there was also Italian people in the room.

But what's interesting, by sheer coincidence, no one was talking on the main show about how one fine day in the late 70s or early 80s, you weren't allowed to call Asians Orientals anymore. You had to call them Asians. Now, I have a joke. Me, me, me, me, me, me, me. But this is the bonus episode. We do a lot of me, me, me, me here. I have a joke from my book. My book, Iris Spiro Before COVID, available on Amazon. In my book, there's an Asian character

that does a joke about how white people love to adopt Asians and that she knew an Asian in school that was adopted by Jews. And he said, don't call me a chink. You're a cock-a-shmuck. Okay? It's an Asian character in the book saying that. Now, I felt that I couldn't say that. I wanted to figure out how I could adapt that joke to my act. But Felton, I think rightly so, that saying chink out of my mouth would be so harsh

that it would kill the joke. I think you gotta start out by saying, by the way, I'm doing an impersonation, just in your voice, go, I'm doing an impersonation of that Asian person right now. I found a better idea. Yeah, what did you do? I found a better idea. I changed the joke, and, you know, the joke is actually better this way anyway. I probably, if I had to rewrite the book, I would put it this way in the book.

I said, you know, a lot of white people adopt Asians. I knew a Korean guy named Jason Horowitz back in school, and he said to me, I'm Asian, not Oriental. You fuck off the schmuck. So I completely made it much more palatable. Now, since this is a person about comedy, obviously we talked a little bit about depression in the first hour. Yeah.

And Dan Doth protested too much. So, Dan, spill it. Well, I've had my issues, you know, but also I am also learned about it. Gary Goldman famously

had a special called The Great Depression where he discussed his battle and his use, I believe, of electroconvulsive therapy. But I know what it is to be depressed. Yes, I do. So it bothers you. You take umbrage when people talk about this stuff because they don't know what the fuck they're talking about.

Well, I don't know if I take umbrage. I take jealousy. Yeah, but when I was talking about, like, Bruce Briggs, he's upset about his life. He should, you know, he should buck up. You're like, you're as angry about that as I've ever seen you angry about anything. That really bothered you. I'm angry. The bubble overhead is like, Norm doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about.

And my anger is that I'm jealous. Insanely jealous of anybody that's that clueless about depression. God bless you. God bless you for being that clueless about it. Yeah, but you're not being quite fair to me because I immediately cordoned off

the idea that if he actually has a clinical disease, that's different. I'm saying that there are other people who just become enamored with themselves and solicitousness. I don't know about that. I don't know what you're saying is valid,

that there's people out there just saying, woe is me. You know, I mean, maybe. Have you been in therapy a lot? What do you think? I don't know. I assume. I don't know.

I have been. Anybody I talk to in comedy, by the way, I assume has been in therapy. Have you been in therapy? I haven't. No I talk to in comedy, by the way, I assume has been in therapy. Have you been in therapy? I haven't. Me neither. Well, it shows. Noam doesn't believe in it.

One of the things that I learned way back when trying to figure out, some youth pastor in our church didn't know anything about the Bible, so he's like, I'm going to teach these kids about temperaments and the melancholic temperament. Like there's four basic temperaments. One's phlegmatic, which is laid back, which is basically me. Melancholic, which is artistic, which is either sad or. Yeah, I think it was originally.

They had to change it from Jewy to melancholic. But yeah, no, where I was, Jewy was acceptable. But I call to melancholic. That's right. But, yeah, no, where I was, Dewey was acceptable. But I call it melancholic now when I recap. But then the sanguine is the very sort of social person, and then there's the choleric, which is the driven type A. And people who are melancholic tend to have these huge artistic capabilities, these huge drives to be artistic, but also on the flip side tend to be so, just go into these huge depressions because there's this chemical makeup of their

persona. I don't even know if it's chemical, to be honest with you. I don't know. Well, clinical depression is certainly chemical. Right, right. But I think there's some of it. Well, look, I mean, arguably everything is chemical. Yeah.

I mean, you could argue that it is all chemical. I mean, we're atoms and molecules. We're a chemistry set. But the interesting thing is I have, in every situation that I've analyzed using that thing, it always seems to make sense. Like, it fits one of those things. What type are you?

Sclerotic? Phlegmatic. What does that mean? That is the plus side is laid back. The downside is lazy. So that's me. That's my primary. Now, the only one I don't have is choleric.

