The Comedy Cellar: Live from the Table - Erica Komisar, Josh Johnson and Kevin Brennan

Episode Date: September 6, 2019

Erica Komisar, Josh Johnson and Kevin Brennan

You're listening to The Comedy Cellar, live from the table on the Riotcast Network, riotcast.com. Good evening, everybody. Welcome to the Comedy Cellar Show here on Sirius XM Channel 99. I'm here, as always, with our producer, Periel Aschenbrun. Periel Aschenbrand. One day soon, we'll get that. Aschenbrand. Not always. She wasn't here last week.

No, I sometimes forget to announce her. And, of course, my partner, Mr. Dan Natterman. Hello, Daniel. How do you do? And we have sitting in with us, just impromptu, Josh Johnson, one of our favorite comedians. Hey, how's it going? And our absolute guest of honor, Erica Komisar, is a psychoanalyst, parent, guidance expert, and author of the award-winning book, Being There, Why Prioritizing Motherhood in the

First Three Years Matters. She has been in a private practice in Manhattan for over 30 years, and she's currently working on a book about the challenges of raising adolescents in an age of anxiety. Welcome, Erica. Thank you, Noam. Now, full disclosure, Erica and I met on the podcast like a year and something ago, but then we kind of become friends, so I can't be as difficult and contrary and as interrogative as I would normally be.

You're allowed. I would think the opposite is the case. Usually when we're comfortable with someone, it's at that moment that we can start really challenging them. Certainly I am not shy about telling Noam he's full of shit when that's appropriate. I also feel like you can't help yourself.

No, I can help myself, actually. So, listen, this is the thing. It's the beginning of school. Now, Erica does not only deal in issues regarding children, but that's a specialty. So, today, I'm having terrible anxiety because my daughter, I think she might have ADD. Whatever it is, she's not like a fish in water when it comes to academics.

She was stumped today for like an hour on the homework assignment that just said, what are two things you hope to get better at this year in the third grade? Why are you laughing, Josh? That's how it just started.

You know what? I'm sorry. It's just you're describing me. So I'm just like, oh man, this is exactly what. And I vacillate from being a little bit hard on her, which she doesn't react that badly to, to feeling terrible guilt that I don't want to demand from her something more than she can do.

On the other hand, having some intuition about that she can do more than she's doing. And also knowing in a certain way, it's also about me that I'm getting mad, meaning like I, I want her to do better for me than necessarily for her. So you must, you must deal with things like this. Just if I could just preface this by saying

that ADD, if that's the worst thing that ever happens to this child, you should count your lucky stars. My God, I know parents with kids, they're non-verbal autistic. Whether

it be a drug, they got drug problems, eating disorders, just plain stupid. Their kids grow up to be a drug, they got drug problems, eating disorders, just plain stupid. Their kids grow up to be a comedian trying to make a living standing up comedy. All sorts of things. Your child has perhaps ADD.

She's also really pretty, right? She's really pretty. She's exceptionally good looking. Listen, if I had to trade places with your parents, I would not. I'm going to say that ADHD and ADD is overdiagnosed. And basically, ADD or ADHD is a sign of stress.

It's a symptom of stress. And the reality is that the schools expect much too much, particularly public schools, interestingly enough. Private schools expect less at a young age, but public schools are very tough. And they expect a lot of the kids at a very early age and sometimes too much. And there's a real push to push cognitive skills early and to push academic advancement really early. A lot of kids are learning Chinese these days, too. Well, that's the problem. Ni hao ma.

Yeah, and the problem is that the kids are stressed, and stress causes symptoms that look like ADD. So, you know, before you do... Are you involved in diagnosing ADD or ADHD? So she would need what's called a neuropsych evaluation. But what are the symptoms, especially for girls? I would not jump to the conclusion. First of all, it's unusual for girls to have ADD.

What I'm hearing is that she is stressed about school and that they're asking something of her that's making her fearful and anxious and anxiety. I'm going to say some learning issues can produce symptoms like ADD. I'm really careful not to diagnose ADD. So I don't see any stress in her whatsoever. It's part of the reason that I get so mad. I'm like, why did... I don't really care.

She doesn't seem to care. Now, let me not bash my daughter. She's a very good reader. Right. One of the best. Which is a huge thing to just pocket and not acknowledge because so many children who have trouble reading, and this is a lifelong curse.

So she doesn't have that. She's a terrible speller, but I continue to be a terrible speller. She doesn't do well in math, doesn't come easily to her, and that bothers me because it did come easily to me but the the thing that bothers me most is that i just can't get her to sit down and just do her work work that i know she can do how old is she now seven so seven year olds are supposed to be playing more than they're supposed to be oh schoolwork. Oh, we don't let her play. Right. That's the problem. I'm going to say that for the most part, she's trying to tell you what she

needs. And the school is fighting what she innately needs, which is she needs more play and less schoolwork. And the school is saying, listen, at seven years old in our day, you didn't even get homework yet. You're not supposed to get homework. You're not supposed to. In third grade? You know, I'm pretty sure we got homework in third grade.

I remember those times tables don't learn themselves. No. Our homework was coloring in the lines. No, we definitely had, I remember, third grade, long division. No, not long division, third grade. Oh, well, maybe not you, but I had long division, times tables. You must have been in the advanced math class. No, everybody had it.

Eric, isn't it true that a bunch of studies came out recently saying that homework really doesn't have the effects that they thought that it had? Actually, the best teachers in public schools that I've worked with are ones who don't give homework. Leave her alone. She's fine. She needs to play more. And I'm guessing that...

I'm sending her more bows. She plays all fucking day. Well, let her play more. She's seven. That's what she's supposed to be doing. That's what she's supposed to be doing. And if she reads, you're already ahead of the curve. And, you know, the reality is some people relate more to letters and some people relate more to numbers. And it sounds like you relate to numbers,

and it's really hard not to impose on our kids who we are or the mistakes we made or the pain that we had. Can't you just be a real estate agent, worst-case scenario? Yeah, sure you could. What you're saying is something that you are touching on something, and I said it, but I really do understand it, especially being Jewish, I guess. It's such a build-up of how important this is

that I reacting from that and I don't want to react from that so like I had you know what the word nachis means? no no not at all nachis is like

is like a delicious feeling of pride joy not joy pride being proud of your children yeah so we had a barbecue

at my house the other day, and Dan was there, and I asked my kindergartner, I said, what's six plus six? He said, 12. And then I asked him, I never asked him before, I said, what's seven plus seven? And he said to me, well, that would be two more, so 13, 14. He knew that I added one to six and one to the other six. That was two. He added... I mean, I've been riding that high for a week.

Honestly. This was every Jewish dad's dream, you know? And I'm like, well, that doesn't make him a better person. I can't help it. Can I just say, though? I think that there's a silver lining in this that your daughter seems to be bad at the things that you're good at.

So you can actually be around to teach her those things and help her those things. As opposed to like your daughter actually being bad at things you were bad at. Because now there's like this offset that I think is a chance to connect on a thing. As opposed to like, For instance, when I would bring math, because I wasn't good at math and my dad wasn't good at math, and I would bring math to my dad, he would panic.

You weren't good at math? I was not good at math. That makes me feel better. Here's the thing. I wasn't good at math. Words were my thing. Reading is so... Just because of the structure of school, reading is on your own. To me, I'm not an expert or anything,

but it's so much more important than any, like if your pastime as a kid is reading anything, then you are miles ahead because there's also. Well, you said she can read. It doesn't say she enjoys reading. Well, it's not about that. But she, like this summer, I had her reading a little bit every day,

and she read, I don't know, 700, 800 pages over the course of the summer of books from beginning to end. Yeah, yeah. So I should count my blessings. Who gives a shit about math anyway? Why do they give... You know, you were talking about homework.

Homework is we can make arguments whether it's a good thing or a bad thing. Summer reading lists are an outrage. I used to remember. Did you ever get those? Yeah, that's true. How dare they give kids shit to read during the summer? What were you going to say, Erica?

When they should be playing. Well, forget about playing. I mean, I'm talking about high school kids. Yeah. That's outrageous. Get your fucking hands out of my summer. Dan, let Erica say what she was going to say. You know, I'm going to say that math is important, but the truth is she might just relate to letters more.

She might be a writer. She might be a therapist. She might be an artist. Oh, my God. But she also tunes out a little bit. One thing I'm going to say is that we put a lot of pressure on kids, and we also put a lot of blame on kids. And what I'm going to say is it's not about blame,

but really if she's not learning or enjoying math, you have to look at the teacher and see how that teacher might be teaching math. It's first day of school. Yeah, so there are creative ways of teaching math. And then you have to say, right, is that teacher really very creative and playful? A 7-year-old wants to play, and if you can't teach them through play, which is experiential, you're not going to get through to that seven-year-old. Maybe there's an unusual kindergartner like your son who likes doing his, you know, times tables or his addition.

Maybe he's an outlier. But, you know, the reality is kids need play to learn. They need the experience of play to learn. So the pressure might be on that teacher to be a better teacher to teach that child math. So I did have one nice moment, and then we'll get on to other things. So I was hard on her today, maybe more than I'd ever been before. Not because she wasn't getting it right, because she wasn't speaking to me nicely, and she was being just very oppositional.

And I was pretty hard on her and I felt bad. So we went through this and I raised my voice to her and then I said, okay, I have to go to work. And she's like crying. She said, Daddy, don't go to work. And I'm going to cry myself. I said, as hard as I was on you just now,

you don't want me to go to work? Dog home syndrome. No. I said, as hard as I was on you just now, you don't want me to go to work? Dog home syndrome. No. I said, as hard as I was on you, you don't want me to go? She said, no, I don't want you to go to work. And then I felt a certain vindication that I'd created a very good relationship with her thus far, that she took this hardness in stride rather than withdrawing from me because of it. So that made me happy. Also, where can kids bring their aggression if they can't bring it to their parents?