I'm not driven. What do you think the best formula is? Not for artistic brilliance, but for success in show business. Driven is a huge part because you've got to market like crazy. Sanguine is probably pretty good. Which one's sanguine again? Sanguine is social. So glad-handing people and marketing and doing that,

especially in show business, being able to do that. And also it makes you more apt to want to perform, to have that. I could be very comfortable just writing stuff as opposed to performing for stretches of time where some people can't not perform. What if I offered you your career, whatever your biggest career goal is? I don't know. What is your biggest career goal is. I don't know what that would be. What is your biggest career goal? My biggest career goal would be to have my own sitcom. I'm going to offer you that. All right.

I'm going to offer you that. I'll take it. Well, those aren't all the terms. This is why I'm bad at negotiating. First of all, those I could have just said, but you're going to die in five years. I haven't finished the offer yet. Nor have you said something that's turned me off to it. I'm going to give you the career of your dreams.

You're going to be 15% objective to the extent that we can be objective, less funny, less respected by your peers. You know, I mean, to the extent that we can be objective about that, you're going to be less funny. Okay. Your peers are going to be less funny. Okay. Your peers are going to be like, oh, God, he's doing the Spirit Airlines joke again.

I mean... Which is, by the way, full disclosure, one of my jokes. Do you have a Spirit Airlines joke? I do. But I take the flip side. I talk about how much I like Spirit Airlines. Okay. Well, that's valid then. Okay.

Actually, I mentioned Spirit Airlines too in one of my jokes. I'm a huge fan of Spirit Airlines. It's not a Spirit Airlines joke, but I do mention some of it. Okay, okay. What's the other part of this? That's it. But you get the fame and the fortune. I zoned out for one second.

I came back here. I was talking about Spirit Airlines. You know what? Spirit's not so bad. I've used them to go to Las Vegas. And you play your cards right. It's not a bad experience. Spirit Airlines is the socialism of airlines.

You pay a little extra. You get a big seat up front. Yeah. But everybody knows exactly how much you pay. It's what it is. It's very much socialism airlines. Why does everybody know exactly how much you paid? Because it's... It's on the back of your seat.

No, no. It is... I mean, you know that these seats cost this much. These seats cost this much. These seats cost this much. You know that on a regular airline, too. No, on a regular airline, I could be sitting right next to somebody who paid way less.

It's also about when they booked it. On Spirit, it's not that. The seats are always that. Now, the base charge is when you book it. It could be really cheap. But Spirit, they've saved my life so many times with just little things things have happened.

Like one time I forgot I had been doing one way flights because that was cheaper for a stretch. And I forgot to book a flight back. And I realized that when I landed and it was just for doing doing a club for a weekend. And I found a spirit flight for a hundred bucks to get back to New York. And I was from Dallas. So, yeah, it sounds unsafe. It's sounds unsafe. It's not unsafe. It has a safety record.

Have you ever heard of a Spirit Airlines crash? The sample size is probably... It's a big fucking airline. They've got like a hundred fucking... I will tell you this. I've flown them a ton from Dallas, New York to Dallas and they have never screwed me over. Delta has. American has. United has. All of those have screwed me over. They're also not screwing us down.

Delta has. American has. United has. All of those have screwed me over. Spirit has not. Now, it is a no-frills airline. So it is. But it's like all I do on a plane is work anyway.

So I don't care to take a nap. So if my chair doesn't lean back, which they don't on Spirit. None of the chairs lean back? Right. Exactly. And that is if you want a chair that le, which they don't on Spirit. None of the chairs lean back? Right, exactly. And that is, if you want a chair that leans back, don't fly Spirit. It's a great-ass bus. But for me, it really is.

None of the chairs lean back. By the way, their fleet size is 194. This is a substantial operation that they're running. To be fair. Now, how big do you think the fleet size of American Airlines? Hold on to that. Why don't the chairs lean back? I don't know, but I will tell you I see the logic in it.

And because when you are in front of me leaning back your chair, I am subject to whatever happens. If I had my computer there, I almost had my computer, like, slammed down on when a guy, like, leaned the chair back in front of me. Just randomly. Like, we had been on the plane for two hours, and he just suddenly decided he was going to lean his chair back. But the tables, like, they stay straight, don't they?

No, they don't. No, those are, I mean, the chairs. 2023, we have engineering. No, we do have engineering. But that costs money, and that's not what the airlines want to spend. Everybody wants to spend the least amount of money to make the most amount of money. That's what everybody's doing. And the middle chair, the middle seat...

You sound like Kanye now. By the way... Well, you know, I will take that. I will take that. They have 194 planes on Spirit. JetBlue, how many would you guess JetBlue has? 326. 284, with 142 on order. So, smaller than JetBlue, but

a substantial operation. Solid operation. In any case, would you take the offer? I would. I have spent most of my time in comedy being funny and respected and unsuccessful. So, I will, yeah. I'm like, I feel like I've gotten a solid handle on what that's like. How disrespected would you be willing to go? Would you be willing to be a complete ass clown of the comedy community, but a very wealthy one?