So where can she bring, if she's stressed out because she just started school, and you're saying she doesn't show it, but clearly she's stressed out. So if she's stressed out because she just started school, where can she bring her bad mood and her aggression and her anger and her fear except to you? So what she did is she brought it to you. And, you know, her vulnerability after just proved that she was really just feeling vulnerable. And sometimes as human beings, we get aggressive when we're vulnerable, when we're frightened or overwhelmed, we get aggressive. It's a defensive response. like oh she just might also

be annoyed because uh i mean school interrupted her summer that summer could last forever and then school came out of nowhere being all boring you know and then even you to your point about the teacher it's like this teacher is i don't know how big the child school is but like the teacher has to teach so many kids and they've come up with in their mind the most baseline in their way, maybe fun way to get across the message and everything. So then they're also probably being a bummer. The best case, one could say that she's she's not stimulated because the work is too easy for her. Now, I suppose that's like saying a woman is is afraid because she's so in love with you and she's pushing you away for that reason. I mean, it's an excuse, but every now and again it's valid.

Anyway, so let's get on to this. Erica wrote a column in the Wall Street Journal taking presidential Democratic leading contender Joe Biden to task for actually the opposite. He was saying he was right, but for not sticking up, standing by his guns for previous opinions about daycare. So you want to tell us about that? Yeah, so basically, Kirsten Gillibrand attacked Joe Biden in the debates,

and about a 1981 piece that he wrote about why government-subsidized universal daycare for all shouldn't be universally subsidized by the government and why it would contribute to the decline of the family. And basically, he was cornered by her because all these candidates are now proposing universal government-sponsored daycare. And I, as you know, know, I'm really disagree with universal daycare. And daycare is very problematic as a form of childcare in terms of, you know, what it does to children's emotional well-being and mental health. So because they're stripped too young from there. Yeah. Yeah. Basically, in the first three years, 85% of your right brain or social emotional brain is growing. And it's very dependent on the environment, meaning it's dependent on the attachment to your primary

caretaker, your mother. Usually, it's usually your mother. Sometimes now it's your father. But whoever is your primary caretaker is necessary to buffer you from stress from moment to moment, to regulate your emotions from moment to moment, but basically to provide you with a sense of emotional security. So when you put a child in daycare, and we're putting children in daycare as early as six weeks, we're basically stripping away that stress buffering. We're exposing them and their brains to stress too early in the separation from the... So just think of a neonate's brain as being incredibly fragile and neurologically fragile. And we need the environment to be secure, to be emotionally and physically present for us,

to protect us from stress. And we're exposing these kids to too much stress and now it's having an impact on their mental health at a very young age. So what made me think one of the, you know, when they find that children do better from breastfeeding, one of the arguments you always hear is that, well, that's not because of the actual milk, it's because of the experience of breastfeeding. It's because of the attachment. So this is actually the ultra opposite of that. You don't even have the breast. You have nothing. You're in daycare. Yeah. And imagine that the average ratio, so what's recommended for children under the age of one is a one-to-one caretaker to child ratio. Okay. So you put a child in a daycare and you have no less than five

to one, usually eight to one. In some countries, it's 12 to one. That means there's one caretaker, one daycare worker that's caring for up to eight children under the age of one. But is that what Biden's proposing? Or not Biden, but under the age of one. Is that what Biden's proposing? That's what Gillibrand's. Under the age of one? Oh, all of them. Yeah, Gillibrand, you know, they're all, Elizabeth Warren is really big on universal daycare. But that doesn't mean it's mandatory. That just means if you absolutely need daycare, it will be available to you.

The problem is that if they put money into universal daycare, they're not putting money into things like paid maternity leave, which allows mothers and fathers to stay home longer with their children. And things like giving the money to families to spend as they would like. If you want to provide families with money for care of their child, let them give that money to their grandmother or their aunt or an extended family member. I'm for that. Yeah. So the idea is when you put monies into universal daycare, you're taking money away from the family and taking the choice away from the family of how best to care for that child.

We used to pay my mother-in-law. Right. But then she asked for a raise, so that was that. But no. So I defend Joe Biden, actually. Well, but what about the idea that just giving people money, they may not spend it wisely? At least this way we know that they're spending it on daycare. Or that they're spending it, at least this way we know they're spending it unwisely.

Well, not unwisely compared to the alternative, which is no daycare at all with parents that simply don't have time to necessarily spend on daycare. Joe Biden wasn't saying no daycare. He was saying daycare for all with parents that simply don't have time to necessarily spend with their kids. Joe Biden wasn't saying no daycare. He was saying daycare for the poorest people. But he was saying that if we institute universal daycare for all, even middle class and upper middle class people, and we're basically providing them a daycare, we're actually discouraging the connection between mothers and babies. And I agree with him. So can I zoom out? And you may have something to say about this too.

So it seems to me, I don't want to get in trouble, that we're suffering as a society because we don't want to push back in any way on certain politically incorrect ideas. One politically incorrect idea is that it's better for the mother to be home with the child when the child is young. We would like to think every mother should be totally unencumbered,

and she wants to drop a baby and then go out to work and have a career, that it's sexist to say that, well, you know, God was not fair about these things. Similarly— Well, I don't think Eric has said that. Eric just wants somebody at home. Right, but generally it is the mother. So similarly, we're not allowed to comment any longer about the fact that fatherless homes are a really bad thing. One in four families don't have a father in America.

So you have things like school shootings, the rise of white supremacy, violence, I mean, I'm pointing at him, I can't help it, like 60% of black children grow up without fathers. Also incels are like a bit of the whole father not being in the home,

not having a male to sort of guide you through your puberty. So there's all these things. I mean, certainly what's going on in Chicago with all this. We know that there's a lot of kids there that are involved in this who don't have fathers at home. We know this, but we're not allowed to say, listen, stop having, we need fathers.

And, you know, don't indulge yourself and it's wrong. So what is that? What's your comment? Well, interestingly, it's, I don't want to interrupt you, but it's interesting that we can talk more about the father issue. The father issue is actually quite hot right now. And it should be because, as I said, one in four families don't have fathers. And fathers do a really important thing for children, particularly little boys. They regulate little boys aggression. So we see a lot of violence.

We see a lot of behavioral problems, particularly in little boys, a lot of early signs of aggression. And the first thing I do as a clinician when I'm treating a family is I ask, is there a father present? And is the father who is in the family, is he present enough for that child? Can a woman take on that role? I'm speaking, of course, of lesbian marriages. Why are you speaking of lesbian marriages? Lesbian marriages. And if there's a son, can a woman take on the role that you just described,

i.e. channeling the youngster's aggression? I'm so sorry. Is it possible? Can I answer the thing just before you? Because I have to run. Go ahead. Basically, I do think that as unpopular as it is, that you have to address every once

in a while in certain cases that nature isn't a feminist. Nature is just, it is what it is and we can fight if we want and maybe we can come up with better solutions there's irrigation for farmer yeah i mean like sometimes you can displace things and we actually end up better off for it but i think that this is one of those instances where i'm glad that there's as much of a conservative presence in america as there is a liberal because sometimes liberal can go so far and left unchecked, people are starting to say like crazy things.

And then there's also that side of conservatism that goes so far that no one is checking in on like, hey, is anyone worried how anyone feels? And I do think that this is one instance where I would love to see more people think that dads are important because it's also it bleeds a little bit into the abortion debate sometimes where it's like it's my body, my choice, which I completely understand and agree with. But it's also treated as if if I want to keep this baby, you need to step up and take care of your responsibility and, you know, and like be there for me and for the baby. Also, if I decide not to keep the baby, there's the door. And it's a it's a hard thing as a human being to be left in that limbo of either I am essential or I don't matter at all. And I think that some people are just opting to like, well, if you don't think that I matter in any case, then I'll just decide not to matter. Because it's also easier. You're talking about young people who are like getting pregnant by accident and everything.

And then they just sort of move on, you know. So it's not as if all of these unpresent fathers are dead, you know. A lot of them are around and a lot of them, it would surprise you who they are. Like I have a friend who is with his girlfriend now that he got pregnant and everything. They're going to stick it out for the child and everything, but he actually had gotten another woman pregnant in the past and they were just hooking up. And then she

met someone that she really cared about and she was like, hey, I need you to back off. I want this guy to be like the father of the child and everything. So he did. I would have never known that story had he not told me because people sort of carry those weights and don't really say anything about it. Actually, a lot of fathers are not incentivized to father.

Now he's just going to drop that bomb and run. Just got a quick spot. Josh Johnson has to do a spot. But I would like you to get back. Well, but you never answered my question about the lesbian. Well, let her respond immediately to you. Well, so to answer your question, mothers and fathers are different. And no one knows I feel this way, and it's in my book,

because biology is different. The difference in terms of the nurturing hormones in men and women that affect men and women's behavior means that there's a difference. So now that doesn't mean that a mother can't learn to regulate a child's aggression or a father can't be a sensitive empathic nurturer. But first we have to recognize there is a difference. And the difference is that there's a hormone called oxytocin, and oxytocin impacts nurturing. It is the nurturing hormone. It's produced in women when they give birth, when they breastfeed,

and when they nurture. And when they nurture, it makes them what we call sensitive empathic nurturers, meaning it makes them tune into a baby's pain and distress. Whereas when fathers nurture, it's produced in them too. It comes from a different part of the brain and it has a different impact on their behavior. Instead of making them sensitive empathic nurtures, it makes them playful and tactile and stimulatory in terms of play, throwing the baby up in the air, tickling the baby, encouraging exploration and resilience. So it actually has

a different impact on their behavior than it does on women's behavior. So, but does that mean that a father can't learn to be a sensitive empathic nurturer, which helps to grow the right or social emotional part of the brain? He can, but let's admit that there's a difference. So we're really big in our society on genericizing, making there's no difference between like gender neutral. And the truth is that we can be equal men and women, but we can also be different. And the differences are amazing in terms of raising children. Fathers are critical to children in a different way than mothers are critical, but they're both critical. So then we say, you know, if you don't have a father, someone's got to step up to that role. If you don't have a father, someone's got to step up to that role.

If you don't have a mother, someone's got to step up to that role. We need fathers and mothers. Is there even a better system? Maybe we could have a father, a mother, and another mother. Or like all these different combinations. What's the ultimate best combination? The more love you have in life, the better. But it's really critical that you have a primary caregiver.

And that's usually, as Noam said, is the mother. It's not always. But you have to have, that's your go-to person for emotional security. And there's a very famous psychoanalyst named Margaret Mahler who said, you need someone to emotionally refuel from. You need to be able to go back to that person and emotionally refuel. And that's how you go back out into the world and explore. You're to be able to go back to that person and emotionally refuel, and that's how you go back out into the world and explore. You're always touching base with that person.

Now, I have to say, in my home, I'm pretty sure my wife would agree with this. I'm the more nurturing parent. I think she would agree with that without being- Well, Noam calls his kids, and I've witnessed this. By the way, we're joined here by Steve Fabricant. Because I want to talk about birth order, too. Sometimes known as Outside Steve. How are you doing, guys? And he's a dear friend of ours and also works here at the Olive Tree. Birth order.

Well, I just wanted to quickly say that Noam calls his son sweetheart. Uh-huh. Don't blow my spot. I know Noam is nurturing. I did not grow up with a male that calls his son sweetheart. Really? No, and I don't think, it sounds to me unusual. Or sweetie, not sweetie.

I have a joke about how we just assume that every family is like our family. And then I go on to talk about how I was at my friend's house for Thanksgiving, and I said to him, hey, these potatoes are undercooked. Your mother's in for a beating later. That's an old joke that I debuted on Conan 20 years ago. But the point is, am I wrong or is it weird to call your son as a father's sweetheart? There's nothing wrong with it. I didn't say there was anything wrong with it. It's not weird.

Is it weird? No, it's not weird. I'd say it's unusual whether there's something wrong with it in a separate question. No, no, it's more about you than it is about me. Why do you think it's weird? I don't. Weird only in the'd say it's unusual. Whether there's something wrong with it is a separate question. No, no, it's more about you than it is about me. Why do you think it's weird? I don't... Weird only in the sense that it's unusual. It may be perfectly healthy, but you've got to admit, it's probably unusual.

Weird and unusual are not synonyms. I don't think so. Is Noam an unusually sensitive and loving father? I mean, I think that the one good thing that's come out of all of this questioning gender and sexuality is that there it's on a spectrum. So we know that men can be more feminine and sensitive and we know, and that's a good thing. And we know that women can be more masculine and express aggression and be out there. And so, you know, it's on a spectrum, but I would say the one good thing that's come out

of it is that fathers are more deeply connected to children and more affectionate with children and more sensitive to children's emotions. So that's been a good thing. That's been a good change. So do you remember the opening scene of the movie Lincoln, the Spielberg movie? I vaguely remember it, but isn't it with Lincoln lying down with his son, hugging his son? So apparently Lincoln was a very... He was also, I think, the more affectionate. I can't...

Yeah, very affectionate father. Don't call me, but the more affectionate of the two. In the 1850s. Yeah. So it's not exactly... It's not totally new, Dan. The truth is that... There is some speculation, of course, that Lincoln was homosexual.

All right, Dan. It's true. There is speculation. But in any case... Do you want to talk about birth order? Do you have opinions about birth order? In terms of? Okay, Steve is the youngest.

See, I'm friends with everybody in his family. The middle child in his family was my college roommate. The older child is a judge who I'm friends with, and the youngest child is here. First of all, when you said birth order, I thought you meant the privilege of having children, like in China. Nothing.

Well, so, and the middle child, his brother Don, insists that everything about him is dictated by the fact that he is a neurotic middle child, and that Steve's kind of carefree way of going through life is because he was the spoiled young boy. I think there's some truth to birth order and characteristics, meaning the oldest child often is a responsible child and feels parentified,

and the youngest child is often babied and given more privileges, and the middle child suffers the most if you have three, and sometimes if you have four, there are two middle children. I think middle children have the hardest time. One thing. What about only children? Well, only children have advantages and disadvantages. I would say the advantage is you get all that attention

and you have your parents in a very unique way. The disadvantage is that having siblings is the greatest fall from grace. It's a really important thing because it helps you learn things like conflict resolution, which is probably the biggest thing that you learn from siblings. It helps you to get on with other people and to learn that you can be in conflict and get through it and still love the person. So, you know, there are advantages and disadvantages to being an only child. Well, one thing I see with Noam is, I don't want to say dictatorial, but he's got sort of a my way or the highway attitude. Might that be related to the fact that he is an only child? He's the boss.

I think she gave you your answer already. Yes. He's spoiled yet responsible. By the way. Also, the youngest children can be bossy. I mean, youngest children can be bossy. I mean, youngest children can be bossy, and oldest children can be. So, you know, there's a loose connection

between these things, but for the most part, yeah, I would say it's... One thing I've noticed anecdotally, I've read this in the literature, and I've noticed it anecdotally, is people in the arts and comedians, there seems to be a disproportionately large number of youngest child here in the comedy business.

That I have noticed anecdotally. Now, Steve is not a comic per se, but he's in the comedy world. He's got a comic comedic spirit. And incredibly funny. I find him quite funny. But I know that I'm the youngest child, and I know that many of my colleagues are the youngest child. We're not... We don't have any other comics here to ask that,

but that's been my... Well, Neil Brennan is the youngest Brennan. Yes. You met Neil on the last podcast. I did, I did. Well, you know, as the youngest child, I'm also the youngest child, and as the youngest child, again, you get a lot of attention, and you also, you know, in a way you you're special

i mean you really are special you're the last you're special you're special as an only child but i felt i felt i have clear memories of feeling okay they paid attention to me because i was cute but there was more to me than just cute i had something to say god damn it and i think that's manifested itself in my desire to be a comedian, because when you're the youngest, everything you say, you just see the little kid. Who cares what, you know, their opinion is. They're cute and all, but

they're not, you know, taken as seriously because they're so young. And I do believe that that had some effect on my own need to be heard and to be respected, and I will be respected. Take it easy, then.

I'm sorry. You wanted attention, obviously. I wanted attention. That's why you got into entertainment. Now, there's other things at play, obviously. There's many things wrong with me, and we can't attribute all of it to being the youngest child. Did you read that in Erica's expression,

or are you coming to that on your own? You have to be the sque child. Did you read that in Erica's expression, or are you coming back to something else? You have to be the squeaky wheel. As the youngest of a large family, you have to be the squeaky wheel. Otherwise, you don't get attention. So you get attention, and you don't get attention. So you've got to squeak loud. So as a comedian, you're squeaky. Go ahead, Steve.

You say what? I would sit at the dinner table as a child, and everybody would have an adult conversation. And as a four-year-old I'd be like I want to say something I want like literally I said that yeah that's right and then my father and my father inevitably would throw me out of the at a dinner almost every night that's not that's not good fathering and and because of it I had a slight eating disorder because I knew I was going to get thrown out of dinner. So I had to eat quickly.

And I would choke. I would choke on the food. And I would spill the meal. So you had the sense to eat quickly, but you didn't have the sense to stop saying, I want to say something. I wanted attention. It was worth it, I guess. And you did have an eating disorder, right? You finally had to go to the doctor for that and stuff.

I was looked at, but I just had to take more bites and smaller bites and chew more. He really got it in good because apparently his parents bought these glasses. You want the drinking glasses? I had little baby hands and these plastic cups that were huge. I couldn't wrap my little hands around it. These cups had a high center of gravity, so they're easy to tip over. Little, yeah. So he would...

And every day I would spill it. And my parents, it didn't occur to them to get normal cups that I could grab, actually. And you get thrown down to the dirt. That's traumatic. My father had a very short fuse and he'd throw me out. And that was my childhood. That's horrible. It's clearly traumatic if you remember it since you were four or five.

It's not. It wasn't. I don't know. I don't think I'm traumatized. I have a question for Erica that is very relevant. Your last three are very good here,

by the way. Oh, okay. Okay. That is very relevant to being a comedian. Steve, well, you're not a comedian, but you're in the comedic orbit.

You mentioned that, yeah. You don't have kids. I don't have kids. Jim Norton, I'm looking at over there, doesn't have kids. Many of us don't have kids. Hey, Kevin.

Yeah. Kevin Brennan does. Yes, he does. Is there any evidence to suggest that having kids is a good move for anybody in terms of happiness? It's not for everyone. Is it for anyone? It is for many people, but it's not for everyone.

People do it because they're supposed to do it. Wait, let's just pause and introduce Kevin. Kevin, this is Neil's older brother, Kevin. This is Erica Komisar. That's my intro now? No, no, we were just talking about Neil. Neil was on a podcast with Erica last time. I've met your brother. When?