Now that you've used the scientific jargon of ass clown, that brings it to a whole other level. I mean, there's a point at which I would say no. I mean, I don't like doing stuff that I feel like. So it would bother me viscerally some, but... Do you make most of your money off acting now or off stand-up? Or it's about half and half? Until

the pandemic hit, I made most of it on acting. Stand-up is probably probably 60% of it now. Would you prefer, what kind of mix would be your ideal mix? I mean, acting, you don't have to do as much work

to make way more money. It depends. Unless you're at the level where you're doing arenas. But if I'm doing arenas, I also don't want to, I'd love to do an arena, but I talk to, I mean, being at the Cellar, you talk to so many comics who've done arenas. And they're like, do theaters. They're like, arenas are great for the money. Theaters are like the best stand-up experience.

Yes, I think so. The pinnacle of the stand-up. I think so. But if you want to make a quick million dollars, you go to an arena. Oh, yeah, absolutely. No, if it were all about making a quick million dollars, of course I'd do an arena. But, yeah, I mean, I think. Acting doesn't necessarily make a lot of money.

If you do day roles. I'll tell you. A day role at scale for $1,000 a day or maybe $2,000 a day. Right. Well, I will tell you, acting on TV shows hasn't made me nearly as much money. I mean, it's still making me money. I got a check from 30 Rock the other day, which is, that's been off the air for a decade, right? I don't know.

But acting in commercials, there was a stretch of time where I was the spokesperson for Napa Auto Parts, and I was getting checks every two weeks like I worked at an office job. And they were insane. They're just like, Just money just rolling in. You know? And that was nice. Yeah, I never had that. It was nice to have the regularity of that. That would be real nice. Be real nice to be

Lily from AT&T or Flo from Progressive. Oh, yeah. But do you think Flo from Progressive, at a certain point in commercial acting, I think your stand-up might... I don't know if it would suffer.

I guess if you're a funny stand-up, they can't take it away from you, but they might so associate you with that character. You know what's funny is stand-up is one of the few things where you can escape that. You really can. I mean, I will say... Is there an example of somebody who's escaped that? I'm trying to think. I don't know.

Ray Romano? He was never a big commercial. I would say. Was that show Wild? No, I mean, I'm talking about like a spokesperson for like your flow from Progressive. Or your Where's the Beef? Or your Joe Isuzu? Or you're the most interesting man in the world from Dos Equis.

Right, right, right. And you become so associated with that character that you... I'm trying to think of how many of those characters were comedians. Most of them weren't. What about Mr. Whipple? Mr. Whipple was a good one. Mr. Whipple?

Please don't squeeze the Charmin. Oh, okay. I was thinking Donuts. No, the time to make the Donut guy. You're thinking about the Breakstone Cottage Cheese guy, but he was also the Donuts yeah. No, the time to make the donut guy. You're thinking about the Sam, the Breakstone Cottage Cheese guy, but he was also the donuts guy. Oh, was he?

All right. The same act. Sam Breakstone, right? The commercial for the Breakstone Cottage Cheese was the same guy that made the donuts, I believe. Yeah. I mean, the greatest thing would be to have an anonymous commercial career,

but constant. Well, voiceovers. Voiceovers. I mean, McSpadden. Yeah. Well, we had him on a couple of weeks ago, but his voiceover career is not what it used to be. No, no, that's...

Because nobody's there. Yeah. How about that fast-talking guy? Oh, that's going back a long time. That's amazing. Can we talk about Richard Lewis? Yes, that's good that you brought that up. He has depression, right?

Probably, but more importantly and more sadly, he's announced on Twitter that he is retiring from stand-up because he has Parkinson's disease. I'm terrible. He seems in good spirits in the video that he made. He said, I got it late in life. You know, he's 75. I mean, you don't live forever.

I mean, 75. Well, the good thing about Parkinson's, too, is if you get, and you can extend, like the first part of Parkinson's is where you're starting to get the symptoms, but you don't get into the shaking part. But you can extend that part conceivably to the end of your life. Right. Especially when you get it late in life. It's very slow progressing. So, you know, he could certainly live till 90.

I love him. I mean, nobody lives forever. Although, you know, sad as it is to think about. Yeah. You know. He said he's been doing stand-up for 50 years. Yeah, well, yeah, I guess 50 since he was in his mid-20s. And he said he's very excited because the next season of Curb Your Enthusiasm is coming out.