Like a year and a half ago. Oh, on your podcast? Yeah. She's a psychoanalyst. She's an expert on child rearing and all issues, children. And you have children. Your brother. Oh, and Neil was complaining about his childhood?

Yes, but go ahead. He was? I don't know. Just take a breath. So we're talking about, Dan asked, does having children make somebody happy? So go ahead, Eric. Happier than they would otherwise be. It depends on the person. I don't think everyone should have children. I think

probably more people have children that really haven't thought about how difficult it is to have children and to raise children, not to have them. It's not difficult to have them. It's difficult to care for them and to raise them and give them what they need. And I think probably more people, if they really knew how difficult it was. I mean, I wrote that book because I wanted people to know that it maybe isn't for everyone. If you're going to really give children everything

they need. And it's rewarding for many, but it's not for everyone. So Kevin, hey, Kevin. Oh, no, I want to tape this in case there's a lawsuit. We have to really tape everything in case people are like, you said, I'm like, I did. It's on the videotape. You know, we're also recording it. But anyway.

No, I know. But I don't love serious satellite radio. All right, anyway, you have nine children in your family. Yeah. You personally have nine children, or you're from a family of nine children? He's from a family of nine. Yeah, I'm one of ten. I have two of my own.

And so what do you think? Has having children made you, and let me just, and him and his, I can say that him and his wife have been separated and then back together and separated. But you said that's normal for Hispanic people, right? That's what you said, quote unquote. You said it's pretty normal for Hispanic people. Should I be recording this? I don't know.

I'm just quoting what you said. I'm not speaking out of turn. I did not say it's normal. You specifically said it's normal for Hispanic people to break up for a while and then get back together. I don't recall saying that. Like the Capistrano, whatever, those birds, those fucking birds that people always like to talk about. Just to be clear for the listeners, Kevin's wife is Hispanic. Kevin, of course, is Irish-American.

Yeah, he's right. I'm always Hispanic. I'm very white. I'm very Irish. Has having children been a joy for you, Kevin? Well, since school starts tomorrow, yeah, I love very white. I'm very Irish. Has having children been a joy for you, Kevin? Well, since school starts tomorrow, yeah, I love having children. But yeah, the summer's been miserable. Summer's miserable. Why is it miserable?

Because my kids are home every day. I mean, my kids are so dumb. They think that you want to do what they want to do. So my kids want to watch like kid shows. I want to watch porn. Oh, come on now you're doing material no we compromise and watch kiddie porn would you be serious please

that's a joke Joe I just came up with that no but my son's like dad do you want to go play basketball today I'm like listen no I don't want to my dad hung out with me not once probably because we played with each other but I got to play with my kids now that's the one thing that people don't understand now.

Like people have small families, so you got to hang out with your kids a lot. And it's fucking, it's not, it's brutal. It's brutal. Like I love my kids, but it's fucking brutal. The hours are fucking brutal. No, you don't even fucking deal with it because you got like two wives and a fucking baby mama. And you got the mother-in-law living in the house. You don't even do your own fucking laundry.

No, I'm not coming down on you. I'm just telling you what you've told me. You're like, I can't get clean socks? I'm like, motherfucker, I do everyone's laundry in the fucking house. The only part of what you just said that is true is that I don't do my own laundry. Yeah, so then what do you do? What, you just sit around in your fucking, in your king's chair,

and people come over and fucking serve you stuff? Did you sit down? Aren't we friends? Yeah, no, I love you. But I never had this kind of animation. No, I just did Chip. I'm a little wound up. Can I get my volume down a little bit?

Yeah, you might. What Kevin is referring to is that Noam does have a nanny, and I believe his mother-in-law lives in the house or did. And then there's others that come, grandmas and so on. And it's crucial when you have kids, you need a lot of hands. You need people just doing shit with your kids so you don't have to. You know, the studies show that it's easier to play with your children if your parents played with you.

Checkmate. We say that the behavior is generationally passed down. It doesn't mean that you can't be playful with your children, but it's easier if, meaning if... No, listen, listen. But you're talking about books. I'm talking about reality. I'm saying when you're one of ten

and the next- door neighbor has nine kids and then down the street have 12 kids, you don't play with your parents. The parents weren't fucking involved. I don't know why I'm yelling at you. She's used to it. The parents weren't involved. But now the parents are involved. You've got to set up play dates.

You've got to fucking take your kids everywhere. It's fucking miserable. I love my kids, but raising them is fucking miserable. And again, Noma is the 1%, so he doesn't fucking deal with it. Anyway, 10 sold-out shows tonight at the Comedy Cell. This is where you're 100% wrong. I deal with all of it. I'm with my kids all the time.

I get up in the morning. I take them to school. They sleep with me every night. I can't even get a night's sleep because they come. My daughter will come in the middle of the night while I'm sleeping. She'll hit me in the back. I look at even get a night's sleep because my daughter will come in the middle of the night while I'm sleeping and she'll go, hit me in the back. I look and she goes, come on. Every night I have to go sleep. My son the other day,

I was taking a nap, a summer nap. My son hit me with a wiffle bat to see if I wanted to play wiffle ball. Fucking ISIS don't even treat their friends. You know what I mean? How dumb is he? He's like, hit me, woke me up with a wiffle bat. He goes, Daddy, we're going to go play wiffle ball. I'm like, no, you're insane.

It's the greatest sign of flattery. It's because he wants to be with you. No, my son likes me, and I like him. But I'm saying, it's fucking brutal. It's brutal. He's the one person in the world that definitely likes me. Now, when you talk this way in front of your wife, does it alarm her? How? If I was a wife, to hear the father speaking so ambivalently about the children.

No ambivalence whatsoever. I fucking hate it. I don't want to send the wrong message that I'm. So what would you. Now, I want you to allow someone else. Clear it up for me. It's very good. I want you to allow someone else to talk without interrupting for a minute.

What would you say to him in a therapeutic setting about what he's just saying? I would say, as you said, that he's ambivalent about parenting, but he probably loves his children. But again, the idea that when you're bored or are disinterested in being with your children, it's generally a sign that you experienced some pain in your childhood, that your parents were too busy or there were too many children or they were depressed or they were bored or they were disinterested.

So that gets passed down. We say it's a generational transmission of fathering and mothering. And so what I would say is it sounds like he probably had a lot of pain in his childhood. I just had a great idea for a podcast, and I'm not kidding. Sessions with Erica and a series of comedians come and do one hour sessions. Because they don't care. They'll tell the word about almost anything. Put it on Ryancast so nobody listens to it.

Wouldn't that, would you do something like that? I would, absolutely. Wouldn't that be a great idea, Dan? Would you be able to speak pretty... I don't know if I'd speak 100% openly with Erica, but I know that many comedians would. But you would speak openly enough. And you know what?

You'd probably get sucked in anyway. Well, it's a reasonable idea, sure. Has it ever been done? Probably. I think it's such a good idea. Look, there's about a billion podcasts out there, so everything has been done probably more than once. It's like an infinite number of monkeys slapping away at a typewriter.

It's exactly what it is. It's a perfect analogy. I think you're wrong. A comic talking to a therapist might work. Well, because comics... I'll invest. I'm guessing comics have a lot of pain. There's a lot of pain there behind

all that laughter. And they're outspoken. They don't mind sharing that pain. That's right. Absolutely. And they're used to doing it publicly. I kill at therapy. I literally kill. Have you ever gone to couples therapy? Yeah, and I kill. I swear to God, the therapists always think it's hilarious all the shit I say because I don't... I'll just say

whatever. Yeah, it's unscreened. I had a therapist one time... And you're paying him's unscreened. I had a therapist one time... And you're paying him. That's the outrage. I had a therapist one time. She would, like, howl laughing. When I lived in L.A., I would go to her, and I was like, she would howl laughing.

That must have infuriated your wife. No, she wasn't there. That's when I would go by myself sometimes, and she was like, do you have a problem with me laughing? I go, I really can't, since I'm a comedian. But I was never trying to be funny. I would just tell her, like, horrible things, and she would just laugh.

She would fucking cackle. All right. This is Dan's list. Disgusting. Don't you think therapists should give a discount to particularly entertaining patients? That's true. Let me think about that. You do look forward to some patients and not others, right?

Yeah, that's the reality. That is the reality. That's human. Clients or patients? Patients. Yes, I prefer the term patients. Mental patients. Well, just patients.

Discussing school shootings with your kids. Yeah. Explaining the news without making them afraid to go to school. We need advice on that. Yeah. I pretend they don't happen with my kids. I don't. I talk to them all the time.

Okay. Well, let her go first, and then you go. All right. I know the rules. It's amazing that for a family of 10, you didn't learn how to take turns. But okay, go ahead. Well, the misconception. Can you, okay. Well, let her go first and then you go. All right, I know the rules. It's amazing that for a family of 10 you didn't learn how to take turns. But okay, go ahead. Well, the misconception.

That was gratuitous. Go ahead. You don't weigh your turn when you want to tell. You just jump in when you have an idea. You're right. Go ahead.

The misconception that we have about how to talk to our children about the violence is that we should protect them completely. And you can't protect your children completely. It's impossible to protect them from the media, from radio, from newspaper, from just people talking. So the idea is to be honest with them but be sensitive with them. Meaning

children generally don't need more information than they can handle and if you elicit questions from them about what's happening, they'll ask what they need to know. So parents have to be careful not to sort of vomit information on their children. But the idea is that you do want to answer children's questions and you want to elicit questions from them. And you want to be honest with them. The one thing that children don't need and don't

like is mystery. Children do not like mystery. Mystery is more scary to children than honesty, as long as honesty is supported with being reassuring. So let me tell you why I don't discuss it with my kids. Now, what I'm about to say is complicated by the fact that they could be hearing this stuff and probably are from other people and that seeps in and then they don't know how to sort that out. But this is the fact.

Humans are not able to put statistically improbable events into context. So that my wife sees some poor kid chained to a radiator in Iowa and now she doesn't want to let our kids, you know, one out of 300 million people So that my wife sees some poor kid chained to a radiator in Iowa, and now she doesn't want to let our kids, you know, one out of 300 million people,

and she's afraid to let the kids go outside. Children are even less able to do that. The fact is that more people die, I think, from too hot tap water than children die from school shootings. That would happen in rain, man. On an annual basis. Or a hot water burn baby. Yeah. So I don't think there's, and certainly from swimming pool accidents

and all kinds of accidents. So I don't see that they really need to be prepared for this any more than they need to be prepared for, you know, every time you put your hand in a faucet, it is all sorts of freak occurrences, which I don't go around preparing them for. And so that's why I think, you know, let's just pretend this didn't happen. But as I said at the beginning, they they they certainly are like they have these they have these drills in the school.

I'm like, these drills are pointless. Did Chappelle say something about the drills being pointless? Was that Chappelle? He was saying that. Well, I don't want to give away the joke. But just like he was addressing that, it's He was saying that. Well, I don't want to give away the joke. Yeah, but just like. He was addressing that. It's not going to happen. And if it does happen, God forbid that my son and daughter are not going to have the wherewithal to go by that drill and save their own lives.

I just, it's such a stress of the drill. I think you're bringing up a good question. Do you bring up to children subject matter that they haven't brought up to you? And the answer is no. It's the same with sex, violence. You know, you're really answering children's questions as honestly as you can, as sensitively as you can, without giving them more information than they need or they can handle.

So, Noam, what do you do when they come to you and say, we heard there was a school shooting, 12 people were killed. That's it. The suspect was a white male. I swear to God, this is what I would say. Just don't worry about it even a little bit. It's not going to happen.

That's what every school thinks. Every school is naive, and the reason it happens is because every school thinks it's not going to happen. So they're not prepared. They're always prepared after the fact. I talked to my prince. I don't even know how this happened, but the day before the school shooting last year on Valentine's

Day, the one in Florida. We had a meet our kids teachers day, whatever it's called. I went there. I saw the principal. I go, you know, there's been a lot of school shootings before they had the big one. But I go, there's been a lot of school shootings.

Why don't you have cops at the school when the school's wide open at the beginning of the day and at the end of the day? And she goes, yeah, you mean like preventative measures? I go, yeah, yeah, preventative measures. Could you imagine? I go, because as soon as there's a school shooting,

as soon as there's a school shooting, as soon as there's a school shooting, there's 80 cops there I go where are the cops they're all at the donut store so why don't you have some of these cops all you need is one cop

with one cop car at the main door of the school when the kids are going to school when it's just every door is open and she goes yeah that's a good idea then the next day

it's a Valentine's Day shooting in Florida and I'm like am I psychic? But the principal must have thought, what the fuck does he know? What does this guy even know? But then after that, I was like militant with them, like making sure the doors were closed.

And then at one point, I was checking. I was like, I dropped my kids off. I went to get something to eat. I came back to check to see if the door was locked. And it wasn't. So they go, sir, don't be trying to open the door. We're going to call the police. I go, that's what I want.

I want the police here. So they always think if you're crazy, you can get away with murder because it's a public school. What are they going to do? All I do is so I can get arrested for opening the door. Arrest me. What did I do? So my point is every school thinks it's not going to happen.

It's naive. Whatever the numbers are, what are the odds that Louis me. What did I do? So my point is, every school thinks it's not going to happen. It's naive. Whatever the numbers are, what are the odds that Louis C.K. sells out Madison Square Garden six times? It's infinitesimal, if that's the right word. So everybody will be like, this can't happen. Of course it can happen. Six shows.

Okay. Of course it can happen. You're being naive. Probability, it's just loser's fucking math. Yes, but it's like, this is what, okay. Okay, Kevin, you know. Don't have me on. If you can't handle the truth.

This is what happens. Somebody wins a lottery ticket every week. Yeah, that's losing the lottery. That's losing. A bunch of idiots go out and they can win the lottery, so they start buying tickets. You're not going to win the lottery. Okay, I tell.

There's 300 million people in this country. I was trying to do a bit where, let me just finish. That's all I have to say, then I'll leave. No, no, leave. No, so. Just shut up for a second. I said, in this country, since the politicians are cowards and they won't do anything, if your family member gets shot, it's like they should give you a million dollars. Like, it's just the equivalent of the lottery.

Like, how do you win the lottery in California? You win 350 million. Just good luck. So this is bad luck. So pay the people. We have the money. So if your family member gets shot, you get $5 million. Problem solved because then you won't care if someone gets shot.

There's no incentive to anybody shooting people. That's a moral hazard. So the issue isn't that you... I don't know your credentials, so I'm just giving you the benefit of the doubt. That's okay. I don't know what your credits are. I've been on Evening at the Improv. I've been on Letterman a couple of times. So I don't know your credentials, so I'm just giving you the benefit of the doubt. That's okay. Like, I don't know what your credits are. I've been on Evening at the Improv. I've been on Letterman a couple of times.

So I don't know. I'm just going on hearsay that you're qualified. I've got to say one thing. There is nobody funnier than Kevin Brennan. No, David Tell is funnier. Ask him. Go ahead, Erica. So the idea of reassuring your kids is not a bad idea,

but the idea is you don't want to reassure them before you've answered their questions. And so, you know, if somebody comes to you and they say, I'm scared, and you say, it'll be okay, it's fine. It doesn't make them feel fine. It makes them feel unheard, and it makes them feel more scared. But if you listen to them and you answer their questions, and then you say, you know, but the chances are really slim and it will be okay. But that should be at the end, not at the beginning. I would definitely answer the question. Because if it's at the beginning, then it shuts down the communication

and it also shuts down their expression of feeling. So as much as you want to reassure your children, you need to hear them first and you need to answer their questions. And that's a very different approach than most of America is talking about right now, which is, you know, protect, protect, protect. The thing is, you can protect your children from some of it, but you cannot protect your children from all of it. It is too pervasive in our society right now.

Talking about guns? Violence in the schools. You know what this reminds me of for some reason? I don't know if the story will translate. So the day after 9-11, or a few days after 9-11. Is that when you get busted in Washington? My waitresses were petrified, Cafe

Wah at the time, they were petrified to come to work. Like everybody was just expecting another terrorist attack. And I made fun of them. I'm like yeah, yeah. They're like Bin Laden's like U.S. call, check. World Trade Center, check. Cafe Wah. Well, you know World Trade Center, check. Cafe Wah. Like, why do you...

Well, you know, my husband says you never can see a grizzly bear when you're looking for one. So the idea is right after these incidents... He's a wise man. Yeah, so right after these incidents, like, then they'll put police at the door of schools. But as soon as it dies down, then the police go away. And that's when the grizzly bear comes. Not right after the incidents when they put the police at the doors. The point is that you'd have to have police there all the time.

And it's unlikely to happen right after it's happened. It's going to happen when nobody's looking. Here's a shout-out to Gnome. I've said this on my podcast, Miserable Loves Company, available on iTunes. I've said this on my podcast where I say, what you do is smart because, you know, when there's like a— I know this is backhanded, available on iTunes. I've said this on my podcast where I say what you do is smart because when there's like a... I know this is backhanded, but go ahead. No, like when they had the guy at the gay club

in Orlando. I said whenever there's something like that, I do get nervous going to a nightclub. You should be nervous at any club you go to. Yeah, where I'm trapped. I might say the wrong thing. Go ahead. I do feel a little something, but I've said no, I'm smart because he might say the wrong thing. It's tough you say. Go ahead. No, I might get... I do feel a little something. But I've said, no, I'm smart because he puts big black men at the door.

And I said, even after, like... I said they should have big black guys at the airport, even, because even terrorists are intimidated by a big black man. Silence. Well, I don't know if that's true. And they should be at the school. I'm not being racist. I'm just being like,

they're intimidating. No, you want to harness racism to protect us. Or whatever. But Kevin, the one thing about putting police at all the schools is then they can just say,

okay, we'll get them when they go to the mall or when they go to anywhere else. I go to the mall with my kids. They don't go to the mall. At school, I'm at... It's really okay, Kevin. We take cow dung and we make energy from it.

We can harness something bad to make something good. I'm saying at the mall, I'll be at the mall with them. At school, I'm totally at the mercy of the competency or incompetency of the school administration. And the reason I think they go to schools is because it makes such a, it's so horrendous. Like the thing in Connecticut was so horrendous that like, back in the day they used to shoot politicians, but they don't because you can't get to a politician anymore. So they shoot kids, these crazy, or they shoot John Lennon.

You can't do that anymore because there's so much protection. So now they go off to school because it's such a spectacle. It's so horrific. And then, of course, two weeks later, people forget about it because politicians are cowards. That's really what it comes down to, politicians are cowards, because nobody needs a fucking assault weapon for any reason, especially when they go, it's a mental health issue. So the guys who sell guns are supposed to be like, are you crazy?

And the guy's like, not at all. Okay, I'll sell you a gun. They're businessmen. Did somebody sell you down for a gun, Kevin? Yeah. It's like you asking people before they order the chicken kebab, are you nuts? And they go, no. Okay, you can have a kebab.