He seems like he's still working. Yeah, just not doing stand-up. Yeah. I gotta go. Where are you going? I'm meeting a friend after this. Look, have we successfully depressed you? Snap out of it! I hope suicide doesn't kill me.

Well, snap out of it. Just buck up. Suicide is predatory now. Do you have anything more to add about Richard? No, I just wanted to acknowledge it just because I love him a lot. I will say this, too, and I usually don't agree with Noam, but there is one thing. If you have been close to somebody who has died by suicide. And, by the way, Noam has.

Right. He has. Yeah, a very close friend died by suicide. Yes. And I also have some people who are extremely close to me who also died by suicide. Phrasing it that way doesn't make— Did we discuss that in the bonus episode for people who didn't listen to the main episode? There was a person who wrote an article that's saying saying committed suicide.

We should change it to died by suicide because it makes it sound like the person was more of a passive victim of mental illness rather than doing something. Committing a crime or doing something selfish anyway. And for more empathy for the victim. But it doesn't take away the horror of it. Right. Like, you know, I have somebody very close to me who shot themselves in the head and somebody else who hung themselves. Was shot themselves or was shot by suicide? I don't know. I'm being flippant.

It's ridiculous. The whole thing is ridiculous. And your friend, I think, jumped off a bridge. Is that right? That's correct. Depression knocked him off. I know I'm being flippant, but...

I'm sort of being flippant. I'm making a point. But he's being flippant about his own story. You can take this logic to almost every sentence. No, but I'm actually agreeing with you right now that it doesn't change how fucking horrible it is. And it may or may not change people's perceptions. But it might start a dialogue and it might change people's perceptions.

Well, the difficulty is words are the easiest things for people to latch on to is the problem because that's the one thing we can all see and go, well, what if we just change this word? But that doesn't generally. People are real good at claiming the surface. It's a horrible way to die. However you phrase it doesn't take away how horrible it is. A better understanding of mental illness, and this applies more than just to suicide,

because suicide is a small subset of the people who are dealing with mental illness and the ultimate bad outcome of it. But there's a tremendous number of people who are dealing with mental illness, and it's good that we talk about it. It's good that we know about it. It sounds very progressive of you. I never said anything to the contrary. It's just this obsession with

sentence construction I think is asinine. I don't know if it's an obsession. Don't be corrected. I'm talking about my friend committed suicide. If somebody corrects you and takes that tone, I would disagree with them.

So I'm on your side. On the other hand, it's food for thought in terms of how we want to phrase it i'm the one who corrected you and i don't think i said it like that that's the way i hear it when you talk okay um anyway um we discussed uh are we are we have we done a half hour yet um Anyway We discussed Have we done a half hour yet? No, we've got a few more minutes Well, well Noam has to go

Noam, we thank you for sticking around Noam's been sticking around lately on the bonus episode He's sticking around Bye Jason, you are aware We discuss this every week That Noam bought the McDonald's on 6th Avenue. I am aware of that, yes.

I've heard tell. Do you do the Vegas Comedy Cellar? I have not. I have not done the Vegas one. Now, Noam's not here, so you can be truthful. Why don't you do the Vegas? It's a long, long week, and the hotel is so-so. No, it's not that specifically.

With all the stuff with the special, I've been traveling as it was. So it's one of those things where I just have to put in... Would you do the Vegas room? Yeah, I would do it. Look, I'm not at the point where I wouldn't do a lot of rooms. Are you excited about it?

I would do it once. I feel like we have not... We discussed it on the main episode. This is the bonus episode. Now, as far as Vegas is concerned, look, it's a long week. I mean, I feel like we have not. We discussed it on the main episode. This is the bonus episode. Okay. Now, as far as Vegas is concerned, look, it's a long week. I'm not going to lie to you. Yeah.

And those walls close in. Yeah. And let me tell you something. You're not even on the strip. Yeah. So you're like at the Rio Hotel, which is off the strip. A little. If you're not there with people that you know.

Yeah. Or the people that you know happen to be in town that week in vegas it can be difficult here's the thing with my temperament so not everybody it's not for everybody you'd make more money headlining say thursday friday saturday at the laugh factory in vegas yeah you know what i'm saying yeah no i mean my thing with my temperament i can get you're not going to tell me that isolation and walls closing in is going to bother me. That's not going to bother me. I have that thing. My parents

couldn't put me in time out as punished. You loved it. Oh, they would come. They're like, you're done. And I'm like, I'm not yet. You're like Brooks from Shawshank Redemption. You didn't want to leave. I'm like, I got some stuff I'm taking care of. I'll be with you guys in a little bit. You're an institution man now.