So it's not their job. So mental health is a cop-out. Politicians are cowards. All right. Can we talk about something else? Hey, Keith. Dan, you want to ask your next questions? We're almost there.

Which one do you like? I like the last two. All right. The trans kids. You know, now all these kids are trans now. You're talking about the kids who take the bus? The trans kids. And, you know, so you've got three, four-year-olds saying, well, I was born a male, but I'm a female.

And some of the parents are saying, okay, you can be a female. So, I mean, at what age is a kid too young to say that he's another gender? Well, it's not too young to say he's another gender. The question today is when should you do something about it? And I think what's happened is there's a push to actually help these kids physically with hormones and hormone replacement therapy and doing the surgery very early, and I disagree with that because there's a certain developmental line in children

when things like gender and sexuality are still very fluid, and you really don't want to make permanent changes when things like gender and sexuality are still very fluid, and you really don't want to make permanent changes before you've let that developmental line play out. But is there a case where it's so obvious that, you know, it's so over the top that this boy that was born a boy is actually a girl that there's really little doubting it, even if the child is four or five. You still don't want to make permanent changes until they've been allowed to sort of go through

that developmental process, because a lot changes in that developmental process, and you don't know where it's going to go, even if you think it... The one caveat there is, is if you don't hit them with hormones before puberty, then they're never really going to be the woman or the man, especially from the male to female. If you don't get those hormones in before puberty, it's too late to be a feminine-looking female. I got them late.

But what we're not talking about, we're not talking about... So we have to balance that consideration. We're not talking about the permanency of the changes. And when you make these permanent changes at such an early age so now we know that adolescence starts at nine and ends at 25 and that's when the brain development stops so if you make those changes too early and they're permanent the degree of depression and suicidal ideation in those kids there's what we don't talk about is the amount of suicide when those kids realize that they made permanent changes

to their body that are not reparable. I understand that, but what about the fact that if they really are legitimately transgender and they go through male puberty, game over. They got big shoulders. It's not game over, but the idea is that

again, my feeling as a clinician is that unless you let that developmental line play out, you don't know which way it's going to go. And you don't want to make permanent changes to a child's body before they've actually emotionally developed fully. Okay. I say it's a balancing act. You say no. There's another aspect to it which I haven't heard discussed, which is, and what made me think of this, is that a lot of doctors are always handing out Viagra. And my friend who's a doctor said to me,

he says, I don't know why they do that. Every drug has side effects. Every drug has risks. And if somebody doesn't have, if it's just like take it for fun, it doesn't seem to comply with the oath of a doctor. So surgery has risks. Great risks. Great risks. comply with the oath of a doctor. So, surgery has risks. Great risks.

Great risks. And the question is, if you need a kidney transplant, you need a kidney transplant. Have we decided that sex change, to not have a sex change, is such a medical condition that it warrants

taking this kind of big risk with somebody's life and that it can come out wrong. And I don't think that's ever weighed. You know, do no harm. Can you let her? Why do you do that all the time? The parts of the brain that are the youngest child, the parts of the brain that are about impulse control and decision-making and judgment, those parts of the brain don't fully develop until you're 25. And so when you're making such major life,

it's why you really can't trust anyone under 25 to make major life decisions. Is that why Hertz Renicar says you can't rent? That's exactly why they say that. Yeah, so you really want to be careful in imbuing children, and I'm saying children under the age of 25, because they're really still adolescents under 25, with that kind of decision-making. Yeah, that's what I'm going to say about it.

But if somebody is so distressed... So you can support a child. You can support a child to be whoever they are. And you can even give a child some hormones to delay some of the process. But to actually do the surgery before they have a real sense of the permanency. The other thing that children have is they live very much in the present. So they don't really connect their present actions to consequences. You don't do that fully until your prefrontal cortex is fixed. And that's at around 25. So you really have no sense of, that's why kids do stupid things. That's why you're a teenager. How old are your kids?

Yeah, 11 and 7. Okay. So, you know, you're maybe 11 is just the beginning of doing really stupid things. He's dumb as fuck. Okay, between 11 and 25, you do really, I mean, right, we all did really stupid things. And the reason we do stupid things... I got into comedy at 23. Right, well... That was dumb. The reason we do stupid things is because we cannot yet connect future-oriented consequences with what we're doing. So that's the problem. So last week on another podcast, there was a therapist. I can't remember her name.

And she said something that I was really surprised at. And I made a note that I wanted to ask you about it. So it was the story of Mark Halperin, who is this, I know him. So he was this, uh, TV journalist who got, uh,

in trouble for a me too guy. And now he just coming back now with a book that's come out and there's a lot of controversy. And his story was as follows that, he was doing disgusting things, pressing himself with an erect penis against people he worked with and things of that nature while at ABC. Apparently, no one ever made a complaint to HR, but this was going on. He'd missed that. Then apparently he got a hold of himself and sought therapy, stopped this behavior.

There's been no accusations since. Went to NBC, had like a 10-year career, 12-year career, and then these things from ABC came back, and he had, and now, and he was fired. And now that his book is coming out, people are upset and saying, no, no, he should never be allowed to come back. So I had a therapist on, and she said, no, that's right. He should, I don't care what happens to him. He should never be allowed to come back. And I said, but you're a therapist. Like, are you saying that if somebody came to you like Mark Halpern and said, look, I've been doing all

these things and I want to stop doing these things. You would tell him I'm not the doctor for you. Go somewhere else. Cause I don't believe you can be helped or I don't believe you deserve being helped. She said, yes, I would tell, I wouldn't want to see a patient like that. Is that? It's unforgiving, but it's also not clinically correct. It's not, right? Yeah. No, it's not. And I think the idea is, I guess it reminds me a little of, maybe it shouldn't, but the Louis louis ck issue too that that we've talked about you and i um the the idea of forgiveness how we've become a society that basically i mean i guess there are some unforgivable things um but that we become a society that really doesn't let people rehabilitate doesn't let people have contrition, doesn't let, there's no forgiveness.

And especially certain, for certain infractions, we don't want any rehabilitation. Yeah. So that sounds to me as though that therapist had some personal vendetta around that particular issue. You know, when you go to do jury duty, they say, have you ever been mugged? You know, it's a mugging case. Have you ever been robbed? You know, it may be that she had some kind of personal issue that was coming through. We call it counter-transference. When our own personal issues enter into clinical situations. We all need to remember that our therapists have problems

too. Yeah, but they're supposed to control them. What's your problem? They're supposed to control them. That's your personal? Kevin, I assume you're convinced that this woman is legitimate. She used the word counter-transference. Yeah, that won me over. So did you see Chappelle's special, the latest Chappelle's special?

I haven't seen the latest one. Have you seen it? No, all I saw was a juicy Smollet. Smollet. However you pronounce it. Smollet, yeah. Smollet, the French actor. So you haven't seen it?

No, I don't watch comedy. I should watch it. Okay. I'll watch it. I don't watch comedy. You have to text me when those things are on. Normally I don't watch comedy either, but it's such a big talking point in the comedy community that I did watch it.

And? Well, we discussed it last week. I enjoyed it. You know, I enjoyed it. I'm not going to go. He's a very talented man. He beat me in Star Search 4-3. Yeah, I remember.

He says a lot of very, very, very controversial things, not the least of which that he thinks Michael Jackson's victims or alleged victims are full of shit. Does he use those words? I don't know if he says full of shit, but he says they were not being true. Here's the point, Noam. Here's the point I'd like to make about that. He's as big as these people.

So he can say it and he can handle the pushback because if he wasn't that big, he would be brutalized. He would be savage. They would try to, like, these women groups or whatever, all these groups would go after him viciously, but he's too big. He's untouchable at this point. It just makes him

bigger. So he's basically like the guy who has to fight the fight because he's so good. You know what I mean? He has to be like Muhammad Ali. Muhammad Ali standing up against the U.S. government saying, I'm not going to fight in Vietnam because it had to be Ali. Because anybody else, any other boxer does it, they'll just be like, who the fuck are you? So when Chabelle does it, everyone goes, oh, maybe he's got a point. If he wasn't this big, he would just be laughable.

I mean, in a bad way, you know? Well, I kind of agree with you. They would dismiss him totally. I don't agree. I think Michael Jackson's victims are very, very convincing. But again, he's going for the laugh. He's trying to set it up. But that's not the point.

And I think your Muhammad Ali analogy is actually pretty good. The point to me is that he's saying whatever he wants. Right. Which is what people need to be able to do. He is gigantic. Which you can only do with comedy. He has gigantic credibility because he's so beloved. And because of who he is, he's getting away with it.

You could say exactly the same thing. I can't even walk up on stage. I mean, people hiss at me before I even say a word. Groups of white women. Because I look like their boss or something.

I mean, it's ridiculous. I wish I was kidding. I mean, I'm not a lawyer, but I think that comedy still is free because of satire, because of the idea of like Saturday Night Live, it gets away with, you know, all kinds of of satire, because of the idea of like Saturday Night Live, it gets away with all kinds of political satire that you...

That's not a legal question. Except what's interesting, he's getting killed on Twitter. He's getting killed in the media. He's getting killed on Rotten Tomatoes. I think on Rotten Tomatoes he had like a 0% critics rating and a 99% audience rating. I saw something today, 33 and 99. So it went up to 33. It was zero for a while.