Some people can be alone in a hotel room all day long. But you don't have to be alone. This is what I'm trying to tell you. You don't have to be alone in the hotel room all day. Hookers ain't cheap, you know. Well, but sometimes you invest in a good time. So what were you suggesting in lieu of being alone in a hotel room? Well, hookers is one

suggestion. Nothing wrong with that. Sex workers, excuse me. Unless you're willing to spend a lot more money than you're even making out there. And then there's plenty of stuff to do there. Like you can go into... Yeah, but if you're not with somebody,

you'll be doing it by yourself. How many days are you going for? You go seven when you go with somebody, you'll be doing it by yourself. How many days are you going for? Is there like four days? You go seven when you go. Seven? You go seven? Seven. Okay.

You go a full seven. So it's not for everybody. A lot of people won't do it because for the same money, they could just headline three nights. Right. Now, a guy like me who doesn't like to headline because I get stressed out. Do you? Yeah. I'd rather do commercials.

Yeah. I'm quite frankly jealous of your commercial career. Thank you. I get stressed and nervous when I headline, and so doing 20-minute sets in Vegas, for me, even though it's longer, is more appealing. Yeah. It sounds like it's six of one, half a dozen of the other because

you don't love going for a week. You don't even really like it. Is the stress of headlining a little bit... It's worse. I don't like doing two shows a night. I really don't like it. Why don't you like it? I just don't like it.

I get panicky. Maybe if you delved into that a little bit, you get i get panicky okay you get okay but if you maybe if you delved into that a little bit you do that maybe we could you know one one could yeah one could i don't like it it makes me panicky and then to shut it down isn't going to help deconstruct it well and perhaps but i've been able to do other things i've been able to have a career doing one nighters at country clubs and corporates and so on. So I've been, that also stresses you out.

We are less so much less so, but, uh, had, uh, and had that not been available to me, I don't know. Maybe I'd be out of the business.

It's weird. I, I have the opposite feel. I get, I get more stressed out when it's a one nighter because you have to figure out your audience and, and perform all in one shot and like i i find that over the weekend i get warmed up to the whole process a little more so in the last

night of the weekend is usually one of my favorite nights i i agree with you i just it was the first time i ever did that because i'm you know much more uh new than you gentlemen are but I for the first time did four or five shows I just opening for Modi and I totally vibed on that that it's like you know you first figure out the room and then you have like four more shows or five more shows to like actually like get into the groove. I'm curious. I'm not asking just to ask why you don't like doing two shows because to me, it's... Because I don't like doing a show where in my mind,

I've got another show coming up. I want to do a show knowing that this is it. And what if you do really well on the first show, which you... Then I'll feel better, but I've got to get through that show

with in my head, I'm thinking about the next show. So you have a hard time separating the first show, which you, you know, then then I'll feel better. But I got to get through that show within my head. I'm thinking about the next show. So you have a hard time separating the next show. Yes, I have a hard time separating the next show. Interesting. And what if they're like Friday, Saturday, Sunday? Same thing. If it's one, one, one.

But yeah, well, then it's it's it's doable. But why? You're still thinking about the next show. Because for some reason, when it's the next day, I can. You wipe the slate clean. I can shut it's the next day i can you wipe the slate i can shut it off well i mean the good thing about sleep is it literally is sort of etch-a-sketching you a little bit it's sort of saying okay we're going to organize all these things we're going to clean up this mess that you've made in your head over the course of the

day and we're going to clean it up we're going to put and you're going to wake up in the morning you go yeah everything's so fresh. That's interesting. Thursday, Friday, Saturday. I've done it. We've done it all. But there came a point where I was just like, I don't want to do this anymore. Ultimately, I think that some level,

I mean, you have to do stuff periodically that's not your favorite things to do. But, I mean, for the most part, if you can maneuver where you're making your life. Although that Napa spokesman gig sounds very, very good. Although I had to do the things. I had to sing. I had to do all sorts of stuff. I had to fake play guitar.

I had to do all sorts of wild, crazy stuff. But it was good. But, you know, that's the whole thing. Anyway, your special, once again, Biscuits and Gravity. Yes. Available on... April 27th. On YouTube.

It's dropping. That's a word. Yes, dropping. Dropping is the word that we use now because words do evolve, as we've discussed. Thank you, Jason, for being with us, not just on the main podcast, but on the bonus episode. Thank you, Periel. Enjoyed it. Thank you, everybody. Thank you. Bye, not just on the main podcast, but on the bonus episode. Thank you, Perrielle. Enjoyed it. Thank you, everybody.

Thank you. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. All right.