It was like 90. Yeah, but just how fascinating it is that the Hannah Gadsby is the opposite. Rotten Tomatoes is like almost 100 and People Meter was like 50 percent. So this is once again the elite Twitter

whatever the most is such a bad barometer like 50%. So this is, once again, the elite Twitter, whatever, is such a bad barometer of what people are actually feeling. And that's not because 99% agree with him that Michael Jack, that Safe Chuck, and the other guy were lying. He's a great comic. If he wasn't a great comic,

he wouldn't get away with it. He's a great comic. He's maybe the best comic of all time. I'm not saying that because he beat me in Star Search. I think he's... I saw him... If you had to lose... I saw him at 18 at the Boston Comedy Club. I'm like,

this guy is fucking great. He grew up on stage. He's fucking great. So, you know, people say, oh, Chris Rock. You know, I'm like, Chris Rock. Even when I saw the juicy small I'm like, it's fucking genius. Starting a joke like that is so fucking great

because it just seems like he's not taking it seriously. He doesn't take himself seriously. He's mispronouncing a name. He's fucking, he's great. He's like the, he might be the best comic of all time.

Isn't this interesting because Kevin is so, I agree with you, but if I had to. I've never, I've never, I've never moved away from that opinion ever. I've never said, Chappelle is like the best comic I've ever seen. But if I had to I've never I've never but if I wanted to moved away from that opinion ever I've never said

Chappelle is like the best comic I've ever seen but if I wanted to disagree with him it'd be so easy to say what a vested interest you have in that opinion

because yeah he beat you on Star Search and he's got a really good mind obviously and he's a great performer yeah he's got both so again

if he wasn't this good he wouldn't get away with it. But it does feel good, doesn't it, to know that the guy responsible for... Basically two things that really bug you. Your brother's success and losing in Star Search. Yeah, I can't get over Star Search. Sometimes I just wake up in a cold sweat. At least you can

blame it on him that Chappelle's the greatest ever. It was a long wait. It was a long wait when we were waiting for the judges to come back with the numbers. Because I already knew I lost. It doesn't matter how much I lost by. Is this available on YouTube? No, but me, us standing there together is available. There's a screenshot of him getting four stars and me three stars.

No, I knew it was going to wait. It was like a little anecdote. But they taped it in Orlando. I had already won. So Chappelle shows up. I know I'm going to lose because Chappelle's great. And it's all Disney World. So it's all kids in the audience.

I've already seen, I've already done one show there. So I know he's going to win. Barry Katz is his manager. They ask him, what's the introduction for Chappelle? And Barry goes, he's the youngest comedian in Star Search history. I'm going, Barry, he's already going to win. It's just, it's a fucking joke, you know? So they said to me, what do you want for your intro and this is when

Ed McMahon was the host I said say I'm I'm from Philadelphia and I have two weeks to live and I'm

come on Dan why can't you do that they wouldn't do it they wouldn't do it I pitched it but they wouldn't go for it oh Kevin you're so funny.

I knew I was going to lose. I mean, Chappelle was magical. And another thing, this is the last thing I'll say about Chappelle. Chappelle showed up to Disney World. Chappelle showed up to the Disney World, to the studio where we were all taping. It was like a run through the day before. And there was all these kids were gravitating towards him. So I asked Bear, I go,

how do they know him? He goes, they don't. He has like an aura. He's a gift. Muhammad Ali asked Bear, I go, how do they know him? He goes, they don't. He has like an aura. He's a gift. Like Muhammad Ali just would walk to villages and they would all just know he was like special.

So they're all kids and he hadn't been on any TV shows at that point. So it's just one of those scenarios. Did they just know to run away from you? Yeah. And I was a grand champion

from the day before. They still didn't care. All right, Eric. I hope that you learned a valuable lesson, from you. Yeah. And I was a grand champion from the day before. They still didn't care. All right, Eric. I hope that you learned a valuable lesson, Noam. Yeah. That things can be interesting that don't involve Asians

not getting accepted to Harvard. All right. I don't even know what that implies, but it's funny. It's an inside joke because Noam, every week he talks about...

Let's talk about that, Eric. No, I'm kidding. Erica, so before we go, what are hot issues for you in the professional world of a psychotherapist these days? I mean, anxiety. Anxiety

and depression in mostly adolescents and young adults. Have you seen Gary Goleman's special, The Great Depresh? No. Well, he discussed it. It's not out yet. Oh, it's not out? I thought it was out. October 5th. I can't wait. Is he allowed to beat me up, by the way?

I never asked you. No, you did ask me. What you said was. Is he allowed to put his hands on me? You said, I didn't want to talk about this because I know you're going to take the other Jew's side. I didn't worry about that. I said the Jewish mafia will step up and it will be decided, as it should be. You said I'll take the Jew side.

But you were wrong. But is he allowed to touch me? Like if he sees me on the street? He's not allowed to come. On the street, can he touch me? Or just in the club? On the street, you guys are... But on your properties, he can't touch me.

Can we just let that go? I can't. You let things go. So how do we handle anxiety? Is there any like, go ahead. Well, so the idea is we're putting too much pressure on kids today. Some of it's implicit and some of it's explicit. And, you know, that's causing breakdowns in younger and younger kids. But we know that it's a problem and it's not going away. Meaning the idea of, you know, at a very young age, having to think about their future when they're not supposed to be future oriented, when they're supposed to play and they're supposed to be very present oriented.

Yeah, we basically created a world for kids and for adolescents that they really can't live in. I wonder if people were happier back in the day when there was no social mobility. So you were born a peasant. Yes. And it sucked. But guess what? You're going to be a peasant. Don't worry about it.

There was no pressure. And you're going to die of the plague at 30. But at least you knew it. Well, you didn't have as many choices. You didn't have to worry about, am I going to be as... You know, everybody's trying to be the coolest, have the most followers on Instagram, or...

Everybody wants to... There's so much pain. Pain is desire. I believe it was Buddha that said that. If you could... The striving is painful. Yeah, yeah. And the choices.

Too many choices are painful. If you could make one change to the world that would save the most lives in mass shootings, including gun control or better families, what would it be? Where is the real center of gravity on that? Get rid of daycare. Give mothers the ability to really nurture their children in the first three years and get fathers back in the home. These are the most important things. Why did you get rid of daycare? The early years are the years that are developmental, that are the most critical for brain development

for children, for emotional security, and for things like regulation of aggression. Meaning these boys, and the profile is always the same, right? I mean, this last shooting was a slightly older version, but as I said, adolescence we know goes till 25, maybe even 30. So this was an older person. What, in Texas, in El Paso? Yeah, it was a 30-something-year-old, but for the most part, the profile is about the same. They're about 19 to 25-year-old, usually white male, but male. And the idea is that they usually don't have fathers. There was an article in the Wall Street Journal. I write for the journal, and there was a piece that I didn't write about how most of these boys that have done these shootings don't have fathers.

They're fatherless. Because the father left, or they're divorced. Families are divorced. They're divorced. They come the father left or they're divorced? Families are divorced. They're divorced. They come from single mother families. The fathers are not involved or the fathers are kind of AWOL. But the idea is that they're fatherless and often motherless too because the mothers are stressed, have to work.

So you asked me why daycare. I mean, at the beginning of this show, I talked about why daycare is not good for children. But the idea is that in the first three years, you really need as much as possible for your emotional security and your ability to regulate your emotions going forward in life. You need to have your primary caretaker, your mother, or your primary love object be your protector from stress and not separate from her to a great degree in those first three years, or if it's the father. Can the experience of being one of ten be the same,

have the same result? There's lots of, yeah. There's a lot of emotion on the go. I haven't brought up an interest. The reason I agree with you, and the reason, listen, I am not a Second Amendment guy. I'm very happy for any gun control they want to pass. But it always occurs to me that you can't prove a change by pointing to a constant.

That's what Coleman says. So the fact is that in New York City, gun deaths went from like 2,500 a year to $300 a year with no change in gun laws. You know, like 800%, 900%. And mass shootings are going up, again, with no increase in guns. So to say that the gun laws are the key to impacting this in either direction doesn't really make sense to me. If you could... The gun laws are the key to impacting this in either direction. It doesn't really make sense to me. If you could— But aren't the gun laws super strict in New York City?

No, that's my point. They always were. Yet, we had almost 3,000, I think— Well, that was crack. That was crack. Whatever it was, it wasn't—they didn't stop it by changing access to guns. And on the flip side, it hasn't increased because they've given more access to guns. Something is changing in the people themselves and their desire to do these things.

So I'm going to say that the mental health crisis is not going anywhere anytime soon. And as much as we... Right. Lucky for me, right? I'd be out of a job. But social media is bad for mental health, right? It is bad for mental health. And that's just not going to go away. No, it's not going away. So the mental health crisis is not going away. So you'd say, what's a perfect storm for violence? A mental

health crisis, particularly in young people who have no control over their impulses and don't really make the connection to the consequences of their actions and have no good judgment yet, you take that with a mentally ill teenager, and then you have easy access to guns. So a perfect storm is easy access to guns and a rise in mental health issues. The mental health issues aren't going anywhere. We can do something about the guns. In my opinion, and that's why I write these books,

we can do something about mental health, but it's not going anywhere anytime soon. It's a perfect storm. We cannot ignore the gun issue as well. I think Kevin said it well. You have to hit it on both targets. You can't just go for one. You have to think about mental health, but you really

have to think about guns too. You have to think about both. Plus, most places you can't even if the guy has mental health issues, you don't even know because they have client privilege, right? Client therapist privilege. So you can't even out somebody if they have mental problems, right? Unless they say, I'm going to kill you or specifically going to kill somebody. Well, what's happened in this country is that because of civil rights, which are a good thing, we have a lot of civil rights in this country, we haven't been allowed to institutionalize or even report people who have mental health issues.

We're not allowed to take homeless people off the street unless they consent. We're not allowed to hospitalize. You're not allowed to hospitalize someone who is a risk to themselves with suicide unless they actually do something. I mean, we've gotten to the point in this country where civil rights override the security of society, but also people's security. But that's also because partly we realize we can't be trusted to incarcerate these people humanely. You remember all the abuses. Well, that came from the Victorian times. In Victorian times, people were hospitalized for illegitimate reasons. Women.

No, I mean legitimate people when they're hospitalized. They're treated terribly and they can't speak up for themselves. And, you know, it's just... I think the solution is give homeless guns. people when they're hospitalized. They're treated terribly and they can't speak up for themselves. I think the solution is give homeless guns and then that way they'll pass some gun laws when the homeless just start shooting everybody. Sign me up to vote for any gun law there is and also let me say I'm

very, very skeptical that they will have any real effect. I think when somebody gets it in their mind that they want to go shoot up the school, there's 300 million guns in the country already, there's an internet, there's a dark web. Yeah, but it's always where the guns are in states that are more promiscuous.

They are more prevalent, yeah, and more accessible. I guess promiscuous isn't the right word. But anyway, it's like... No, but promiscuous is the right word because guns are sexy to a teenager. Yeah, so where any state where they have no laws, like Texas, Florida, they have no laws, and it's just ridiculous. I mean, fair enough. Who needs a machine gun?

Who needs a military-grade machine gun? It's sick. I think, listen. Other than the military. I think it's like eventually it becomes like these things like, you know, everybody thought homosexuality was bad 30 years ago. Pot was ridiculous. So I think as the country gets the younger people get more mature and take over the country, eventually they'll be like the guns is stupid. Like even when these kids in Florida were, you know, and they're like and Louie had that bit where like they should.

It was a dumb bit, you know. But anyway, I'm like, you know, the kids, like, so when you watch a Vietnam show, the guys who are in Vietnam, they shouldn't have an opinion about what the fuck happened in Vietnam. It's the same with these kids who were in that Florida shooting should absolutely be stepping up and going, guns are horrible, as opposed to like, oh, no, they're just kids. They shouldn't, they were there.

They were fucking there. And what you're saying is probably true about 25, but like, if you're 18 and you can fight in Vietnam, you have pretty good memory of what. So if you're at a school shooting, you remember what happened. You don't have to be like, well, you're not 25. You don't know what the hell you're talking about. Who knew Kevin was so empathetic and soft-hearted? I've never seen this side of you. I just take reason.

And I've got to protect my kids. I've got to feed my family. So I've got to protect. My only job now is feeding my family and protecting my family. I don't give a fuck about, you know, uh, now I'm going to care about a little bit. You, you seem like a nice lady. And of course I'm just joking.

Of course you have nice tits. No, I'm just saying, I'm saying like, I'm saying, I'm saying my job is to protect my kids. So whatever it is I got to do, that's what I'm going to do. So do I care about like, you know, statistics? I just care. My kids are safe. I told my kids, if you hear firecrackers going off and it's not July 4th, stay in your classroom. Don't leave. But listen, what we're not addressing is that there's a kind of paranoia, like a low level paranoia in this country that anyone would need a machine gun. I mean, the only reason you would need a machine gun is to rise up against the government

because you think the government will rise up against you. Which is crazy. Which is laughable. So that is already a low level of mental illness because it's a kind of paranoia that is at the foundation of why people need to have machine guns if they're not in the military. Yeah, you're going to outgun the government?

It's laughable. Well, that is the point. I mean, there's one thing to say that I'm a hunter, and I'm a sustenance hunter, and I need a gun to shoot my deer, to feed my family. There's another thing to say that you need a machine gun. The only reason you would need a machine gun is to protect yourself from a

government and rise up against that government because they'll rise up against you. Machine guns are more or less illegal, but I get what you're saying. It's paranoia. No, it's just words. We're talking about AR-15s, anything that you can... Spray bullets. Yeah, that you can kill a lot of people quickly. They're not necessary.

I agree a thousand percent. I don't dismiss entirely the notion that an armed citizenry can be a check against a tyrannical government. Oh, come on. Of course it can. You see what David Koresh did? It's laughable. They just do whatever they want. It was written.

They made one mistake. The founding fathers made one mistake, and that was it. Everything else was genius. You can look at all the things they did. Genius. The checks and balances. Fucking genius. And the separation of church and state.

But the Second Amendment was just something they had to have. They were fighting against everybody then, like bears and British. And they needed you. The government had to say, but they would assume that we would fix it if it got out of control. And they couldn't anticipate AR-15 any more than they can anticipate anything. The cell phone? You can't anticipate things. There is a mistake.

There is a flaw there. Forgive me for pointing it out. The Supreme Court has not ruled that you can't ban AR-15s. As a matter of fact, they were banned at one time. The country doesn't want to ban them. Now the country does. The politicians are afraid. The Supreme Court

ruled that they can ban certain handguns and things like that. There is a certain basic level of arms they feel you're entitled to. But assault weapons were banned under Clinton and then it lapsed, and it hasn't been... Because in 1994... And a state certainly has the right to ban them, but in Texas, they don't want to ban them.

Okay, that's fine. I'm saying they're afraid. Politicians are afraid because in 1994, they tried to get the. Okay, that's fine. I'm saying they're afraid. Politicians are afraid because in 1994 they tried to get the assault ban and the Speaker of the House lost. Tom Foley lost. And ever since then, they're all scared. They're all afraid they're going to lose.

Because the politician's number one job is to get re-elected. That's it. In other states, there was a culture which is drastically different from ours. And that culture, they love their guns. That's just the truth. We might think it's ridiculous. Rural error is fine.

Have a gun. And they don't want to make them illegal. The Second Amendment doesn't prevent it. They don't want them illegal. So they can cancel the Second Amendment. You're still going to have assault weapons. Yeah, but the fact that it's in the Constitution gives them huge protection, just like abortion gives them huge protection because it's a law. I'm just clarifying something.

But I'm saying they always say the Second Amendment because they know push comes to shove, they're going to win. They do say Second Amendment rights, Second Amendment rights. Yes, the NRA does pretend that these are Second Amendment rights. But the fact is that's not accurate according to the law. Assault weapons are not protected by the Second Amendment rights. But the fact is, that's not accurate according to the law. Assault weapons are not protected by the Second Amendment. Well, according to the current constitutional interpretation of the Supreme Court case. But any comment about the Constitution? Yes, that's true.

If it wasn't in the Constitution, we wouldn't be having this fight. They would just be eliminated. They were restricted. I don't know. This country came up with guns and pioneers and cowboys. Militia. It came up with militia. The idea that you could form a militia to fight an unjust government.

And the idea is at that point there wasn't enough trust to believe that the government would be the same. But look, we have a large segment of the population on the left that thinks Trump is literally Hitler. If I thought Trump was literally Hitler, I'd want a gun. And those are the same people that say we shouldn't have guns. But it's the people who love Trump who want the guns, not the people who think he's Hitler. The people who think he's literally...

Did I say mental illness is pervasive? The people who think he's literally Hitler are on the left, but those people don't want guns. It seems that's a contradiction to me. If I thought Hitler was in power, I would want a gun. Yeah, but reasonable people realize now the government can do whatever the fuck they want. And you're not going to win against the government. You might win against your neighbor, but you're not going to win against the government.

Dan does have actually an interesting point there. So many people were sure that Trump was going to become a despot. Like our liberty was done. And if they really believed what they said, you'd think they would actually. Let's hold off on the gun control. I don't think they ever really believed that about Trump. They believe he's a monster. Because they know it's a great country.

They know it's a great constitution. He can't become the king. There's separation of powers. Yeah, you're right. Okay. Erica, you're my favorite ever. And thank you for coming again. Thank you for having me.

You can buy Erica's... I don't want to get the title wrong. Where's it? You can buy Erica's book, Being There, Why Prioritizing Motherhood in the First Three Years Matters. It's a very, very good and important book. What's your last name again? Komisar. Are you on Twitter? I am. K-O-M-I-S-A-R. What's your Twitter name? Erica Komisar, CSW. Okay. And she writes for the Wall Street Journal with some regularity. And we didn't talk about it, damn it, about just coming back from what country was it? Well, I came back from Africa. Well, we don't have time on that.

From Africa. You just said we have to go. Where in Africa? I was in Rwanda and Uganda because I was observing mothers and babies and how what they call they have the maternal economy in those countries where mothers can still work and bring in money to their families, but by taking their children with them and not leaving them behind. and Uganda and she's found that motherhood and parenting was much gentler there and much more healthy for and you have a column coming out about that in a week or two. In a week.

So look for it in the Wall Street Journal. Damn it, I wanted to talk about that. Okay, thank you very much everybody. Can I do my plug? Yeah, please. They're having a roast for me October 1st at the Stand Comedy Club. Why at the Stand? Because you guys had no dates available. For a Kevin Brennan roast? Yeah, that's what Liz said. Ask Liz.

She's in big trouble. Yeah, fire her, finally. I would have canceled the show for that. Cancel what show? Any show. For a Kevin Brennan roast? Liz said the Stand was much more amenable to my situation. Alright, okay. October 1st. You'll bounce back.

Your club's going to be fine. October 1st, we just booked Chip Chipperson to be on a row, so it's going to be hilarious. Okay. I got to go.

Anything else? Well, just if you have comments about the podcast, it's podcast.comedyseller.com. And follow us on Instagram at livefromthetable. Okay. Good night.